How Holly Wainwright Reinvented Her Style After 50

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Mama Mea acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded on. Hello, it's Holly Wayne right here, and we are dropping an episode of a show called Nothing to Wear in your midfeed. And if you're wondering why look, indulge me because it was a dream of mine to get to go and talk to Lee Campbell about clothes for a little while. And she asked me on because she's like, oh, you're fifty ish, let's just say and you don't look terrible. I was

Whoever said orange is a new pink with seriously disturbed laurels for spraying groundbreaking.

Oh my god, you have to do it. You live for fashion.

Hello, and welcome to Nothing to Wear, the podcast that solves fashion problems and levels up your wardrobe. I'm Lee Campbell and every week I chat to an expert who helps us work out how to get more out of the clothes we already own and tells us exactly what is and isn't worth adding to our wardrobe. Polly Wayne Right is a powerhouse for many reasons. She's a co host on Mamma Me as flagship podcast Mama Me Are

This is embarrassing because we did this three words style thing on out loud, and I can't remember what mine were, but I think they were something like relaxed something. And then it was suggested to me that one of them should be French, and I got really into that and then you to me, no, it shouldn't be French. I think, like, if I have a picture of my head of what I want to look like, right, I want to look effortless but put together. Yes, And I'm really attracted to

I don't know, but I think we're working on your three words. Obviously we haven't got them. I don't have mine. What is French in terms of a word, because Brenton t long Sley, Brenton Tina Beret.

No, no, no no. If I was picking a style icon of the last few years, it would be Sylvie from Emily in Paris. Okay, now, not strictly speaking, because she flashes a lot of flesh and I do not. But she is an older woman, as am I.

I am now.

Officially fifty three, which is officially quite grown up. But she doesn't conform to lots of rules. But she always looks great, like I love she wears these and she's in Paris, and she's in Paris, and she wears these gorgeous like silk shirts. But you know that look, the look I must spying Flora as a grown up is she looks older. She's not trying to look twenty, and I Am not trying to look twenty or dress twenty.

Too matronly, which is a silly word in itself.

I know, but it's kind of what everybody thinks.

It illustrates what we're trying to say before we get into the topic, which is you and mid and your amazing podcast meet and how you're a very stylish woman. Oh gosh, thanks the ten percent of your wardrobe, you were ninety percent of the time.

So what is on high rotation jeans? So a few years ago and I wrote about this, and I've remained very wedded to this. I think one of my style flaws is that I hold onto things for too like a look for too long. But I found a gene that I love a few years ago that are by Karina. They're an Australian denim brand, and they call the Frayer and they're kind of wide, like high waisted but not too high waisted, wide leg but not too white. And

Because I don't really have to think about it. You know what works.

And I really like that kind of it's a bit seventy.

I was going to say, you give off a bit seven retro. I like that, not rollers skating retro.

I know. Also, you would be so modified if you came to my house, Lee, because I don't really have a proper closet because the bedroom that anyway, long story, but my clothes are all over the house. Some are in Matilda's room, some are in Billy's room.

Oh that's hard to get ready.

And so my ten percent that I wear all the time is literally the one that's in my room. And I just wear those clothes all the time. And then I'll go to my children and I'd be like, oh, I remember I've got that dress.

Yes, so you've physically done an edit by way of storage.

So a lot of jeans, a lot of shirts, and a lot of colorful shoes.

Okay, yeah that's you. And you know what, you haven't held onto those jeans for too long.

They work for you.

Why start a whole new mission?

I know I do really like I love them. I'm wearing a pair today, dark blue. That my darkest wash.

I'm into those now. How has your style changed over the years. Do you think you used to be in magazines? We were both at the same company that we didn't know each other until now. Has your style changed much or have you always kind of been sure of your parameter?

I see, I don't think I'm sure of my parameters. Like a lot of women, I'm quite insecure about my body and my shape and all those things. And I know we don't have to say, don't have to be like women are atally, So often I've been very insecure about what I look like. It's funny that now my go to as jeans, because for a very long time I never wore jeans. I only wore skirts.

Were scared of them.

Dresses, Yes, I was definitely scared of them. I thought they didn't flatter me. I thought because I'm short as well, like I'm really quite sure five foot three. Often when I meet people, they're like, oh, I didn't know you were so sure. And I used to only really wear skirts, and now I rarely wear skirts. I definitely decided around fifty that I was going to make more of an effort.

Work, but every day gets a bit monotonous, whereas now you and I are sort of part time here, it's fun to do the fancy and then the next day you're in your leggings.

And generationally, it's interesting to me that all the young women we work with, who are all very gorgeous and cool in all the different ways, but they will come to the office in leggings like it. Not all of them, but some of them definitely will, And I would never I think that must be a bit of a gen X thing. Like I am not an active wear out of the house unless I am literally just walking the

See. I'm an elder millennial, and I am active where outside of active, but not to the office. And I sometimes think that maybe there needs to be a bit of decorum, But I actually think that's because I'm old and things are changing.

I don't judge it. I just really know, I just judge it. I remember saying to one of my young colleagues recently, oh, but these aren't work clothes in whatever I was wearing. Oh no, And she was like, what a work.

Clothes, particularly in such a casual office. You know, well, speaking of this office, you work so closely with me. She's a bower bird when it comes to trends. She will try anything and maybe everything, all at once. How do you personally feel about trends? Do you think they're too fast, too intimidating.

I think they're too fast and to intimidating. And I am a late adopter. So Mia will be wearing this pair of trainers or whatever, and I'll be like, oh, I like those, but they're too much for me, suddenly everyone in the office is wearing them, and I'm like, oh, no, I don't want to be that. But then six months later I'll totally be wearing them.

Do you feel any pressure to be trend driven or to wear trends?

Though, No, not really. Every now and again I'll get a comment from my beloved friend that makes me go all like, you know how I was wedded and I still am in a way to my wooden soul seventies clogs.

Yes, they're great.

I have so many pairs of those.

So when you find something you really commit, yeah, I do.

When I find something that I love, I love and I'll wear for ages. And I remember mea saying to me once like, you just got to stop wearing those, they're not cool. I was like, I don't care that they're not cool.

They're kind of a very cool right now. Yeah, and it's noisy.

They were noisy. And what amazes me about me and I love love Seeing what she's wearing every day brings me a lot of joy. She walks into the meeting eight thirty in the morning, and I'm always delighted to see what's going on. But I just can't give it that much time and energy, and I just.

Don't Yeah, and the variety, you know, I think it's.

I can't imagine how many clothes she has, or you, my friend, you wear amazing clothes all the time. They're very different vibe.

Yeah, different to me, But I then have the all my personalities in my ward. Sometimes she can't decide. Yes.

Of course, I think that absolutely women can care about fashion and feminism, of course, and politics and makeup and all those things. But it's interesting in that we still have this embedded view in our heads that because the idea of being a real feminist is that you're not kowtowing to the male gate, right, that's the idea. And I know this wouldn't be shocking to you, but I know very few women who actually dress for the male gaze.

When you were younger, do you think you dressed still for yourself or for other women or I have some outfits.

From different eras that were very defining of what I was wearing at that moment. I've always worn whatever I want or whatever I felt comfortable, and, as I say, with all the usual insecurities, you know, I remember there were phases when I would be in relationships and the guy would be like, I like short skirts, and you'd be like, oh, you know that, and then part of you goes okay, and you go and try and you think, yeah,

Because how do you feel when you've put together a good outfit or throw it together and you've come to the city. Does it make a difference if you like the way you feel in your clothes that day?

Definitely, one hundred percent it does. And equally, and this is one of the things that can be quite confronting as you age, right, is that sometimes making and I hate to use the words, but making a bit of an effort, like you know, putting on the lipstick or wearing that outfit, you can become invisible very quickly when you don't as you get older.

Because I think there's a difference between giving no fucks and stop trying, because as long as you're trying for yourself, I.

Think, but that's the key, trying for yourself because often when people say, oh, she's given up, that statement is so loaded, right, It's often about bodies and it's about gray hair, and it's about a lot of things that don't necessarily mean anyone's given up anything, but what I do think, and I've certainly been through periods of my life like this. When I don't like the way I look at all, I do try and disappear. Yeah, and

And do you like that? I do. I like the ability. I mean, I'm forty three next month, and I think I've got to the point where I dress fully for myself, not for my girlfriends anymore, definitely not for my husband, because i'd be wearing red late eggs. But I also like, I care what I want to care, but I don't feel pressure to care if I don't have it in me that day.

If I don't have it in me, I don't have it in me. But I think what's interesting is that if the story you start telling yourself is that I'm invisible, I'm no longer interesting to look at, I'm no longer valuable and to be seen in this world. Because it's a really, really pervasive idea that only young women are interesting in sexy, right, And so we've all digested that.

Idea is dead, Thank goodness, because I felt that too. But you are my moral compass.

Now.

Last year you launched Mid, which is a podcast that has changed my life. I am forty three next month, as I mentioned, and I'm definitely mid.

I am on You're only just mid, but welcome I'm.

Middle, well if I live to eighty something, but I'm your own replacement. Loves that the show really does cater for you know, anywhere, for everybody. It's for everybody. How has Mid changed how you feel about all of this stuff in terms of getting dressed, putting in an effort? Also, our podcasts have recently gone video.

I don't know that many women who love looking at themselves endlessly close up talk.

Yes over the internet, and you have to be on every day.

I it's interesting because we were just talking about, you know, I am here, I'm still here, I'm not invisible. But I've also had to decouple myself a bit from just that constant self critique. It's like, you look old, you're jowled, you're this, you're that. Yeah, very much, tell that voice

About And I feel like from that I've taken mid It might be a life stage in terms of age, but it's not a label. You don't have to be that's all you are. No, it's nothing about that, not at all.

And also the other thing is we've again with this agism that we've all internalized. We're why Like when I think about U, LEI like nearly all the amazing women I know, think of all the shit you've lived through, Like, think of all the things you've been through, all the different versions of yourself. You've been trials, you've survived, the disappointments, the griefs, the triumphs. We're amazing, and yet somehow we've

And it's just going to get better.

Now.

You touched on around turning fifty, you kind of had I won't put words in your mouth at a light bob moment. You wanted to really feel good. So how did you approach that with fashion?

You know how we always, when we used to consume fashion magazines all the time, dressing is always like bottle make you look taller, wottle make you look slimmer, bottle make you look younger. What's flatwering? What's this?

And when out your body shape? You're a pair he this way.

Exactly, and you have all these scripts in your head about I can't wear this, and I can't wear that, and I can't wear that, and I think that part of this whole reclaiming of things. I was like, I can wear what I want, you know, and I will die on the hill that any woman can wear what they want, what she wants in terms of how much flesh she wants to flash and all that. That's not my thing, but like, go hard if it's your thing. But I was like I don't want to stop feeling

Shits a bit of a safety net, h Like, I've got all.

These great pairs of jeans whatever that I know look good with a shirt and a shoe. So where can I find interesting shirts?

You know?

And then colors, Oh, godly don't know.

We're not going into colors. Wear whatever color.

I know, but I for a long time would only wear blue because I love blue. And I walk into a shop and I'm nearly always I.

Think we were in Maya once and you bought a cornflower blues something I.

Did, and I bought a white Greek shirt with like this blue. I love that shit. I still wear it. You can get a bit stuck in those roots, and I was definitely stuck in a blue rot still I'm wearing navy today, so I kind of try and push myself out of those things. But it's also okay, have you comfort?

Oh my gosh, that's called personal style.

Yeah, it's a good thing and it suits me, I think.

So are you feeling a bit on the edge of a little bit of an evolution? I am.

I'm feeling like, what does that look like? I'm not sure, but I've suddenly started wearing flat shoes, which I haven't done for years. Obviously I wear flat shoes in my real life, but in my work life. Back to that sort of insecurity thing and the feeling like I'm a bit short, I always wear a little bit of a heel, my clogs or those awesome shoes that you got me to buy.

But when you walk into the studio today, said Holly, I love your cage sandals, and you said, thank you. What's a cage sand? And it's like a thatched sandal, but it's closed at the toes. So they're very transseasonal. They're the color of the season, cherry red. So look how trendy you are.

I've always loved colorful shoes. Okay. I think that goes back to the times that I haven't felt very confident. You can wear black and a great pair of colorful shoes, you can wear jeans, so I've always had I don't think I own any black shoes, maybe one, and.

I think, you know, pregnancy aside, usually your shoes fit in your back fit exact. At least it's like I'm going to bring my joy there if I'm throwing on something.

So I bought these the shoes are wearing today my new favorite thing. They are from Bed and they are a bright red cherry red sandal and far out. They make me happy.

They're so good to women who are meet or in their fifties and they feel like they're stuck in a style rush. What's your advice.

I think that find a couple of pieces that make you feel great and work from that. I know I've already said it a few times, but I think that just discovering this bit of a uniform for me was a bit of a turning point, and then it let me play with it. So then I was like, oh, well, if I can wear this kind of seventies is Geene and shirt think i'd probably wear like a denim line with my cloggy shoes and.

That was line piece. Yea phase you were great with you.

That was good and it's still in the same yeah, exactly, and so that made me feel good. Just start with something that doesn't feel too scary. And you know what the other thing is is that when you change your style a bit, if you don't live in a fashioning world, sometimes the people around you can make you feel a

Yeah no, does S don't comment?

Oh yeah, So don't let other people scare you and just find something you like and then sort of branch out from there.

I so agree because I think the volume I mean mea and myself aside, who probably have a problem volume is not an ideal scenario. If you're not going to wear it, just get your key pieces that's your ten percent. You don't have to have the ninety percent hiding feet in the back there.

I am a mid range queen, right, so I'm scared of really expensive clothes, but I'm not really a fast fashion.

Caut range if when it comes to everything, I'm like.

I don't want the cheapest and I don't want the must expensive. Yeah, it's very realistic.

It's not embarrassing. That's how most people are. They want stuff to lie, not to have to mortgage your hair because exactly, it's like.

If you like your genes to look like their quality, you know, blah blah. And also, I literally do wear things for years, which you know it's maybe a bit embarrassing for me, but I do.

It's not holly. That's how the world was speaking of what we wear or what we want to wear. Bougie and budget time.

It's very expensive.

How please start with your budget?

Okay, so my budget is really boring, but my MVP of budget fashion is a pair of denim shorts as you get mid and this isn't true for everybody. Some people can still rock the hot pants.

But I don't want to.

I wear shorts in summer a lot, right, But they have to be the right lengths, not too short but not too long.

Though, and wide enough on the thigh.

Wide enough on the thigh and high enough in the waist that they're a bit flattering, but that you don't feel like your button. And the best pad found are from Just Jeans, and they called the original seam front short and they're denim and they're about fifty five dollars.

Oh my god. I live in this style of short too often. I do a paper bag waste soo because with my endo, I like that it kind of looks fashion. But then when I'm bloated, if it's not wide enough on the thigh, I'm furious.

No, you need just change so and I have worn those all summer long, and I just think that it comes to things like shorts. I'm not going to spend lots of money, no, but also it's a particular cut that you want, and then when you find it that she want.

I agree. I found some that I love to and look, I will wear a longer short like that with maybe a kitten heel and a shirt to the office, But then at home, I'm so hot and I'm so pery, and my bedroom is in the attic and I'm in a uniglow cotton singlet and those shorts.

That's life and I love them.

My budget is a bag because I feel like, metaphorically, when you get to mid you need good shoes and good bags because they're carrying you.

I need a good bag.

They're carrying your shit and your emotions and your to do li and everything with you. That's why I think I'm not saying expensive, but quality shoes and bags really get you through at this life stage. Because he's sick of being uncomfortable. He's sick. It's stupid little bags you can't carry anything in. So it's the Marks and Spencer M and S Collection quilted shoulder bag. I'm about to

I hate that.

It's ninety nine, ninety nine, it's huge, zip shut great for travel, and then there's like a tanny color. They've got really good bags. At the moment, hole like, I want a tote that fits my whole life and zip shut.

You know, because I'm a commuter person now, and I'm like, this is one thing I need advice from that. I know this isn't an advice show.

Well, people don't know how often you and I talk about these and I love it. I'll get a message from Hollyway and on a Sunday go I'm in Mecca.

Yeah, I'm like, I need a bronze to tell me which one. And I also do that with shoes. You and me are a very excellent purpose in my life in this way. And to be honest, you're more reliable with your recommendations. She's to me, She's exciting, but she's mean, Okay, what is your bougie? All right? So both my bougies are things I haven't bought. But I think I'm seeking permission right because.

I don't forget I have to tell listeners about the shoes I helped you buy.

Oh for one hundred percent, So I don't know if these classify as bougie. I guess they do. But when last time I asked you, I said, I want a mid heel, pointy, like look stressy but not uncomfortable. You put me onto this brand called Vivea, isn't I saying that that's right Vivea? And they I bought these bad. Oh my god, I love them. I'm so excited for it to be cold again because they're like very close toe point he a bit much for this time of year. Red,

It's like a knitted fabric. A lot of people have seen ankle boots, like pointy ankle boots in this knitted fabric, almost like a holyyist a sock type vibe. But these ones they do a courtry and sling back.

So I bought those and I wore them to death. And then I bought a navy blue sling back pair of those with a little kitten heel and I love those too, and they are comfy and they are great. And that's the thing is that one of the things I think about trends is I don't feel like I'm cooler. Well, I don't want to be. It's not that I don't feel like I am cool enough to wear something really like out their directional stretchy boots, but I like a hint of it, do you know what I mean?

So don't want to wear it next winter in the winter after, and you want to be comfortable exactly.

But the thing I'm thinking about buying, there's a dress that I have hired from Dress Higher Place three maybe four times now, and it costs me two hundred dollars every time. I dress should have bought the dress. And it's a rixos Oh I love, and it's I wore it to the Live shirt. And it's green because green is another color I can wear. And it is sequins. But it's got sleeves because this is a big thing

And you feel better with that kind of car.

It's got these wide sleeves, it's got a very lovely cut. I love that fricking dress. It's called the Coco sequence.

Peration to purchase, But may I suggest if you've hired it from the same place that many times offer them, to buy it, because oftentimes higher places will sell X rental. So just say, hey, can I buy that?

I pretty much live in that dress.

Yeah.

And the other thing I'm dying to buy that I need permission to isn't need Habit shoes. Do you know that brand? Ain't Abbot? Please? There are Australian quite classy shoes. I go to their site all the time and just look at them all. But see, this is the thing about shoes, right, those shoes are a.

Bow tee four. Oh they're four ninety five. Yeah, they're like expensive, three twenty.

I love a lot of their shoes. But then these all bad sandals were two sixty nine, which is quite expensive for me.

But you're paying for comfort, and like, I shall look into this and report back. And a nice segue there is my bougie is a pair of shoes not as boogie as the original shoes I wanted, so they're a dupe. So they because I'm ready for winter already. I'm so jumping at the bit to get into your winter wardrobe. And my winter is similar to last winter that I'm doing a lot of light colors, grays and beigia's, and I don't love a dark shoe either, do you.

You don't miss color. You're not a color person, and.

It makes it harder to get dressed. Yeah, I like shades.

You look great than neutrals, thank you.

I have very large feet, not that we doesn't matter. I don't have ankles, so I'm not really about a big, chunky black loafer because it just would look silly. So there's a loafer I've wanted for quite a while. It's a Saint Laurent loafer, which I will not be purchasing as it is in the budget. And also the jupe is fabulous. So the Saint Laurent loafer is called the lo Loafer leather loafers. They're one thousand, six hundred dollars

So the flowy Maxie.

I'm proud of myself for not spending Saint Laurent money and somehow that made me justify shoes over two hundred dollars from twenty Bianco. But I've got the other of their flats. They're comfortable. They've got a returns policy, so when they turn up, if I don't like them, I'll return them. But I just think women of a certain age is sick of being uncomfortable. I want shoes I look forward to wearing that are comfortable, and a bag

I love your two friends. It's been so good. Come on all your shows.

Yes, I don't want to come on yours because that means I'm officially met and I've only just started Magel. Thank you for joining me.

Thank you, Lee.

Well, that was my dream to have my girl crush, Holly Wainewright on the show, so I'm very happy. So thank you for listening to Nothing to Wear. I hope you enjoyed. And it wouldn't have been possible without the wonderful producer that is Cassie Merritt, with audio production by Lou Hill.