Mick Shots: The Big Picture

The following is a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.

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This is nick shot streaming live on dallascowboys dot Com and the official Dallas Cowboys have now Here are Bill Jones, Everson Wolves, and Mickey Spagnola.

I would like a fight song on this Tuesday, but I'm not going to get one.

No, you should not.

What are you going to fight about?

I'm fired up? Oh it's stay number nine of Cowboys Coach Search twenty twenty five. The college football season is over and now it's full steam ahead for Shrine Bowl Week. Here come right at the end of the week.

How old is that bowl game?

It goes back as long as long as Randy White goes back. A Manster played it in nineteen seventy four, whatever year it was.

This year is one hundred. I was going to say one hundred.

Yeah, Producer Supremes got the answer for you.

Because Randy White is only halfway there.

Yeah, yeah, it was half one hundred years ago.

Did you not play a heck?

No, I went to Grambling. They don't look at us.

Usually players in Grambling do play.

No, they don't not back then, back now they do now because the Shrine Williams came along, of course there had to be something extremely special. But no, if you're going to catch those guys, it's rarely HBCU players.

Well, the Shrine Bowl used to be big time.

It still is.

It's going to be played at at and T staate away.

From compared to the Senior Bowl.

Well, it's now it's rivaling that they're just going to be played at at and T Stadium. Mickey, Thursday, January thirtieth.

I still have a Senior Boat and they're gonna work.

Then I found out there was something called the Tropical Bowl that they moved from Orlando to Daytona beach.

Diet This ever, the Portal Bowl.

You know what?

You know what?

Ever, since get this, they actually now play high school. Of course, you had Pro Bowl in Hawaii. Now they've got high school All Star games in Hawaii. The point set of bowl. And I saw the catch of the Year on Friday night on the NFL Network, Decorean Moore out of Duncanville High School, who's headed to Oregon, number one wide receiver recruit in the nation. He made the most incredible one handed catch in traffic.

And I have started out, I know you got it on the iPad.

I can send it to you, but I'm got I've already made him my number one pick in the twenty twenty eight NFL Big Green Notebook, Big Green Notebook.

That's right.

Well, I coached them kids the Navy All Star Game, All American Game.

I think that was on that this past Saturday. Oh you did? Yeah? Yeah?

Was it this bad Saturday for wuk Muhammad all the dbs that I coached out there? Man, they were pretty good kids and they ended up playing in the the Navy All American Game, which is down in San Antonio. It was nice, all right, very good. I cast some really nice talent there and they played nationwide television that Sunday that Saturday following Saturday.

Did you have coach number twenty nine from Notre Dame on the island by himself with the best wide receiver in the country?

Hey?

Man?

Well?

Or is Ryan Williams, the Alabama seventeen year old true freshman.

What happened to him?

Did? He seemed like he fell because Alban wasn't good this year. He fell off big at ther Man Nick Saban retired.

Yeah, well, Nick will say that's why.

That's Jeremiah Smith, who Texas, by the way, held a one catch for three yards, and the true national championship.

Guy really only had two catches of significance. One they chose not to cover him when the corner back back then the law. Okay, so the first touchdown, right, he's waving, we don't have enough people over here, and he chose to go inside and let the best wide receiver in the country just uncovered.

Do you think that's just a jerk reaction, Like, Okay, if I'm here, I got a choice, you're number four, you're somebody else, and so I come over and I'm.

Not taking him. I'm gonna take him.

I say, my job, you know, do.

You think that?

You know, now on that play at the end, would did they send everybody on the blitz? Was there no safety?

There was no safe?

Yeah? Right, no?

See, which is you have to question that?

So well, well, one thing.

You can't question, regardless of what they decided to do with number before or.

Not, was Jeremiah paramise.

That catch is still the catch. You know, it's still that that was still his moment.

You know, he was gonna catch it and wide open, wide open. I mean, we got to catch it. But yeah, what about.

Just getting on him on the line of scrimmage. You know, don't worry about the first down, worry about the touchdown.

Yeah, well you you would think, I mean it all though it was third.

Well, I'm saying it's a hell of a call.

Yeah, well it was third not not particularly it was third and eleven. Yeah, you know, and they're not gonna the only way you're going to end the game is that way, basically, because it was an all out blitz, right and uh and so he just reared back and throw it to the best receiver in the country, as you say, and he made that's right, and and he's wide open. And what was interesting about it is if if they don't complete that ball, then Notre Dame is

It would have come down all right.

Number one, they were not going to convert on fourth down the way that game was fourth and nine or whatever. It was, right, and you had enough time left where you clearly had enough time to get possessions if they kicked the field if they make the field goal and then it plays out like it did, they got the ball back, they scored a touchdown, they would have been down with four point fifteen left in the game. They're down only six, needing a touchdown and just an extra

I was thinking, you've got limited time and you're going to have limited possessions, right, So if I kicked the field goal and make it, I can on side kick and get a steal of possession back. But if I miss on the fourth.

Down, yeah, I'm toast. I just felt like.

I thought that's what he was thinking.

I'm gone, Well, you know what I was thinking. Number one, they were bogged in and they weren't. They weren't converting, And secondly, what were the odds that they were going to make three two point conversions?

Right? Right?

And so you were you were probably going to have to kick a field goal, and if this miraculous comeback was going to happen, they were going to have to kick a field goal at some point, and as it turned out, there was plenty of time left because they finally got a stop and Ryan days much like Lincoln Riley where he gets a lead in the game and

Anyway, I wanted to be there and ask him, were you thinking of on side kicking because there was like four minutes to go and they still needed too.

Well at that point they were like nine minutes. There was eight or nine minutes left.

Yeah, when they missed.

When they missed the field goal, Yeah, yep, there was that much time because they got the ball back, scored and got it within eight with four and four minutes, and I think.

It just seemed like it was less time because they wanted to They just went because they weren't doing it at the point.

Yeah, that's right.

Yeah, so are if you're Washington and you just banged the field goal off the upright, let it bounce.

In right.

The bank the mithfield goal.

Now the one they the commanders, the commanders, the one they made.

Oh oh oh, well you got me.

There, Sorry, I changed I changed it here. So I was getting back to the NFL.

And by the way, we are on at a different time because of the holiday yesterday. Yes, we moved to nine o'clock on Tuesday, just for this week. Next week we will be back at eleven am on Monday. This, as I mentioned off the top, is day number nine of the coach search. And do you think we will have a coach named by the next time we convene next Monday at eleven am? Or is it going longer than that?

Well, if indeed they're serious about Kellen Moore, then it's going to go longer than they could make that that and that game is being played on Sunday.

If he lost on Sunday, right by eleven am Monday, they could name him the coach, kind of like what Chicago did with Ben Johnson.

So Ben's gone.

Johnson's gone to Chicago, So Mike McCarthy's not the new coach of the Chicago.

Bears, and everything was going to be.

That was always a ploy to try to get the show the Cowboys that Mike McCarthy's got other options.

And then we don't get to use Ben and Jerry.

Married thinking about that forever.

Come, did you ever express to Jerry that thought that was a great I just knew some sponsorship.

From one of the radio shows is gonna say. I've been way up man, I've been having that. I think I wrote it down.

Jerry might have actually interviewed him if you give him that sponsorship idea.

All right, So I don't think that was gonna happen.

I don't think so either. So uh, what would you say?

Well? Number one, the Bear's job to me would be safer because now I've got a young quarterback that I'm in charge of developing, right, instead of inheriting a job that everybody expects. Okay, we're going now thirteen and four because I've got the quarterback. So I think from a you know, a five year deal that's safe. I think the Bears was probably a better choice.

We have breaking news, yes, you reported now the Cowboys are expected to interview their own offensive coordinator, Brian Schottenheimer, for their vacant head coaching job.

Okay, so last week I was told that there's another candidate whose name hadn't come up yet that would be the one. And I think this might be.

The one because his name had not come up yet, and the first time I think it may have been mentioned by others, but.

No, it had not.

The first time that I heard his name mentioned was on the Fox pregame show just prior to kick off on Sunday when and it was now that I look back at it, Kurt Menafee.

It was.

It was a strange placement in the pregame show, right, because that we are leading up to kickoff of the Philadelphia Rams game, and usually earlier in the show they take care of all the coaching rumors going on. And Kurt Menafee said, he set up Jimmy Johnson to say something about the Cowboys coach search and Jimmy and this

And I went, huh, And he said it.

With Jimmy has operation yes.

With a lot of emotion.

Confident, yeah, confidence, confidence, I mean he was Jimmy was I think, Jimmy, do you know on air, I'm just speculating because of the timing. It was late in their pregame show. Now, maybe you mentioned it earlier. I don't know.

That is just what I saw.

That's what I saw, and.

I thought, uh, he has found out something here because no one else was talking about Shottenheimer. So and then sure enough by the next morning, Uh, the odds.

The odds in Vegas just shot up like he was.

He was the odds on choice to be the next head coach.

This came down from the mouth right that Jimmy said it. Uh huh, odds are here's our betting favorite here.

I thought I was telling you Jimmy never really speaks on the Cowboys.

No, he doesn't. That was another thing that Okay, Jimmy's not like an investigative.

No, you know, he's not going to be hey, I got something.

All he's doing is he's doing his answer in his phone.

And as it as it turns out, I heard that his name did get mentioned last week inside the building. Okay, sure, So, I mean it was kind of I when Jimmy said it, I was thinking, okay, well, that's just kind of putting two and two together. Right, he's the offensive coordinator that has a relationship with.

But the way it was packaged, yes, I know, you know that was like, okay, it was intentional. Yes, he's got some new information here and he wanted to get it out there.

And yeah, I mean is it legitimate information?

Oh?

I think it?

I think it.

Well, clearly it is now that we are learning they're being reported widely that the Cowboys are interviewing.

I mean, did they have to report they were going to interview. He's in the building, right, It's not like they got to bring him in.

But Jimmy said it's important.

Well, he said it, like, is he still in the building? Well, I think didn't all the contracts expire?

I know, but you still be here?

I mean you can, yeah, but you can still be here.

I would think you still get good lunch, like like we lunch.

We last night on our show, I went and found some old sound bite from Brian Schottenheimer talking about Dak Prescott talking about his relationship with Dak or whatever, just for mainly for people. Even though he talks every week, we don't typically use Brian Schottenheimer sound bites on TV, And so I wanted to show people, Okay, this is how this guy talks, which is one of his strengths. You know, he's very good communicating.

Okay, But.

And just to give people a paint a picture, Okay, this is who Brian Schottenheimer is. And I can't remember where I was going with that.

Well, do you consider this low hanging fruit?

Is this something that's legitimate even though it is it has been brought out?

Yeah, makes the relationship with Yeah, I take it. One of the keys on this is they paid a lot of money to their quarterback and he's a part of this process and it's how he's going to be most effective. And if Dak I think Dak probably he's given a ringing endorsement to Shottenheimer.

I'm sure the last thing you want is a big shake up while you're trying to come back from a major injury. You know, you want to be as comfortable as possible. You don't want to have to go through a whole bunch of.

But the other thing, with the other thing with Schottenheimer, Okay, if you want him to remain or start calling plays now or whatever, I mean, he doesn't have to be the head coach to do that, right, that's me.

I was thinking he could.

Remain the offensive coordinator and now you've basically giving him a promotion where he's calling plays now under another head coach. Well, and because what as Mike McCarthy may be finding out right now? Okay, where's he going to land?

You know?

And if he gets hired as the head coach, do they want him to be the offensive coordinator?

Right? Does?

Because my bottom line on Friday when I wrote, I said, you can give me all these people that are candidates, right, but the question everybody's got to answer is who's the offensive coordinator? Because if you hire a defensive guy, that's the first question I ask you, who are you going to hire and so? And if it's an offensive guy, are you the head coach? And then you got an offensive coordinator? Or are you the offensive coordinator? But the key thing here is who's going to run this offense?

It seems like we're just going for comfort here. You know, I don't want to be too comfortable, you know, I get it.

They don't want to change things.

You know, if we wouldn't have had all these injuries last year. I get I get it where they see if we could just get most of those guys back and won't be so chaotic as it was this past season, then we could keep things as close to normal as possible as far as keeping the same coaches, as far as keeping the same coordinators, you know.

Or did he have other ideas that they weren't following. He was just following what McCarthy said, because if you think about the offense.

He took it over. He took it over the last two.

Years, last two years. And Schottenheimer see three years ago in twenty twenty two, Shottenheimer was in the building as an analyst, primarily looking at the defense at that during that season, and then Kellen Moore walked away and went to the Chargers in twenty twenty three.

And shot Mike wanted to take over it enough.

And so then Schottenheimer became the quote unquote offensive coordinator, though McCarthy was a play caller. And that's the way it's been the last two years. And by the way, in the twenty twenty three season, DAK was second in the MVP voting.

So now, and here's the other thing that.

They and they cut down on those interceptions that they had with Kellen Morris.

Yes, oh see, that they did. But remember Kellen, Yeah, a lot of those interceptions weren't daxx. Though the criticism of Kellen was always he wanted to throw.

The ball too much.

What did they do in Philadelphia? Ran the ball at the NFL record well until until because they could run the ball.

Vicky until the last drive of the game. The other day, and they're in the snow. They've got Saquon Barkley who's run for two hundred and five yards in that game. And on first down they handed off to Barkley for three yards. It's second and seven, and then Kellen Moore called a quarterback bootleg and with a quarterback I'm playing on a bad knee, and it was a sack and the Rams got back in the game because of that play call.

But they ran for two hundred yards exactly.

But you would too if Jalen Hurts was your quarterback in sake, when Barkley was your running back.

Right.

But my point is when, and this is what happened a lot of times when Moore was here. I think you go back to what is in your DNA in critical.

Oh you mean it's too cute.

Well, yeah, passing is in his DNA well, and so on second and second down and seven at the thirty three where they need to run the football and not give the football back to the Rams, they run a bootleg where and get sacked and now you got to put the football away.

I think that the term is he tries. How smart of it? That's right, That's what that play was. Just just give Barkley the ball in the snow. Anyway, And by the way, speaking of that.

Did you like Ben Johnson's play call on the double reverse wide receiver pass in the game against Washington the other night. Jamison Williams throws the interception. Talk, I mean, what are you doing?

Cute?

Yeah, I mean, whoa, this is the offensive genius. Okay, they're finally getting some momentum, they're getting back into the game, and he decides to call a double reverse pass with the wide receiver throwing the ball in the coverage one of the already one of the best cornerbacks in the league, the rookie Mike Sainras still with Washington, who had two

And you know that's just the waste of his talent right to throw the ball? What is he a quarterback? Does he have any don't think so.

But it was a nice pass, yeah, short the spiral, Well that whole data. Look Washington, and I wrote it on Wednesday, this don't bet against this team because they're living a charmed existence. What are the chances? What are the chances that on what was it? Fourth and two at five and they're not listening to Tom Brady yelling you better call time out, You better call time out. You got too many guys in the field, right right, And then they got penalized and now it's first in

Well, I must say, regardless of that, they were less charmed in this game.

Than they were in any other game. Well, because I mean.

That play they turned into a touchdown.

Right, yeah, but for that, for that play, what if you stopped them on fort for that play to give you a fourteen point win right against this team? You see what I'm saying, right, I mean, Detroit should have they still they played them as well as I've seen anyone play Detroit this year offensively on defense.

Okay, and so but you still gave up thirty some points.

Yeah, but you scored forty five.

I know.

The speaking of that, I'm sitting near on Ben Johnson. Okay, he's supposed to be this genius, you know, and you gotta hire this guy or I can't believe you're not an interviewing that that called the double reverse wide pass. Okay. Well, then we got the other guy who I love, Aaron Glenn. But okay, he is the defensive coordinator and there are twelve men on the field there, and so who's responsible for this stuff?

You know?

And it's like it's like these other candidates, Okay, on a fifteen win team, they can do no wrong. Okay, they gotta gotta hire these guys. And they're just as human as the guys that you've.

Let me tell you, And I think they got a very few, very as you look at they had coaches. As you look at all these championship games, there are very few coaches that are like the elite coach and and these are good teams. But I'm sorry, coaches make mistakes, and we have seen it in every game over and over again.

Not the player.

We're talking about, coaches making critical mistake in the huge games. We've been watching them since December. Yep, it's crazy, man.

The greatest coaches of all time make mistakes all the time.

Bro, So we we we will manticize the Toms, and then with Pittsburgh's coach, we we will manticize those guys.

But man, Mike Tomlin, Mike Tomlins up a whole lot under as much fire as any coach in the league, and he's got twenty one straight winning small.

But he can't win a playoff.

Yeah, right, all right, it's got to work for.

Even Nick Saban might have made a mistake.

Once, Yeah, every once in a while.

Don't be flushing the toilets any.

Time, and don't get that barbecue pit.

And we're back with more. Make sure.

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All right, very good, Uh, Mickey, would you like to clarify anything on the shrine bowls here?

No?

He was called on the carping mouth during the break. Mickey was called on the carpet for saying that the practices would be at Ford Center. They are not because we've got Dallas Open Tennis that get started next week, and so they would be practicing on tennis courts if they were here. So they have They're going to be practicing at indoor facilities in the area. And I was told last week that you n T was one of the That's correct, you and T.

So I can't just walk down the hall. No, you can't like I did last year.

That's I was told.

Isaiah standback is on that call, by the way, for the Shrine Bowl.

All right, okay, very good. All right, So we've talked about anything else on Schottenheimer that you want to And again the breaking news this morning as the Cowboys have put in a request to interview Brian shot you have to they put a request with their own team guy coach.

It's just going well, one guy that evidently he's not in his.

Office as John Fossil, right, and the other the others of course, just to bring everybody up to speed on the long weekend, maybe you were out of pocket, but Kellen Moore did a virtual interview on Friday morning, and then on Saturday morning, Robert Salah, the former Jet said coach was here. And then yesterday it was Leslie Frasier, the assistant head coach of the Seattle Seahawks. So Schottenheimer, by our count, would be interviewed number four and but the third on the premises here.

So I wonder if they asked my question to Salah and Leslie Fraser.

About who would your offensive coordinator be?

Yes, better have a good ad, And they.

Answered Brian Schottenheimer. Right, here's their answer. Here's the answer. The offensive coordinator is whoever Dak Prescott wants it to be right.

There you go. What if he says Kellen Moore.

He won't say Kelling Moore. He will not say you don't.

Think so, now don't Well Kellen Moore got an interview, he got it.

Well, I'm sorry to yeah, right coordinator?

All right, yes, okay, that's why I want to make sure you're clarified, not making a sideways yeah. You know how people will just take a little clip, that little sound bite. Well, Everson Wallace s is that like Kelling Moore?

Well, and I did not not say that.

And here was here was my Here was my point too on answering the question about the offense offensive coordinator. Five of five of the top seven salaries in twenty twenty four were offensive guys. So if I'm spending all that money on the offense, I better find somebody.

To run that off offensive right.

And then next year I figured out seven of the top twelve guys were in cap hits are offensive guys. So if I'm spending all my money there, then I better be able to take care of my top salaries and I better be pretty good on offense if I'm healthy.

I mean, I look at the Detroit game. I was very surprised.

I'm always I always seem like I'm on the outside looking in when it comes to favorites. Yeah, I was really carrying the banner for Jared Goff for MVP this season, which he was doing, which he was doing pretty well at the time, right Uh, I mean just really looking good through some really good passes in clutch situations all season long, even the games as they lost by.

The way, playing in the one of the worst divisions in football, as it turns out if you look at the playoffs.

But it wasn't like that before the playoffs.

It turns out the Cowboys were playing in the best division.

And figure that conference. Go figure that, huh right.

Yeah, and they went five hundred.

Yeah.

Man, come on, look at the teams that we did beat outside of our division. Come on, this team was right for agetting out yo yo, Gary go. I was gonna say, well, now I see why everyone no one wanted him for MVP.

He's just the way it was.

He ended up going back to the same old things and he did back when he was with the Rams. You know, you could see as he and Sam Donald to me are from the same cloth, cut from the same cloth. These guys don't like pressure. They don't perform well underpression. And when I, of course, I'm gonna always compare this to what I've seen Dak do. Everyone talked

And the same thing happened to darnalda thing that was the guy you were used to seeing, and it showed up last game.

Right, it wasn't even close.

It was like, what are you doing? And that was the question you used to ask about that guy.

Well, here's the thing.

When that's why defense is so good, That's why good defense is so important. You stop a lot of things from happening. I'll say this, A good defense stops.

Some history making plays. They stop history from happening.

Ye know, if we if you play good defense, then then great plays don't happen.

I hate to point this part out because it sounds so clich ish, but watching the college playoffs, the NFL playoffs, if you ain't strong up front on both sides.

That's it. That's it, ass Texas, that's Texas, right, Yeah, you can't.

They yours was under pressure and that's why. And those are two tackles that are supposed to be first round draft picks.

And I keep hearing people saying about yours. It's like, yeah, and any fumbled in the biggest play, and I'm going no, it's right. Tackle didn't block the guy?

My brother from you. He went to ut He hates the do what what is wrong?

He gets blind sighted by a guy that should have been blocked.

I don't get it. I don't get it.

But you know, we'll see when it comes to us next year. But man, as far as a college quarterback, as far as the University of Texas, I think that's the quarterback they needed at boy I hope Archie Manning is at arch arch Manning.

I hope that he.

Comes in here and does well because they are depending on this young man a lot.

By the way, my understanding is that, uh, just going back to that, we got to go to a break here on that goal line situation for Texas and Ohio State.

Uh, arch arch was not available. They didn't.

You got him, he got he got hurt earlier on the Remember the play he ran the ball, he popped up the ball down. Yes, I understand he was in protocol and so he was on. No one's ever said anything about that, But that's my understanding from inside sources down there.

And just look at Notre Dame last night. The left tackle who hadn't played all year. You had to go in there and play against their best pass rush, and he struggled right and turned a guard and he yeah, kicked out the tackle.

Yeah.

And then you got Kansas City. They got one of the best guards in the league, Joe Toney. They've had to kick him out, attack and struggle and so anyway, all right, we continue with more mix shines in a moment.

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Bam, that's next week.

They didn't give you the dates.

They give me no dates, man.

The livids February first through the ninth or something like that. Okay, yeah, which is why this February.

That's it?

Well when's the when's the Shrine Bowl?

It's January thirtieth, So yeah, I guess I have to set up early for the Dallas.

You don't even have a for the trying.

For at and T Stadium.

Yeah.

Well we've been We've gotten a lot of a lot of time to the Thursday night, Thursday night, a week from Thursday, okay, okay, so the prospects will be arriving probably on Friday something like that.

And so.

All right, uh, this little note that sounds like the Jets have targeted Aaron Glenn as their new head coach. He's talking with them today and the goal he played there, Yes he did. He was drafted first round draft pick of the Jets out of Texas A and M. And the goal is to keep him from leaving the building today the next head coach of the New York Jets.

I just really like him, like him as a person, like the way he coaches the way he speaks, I think he would be good. And again, we got to remember when you're hiring a head coach, it's got to be somebody can stand in front of seventy people five days a week and hold their attention like, Okay, this guy knows what he's talking about, or at least you say it like you know what you're talking about. Not every coordinator is a head coach.

It's you know, some guys have to manage, you know. He Some guys are good at head coaching. Some are two different skill set of.

Being hands on.

You know, you have to, like you said, you have to capture their attention every day, all day.

And you have to have to be able to manage a team.

You have to be able to manage people, you know, And as defensive coordinator, I'm sure he's done that on a partial from a partial standpoint, and I would imagine the way he saw Dan Campbell do it.

He's been back there with him the entire time.

And we're going to get to the Bills and the Ravens here in just second, But real quick, what did you see in Bill Parcells in the way he managed people?

He was really good and how he was able to.

Because with Parcels, he and George Young didn't like each other, so he had to deal with.

A hostile GM.

GM and I mean they hated each other. I mean it was so clear.

When boom Bill left, George was like, yeah, I finally got what I needed.

And then he made the mistake on who he hired after well.

Yeah, I mean he made the mistake by not liking part.

Sales, you know, not dealing and and and dealing with him better on on a more even basis. Uh pars Sales was able to keep management out of the player's way. He was always good at he He always said, I want the team and management to hate me, not.

To hate each other.

He was the goal between Okay, keep keep George, keep you away from my players, you know, let you. I'll talk to you about my players. That that's what you talked to me about. You don't go talk to my players. I'll take care of that. And when it came to management, if players had a beef, then we had to go strictly to Parcels. Don't go above him. You could if you wanted to. He wouldn't hold it against you. But the way he.

Wanted it was you come talk to me about it. I will handle management. So he was just a real good middle man.

And the one thing that he did here he brought in a couple of his guys and they were the locker room guys of course, right, they kind of not.

He believed in that.

Not only ran the locker room, but he was the go between between the players and himself.

And most likely it was a linebacker. Is a linebacker type of person?

Was it Gary? He had? He had somebody on defense offense? Was Richie Anderson?

Uh huh.

So he could kind of monitor. He didn't go in the locker room, but he had locker room monitor, that's right. And uh yeah, and he commanded.

It was usually call Banks or Pepper Johnson type that would he would take them with it. He took him to Cleveland. You saw what happened when Pepper went to Cleveland. Yeah, come back in here, and they whipped out butts, you know, after they got rid of me. So I'm like, yeah, they don't need you ever.

But I guess my question for you is more along the lines of how he dealt with players on a daily basis as far because a lot of it was the antagonism type. But he also if it was he one of those types that if he's given you a hard time, that means he likes you.

If he's given you a hard time, yes, that means you better. That means you better tighten up. Okay, that's what that means.

But he's also there's a good nature.

Yeah that if he if he doesn't give you a hard time.

You're out. That's right, Yeah, that's right. That's the point right there.

But he's engaging.

He engaged with you, then he he wants to work with you.

Yeah, you've got you've got a future.

He's he's he's you know, he's checking out you. He's checking your temperature. I see what you're about. And so you know, when I first got there, he did the same thing with me. Uh he went around asking uh, some of the players that not just came in with me, but those were that were there, asking them what kind of person did they think I was?

What kind of player did they think I was?

He asked Thorn Channel, He asked Steve Diassi, but he also asked Pepa Johnson, and he also asked Called Banks.

But that's all part of managing people.

No doubt, Because he talked to different types of people. That's right.

That's why. That's the way he treated the media too.

But that didn't work for them.

Yeah, well, if you were smart, you understood if he was on you, he was paying attention.

At least it may sound to an outsider like, well he really gave Mickey a hard time, but he was. Actually I told you that new Jersey.

That's new Jersey.

He's a New Jersey guy. You know, they're gonna be real with you. But come on, I'm gonna be real with you. I'm not trying to go behind anybody else's back. I'm coming to you. But you have some who if I'm plus salesmann come to you in that manner, they're still uncomfortable and they will go and complain and they will, you know, take note unnecessarily.

That's the half Italian in them.

I think it is.

It is, it is, I mean, and you gotta love it because it's real. You know, give me a coach that's not gonna be ask me man, I really and some some players can see it coming.

And then and the players who can't handle it, they don't need to be honest. Team.

That's why the culture there when I went, when I came from here, and simply because we had gone through so much here with the Cowboys. There are a lot of builty excuses, a lot of finger pointing, a lot of blaming every just everywhere. But when you when I went to New York, the whole thing was nobody's blaming anybody. We are in this locker room. It's the most solid locker room I've ever seen. And I've never been on the defense. I've never been on the defense like that before.

And I think that's why I'm not sure about Bloodshell. But like guys like Drew Henson, Chad Hutchinson, they were not never gonna shrunk. Yeah yeah, but Romo hard. It was for Phil Simms, but Romo is not the sensitive type where Romo will flourish under it. Yeah, okay. And Witton was the same way. It's tough guy. Yeah, you love with them, sure right, all right? Tell me about the Bill's Ravens.

What do you think. I feel so sorry for Andrews. So sorry. Good pass, right, good pass. It was good.

It could have been you know, he kind of he kind of aimed it, you know, and it was right.

There's the championship.

It's kind of like I think it's the same way that Roger talks about the past that Jackie Rogers. I thought that immediately, but but but Roger would say that, you know, I should have given him a better pass.

But he still got to catch it, right. You come on, guys, I remember Drew Pierson. I'll never forget you Pierson. He talked about how wide receivers complained about they want to pass it. He said, anywhere in here youth is a good pass that you.

Can be as low as you want. Just kiss the damn.

Ball, bro And he's their best receiver.

And he's the best receiver. Well, Jackie, he made more than one mistake in this game though. Yeah, he made like three mistakes. We had to fumble bumble, Yeah, another.

Mispass, saying like with Jackie Smith, people forget that he's in the Hall of Fame, but so does Mark. Andrews drops that ball and Jackie Smith starts trending on Twitter and trended in.

And my brother was like, oh, he's from Ou. A, oh yeah, he from you. What do you expect? I already used it.

I was texting with Babeloffenbury what I said earlier in the show that, uh, you know Ryan Day, Yeah, he quit running his offense late in that game, you know, and he got close on him. And I said, that's what link. That was the most frustrate One of the most frustrating thrink things with Lincoln Riley at OU is that he would he would shut down the offense once

Mark Andrews gotta be like Jimmy and throw the slant to Elvin Harper in the ninety two seed title again, right.

I mean, you know, we could have been looking at a really classic over time.

So when we.

Oh, yeah, can you imagine if that game went overtime?

Man, So when we reconvene on Monday, Nick shots at eleven, we're going to have a new head coach. No, I don't think so. Yeah, I think we could.

Do you think we could? I think Jason Witten will be named the new head coach by Monday at eleven eight.

I think he'll have a spot. I think he'll have a spot on the spot on the on the staff.

You think he wants that, I mean just the tight end coach.

I don't think he wants just the tight end coach.

Yeah, well eventually, No, but.

I don't think you got to think about what he's given up. He's got two more years coaching his son, so I think I think just me, just me talking here, I think he the only way that he would give that up coaching his youngest son for his older son is going to Rice. So he's already graduated, he's got one more one of the top recruits in the country, a safety. He's got him for two more years. He would be given that up. So if he were giving that up, he would be want to be more than

I'll give me some promises. It'd better be a hell of a promise. I'd better be considered for something.

Or he's getting better, He's getting more. Uh, he's getting better experience than just being in the tight end room for an eventual goal of being a head coach in the.

NFL is Remember they keep comparing that to Dan Campbell. Dan Campbell coached in the NFL quite a while before he got the head.

Come out, and Whitten was in the NFL for seventeen years. So it's it's gotta go quick learning curve here, all right? Bell went off at eleven am on Monday.

Cowboys.

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