Explaining Ourselves

I've hit record. I'm gonna turn those headphones down, but maybe not all the way. So hopefully they won't leak too much.

Hello?

Say stuff.

Okay. I'm gonna read a poem, by David White. Start close in. Don't take the second step or the third. Start with the first thing. Close in, the step you don't want to take. Start with the ground you know, the pale ground beneath your feet, your own way to begin the conversation.

Oh, fabulous way to to kick off a podcast.

Yeah. I just really like that, and it's about starting things, which is gonna be part of what we're speaking about on the podcast Yeah. As well as nurturing those things, those projects, those ideas into reality.

I think, I think that's absolutely captures the essence of what what we're gonna what we're gonna be talking about to all these people that we're gonna be talking about it with

Well, it is just me and you in a room.

Well, that's that's today.

Yeah. So

so so what what are we doing today? We've got no guest, which we would normally have.

Yes. So Ian and I have already recorded a little trailer for this, podcast for this project of ours.

Go back and listen to it if you like, and then come back.

But I think through that process, we or I definitely realized maybe we needed to have a longer conversation about what this is, why we're doing it, why it's taken a while to get us here.

Mhmm.

Yeah. Because we had a lot to say in the trailer, and I think the trailer is good, but it's short, punchy, like, what are we doing? And then now we can have a bit more of a a longer chat. We're basically… we're interviewing each other. We deserve a place on this podcast too, Ian.

Yes. So I guess what we're saying is we're going to just explain ourselves a bit. Why we're here? Why we're gonna do this? And then we'll be all set for episode 1.

Yeah. We're just gonna have a good chat. But we did want to use a little bit of the recording we've already made because you can use things and reuse things in the creative process. It's just a constant stream of learning and reusing and redoing. And… yeah.

What a what a great way of looking at it, actually. And it's about why we've picked the name manifesting agency.

Yes.

So we've got 2 little clips, and this first one is about the Manifesting part of it. So I'm just gonna roll the tape even though there's no actual tape because this is 2024.

The definition of manifest, to create something or to turn something from an idea to a reality.

Oh, I like it.

But I feel like manifesting gets a bad rep at the moment. People think it's just believing in something, and then it happens.

We're just gonna believe really hard until it happens.

Yeah.

So maybe we can have a chat about that before we move on to the second part of the name.

Yeah. I I I particularly like the believe really hard idea because I think and, actually, that whole thing of this kind of quasi religious thing of “manifesting” things by believing in them hard and how that's totally against what we're really the point of what we're we're here to do, isn't it?

It is. Although, what I what also is… comes across in the second part of the name is that the belief is necessary. You have to have the belief in your ability to do stuff.

It's necessary but not sufficient.

Exactly. And I think we often, I definitely, and I know a lot of other people can get stuck in the “believing” bit and come up with a lot of ideas but struggling to actually take the step, the next step, the first step into, yeah, make… manifesting that as a reality, as something that is solid and tangible. And… yeah.

I think that kind of leads us, doesn't it, into the second half of our name. So this is the clip we recorded about Agency.

One's agency is one's independent capability or ability to act on one's will. So it is very much about doing an action, but I think in order to access your own agency, you need to believe in it.

Yes. And that's what you were just saying there.

Yeah. And, actually, listening back to that, it's interesting because I'd I'd just come back from a a course at Berlin Art Institute.

Ooh, I'm very impressed. Berlin is a place I've always wanted to go, and it is a creative hub, isn't it, in in Europe?

Yeah. It's amazing. The course was super intense, so I didn't actually have time to to do much of Berlin stuff other than the course and existing in Berlin. But, something that came up on the course was the the difference between desire and will, which I think maybe is something we will we will be exploring because the desire is like, oh, I I want this to happen. I wanna believe in it, but you need the will to make it happen.

I think you're absolutely right. And I think we can make sure that we we ask our guests about that. Because I think that aspect of deciding to do it and being determined and and holding yourself to it is gonna be a theme because everything worthwhile has either already been done or it's hard.

Or both.

Yeah. Or both. And so keeping going when it's hard, I think I think is gonna be be really important.

Definitely. And that actually leads really nicely into talking a little bit about when we came up with this idea because it's been a year, I think.

As you said at the beginning of the trailer, we needed the time.

Yeah. And I think this so often happens with projects, ideas, creative projects, whatever it is. I think an idea can come up and and you have a lot of energy for it as at that time, but it's not the right time or other things need to happen before it can be manifested. It can become a reality. And that that was true for us, like, lots of things for many different reasons. I think we couldn't we've we struggled to sit down and make it happen until now.

It's been an eventful year, but, we don't have to go into that. But, yeah, I think you're right.

And maybe we will go into that as throughout the the season because I think it would it's good to share a little, like, our personal relationship with manifesting agency. Yeah. Absolutely. But, yeah, I think that'll hopefully, we can chat about that with guests as well because they might wanna ask us questions.

So I've got a question for you.

Okay.

So why do you wanna do a podcast?

Ian's told me I have a very good voice for podcasts. Oh, wait. I've got a little quote here from I've got a little quote from Ian from when we were recording the trailer, so you're gonna just hear a bit of a rustle.

Who's Russell?

This is what he said. And I wrote down, this is a great way to introduce myself. He was like, “you've got one huge kidney and a great voice”.

Oh, that's your victory in the genetic lottery.

Yep. No. Apart from that, we were working on a different project and just having great chats about that project, but also just life, like things that connected with that project and other stuff as well. And we like going to the pub and having chats in the pub. So that means you wanna make a podcast.

It's a bit too noisy in the pub, though. So

Exactly.

Have to come somewhere quieter to do it. Yeah. Okay. Cool.

Why do you wanna make a podcast?

I love podcasting. I love listening to them, and I've made a few now. So I made, Ilkley Lockdown originally that your Dad was on, actually.

I remember.

And I interviewed 12 people in Ilkley during the pandemic to find out how their lives have been affected by it because well, I won't go into it, but I I really, really enjoyed doing that. And I've got a couple of other podcasts, and I'll include links to them in the notes for this so that, people can listen to them if they are nerds, particularly like me.

Lovely. Yeah. That sounds great.

And I'm always very impressed with people who get off their backside and do stuff, particularly in communities. Because actually, there's that quote, isn't there, about the concerned citizen being,

I think I've remembered it. Never doubt that a small group of concerned citizens can change the world. It is the only thing that ever does. And I think it's by Rosa Luxembourg.

I love that though, and I admire I've always admired the people that do that. And it's only slowly dawned on me over the last, like, maybe 15 years that I can do that. It it just never occurred to me before then. So

And what is it do you think that that helped the dawning of that?

I don't know. I I think I just the people I met and things I was doing. I I worked, for a long time in a big company, and I, for a long time, felt very powerless in that environment. Then it slowly dawned on me that the people who were doing really well, they weren't given any different sort of they weren't smarter than me or or, you know, had other qualities, but they but the quality they did have was that they kind of… they did stuff.

Yeah.

And I kind of admired that but eventually learned somewhat anyway, to do it do it myself. And I'm fascinated by people that can do that and what makes them tick and and what we can we what we could learn from them. So that's why I want to

Yeah.

I want to do that.

That sounds like agency to me. It's like

Yeah.

It doesn't really matter about your your capabilities, your skills, or your knowledge. It's more I it's more a know I knowing I can do this and then doing it.

And, you know, the other side of that coin is that there are people who can start things but maybe not finish them.

Yeah. And that's

another sort of side of that.

I am definitely among those people. It's something I'm, like, I think moving out of. But, yeah, definitely, I think it runs in the family. But it is hard because you lose the you lose the momentum. There's always always more work than you had anticipated. I think things unseen things, yeah, come up. But it's it's all part of it. It's part of the process.

It is. Yes. And, actually, one of the great things is that when we get to episode 8, which is what we've committed to each other we're gonna do

Mhmm.

Then we'll have finished it. But we'll be… But well, that's not to say we can't recommit and do another 8 or…

Yeah.

…or 12 or whatever. But it means… it will mean when we get there, and now everyone's in the future is judging us when they see that there are 6 episodes or something. But, you know, when we get to episode 8, we will be able to feel that feeling.

Yeah. But I just I do wanna question the whole we will have finished it thing because I wanna play a little bit. Earlier, I said, like, we're in this constant cycle of creative process and I think part of that is seeing endings not as as final, not as like okay that's it I've done it I'm gonna put it in a box now and it's over and I don't think that's what's gonna happen with this podcast. But I think with most things they lead into something else, or you will come back to it and it will evolve and the process will begin again. So, yeah, it will be great to look back on these 8 episodes when we've actually done it.

You may hate me in…

Yeah. We'll see. We'll check back.

Yes. Yes. We might have to record separately.

Yeah.

Yeah. I I think that is interesting. You're right to address this kind of it's finished thing. Because in some sense, things are never finished, and you you just stop.

Yeah.

That that what what does finished mean? But what I would ask you, I think it's an interesting thing for us both to reflect on is, what does success at this look like to you?

I think the fact that we're here doing this, I already feel like this is a success.

Something of a success already. Yes.

Yeah. Totally. Because… and and then I think the the step beyond that is if one person listens to it, even if it's somebody we know and we're like, sit down.

We're standing over and making them listen to it.

But, yeah, I do think that. And I think this is something that I've that has changed for me. Like, lower the… lower the parameters of success, and you will find it a lot easier to take action, I think.

You don't wanna be intimidated to the point of inaction by the goal.

Exactly.

But I guess what I'm I'm sort of getting at is, yes, we have had successes to be able to get to where we are. But think about this 8 episode season. Is success we've got 8 episodes that we've published, or is it some number of people who've listened to it? Or what would make us feel like that was worth doing?

I already feel like that. So I think it's fluid, isn't it? Like, it that will change as we go through this process, as the project evolves and grows. And, yeah, I don't think it's something that we have to define and pin down. I think it's important with your projects, with one's projects, with one's agency. Keep it, yeah, keep it fluid. I don't think we need to say I'm gonna do this by then. And if I haven't done it, I am a failure, and I can't go on.

That would be a that would definitely be a mistake when it comes to podcasting.

Yeah. Trust me.

I know. I've failed in that way already. In fact, if you listen to, little plug here, Bought A Lot of Things, which is one of my, other podcasts, quite a lot of the humour, particularly around certain episodes was, me trying to say the next episode will come out at a particular time and Ash saying, no, no deadline. And there was this memorable thing where we talked about, it will come out in January, and then it was 2 years later it came out.

Yeah.

It was so I think, yes. I I agree with that. I did enjoy the humour of that. But for me, I think success is we published what we said we would. We publish 8 episodes, and we'll do whatever we can to get you know, we we do want you, dear listener, to be listening to it and we want you to go to all your friends and say, oh, Ian and Esther, they're just so awesome.

Good. Yeah. Well, it's good. I think yeah. I mean, it's good to also have a clear sort of vision of of the direction of of success maybe, but not not being so fixed in that. And I think you're right. We have said we will do that. And it and the feeling of doing something you've said you were gonna do is… yeah, that does feel good.

Feeling, isn't it?

Exactly. Yeah. So yeah. Well, I'll go with that then.

Cool. Okay. So, we can have our report card. But I think we we will be able to do this. I feel really I feel positive. I'm actually quite excited about it because I'm really looking forward to all the people that we're gonna talk to, and we're gonna meet through it.

Yeah. Me too.

Yeah. So, I think we're we're we're in a bit of confusion about episode numbers at the moment. We've got a trailer, and then we've got this we want to be episode 0, but the trailer may have to be episode 0. So but whatever we end up with, the first real episode

No. This is real.

This is real.

The first interview with

Our first interview. Yeah. We're interviewing Kath Steward, as you all know if you’ve listened to the trailer. And if you haven't, really? Still? We've promoted it at least twice or 3 times during this. Look. Go and listen to it now. We'll we'll wait. We're not going anywhere. Right? We're just waiting. Right. Good. So as you can hear from the trailer, we are we're interviewing Kath Steward who's done all sorts of amazing things in Ilkley where we live, and we're going to, go from there. So

See you soon.

See you soon.

(whispers)

No.. no… no, I'm just gonna I'm just gonna be awkwardly…

(whispers) Okay.

We'll just awkwardly peter out and then just suddenly stop it with no warning.

Okay.