Post-Game All-Star Podcast

And we're here in Oxnard, California and the site of Cowboys training Camp twenty twenty one, presented by American Airlines, and we're gonna break it all down for you here on Dallas Cowboys dot Com. Kyle you Oomen's alongside David Hellman, Mickey Spagnola. We've got Nick Eatman and Rob Phillips coming up a little bit later on in the show. But you guys get the first take, the first swings at it in terms of what you saw last in Canton.

And I'm go ahead and start with Mickey, since you were actually on site at Tom Benson Hall of Fame Stadium yesterday, what were your first accounts of this twenty twenty one season. Well, I was reminded of preseason was really preseason. Football's back. Everybody I was really looking forward to where you were gonna go with. Yeah, that's kind was the lead to my column. It's like, oh, so that's what we missed last year, right, pretty dull game, But you know what, both teams kind of did the

same thing. Very few starters played on either side of the ball. I think Pittsburgh had maybe three guys playing on offense and defense that were starters. So it was kind of what you expected. So I think you have to kind of put the thing in context. You throw out the score, it really uh doesn't matter, I thought from an offensive standpoint. Uh, you know, Garrett Gilbert had

some nice moments. You know, the protection wasn't the best, which was one of the worst things I think happened with the Cowboys with playing all backups after that second to series. It reminded me why alternative football leagues don't work, because there's not enough offensive linemen to go around, and there's not enough to go around in the NFL on your second and third team. And if the offensive line can't block, the quarterback can't operate, and if the quarterback

can operate, the wide receivers can operate. So I thought that was sort of the downfall of the Cowboys. But on the bright side, I think Michael Parsons definitely showed why the Cowboys selected him with the twelfth pick in the draft. And I think you have to remember that he had not played a game until since late December. I think it was December twenty eighth in the Cotton Bowl of twenty nineteen, and that was his first real game.

And he went out there and I felt like every play he was out there, I was writing something down about him. So, uh he was awfully, awfully good. Um. And then after that, defensively, it's you know, it's kind of hard to pick out other guys. Um. You know, at times they didn't get much of a pass rush, um, but they did kind of stop the run a little bit. Uh So you know, all in all, probably the absolute best thing is is they emerged without an injury. There.

It is there, it is Nicky. That's the one. Uh yeah, I think I think you use some of that thing. Do we have to do the rest of the year. I don't know. Let's go, let's stand off. Appreciate it. They got out of it healthy, um, you know, right, like just thinking about what you just said, Yeah, like somewhere through the somewhere halfway through the third quarter, I was like, what are we even getting out of watching the rest of this? Like it was? It was just messy.

It's hard to evaluate the quarterback other than the fact, I mean, Ben d Nucci went full shortstop last night. I feel like we hadn't We haven't been seeing that as much out here at camp. I don't know if he reverted to that because the protection was bad, or maybe just in the adrenaline at the moment, but it was hard to evaluate the whole picture with the offensive line play being as bad as it was. The same can be said on the other side of the ball.

I guess my predominant impressions were the guys that did get in looked good. Michael Parsons looked pretty good. I thought, you know, the rookies had a nice showing. Jabril Cox got to make some plays in the second half of that game. Even you know, Nishan Wright gave up the big completion to Chase Claypool. Thought that was a definite pushoff. Thought it was fun to see him compete out there. Lyle Collins probably played six snaps, but it looked like

they were running right behind him. When he was in there, he looked good. And nobody's hurt. Yes, nobody's hurt. And we're back in Oxnard, which and you think about you know they're gonna be practicing what twenty five twenty six hours from now, so clean bullet health coming out the first preseason game is my big, big takeaway, And Mike reemphasized after the game the fact that he had to regulate snaps in that game knowing that they had a

practice against the Rams on Saturday. So that's why you might have seen some guys come out a lot quicker. They may use them more in the in the scrimmage, but yeah, they they wore out that third string office. I think I think Mike was being judicious with his better players, knowing that they need to get some work

against their Rams. But but I love that like the And I'm the guy that's always worried about injuries and you don't want anybody to get hurt, But you can't afford to be as worried about that with your down the line guys. You say, Jabril Cox, you haven't had a lot of opportunities in training camp. Get out there and be somebody My man get out there and play forty snaps or however many he got. And it was fun to see a lot of those guys get that type of action where they didn't need to come out.

I thought we were going to get to see a I would imagine a preseason NFL record ninety nine and a half yard run by Rico Dowdle. He almost broke it. A guy got him by by his shoe string and they had one other guy. He had one guy. Yeah it was it was And he said it afterwards, He goes, yeah, man, it was ninety nine and a half yarkards because they had the false start and they backed him up two inches. He actually had a good game. He I thought he did a really nice job. He was hitting the hole

if you looked at the other guys that well. And in sue Sue, I like that. We got to see two back and got to see him in a one back set, so I might bode well for him. Uh, trying to make this this final roster, I I would put Rico Dowdle's name on my fifty three in pin like a yeah, oh absolutely, I think I mean he was he made he made it last year. He was impressive enough to make it without the preseason. You would think he's gonna get a lot of run. He's got juice,

he's a surprisingly like he's an underrated receiver. We've seen it out here at camp. He did it yesterday, caught a ball or two coming out of the flat, and I just think he has differentiated himself from all the other backs here not named Zeke or Tony. Yeah, and Shawell,

you know the practice squad is gonna be fifteen guys. Again, he gives you something as a fullback, as a runner, I think, Um, I don't know about the fifty three for Shawell, but I think both of these guys will be in the locker room this Yeah, I oh absolutely. And you know he had it didn't end up in a touchdown on the goal line, but he had a big block to clear out a hole and then somebody didn't do their job on the offensive line. So I like, and I like the way he ran the ball. He

caught the ball, so yeah, I was. I was impressed with him. But dontal you noticed the difference between him and those other backs behind him. Yes, they were dancing around before they hit the hole. He hit the hole the way, you're supposed to five point four yards per carry. For doubt will he ended up with eight carries for forty three yards long of twenty five, which was by far the most impressive, maybe the most impressive offensive play

the Cowboys had over the course of the game. Maybe the other one was siwo Ilana Lua's seventeen yard reception. He had out and wide to the right, got a really good block from I believe it was Malite Turner on the outside. I have to go back and watch the film, but I think both of those guys showed that they can be versatile in the backfield. You mentioned the offensive line, and sure the protection was definitely not

ideal yesterday. From really all three standpoints, the first, second, third string guys quote unquote, I should say rotations of guys. Out of the six most utilized players last night in terms of snap counts, all six were offensive lineman. Matt Farniok led the way with sixty two snaps. Second was Brandon Night with fifty two, Then Braylon Jones, then Terrence Steele, Isaac Alacron, and Eric Smith. Those were the top six snap getters in the entire game, so they wore those

guys out. They absolutely did. Now, Michael Parsons got eleven snaps yesterday to match his jersey number. And of course you like you said, the recovery on the fumble in the first drive was something that was really encouraging to see. That was a big confidence boost, I think for a rookie in his first defensive drive. But he also made three tackles, he had one run stop. He did look impressive. Dave,

what did you see out of Micah Parsons yesterday? That really bodes well for the rest of the preseason and getting into the regular season. I mean there you can take both sides that. Obviously, you know, the fumble recovery wasn't really anything that Micah Parsons did. It was a

bumbled exchange, but by place right time. No, that there's something to be said for that, and that's what he's done out here, Like he's around the football and people always say that's not necessarily a thing that you can coach, Like instincts are a big part of this. So you know, he didn't force the fumble. It wasn't some crazy amazing play, But you put yourself in those positions, you'll be able to make a lot of plays. You know, we were

talking about this right before we came on. I think Pro Football Focus said he was one of the highest graded players in the game, the number one defensive graded player on the Cowboys roster. Eleven snaps, okay against that, and it was actually was eleven of thirteen potential snaps because he only played those first two series and I counted up the plays. I was going to give him thirteen, but he did come out. They did some rotation, rotation stuff that first series. Point being it's a very small

body of work against a mainly second string Steelers offense. Like, I think he played very well. I'm very encouraged. And again, like I think of it as like a staircase, like you start at the bottom. OTAs was super encouraging. Another step, he's you know, mixing and matching his identities. He's doing some play calling stuff out here. Another step, he goes into his first preseason game. I mean, that's about as good as you can expect a first preseason game to

look if you're only playing eleven snaps. So he just and he hasn't taken a step down that I've seen, Like he's just continually taking steps up. And you know, I was the guy that wasn't sure what his role was going to be or whether he'd be able to unseat some of these starters right away. I'm not going to bet against him at this point. I mean, like I said, he just keeps checking the boxes, keeps working

his way up, stacking good days. To quote somebody who used to work here for a really long on top of each other, right, absolutely, and you know, and maybe the neatest thing. And I used it in my column for this morning. After he got done on the podium um doing his interview after the game, he was getting ready to walk off and some guy walks up to him says, hey, coach T wants to say hi. Well, he was talking about Mike Tomlin. Wow. And Mike Tomlin

came around the corner and looked at him. And you know Tomlin when he gets that look in his eye and he goes, you do your thing, You keep doing your thing, just like he like he knew him, Like you know, they had some sort of prior relationship because you know Harrisburg, Pennsylvania not far and then Penn's days. You say, the head coach of the Steelers probably keeps

a close eye on what's happen. I would imagine he knew him and he he and he kind of, you know, kind of popped him on the on the chest and it was like, hey, there's a big compliment from the the guy on the other side who might have if he had a chance, and I didn't look. I forgot where Pittsburgh drafted. They were back. They were back because they took it was at Claypool. That's right, Harris. That was last year. Yeah, and so yeah, he was. He was pretty complimentary of what he did. So, yeah, good

start for a guy. It was funny. They sort of asked him and he goes, no, he goes, you know what, he goes. I wasn't nervous, he goes, I was more nervous in college games than I was in this one. He goes, because the what we do defensively was very similar some of the plays we run defensively to what I did at Penn State. But again, he hadn't done

it because he didn't play last year. So to come out and play like that and did it in front of his family, I think he was pretty He was pretty pretty happy, although at halftime when they interviewed him, he mentioned he made some of the mistakes. Well yeah, okay, fine, no one's perfect, right, but boy, uh that that was a performance to let everybody know cowboys got something here. He's impressive and that's you know, it's one. You know, we're all out here at camp. You see the grainy

cell phone videos that hit the internet. But again, you know, people are excited for this game because it's their first look at the team in HD with all the camera angles and you're not seeing it the same way through my cell phone camera as you are in a game, right, And I think fans should be excited that first opportunity. You know, National TV. He showed up for sure, well, and they did the same thing with him that they've

been doing out here. He started off when they went base four to three the strong side linebacker and then he started playing the middle linebacker on the nickel rotation. Yeah, pretty impressive. Yeah, he did definitely look good. We'll ask him again whenever Week one comes around. He's got to face Tom Brady. If he's nervous for that one, yeah, we'll ask him. If it's not Tom Benson Hall of Fame Stadium and instead it's against the reigning champions then

maybe he'll be a little nervous. I want to talk about the quarterback spot a little bit, and Dave you mentioned it right off the top. It was really hard to evaluate some of these guys. But I'm gonna start with Garrett Gilbert actually looked pretty good overall, nine of thirteen passing one hundred and four yards. He didn't have a touchdown, didn't have an interception, but he had a

ninety three point one passer rating. Looked confident. I think in the pocket, he looked like an NFL quarterback, somebody who could step up in an emergency situation. What were your thoughts on what Garrett Gilbert did last night. Yeah, I think you summed it up really well. I just I thought he looked comfortable. I thought he looked poised. Im you know, I'm not convinced that this is the best that the Cowboys can do in terms of finding a backup quarterback. I think, you know, I think and

that I said that last night. I think Garrett Gilbert is competing against whatever else is in the league right now. He is competing against somebody else's guy who's gonna get cut or yea. And not to throw out a specific name. But you know, there are players making too much money for their station on the team. Maybe you talk about trades, maybe you talk about being roster casualties. That's his competition, because I really I think he is clear cut much

better than the other two guys on this team. I thought, you know, Cooper Rush wasn't he wasn't terrible. He had some really nice throws. His throwed them a leak turner that wound up being wound up being a fumble. Um. It was a it was a heck of a throw, but I thought there were accuracy issues there. I thought the ball didn't look as good coming out of his hand to me as it did for Garrett Um. Obviously the offense bogged out in the red zone when Garrett

was in there, but let him downfield. It looked smooth and somewhat efficient when he was in there, and I don't think you could say the same for the other two. Yeah, he looked like he was in control U A couple of times, he might have held the ball a little long and then you don't know if there was nothing there and he just didn't decide Okay, I'm just throw this away. But yeah, he you know, he had the one. The fumble was a sack, but but you know he

drove him. He had drives, you know, they're what was It was first in goal at the five yard line, right, and they run the ball with Dottle uh up the middle. That was the play that I thought. Uh Alana Lua had a nice block, but they only got one yard out of it. Second down Nasecki gets just blown up. Yeah, and so uh it ended up in a sack minus seven yards. And then third and goal at the eleven here comes uh. I think it was it was seventeen.

I think they blitzed um. Anyway, Nasecki didn't pick up the blitz and he and so it kind of blew up the play. So oh, I know what it was. He blew up. He blew up the play and uh Turner broke up the pass. It would have been an interception, right, That's what happened. I had seventeen written down here. So yeah, um so, but you know he drove the ball, and I think that McCarthy talked about it afterwards, talked about how we had long drive. You want to see the

case in preseason games. You want to see stacked on. It wasn't exactly, and then uh yeah, Rush had some nice passes. But boy, you mentioned the ball just doesn't come out of his hand quick. It's like we's got this long arm thing, right, it kind of dies when it has to go, yeah, like if it's got to go to the boundary or go too far outside. And then Denucci up and down. You know, he had a couple of nice passes. Now he was working with what we used to call in high school the nuts squad.

You know. It was like that's when I got to go practice. By the way, his time, Okay, what do we need out there? Because I go play that position, right, we gotta arrest somebody. Uh but uh yeah, he had a couple of errant throws and then again holding the ball, you know, and that was one of the thing I thought he was starting to do better out here. He was getting the ball out of his hands, but the hair he started holding it and then he had to run um. But again, he just hasn't played much football,

So we'll see what happens there. But I think Dave's right, Uh, Gilbert's competing against the rest of the league. If somebody gets released, it's yeah, it's hard to imagine somebody on this team other than him being the backup quarterback. Yeah, but it's also you look at it at the same right and saying, are you feeling comfortable with him at the backup spot, because right now it's not a for

sure yes and not a yes. We know how important the backup quarterback spot is so last year, right, so see it right now in camp DA Dak was out there doing some rehab this morning, and it's my understanding that you know, we may not see him until we get back to the Star Yeah, and it you know, if he plays, it might be the Houston game. Otherwise he needs uh. And it wasn't portrayed to me as a setback. It was always it was gonna take this long to recover from that injury, and we call it

a shoulder injury. But finally got showed to me where it was. And it's the muscle from your back that comes underneath your arm. Yeah here, and and that's what the problem is. I saw somebody say, yeah, he's throwing with his shoulder or or no, they said he was throwing with his left shoulder. I said, no, you don't throw with your shoulder, you throw with your arm, right. But I don't know who wrote that. We had a really you might have which you saw so much more

than we did last night. But one thing we got to see what They interviewed him on Fox at halftime and Darry Bradshaw put him right on the spot and was like, yeah, it's just what you just said. He's like, it's under your shoulder, right, it's not like your labor room or your rotator cuff. And God bless Dac, he was like, yep, that's right. Anyway, yeah, anyway, if you want to give away too much, he literally was like, yep, you're right, but we're not gonna talk about it. We're

gonna do like cockey. It's an upper body injury. I don't know anybody trying to hit me underneath my arm, but that that was the deal. And it wasn't from throwing too much. I was told that it was one throw. He tried to throw a deep ball and he threw it weird at a at a weird arm slot angle. Uh, and that's would cause the injury. So it wasn't. No, he didn't throw enough. His arm was tired at nothing to hire an LB pitching coach. Yeah, and so you

know he had somebody working with him out there. I didn't recognize who the person was, but they they I guess somebody wrote that the Cowboys had contacted the Rangers about pitching because pitchers have that injury. Um usually football players don't. So he's worked with an old MLB pitching coach before. I wonder if and that could have been. Um So kind of downplayed that the other day on talking Cowboys and then they go out and do it.

So he was, he was, he would, he would. He had the like medicine ball, and he was doing these things with it, like throwing it to the side for people that are actually watching us right now, I'm diagramming it. Um So. Yeah, but we'll see where that one goes, because you know, you better have somebody ready just in case. Well, it's it's I was thinking about this today. It's a funny. It's ironic. It's an ironic lesson to learn because you know what do we always do, like we roll our

eyes when coaches don't want to give timelines. Yeah, come on, just tell us what's what. Well, McCarthy did that and he probably regrets it now because it because you know, McCarthy said two or three days, and it becomes a story when Dak doesn't meet that timeline. But I don't think their opinion of what this injury was has changed in that entire time. It's just don't put yourself on a timeline because then if for some reason you need

to change it, everybody freaks out. And and Dak didn't help things when he when he basically said during that interview, well, if I was in a game, I wouldn't have come a way through it, right or if it happened during the week, I would have done whatever I need to do the play. Well, they've got time here, so might as well use the time that's on your side. No

reason to rush things with Dak Prescott. Now, one of the things last night with Ben da Nucci, and we just talked about how he kind of reverted back to some of his old ways and some of the at least found fundamentally wise, did not look good last night. Now, he's not expected to be your backup quarterback. He is a developmental player. But did anything last night, Dave change your mind about Ben da Nucci and what he could be moving forward. It's a preseason game, it's really only

his second real NFL action. What else do we see from Ben da Nucci? I and I said this last night, and you know, Twitter during a Cowboys game is not a great place for nuance. I don't know if you know that, but or the next morning. Yeah, well really ever, um, I'm I'm dead serious when I say this. Remember a few years ago how much use they got out of Jamille Showers as a Scout team quarterback. And yeah, he had the athleticism and obviously played in college. He is

a developmental guy. And you see, like Bend new she has an impressive amount of athleticism. He gets outside the pocket very easily, probably too much, although I can't blame him too much considering the level of the protection there, especially last night. But I mean he can make plays on the move and get outside the pocket, whether that's

scrambling for yards or buying himself time. And I think that makes him valuable as a Scout team quarterback in the sense of, Okay, we're you know, we're playing a mobile quarterback this week. We need you to give us some looks, We need you to do this and that. I think he has real value there and that could give him a chance to continue to play and develop

his skill set. I hadn't seen anything going into that game that made me think he needed to be on the fifty three, and I definitely didn't see anything last night that changes that opinion. So I think he could have a future here at continuing to develop and help them in practice as a practice squad quarterback. But it's hard for me to see anything else based on anything we've seen to this point. There are still three more games,

but that's how I feel right now. He's competing to be the developmental quarterback, whether that's the third one on the fifty three or if they think he can get through waivers to put him on the practice squad. I think that's what it's got to be his job. I mean, if you think about it, other than being a seventh round draft choice instead of a fourth he's sorted in the same situation when the Cowboys drafted Dak Prescott. He

was supposed to be the third guy. He was competing to be a developmental guy that could potentially down the road be your backup quarterback. And I think you know, and we know how things turned out, but I think

that's what Denucci. That's got to be his goal, to be the developmental quarter everybody's got one, because look, go look at other rosters and see who the third and fourth quarterback are on some of these other teams, and you'll be sitting there going who round quarterbacks from small schools that didn't have a ton of college and go back and look in some of these I bet half the teams in the league are looking at their backup quarterback scratching their head right now. So they're just not

a bunch of guys out there. And there's definitely, I mean, there aren't enough good quarterback X for all thirty two starting jobs. Say that every year I do just you know, with and you know, y'all can get into that and weird we already have. But like there's a billion dbs on this team fighting for roster spots. The defensive line is a mess in terms of how many do you keep and who and to this point, and they don't

ask for my opinion, we all know that. But to this point, I haven't seen anything that makes me think, well, they gotta have they gotta keep a third quarterback. They I mean, you know, plenty of NFL teams keep two and have a guy on the practice squad. And I just think this team has more pressing needs and we haven't seen enough from any of the quarterbacks not named Dak or Gilbert too that they should be worried about. Yeah, because if you want to go long in the secondary, right,

you might need an extra spot. If you want to go long at the running backs, you know, Allana Luau, you know, want them on. There's a spot there if you want them on the fifty three. So yeah, I think at this point, unless something dramatically changes, you know, two quarterbacks, uh, and and Gilbert needs to continue to step up to be that guy ready to go. Unless some team that drafted one of these quarterbacks in the

first round says, okay, he won the job. I've got an expendable uh, you know, backup veteran quarterback who has started games in this league. And it'll be interesting to see what happens in Chicago. That's that's the one. That's the one. But that's the thing is that there are thirty other teams looking at Chicago well along with the Cowboys. And depending on how much money you have now and you know what it's going to cost. My thought is, though,

if if, if you're unemployed on August thirtieth. You're probably not going to sit there and and you know, drive a hard bargain unless you got another team, uh that's interested in you. Yeah. I think there'll be multiple teams interested in whoever does not end up in Chicago and moves forward. But like you guys said, I think there is some competition whenever it comes to in between positions to stay on that fifty three mantra. Because you mentioned dbs,

I think defensive lines there too. You may want to take ten or eleven defensive linemen based off of who you have in the middle of that interior and linebacker.

Do you want to keep five linebackers six linebackers? Maybe because of special teams in the in the future, so maybe I think it's undoubtedly quarterbacks probably gonna be too deep with a practice squad player and who's going to be on that practice squad And that's what the competition is right now at that So I don't think they've got eleven offensive lineman you want to keep good point

that's way too many. I don't think you would if you had good ones right but right now they're probably down to maybe eight, and you would like nine or ten if you had them. But I don't know. I agree with you. But if I mean, with the injury histories of some of these offers, I know eight's not enough. If you got to claim somebody or make a trade, you do it. But and I I mean, I don't think anybody was overly impressed by what we saw from the offensive line as that game went on. But eight

would make me incredibly nervous. See, this is why they're pushing the envelope on Connor McGovern as a backup center, because they can save a spot one of Williams. I said, I said, McGovern Williams, Uh, you know, because they're they're looking at from a salary cap stampoint but also a number stampoint. Boy, if I can get that guy to do you know two things for me? Oh, I'm in good shape. But other than other than that McGovern right now, Uh, he's your sixth guy and that's about it. And I

don't know after that, you know, the backup tackle. Things still not settled. I will um I will stand up for Terrence Steele. I will too. Actually, I will stand up for Terrence Steele. I don't I'm not saying he was amazing and unfortune you know, hey would love to be able to watch the all twenty two of this game. Anybody somebody if we could get to work on that, Yes, yes, yes, Um, but I thought I thought Terrence Steele he seemed to

hold his own. I didn't notice him getting bully and he's been on the right side right mostly, he played left left. Yeah, And so am I ready to say, like, yeah, he's my swing tackle and I feel good about it. No, but I'm also he's worth probably keep. Yeah, I'm not ready to move on from him. So that's seven yeah, and not And haven't seen anything from Josh Ball and

he's hurt right now. Didn't go to Canton last night. Uh, Ty and Secky's first you know, outing on TV as a cowboy was not anything to get super pumped about. And uh and Brandon Knight kind of the same thing. Hasn't been playing as much tackle at this camp. We know he has before. Yeah, I don't. I think I got seven that I feel okay about. And then I'm not sure. And then then then they're gonna have to make a decision on Forniac if he if they think he's worth keeping, as you know, a guy that's in

act of every Sunday. But we can develop this guy. And they did actually have him out there I think at guard sixty two snaps and he played back and forth between and by the way, Terrence Steele forty eight s apps, nine of which came at left tackle, thirty nine at right tackle yesterday. Yeah, so he saw a little bit of time and both. That's pretty much a series at left tackle and four series ball made to get himself healthy if he's wants to get into the

equation here. No, absolutely agree. Well, guys, thank you so much for your time hopping on with us knocking out a quick thirty minutes. I always enjoy talking with you guys. By the way, for those of you watching, you can catch this exact cruise starting tomorrow at five pm Central time. Rams and Cowboys are practicing out here on TSA twenty

one and Dallas Cowboys dot Com. We will kick off the coverage right at the top of the hour and you guys will be on for thirty minutes there and then we'll have Nick and Rob and Nate Newton and Isaiah Standback who just landed in La couple hours ago

as a part of our coverage. There, so plenty more of David Hellman and Mickey's Bagnola when we come back, though, Nick Eatman Rob Phillips join us as we continue to break down the Hall of Fame game reaction and heading into the rest of Cowboys training camp here on Dallas Cowboys dot Com. Honey, big news scary? Are you Okay? Oh? I'm not Gary anymore. I'm Jackie Flash. What see? I want the latest smartphone, but the best deals are only for new customers. So to get a new customer deal,

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game reaction and Cowboys training camp from Oxnard, California. Special thanks again to Mickey Spagnolan David Hellman. Now we're joined by Nick Eatman, Rob Phillips, Dallas Cowboys dot Com. I'm Kyle Yeomans and raising this thing up a little bit, raising it up, yeah, in terms of whatever you want, production or we're talking physicality, whatever, short jokes. Didn't take very long to get into it. Waiting for them to leave too, so goodness, Yeah, you waited for him to

walk away. That's a cheap shot. Whatever, That's okay, four hours asleep if that that's true, and there's no way, there's no way its four hours. Yeah, I didn't realize today was the day we have to mow the whole grass and the whole place. I mean the leaf blowers still blowing stuff around there. It ain't you had an encounter with a while. Yeah, so that awesome kingdom there you go get song by the Toady's So Nick, you were, like you said, running on very short amount of sleep

because you were in Canton. I started with Mickey last segment. I want to start with you. What were your thoughts of last night? Um, you know football's back is you know, I think that's what you've said to kind of start the show, and that's that can't be overlooked. I mean, didn't wouldn't the greatest game ever. I think I've said that it's not going into the Hall of Fame or anything like that. Archives ESPN Classic is not a calling for this one. But you know that's what the game

it was. You know, just see some individual efforts and another thing that y'all touched on, no injuries. That was the best part you get out of the game. You get evaluates some guys. We know that's not how the Cowboys are gonna look. We know that's not how the Steelers are gonna look. But it was good to kind of get back, get some football and get some individual evaluations on some players. Yeah. You know, Twitter is the

place where human emotions are just microwave. You know, everybody just wants to flip out, and you know there was a lot of those comments after the game. It's one guy tweeted like I'm done with this team's like just hold on, tap tap the brakes. It's sloppy. It's always sloppy, especially in the first game. Remember they've had five padded practices five so far so and a lot of starters

did not play. There were some good things though, and I know you guys touched on the offense, but I will say the biggest thing that stood out to me was you're trying to find out who your backup quarterback is. Yep, Dak Prescott. They're not worried about the shoulder injury, but look what happened last year. You gotta be prepared. They don't have the money they did last year. I don't think to spend as much as they did on in Andy Dalton. Garrett Gilbert did some things that makes you

feel better. I think now they had two field goal attempts out of those two drives and and didn't get what they wanted. But that was a efficient drive up until they got inside the ten yard line. So I think that one number one to me stood out when you're looking at that competition. He looked like a backup quarterback to me, and and that's not a bad thing. I mean, that's what he's trying to this he's trying to do he's not. If he was outstanding, he would

be going for a team that needed a starter. I thought his throw coming out of the end zone there, I think to Cedric Wilson, Yeah, the twenty one yard er. I thought that was a really poised play. I actually tweeted this. I thought he looked less, He looked more uncomfortable than he did when he started against Pittsburgh back in November. He felt it just looked like it was willle jittery, get the ball out quick. Something that could be with the offensive line that was in front of him.

You know, that might have alluded, I mean, helped with that. But I thought the second drive we kind of got out there, or remember it was the third one where he threw it, you know, out of his end zone, made a nice throw. He's got some things that I think you can work with. You get the you know, if he has to play better guys around him, I think Rob I agree, I think he'd be fine. We talked a little bit about the offensive line in that early segment. We didn't get a chance to talk wide receiver.

So I want to get a chance to hit on that anybody stick out from a pass catcher standpoint, because Dalton Volts was really good early on him, and it was a mix of guys late well. Nick had it in his five plays, which I applaud you for writing a five plays column. Yeah, that's why you didn't have any five plays that shaped the game. The Noah Brown catch on at one point during the day about that one, but it's okay, No was it the first drive the Noah Browns plant for the I mean that's like you said,

he's a big bodied receiver. That's a type of route he can run and be successful at. And they hit him right in the stride and it got him into position to try to score. Cedric Wilson did some nice thing, Cedric Wilson. I feel like Noah Brown and Cedric Wilson, certain fans or whatever, they want to cut both guys because they're making a lot of money for fourth and fifth wide receivers and they drafted a wide receiver who's got talent. But don't forget what Cedric Wilson did when

Dak Prescott was healthy. Yeah, before the injury. Last Seattle game, two touchdowns and Noah Brown quietly played quite a bit at wide receiver last year and did a pretty nice job. And as he told us a couple of days ago, I'm finally healthy. So I thought both those guys stood out. Sean McEwen might be the third tight end on this team. Yeah, yeah, he just he just makes plays. A blocking tight end who can produce in the in the receiving game as well,

a little bit of both. That's what he was last year. That's what he did the majority of the time. A little bit he didn't play much period, but yeah, that was part of his I mean, you know, he wasn't a receiving tight end. He played fourteen games last year, which yeah, yeah he didn't. He didn't get a lot in there. But um, another play I put in that five points again, just trying to see through the game and visualize stuff. Rico Daddle out in the flat makes

a catch over the middle. Nice play. That's a play that that makes me think what Tony Pollard or Zeke will do. Lining him out there and letting everyone go, letting him kind of cut underneath. I could see Tony Pollard making the catch like that. Um, and maybe you know, obviously having a bigger play, so you know you're seeing concepts from Kellen Moore and dan Quinn and all that, and I thought that was kind of interesting on just

some of the things we saw earlier. You mentioned dan Quinn and getting his first reps with a revamp defense with I guess the Cowboys defense in general. In a game action, what did you see from the secondary? Reggie Robinson got a ton of snaps yesterday, played thirty snaps, fifteen of them and run defense fifteen of him in coverage straight down the middle, forced to fumble in the game as well. What did you guys see from some of the secondary players that we've kind of been waiting

a while to finally get our eyes on. Well, I'll get back to Reggie Robinson in a sex because there was a play he did not make that I think would really hurt him. Wasn't even on defense. But in the secondary, you know, Nashan Wright stands out because he's six to four and he's tall and lanky. It's easy to watch, easy to watch. But I thought, you know, I thought he did what he did. Okay, you know,

I talked to him after the game. He said he made a rookie mistake there with the side that's a tough draw his first game as an NFL player, was running with him pretty good. He actually said, I was holding him, so that's why he put his arms up like that. He puts his he put his arms back, and then he kind of Claypool did kind of push him, but not you know, Michael Levitt would have had no career if they if they called push off stuff like that,

you know. But um, you know, I thought it would be still made five tackles, and it was to his point he said, look at me. I mean, I'm a I'm a tall, anky corner. No one thinks I can I can play mix it up. So I'm glad I got in there and tackled and show people somethings. So I thought nichean Um was a guy that stood out. Speaking of guys who stand out, is real mcquamu is

six four as well. Yeah, you know, I think one of the past breakups he had in the middle of the field was an example of his arm length and just being able to close with his arms and get his hands on the ball. That's I mean, he's a guy that they're trying to develop at a different position.

So you got to you gotta maybe temper your expectations in year one, but there are traits there that they like, I want to work with, so again, Yeah, I mean, Kyle, it's it's one of those things where I guess every draft pick on defense, seven out of eight Goldston's still on pup all got a chance to get in there, and you saw some some things from different guys, not only in the secondary of been in the front seven too.

I like you bringing up Israel mcquamu because he was targeted twice yesterday, had the one PBu over the middle where he got up and celebrated a little bit, had some fun with that. But they really used him in a couple of different ways. They used him in the box for nineteen snaps. They had him as the free safety outside of that for seventeen, so he saw a lot of game action. They used him on a couple

of different ways. And as a guy who switched from corner to safety full time now he played a little bit of both at South Carolina, but the full time switch, he looked like he was comfortable back there, and I think that's important for a guy who's still trying to find a roster spot. Yeah, and also, you know, let's remember where he played, and he played in South Carolina, where you know, jac Horne was the corner most of

that time, so they had a lot of secondary guys. Yeah, and I think that his role at safety is probably gonna be covering tight ends, maybe playing some in the slot. So any corner or any safety that does have corner skills, but he looks like a safety. That's I think that he's making the team. I mean, I think he's making the team. I don't know if he's gonna be active. I think I have him as well. Yeah, he's he you got your fifty three? I do somewhere. I don't

have a lockdown here. I mean people paying people on Twitter, they're like, did someone still make the team over him?

I'm like, can we not finish? It's only week one, I wrote as of August first on my list, So you know, for years we used to take that that that same flip card and we can do our fifty three and yeah, so what I do along the way, Yeah, it's I mean, it's a veteran move for a guy who's at his first training camp, right, yeah, just remember this, Uh yeah no, but you're right, Yeah, it's still it's

still super early on. Now you mentioned Reggie Robinson. I'm curious to go back to what there was a punt return. I think the Steelers um I forgot who, Baxton Buckston something like that went like twenty five yards thirty yards. So I'm watching it and I see on the left gunner spot is and they were punting right to left, So the left gunner spot um was was Robinson. He got double teamed and never got off the line like ever, like he you know, the punt was forty five yards

down the field. He didn't get fifteen yards down the field. He was jammed up and kind of into the bench and the whole left side of the guy took it and he's supposed to be there and he didn't even make the tackle. He was still getting blocked. I think Nice Wonder either had to make the play or something. You know, you know, that's a problem in coverage if that's happening right when. Yeah, that's not good. Yeah, that's never it's never good. Yeah, and that wasn't his you know,

worst night. Hey, can we just say the guy's a the guy's a punter, I mean he's a punter. Oh yeah, he's a punter and punch of the punters a better ring is the ki Yeah, I mean doesn't work well. They're they're trying to give you know, Greg's airline is not ready to go with the back surgery. He's coming off of that. Bryan Anger, I guess, is the punter week one because they're they're resting him, getting him to the to the season, I guess. But can you let

Nice Wonder practice some kicks in practice? I mean that I'm a little surprised. We've all said it. Like, I think he's had three attempts, three attempts, and he's done like ghost kicks the rest of the time. And Mickey asked Mike about it, and he said, that's just part of the install It's they we were talking about this on Tom Cowboy the other day. It used to be an event for us with our notepads charting Dan Bailey every freaking day in practice. Did it last year? Yeah?

And and and they just haven't kicked in this camp for whatever reason. So but but again he's he's yeah, but he's not a kicker, You're right, An, he's a punter, and and and I think he's a good one. And I just don't understand really why you have to why you the limit anger? And he's only played he's played four team on I think this is fourth team, so he's been a capt will I think a couple of times. But you know, I don't know. I don't know why we're limiting his snaps. Yeah, I guess you would call

it anger management. You would call it. That's that would be a headline. That's what you would call it. It's pretty good anger. Have we said that one? No, that's my role call pretty darn four camp. I don't read that. Oh wow, okay, interesting. It's a great site. It's a great website. It is cowboys dot com. Everybody. If you're not on it, then jump on the bandwagon. We did have anger management. Yeah, I stole that from you, Rom good movie. That's to think William's over here. Nod and

William will give you his thumbs up approval on headlines. Yeah, good, headline bad bad? Yeah, he'll tell us about the one you told me for two days you were so happy about that with oh because Lie Collins had, yeah, had lost a little weight, And I said, lean on me. Boy, you must have loved that movie, William. It's a great movie. It's a good top three, top three, Uh, anybody else on Special Teams stick out to you yesterday, good order about the store, our best. I mean overall Special Teams

was rough yeah, to say the least. I mean, if you had one word to describe it, it it would be roughly. The whole game, which probably it always is. Special Teams is a you're a double a, you know manager in baseball double a. I mean, if your guys are really any good, they get plucked and go somewhere else. So every time you have to kind of just you know, make you know, lemonade. It really what you have to do.

And so you know in the first game, you know it's never gonna be great quality, and never really any of the preseason games I think every year, I remember we would do stories like what's wrong with the Special Teams? That's because, you know, because they're trying some stuff out. I was thinking of what Joe D. Camillis used to call the players you know that we're playing out there, that it weren't necessarily going to make the team, you

just got to fill it fill it up. Speaking of Joe D. Camilisi should be come out here tomorrow with his Rams. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, anybody else from the Rams that we know, I think anybody from the Cowboys used to be at the Rams beside the whole special team, say like McQuaid and Foster everybody. Yeah, yeah, you're you're exactly right. Um. Let's go back to defense a little bit and talk about that defensive line. Looked

like there was some good push up front. I thought, now, there weren't any big time sacks and there really wasn't a huge splash play from the defensive line. But I thought Quentin Bohannah had a nice day. Yeah, I thought to Rob Bashum and limited snaps, Carlos Watkinsosa, Diggy Zoo, what did you guys see? Rob will start with you on the defensive line. You just named both guys. I

was gonna name, but Quintin Bohanna. He was on my two to watch that we had before the game, just because he watched him out here and he's three hundred and thirty pounds but he doesn't move like it. And they drafted him mainly to be space eater in the middle help stop the run. But you're seeing what he can do in terms of movement off the snap. What makes you think, well, maybe he can. He can give him some pass rush inside as well. And dan Quinn's

scheme one, it's kind of like Rod Marinelli Nick. They want to get up the field, yea, so maybe he can help in that regard. And I thought Osa had a couple of nice rushes too that helped force quick throws and helped him get off the field defensively. Did um in your first thirty minutes, did any of those guys talk about Mica Parsons. We did. You talked about him, and we did talk about Mica. I felt like Mickey was you know, I think it was what we let

off with. Of course, Mickey just got a column, right. I sat next to Mickey on the plane and he was he was hammering away on the on the Mica Parsons and that was his his guy going into the draft, and he was the one happy guy. But see, yeah, he wants to say it's just him. No, but the Cowboys hadn't rated higher than both corners they liked, right. I don't believe and on our show, well, I don't believe that. I do not believe that even a little bit. I know they say that, but I don't believe. I

think it's true. I believe it. I believe I don't think I believe it. Now, what were they gonna do If a Corner was sitting there, they probably would they were still gonna take it. You don't always, you know, That's why you don't always stick to your board. I mean, yeah, they they have admitted that they were gonna take Corner. I do believe he was the highest rated. But then again, if you're not gonna take him, then then what does it matter. We're not gonna go to the board now.

I just I'm sure they've said it. When we we'll say it again. Maybe Parsons is just a guy that that you know, the ball, the ball found him and this one. But he's typically the guy that that that finds it. Um, he's he's just gonna be fun to watch it, you know. Yeah, And I think I think we can't discredit I had. I actually talked to Stephen Jones a little bit before the game and we were talking about about Parsons. He said, just the fact that

he played all these spots. Not all rookies can actually handle the workload of what you know, what this guy does at this spot, what he does here, it's one thing to line him up all over the field, but to be able to do it and learn the system for all those spots is amazing. That's a great point because as an athlete, you look at Michael Parsons you

say he's gonna fit in wherever you put him. But from a mental standpoint, especially after not playing a football game for over a year and a half, then you turn up and you're in training camp and you go, Okay, here's three different spots we want you to try and play at, do three hundred different things with it, and he's successful. I asked Mike McCarthy that the first week out here because it kind of reminded me. I was trying to think of something similar, and maybe Byron Jones

in twenty fifteen. You know, they had him working at like every secondary position point yea, And the question becomes like, how much is too full of plate? Early and Mike said, maybe early on, a little bit too much on his plate. Dan Quinn basically says, I'm gonna keep putting stuff on his plate because he's shown he can handle it. And if you notice between series, they're always talking and I don't think it's been too big for him. And we did see him again in some different spots. Dave and

I talked about it. On that first series, he could have had a tackle for loss if you'd taken maybe a little bit different angle. Talking about on the run play out right, Yes, I guess it was Steeler's left. He was going out right, yeah, intensively. Yeah, that's the one. Obviously, the fumble recovery. The in series he had blitz up the middle that uh that that forced a quick throw, also a tackle. I think he stopped Naji Harris for

a one yard game. He was just productive. He's just around the ball, and it is exciting because you kind of don't know where he's gonna be any given snap. Right if we're gonna take it to the next level of linebackers, Um, well I did. I also think Layton Vanderish I thought it looked pretty good out there too. Definitely look good. Um, you know, he only had five snaps, but he looked good in those five. I thought, Yeah,

I thought he played well. Luke Gifford starting to get back into the buddy what he showed he definitely is and you know, we we just put Jabrol Cox just over him and and that's not the case at all, like Gifford, you know, and that Cox is gonna he's he's still gonna work his way in there. Did he made a specially he made the only specialty tackle right. He had five tackles on defense as well. Who Luke? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, who Who's who's the new corner?

Um Brown? Yeah? Two tackles for loss. He's pretty good. We haven't really seen a whole lot. I was like, where I'm missed that one? That That was the thing is we were looking at him in practice a training camp and you didn't get to see a whole lot of brown now and then he comes out and he makes two pacles for loss and it's like, oh, okay, there you go. Kennedy was there too. He made a couple of good plays. I think a zur Kamara off the edge. He had three pressures yesterday was probably the

closest to getting a sack. He had two hits. Is maybe the leader in training camp of guys we haven't talked about. I would agree with that. There's always you look at the roster and you're like, oh, he's there and so and another guy that actually had had a nice catch. I believe Aaron Parker like and then we don't really talk about Aaron Parker. I talk about Aaron Parker a lot good he was. That was That was me like puffing up a little bit. I liked him

in training camp last year. And I think if he would have had a if he would have had a preseason a year ago, I think Parker would have shown out yind him he was playing well in preseason, I mean training Yeah, for sure. It just comes down to a numbers thing. I mean, how many spots are open at wide receiver, linebacker with Kamara uh cornerback for Kyron Brown. Just there just aren't spots. Now there's more practice wat spots when you're evaluating receiver Malik Turner good or bad?

Both both? Right, had you had a good day led the team in receiving, had forty seven yards on five receptions, and then he had had a big turn Yeah, I got to hang onto the ball on the best play he had toost play he had and he turns around through that rush Cooper rush. Yeah, way more good than

bad if you factor in everything out here. But as we talked about from league, Turner, although not the game, that's true, No, yeah exactly, But as we've talked about on Talking Cowboys, Like, how many times have we talked about receivers in offseason workouts, training camp? Get to the games and it can be a different story. Yeah, so you got to be able to translate it over these next three games, because again, I don't know if there's spots open at wide receiver. There might be a sixth

spot open, but that might be it. Yeah, sorry, what was that you need? I am? I am a little bit. We all are, I mean, I mean, I'm sure you guys. Yeah, there's the reason I went and grabbed it while you know, I was on the plane and I was about to go to sleep and they had a mute a movie playing and Creed too, which is one of the favorite was Yeah, Creed, Creed, the original Creed better than anything in the Rocky series my opinion. Okay, let me see,

you're just looking for excuse to stop the show. That's a strong take. It's a strong takes, a strong in accurate. No, it's able discussion. It's good, it's good, it's up. I mean, it's up in there. It's up there for sure. I don't know Rockies. I don't know even they of them. Kyle I have young but I don't think I've watched Creed too. But I've watched Creed and you were the rest of the Rockies. You were minus twenty five. Yeah, Rocky, the original Rocky. It's exactly right. But it's great. You

can't watch out. You can't watch Creed two if you don't see all the Rockies because there's there's a lot of stuff, lot of stuff. Yeah. Yeah, it's like the Marvel movies. They all kind of intertwined. You got to see them all in a specific order and whatnot. Yeah, to really get it zero there. Yeah, I'm sorry, you can take that there. My next My next Marvel movie will be the first first ever. I don't know how you've gotten through that pretty well. Actually, just keep watching

the Rockies, just keep going back to it. We talked a little bit about safety, and of course that's been a topic of conversation throughout training camp. And we only got a couple of minutes left. But what did you guys see in the rotation at safety yesterday that stuck out to you outside of maybe what Mukuamu did and back behind that defense, it was just I mean limited snaps for Casey, right right, He was out there for

was it one series? Six snaps to six snaps? It's just such a small Sam Wilson was on a ball cap right, Yes, I believed Curse started opposite or next two. Yeah, Curse played the most out of at least those initials. Oh wait, no, never mind. Cursonally had six naps as well. I think that's a throwaway game for safe safety. I mean, Millie Cooker's gonna eventually get into into this mix because

he's gonna play more. Obviously, donaltor Wilson. I mean the Steelers, the Steelers receivers and tight ends would probably feel it'd be good about that. They'd be happy that he went out there because he's gonna hit. Yeah, I mean he doesn't really care. He's just gonna go out there and hit. And so no, I think, you know, we'll see what happens in Arizona. I'm a little curious about Arizona. We've done this once before where we have a long training camp and you go to Arizona. It was not so good.

It was not good out there. You know, when when you know when the end is near and you know getting back home and all that, you got this one more stop to make. It's never really a good game there. Well, I mean we talked about this on our local TV hit this morning with Kyle that you know the Rams coming in. I don't know how much you guys talked about it at the first segment, but that is like a preseason game and a half these last three days here,

I mean between Steelers and now Rams. Mike is he's balancing his playing time in the Steeler game, he says, based off of what's coming on Saturday. Now, look, you're never going to play most of your starters in the preseason opener Hall of Fame game. But he's looking at this like it's a competitive practice coming up here, not a live practice, but you know, another team coming in

and get some good situational work coming in. But defensively, yeah, I think in the secondary there weren't any busts from the safeties that I saw. That's good communication. You're still looking for that communication to be better with Dan Quinn and I think it has been out here for the most part. And then hey, run defense two point five yards Kerry for the Steelers. That's good, that's progress. And again it's not all the starters in here for the

Dallas defense. But you know, for a Steelers team that has struggled last year to run the ball, that continued in this game anyway. And I know you didn't get a chance to hear it, Nick, because you were probably on the field doing doing your pregame hits. But Troy and Joe talked about it a little bit when it came to the Steelers. Their number one knock last year as a team was not being able to run the football.

They had dressed dressed that in the first round last year with Naja Harris and then twenty fourth overall pick, and they wanted to establish the run early. You could see that the whole first half was them trying to establish the run, and the Cowboys held them to seventy six total yards over all four quarters. In terms of run defense. Yeah, and you shut them out in the first half. I think that is something positive. Yes, the final score was sixteen to three, throw that out the window.

That first half was impressive to me in terms of the improvements they've made in the run deep. You know, Pittsburgh was kind of running a little bit early there, and I thought the Cowboys got fortunate with that botched snap snap and so they were kind of moving it there. Yeah, I think, you know, I think we'll see a ben but don't break defense. And I think that's that's not what we saw last year. We just saw just give up sixty yard passes and eighty yards passes over the

top and five right. But you know, depends on where you're bending. If you're bending in a little bit of receivers, that's fine. If they are running the ball four or five six yards, that's not a good thing. But no, I think they got to fix some things up. But um, you know, and nobody nobody's throwing you know, the the swirl ice creams with the with the sprinkles and stuff like that. I mean, it's vanilla vanilla all the way and just boring you know stuff out there. No tooty

fruity until later on. You're making me hungry lunch. Yeah, absolutely, you kidding me? Hot California son? Uh? Really quickly and ten words or lass? What are you looking for tomorrow? In the rams practice? Try not to get into a big fight. And he's had some unproductive football out there. Okay, interior offensive line against Aaron Donald. If we see Aaron Donald, I hope we do. I think we will. I think

that would be really fun. Tyler Bottish, Connor Williams, maybe Zach Martin, depending on how much teamwork they give him. That'd be fun. Let's go. Yeah, it's gonna be a lot of fun matchups. Jalen Ramsey coming to town, Cooper Cup, Robert Woods, Matthew Stafford, lots of stars coming and converging on Oxnard, California tomorrow. Nick Eatman Rob Phillips will both

be on that coverage tomorrow. I'll be on there as well, starting off five pm Central Time at three pm Pacific time here on Dallas Cowboys dot Com and also on t x A twenty one. Want to thank you for being with us here over the last hour breaking down the Hall of Fame game. Will be back throughout the week. More training camp coming from Oxnard, California, presented by an American Airlines. But for Rob and Nick, I'm Kyle saying

so long from Oxnard. We'll see an next time. This has been a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. Us out there