155: Where we go wrong with managing up, and how to do it right

One of the biggest skills that we actually, I think we don't talk about enough in managing teams is the need to manage up. Welcome to the Managing Made Simple podcast, where you get a masterclass in managing your team with ease in 15 minutes or less. I'm Lia Garvin, your host and team operations consultant for this show am I programs with small businesses and corporate teams.

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We leave no stone unturned when it comes to what makes us love managing. Kind of hate it and everything in between. Let's go. Welcome back to the show. You know those days when things are coming at you from all angles, you got your team members asking you for help and help, figuring out problems and to do all this. And then you got your own leadership coming in. Turning up the heat on deadlines and you feel like, gosh, I can't I can't ask my team to do one more thing.

They're just gonna, like, explode and burn out and quit, and you feel like you are a diamond in a lump of coal just being squeezed from all angles. And it feels like, what am I going to do? How are we to get through this?

Well, that's why today I want to talk about managing up, because for folks listening that work in a situation where they have their own manager or leadership to respond to, even if you're a business owner or you have a board or you have stakeholders or investors, right, this might show up for you. They're a One of the biggest skills that we actually, I think we don't talk about enough in managing teams is the need to manage up. So a lot of times we're managing down.

We're managing our teams of people. But under us that we oversee and maybe we're managing peers and kind of like stakeholders and we're getting things, you know, like we're collaborating with people horizontally. Then there is, well, what do we do to really set expectations with with people senior to us? Now I'm going to talk about where we usually go wrong. And then I'll share what I, what I would suggest you do instead.

So a lot of times what I, what I see, and I frankly have experienced and done wrong in, in the corporate role as a manager was when I'm feeling like a lot under a lot of pressure and my team is coming to me complaining we can't take more on and the deadlines are too tight and there's too much work. Then I start feeling that emotional energy and I go to my boss saying like, this is impossible. What are we going to do?

People are going to quit and we go with this alarmist, you know, really emergency tone. Now, if we if we bring that, I'm just going to say it straight. If we bring this to a senior senior executive and we're coming in complaining and a little bit like they're just going to say, like it's too bad that that typically shuts people down. Not saying it's fair, not saying it's right, but that's what I've observed firsthand.

The more emotional, heightened state I'm in, the more the person's like not interested in engaging and the worse I look like. It looks like I can't handle the situation as a leader. And I've really been burned in that situation where I kind of take on the energy of my team, and then it looks like, well, I'm either not able to handle this situation or I'm actually making this more of an issue than even it is.

And that's not what you're doing as a manager. I'm not saying that, but that can be interpreted that way. So I want to help us avoid that. The other thing that can happen is not only to say, I'm going to shut it down, right? Like you're not actually able to communicate the real problem, right?

And so what do we want to do instead, my friends, is when we approach a leader about deadlines or timelines or resources or or project scope, whatever it is, we really want to frame the problem in terms of, hey, you know what's going on and talk about risks, okay. Talk about risks and mitigations. And what are the things this person cares about? Is this person's biggest concern. This leader we're going to is it budget. Are they like a stickler for numbers and hitting budget.

Is it about resources. Is it that this schedule can't be missed? We have this launch and it's like sink or swim first thinking about that, because that's the risk you're going to speak to because that's what that person cares about okay. So this is big, right? Once we've thought about that because frankly, what we usually do wrong, I'm to add another one.

We think about what we're concerned about, which honestly usually is that more morale of the team folks quitting, folks complaining of you folks being freaking out. That's not what the leader thinks about. They're thinking about higher level things like, is this thing going to happen or not? And we're going to be spending too much money or not, like really like bottom line type of things. So you have to come to them with the thing they care about.

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Let me give you me, let me share a little story, okay, of how I coached a manager in a large tech company and how to do this. So she came to me and said, oh my God, my, we need to get more resources on this project like we have for designers was a major, major product in this in this tech company that was had, I don't know, was 4 to 5 designers, like 50 engineers. The ratios were really off. And she said if people are burning out there, they're losing steam. Folks are calling in sick.

If we lose a few team members, you know, like this, whole products can go down. I got to go tell the engineering VP that, you know, hey, everyone's burned out people to start quitting. And I said, gotta stop right there. This engineering VP, what he cares about is, is this product going to ship or not? That's what he cares about. He doesn't care about if your team is happy or not. Sorry to say it. Like we've seen this. This person in action doesn't care.

Now again, that's a different issue that it's for another day. But we're talking about what do what have we observed this person's biggest priority and it was shipping the product or not. So I said well instead of talking about burnout and morale, which are things I love that you care about and you are going to still focus on, but we're going to frame it in terms of what this guy cares about. And it was risks to the launch date and we said, okay, we have four people on the team.

Each person is caring 25% of the capacity of the load. So if one person goes down, we are already out of the gate, can only deliver 75% of the deliverables. We're just like already unable to finish the work. So we're asking for an additional resource to mitigate the risk to bring everyone's kind of ownership load from 25% down to 20. And if we could get two resources, we're really looking much better, right? Because now we have a level of buffer where people can load balance.

If someone calls in sick, if someone has a vacation, whatever it is that we can get this done. So this is risk management purely. Now from his point, he said, okay, I get it. And he gave her the resources right away. From her standpoint, getting more resources was able to alleviate the burnout and the stress and to show her team, hey, I am covering you. I am making sure we're okay.

So it really was a win win because we were able to speak the language of the person we were managing up to, and then when she managed back down to her team, she said, hey, I went and I fought for these resources. Like, I really hear what you're saying. And so again, this conversation is not about like, how do we get senior executives in our companies to care more about morale? Okay, that's for another day. And I and I do do a lot of work on that too.

But this is about how you when you're in a position of feeling squeezed, how do you communicate really the needs. And that's all about risk management. And it's all about, you know, framing in terms of pros and cons. What does that person care about? What have you already tried? Right. Really I understand. And again I said it. I get so emotionally invested in my team and like their morale that I can bring that right. Like, you know, I'm living it with them.

But I have found that that heightened emotional state, it actually doesn't allow you to kind of often it doesn't. A lot of you explain what you're actually asking for, and you're asking for this risk that you foresee that you're feeling and living and breathing to be lessened. And that can be done through more people, more budget, a change in the schedule and things like that.

And those are very rational asks and when you when you kind of tease apart the emotions from the rational needs, now you can have a conversation where you're kind of talking about trade offs and it just goes a lot better, look a lot more smoothly. Okay, so that is my strategy for managing up, talking about the risks, mitigating the risks, really in terms of what that leader that you're talking to cares about.

And again, it could be similar if you are a business owner or a founder and you're talking to your investors or you're talking to the VC that you work with, right? Whoever it is and, and your board framing things in terms of what their biggest concern is and then the risks and the trade offs, that is going to get you so much further. All right. And and I am so excited to share of the new manager playbook comes down to January 27th where I talk about all these things right.

How do you navigate feedback and set expectations and deal with conflict and have that not have to have that conversation about your team every promotion every two weeks? Right. Like these are the things that we have to wrestle with in order to really feel like we're setting up our team well, but that this whole managing thing is a lot easier. Okay, so that comes out January 27th. I am so excited to share with that with you.

Head to liagarvin.com/newbook to get on the list for exclusive updates related to launch. So you're not going to want to miss that, but I'm going to give out a lot of freebies, tools, tricks, things that are not even in the book. All right. See you next time. That's all I have for today. Thank you so much for tuning in to the Managing Made Simple podcast, where my goal is to demystify the job of people management so that together we can make the workplace somewhere everyone can thrive.

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