#1 The Monthly Hotseat! Where my athletes put me on the spot with their running questions!

Hey, trailblazers and Tarmac Tacklers. Welcome to the Maximum Mileage Running Podcast. This is your one-stop shop for everything Ultra Road and Trail running for busy people. I am your host, Nick Hancock, the certified USCA Ultra running coach and UK athletics coach in Running Fitness. I am here to answer your questions and provide a little bit of.

Humor and inspiration for those tackling marathons and beyond. So whether you are squeezing miles into a busy schedule or just dipping your toes into long distance running, I have got your back. Prepare for some laughs, learning and a few colorful words. So lace up, gear up, and get ready for maximum mileage.

Let's get into it

on this week's episode. I answer my athletes' questions. They put me on a hot seat once a month and they throw questions at me sometimes ahead of time, sometimes on the spot. And we talk about everything to do with running. Enjoy. Yes. So we're gonna talk about the time of the month. Cause it is a question from somebody.

I won't say, here it is. They're not on the call. But I won't say who it is. And Faye, you can chime in here as uh, you are a running coach as well. I was just gonna say, I am so pleased this has been brought up cuz I was running today and I was only thinking, oh yeah, I need to talk to Nick about that because yeah, why I'm glad Who put the question forward?

Yeah. The question was, uh, should you keep running or should you listen to your body? And it is a time of the month that can be really, really difficult for women. Just cause of the inconvenience side of it, but also do fatigue and it is a hormonal response on the body. So should you keep running through it or should you listen to the, to your body?

My answer to that, like with anything really is to listen to your body. If you don't feel particularly great because of it, then don't run. It's okay. You missing the odd run is not gonna make much difference in the grand scheme of things. So it is something that generally only lasts a few days, and if it is, you know, making you feel tired, fatigue, you know, emotions, all of that kind of stuff, then absolutely listen to your body.

Just take the day off. Don't worry about it. It's not a problem at all, you know, day or two days. Would you agree with that Faye and Maddy and Jang, you are all female. What are your thoughts on that? Some women I know can run through it absolutely fine, and actually not many people bring it up with me. I will say it's a, a funny one for me because I started thinking more about it going back five or six years for different reasons because I was getting panic attacks and palpitations, which was the result of my hormonal cycle anyway.

I also realized that on the lead up to it, kind of, uh, four, five days before I start to feel really tired, like I could literally sleep. 12, 15 hours a a night if you let me. Mm-hmm. And then when it comes, I'm about as useful as a chocolate teapot, but I have had it where I've run races and it's just arrived or arrives and you just crack on.

Yeah. So it's a funny thing because sometimes you just go, I'm just, I have to get on with it. So just get on with it. It's a strange one sometimes I do find, I do find a lot of women are. More on, maybe on the side of, well, it happens every month. I can't just stop my life because of it. I just need to crack on.

But I think when we are talking about things like fatigue, which is the flavor of the question, the the, the flavor around the question is, you know, I get really tired when I'm gone that time of the month. Should I just push through it or should I listen to my body? And I, I think that is a really individual thing, you know, if you feel like you can run through it, then okay, but ask yourself that question.

Is it worth it? Do I feel that fatigue, that I should actually just not run and just go relax. So the person who asked that question, I hope that helps. Shang ju you asked loads of questions. Let's, um, let's have a look at your questions a minute. Sorry. No, that's right. There's some great questions and actually one of them feeds into one that Chris asked as well.

So I'll start down the bottom here. So when should I start car loading? So I'll answer that one first. Around 72 hours from your race is about the latest I would start now, I wouldn't start loads earlier either. Carb loading over the years has been blown all outta proportion. You hear of these things called past the parties, which, what the fuck is that?

I mean, even a kilo of past the night before your race A is not gonna be enough carbohydrate to fill your glycogen stores, but it's also just gonna make you feel like crap the next morning. Crap being the operative word, you're probably gonna be doing a lot of it. So the general sort of rule I go with is around 72 hours out.

So in the three days leading up, because you've gotta think of it like this as well, is that you're gonna be tapering for your race as well. So you are running, volume is coming down as your eating habits are probably not gonna change. So therefore you are l you are using less. Anyway, so you, you, you kind of just by default, just through the tapering mechanism, you, you start to carb load anyway, so around that 72 hours out, that is when I start thinking about adding in extra carbs the way I do it.

Yeah, I'll start doing things like adding extra bit of cereal, a bit of extra potatoes on my meal, a bit of extra rice on my lunch. I don't go crazy on it because I don't wanna feel bloated. But then what I will start doing is I'll start having some treats because this is where kind of long distance running nutrition gets a little bit wacky cause you think, you know you should be eating really healthy, but actually having those extra fast acting carbs like chocolate, sweets, that kind of stuff it that's okay in the days leading up to your race.

Because they are gonna help to give you those extra carbohydrates without having to eat a load of starchy stuff. It is really, really hard to get six to 12 grams of carbohydrate per kilo of body weight, lean body weight. So for me, let's say 600 grams of carbs per day, that's a lot of carbohydrate. A lot.

And it's really hard to do that through starchy stuff. So that's where I'll let my hair down if I had any, and I'll. My, my usual stuff is HaBO strawberries, brilliant Oreos, banana chips, you know, banana dried banana chips. I'll nail like a bag of those a day in the, the three days leading up. And there, there's still a little bit of health benefit and electrolyte magnesium, potassium buildup through those as well.

But yeah, that for me is carb loading. Um, and I'll also sip on the day before I'll sip on my carby drink, you know, my sports drink. The day before the race as well. So that'll be another addition to carbs. Does that answer your question changing? I will share on the group a link to a little carb loading.

Thank you. Yeah, and which has got some extra stuff in there. When done right. Carb loading can be your weapon, but so many people get it wrong because they leave it too late or they start too early. And that's why I like that 72 hour window. If you start too early, you start to get. You know, you start to feel a bit fat and groggy and gross by gum race day.

Um, and if you start too late, you just don't get enough carbs. Nick, I have problems with my stomach quite often. Is it worth kind of practicing the carb loading some time beforehand? Yeah, yeah. Like I can try now. I guess. Like I keep saying, your gut can be trained. So it is worth it, you know, particularly as those, you know, those big runs start to come into your, your diary in those final weeks.

You probably, you don't wanna be doing a full carb loading program before a long run, but it wouldn't hurt you to practice, you know, the 24 hours before the sort of stuff you'd be having the day before the race. Yeah. And then, and we'll talk about this in a bit more detail, but then, you know, there's the fueling on the run as well.

As those, as those runs start to creep over, you know, 12 to 13 miles, which they are starting to, you need to be practicing exactly what you're gonna have on race day. Don't worry about weight gain. It isn't gonna happen through having three or four gels on a long run. Actually, your body uses sugars in, in the carbohydrates, the malrin and fructo in a very, very different way when you are in exercise than if you were sat on the sofa.

Just chewing on packets of torque energy gels or whatever, you know, that would be a very different proposition for your body. Cause it'd be like, well, what do you want me to do with this stuff? So, don't worry about practicing and sangio. This goes back to your comment around, so the next part of your question was, What proportion of proteins are carbs should I have on a daily basis?

I used to cut carbs, but not anymore. Since you're coaching. Good. I'm glad you're listening cuz. Carbs are our friend. I don't do all that low carb nonsense. Carbs are, carbs are our friends. They are fuel. Personally, I go with 30% protein, 20% fat, 50% carbs as often as I can in that kind of region. Try and keep you fat.

You know, we don't need a lot of fat in our diet to. I think it's something like a teaspoon. That's where keto just goes crazy with the fat. But yeah, me personally, 30, 20, 50 and I, I tend to find that I put a day's worth of eating into my Fitness Pal, and I'll generally hit that pretty much every day. That is quite a lot of protein, but protein is underrated for runners as well.

You've gotta think about the, the muscle degradation, the muscle damage that happens on long runs and you know, you are doing strength work, you should be having that little bit of extra protein. So like one of my go-to snacks to really buy protein up in the day is skier yogurt with a protein scoop mixed into it.

And that's like, that's a solid 50 grams of protein in one hit. Boom. Lovely. Then you said about you are not sure how much to eat in terms of total calories, get online and do a T D E E calculator and that'll give you a good estimate. The important thing is, particularly on long run days, is to eat well and I'll come onto that a bit more in a bit.

Um, right. Hydration vests for road marathon, should I use one or just use the water stations? And this was cuz this question as well as xang. So Chris, you are gonna be pushing out sub three 30 time. I would say no. I know you said you, you get thirsty. I think if you are hydrating well enough, you know, two and a half, three liters of water a day, particularly in race week, if you can really be regimented with that discipline, with that in race week, you shouldn't go into that race.

And be thirsty and just use the, the water stations on the course to sip. I just personally, I think if you're starting to head towards five hours, then yeah, I think a hydration vest is, is quite useful because having just gels when you're running for that long is probably not great either. But for the majority of people I coach, you wanna be trying to do as much.

Using hydration on the course, which is literally just grabbing one of the cups or the bottles, having a little swig. You have tiny swigs in small amounts. You know, don't be taking too big of G cuz otherwise you'll have water bouncing around in your stomach and you'll get stomach cramps and doing as much of it as possible, if not all of it on gels for portability.

And you just, you don't wanna be faffing around with hydration vests personally on a road marathon, plus they're gonna slow you down. Yeah, I guess that's the big concern for me is kind of the, the weight of it. But it's something that I've always had water on me, so I think that's something I gonna need to kind of Yeah.

Get used to and, and train around, I think, to try and reduce that. Yeah. It's another, it's another practice point. I know you were only other marathon you've ever done was a trail marathon, which is completely different. I mean, even if I was running a three hour trail marathon, which I wouldn't, cuz that's crazy fast.

I, I, I'd probably still use a hydration vest in that scenario. Uh, yeah, just. Probably because you're not gonna have the frequency and convenience of well organized aid stations. Um, like you gu at London. How often are they, Kyle at London? Is it It's like every, oh, they're, they're all the time. And not only that, but Lucas a sport have, they have like their own drink sections in between the water.

Which, uh, I avoided like the plague after taking one, I shaved that morning trying to run and knock back these sticky fluids. It was like burning all down my face. So, uh, and sticky. Very sticky. I had, I had one that was kind of like this weird ball that you kind of like, Bit into, and it was just, just a complete mess cuz some of them had exploded in the vat that they were containing them in.

So they're just this massive sticky mess, lugging them out to everyone's like London sponsored, what are Buxton's? The supporters. So they're all like the little mini Buxton bottles. Yeah. Yeah. They're nice. Easy to grab, easy to, yeah. Stick the lid back on if you wanna carry it with you for, you know, for the next mile or something.

You know, if you, if you are feeling that you do need to take on some extra water. I would say try practicing your, the long run. Maybe get a handheld soft blast. Okay. Rather than, you know, practice with that. It'll perhaps help to mimic a little bit of what, what your experience on, just to give you an idea, I'll take a bottle to park run.

So that, that's the kind of level that I'm at, at the moment to, you know, it almost as a crutch to, you know, to, to have in front of me. So I think that's something I definitely need to focus on because it kind of struck me when I was kind of looking at the. London marathon photos from last year and I just suddenly looked like, oh, I need to get a new hydration vest cuz my zips broken.

What kind of ones are people having? And the answer was none. Yeah. Very few far between. Yeah. I just wouldn't for a road marathon as, as best as you can, how do you carry your gels and things? Do you have a little strap for that or something? Or Ha. Nathan will tell you. Yeah. Chris, I asked the same question for the, from last year.

And I bought some shorts and carried all gels in. There were quite easily, they had six or seven gels. Might might have been more in there. They are. And there was, um, plenty of, um, plenty of water stations. I'd say it'd be mild, two mile like Kyle said. And then towards the end you get Lucas a stations, I think I just used the very last IDE station.

The shorts that he's talking about are the decathlon trail shorts. Oh yeah. Don't tell run wear this, their shorts on the market. I, I did have like, like, like a little gel belt, but it looks a bit too much like ammo for going around Central London with, so I might might skip that. Yeah. And they bounce around and they, they're really annoying.

No, those shorts are the absolute best and they make 'em for women as well. So the Lon trail shorts, they've got like a built-in band, you can keep your phone in. And I did Newport Marathon. I think I had eight gels in them. No problem. And McCarthy. Oh, okay. No problem at all. Thank you. So that answers that question.

What hydration vest? Very simple. Chris, if you're gonna get one, get the Solomon a d v series. They are just the best, I'd love to say Harrier because they're a British brand and I, I know, I know Kate and I think in two or three iterations of their current series, I would say absolutely, but I don't think they're quite there yet.

They're just a bit bouncy, I find. Is anybody else who's Harrier? I had Harrier to start with, so I think my first hydration vest was so about two years ago and it bounced all over the shop and then I moved to Solomon. It was amazing how still it kept Just doesn't go, does it? Yeah. The Solomon, the Harrier was all over the place.

Yeah. The a d B series and the new ones are even better than the old ones. I've literally just got the new, new model and it is amazing. They just hugged you no matter how much you've got in them. You, you almost don't feel it. I did sort of the 12 lead one I think, so you can get lead and a half of water in the back as well as on the front.

And I did about 50 miles over two days with that on it was absolutely fine. It didn't bounce around at all in with a change of clothes and things in it. Yeah, so Solomon ADB series, I've got the the 12 as well, and I mean I've done 50 Ks in in the 12. A lot of people would say like a lot of other models, a 12 would be too big, but the pack on on the back, it just packs down so small that.

There's no point in having a, in a five liter, an eight liter and a 12 liters. You just get the 12 Got got it. Where everything, every, um, occasion. Then question on gels from DU in the past, gels seem to give me stitches. It depends on which ones I am gonna just hazard a guess that you were using High five Aqua or sis.

Yeah, I think it's sis. Yeah. I had a free sis gel come from sports shoes with, I bought something from sports shoes the other day and it was raspberry. I was like, this taste like Asbury, not nothing raspberry. So yeah, cis and high five tend to be very loose and high five, uh, gels. I've had problems with them in the past because they're so loose, they're so liquidy.

And then you're drinking water as well. They just bounced, just bounced around in your, um, in your stomach. And that's probably what the, the cramp might have been from the stitches. So like with anything nutrition wise with running, just try some stuff. If you find that gels just don't work for you, then it's a case of finding what does work for you.

So in your, when you're not running, what really sweet things do you like to have? Chocolate. Chocolate. Yeah, chocolate. Yeah. So I, I know somebody who can't stomach gels at all. He runs every race he's ever done. He just takes little mini dairy milks and he just has them. I mean, I dunno how that happened, how that fares on a, on a hot day.

But chocolates, one options, sweetss, you've got things like cliff blocks, which are like, you know, they're, they're the same formula as gel, but they're, they're just a bit chewy. So cliff blocks are really good. And there are other blocks available. I think the blocks are the ones I've used before and they make a ginger one as well, which is quite good for your stomach.

So there's a few options there, but I would say just try some stuff. You can try things like Haribo as well, but you, you do, you do need to have a surprisingly large amount of Haribo to um, Or jelly babies. Like I hear people say, oh, you know, I did my marathon. I only had two jelly babies. I'm like, and how did that go for you?

Like, oh fuck, is it 20 miles? I'm like, that's cuz you only had two jelly babies. It's like 10 grams of carbs in there. Yeah. You were nowhere near what, what you needed. Yeah. Give uh, give a few things a try. Sorry. So how many grams of carbs should I have on, on a long run? Or like, uh, every hour. How heavy are you?

If you don't mind me asking? 52 kilos. Good. Okay. You'd get away with one every 40 minutes of thir 30 gram gel. So torque, which I use, it's 30 grams of carbs in one gel. You probably get away with one of those every 40 minutes. Sorry. Every 40 minutes. Yes. 30 grams of carbs every 40 minutes. You'd have to set a reminder on your watch.

You should be right to get away with that. You're not the the biggest person in the world either, so how, how heavy you, yeah, 53 kilograms. So pretty much the same. Yeah, so what a joy. I mean, I'm almost twice the way you'd say. No, not quite, but yeah, sort of being male. We do need a little bit, little bit of extra card compared to women.

So I tend to hear on the side of 90 grams per hour, which, which is hard work. I must, must admit. Yeah, every, so when you do your, I'll show you, Anna will talk about this closer to the time. I mean the, the one in Bulgaria, not uts, you are gonna need to be thinking about eating real food. But yeah, we'll come onto that at some point.

And then trainers, Chris, you asked the question about trainers and ch you've also asked one as well, just to simply answer yours, Shang ju, so you wanna get a pair of trainers for London? Should you start to train in them from now on? If you can, I'd buy two bits. So by appear to training for like your, just your, your normal training runs and then the, the shoes that you want to do London in, you can use those for training but use them for speed sessions.

So you want to get something like, I dunno, I like training my just general easy runs in like Pegasus cuz they're super durable. But then when I actually do the race, I'll, you know, wear a pair of super shoes, the alpha flies or vapor flies or whatever. So that's what I would do personally. Have a bit of a rotation.

Do speed work in the vapors of the alpha, isn't it? So I've got a pair of vapors that, that I did Newport in, and they are, they probably got about 800 miles in them. They, they've lasted, they are battered, but I do my speed work in them just because, yeah, I don't like doing speed work in the Pegasus. I find them a bit too, um, a bit too aggressive, a bit too stiff for me.

Like a little bit of the extra cushioning for the speed work. So I'll use the vapors and then, and then when I get close to race day, I'll start practicing. So all of those marathon pace runs that you, you're gonna start getting, I do them not just in the shoes that I'll be wearing, but I'll make sure I get the sock combination right.

I'll wear the same pair of pants, shorts, vest, everything. Like I'll, I'll carry the gels. I will practice marathon pace with everything I'm gonna have on race day. Something else you to think about as well. Chris, what was your question about shoes? Yeah, I guess what my question is, I kind of got loads of different pairs of, of running shoes over, over the years.

Um, there's kind of three that I'm using at the moment. I've got a pair of trails that I use on the Thursday runs and, and when it's muddy and then a pair of alpha flies and another night pair as well. Um, I took those three pairs to my physio session, um, this week and I could see, she could see the same problem with all of them, my kinda ankle, um, kinda being in the wrong position, pronating too much and I couldn't, um, I need to get some support for those.

So I guess my, my question is more when I'm trying out shoes and so face, face then, and it was exactly the same exactly what I was thinking. Sorry. What's that? No, that's okay. Go on. Keep going Chris. I, I just saw face. Face and it's exactly. The, the sort of reaction that is going on in my head. So I was just wondering like how you choose a pair of shoes, kind of when you're wearing them and trying 'em out at the shop or you in a running club and, and yeah.

Know if you got any tips apart from trying 'em on, you know, try them for a little bit and seeing if they work. I mean with the brands constantly. I mean even like the Nike, Nike Pegasus 38, that I love that I've got two pairs of both have done near enough a thousand miles in each of them. I'm thinking I, I should probably start thinking about another pair.

But I've read the reviews like the Nike Pegasus 38, the new 30 nines, like a lot of people saying they're just completely different. And because the brands obviously keep changing, they keep, you know, tweaking things and, and stuff. I just, I find it, it is an, I think it's an everlasting conundrum for us, you know, everyday runners because all of these shoes are designed around Elliot Ccho and Kenisa Pele and all, all the other sponsored athletes, and then their mass marketers.

I think it is a bit of an, an ever running cycle of discovery really. I know I, I bought shoes recently that have only lasted 200 miles cuz they've fallen apart. Or I, in fact, I bought the Adidas Terrex a Ultras for bracken beacons and they absolutely tore my, my arches apart. But I, but I had the, I had the Aex aida, Terrex speed ultras, one's aggravated, one's speed, and right there my favorite pair of trail shoes ever.

So, you know, same brand, same, you know, line of, you know, for trail and, and they're just completely different. Like, so I, I've run, I think I've run about 40 miles in those, um, those other Aidas, the point where I'm just like, just gonna give them away. So it is a bit of an ever, you know, just bought Altra for the first time and have to say, I'm blown away.

They're amazing. They are amazing. So yeah, it is a little bit of a, yeah, a, a thing of on your physio, giving you orthotics and telling you, you pronate too much. Face. Face just said exactly what I was thinking. Like physios, particularly what, what's the word for somebody who deals with feet? Is it orthopedic?

A podiatrist? That's it. Podiatrist. Yeah. Podiatrists. I mean, they hate runners. Hate runners and they, they, they're, they're just like, oh, you should be running. Yeah, you are all over Pronators and therefore you need orthotics. Look at Elliot, if you can see, find any videos of Elliot Oggi running. You should see how much he pronates.

That is a normal part of the spring loathing of our foot pushing back off. It's like a spring. It's, it's sort of, it's like a coil mechanism, but for some reason physios are like, ah, you shouldn't be doing that. And it's okay. It's crazy. I mean, unless you are like, you know, your ankles are buckling in to the point where they're almost touching and I have seen, I was running behind somebody once.

That was like that in a when, when the vapor flight first came out. Unless you are actually running like that, I think you just need to be a little bit careful. Go Faye. I also think it's nothing that a bit of decent base strength training can't address, because often the reason people over pronate in the first place is due to weaknesses or tightness in certain locations.

Yeah. So usually it's more of a case if you can have a good. And I'm not saying loads of strength training, just some basic fundamentals. Mm-hmm. That will help a lot because as soon as you put an orthotic in someone's shoe, you throw their biomechanics mixed out and you've been walking and running in a certain way for so many years, Chuck, the, the, the orthotics in and it's not necessarily gonna solve the problem.

It could make it worse. So I am not a physio, I'm just a mere massage therapist, but in the sense of, There's good stuff you can do without having to go down the orthotics route. Cause one that can be quite expensive for It can, yeah. Or yeah, like 40, 50 quid, just, just for the inserts. And they, and they have to be per shoe as well.

You can't just take them out and stick 'em in another shoe. So yeah, I'd just be a little bit, a little bit wary of that. I mean yeah. They gave you strength for it to do, didn't they? Yeah, absolutely. And, and, and what she said was usually we'd just. Recommend the strength work and see how it goes. But because you're training and keeping to go on it, um, she kind of recommended those as well.

But I mean, the pair, the pair that she recommended, which were a cheap, yeah, they, they were a cheapy pair off of Amazon pretty much. Um, I'm not a hundred percent convinced about them anyway, so yeah, I might might go back in a couple of weeks after doing the strength stuff and then see how it goes. And maybe Nick, I'll.

I'll recall some slowmo on my treadmill of, of what it looks like as it as it is now and just, yeah, get your phase opinion and you see what you think. Yeah, that'd be good. Yeah, send it over. Yeah. Okay, cool. Thank you. Next, asked the question, she's not on the call, but, um, she asked the question about shoes as well, just in terms of should I have a rotation?

Yes, yes. Yes, you should. It's good to run in different pairs of shoes and particularly if you're a trail runner. No one pair of trail shoes. I love it when people transition from road to trail for the first time. They go, woo, I got a pair of trail shoes. And I go, all right, which ones did you get? And they go, I got Hoka speed goats.

I'm like, it's fucking February. You ain't gonna get any grip out there in Hoka. Speed goats like you go, go get yourself some mud course. So yeah, get, make sure you do have a decent rotation of shoes and particularly trail shoes. You need a different pair for different um, situations, even a type of soul.

Not just like the lugs. I mean I just bought a pair of ultras, which I'm gonna be hopefully using for the UTS and Yoanna. You wanna be listening to this actually. And anybody else who is watching this afterwards? Kyle, who else have we got doing uts Andy or got somebody else doing uts? Like it's potentially, if it's wet, it's very rocky up there by bra soles.

They are so sticky. It's amazing. What trail shoes are you thinking about for uts Kyle? Uh, I'm playing with some North Face ve right now, which I've fallen in love with. They're really cool. They've got by bra sos. They're quite heavy but they just feel great. Um, too narrow for me. They're also really cheap at the moment.

They've got a half price sale on everyone. Um, north Face Shop in Bath. When I went in to try them on, they said, if you buy them, you can just bring them back after 90 days if you don't like them. So 90 days, I was like, what used Smashed up back? And they were like, yeah, just as long as it's within 90 days.

I said, wow. Serious confidence in your shoes to put that kind of guarantee on? No, I'm, I'm going with, um, I'm going with a Vibram, so a hundred percent. They're so sticky on wet rock. So yeah. Nick, is there any, um, trainer you could recommend if you are on the trails, but you're also running on road or what could we, paths or, yeah, anything with lugs less than four mil, then.

You should be okay on the, on, on the road for some period of time. I mean, it depends on the shoe. Like I did have Solomon, um, Solomon like, what are they? I can't remember what they called now, which were great shoes, but they only lasted 200 miles cuz I used to right, used to live like two miles until I got to the trails and I think the, the pavement just chewed them up to bit Hoka Speed can be a bit like that as well.

In fact, I just find Hoka to be. They just wear down very, very quickly. Yeah. My road trainers from okra wore down really quickly, but yeah, if you, if you've got lugs less than four mil, if you are regularly doing hybrid runs where, you know, you're a bit on trail or bit on road, then four, four mil, but it, I think now I'm sort of saying that I think you should, it should be governed by the trail.

If you are gonna spend a significant amount of time on the trail, and let's say it's. Super muddy, super slippery. Well, you might just have to bear with running on the road. Yeah. In a pyramid of mud cause, which are like eight mil, really aggressive. So, yeah, I think I, okay mate. I would, I'd go with governing by, right?

What sort of trail am I gonna be running on? Yeah. If it's really dry trails in the summer, then yeah, a four mil lug is gonna be absolutely fine. Do you know what I mean by lug? Is that the thread on the bottom? Yeah. So the depth of the Yeah, yeah. The little, little nobby bits. Yeah. Call lugs. So yeah, they, they come in different depth.

I'm just thinking about the ultra often in, um, in May time in the peak districts, it could be quite, quite dry in. It could be, but it could also be pissing down the rain. And I haven't run in the peaks before, but I'd imagine it's relatively similar to the lakes where it's slippery in places and. Moss on the rocks and stuff again, I'd be going with something with a vibram sole, something quite sticky.

They were, you, you've run, uh, done a lot of mountains running. One of your thoughts on the peaks? I would say treat it like, I was gonna say, treat it like Wales. It's always wet. Pretty much 10 months of the year, just I would go griper rather than not. Griper you do better off having a better grip than not enough.

I say when you to, um, when you comes to look at, look at shoes, Nate, just, just let me know and I'll, I'll give you some steer. The, the thing with mountainous terrain in this country is you're pretty much gonna be dealing with some wet rock at some point. Unless it's guaranteed sunny weather, then you, you're probably gonna be dealing with wet rock, even if it's just through, you know, being up in the mountains and running through cloud cover, that's gonna add moisture to the, um, to the rock.

Okay, brilliant. Cool. Any more questions from anybody? No. I talk about recovery, which not got that much time for. It's okay. I wasn't gonna be all preachy about it. Cool. Okay, so recovery. It was really interesting. Not surprising though that Nick Mazzo, who's over in Ohio, he asked on the group, what was he asked?

He asked something like, phone rolling massage guns. You know, he went straight for the gadgets. Like how much, how often? So that was quite interesting because it is, but it is unsurprising because so much of the stuff you see on like social media and I actually did a bit of Googling today just to see what things like Runner's world, which don't get me started on Runner's World.

I've got a real bug bear with 'em at the moment. Um, just putting out clickbait, spammy crap. But yeah, the sort of articles that they put out, you know, five best methods for recovering from your runs and it just, it generally involves some sort of gadget. And there are some much more simple things that should be prioritized before we get onto things like massage guns and phone rolling, which can be helpful for some people, even if it's just a.

Just mentally thinking, you know, you, you're doing something. And I, I will always say something that, uh, a guy called Mike James, the endurance physio was called, I know very, if you've heard of him in in sports therapy circles, he's Welsh, actually, I think he's from Evervale. I like what he said. He said there are certain things like stretching, foam rolling, that sort of stuff, but he wouldn't personally recommend it to somebody.

But if somebody wanted to do it, cuz it made them feel good, he wouldn't stop them. I quite like that. I thought that was quite a, a nice way of putting it. It's not something he would say, yeah, you should be doing that, but if if it makes you feel good then, then off you go. And I think that's because there's still a lot of, the science doesn't really support much of it.

What the science does support and I've got first on, on my list and I don't think there's any sort of real order to these first three nutrition. Eating enough and eating high quality food as well. You know, getting enough calories in is one thing, but not all calories are made the same. So, you know, making sure that what you are eating is, is generally of good quality.

And, you know, we obviously have the discussion with Lu last month, so, you know, make sure your diet's good and you're eating enough of it, you know, get enough protein, get enough carbs. That's what the body needs, you know, the protein for, for muscle recovery and, and, uh, preventing muscle, uh, muscle degradation.

And then obviously the calves to replenish the glycogen that you've lost through exercise, um, with a, a moderate amount of fat. But eat, eat healthily. I, I, I really like what Lou said last month, actually try and eat 30 different fruits and vegetables throughout the week. Oh, that'll be really good.

Hydration for me, nutrition, hydration, the two go hand in hand, you know, got to be drinking two to three liters of fluid a day. I'm changing my tact from saying water per day because I used to discount coffee and that study I posted was just, yes, I was just a, an absolute brilliant moment for me. So I probably had about four liters of, uh, fluid today with, um, with my squash and my 97 coffees that I like to drink.

So, yeah, making sure that you're drinking plenty of fluid. And if you think about carbohydrates and what a carbohydrate molecule is, it is a, the carbohydrate molecule is carbon with two water molecules attached to it. So if you're not drinking enough water, you don't get that carbon that, um, carbohydrate absorption, um, as well as you should do.

Sleep, sleep, sleep, sleep. Sleep is, I know, I didn't know which way ran to say, uh, to, to put nutrition or sleep. But yeah, sleep is so important and this is where I kind of get annoyed with people. Oh, you know, I, I feel absolutely fucked after all the training I've been doing. You know, I'm sat on the foam roller.

I'm smashing myself with a, uh, with a machine gun, a massage gun, you know, rolling on a hockey ball and doing yoga and all of this stuff, and I'm like, Okay, how have you been sleeping? And now I can see all of your data from Garmin. That's brilliant that, yeah. Not from mu Chris, but I can see everybody's sleeping hours now, which is great.

So if I see some of who's had a bit of, a bit of a bad sleep and then they go and then that day they've done a hard session and the hard session didn't go quite right and go, well, you didn't sleep very well last night, did you? And they go, ah, yeah, no I didn't. I only slept for four hours cuz you know, my little boy was.

Waking up in the night or whatever it might be. I know sleep can be a bit of a tough one, particularly for the parents and, you know, shift workers and that kind of stuff. Nathan, I know you do nights from time to time, but sleep is one thing that you've got to try and prioritize in terms of recovery, because that's when the magic happens.

That's when the body is like, right, let's, let's recover, let's, let's get ready for the next, next day. And so yeah. Sleep is a, is a huge one. Who gets. Seven hours of sleep minimum a night. Pretty much every night. Yeah. Yeah. Good. Mad, I can't see your hand. I'm just gonna assume you said yes and I, well open trace.

Thank Keep a lot. It's good. Yeah. Good, good, good, good. Next thing, and this isn't always easy, but reducing life stress can be almost, in fact, I would stick my neck out and say it is more stressful than the training itself. It really plays its part. So if you can reduce your life, stressors, stressors, stressors, that's a huge thing.

And that can be honestly as simple as, you know, you just had a shit meeting with someone or many, your colleagues who's being a dickhead or your boss is pissing you off, or you know, the kids driving you nuts. Just literally taking five minutes. So just close your eyes and take a few big, deep breaths. Um, can be quite powerful.

I was listening to Huberman Lab podcast that is being seen as the quickest way to reduce stress is by four seconds in through the nose, and then eight seconds out through the mouth, even for 60 seconds. The, the study was something like, you know, somebody's stress score went from like 80 to 10 out of a hundred.

Within that 60 seconds just through taking a few big deep breaths, four seconds in, eight seconds out alcohol. There aren't many. Chris, you, uh, did I see on the group you gave it drinking? Was it three years ago? Yeah, just over three and a bit years ago. Yeah. Wow. Good on you. I did this, um, one year, no beer, one month for, which turned into 90 days and I realized, My park run times were going up and up, you know, down and down and down and I just kept going.

Yeah, that's so funny cuz I think some of my best park run times would come after a skin full of red wine. The before no inhibitions. Yeah. Alcohol. I mean, I, as much as sometimes I get a little bit annoyed with all of the data in, in, in the Garmin watches and, you know, they are just a number. There's no denying.

When I've had more than two glasses of red wine, my HRV stress score and my sleep score are terrible. So if you drink more than you maybe should, then reducing that is a really, um, really important thing. I've gotten really into nice herbal teas every night. This is my sleepy tea, this one. So instead of having a glass of wine over herbal tea each night, then hot bass.

Because, and I put that above massage. Sorry, Fay. I put that above massage purely because it's easy. Like you can have a hot bath once a week, quite easily. Not for free because we have pay for water and heating, but actually that's probably more expensive than a massage these days. But I totally agree. I'm not a full-time massage therapist at the moment.

Cost of living and all that, it's not really a priority. So I had to get a real job, but a hundred percent. I love a bath with Epsom salts in. One of the best things ever, even if I can't have a bath, you know? Cause someone said you're not having a bath filling the bath water. I fill a bowl and put my feet in it and have a foot spa.

That's lush. That's lush. Yeah. Definitely got the, uh, south Wales in you now.

I was gonna say, say the same dick about one of what I've found on, say I've been on a long one, there's an bag path with salts. The amount difference it makes in the morning is unbelievable. Yeah. Brilliant. I always try and have a hot bath on a, on a Sunday. That help with sleep as well. Cause Nick, well coming back to the sleep thing, that's one thing I was gonna ask.

Cause after a long run I often sleep terribly. Oh, okay. That's interesting. So yeah, probably the worst night of sleep I get, if I run 10 miles or more, I don't tend to sleep well that night. I dunno why I'm exhausted, but I lie there. Why do awake? So I would go back to if you feel like that after, I mean you're not doing your long runs right before you go to bed either.

No, no. In the morning, I don't. I just feel, yeah, just, I don't know. I'm just not that tired. So I go back to how are you feeling on the run? Because actually, sorry, let me just rewind the clock a second. My number one point was not nutrition and hydration. It is actually, recovery starts on the run itself by fueling the run properly.

So make sure you are fueling your runs. There's no excuse for fasted running. Yeah. Unless you've got some sort of dietary. Issue. That means you have to fast the run, don't do it. Get your fueling right, fuel your runs, and that is where recovery starts. That's where recovery starts on the run itself. Then I'd be thinking, well, you know, you've come in from the run.

Have you started rehydrating straight away? Are you eating, you know, well straight away. And then throughout the the day itself, are you eating enough? Um, what are you doing afterwards? You know, are you doing your long run? And then, Is drag union around the shop for the next six hours. It happens. Um, but yeah, I mean something like a hot bath.

I haven't tried that. Yeah, pretty good. Try showering, hot shower before bed. What happens, and this might sound counterproductive, but what we need to do before we go to sleep is we need to reduce our core body temperature. And having a warm shower actually sends signals to the brain to go, oh, I need to cool myself.

Because I'm getting hot. And then in the morning, and this is Hoberman lab again, I think he's brilliant. In the morning we need to raise our core body temperature, so I have a cold shower in the morning. Just try and wake up quicker, not just cuz it like, oh my god, that's freezing. But actually it raises your core body temperature a little bit quicker, so you can try that.

Cool. Thanks. I, yeah, so hot baths. Then massage. Massage is, is great if you can, you know, afford it once a month. Brilliant. I think that's a, that's a great amount of time for, you know, if you can afford it more, then great. Yeah, I, I love a massage. I think it's a, a great thing. Even if, even if it's just a bit of a, going back to what that Mike James would say, you know, if it's something you enjoy, you feel it works for you, then even if it's just mentally then, then great.

There's a word beginning with S that I haven't mentioned. Stretching. I'm not a fan of it, but I did go to yoga on Monday, a yoga class. I really enjoyed it. And again, I think it's, the evidence just isn't there for stretching either way, really. It's, you know, there isn't enough evidence to say that it's, it's a benefit and there's not enough evidence to say that it isn't a benefit.

And it's the same with ice baths as well. I've got ice baths on my list with a question mark. I was listening to a guy called Alex Hutchinson, who has done a bunch of studies on cold and hot therapy he hears on the side of hot therapy. Um, there's plenty of evidence around that. It, you know, they've shown that it, it helps to speed of recovery process by getting more blood to, you know, the places than it needs to.

Whereas ICE baths restrict that, but they still don't know whether. Getting in an ice bath is good for us or bad for us. There just isn't evidence, a bit like stretching. So it's one of those things where he said both about stretching and ice baths. If you like stretching, if you like getting in freezing cold water, then you go for it.

But if you don't like stretching and you don't like getting in cold water, then don't bother. And I think that's kind of where I stand on that cuz I hate stretching. I did enjoy yoga the other day, I must admit that was. I think having somebody there to go, you know, you know, do that, put that there, try and do this.

That was, that was quite good. I think trying to do it in front of a YouTube video just doesn't work for me. And then we can start looking at the things that Nick mentioned on the group. Massage guns, gadgets. I can zip up. Sauna bags. What else has come on? My Facebook feed recently. Yeah, there's just, there's loads of stuff out there.

Phone rolling. Again, it just, they've sh there has been some evidence and Faye probably agree, there has been some evidence that it can. Help with mobility in the immediacy. So if you were to do some before a run or through a before a work, before a strength workout, then that might have some benefit, but the effects are not that long lasted.

So doing it after things is. Maybe not. Again, a bit like stretching an ice bath, is it? If you like it, go for it. What do you think, Fay? I hate foam rollers and I think part of the problem is they're used incorrectly, which is no one's fault in particular. There's, just so you know, you can pick up a, a foam roller and have no education with it.

It is good for using as a prop for mobility exercises, so I do use it to like stretch my back out or have used it in yoga for different bits and pieces, but I don't, I have one in the corner and I dunno, the last time that I actually rolled on it, it's just there. But yeah, for like mobility, like stretching out the, my upper back and stuff, it's really nice for, but not for actually rolling.

Yeah. Not, not as a recovery modality, no. But then that's where I go back to the bit about stretching. If you're doing the right type of, in inverted comm stretching. I don't like calling it stretching, mobility work. That's good for mobility. Is it good for recovery? We don't really know. So when I did that backyard alternate it, there was quite a lot of people had their phone rollers and massage guns and, and do you know what?

Like I say, if that makes you feel good, then you go for it. Those massage guns that you get off Amazon for 35 quid or whatever they are. I don't know. I don't you have them on sale at the petrol station. I honestly, I was like, are you for real? So they on that, you know they have those little plastic things saying this week we've got W uh, heated gloves and massage guns.

And you just think what I mean, the ones from Amazon, they come with all different attachments and you just know that there's one attachment in there that is for pleasuring oneself, ladies. That's all people use it for, especially the people that buy 'em from the garage. Oh, right. Love, I've just got you a present from the garage with your garage flowers.

Anyway, so yeah, I think all of that, uh, Nick, if you are listening and, and watching that sort of stuff, if you've got your nutrition right, your hydration right, your sleep right, you are reducing your, your life stresses. You are having hot baths, you are getting massaged from a, a, a good sports therapist. If you got all that right and then you still want to look at recovery modalities.

Then start going to that sort of stuff. Um, yeah, there just isn't a lot of evidence on it at the moment. All those, all those gadgets, some of 'em claim too, but yeah, unless it's a nicu, uh, you, you know full well what it's like to be published in, in things like PubMed after his caffeine study that he did.

Yeah. Unless there's good evidence around it, I just wouldn't bother. I'd rather you spend your time doing something else, like getting another 10 minutes of sleep instead of sitting around with a foam roller. Have a nap if you can. I need to try doing that in the middle of the day. Just sack off a meeting or two.

And that is all I got for you today. So in summary, your, pretty much all of you, your mileage is going up now. It's starting to hit. Half marathons are coming in in March. So you know, that's why we're gonna be testing out race pace for you, uh, for you marathoners. Maddie, I think your half is in March. Is it?

Yeah, that's right. 11th, you're quickly coming into your, um, your key weeks now. So get really prioritizing recovery as, as best you can. Your body needs it. Alright, thank you all for coming and next week I am definitely gonna have a guest speaker. I was a bit unorganized this, uh, week, but I did want to talk about things.

I mean, we've had so many questions and, uh, and things anyway that it's been all good. But next week I'm hoping to get Marcus will day. On who is the top fitness performance director. So he's their very, very scientific brain around their. Products and um, uh, yeah, there's nothing he doesn't know about fueling your races.

So I'm gonna get him on and we can help you all through, um, for your fueling strategies. Alright, have a great evening everybody. See. Bye.

And that's another lap done on the Maximum Mileage Running podcast. Thank you for joining me and my athletes and my guests on this world. Ride through the world of ultra road and trail running. And remember whether it was a mountain trail or the local road, every mile you conquer makes you stronger.

Keep pushing, keep laughing, and of course, keep swearing when that hill just seems a little too steep. If you enjoy today's journey, don't forget to subscribe and leave me a nice review. Please. Your feedback does help me go that extra mile. Until next time, this is your host, Nick Hancock, reminding you to make every mile count, run long, run strong, and run with a maximum mileage.

Catch you on the next run