Hello and welcome back to another episode of MCU Need to Know, a podcast dedicated to the Marvel cinematic universe and everything you need to know. I'm Trey.
I'm Jude. How are you doing Trey?
Well, Jude, I'm excited because today the Podvengers vendors get to assemble once more. She's an expert at distilling the insights and highlights of all the latest MCU projects and the fantastic host of There Was an Idea. We may owe her an apology for today's impossible task, but more importantly, we're delighted to welcome Tara, back to the podcast. Welcome back to TK.
Hi Trey and Jude. Thank you so much for having me on the show again. And this is such, we were just talking about it. This is such a fun challenge to have to choose. Five scenes from the MCU this year. It feels almost impossible, but just the whole process of thinking through it again and revisiting some favorite scenes from the year was just so delightful. So I'm so excited to do this with you guys.
Super excited. I'm so glad you could join.
Like I was saying, I was just nervous.
Yeah. You know, I I've taken some inspirations from one of my favorite podcasts or where they do like their top five favorite games of the year. And the thing that always makes it so exciting is that most places do top tens and to distill it down to just five makes it that much harder. And I'm curious to see how this is going to play out. I'm I'm wondering how much overlap we'll have as well as how diverse these may end up being as well.
More importantly, uh, for those who are unaware, you run the podcast. There was an idea, a Marvel cinematic universe podcast, uh, if people are not familiar, uh, normally you cover the shows that happened to be running as long as well as the movies. It's going to be a while before we have anything new in the MCU. So what's on the docket for there wasn't any. Yeah. So
when this episode of your show drops, my episode on my 2021 MCU year in review episode will be out. And that was really fun. I didn't distill it to five scenes like we're doing here, but I did choose a few categories for some super relatives. So I had on a Ellie from, oh, shoot, who I know has been on your show before, as well as Sean from the caption life who I know is a kind of in our circle of, of podcasts, friends. I don't know if you guys have had the chance to work with him yet.
Um, but they came on and we talked about some supper relatives for 2021, our rookie of the year, our MVP, best quote, best dress, things like that. So that was a fun approach to thinking about the, you know, reflecting on the past year in the MCU as well. So look out for that. And I'm also going to be doing. This month on my top 20 favorite films of 2021 overall.
So both MCU films and non MCU films, which is a little bit of a departure for me, but I'm looking forward to branching out a little bit and, uh, sharing some recommendations about things that I really enjoy that are not necessarily MCU. And I will also be doing a Hawkeye series retrospective and an Eternals deep dive analysis with friend Daniel coming up later in January as well.
So some exciting things looking back a little bit, uh, before then looking ahead to what the MCU will bring us in the rest of 2020.
That's awesome. Yeah. I'm glad you said yet for Sean. Cause we in the works
and you know, I want to say you talked about this recent episode that just came out. There's been this funny timing that every time we've had you on, it happens to be the day you've released an episode.
And so I haven't gotten to listen to it yet, but I'm very, very much looking forward to it because as evident in the drafts that we've done together with you, and in the way you just described your ser purlative, uh, categories, I love the different and creative ways you come up with those superlative names, Sarah, very much looking forward to that. Thank
you. Thank you. I'm looking forward to hearing your picks as well when you do listen to the episode, because it was cool to see how they're just like you were saying before Trey, there were some. You know, particular characters or moments where the three of us, myself, myself, Sean, and Ellie were all kind of, of the same minds about certain standouts. And then there were some where we had vastly different responses.
So it's always kind of cool to see what stands out for certain people and what patterns emerge kind of among all of us as viewers and fans, uh, versus more of that personal taste element. So it's a.
And of course, if you are not already, you should definitely be subscribed to Tara's podcasts. There was an idea, a Marvel cinematic universe podcast on most podcasts platforms, as well as following them on social media at an idea, underscore podcast, both on Twitter and Instagram, very much worth the following. But of course, if you downloaded this episode, then you know, we are going to be discussing the best Marvel scenes of 2021.
Now, the way we're going to do this is we're going to take some moments for some brief overall thoughts of the year with the MCU before jumping into the spoiler zone to discuss our personal top five scenes from those same entries. So starting with you, Tara, what did you think about 2021. Oh,
well, when I sat down with Sean and Ellie, actually, I, I wasn't sure what to say about this. So I kind of posed it to them, uh, first asking them about, you know, what, what are the qualities that stand out about the MCU in 2021? And there were a few things that emerged out of that discussion about. Uh, some trends that we're seeing in where the MCU is going.
And, uh, certainly in some of the standout installments that were released this year, that I don't think people are going to forget about anytime soon, whether that be for breaking records in a really a positive way, like let's say Spiderman, no way home and shattering pandemic box office box, office records among others.
Uh, and then you have on the other end of things, a film like a terminals making headlines for having the first ever rotten score on rotten tomatoes for an MCU film, you know, for whatever that's worth to anybody who that may be worth something too. But, you know, it was part of the discourse around that movie. So we, we have that.
And for me though, you know, what I'm always looking at is conceptually in terms of the big ideas in terms of the, there was an idea about what is 2021 saying, and from. Looking at the installments that we saw this year, I'm looking at this concept of legacy, this bridge storytelling of connecting the infinity saga and old favorite characters with the new kind of leading us into whatever our next big destination is going to be. Whether that is going to be a, a new, big.
Villain along the lines of banjos, whether that's going to be the multi-verse, uh, opening up further and what that's going to look like. I really see 20, 21 as this bridge. And I, um, was really interested in seeing what this year had to say about our heroes identity stories, because that's something that I'm always really interested, interested in as well. And this was a big year for characters coming face-to-face with themselves.
Uh, certainly metaphorically and, uh, also sometimes literally in the case of some of our heroes. So I thought that was a really cool, cool trend that emerged as well.
Yes. I, I say I like that you bring that up cause it's man like going all the way back to Wanda vision through that's it's it seems like the big villains have been this conceptual. Idea, our feeling or emotion, um, less than just a simple person. And, and that that's, like you said, forced these characters to take a really hard look in the mirror.
Yeah. And I like the way you have described it as a bridge from the infinity saga to where they want to go next. Um, because if I, you know, jumping in here with what I felt about the year overall, it really feels like an ambitious step forward for the MCU, because I think the standout for the year is Disney plus because that is the new arena in which they are working with.
Like they've already got the movies down to a science, and there's never been a doubt with that when it comes to what they're doing, but the strides that they have made with the entries of the TV show side of things, Yeah, it's, it's hard to say where exactly that's going to fit all together because I don't think we've quite seen an integration to the movies yet. Although I have a feeling that's coming this year, but the first step of the Disney shows being as good as they've been that year.
Um, it's, it's felt incredibly ambitious and I'm excited for what they have coming,
uh, Disney plus I think that is also going to be a, an unforgettable, uh, distinguishing factor about 20, 21 in the MCU, because that experience of being able to follow the installments in week to week releases generated so much conversation. And as we know, speculation and prediction and a sense of community at a time when, during the pandemic, I think that felt very resonant. Um, and I know. Definitely think that that is always going to be part of the conversation when we look back on 2021.
And when we evaluate the success of the Disney plus side of the MCU, I think that as you said, traits, it's, it's bold, it's risky to change up the style of storytelling and then to try to interweave that style with what they've already done so well for so many years and, you know, so far, in my opinion, I think it has been really effective.
So, so one of the things I'm curious about is do you feel like, um, and I'll just say, right. I don't think it has, for me, the COVID had kind of a negative impact on, on the viewing order in the change, or do you think that actually helped it? ' Trey: cause originally Falcon in the winter soldier was the supposed to be the first Disney plus show. And I think that. Would have been after black widow, right? I think, and this is where my own bias is coming in.
I think the fact that COVID did shake up the schedule and a Wanda vision was the first thing to come out of Marvel studios, not just on Disney plus, but just overall from the movies are the TV shows I think has cemented such a solid reentry after having such a long hiatus because of the unfortunate delays with, with COVID that I don't know if that would have been as big of a shockwave across the, the internet, whenever one division started, if it would have been Falcon in the winter soldier,
because one division captured everybody, like even people who weren't into the MCU, everybody was talking about that show. Um, so I think, I think, yeah, that the, the rescheduling of the release has, um, made a huge difference with the original plan.
I can't imagine one division not having been. Disney plus show, I think in terms of the reception of black widow, I think y'all know how kind of protective I have over them. So I, I think that it, it certainly suffered not only from the many delays and the fact that as many people, many people understandably believe that the character should have had her own standalone film much earlier. And I agree with that as well. I don't think it harms this film in the same way that others do.
But in addition to the delays, I do think the shift in black widows placement, I, it, I think it suffered for it a little bit. I think the impact of it, the reception of it suffered a little bit. I think also the simultaneous theatrical and Disney plus release. Yeah, it's suffered from.
Um, so that is something that looking back on it, I, I kind of wish it went a little bit differently for that movie, but I 100% agree with everything that traces in terms of the Disney plus side of things like it. I cannot imagine it being anything other than one division because it was just so perfect that one of that one division was that love letter to TV and really played with the serialized format. So
well,
yeah. Yeah. I completely agree with you on, on both the accounts, the one vision and the black widow, you know, it was just such a fantastic way to kick it off. Now I know Trey would, would, um, you know, he held back a little bit. I think he wanted what F to be first. Um, just get it out of the way and
yeah. You know, it would have been like a nice little 24 to 28 minute morsel of MCU to start out after having nothing for so long. We've been a great way to ease into, right. Well, with that being said, I think that's a good overview of how we thought about the MCU in 2021. And I think it's time to jump into the spoiler zone so we can talk about our top five scenes of 2021. So like we said, you're going to hear an audio cure. And on the other side, it'll be fair game for all spoilers in the MCU.
Normally we do talk about exemptions, but since this is going to be covering everything that came out in 2021, you should expect spoilers for everything. So with that being said, we'll see. On the other side and we're back. All right. We have five TV shows, four movies, a total of nine projects. We have to pick the five best scenes from these entries and Tara,
you actually made it worse. Okay.
Listen, this part of my job, I gotta, I gotta hype
this up. I'm gonna call lifeline
Tara. I am so sorry, but to throw to you first, what is your number five top scene in 2021.
So I mentioned before we started recording that coming into this discussion tonight, I had six on my finalist. And so I am going to cut number six for now, and I'll mention it in a little bit as an honorable mention. It was really tough and. Even just thinking about choosing scenes for me, I was texting you guys about this earlier today. I was like, oh, do I go with the thinking part of my brain? Or do I go with like my feelings?
Right. Am I going with the scenes that upon reflection upon rewatch feel like they say something that connects to these overarching themes of 20, 21 in the MCU? Or do I go with things? I just really in the moment felt really strong, right? Like, um, I was talking with Sean the other night for my episode and he was choosing, uh, we did our top favorite scene on that episode. So I've had to choose one already and stick to that one.
But one of the things that he was talking about in, in choosing his scene was that he was going with. The visceral reaction he had in the moment. So I try to land with some combination of both thinking and feeling here, and that is all to say that I'm providing far too much context for just getting into it. But my number five scene is going to be from Hawkeye season one, episode three Clint's phone call with his son, Nate.
That is an incredible choice. That is a
really, really good choice.
So
I chose this scene because it really made me feel for a character who I previously didn't have a deep. And a character Clint, who has been in the MCU for so long, and I've enjoyed some of his scenes. I've poked fun at him and other places, but I didn't have that connection with him. And here we have the scene in 2021 where I'm like, oh, I get it. Like, I thought it was beautifully acted by Jeremy Renner.
So much of this year has been about recontextualizing what came before for me, I think a lot of the installments. Have really done a great job, especially the Disney plus series of filling in some gaps for us in really being able to zoom into certain characters and understand them better. And with a, so think about a show like monovision, for example, after seeing that you go back to, or I go back to a film like age of Ultron and it feels better. Like it recontextualizes it.
And there's more that I appreciate from it. So with cleanse here, this really operated in that way. And not only that, um, so I felt like it for me emotionally, it did something to me as a fan that I wasn't necessarily expecting in making me connect with him. Um, but it also was really important for the narrative of the Hawkeye show because it's kind of this scene, I think.
Of the same piece as the car chasing, which I almost chose in the same episode, the car chase scene, because in that scene, you see Clint kind of teaching Kate without teaching Kate it's, it's her learning from him, the trick arrows on the fly, in the middle of the action. And that's all of the cool stuff about being a hero. That's the rush. That's the exhilaration, the scene where she's watching him on the phone with his son and helping out because he can't hear anything.
That's the scene in which she learns about what you can lose. Uh, that's the scene in which he's demonstrating to her indirectly. The other side of what's involved in being a hero, the risks and the sacrifices. And she hasn't learned it yet, but it's set up here to unfold for the rest of the season. So it's just wonderfully acted on both of their parts. And I, um, yeah, I had to have it on my list because it, it just, it really sucks.
Now it's a fantastic scene. That was a man that should have been on my list. That was hard. Cause it is, there's so much stuff to leave off. Cause it was heartbreaking for me, uh, to watch, to watch that, uh, you know, I I'm a dad, you know, and have kids. And so like, I, I really related to that. Uh, but also my parents divorced when I was really little and not the deaf part, but like I remember being the little kid on the other end of that phone call.
Uh, and so like, so yeah, like that, that scene was really, really meaningful to me. Yeah. It's fantastic.
100% a great pick and definitely I'll reveal too. Definitely. One of the ones that didn't make my top five, that just made me so sad that I couldn't find a place for it. But, uh, you know, I, I liked the way you talked about how this was a character, that wasn't something, wasn't something that resonated with you before this. And I mean, that's what stories are right. There are about change and sometimes that's within the character.
It's narrative or I think within the perception of the external audience. And so watching the audience at large go from being unmoved by Hawkeye to now referring to them as Clint Barton, more widely that is speaks through the power of that scene. So, great pick,
just add one more thing too. I feel like I've already talked about the scenes too much about that one scene too much, but I love that this is his son, Nate as well. Right. And, and we have seen the relationship with his daughter, which is also really powerful and he has his other son, but maybe this is black widow Stan in me coming out a little bit too much, but this is Nate, right? Like. Is named for Natasha and Nate is his youngest.
And there's so much of the weight that he's carrying from Natasha, the loss of Natasha. And I just feel like that it made it just that little, extra bit more emotional to me that it's specifically him who's on the phone
and how well that worked out. Right. Like, you know, maybe they were playing that way out, back at the age of Ultron because it was at seed house, little Natasha and she's pregnant. And she says it's Nathaniel. And to be able to call back to that.
Yeah. So good. All right, Jude, what about you? What is your number five top scene, man,
I'll be honest, listening to Tara's qualifications and thought process. I made a quick rearrangement. I was like, oh wait, um, number five. I feel like, like I'm going to be the Nita redemption episode. Um, because thinking about the draft the first time and the movies I ended up with, although I was still happy with what I had, uh, You know, but my number five actually is the Tobey Maguire scene where he was complaining about his back and Andrew Garfield, uh, cracked it.
And it's such a brief moment, you know, and it's almost like you can't even call it a scene, but I think what, what stuck out to me was I, I remember seeing that first movie and the theater and just how awesome it was and to see Spiderman swinging on the big screen and doing the New York thing and how fabulous it was, uh, the wall crawling and just all of it.
And it truly like, I mean, if you, if you think about the look and the aesthetic of MCU of everything that came prior to the MCU, the Raimi Spider-Man. Has that pre MCU look, you know, it's still, it's still what we have.
Um, and so having that seen knowing, you know, it's the, the reference to him hurting his back and, and this whole, um, in two ways a right, like there's, so there's the, there's the Spiderman one and two in between where he hurt his back and they might re uh, cast them for Chick-fil-A hall. And then in Spiderman two, where he just has web swinging and falls and hits his lands on a back, you know, during his existential crisis crisis. And he just kind of has to walk away holding it.
Uh, so yeah, it's just. Last thought I was probably the one laughing the hardest in the theater at this point. Um, others were laughing, but it just, I don't, I don't know if they appreciated it as much as I did so, so that, that was my number five.
Excellent pic. And I just want to say, cause you mentioned that moment whenever we did our quick reaction and I just took it like, oh ha my back hurts too. I didn't know all the meta textual stuff about the Jake Gyllenhaal. So even when you said like, what would have made it even better is if Jake Dillon hall was walking down the street, I had no idea what you meant until brother Daniel explained to me all that, that like real-world knowledge about it. So that just makes that scene even better.
Yeah. Yeah.
Well, that seems like my turn, uh, Jude, I am going to follow in your footsteps and I am also going to choose a scene from Spiderman, no way home. Uh, the scene that I'm going with is what I have called spider scientists, because it is that scene where the three of them are all working together to find cures for saving the villains that have entered into the MCU universe. Uh, and the thing that I think is so special about that scene is it captures what makes that movie special in that?
I think the movie is. Goofy at times, and the way that it is tried to merge these three, you know, franchises, but also so sentimental as well with the way it took time to, to give a relationship between Tom Hollins, Peter Parker, and these different villains who have entered in because he's never had any connection to them prior.
So to have a scene where they're goofing around in the lab, making jokes about how like, oh, you know, Toby's best friend, you know, ended up becoming a villain and dying in his arms and having that moment where Ned's having to wrestle with that idea and whether or not that's going to happen in his universe, or also having that scene where, wow, I'm realizing how Toby centric this is. But realizing that, you know, Tom Holland's, Peter Parker was kind of shooing away.
The idea of saving Norman and Toby has to remind them like, Hey, we're saving everybody. So. If I were to pick an entire S if I were to pick a scene to encapsulate what makes that movie special? I think it starts right there in that moment, because it's a little bit of everything.
That's a good point. Is that just, you know, that whole that's, what was it? That's just what we do.
Yeah. I'm trying to figure out how to phrase this. It feels like there are certain, and I'm speaking highly about a Spider-Man movie. I know, but it feels like there are just certain points. What does that mean? Meaning like the way I'm going to phrase this, there are certain points in time where you have like a single shot to make something like this happen. And the fact that it did happen and it was good is incredible, incredible.
Like there's so many ways this movie could have gone wrong and there's not that many windows that you can make this happen. Totally.
That's my, I thought you were trying to say like some other franchises were better than this one or something. Like captain America is strange like that.
Jude are you team the best trilogy in the MCU is the Spider-Man trilogy.
That's a good question. It spotlights on you. Now
I might have to say yes at the current moment.
Um, John spot, I'm sorry.
No, like
I might, I will. I'll you know, the only hesitation I have is what is guardians of the galaxy three going to be that's fair, actually. Um, and, and I'm, and I'm not counting the Avengers trilogy,
right? I was thinking Ironman capsule.
Yeah. So right now I, yeah, I'd have to say it's Spiderman trilogy, um, with, you know, a wait to see what James Gunn does with the third.
Well, we'll put a pin on that and, uh, that's something we need to revisit once that trilogy finishes. Yeah. But moving along, we're now circling back to you, Tara, what is your number foreseen? Okay.
So at the number four spot, I have a scene from Sean MACI and the legend of the 10 rings. It is the scene during which Sean and Katie are on the bus in San Francisco. And it's the first big action scene in the film? Well, the first actions, she, excuse me, the first action scene with shonky obviously there's the, uh, the prologue to the movie with his father when we, but I chose this moment because it was tough. I really, really love the sequence of scenes in Macau, um, in, in Cianci as well.
But I chose this one because this is our moment of introduction to a new hero, seeing the way that he fights the way he uses his clothes and the props around him and that sort of Jackie, Jackie Chan style, um, seeing what it is that causes him to spring into action in this moment, which is his concern for his friend case.
And we talked about this tray when you and I did the deep dive episode on Sean Chi, the way that that film uses the action sequences to express or demonstrate something about the characters is really, really well done. So this is also the scene in which we see the pendant on, on his chest, which is this significant object for him representing his connection to his mom. And this is before we really learned about his full story in his past.
And there's that moment in which Katie just looks at him after he's been able to beat off these guys. And she's just like, holy shit, who are you? And that's the question of the movie, right? Um, so I think it's just to me, it's like such a well done example of what the MCU is all about and what the MCU does so well, this combination of. Incredible action. Just like you can't take your eyes off of it and be thinking about that visceral, visceral reaction criteria here.
Like the first time I saw this in the theater, I was like, oh my God. Just like watching the scene as the bus is traveling along and they're moving from the front towards the back of the bus and the music is incredible. And, um, it's just that comedy, there's humor in the scene with the guy, what's his name, cliff, the YouTube guy.
And, um, and there's, it's just fantastic to me, it's like prime, what the MCU can do and watching the behind the scenes of it in the assembled documentary was pretty awesome as well.
Yeah, the moment you said Shung G I had the biggest smile on my face and it's an amazing pick. And just to like, add in that space, like the, cause we, like you said, we talked about it a lot here on this show and on your show that we did together. And I can't stop thinking about the, the way one of my favorite podcasters. Jeff, Kanada talked about it on the film cast, which I think is the summation of everything that I tried to convey about that scene.
So often superhero stories are about the person learning, who they are. Shonky knows who he is and he's been running for it. And the way that this demonstrates who he is to everyone else, except him who already knows is beautiful. So I went a hundred percent. Love your pick. So good. I want to watch it right
now. Yeah. I was going to say, I think Sean, she is to Trey with black widow is to, to Tara here.
I think that's a good enough
100%. All right, dude. Uh, what about you? When is your number four pick?
Oh, all right. Let's see. Let's put all my, the rest of the remaining selections of the random generator here. Um, number four is I haven't titled Yulaina and Kate Bishop meet cute, or where they meet at the apartment. This is one of those scenes that I've probably watched. More than any other, well, I'd probably, let's put it this way if you counted.
And like back to back the number of times, and just there might've been the length of an episode or more like, I just, I keep going back to the scene and going back to the scene. Um, and I don't know at first I wasn't sure what, uh, struck me so much about the scene and, you know, outside of the chemistry, it was phenomenal, but it came to me that seeing this is what the future of the MCU is going to be, you know?
And there was this, I don't know for everybody, if it's on a fan, like, but for me, for sure, with the end of in game and this kind of, oh, where are they going to go? Now? Don't have. Robert Downey Jr. Anymore. You don't have, um, scholars, your Hanson anymore. You know who these new characters going to be. What's it going to be like in the end to see these two brand new characters interact, um, and have such chemistry. It just, it just made me so excited for what the future is going to be.
Um, so yeah, that's, that's, that's why this is in, uh,
Love that pic. And I gotta be honest. I've been trying to guess what I think is going to be everybody's favorite scene they're number one. And I legitimately thought that was going to be number one, just because of how much that I, cause I knew cause we would talk about it as we were getting ready for our podcast. How much you had that on repeat. So I'm very happy to see it make your list and I, and for all the reasons listed, I think, uh, I think it's a great
pick that you spoke about it because I don't have it on my list and I. I don't know why I just needed to make room for other things, because I think it's clear how much I love Julina and Kate and Hawkeye and black widow and the whole thing. So everything you said cute. I completely agree with it. It was such a dynamic scene to watch the two of them interact and the, um, in the finale as well.
The elevator scene is also absolutely incredible, but just to echo what you're saying, that first time that they're on screen together, that the Mac and cheese scene is just, I think we will absolutely look back at that as the moment that something very, very magical began.
Yeah. Just that whole, the sea yummy macaroni tastes like it's delicious. No, not I'm not going to be, I know what boxed Mac and cheese tastes like delicious. Oh yeah. Right when the door opened, dude, right? Yeah. You wouldn't have time to know, like you see what I mean? Like I, I got it down. I even ended up myself. This is crazy. Yeah. Oh, by the way, next time, your friend, Elena, like hang out, um, you know, let's just let him know. We said hi.
Yes. Uh, listeners will have to tune into, we'll have to check out my Hawkeyes episode six, a podcast episode to know what you mean.
You're a special
guest. I got to say that that's a huge get as a podcast guest.
I don't want your listeners to actually think I had to show,
but you didn't.
No, I don't say Florence Pugh. I say Yulaina as if she's a real person. She's
real. To me.
who's this Florence Pugh. You speak of. Uh, Trey right here. And
four I'm here comes number four. Okay. Here it comes. And I'm bracing myself because I, again, I apologize already earlier, Tara, for any fights we may have, uh, with me and Jude. Oh boy. Oh my gosh.
Here we go.
Number four. This is actually one of the harder ones, even though it's set number four, because the episode that I pulled this from, there were so many different scenes that were pulling. For my attention for this spot, but there was something about this scene in episode five of Falcon and the winter soldier truth, where it's around the 30 minute and 36 second mark, where they start the boat fixing montage. Uh, if you listen to our coverage, I think I frequently would pretty much yell out.
I love the boat because I love so much of what they were doing narratively about that boat. And, you know, I, to preface what I meant by the fight, you know, Jude and I have gone back and forth about the truck in the finale of the episode. For me and what I'm looking for in the character of captain America, I think this scene is the standout moment of that season because it embodies so much of what I am looking for in the captain America character.
It's, you know, even, even back in the Steve Rogers days, the thing that I always would say is that captain America's not the smartest, fastest or strongest. He is that inspiration and hope and that resilience to, to keep doing the right thing. And the way at this 30 minute mark, the way it leads into it is Sam is inspiring the people of this town that knew his family to all come in, to help fix the boat. And they're all contributing in different ways. And that sense of community that inspires.
It brings me to tears. Like that's, especially with the last few years we have had, you know, that is such a beautiful scene to me. And it continues to build because the person that they introduced in that scene as well is Bucky who at this point in the season, Him and Sam are at odds and they used the fixing the boat as a way to fix their relationship and to step even further, the, the way the scene ends is salmon. Bucky have a conversation about what they're going to do about Carly.
Because up until this point, everybody has been adamant about the only way to stop her is to kill her. And you see Sam really wrestling with, that's not how he wants to do it. And I think to juxtapose what Sam's wrestling with, what he's doing with the community and what we know he ultimately does, and wanting to go, not necessarily a pacifist, but trying to neutralize the, the disagreements in a more peaceful manner. I think everything about that scene makes Sam captain America to me.
And I absolutely love it.
A couple of things quickly. You said the phrase I love. And it made me think of a, a quote that Clint has about boats in the comic run the hot guy, my life as a weapon. So you definitely. I need to read that for many reasons, because it's fantastic, but there's a really great little line there about, about boats that I think you'll enjoy. Enjoy Trey since that's, uh, an ongoing bit for you here.
Yeah. I'll check it out. I did buy the collection, so I'm still reading. Great. I
can't wait to hear what you think of it. And also thank you so much for everything you said about that scene. I don't have it on my list. And I, when thinking about Falcon and winter soldier and thinking about if there was going to be a scene that I was going to choose to make the top five, and there, there certainly are scenes from the show that make my top 8, 9, 10. Um, but it would be, it would be that episode.
And I didn't kind of think to narrow it down any further than from that episode, because it didn't make the top five for me, but I love that episode so much. And I did recently rewatch it and that boat scene is, is wonderful. So I think everything you said, speaking about who captain America really is, is really shines through there.
Oh yeah. It was that that boat was the grounding tie right. To, to family. Um, Falcon's, you know, uh, family has passed and he was running from, uh, fixing that, you know, fixing his issues moving forward. It was great. And I thought Trey was going to go with that quick moment of winter soldier, holding the cake and doing the little sidestep from the kid on the dock.
Uh, you know, and as we tend to do here and rewrite things, if we, that in flight would have been at the dock and it would have been a boat instead of a truck, it would have knocked it out of
the park. For sure. You can't, you, if this was video, you would see I'm just hunched over waiting for I, so, yeah, that's a. That's my number four.
Nice. It was a good pick. All right,
we're coming back to you. Tear out. When is your number three?
Okay. So my number three moment is from Spiderman. No way home. And you guys both spoke to other moments in Spider-Man that I also think really, really effectively capture. Uh, what one of you said before, it's like, what makes this film so special? It's kind of this once in a lifetime opportunity to really represent the culmination of 20 years of Spider-Man storytelling in live action on the screen and. In choosing the moment that I chose, I very much went with the sentimentality.
I went with the straight up the stall JEA and the, the feeling that I had in the theater. And there were a number of moments in the theater, the first and subs. And subsequent times that I went to go see it, that I just was straight up a goosebumps, you know, tears, the whole thing. And then when you think about it a little bit more like you, you kind of realize, I kind of realized like, oh, like they got me, like they got me right in the sentimental part of myself.
It doesn't mean that necessarily upon analysis or reflection that everything about the plot of this movie makes sense. But man, it got me. Right. So the moment that I'm choosing is I think speaks to what this film did so well in representing the change and the growth for. Peter Parker. He's at his absolute lowest moment after the death of aunt may. And I loved, I almost chose that scene as horrible as it was. Like, I thought it was just so powerful.
Um, but right after that, right, he is alone on the roof and his friends, Ned and MJ come in saying, you know, there's some people here and you look up and we see this amazing shot of Andrew Garfield until we Maguire and Tom Holland's, Peter Parker doesn't even really react to them. Right? Like this is the kid. Is so freaking excited to meet everybody in civil war. And this is the kid who just like, has so much enthusiasm for life and he's not impressed.
And he's not geeking out about meeting alternate universe versions of himself, right? He is absolutely in pain here. And these two guys, these two other Peters come in and they are representative of other versions of what may come for Peter. And we see in that scene in which they're sharing with our Peter, the trauma they've experienced, it's this moment of reflection for them. It's this moment of kind of a beginning, a process of some healing for Andrew Garfield's, Peter.
And he's talking about how after the death of Gwen, he stopped pulling his punches and, and you see that emotion on him. And that kind of carries through the rest of the film, how he is able to reach some closure here. Um, and in Toby's Peter, you know, the story of. This kind of arc of, of what he tells a doc later in the movie, like I'm trying to do better, right. This is what we do, right. He's here. And he can be this inspiration, this guide for our Peter Parker.
And, um, yeah, the, of course they bond over the, with great power comes, great responsibility line and uncle Ben and ed ma. And it just completely, completely got me in the moment. And, um, I have gone to see the film three times. I saw them, the three viewings I did were in very close, um, progression one to the next, I lost my word there.
Um, and then since then I haven't been able to go again between the holidays and quarantine and everything else, but I'm dying to go see the movie again as well, because I. I have to imagine that even after three times of seeing it, it's, it's going to be something that continues to just kind of really hit me where I live.
Oh, I, I have to imagine. So, um, I've only seen it twice. Uh, a friend of mine, I even mentioned on pod site, not just twice, but back to back. And this was his experience was my experience. So it was just better the second time. Um, that first time there was so much information dumped in. And so I can only imagine, you know, that, like you said, this is just going to get better with each time.
And I, I gotta say I, I have seen it three times. Uh, and I think you have given me a new appreciation for that scene because to speak to why I think. You know, it takes multiple viewings to let it all sink in is too. You get caught up in it all. I was like, I, they brought them back. There's a Tobey Maguire and Andrew Garfield. And here they are, and they're making this multi-verse thing work.
And the thing that I missed, and I'm so glad that you have highlighted this way for me is the way Peter reacts to those two, because I was so fascinated by my own reaction. That you're totally right. That Peter, like I'm every time I talk about the thing that makes Holland Peter Parker special is the way he reacted in civil war. Oh, that's cool. You got a metal arm. Like he does that for everyone.
And I never thought about how he's just not amazed by the fact that he has met variations of himself. And so I think you have deepened by love for no way home. It's
so hard to put that moment at number three.
I know you got two more better than that one.
Yeah. I got to say I'm amazed that none of us have had an overlap so far and that's, I'm so excited.
Well, that's the beauty of having like a list of 15 and I can listen and
be like, dang it. All right, dude, you're up next? What's your number three. Number
three for me comes from Loki. And again, it's just one of those scenes that just really stuck with me, you know? And I mean, you listen to the pod, you know, that Loki, as it was coming out and watching it, I went back and forth on it and it low-key, the series is probably my, not probably it's my it's. It's my third favorite of the Disney flushes, um, with, with Hawkeye and wanting to vision above. But the scene and the time prison with lady SIF was just super moving and powerful for me.
Um, just this whole idea of, well, and I talk about this a little bit with my seniors, just this whole idea of solitude and, and the importance of being comfortable sometimes alone by yourself and, and being aware of those times when you get moments of solitude and you can't, um, when you look for something to fill it, you know, and what, and why, why are we looking to fill it? Why can't we just be still and, and, and content with just us. Um, and now I know that's how I look at the time prison.
Look, he's not there, but just like, just as representation of, of these things you do and how they weigh us down and to, to see him. Being faced with that and faced with that and faced with that until the point where he, he has to, to finally wrestle with it, it comes to terms with like, yeah, I did that.
I'm that person and I should have known, you know, and that, so I just loved that the way they were able to creatively within that world, um, have him face his own, his own demons and temperament.
I really, we really liked that pick, um, eh, that's a moment that definitely stood out to me as well. Uh, And, and, and to walk through this, like the music in Loki was always good from the beginning, but it is in that scene that it really hit me how expertly they were using the, the music, because that end of that scene, when SIF, I can't remember the exact words, but she says something like you will always be alone.
And it just, the camera stays on Loki's face with that realization, even after he has come to terms with who he is and the music is just underscoring that moment. Um, and I'm great pic, I'm so glad that you have that on your list.
Yeah, well, I'm glad you brought up that line. You always be alone because it is that, that, you know, that difference of like a solitude is not loneliness, you know?
Um, and, and solid, you know, solitude is not like solitary confinement, like no, like solitary, like I, you know, um, I'm in the car, you know, I think of it personally, like if I'm in the car and I notice, um, you know, if a podcast not planning, if something's not going, am I, can I just be with myself and be okay or my like, trying to feel the time and the space and, and, uh, and if that's the case, what's wrong with me, I'm not wrong with me. It's like, I have a problem.
But like what internally is, is bothering me. So I'm really glad you brought up that line there. Um, cause it's not the same thing. And when you F when you can't even be comfortable with yourself, you know, that's, that's an extreme kind of loneliness.
Well, yeah, I really appreciate what you're saying about this scene. So it's a kind of echo what Trey was saying before. I think that here you talk about this from this perspective, dude gives me more of an appreciation for that scene from lucky, which I hadn't, uh, I hadn't really been thinking about. So man, this is great. This is a great conversation to revisit some of these moments and see what resonates for, for different
people.
Oh yeah,
yeah, yeah. I wasn't, uh, it wasn't expecting to be hit with those fields. Jude, I liked the way that you explained that, that that's got me rethinking a lot about that scene now. You know, I had just said, I'm so happy we have not had any overlap. So whenever you said your third pit came from low-key, I kind of tensed up for a second because my third pick is also from low-key, but it is in a different scene.
Come home when she come home.
Yes. Uh, my scene comes from episode six for all time, always. And it's around the 19 minutes and 34 second mark. And I'm, I'm willing to catch some flak on this one because this feels like cheating since this is essentially Kanga monologue. And I think it goes on for close to like eight minutes. So this is all a whole lot of bang for one pick of a S of a scene.
But the thing that I think is so special about this is so much of what Loki was examining the series, what Loki was examining is futility. Like what, uh, what does choice matter if, if nothing matters and, and so much of that sentiment is what they were playing with. So to have this moment where we see our two central characters meet with this almost embodiment of futility and have him explain through.
His reasonings of why he, he, he came to be, you know, and, and the way that it was being demonstrated with those little clay figures that he was controlling and the way that he would effortlessly flip between being electric, to being bored, to being tired. Jonathan majors is just putting on one of the best performances in the 20, 21 season of the MCU. And it's perfect. Like I just, I was captivated from start to finish of that scene.
And I even talked about it when we had our episode review of that specific scene, where I said it felt like the MCU bay brew thing and pointing to where they're going to go for the next 10 years. And so I, I just. Um, I mean, I, how could I not pick a scene that has the line you came to kill the devil? Right. Well, guess what I keep you safe. If you think I'm evil, just wait until you meet my variants. And every time I have that line in my head, it gives me shivers,
such a good pic. And I'm thinking about what you was saying earlier about the Kate and Elena scene, you know, and having that feeling of like, oh man, we're in for something great with the future of the MCU, I feel that way about them. And I also feel that way about Jonathan majors, uh, because of everything you just said,
right?
I'm not going to get sidetracked right here. I'm stopped. I saw myself tell myself, no, I'm not. So like the king pin, like, this is what I mean of like, like what you just said, like, you got so much with so little and we're not going to see him until 20, 23. And it's just that anticipation and that waiting and that's, uh, they had kinked into too much, but, okay.
So number two for you is kingpin, right?
Uh, I'm kidding. I'm not going to comment on that just yet. Since I have two scenes left to go, it might not be number two. It could be number one. You'll find
out well, and anticipation of fighting out. We can go ahead and move on to Tara. We are at number two. Okay.
So this, this was the, uh, the hardest choice for me because I, I want to say. The movie, black widow I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I thought very hard about it. So I also, I don't know if I've set this on social media. I did say this on my 20, 21 year in review episode.
If I am considering all factors and ranking the films of the MCU in 2021, I do like squeeze black widow out of the top spot and put Spiderman away home there because that's in taking into consideration some criteria like the, the nostalgia and the culmination and the event of it all, which is why Spiderman kind of gets that top spot for me.
But when it came to the moments here, I, black widow felt like it had to be higher because I have rewatched black widows so many times, and these moments, I just feel so close to so many of the moments. And I, I actually kind of revisited my first impressions episode that I did for the podcast when black widow first came out to see if I could get, um, get some sense of what my past. What really resonated with that, that my past self in terms of choosing one moment here.
And all I talk about in that first impression episode is like, yes, like how much as it was unfolding, it felt really special to me. And, um, yeah, I, I almost went with the credit scene for the way that it set the tone for the film and really suggested, wow, we're getting into some territory here of really acknowledging just how traumatic and terrible Natasha's past really was and just how much that. Her survival and her strength, all the more powerful.
But, uh, I apologize for talking about scenes that aren't actually my scene. I know it's, it's, I'm a,
it's all contextual.
I realize, I, I say we, we realize how painful it is. Um, like I was surprised that you were going to pick any individual scene because of the pain of having to cut up the film. Uh,
and if I could just like interject here to its cause on that topic of like how we have watched your love of this film developed. Whenever we did the second draft episode, I had went back and listened to that first one, just in preparation. Funniest things to me is at the end or the beginning. I can't remember. We were talking about black widow and we were all discussing about like what our plans were to go watch it.
And I think you had just gotten the AMC pass and you were like, oh, I, you know, I'm going to go see it maybe once. And we asked like, oh, are you gonna get it on Disney plus two? And you're like, ah, probably not. That was before you had seen it. And just to get that glimpse of where you were at to where you have come has been fantastic.
It's a bit fun sometimes to revisit older episodes of the podcast and really see, see how much a change and growth happens. So I guess, you know, despite all that, the moment that I did land on. Is quite, quite a long scene. I think I went a little bit more with a sequence as opposed to a scene, but Natasha and Yulaina, they are at the gas station and there are these, this scene or sequence of scenes encompasses the humor of the pose that you do, your fighting pose.
It encompasses the pain and the insecurity that these two characters have when Yulaina says to her, oh, you know, if someone attacks an Avenger, one of the big ones will come to avenge you. And she's like, oh, who are the big ones? Um, when, and so, you know, Natasha's insecurity there.
Uh, you know, Elena's insecurity the face that she makes when Natasha says you weren't really my sister and she bites back the vendors, aren't really your family or at this tension between the two of them and the incredible. Incredible line when to Tasha says all the time I spent posing, I was trying to do something good, make up for the pain and suffering. We cause trying to be more than a trained killer.
And when Yulaina says I'm not the killer, that little girl's called their hero there, they're learning so much about each other here. So much of these two characters who these two people are as being revealed to us and why I chose this is because this is our last real installment. Natasha Romanov in the MCU. And I love how much her presence is felt in the Hawkeye show. I love how much your presence is felt in 2021.
Um, because, because I do miss her and I, and I don't think that end game necessarily, um, uh, took, took the time to really acknowledge what her loss meant as much. Um, but now we have this new character in the MCU Yulaina as you guys have already talked about, who is setting up so much for the future.
So in this scene, we're both saying goodbye to Natasha and we're reflecting on who she's been, and we're also greeting Yulaina and we're learning about her and we're seeing where she's going to go and, and. Gas station scene then kind of leads into when they're outside drinking a beer and they have more of that conversation learning more about each other. And, um, some tenderness when Natasha helps you with like, with her wound.
So just like there's so much healing, there's so much related to the ideas of identity and family and choice here. And of course, then that leads into there in the car and the vest moment. So again, it's what the MCU does so well of combining that humor and that heart. And, um, yeah, I that's, that's kind of like three scenes in one, but, uh, Natasha and Elena and they're, they're learning each other in black widow has gotta be online.
I love that. I love the way he had walked through that, uh, much like with w you know, with Jude and trying to guess what I thought was going to be his number one and what was going to be yours. I was under the impression that number one would be something black widow related, and, and this isn't a knock on the movie, but just, there's so many great moments that I couldn't figure out. What is the moment that encapsulates it or defines it as a scene pick.
And you found it like, of course, even though the black widow scholar, uh, I loved your description.
Thank you. It was tough because it's such a good such,
I love that. You're going to have to change. Add that to your bio black Twitter, black women, black Twitter. What's up. What's a winter. Um, black widow, black widow scholar.
I could have a scholar. I like it. I'm going to put that on my email signature.
Please do, please do. And I'm talking about your work one?
Yes. Has got it's exactly not the podcast one. The work one only.
All right, Jude, number two.
Oh man. The Hawaiian shirt. Sorry. Number two. God, this was difficult. I'm going to be honest. Um, I jokingly. At first, I jokingly said, you know, our, this whole listening to Tara and rearranging it. Um, but I actually did this one, jumped up to number two, listening, uh, to you, um, kind of give that context, uh, because this, again, I don't know what it is about me. I think, you know, there's the second time that I have a moment, right?
Cause like, like the Toby McGuire back, wasn't really a scene per se. Uh, it was just kind of a moment. Um, and my number two comes from the Eternals. Uh, it's the fastest kiss and the internals and the, it was, I mean, there's more to that scene, but, but, uh, taking my oldest to the theater and when that happened on screen, Like they, oh, my heart is jumping like that. Like, that's the quote. Um, and so it was just, it was so cool.
I'm glad that you mentioned that Jude, because I think that moment of representation and that moment of, uh, CA. One of our heroes up on the screen, you know, having the type of relationship that is not always depicted in these stories and have it be something that felt so kind of natural in that moment was really, really powerful to see, I think, for so many audiences.
And thank you for sharing that because that's, um, it's especially powerful knowing that for young people seeing this it's something that speaks
to them even outside of what makes that scene special. Just hearing the story about what, what your, you know, your child's reaction to. It was fantastic. And to speak about the scene itself. You know, I remember one of the things I talked about Eternals is that this is a movie that is as interested in these heroes. And what they can do as it is interested in how they feel.
And I can also help, but remember one of the articles, I never found the source for it, but I remember reading somewhere that one of the things that they were talking about with writing these stories is that it's not enough to see them go out and save the day. You need to see them go home. And what they're like in that home life and getting to see that moments of Fastow's and who he was with his family. And up until that kiss, like that's special.
That's not something you get to see often in the superhero movies. And I am so glad that you have picked that on your list.
I love that you said child to cause there they're 13 counting down to 14 and I'm trying to slow that down as much as possible.
I guess I always get super concerned with privacy reasons on how to refer and I will sit offspring,
look for the longest time. Hey, I was gonna say for the longest time Amaechi and I would just say progeny one, two or three, because the names messed up. We was just saying, Hey, come here. I need you to clean the fridge. Like I'm not kidding. That's what they had answered to.
I started calling my niece and nephew thing one and thing two.
That's amazing. So we're at Trey's number
two,
right? Yes. I just went we're at Trey's number.
My number two pick, this is another one of the hardest ones because per entry, I don't think I talked about this part of my method when it came to making this list is I sat down and I tried to write the most impactful Steans I had by memory. So I wrote down one of vision Falcon in the winter soldier, black widow low-key. And I just went through the release order.
And in each category I wrote down the list that I remember just really standing out to me and what divisions, I think had the most of most moments per category. And the moment I ended up going. For my number two pick is in episode eight, called it previously on around the 11 minutes and 46 seconds. Mark, the revelation of why the sitcoms were so important to Wanda and that glimpse into her family life and the tragedy of what that was like and how it changed her life.
When that bomb exploded, everything, she knew that I called it a magic trick whenever we discussed it, because I. Generally don't like whenever they retrofit an idea to a character that expressed none of that in prior and previous storylines. And there was this lingering question throughout all of one division for me of why is this taking the form of these sitcoms?
And as the season progressed, we kind of got to this idea like, okay, maybe this is something she had as a home life, but I just couldn't see how they would make that feel real and sentimental. And I was just. Almost on the floor, just smacked with how much that scene moved me because you got that glimpse of how happy it made her.
And it made me forget the tragedy that was about to come because we knew her past life from age of Ultron and what she had gone through that in that moment, I was with them, excited watching those shows. And when that bomb lands and reality snaps back into place, I was in tears. And I think that moment will easily be one of the standout moments for all of the 20, 21 entries because of the magic trick. They were able to pull off and the effectiveness at which it just works as a scene. Yeah,
you're right. That was the one thing I remember the most of that scene is just how much that you knew it was coming and it, and they still were able to pull you out of that and get you immersed in that. And, and then the a, and their family.
I think, you know, Tara, you joked about wanting to put all of black widow is your pick there's multiple entries that I wanted to do that just adding episode eight of one division is what I wanted to put for number
two. Yeah. Well, that's actually a good, a good translation. Cause it's my number one next, right? Yes.
Okay.
Here we go. It's a very, it's a very good transition because I similarly we had a very similar approach because I too, when you first presented us with this task, I wrote down the installments and release order jotted down. Okay. What are the things that stood out to me most? And I also had the longest list for Wanda vision and black widow, but, but for one division and, uh, Episode eight. Well, when we actually, the three of us, we did a wine division wrap up episode for my show.
And we talked about our top. I think we did three favorite moments from the series. And I think I kind of made that joke and said, ah, episode eight is my number one moment. Um, and I, at the time I chose as my number one moment, the same moment that I'm choosing for my number one moment overall. And that is after black widow after Spider-Man like, this has remained for me my, my top moment of the year, I think, partially just because I am also thinking about.
The power of Wanda vision and just how special it felt in those early weeks of 2021. And I, you know, if I, if I had to choose my number one favorite installment of the year, um, all factors considered it would be one division. And I, yeah, I know it sounds a little bit like a surprise there, but it's just so. I have this personal connection to it. And I think it just, it just did so much for, for the MCU and it just feels like such a singular moment in time.
And it's so incredibly rewatched bubble. And the number one scene for me from episode eight, it's so close to being the one that you chose Trey. But for me, it's the scene when she goes into the memory with, with Agatha of her envision out of vendor's compound, this is sometime after the death of Pedro.
So sometime between age of Ultron and civil war, and it's this moment of connection and tenderness between the two of them, which was so important to see in this show, which, you know, the entire conceit of the one division show was based around just how much love she had for him and this extreme grief that came from the loss of, of that love. And here we see again, kind of. Magical way, as you said that they were able to pull off.
Um, so I'm filling in the gaps of establishing for us, these moments of connection that the two of them would have had earlier on. And it's also based around this moment in which they're watching a sit-com, they're watching Malcolm in the middle and vision. Can't understand why it's funny that the character is getting injured. And how do we know that he's not really hurt? And she just says, it's not that kind of show.
And it's just such a good line that speaks so much to who she is and how she relates to these sitcoms and how that manifested itself out of her, in her grief. Uh, it speaks to his character and how he's learning, how to be human when he says. I've never had a loved one to lose. So I don't really know what this is like.
And it's a moment that, you know, again, thinking about first, watch it really, really got me this, that whole episode did, uh, there were a lot of moments of tears in that episode, but especially this just the, the way the two of them relate to each other. And when he says the line, what is grief, if not love persevering, you know, listen, it's become a little bit memorable now. The what is blank, if not blank, persevering is a really great meme template.
Um, but in the moment, uh, you know, before any of that internet reaction, it just felt so sincere and so beautiful, a very beautiful vision, vision quote. So, and then they have a laugh at the end of it, right? Like he's laughing at something on the TV and she's loosens up a little bit and says, yeah, it was funny. And this tender, this tenderness between the two of them, I. I love it. Uh, to me it really encapsulates so much of what one division was all about.
And one division encapsulates so much of what I loved about 2021 in the MCU. Yeah. I
had a feeling there might be some overlap here with our picks because I remember that moment in the wrap-up of said we were, we were both very high on this episode and. The I wanted the, I wanted to pick this scene, but I just kept coming back to the, the one that I had at landed on. But you highlight, what's so special about it.
And I, I think the thing that, to me, that stood out is that you have two characters who are both feeling nothing from different perspectives, obviously with Wanda and the trauma that she's going through, there is this feeling of loss and not knowing how to express those emotions. And you have vision who is literally just been born and doesn't know how to express those emotions because he's learning and through each other, they learn. And that is beautiful. Yeah.
It's interesting that it, we mentioned vision gets all the best lines. And like I said, that line is just such a powerful line. And even the meat for some reason, uh, for me like the means of that, it just hasn't. I don't say hasn't set. Well, it's just, it just, I don't, I, I have a person that likes gifts and I will have a complete conversation and gifts on texts if you let me. Um, and, but just with just that one there, I don't know. I just feel, it just feels different and it is gifts.
And I just want to be clear. I don't think there was any confusion.
Got it. Before we started another horse that we continue to beat all year, dude, what is your number one?
So it was just really cool moment. Uh, no, just kidding. I'm not going do that. It's 20, 22. I said, I'm leaving the truck behind, um, set it in our very first episode. I only said I'm leaving it behind. This is all I brought it up to say, I thought Tara and I were about to overlap. Uh, my first scene was the opening sequence, the black widow through the credits, like opening scene all the way through the credits that if for a couple of things in it, just, I remember watching it.
And just some thinking about how different it was and anything else, I, or at least to me, it felt so different than anything else I had seen in the MCU, uh, that, that segment, um, and how intense the opening credits was like, and I was in tears. I would like, I didn't get past that and my eyes were watering and I was tearing up.
Um, and then so thinking about like, well, cause it's interesting of, of what that was supposed to be film wise and before COVID like in terms of release order, you know, and sort of have that be kind of the first thing and B imagine what it was like to, to completely kick off the next set of MCU stuff with that scene and really kind of make a statement of. Okay. You know, we had our fun and now let's, let's kind of dig in.
Um, and so, yeah, so for me, that's, uh, and honestly, I think that's probably why, cause I know, and I've, I've got a little bit, uh, uh, pushback jokingly. So, um, I'm going to, I'm going to say it that I take it that way just, but I had black widow is the best movie of 20, 21 over no way home. Then a big part is I felt like it just kinda what I'm saying right there. The sense of it's it's yeah.
Part of black widow, we got MCU, but it, it just had such a feeling of, you know, this isn't the MCU you're used to, um, it was female led. Uh, we got Yulaina um, you know, we got. Um, red guardian, we got like all of this stuff that trapped up into it. Uh, I liked the task master reveal, you know? Um, and it's just all of that. So yeah. It's, I know I'm drifted off into why I thought that was the better movie. Um, but yeah, that opening sequence, uh, that has to be the best for,
so that you chose it to talk about it because I, I touched a little bit on how the credits were almost my pick before the opening sequence could have also been my pig. Um, there, there. Absolutely agree with you that there's something so uneasy about that opening scene. There's something so beautiful about it, the tension, and then when they're in the car and listening to American pie, I could go on and on about it.
I think ultimately for me, I, in picking the scene that I picked, it's it put it on my list. I felt like I wanted to pick something that had Scarlet and Florence Pugh in it. Um, but if I took that criteria out, I mean, this is just so incredible at setting the tone for that movie. And one of the best opening sequences out of any of these Marvel films, in my opinion. So good. I think I agree with you.
I think it's a really underrated film and I think as a contained standalone film, I think it's very, very successful. And, um, you know, the Spider-Man movie has the event feel to it. It has that culmination feel to. Um, which kind of just puts it in a, in a separate category for me. Um, but, uh, yeah. I'm glad that you, uh, shouted out
Blackwood. Yeah, I I'm so glad that that specific scene has made it into our collective lists because it was one of the ones when I was making my list. Whereas I kept thinking, how can I not have that somewhere? And I don't, uh, but it is one of those scenes to even just speak within the movie. It is a scene that the reverberations of the effect that, that had the tone that they set and that opening credits is felt through to the end. And it is a wonderful picture. Cool.
Um, like Sandy
first, Nick Cindy drop of 2022.
So I think we know which installment tres number one is gonna come from, but I'm, I'm really eager to hear. Here, which scene, which scene it is you chose from what? After, wait,
wait, can we guess, can we go?
I would, I would love to get to him. Wow.
All right. I'm serious guests or guests. If what he chose from,
what if, uh, I would love to hear what you thought I would take from what?
No, no, no. Um, no, you know what? I don't want to step on your step on your toes. I don't want to guess. I want, I want you to share your number one
moment. So, you know, Tara, you just talked about how, whenever you were trying to pick something for black widow, you felt like it was appropriate to have something with Natasha and Yulaina. Yeah. And I wanted to, to, to bounce off of that, because that specifically is what helped inform my number one pick, uh, I don't think it's a surprise.
My pick comes from and whenever I talked about this, I think I have highlighted three different scenes throughout three different points that have stood out to me the most. And Tara, you already picked one with the bus fight and we talked about what makes that so special. Uh, whenever I joined your podcast, we talked about, you know, I called it a freaking tower sequence and how impactful it was to do that.
Uh, whenever they have the scene where he scaling the side of the building with Katie and, uh, shall Ling. But when I sat down to pick my number one, I could not pick a scene that didn't have both and , and it is the scene around the one hour and 42 minute mark, where they have the final clash of shonky and windmill with the rings. Um, you know, so much of that movie. Is about shank.
She wrestling with wanting to run from his father's influences, learning about his mother's and embracing those influences while maintaining who he is as a person and who he wants to be. And on the flip side, you have Wynwood who I have said multiple times is the emotional core of like he, the movie works the way it does because of his storyline and the work that Tony Lee young has done within that film.
And so even though you can pull criticisms of the MCU doing its MCU thing with CGI and so much going on this moment where they're fighting and they have that callback where Shung, she is able to. Use the, the fighting style that his mother had learned. And it was used in the beginning sequence when, uh, yang Lee and when we meet, uh, and then he uses that to finally overcome his father. And we see that in doing so he's able to take control of the rings as well.
And he just throws them down at the foot of his father, because he's learned that killing him is not the answer he's looking for. He's truly trying to save his father. And, you know, dude, I think your child, uh, has made references that the, the MCU is just littered with fathers. And that is definitely true. But what is special about Shang Chi is it's not just about the, these, the, the son dealing with the father issue. We get to go through that journey with the father himself. And so.
The thing that hits me the hardest every time. And that scene is right before, um, the, the soul eater emerges. The last act that when we has with those rings is saving his son and the movie opens up with, uh, the narration of Shanghai's mother saying that he could have done so much good with those rings, but instead conquered. And the last act that he does is the final moment of good.
And it brings me to tears every time, because shank, she has one, not through just physical violence, but he has one his dad over back to a moral side. And it's beautiful. And so that is my number one scene of 2021. I'm so
glad you chose that one tray. I, you know, I, that's why I didn't want to guess because I was like, you know what, at anything that you were going to say about Shannon, she was going to be incredibly poignant and powerful. And I was like, I'm not going to go ahead and guess which one is going. Uh, I it's, that's such a good one. And I think having one whew in there is really important to speaking to the messages of that film and really trying to encapsulate what that film is all about.
Yeah. There's so many good scenes.
Yeah. I, I, I love how much you love that, that movie. It just can go on and on. And I just gush about that movie. Um, and you're right. We, when I saw it, uh, my oldest, um, who's that I was like, that's Sean? She said, oh, is this another dad movie? That was actually almost in a top five moment.
Chung she's dad, uh, for me is I have it at six, uh, actually, uh, but, but it was, it was having that moment and it's kind of that recognition of like, oh, well, You know, and, and that's one of the things I'll never forget about that movie is just that interaction that I had. Uh, but yeah, I love it. And also I love like what you said at the end, cause it's in terms of the, the dropping the rings, because any time you know them, she's done it. Wow. Off the top of my head twice.
Uh, you know, in my most favorite one is returned to the Jedi where you can have that. Um, the redemption, you know, is not, it's not on that redemptive violence, right? Where we're the hero or, or so to speak, you know, lays down the weapon, um, rather than, than, you know, acting through violence. I just love how they, when they, when they, um, when creators are able to create
that moment. Yeah. It's, it's such a special moment when you can find a nonviolent way to, to solve the problem. And again, I say that knowing full, well, this is the MCU. We're going to have that moment where strong she takes on the dragon, which I still think is poignant, but that's not my pick. But to have that, that realization that I don't need to overpower you this way I can play to the person. I know you can be.
I mean, not, I don't want to diminish it because I think Sean cheat is their own character, but that is what that's a commonality that I like within captain America. The, the inspiration for better in the self and others. And in that moment is a small distillation of what I like about that hero at. Yeah.
So like you're right, like right at the end when, when John Walker took off.
So that's going to do it. Thank you so much,
man. I was really gonna throw a curve ball and say the first time we get to see John with a shield that has to be traced in bro.
Tara saved me cause I knew that was coming. So I'm going to leave it in the edit specifically. You can see my voice go in two different directions and I just leaned to her stare at like, okay. Yeah. What is my favorite? What else? Oh man. Well, Hey, we did it top five scenes of 2021.
And you know what sticks out to me the most is how much was left on the table.
Is there any scene that sticks out to anybody and it doesn't have to be your honorable mention, but is there any one that you think was going to make it that didn't?
Ooh, Ooh. I what's
your stray Agatha all along. Yes. That's the one.
And that wasn't my number six either, but it was definitely on my list of one division moments. And I, I thought someone might bring it up just because like, for what it represented, like what a WTF moment. I don't know about you guys, but like watching that for the first time, I was like, oh, there's, there's a song. Now there's a fill reveal that it's a song. And like, it, it was just such a unique moment that really leaned into the genre conventions at the sitcom thing.
And, uh, yeah, I, I'm glad that we brought it up here just to note it as a, certainly a unique and special moment from the year.
Yeah. I don't have a specific scene. I'm just going to say, well, no, actually I haven't seen in mind, but there's so many, I'm surprised a scene with, um, Willem Defoe screen goblin that it make it, that kills me, um, in particularly.
When he shows up at feasts and he's talking to me, um, because I didn't notice the first time, but the second time, you know, and Maples Peter, Peter, the side, and you can see between the behind and he's like grabbing muffins and stuff and sticking them in his pockets. But like, I wanna do more analogies he's to the green goblin. What Heath Ledger's to the joker. And, you know, Tony is Tony, Robert Downey Jr. Is the Tony stark, right? Like, it's just. It's amazing.
And so I'm really surprised none of us was with him.
Yeah. That's uh, that kills me because that is, and I've talked about it in text conversations, like to use that scene specifically, the thing that's so impressive about, uh, no way home is the way that it cares about these villains and treats them as people that need help and not people that need to be defeated. And it starts with aunt may and say that something's not right. And she like points to her head. I don't know the line specifically.
It's one of the ones I wish I had on video on demand to be more accurate, but I was bracing myself because I thought, oh my God, they're gonna make a joke, you know, in regards to mental health, but they took it seriously. And that that's a hallmark of. Yeah. Oh,
I can't wait to talk more about no way home. Like, especially once it's available for further viewing at home. There's so much to unpack with that
film. All right, Tara, I know you mentioned earlier, you had some honorable mentions. Is there any, you wanted Sera list out? Yeah, I guess,
you know, the one that was hardest for me to cut that I had as a, an official number six that I, you know, had some notes on was from low-key specifically episode one, his initiation into the TVA, because I thought that that was such a great moment in terms of ushering in a new landscape for the MCU. This was a new look and feel. The aesthetics of the TVA are so interesting and how they. Mid century modern kind of inspired style that feels both past and future.
And so ultimately somewhat timeless and here's Loki a very familiar character to us. Who's thrown into an unfamiliar context and they're using him to introduce us to new kind of riskier sides of the MCU and grounding us a little bit, but also establishing the stakes. When we see that, you know, he he's stripped of his Asgardian leather and, uh, and really thrown into this environment.
So I wanted to have a chance to mention that as, as a, as a moment that I think is really important and, uh, just also beautiful, uh, visually in, in the MCU this year that I didn't get a chance to talk to, uh, talk
about before. Yeah, that's a, that's a good mention. What about you, dude? Well,
I've already mentioned the, what I had listed as number six. Um, actually the shame Shang, what's wrong with me? The Shong she like, like now that I know the , um, actually. There was an interesting moment the other day with my friend, TJ. Um, and we were talking about, uh, Hawkeye and he was, uh, talking to. I don't know how it came up, but you mentioned Budapest and I corrected him. So I wasn't TJ, I'm pretty sure it was TJ. Um, but yeah.
So the other one, the last one I'll mention here dose wise was the moment on the statue of Liberty, where they're talking about the organic web shooters. Um, because I am a proponent of the organic web tutor. Um, I liked it, uh, in back then and I still like it now. Um, and just, you know, just that they addressed it in the way they addressed it.
Uh, just cause, cause you get Andrew, you know, who's an older Peter and he's kind of asking questions and then you get the, you know, he's supposed to be a senior, but. He's a senior he's like, this is, I teach all seniors, a senior would ask this question. Does it come from other places? Like, like that is completely a hundred percent what the 17, 18 year old would ask. Um, so yeah, that's, I, I just loved that whole sequence,
so good. I got a quick honorable mention and what would have been my number six, seen, uh, honorable mention it, it kills me that I also wasn't able to find a spot for the flashback scene where Sean Chichi. And when we go to that bar slash gambling place to exact revenge on the people that murdered, uh, there, his wife and Chunky's mom, um, it came down to like what I said, I, I wanted a scene that representative.
But I wanted something a little bit more uplifting despite how much that scene impacted me. Uh, so that one gets an honorable mention and w would have been number six and another one that I'm just, this is what I mentioned when I said I had to delete it and walk away from my keyboard earlier. It's the bridge, the chase sequence and Hawkeye the, the one where they're escaping, uh, being captive with the tracksuit mafia all the way through to the Penn tech arrow.
It is a wonderfully well done scene. And I'm so sad that it, I couldn't make it in the top five
thinking about it. I think. We have some on our lists. We have some representation from each installment of the year, except what is right.
Well, I, I will say this, but, and I, and I mentioned this in, uh, no, I didn't mention this tray. And I w when we were trying to put out our top, uh, our ranking, our Disney plus shows, we talked about this, um, for, at least for me, because it's animated and I still see it mentally kind of separate from the, from the MCU proper. I know that's changing. I know it's changing, but like, for some reason there's just like this mental block.
Well, like even when somebody asks it was like add students acid, is that your favorite Spider-Man movie? Um, you know, and I get my answer and then somebody immediately followed up. It's not into the spider verse. And I was like, well, I I'm thinking live action. Uh, so that's honestly even going through these. I really didn't honestly didn't give what if much thought, uh, for that reason, just the difference of live action.
Yeah. I, I think I'm in that space with you. And I feel like I, I feel bad because I don't, I don't want to ostracize it from being part of the MCU because I mean, it is intended to be that way, but it just, it didn't really cross my mind whenever I sat down to write lists, uh, there were moments that I think stood out to me like the, the second last episode where Hawkeye has that sacrifice play and he is aiming down as the Ultron bots are coming up. That moment was.
Amazing. And I love the way that that was framed and the lighting and the animation, but it just, when it came to cracking a top five, I just, I couldn't put it above anything
else. I feel similarly there are some, uh, cause I wouldn't even necessarily think of them in terms of scenes, but like there are some, uh, frames, there are some visuals, there are some shots that really stand out that I think were really stunning and in what if, and there are some character beats too, and, and some lines that I think stand out, but, uh, but I I'm in the same boat as you guys didn't it didn't really feel as much part of the same conversation for me personally.
Well, we're, we're getting to the end here, but Tara, you had a fantastic suggestion on Twitter where you thought we should share what we thought were some memorable scenes from 2021. Uh, I know you use kind of tiptoed into one, but uh, are there any that stand out to you specific. Well, this
was prompted it, it was Al who, who shared the gift of Zemo dancing. Right. So once he posted that, I was like, oh man. Yeah, this year, So my chronic gifts here, uh, some iconic meme template, uh, opportunities. So the other ones that kind of stood out to me, um, I mentioned before the kind of, what is blank, if not blank, persevering, which to your point, Jude, like that is such a powerful and tender and sentimental moment that I don't need there to be jokes about that.
Um, I've seen that out there and I they're fine. They don't undermine it or ruin it for me. But I, uh, that line still lands for me. I'm such a poser. Oh. And from Sean cheap or
that's
that has infiltrated my conversations with my mom and dad. They will throw out or so frequently, especially since I'm in the family lawn service, we'll have conversations. And then I'll say like, oh, we need to do this. And one of them will pipe in. Oh,
well the thing is, is even creeps into our text. Like, he'll say what about this? Or then the textural following or,
oh, that's great. So what about YouTube? Do you have any memorable scenes from 2021?
Um, I got. No, I'm so terrible at this. And again, and like, I'm trying to think, and I'm just, I had one and I was like, no, that's terrible. And I had another and that was bad. Um, I, I don't know what it is. I like gifts. And so my first head, my head keeps going to gifts and it was like, oh, this moment, this one is like open. It's not a mean, that's a gift. Um, that's just to be honest, that's what makes it so difficult for me.
I was kind of using it as an umbrella term for funny internet thing shows how much I know, I guess, I guess we're all a little bit older than the meme crowd. I don't know. Is that.
I don't know. I don't know. And
listen, Willem Defoe recently had an interview where he said he only wanted to come back if he can do the action scenes, because that was a way to route the character. Otherwise it is just a meme. So he knows what means.
Oh. And he had the somewhat of a scientist myself call back.
Yeah, he did. Um, so yeah, so now I'm trying to think of, of there. I think, I think the, the one that I think. That if I was going to have in use. And again, my mind goes to gifts is just low-key and there's reaction to Mobius. And I is where he's like, and I wouldn't do it again, you know, for some reason that just sticks out
to me. So I have two and the first one I think is easy, but it's flourish. I think that has been thrown around so frequently. And I love it just because of what it represents within the episode and the way people have used it. The second one, and this one may be a bit of a stretch, but I'm going to try and make my argument for it.
And the second episode of Wanda vision, there is a moment where somebody says something, the devil's in the details or the details and the devil and Agatha says, fuck the
details. I've
thought I've reversed it, even though I had it current, regardless, my details are all over the place, but the devil, uh, regardless Agatha had the response. That's not the only place he is because of that line. You can now not go more than five comments before someone comments Muffet STO on speculative thing in the MCU. So that has to be for me the most memorable moment of 2021. You're so right. Yes, yes, yes. Even if I botched the sea. So those are my picks.
Festo is, is coming.
He's on his way. And may this may, it's going to have Dr. Strange. Okay. You want to get Marvel fans mad the way to do
it is you can go ahead.
Well, I was going to say in Dr. Strange. They should have manifesto, but do the Trevor Slattery Mandarin twist. And it not be my Festo. That would definitely get them going.
So kind of like you have Pietro, but you don't have Pietro. He's just a dude named
Ralph. Hey, I guess Marvel's not shy on pooling. Switcheroos like that,
you know, what's kind of a meme or, or I guess has meme potential, but maybe hasn't really been used this way. And I wish it was used more. I don't know if I'm using meme and internet reaction interchangeably here, but remember at the end of, I guess it was episode five of one division before pediatric. All right. So the door, when want to envision or having an argument and she just starts rolling the credits over him. That's hilarious.
I wish that there was a way of capturing that more in real life or on the internet of just like I'm done with this conversation, but credits.
Amazing. All right. We'd like to thank Nick. There you go.
The number of times that I just imagined that in my head anyways, it happens in real life. I'm just, it
doesn't happen on every episode of your podcast. I can't believe I didn't make that connection.
It was literally the same thing. Oh man. Well, Tara, thank you so much for the suggestion. I think this was a very fun addition to this podcast and say, yeah, you know, we've got one more thing left. I know Jude, and I just recently talked about it in our previous episode, but, uh, I wanted to give you a chance here to say, what are you most excited for in 2022 regarding the MCU?
Um, well, I, I listened to your episode. I actually really enjoyed hearing your thoughts on some of the troubled production around black Panther. Yeah. Go in a downer type of direction, but I, uh, I did just want to bring that up because I thought that was a really, um, uh, conversation that you guys were having about that. And I share some of those anxieties around that film because the first black Panther is just such an amazing work.
Uh, and I just want the franchise within the franchise, uh, the black Panther franchise within the MCU to, uh, continue to, to thrive. Um, but I like Jude am very much looking forward to she Hulk because of the wonderful Tatiana Maslany. And, um, I know you spoke to it on your episode, but she is a remarkable actor who can really capture so, uh, so much emotion, but also so much humor she can, um, she she's absolutely.
Uh, dynamic force and I'm really looking forward to the tone of what she hope can be with this idea of it being maybe a little bit more campy and breaking the fourth wall. So that's probably my number one pick for the Disney plus series that I'm looking forward to. And probably my number one overall. Um, but I, in terms of movies, I got to go with Dr. Strange and multi-person madness, probably just because it's. In my mind.
Cause we did see the trailer after Spider-Man and I love Wanda so much as you guys know from some of my picks here tonight and I'm so looking forward to seeing where her journey goes next and how that's going to interweave with the world of, of Dr. Strange as well. So yeah, I'm very much looking forward to 2022. I think that it'll feel a little bit different. You know, we had nine installments this year. That was a lot of content in 2021.
And it seems like with them doing three movies, as opposed to four in this coming year, I think maybe that will be a little bit. A good thing to, to slow down the pace a little bit. So, um, I'm very excited.
It will certainly make this task a whole lot easier next year. But yeah. Thank you so much for sharing that. I I'm so glad to get, to hear that, uh, perspective. And again, I look forward to hearing and I know you just recently did an episode on a retrospective and a little peek at what's to come. I think that's going to do it for this episode, Tara. Thank you so much for joining us on this. This has been a blast. Thank you,
Trey. And thank you, Jude. It's always so much fun to collaborate with you guys, especially on tasks like this, which are. Incredibly fun and also somewhat daunting and cause us to do things like have multiple tabs open on our computers before we start. Um, so always a blast. And, uh, thank you so much for having me on the
show.
Yeah. And of course, if you're not familiar already, you should definitely be following Tara on social media. You can find them on both Twitter and Instagram at an idea underscore podcast. And if you're not subscribed to their podcast, there was an idea, a Marvel cinematic universe podcast you should definitely do. So we will have links to all those respective places in the show notes.
And of course, uh, if you'd like to get in touch with us, you can always reach us at MC you need to know on Twitter and Instagram. Uh, we recently just put out a post asking for your favorite scenes of 2021. And we had so many wonderful responses and it was so much fun to get to see, uh, what was the most impactful for you all in 2021? So if you want to see some of those or answer your own, uh, make sure you're following us there and let us. Yeah,
and be sure scroll down in the show notes, click on the discord. You can find a wonderful community to talk around a variety of things. And of course you be there for Marvel. So make sure you click on the role, assign her to the Marvel section, click on the emojis, have access to all the spoiler channels. Um, and of course the best thing you can do for us rating on right at this point.
What about a month, three weeks now and on Spotify, or at least as we record apple podcasts and please share with a friend.
Yeah. We'd also like to thank Nick Sandy for the use of our theme song, which is his rendition of the Avengers theme. You find more of his work on a SoundCloud, which will be linked in the show notes. That's going to do it. Thank you so much for listening, Tara and Jude. Thank you so much for doing this. Thank you tray. Thank you, Jerry. Thank you guys. We'll see you all next week.
Um, now my question is you are completely to monitoring the saying and having like black widow on the second monitor. Aren't you?
Okay. You're not, no, I, I had black widow up on. Just a few minutes ago and I do have up in another tab, uh, like my notes for when I did a black widow deep dive episode. And you've totally nailed it. That black widow is the one that I can't decide. So, so yes, Judy, you are, uh, you're, you're thinking along the right lines there.
I love it. I can't wait to edit it. And I'm just going to hear scenes from the movie.
Well, I kinda liked when the movie started and there was a middle section that was really cool and the end was pretty awesome
too. So that's three spots right there.
And honorable mention, I think is the in credit, so,
oh man.