Loud and Quiet presents Midnight Chats.
Good evening podcast fans, Greg here on another cold, dark Thursday night, bringing you a new episode of Midnight Chats. Thanks for joining me wherever you're listening to this, and cheers to Stewart who brought you the last two episodes back to back. That was Backs to Jewelry and Charlie XX. Dig those out if you haven't already. We definitely bring you a variety of stories and guests on this podcast
of ours. Tonight's guest may not have spent twenty eighteen touring stadiums around the world with Taylor Swift like Charlie XX had, but I hope that you're going to enjoy this conversation all the same. On the podcast this evening is Damian Abraham, best known as frontman with Toronto hardcore punk band Fucked Up. If you're listening to this thinking I don't know who that is, you are in retreat.
They are the kind of band that you could spend hours not only googling, but more importantly days listening to, such as the amount of material that they've released over the years. But if I was going to give you one tip, maybe start by youtubing their performance of Baiting the Public on MTV Live in two thousand and seven, or Twice Born a year later, also for MTV. That will put you firmly in the picture about who Fucked Up are personally. I met Damien and the band for
the first time a decade ago. I was just starting out as a music writer, and the weekend that I spent with them involved lots of blood and pepsi and a giant cardboard Trojan Horse. And it's still one of the most memorable commissions that I've ever done all these years later. But a lot has happened since then, not least that Fucked Up became kind of a big deal, as unlikely as it seemed. They went on to share stages with the likes of Foo Fighters and Arcade Fire,
and toured the world multiple times. I should probably say that they released their latest album, Dose You Dreams in October of this year. Do check it out. It's extraordinary stuff. That's not Damien's only pursuit though. The last few years, from the office in his house back home in Canada, he's been making his very successful podcast series Turned Out
a Punk. Just today, in fact, I finished listening to the recent one he did with Cedric Bixler from at the I should probably be telling you to subscribe to Midnight Chats at this point in my introduction, but do go and check out Turned Out a Punk because it's an excellent series and you don't have to be a punk fan in fact to appreciate the guests and the connections that explores on that Damiens have won off though, a real self confessed nerd and one of the few
people I've met who, if he went on Mastermind, could basically take his pick when it came to specialist subjects, be it punk music, wrestling, or the current international political debate surrounding the legalization of marijuana, all of which you're about to hear us go into on this podcast.
Anyway.
Back in August, Fucked Up had a fleeting trip to London to play at Visions Festival. Damien was due to come to Loud and Quiet's offices to record this, but very graciously offered to relocate to his hotel room nearby when a guy with a pneumatic drill started digging up the crete car park outside our window. Poor Damien had literally just stepped off an overnight flight. He hadn't even
had a moment to unpack his suitcase. But he is a pro, and he is a gentleman, even offering me some of his pot noodle, which, incidentally, and I do feel bad about this, went cold by the time we'd finished this podcast, so I probably owe him lunch at some point before I leave you with that. Though this is the penultimate episode of this series of Midnight Chats, I'll leave Stuart with you next week to wrap it up.
After that, will disappear for a little while, but we will bring you some more episodes for me personally, though, I've loved chatting to everyone from Interpol to Anna Kelvi to John Grant for this series. I hope you've enjoyed listening. Like we always say, if you do want to do us a favor, it's subscribe, comment, share, and more. Basically, just tell your mates if you do like Midnight Chats.
But let's crack on. This is episode sixty two. This one is Damien from Fucked Up Enjoy Damien, Welcome to Midnight Chats.
Thank you for having me in Monday Chats in my hotel room.
I know we had planned full disclosure. Normally, regular listeners will know that we record this podcast either in our office in East London or sometimes we take it out and about depending on who we're speaking to, is you know where they are at that time. But rather inconveniently, they decided to dig up the car park next door to the office, and at the moment there's a giant drill that's like basically taking out a whole chunk of concrete.
So we had we had to come here. Thanks for accommodating us.
Well, I'm very happy. I like, you know, I love having people over. I wish I could have prepared something a little bit more substantial than one order of pot noodle, but you know, we can share.
I got two spoons, th mate, Yeah what flavor if you got one?
Bombay bad boy two spoons?
But it's not your favorite part.
No, I'm a beef and tomato. I'm definitely a beef and tomato fan. I also love one. I don't know if they're still doing it because I haven't seen it in a while. But when we used to come here and they'd have like the surprise flavors, like kebab flavor or like Southern fried chicken flavor, and it never really tasted like any of those things, but it was always delicious.
And they always do yeah, limited runs. They do it with Walkers Crisps as well. They'll do like they'll be like, these three flavors are available for the next six months. The one that sells the best we will keep. But they're all sorts of yeh, bizarre things like English breakfast flavor, crisps and stuff.
Yeah, I like Branston pickle flavor.
That's a good flavor when you have that one.
Yeah, I don't think I ever got round to those, but does sound good.
They're delicious.
A lot of people we have on our podcast when they come on, it might be like the first time, certainly amongst the first times that they've done a podcast. But you are a very experienced handed. You've got not just one, but a couple of podcasts, right.
Yeah, I do. But I'm actually not as experienced in this side of the podcast. Like I keep waiting for me to ask a question of you, like that's what I'm so used to doing. Like, yeah, I think I've only been as a guest on a podcast. Well, my friend Danko Jones's podcast, I've been on that a few times. But I'm also like I'm like a co host on that one too. I think I've only been a guest on like two or three podcasts.
Okay, so this is a little bit of a new experience.
You're gonna have to hold my hand and guide me into this, because I might screw this all up.
I'm gonna start swearing.
And saying things I wouldn't need you to edit, like all the things you hate when you're interviewing on a podcast.
What's your favorite thing about making your own podcasts?
I think it was, you know, I just before I did my own podcast, I was the host of The Wedge on Much Music, which is like for It's like the music program that all of us of a certain age grew up with in Canada that got wound up getting into alternative for punk music. And I was doing
that show, and I love doing that show. But the thing that bothered me was the fact that I always had to incorporate stuff that I wasn't necessarily interested in or you know, I'd be in these interviews and I'd be asking the person like, oh, like you played in this band before you did the band you're in now, let's talk about that for a while. And then my producer would be like kind of got to keep it
on what's happening now? So when I lost that job, I was like, well, I'm going to just do my own thing, and I'm going to make it exactly like I want it to be. And it's just an excuse to punish people, Like there's very few socially acceptable situations that allow you to grill someone, like just grill them with questions and pepper them with all sorts of things.
But a podcast is one of those places. So I can have these kind of conversations with people that I'm a lot of times friends with that I've toured with before or played in other bands with, but never had the opportunity to find out, like what was your demo band?
Like what do they sound like?
So your podcast will turn out punk? Yes, And so basically give it to people. If anybody hasn't heard this yet, because I've kind of been gorging on your podcast recently, as I've already told you, I've been kind of making my way back through your substantial archive almost two hundred episodes now, I think. Yeah, So in a nutshell, it's called turned out punk. Tell people what you do with it.
It's me sitting down and having a conversation with for the most part, one person who was involved in punk may or may not still be involved in punk, but had their life changed by it in a major way.
And so it's amazing. I've always kind of felt this, like there is this weird.
Commonality between a lot of the people that I find interesting in pop culture, and that's the fact that they were always somehow into punk music, you know.
And I just revel in the opportunity to kind of sit down with.
Someone when I know this stuff about him and just have this conversation. I think Jack Black's like the perfect example. He was a guest recently. He's someone that I went on tour with five six years ago with Tenacious Ty and Fucked Up and the Foo Fighters, And on that tour, I was asking him like, were you in a punk Like were you a punk rocker guy? Because it seems like you might have been. He's like, no, no, no,
not at all, not at all. And then over the years the evidence began to emerge and I realized my instincts were correct. Jack was the liar in this situation, and so I had him on the show and exposed his lie for the world to see he was indeed a punk rocker.
The Jack Black episode is definitely one of the highlights. So I went back and I listened to that one the other day, and it did unveil this whole kind of punk rock history with him that people would probably
not be familiar with at all. But amongst that you've had, well, the series itself forms if people have like a passing interest in punk, or even if you're a real punk head, it's beginning to create a real ata z history of punk rock because of the people that you've had on it that are from various different places around the world, but also different scenes, different cities, different sounds, and so it's like creating this whole universe where the dots are
like joining it's. It's it's a really immersive listen because what you're what you're doing is basically creating this sort of yeah, of all the stars of punk that are out there that you're kind of putting them in one place. So you know, there must be some pride in basically putting together this this kind of compendium of the history of punkin away.
I thank you for that. I think that is just a happy accident.
If that's happening because I think, you know it definitely, it fills my bucket, as my children like to say when they're happy. When I do find like a weird connection between two people. Like two weeks ago, I had Dwid leasing of the band Integrity, one of my it's like my Frank Sinatra as far as vocalists go, like someone I.
Have been heavily influenced by.
And then I had Dave Paho from Slint, you know, like one of them, you know Swan like Papa Am like a legendary indie rock guitarist, and both of them from different cities, have the same starting point in Louisville, Kentucky at this band that Dave played in Maurice's shows, and Dwyd was a fan of this band, Maurice, And so in that room.
You also have Will Oldham.
So you've got Will Oldham, Slint, all the people that would be Slint and Dwid from Integrity in this like little tiny club in Louisville, Kentucky. Like these three people that would have massive impacts on kind of different sounding genres, but like yet they all have the same starting point.
You've had people like Nate Mendel from Food Fighters, who's in Brotherhood and.
We might be in this band of the food Fighters too, But he's really in Brotherhood, even though he was never allowed to be an official member because he wasn't straight edge and he wore no effect shirt.
Yes exactly, and then he went on being sunny Tale.
In Real Estate. He's also in Galleon's Lap. He's got like.
He's got the quiet member of Food Fighters with serious history, isn't he.
The food Fighters to me are one of the great They are the greatest punk rock supergroup of all time. And no diss on Taylor, because I haven't talked to Taylor about it. I'm sure he does have a punk pass that I haven't discovered yet. But when you have the original drummer in that band, you've got members of the Germs, You've got members of Dane Bramage and Scream in Mission Impossible. You've got like members of Brotherhood and
Didley Squad in there. You've got members of all these other Seattle cool straight edge bands, like the pre other sunny of the Real Estate band that the drummer was in. It's like, Wow, they put together like the greatest punk band ever without even realizing it and unfortunately, well not unfortunately, They've done incredibly well for themselves. I don't think they have any regrets they decided to play a different genre
of music. But I would long for the day where they're like, Okay, let's do it, let's write a hardcore record and it's like Brotherhood meets the Germs meets Dane Bramage.
Would I wouldn't put it again since to be honest, Like I mean, I guess you know, Dave Girl has been involved with all sorts of projects that are on the Foo Fighters over the years. Who knows he might might be yearning to return to that sound.
I've tried to get him to do, Like when we were on that tour, I was like, you know, you did that probo record, what about doing one for punk and hardcore? But I don't know if it really lens itself to punkin hardcore, like it seems like, you know, punk is almost about thumbing your nose at someone doing that.
Yeah, whereas that I think more embraces it.
Yeah. Is there anybody that you've yet to have on the podcast that you are dying to have? Do you have like an almost like a bucket list of people that you really want on who's on it?
Oh gosh, it's a huge list. Rick Rubin, you know, I'd love to talk to him about Hose the pre his like and def Cham was a punk label and it started.
The first two records are punk records.
This is it. So people will be familiar with Rick Rubin's production work now in this era, because you know, he's out in his Shangri Las studios in Los Angeles, Malibu. He's not wearing any shoes on his feet, and he's producing all of these huge records. You know, he's working with Kanye West, you know, and he's working with Smashing Pumpkins, and he works like a kind of across the board. But as you just alluded to that, the guy's got his roots are in punk rock.
At one point he was taking a rubber stamp and stamping Hose onto a brown paper bag and sliding his seven inch in and calling that packaging that is it's a oh no, sorry, I think it's it's a glue piece of paper. I should he was not rubber stamping. He was gluing a piece of paper on it. But still it is a brown paper bag. That is the sleeve for that and that is that record right there in that brown paper bag is the jumping off point for one of the most important record labels to emerge
in the eighties. Like everything from Run DMC to Slayer you know had at a place on there.
So so Rick Rubin's one that you.
Right there.
Elizabeth Hurley, she's talked a lot about growing up loving the Clash and other punk bands and stuff. I would love to talk to her about what she saw because I think, like also, she'd be too young to have caught a lot of that first wave going to show its Like, no doubt she was a fan of that stuff, but I imagine most of those bands were kind of done by the time she was in there, So I'm like, what.
Bands was she seeing?
Like did she see Leather Fait, did she see like Napalm Death? Like what are the bands like in that in middle period? That's the stuff that I'm really fascinated by, like, you know, And another great one would be Gillian Anderson too, who was a punk model for a time, a New Way punk model, and so I'd love to find out
what kind of band she liked. And then my, my, my ultimate white whale I think is Josh Brolin, the actor who was the original drummer in rich kinson Elski before they became rich Canzonelski.
Right were you Are you aware that Ben Stiller was in a post yes that captured tracks right now, you're chasing that one.
That's uh, the Capital Punishment his name of his band, not to be confused with the German Capital Punishment once again. Like that's another example. Like that was someone that I didn't know untill they announced that record, I think.
Four years ago, three years ago they were trying to do it, and all.
Of a sudden, it was like, oh shit, yeah, the guy was flirting with disaster. Of course he was in a punk band. That's why I liked him, That's why identify.
With that dude.
Yeah, it feels like you'll you'll pocast kind of uncovering all these people that have a punk pass. So we weren't even necessarily aware, did you know.
I think sometimes they're not even aware they did.
I remember David Cross I called them up because there's this video online of a show in Atlanta. It's Rupe Paul's band we we Poll playing a very early show of them playing, and they're being interviewed by like a college TV station in the basement and at one point the interviewer turns to the guitar player and he pulls out a cigarette and he's like, oh, are you nervous, and.
He goes, of course I'm nervous.
I'm nervous every time before I play, and he puts a cigaret in his mouth and then someone comes and leans in and lights it and it's David fucking Cross. It's when I saw that video, I was like, my jaw hit the floor. And so I'd seen the video a few years ago and then finally one day I just, you know, texted David Cross and I'm like, you got to come on my podcast about punk and he's like, I wasn't really in a punk and I'm like send
them the link to the video. It's like, then explain this to me and he's like, okay, I'll come here, pot look on me. It came on the podcast and it was like by the end of it, he's like, you're right, you know, I was totally in a punk rock. It did change my life. It did define a huge part of me. But I think there's like an insecurity because punk has been so codified and like what punk is is very much defined in the media as a
very specific thing. But when you actually get into it, especially with people that were there at the jump off, like you know, when when punk coalesced in, like the late seventies early eighties, it was not one style and it was like not one type of dress, like that was something that was put onto it after the fact.
Like it was all types of bands. And if you listen to the first wave of punk, even the stuff coming out of New York, or the stuff coming out of London, or the stuff coming out or all of England. Actually at that time, all those bands sound different. The Buzzcocks saynd nothing like Susie in the band Shees just said, nothing like the Clash she said, nothing.
Like the sex Pistols.
Like all those bands yet were punk, you know, And then it got even more interesting when the DIY explosion happened.
So basically, the longest short of it is that I aged people go and listen to your podcast because it's I mean, this is just a mere taster of kind of the depth and the stories that get revealed as part of it, Like these days I should probably fill people in as well. You and I met, we worked out or rather I worked out today that you and I met for the first time almost ten years ago
to the day. You were part of Fucked Up at that point, and we met up to do a piece, a cover feature for Enemy magazine.
I would say it's still one of the most exciting things that ever happened to me in my music career.
Oh well, that's absolutely I'm glad to hear it.
Beyond the cover of the Enemy was, you know, and obviously now it's print format is gone for it, but like that was a huge deal, Like even in Canada, I knew that was a big deal, you know, and I would pick up The Enemy as an import, you know, because there was better bands covered than a lot of the times in the Canadian music press.
Can I tell you about my recollections of that day.
Yes.
So it was a bank holiday Monday in the UK, which means people were kind of off work and the place was quiet. I traveled up to brad because you were playing a kind of infamous club in brad legendary twelve club, that's it. I was sent off to meet this this mysterious band called Fucked Up because at this point, you know, there was no Facebook, there was no Twitter, really, you know, a decade ago, it was all whispers and and rumors and all this kind of stuff was the
information that we were getting about the band. So I was really excited to meet you all. And I met with you guys, and each member of the band told me a completely different story about how the band formed. Told me that you all hated each other and you didn't know why you were there, and it was like this. It was a journalist's absolute dream, because I can remember coming away with sort of hours worth of interviews and also just this sort of jig saw of a story
to tell and for the photos of it. Part of the photos, we were with a photographer called Danny North that day, an amazing photographer, amazing photographer but also one of an incredibly nice guy, and we'd had an idea for what we were going to do for the photos, and we went to a supermarket and an independent supermarket in Bradford and we were going to take photos of you in the like fizzy pop aisle. Basically I'm not sure why where that idea came from.
But was I drank so much soda back then? That's right, that would take like six liters of soda day.
You had like a bottle of a bottle of fanta.
I think pepsi.
Pepsi was my go to as I'm drinking one right now, but that's because I'm exhausted right now.
Just medicinal reasons only.
Okay, we'll come back to the fizzy pop. In a sect we were in Bradford. We we'd ask this this kind man who ran this shop whether we could take some photos in his shop, and he sort of looked a bit bewildered, but was like, okay, sure, And we went back to the back of the shop into the aisle. There's nobody there, and Danny took your photo and and and you kind of took a razor blade and cut
your head open. And so we're bleeding in this independent supermarket on the outskirts of Bradford on a blank holiday Monday, and the guy behind it till looks over to see what we're up to, and suddenly it's like, what the.
Hell you're forgetting it?
Also, I had a bloody hunk of meat in my hand too, that's right, because we couldn't get a heart.
But it's just like this, it looks like a heart. It's like some organ me it might be liver.
Did we have some fake blood that we must have had some fake.
I think it's all the real blood.
Your blood, No, my blood.
I couldn't bleed. I was so nervous.
I barely bled because remember you guys were like, maybe shoul just go the bathroom and pull the blade jobs you're not doing in the middle of the thing. And I'm like, good call. So one of the bathroom, I was like, I can use your bathroom.
They're like, okay.
They showed me where the staff bathroom is. They're waiting for me outside. I come out covered in blood.
And so Danny took maybe ten frames before we were like we need to get out of here. I just remember it's rushing out, getting in the car and driving back towards the venue, and we were all laughing like I like little kids. You know. It was such a thrill and went back there and that show is like forever imprinted on my mind because you know, I think just the energy of the occasion and everything else. And had the the Trojan horan.
Cardboard tropan aboard trojan horse.
That's right, that's right, And it was just this It was maybe there were maybe a one hundred and fifty two hundred people there that night and it was just incredible. But that's the first time we met, and that I can't believe it's almost well, yeah, almost a decade ago.
What do you remember from those very kind of early days of taking Fucked Up abroad and kind of like, you know, the sort of spreading the word about that band because or actually, rather put it in another way, when people ask you what Fucked Up is or what Fucked Up were when you got together, just explain that a bit, you know, because some people won't be entirely familiar with the early days. You know, you were a bunch of punk kids from Toronto, all played in different bands,
came together formed Fucked Up. But like, what what was the Damien version of events?
Like we were we were we were all friendly, you know. I think Mike and I were the closest friends at that point. I wasn't in the band though, when they originally started. I remember Mike coming to me and he said, I want to form the most fucked up band part possible, and I'm gonna call it Fucked Up And he was naming it after the NTA song and he actually had written on the wall in our bathroom because we shared an apartment.
Fucked up.
Also, Sandy lived in that apartment too because her apartment was being renovated, and she's like, I need to move into your apartment for like a couple of weeks. I'll pay you guys rent, and we're like, sure, you can live in the living room. About six months later, we're like, you got to get out of this place. Campe still being worked on. We need a living room in our apartment eventually, because there was like five other people living there.
But so Mike Kid decided to put together the most fucked up band possible and just put together.
Josh was gonna be on vocals.
They were super influenced by this band from Virginia Beach nine years insure its Virginia Beach. Someone's gonna crect me and say it's w wasthing DC or something, but that general area called No Justice, and the singer of that band, Timmy, one of the greatest front people I've ever seen, does stuff that I would never be able to do because I don't like to necessarily hurt people in the crowd.
But like when you were at those shows and you see him like walking on people's heads all around the venue, like running on people's heads, like throwing the drummer's drum stuff into the audience, like you know, just like going crazy on stage. And so that was Mike and Josh's inspiration. They're like, we want to form a band like that. So Josh was on vocals, Mike was on guitar, Sandy was on bass, Chris Callahan was on drums. Chris Collahan is the singer in.
Cursed.
He's saying and left for dead, he's been in He's kind of our legendary local punk guy. And so he was playing drums in the band. Of course he had other bands, so he couldn't do it. So Jonah was brought in as the replacement drummer.
They played I.
Think three shows, and it was just like a not very tight punk band put nicely. I remember the very first show Josh came over. It's in this bar in Toronto called Playing in Kensington. That's no longer there now, it's called Thirsty and Miserable. Where I'm watching them. I'm in the front row. Josh comes over and just kicks me in the nuts and apropos of nothing, and so I picked him up and I choke slammed him like the Undertaker, like just like full On slammed him down.
At that time, Josh had a bunch of friends that didn't really like me, and they really didn't like me. After I choked slammed it in the middle of the show.
He started it. He totally started completely. I was just like rocking out, supporting my friends. Come over, kicks me in the nuts. You want to get crazy, I'll show you crazy. So then Josh had to go. Josh went away to go around. He was traveling doing some stuff. There were two cool shows coming up in Toronto. And that's the thing when you start a band. You don't start a band because you're like, I want to make
great art. You start a band because you're like, I want to play on cool shows with these other cool bands that I like. And so Mike was like, would you like to come and sing.
For these two shows?
And I was sure. We did a demo, and the demo was preferred over Josh's vocals, and so Josh was asked to move to second guitar when he came back from the trip, and he had to learn how to play guitar, and I became the vocalist.
At that point.
An enormous amount has happened in that time two years.
It's fucking like seventeen years now or.
Something, right, right, did you ever imagine that? I mean, I mean, yeah, I'm sure you never did imagine. But like the years later you would go on to play arena tours. I saw you on arena tour with Arcade Fire. You already mentioned it in this podcast. Playing with like
the likes of Foo Fires. You started a band called Fucked Up in Toronto to be the most fucked up band you could imagine, and you end up sharing a stage with huge megabands like that and doing so much stuff in your kind of own right, So, how did it did you? I'm just interested in your kind of thoughts somewhere it all went and how it went, you know, I.
Think I think now looking back on it, it kind of it kind of broke me mentally, I think a little bit, because I knew very it was very defined what fucked Up was. Maybe not in the very very beginning, but like once you started getting going and once started putting out the seven inches, it's like, okay, we know what we are and we had this plan that was
gonna end. We're gonna put this the first LP. It was gonna be called Crusades, and there was gonna be one called Cascades, and they're gonna be built around the same riff.
This is Mike's idea. I'm not taking credit for these ideas. And it was gonna be built around the same riff.
And then we're gonna put it a seven inch called Back to the Womb, and that was gonna be the end of the band.
And we were.
Kind of going towards this plan, you know, and it was going really well, Like people liked the band, which was amazing. Like having someone sing along to words that you wrote is the most gratifying feeling you can have as a fan. I think of punk and hardcore music because so much of the live experience is based on sort of the sharing of the mic, and so to have someone kind of yell your words back in your face, it's just incredible. So I was like, mission accomplished. This
is what I wanted to do. We got it. We got strangers that I don't know singing along to our songs.
We're good.
And then we met the guys from Jade Tree opening for Hertskin in Philadelphia.
The guys from Jtree came.
Over and started talking to Darren and he was like, I think, you know, I like your band. Would you guys want to sign to JD Tree? And all of a sudden, it was, well, that's not according to the plan, so what are you gonna do? So we kind of sat down and came up with a new plan, which is like, let's just do whatever makes our lives more interesting for a while.
And that theme has just continued. You managed to I mean you mentioned that that that success that kind of had an impact, you know, on your kind of mental health. Is that just because you never imagined your life being taken in that direction or like it was it dealing with the the scale of it, the intensity of it, the lifestyle of it, all of those things makes together.
I think it's all those things. I have an anxiety disorder. You know, I've had it my whole life. I recognize that now, you know, And I really started getting treated for it in my early twenties, which is kind of around the time Fucked Up started getting going.
So I think I didn't really come to terms.
With how my life was impacted by my thought process my anxiety until fairly recently. So a lot of times the situations that you're thrust in are the worst possible situations to deal with when you have an anxiety disorder, you know.
And it's so I think it.
Was the travel was getting got to me, just like the loss of control, you know. Like I we went from being in a band where every city we went to, I'm like, oh, here's my group of friends. I'm going to stay at this friend's house tonight and We're gonna all hang out and have fun. And I'm just going to like travel around the world basically having slumber parties at friend's houses. And then all of a sudden it became like, no, no, that's.
Kind of a job and it needs to be at the arena three.
Yeah, we never showed up for one of those arcade fire shows on time. We were late for every single night of the tour.
I just imagining Wins just like tapping is tapping his watch, being that West. We brought these guys on twity and even sign up on side. Well.
The thing was it was routed for a bus and weren't a van like trying to catch up to go keep out around your Yeah, and it's also like one of the coldest winters on record in Europe too, and we're like, yeah, we were late. We were load onto the stage in front of the full pack stadium. We're like wheeling our amps out.
To the guys. I guess because one second we start playing.
Yeah, like it's still like playing a you know, a basement show, but in front of twenty thousand people, thirty thousand people.
But it's yeah, I think it was that. It was the.
It was a lot of stuff. It was like not you know, not being the cool punk band. All I wanted to do was be in the cool punk band, Like that was the dream. And then when I was in the cool punk band, it's like, all right, let's do it. And I have really enjoyed every experience that's come to my band since, you know, and I and I still enjoy them. But at the same time, it
wasn't what I had prepared for. So when it stopped being what I had prepared for, what I had envisioned, that's when it was became like, well what is it?
Like where are we at?
And I think that that Enemy cover day was a very interesting day, you know, because that was like the two was like the fucked up that we were becoming kind of colliding head on with the fucked up that we were. It was a uh, just once again like it's all in my head. You know, I realize that now how much of that was in my head? But yeah, I think and it changed at the last record, Like the last record is what really broke me, like Glass Boys.
I think after Glass Boys, I was just like, you know what we gotta you gotta sit down and rethink.
This was not just you wanted to take a break, or you just you needed some time away from it, or you needed to be thinking about other things. You needed to organize your your your mind a bit different new.
Or I wrote Glass Boys to be the last fucked up record that I write, you know, like I wrote the songs that I wrote on There were all these things that I've been kind of like wrestling with for like the last or the proceeding sort of ten years, and I just kind of laid them out there on that record, and I was like, well, I've said it, I'm done now. And then so after that record, when Mike came to me and he's like, let's do a
new record, I went down. I tried to write and I just couldn't write, you know, I just was not in that space, like I really do feel like Class Boys was my like that's where I've said what I wanted to say, you know. And I wrote some songs for it, and there's a couple of songs on B sides that I ended up writing after the fact, but the stuff that I was writing I wasn't happy with. So I was like, I'm sorry, Mike, I don't think
I can do this right now. I was also working on a TV show, so I was away a lot at the time. So I came back one day from one of these shoots and Mike's like, I finished the record, like I've written all the songs, all the lyrics, and I was like.
Well, how's this gonna go?
And I went in there and it was a completely different experience than any other fucked up recording I'd ever had, where, you know, once again, i'd be in my anxiety, I'd be arguing with Mike over song placements, over who gets to write which song, like all sorts of things, and this time I kind of just went in and I'm like, let's just ride this wave and see how it turns out. And so I didn't argue with Mike on it just about anything.
That is unique for Fucked Up, but unique. Even in the times that we've seen each other over the years, the band has always been very refreshingly honest in the sense that you would always admit that there are certainly times where you basically can't stand the side of each other, you know, where things that tension does build when cause you are always living in each other's pockets when you're on the road, for example, and when you did that
for such an intense period of time, things get difficult, I'm sure, but you always admitted to that. It was never like you kind of tried to cover up those cracks, if you like. It was an admission that they were sort of part of what it was that you did. Is that fair to say?
Yeah? Absolutely, yeah, and I think we you know, and like it. Then it became almost like a marketing thing. I was like, Oh, they don't get along as a band. I know they're just saying that, but it's true, Like I think we are five six very different people, you know, like we all wait then Josh, Mike, Sandy Damien, then Josh Mike, Sandy Damon.
Yeah, five five but but Jonah.
I forgot Jonah six. I always forget Jonah, the nicest member.
Hang on, we're here in the UK's play a show and it's five of us. Where's the drummer?
Well, that's why they got those drum machines, you know, big Black.
I feel like that should be part of a kind of like a punk you know, satire documentary where he left the drummer at the service station and driven onto the gig. You know, we're missing somebody here. Who is it the drummer?
They left me at a truck spop. One time in Germany we did that. I watched them drive off. I was so pissed, like you motherfuckers. I was chasing them down the street and then I just gave up, and I'm like, well, what are we gonna do?
This?
Before no cell phones existed, obviously, but it's before I.
Had a cell phone, so I'm like, well, I'm trapped in this random German town with nothing.
So what happened?
Then they eventually realized that I wasn't in the van and turned back. But it was a good five minutes.
Guys, how did you not notice that I was in the van?
Come on, yeah, they're like, Man, it's so quiet, Oz.
I want to talk about a couple of your other great loves. Because we've already talked about the podcast that you make. We talked about the band obviously, you and I we have spoken before. I've been fortunate enough to have to kind of have an insight into your every day at home. You live in a family home in Toronto with your wife and your three children. You've collected an absolutely enormous amount of memorabilia and records and incredibly cool stuff over the years. But you've got a vinyl
record collection of almost ten thousand. You're telling me so, like all of your passions exist there at home, But there's a couple of things now that, alongside the music, you're really passionate about, one of which is wrestling. Yes, tell me a little bit about that, Like, you've got to treat me as a complete wrestling novice, Like I know very little about it. So what was it that first attracted you to the theater of wrestling and what brought you into your interest in that?
I think, like, and I.
Would say, this is just about like almost everyone else in the world, because this is truly something that happens globally with professional wrestling. As a young person, I was taken to and I think it's a lot of young people see it, you know, like whatever type of wrestling
you're exposed to, and it's exciting. You know, it's like people fighting, but they're not fighting like when people really fight, where it's just sort of upsetting and violent, Like they're fighting in a spectacular, entertaining way, and they're doing these amazing moves, and there's bright costumes and these sort of eccentric, larger than life characters. Like you're seeing real life superheroes.
And as a young person, you know, you want to believe in superheroes, so you're seeing like physical, real people are that perform like superheroes.
Like you see Ray Maisterio in the ring. He looks like a superhero.
Obviously, we've both got experience of speaking to working with getting familiar with musicians and artis people that work in that area. Is it similar? How different is it that when you meet you know, sometimes I meet with them in bands, they've ever quite clearly defined persona one that's on stage and one that's off stage. Is that the same for wrestling or is it different?
It's different it's different, like it's wrestling is like it's very similar, like the lifestyle and the world like. And that's the thing is, I got more as I got more and more into punk and more and more into music. As I got older, I started leaving wrestling behind, being like, well, it's not conducive with what I'm into now. But as I kind of got, you know, more aware of it, I realized, no, all these guys.
Are punk rockers too.
All these people kind of come from the same sort of backgrounds, not all of them, but a lot of them, especially the newer generation of people. And I started seeing like how similar their world of traveling, especially on the indie circuit, is to the world of an indie band, Like you know, you're traveling from city to city, staying at people's houses, you know, really connecting with your fans, Like your fans are not a huge number of them, but the people that are coming you connect to it
in a very direct way. But I think pro wrestling is like punk rock is all about no, you can do it too. Yeah, you and the crowd get a guitar, be like us, come on stage, do it, do it.
And wrestling it's like it's it's a secret world, you know, and they don't want you to come behind the curtain, you know, so it'll be they're friendly, you know, they're but like at the same time, like you're a fan and they're a wrestler, you know, and there's there's even like old wrestling lingo like that you're a mark and they're a worker, and you know, marks don't hang out with workers and stuff like that has changed because everything's
kind of changed, but like you still meet wrestlers that don't have time for fans, like in a way that you know that's different than a musician, you know, like everyone has bad days and stuff like that. But there's certainly wrestlers that are, you know, very willing to keep
you out of arm's length. And I think that's because it's it's kind of like magicians, you know, with their secrets, and it's also still kind of an outlawt sport, like they're still trying to trick the audience into thinking what's happening in the ring is different than what is actually happening in the ring.
You know.
It's still it's never I would never use the word fake to describe it, because it's very real. No matter what they do to each other, they are getting hurt. Like having now taken a couple of these bumps, even the most minor thing in the ring can really fucking hurt.
Yeah, yeah, I mean you mentioned already you've made TV series about wrestling. Yeah, you know, you make You've been involved with podcasts and stuff before and in wrestling.
Is that right?
I've wrestling podcast and then I did, like you're I started making cannabis documentaries for Vice about five years ago, and the whole time I was like, there's this deathmatch wrestling tournament that happens in Delaware, and deathmatch wrestling is
the most maligned, misunderstood sub genre of wrestling. Like, you know, I guess you could liken it to like rock music, classic rock, and then over here you've got like grindcore or something that like the classic rock guys would be like why would you ever want to hear that noise? You know, and a lot of the you know, mainstream pro wrestlers like why would you ever want to be
involved in that garbage wrestling? But what it is, it's pro wrestling, so it's still people working together in the ring to kind of trick the audience into thinking what they're seeing is different than what they're actually seeing. But they actually use weapons on each other, and you can't, you know, trick.
The audience with a weapon.
You have to kind of use the weapon, like so you're not going to kill the person with the weapon, like I'm sure you could, but you are going to make them bleed and probably need stitches. So it's weapons like barbed wire, light bulb tubes, fire, thumb tacks, a lot of thumb tacks, kenzon, which is used for flower arrangements. In this wrestler Jeff Cannonball, straightedged vegan, hardcore kid, had one hammered into his head and it.
Took like eight people to take it out afterwards.
So I knew I wanted to make a documentary about this thing, and VICE was like, I don't think anyone's gonna care about wrestling. So I tried for four years and then finally they were like, Okay, here's a little bit of money, go make your show.
Go go make this movie.
So I made the movie with this director, Shannie Cohen, amazing director. Came back and it did really well, and then they were like, okay, what would a.
TV show look like?
Right?
Right? So we started working on the TV.
Show, So of the way you just described it there makes me understand it a bit more now. It isn't hugely miles away from comparisons to rock musical, punk rock music in the sense that there's like this kind of one overriding name that it's given wrestling, punk rock, whatever. But then you have all your kind of like sub genres and your different communities that exist in different places, and they're all a different twist, a different spin on it.
And obviously you've got your characters that have been involved in it from over the years, so you've got your legends, and you've got your emerging newcomers and all that kind of stuff. The storylines aren't all that different, are they from anything else?
No, And I think it's actually the storylines that happen outside of wrestling are are probably more relevant now than.
They've ever been. Like you look at America. The President of the.
United States is in the WWE Hall of Fame.
Yes, And I saw today that Cain, who might be a name people recognize from from Wrestling of Wrestling Fame.
If you don't remember Kane, just think of him as the Undertaker's brother.
That's right. He's just become mayor of Tennessee, is.
That right, A mayor of Knoxville, Mayor of Knoxville.
Okay, So, and that's.
Happened before Oneita in Japan, he was in the diet Antonio Noki was in politics over there. There's certainly in all over the world there's been wrestlers that have kind of crossed over.
And I think it's because in wrestling, there's this term called.
K fabe, and it's the idea of what wrestling is, you know, and it's the idea that like it's hard to explain, but I guess it's like to simplify.
It's the idea.
That the wrestling world might not be reality, but it's presented to the audience as reality, and you're not going to admit that it's not not reality. And that's kind of the exact same thing that happens in politics, you know, like we all know, like even his supporters must know deep down that he's lying and he's fake, but at
the same time, you just make yourself back leave. And there's also this whole line of thought that Donald Trump, if you look at Donald Trump prior to his run in WrestleMania, a few years ago, he was really a star and a celebrity of a very different population than makes up his base. You know, if you look at the demographics that watched The Apprentice, it was incredibly diverse,
generally progressive audience was watching The Apprentice. He was you know, mocked but written up in Spy Magazine, which certainly wasn't a magazine that was read by a lot of people in more red.
States at the time.
But then when he went on WrestleMania, that's when he met his bass And that's also when he learned how to cut a promo, It's when he learned how to deal with the hostile crowd.
It's when he he learned and.
You know, I talked to friends that were writing for ww back then and working with him when he was there, and they were saying he was quiet, very respectful and just listening interesting.
So he kind of schooled himself in some of those skills that he's gone on to use to become president.
Absolutely, And it's and it's amazing how with wrestling, like it goes further too. Like if you think about the WWE, which is WWF, which is where we all kind of in you know.
America, it's the thing. It's the McDonald's, you know.
But like McDonald's, they make one style of food. However, wrestling is you know, not always McDonald's. There's all different types of hamburgers out there. There's burgers that are made with tofu, there's burgers that are made with chicken. There's
all different types of hamburgers out there. And I think that's the thing, is like when you go out there and you realize, oh, there's all these different types of hamburgers, and like kind of just corporations do they take over, you know, Like so like Starbucks does this with coffee, ww has done it with wrestling. So it's not coffee anymore. It's Starbucks, you know, and it's not wrestling anymore.
It's WWE. And of one of the.
Side effects of doing that are probably actually not even a side effect, when one of the sort of main components in making that happen is to wipe out traditional forms of wrestling that exists. Like you see it in the UK in the eighties when the WWE came over and they ran Wembley and they had that huge show and wrestling became very popular here. It annihilated world of sport.
It annihilated British wrestling, which had been something that had a huge tradition that goes back centuries decades at least, and now it's finally coming back again. But like once again, it's amazing to kind of much it.
It kind of, I don't know.
Mirrors the reality of the real world when you look at wrestling.
Yeah, certainly does when you kind of think of it, like yeah, in those terms now, and just the very real consequences of Donald Trump going from that to being in the Whitehouse. The final thing I kind of wanted to talk to you a little bit about was you mentioned that along with wrestling, you've also made documentaries about cannabis.
Because and you guys just got medical cannabis here.
Well, this is the thing. So this is quite a timely thing to ask you about. So you've been talking about this subject for what kind of five, six, seven, eight years or a long time.
It's been eight years now.
Cool, because Canada has very much been one of those countries where the debate has been going for quite a while. There's been some you know, recent movement in that. So there was the medicinal use of cannabis was brought in and then recently followed by the recreational legalization.
Coming October seventeenth.
October seventeenth, Okay, so talk to me a little bit about the journey that and the debate that's been had around that in Canada, and then I'm interested to know what you think, Yeah, what you think the positive consequences of that has been so far, and what why presumably you're kind of all for it and you know why you think it would be a good thing for the UK to do.
It's a long This is definitely an area that I'm obsessed with as well, so I can ramble forever for it. Well, I think I'm not in favor of legalization as it's being presented right now.
Okay.
If you look at some of the regulations that are coming out about how cannabis is going to be handled under regulation under legalization, I mean there's some really frightening things in there. You can't be stoned in public, like public drug kenness is a crime. Public high intoxication is going to be a crime, even though being high on
cannabis is nothing like being drunk an alcohol. But they have now made this sort of equivalency, so they also have made it illegal and punishable up to fourteen years in prison if you're caught with cannabis. That's not government approve cannabis which they're making money on. Also, like let's say if you gave a child a drink. If you gave your own child a beer, your teenage child in Canada, that's not a crime. If I gave my child's friend a beer, that would be a five hundred dollars fine.
If I gave my child cannabis, which I would never ever do, But if someone did give a child cannabis, it's fourteen years in prison. The police are going to still have all the same tools that they have under prohibition criminalization, but they're also going to be able to generate a little bit of revenue off of this cannabis. Now, they're still going to be able to bust people at nauseam.
Yeah, yeah, So it is the most kind of simplified way of looking at it. That like the medicinal ways that cannabase has been introduced in Canada, there have been positive consequences from that. Do we obviously getting to point where they're about to legalize it, But as you say, there's a whole nother huge more around that to kind of unravel to see if it's actually gonna work. What's your kind of view generally on.
Our medical program actually was never that great in Canada. Like America, because of the state sort of freedoms that they're given, they've developed a lot more evolved medical programs, especially Colorado, California, Washington State prior to legalization, so they already had like little industries set up. In Canada, the government has always been like, we don't really want to have to deal with this problem. There's been a lot of efforts to legalize cannabis in Canada over the years.
It's always kind of stalled out. Just before it happened, the medical program kind of just developed on its own, you know. There was the government made provisions to allow people to have access to medical cannabis. People then decided to start setting up dispensaries to sell medical cannabis because it was really hard to get into the government medical program, and they would sell to people that weren't in the program. They would sell to people that were referred to them.
These dispensaries begat another wave of dispensaries.
Mainly in British Columbia and Vancouver that were.
A little more lenient with how much checks they were doing into whether or not someone you know had doctor approval for medical cannabis. And then there was another wave of dispensaries that kind of came after that was just which was just giving cannabis to anyone over the age of nineteen that brought an idea and was able to
buy it. Those were all illegal and the government has shut down all of them, or tried to shut down all of them, I should say, over the years, but they keep popping up, you know, even right now, they keep popping up. Medical cannabis changed my life. Like I'm a huge proponent for medical cannabis, you know, people having access to cannabis.
Period.
I didn't get it through the medical program. Originally, my doctor actually refused to sign a medical form. It was only when I started losing weight when I she agreed to sign me in to the program. I lost one hundred and fifty pounds since I are smoking weed. And you know, I don't think it's going to work like that for everybody. I don't think it's necessarily going to
cure everyone's anxiety. It hasn't even cured my anxiety. It helps me treat it, But the fact that it is going to have that impact on some people I think is reason enough to kind of investigate it and to
allow greater access to it. And also the fact is it's no one's ever died on it, Like, no one has ever died from cannabis, but like there are probably gonna be a few deaths tonight involving alcohol, and definitely gonna be a lot of death involving prescription drugs, you know, And so if we can get people to kind of choose cannabis over those other things, you know, I don't think that's a bad thing.
Like you pointed out, the UK is it's a debate that's been having, you know, being how it kind of right now happened before the summer recess of Parliament around the introduction of medical cannabis the usage of it. So as far as you're concerned, you've seen it work, you've experienced the benefits of that anything, that's something that should definitely be encouraged.
Yeah, I think so, Like, once again, it's not can have the same effect on everybody, but once again, like there's tons of things that we have access to that I think are far more deadly, you know, I think there's certainly, you know, weapons, you know, not so much obviously in Canada and in the UK, but in America you can get access to weapons fairly easily. Prescription drugs, you know, and the amount of time that have got
my doctor to signed me over to medical cannabis. I was offered maybe five other prescriptions that I could have gone on instead. There you know, soda, The amount of sugar that I'm consuming in the soda pop right now, I'm sure is doing way less good for me than a joint would be doing right now. So it's yeah, I definitely see there's I see cannabis is having a
lot of benefits. I just think that one of the scary thing that scary things that is kind of happening under legalization is, you know, there's a group of people that want to take cannabis away and take the revenue away from this other group of people. And like, certainly there are criminals in this other group of people, but there are also just people that love cannabis and have sacrificed their freedom to to you know, be an advocate
for this plant, or have sacrificed their lives. In some cases, people have died for the fact that this plan is illegal and to have this industry ripped away from them and then just given to the same rich white guys that own everything else in Canada, that I kind of find a bum out.
Yeah, and my final question because I'm going to let you play a show with Fucked.
Up and this is the first time in like, oh, I guess we played the subway not too long we played a subway show, but I was gonna say, it's the first time in like like over a year.
Really, so this is the this is like getting back into the saddle.
Then.
Really, yeah, we played We've played a show on the like a subway platform a few months ago, but yeah, like as far as a real show, this is our first reel show and over a year.
How you feeling about it?
Good?
You know, it's it's definitely not. Actually it's a little nervous, you know. It's it's weird to be doing something so much for so long and then to take an extended break from it and then to kind of get back into it. So yeah, it's really different. I also, like I find live shows in general, like I've I kind of.
I kind of you know, as.
I get older, you know, you treat them differently, you know, Like before I'd go out there and I'd just be like, whatever the fuck happens, happens, and you know, that's the show. And now I kind of want to go out there and make sure that there's there's a show too, right, Like I don't want to be just throwing that microphone around till I break it and then I won't be able to sing into a microphone for less for the
rest of the evening. Yeah, So there's like I find changes in the pressures that you experience as a lead singer too as time goes on.
Also, I got beaten up on stage a couple of years ago. It at Sound.
Liverpool, Sound Sound Safe, Sound City in Liverpool.
Okay, what happen that we're playing?
We're playing on stage and I saw this group of guys that I would describe as being somewhat chavvy from what I've been told what a chavel looks like, and they were picking on this couple in the crowd, and I could see the other people in the audience kind of getting you know, involved and trying to get rid of these guys.
So I just jumped off the stage and.
It was you know, quite a number of people and was like, I don't want to play for you guys, get the fuck out, and we just.
Human walled these dudes out of the show.
But one of them broke around our phalanx and smacked the guy and the girl in the face, like this couple in the face. I don't I'm not a fighter. I'm not a tough guy. I don't know a lot of stuff about like that sort of world, but I do know a lot about pro wrestling. So when I saw him do that, I just went to, you know, my best Kurt Angle impression and just attack this dude. And then his friends came over and attacked me, and then more people than more people, and then security was
stopping people, trying to break up the fight. And I'm just covered up and they're just stomping, stomping and stomping, and I got up and we you know, it was over. I was covered in blood. I'm like, holy shit, and they're like, what do you want to do. I'm like, let's finish the set, and so we went up in finish the set.
And I don't know, I think that was a real.
Turning point for me playing live, because I think up until that point, I felt like I was invincible, and I realized after that point that I'm I'm a person. It didn't change the fact that I'm going to go on the crowd, I'm going to interact with people. But what it did is, I think change the way I go into a live show.
Were you injured, were you were afterwards? Effect? You know, does it does it make you not want to you know, psychologically? That's quite the shocking things to do with, isn't it.
It was?
It was definitely, uh, I think I had a concussion in retrospect, I know I had a concussion, especially because of all this stuff I know about pro wrestling. But there's no days off in music, so we played shows immediately after. My jaw was pretty fucked up. I couldn't close my jaw until I got back to Canada. I got a chiropractor to kind of put it back into place for me. Yeah, it was it like, I don't want to make it seem like you know, that made me stage? You know, Yeah, I gave me stage right
after that because it wasn't like that. But I think what it did do is give me a chance to kind of pause and reflect on.
The role of musician and the role of.
Audience and how you know, as the musician in front of this audience, you can feel like you're a superhuman, but the reality is you're just the same as anyone else in that crowd, you know.
And just finally, then we talked about making a podcast about punk history and talking to punk legends.
Well as to cannabis thing, because we have to bring it back to punk again. Yeah, you know, Canadian cannabis legalization only happens because of punk, right, okay. Jel Biafra on his third spoken word record, did a song or did a spoken word track I guess, uh called I
Believe It's everyone should grow more marijuana. And in that spoken word piece he mentions this book The Emperor Has No Clothes, which is written by this cannabis activist named Jack Harro and that's like the original text for cannabis legalization, cannabis advocacy type thing. So he mentioned this book and at the time there was this anarchist not anarchists, I guess, more like libertarian bookstore owner in London, Ontario that owned
this bookstore called City Lights named Mark Emery. Mark, you know, became like a big fan of this jel By Afra spoken word piece. It wasn't a cannabis guy. It was just like, you know, just fucking with the government. Like he would do things like refill expired parking meters dressed as a faery, or he would open up on Sundays, or he'd sell the Two Life Crew record after it was deemed offensive material and couldn't be sold right, So he'd just do anything to kind of agitate the government.
He was like a libertarian guy. So then he heard this track by jel By Afric because at the time by Affra was embroiled in the PERMRCI censorship lawsuit where the PMRC was coming after him for the Geiger artwork in one of their records. So he became a huge fan of Jael by Afra and actually brought him up to London, Ontario do a spoken word thing and really
took to this track Everyone should grow more marijuana. And so he tried order in that book The Empire Has No Clothes and was informed by a supplier that that book was actually on the banned booklist in Canada. So he was like, well, here's my new cause. So he smuggled in that book and also smuggled in High Times magazine, which was also illegal in Canada at the time, and
was selling those and they sold like hotcakes. So then he started bringing in all these advocates and activists and got them to start doing lectures and basically radicalized himself. And then he ultimately moves to BC and opens the first seed bank in British Columbia, selling seeds to America. Eventually got arrested by the American government for selling a million seeds. They charged them for a pound of marijuana for every seed he sold, so they charged him with
one million pounds of marijuana. He did five years in prison, came back to Canada. But he's really there's a lot of baggage with him as a person, so I'm not you know, but when it comes to cannabis, he's really the guy that spearheaded the legalization effort in a big way. And once again, it all comes back to Jello Biafra and punk rock.
It's a cyclical thing, isn't it traces back?
No, And also you didn't we didn't even get into it with wrestling. My god, the punk wrestling connection is strong.
Okay, Well, that's that's for podcasts. Exactly exactly where do you see all of these interests like converging in the next kind of five years, Because you've got to make TV shows about wrestling, you know, you make the podcasts about punk rock, you get to be the front man in a punk band tour in the world. Like, where where do all these interests collide in the next five years. You're a great front man, you're a great broadcast you're a great journalist, So like, where where do things go next?
Well, I definitely appreciate that journalists compliment, but I'm just a fan. As a fan who likes to be a nerd, I think they have, you know, coalesced in a certain exec Like it almost feels like they're once again kind of all feeding off each other, you know. Like recently, a bunch of wrestlers came to town to do a TV taping and I took them to dispensary or a cannabis lounge to smoke cannabis.
Afterwards.
There was another wrestler that I ran into when I was in Montreal, that wrestler from the UK, Jimmy Havoc. Shout out to Jimmy Havock, death Match King of the UK and Jimmy Havock named himself after Davy Havock from AFI. Davy's someone that I've been friends with for a super long time. So I got to introduce the two of them, which was a huge thrill to me. Oh my god, that made my summer getting to do that. Jimmy was
pretty stoked too. Davy was a little indifferent, but Jimmy was super stoked and I was super stoked, which is good enough. So I kind of see them always kind of interacting and like dancing with each other in a real way. You know, MVP who's been on my podcast a bunch, who's a pro wrestler, traveled all over the world wrestling. Also, like you know this punk rock guy who by his own in middle is a fan of
cannabis as well. So you know, I find that all these things kind of are constantly, you know, revolving around each other, and like, I couldn't imagine my life without one of them.
Midnight Chats is a loud and quiet podcast production by Emma Snook Music courtesy of gold Panda. Search Midnight Chats on iTunes for more episodes and to subscribe. For more information, visit loudan Quiet dot com