BONUS: Rob Mills On Feeling His Lowest While Under The Spotlight

So much.

You're listening to a MoMA Mia podcast. Mama Mayer acknowledges the traditional owners of land and waters that this podcast is recorded.

On high out Louders. It's Claire Stevens here. It's been a little while since I've been in your ears, and I've been busy making a new season of my award winning podcast But Are You Happy. This season we had some incredibly vulnerable chats with some of the biggest names in Australia like Josh Thomas, khan Ong and Laura Byrne, just to name a few, and I thought i'd share with you part one of my conversation with actor, musician and mental health advocate Rob Mills. Enjoy and if you

I think this is just across the board for everyone, and it's definitely for me. When you do the thing, when you get to think you're going to be instantly happy, you know, happiness is like sadness. This is a fleeting thing that comes and goes.

Hello and welcome to But Are You Happy, the podcast that asks the questions you've always wanted to know from the people who appear to have it all. Rob Mills is actually my boyfriend? No he's not, But when I was thirteen, I truly believed he was my boyfriend. Millsy was on Australian idol and he was a bad boy,

No, it was way worse.

Now he's one of the biggest musical theater stars in the country. To Rob about the experience of working out what it is you really truly want to do, achieving it, and then having the media bring the focus back to a fleeting moment from the past.

I remember with this article.

I made an interview about me finishing the show and I was heading over to New York to go and do auditions, and the person that interviewed me hadn't even seen the show. Wow, I've done it for two years and the titles ZI about Paris Hilton.

We also talk about his relationship with alcohol, the mental health crisis facing men, and the magic of falling in love. Here's my chat with Rob Mills. Rob Mills, You're an actor, a singer, a host and author. You've been a household name for over twenty years since your time on Australian Idol in two thousand and three. I was prime Australian Idol audience. I was absolutely obsessed. I had your poster on my wall.

How were we? Oh?

I would have been thirteen thirteen, so you're really knew your demo was twelve. I've told Gorgie, I'm like, you're dating my boyfriend.

She did tell me. I'm going to bring it up. Okay, it's fine.

Here here is between me and Georgia.

The space between contractual space.

Since then, you've had a solo music career as well as primetime TV hosting gigs and a role on Neighbors, and have gone on to become one of the biggest names in Australian musical theater. You released a book in twenty twenty two and you're currently playing Shakespeare in the Australian production of Anguliette, which I saw a few weeks ago. That's the big picture stuff, bringing you back to the present moment. How are you right now?

Right now, I'm pretty good. I'm having a sweet treat with some lovely humans.

Here in the office.

I was up in about caught up with a friend this morning. Spoke to Georgie last night.

When I got home.

I was like, that was really good little face time with living in separate cities at the moment.

She's in Melbourne, I'm in Sydney.

If you asked me this a week ago, mate, I was low as I've had this cold and sickness. I was off work. I was having a really, really tough time.

If I'm being.

Brutally honest, I had suicidal thoughts for the very first time in like seventeen years.

Wow, on stage during a show. What I say, suicidal thoughts. I will also clarify.

This as a fleeting thought, which was clearly irrational.

In the moment.

There would have been a lack of food in my stomach because of the show schedule, but also just I was exhausted.

I was so tired.

I miss Georgie, I miss life like I work every single night. I give my heart and soul to this production, which I love so much. But at this moment, I like, I just can't do this. And I was like, why is my body failing me? Why am I sore every day? Anyway, it was just this really crazy moment last week, Mate, and I got on the scooter on the way home, calling Georgia.

I'm like, oh, this is very hard. I just so I was a mess, an absolute mess. Anyway.

The following day, I was like, I probably just needed a really big cry, and I'm a big cry, Like it's releasing the pressure valve in your life and you're like, ah, cool, cool, cool, feel better. But at the moment, this week fantastic. And as I said, it's just obviously a build up over.

Time.

But yeah, it was a really scary moment though, having not had any of those kind of thoughts for many, many, many years, and yeah, now feeling like, oh great, okay.

I'm just exhausted. Sickness. Does that makes you feel very irrational? Like a sleep makes you feel those things?

You know this as a young one, Yes, And I've always thought that. I notice every time I get sick, like fluey or anything like that. I think I have depression, and I think it is actually like inflammation of the brain and that kind of thing, and you have to remember that it passes. But in the moment it is so distressing. In a moment like that where you're on stage, do you feel almost trapped by the stakes of what you're doing, like you can't stop.

Yeah, I mean there's the moment on stage like at least I know I have the show, Like I can just sit in this character for a bit longer.

The character gets yelled at by.

His wife, and you're probably like, don't yell.

Which about it worse.

But also like I was like, I just as I said, rational Robbers, like you're doing the pit the character, and then I see can't stop the feeling, and I'm like, oh, I.

Got the feeling.

And I'm like, I've got this feeling so funny.

Yes's so funny, so strange, But there's also the security of the character. I suppose if you're not going out there but doing the same thing over and over again can sometimes feel a bit like groundhog Day. But like, luckily for me in this show, it is full of joy and wonder and love and hope and positivity and progressiveness. It takes all these boxes you said about feeling depression. Of this is where they get thrown around quite a lot.

Sad just for a moment. Yeah. I think it's that movie Inside Out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that really cemented that for me.

I was like, Oh, sadness just plays a really important role in your life. You have to have sadness or else you can't have joy. Yeah, and they have to be best friends. Well, they don't have to be best friends, but you know, I mean, like, it's okay to sit in the sadness for a bit. If it goes on for a long time, it's definitely worth seeking help and talking to friends and counselors or psychologists, rabbi whoever you've got. But to diagnose yourself with depression, I think is problematic.

You're probably just a bit sad.

And to acknowledge that it is just a state that.

You move through, yeah, into instead.

Of I think the thing is when you feel really low, you tell yourself it's forever and you cannot imagine your mood ever changing. But the nature of being human is that we move through all these different emotions in a day and they can be quite extreme.

Yeah, and for the people who are struggling with that, definitely, yes, seek help. I'd put your hand up and say a should not doing so well at the moment, and then you might get some clarity from that. You're like, oh, I was just in a moment and now I'm okay. As I said, my thing the other night on stage was just a moment. As I said, I'm pretty self aware. Like I've done a lot of work with so collegist over the years. I've got a great psychotherapist. Now in that moment, I was.

Like, ah, yep, I was just having a moment.

And knowing that I had that moment and just knowing that I needed to talk to my person and talk it through was yeah, quite confronting, but also therapeutic for both of us as well.

You were the heart throg of Australian idol.

Oh thank you.

Were you twenty one when you were on that show.

Yeah, I just turned twenty one. I was twenty with my first audition. I turned twenty one before I went to Sydney.

You go to Sydney.

I remember. It's so vividly. What did the public not see about that experience? Like, I can't imagine what the actual day to day reality was of being on that show.

We were really busy, Like there was so much publicity and stuff that we had to do little stories every day, Like the producers were pulling a left, right and center to go and do stuff. And the singing was really the small part of it. We're saying for a minute and a half. And I found that really strange as a kid who spent the last three years singing in pubs, singing thirty forty songs a night, three or four nights a week, I only have to sing.

For a minute and a half. Sure, let's get a little beers, Like.

It's so weird that it was only a minute and a half, Yet to audiences it felt like that was your whole week. It's really strange looking back on it, that it was such a fleeting moment and it would have been so easy to stuff up that minute and a half.

I remember thinking like afterwards, like, you know, people talk about you fifteen minutes of fame.

I actually calculated it.

I was like, it literally was fifteen minutes of singing time on stage. Wow, which is wild to be. What they didn't see probably a precocious, super inquisitive young kid. I think they sort of painted me a little bit as the boy next or maybe a party boy kind of guy, which I kind of was as well. So I spent the last three years singing in pubs. I didn't really have weekends. My weekends were working. So it's the first time I'd ever been in a plane before.

Am I doing here? It's like, I'm not going to win. So I just remember going I'm here for the ride.

What was it like to go on a show and develop this profile and then have people tell you who you are before you know who you are.

Yeah, I don't think it's healthy.

Every time I've gone and talked to kids at schools, like the performing out schools, whatever, I teach workshops and I get asked, you know, would you recommend my daughter or do you recommend me going on the show?

I was like, do you have a good sense of self? They're like, I don't know what that is? Is Like then no already.

So if you have self confidence, great, But I always talk about self worth, which is just knowing what your value is or your integrity or your reputation. Like, growing your self worth will lead to your self confidence. So you read more books or like listen to music and understand why you like these songs or understand why they resonate with you, which is really difficult to know all that stuff as a teenager. I don't think your brain

A sense of self, is it something that you have even going into something like Australian Idol and the years before that. When you're performing, do you experience any jealousy or competitiveness or comparison in the context.

Of no, not, okay, how this is weird. Not in the real world, but when I see it online.

Yeah, if I'm on my phone, then I feel a pang of jealousy or like foma or whatever. Wow.

So it's really strange.

If I see it just in the world, like I see like a performer before, like this is amazing, You're incredible. I never go I want to do that. I'm like, you are doing that, So that's okay, you are before.

That's fine. But like there's something about seeing it online. I have a weird reaction to it. Every now and again.

I kind of get that, Like if I'm seeing somebody in person and they're at their best, I have a weird sense of that's you. You do you, I do me, Whereas when I see something online, there's something about the flattened sense of reality where you're not really seeing the difference between who they are and who you are. You're just making kind of a snap comparison. Yeah, I totally get that. Weird, right, That's when I find myself feeling shit.

Yeah, yeah, I hadn't thought of that before.

Yeah, you asked me that question, But yeah, I think that's a strange phenomenon. Hence why I've maybe deleted Instagram in the last week and I'm having the best week.

I just I just don't care.

Not It's not like I don't care, but like, I've got a great job. You know, the marketing team is doing a great job with the Angeliette stuff. People know what I'm doing the show. At the moment, my life is literally get up, do some exercise, and go to the show.

A lot of people want to know how my day is. A lot of people don't want to know about my.

Day because you grew up without social media, you were just yeah, and because I'm very grateful that I grew up without it. Have you kind of seen how that, especially in your industry, how that plays with how you feel about yourself and feel about what you do.

Yeah, it's a really weird one because most artists, entertainers, or people have a creative people have a sort of creative flair, but we also have this weird imposter syndrome that comes with it.

It's like the double edged sword.

Maybe and I struggle with it at times to like, I love being part of the team. I grew up playing team sports baseball and cricket and footy, and Ozi RULs I should point out, and I love being part of the team. And a musical does that for me. Sometimes I'm the back pocket player, small bit parts. Sometimes I'm the full forward and being part of the teams are like I can't do my job without the lighting person. I can't do my job with that sound person. We're

It's just you.

Everyone is becoming their own brand and they see that's the only way to success these days, not so much this is the way to be famous, but this is the way to success. This is how you make your money, This is how you get free things, this is how you exist in the world. But like, is it because we still exist in the world world, Like, how does that skill set make them a better person or connect better with people? And I see it across the board that so many are doing that at connecting with people

I just yes, and I'm an introvert, but I think that idea of there's a selflessness that comes into play when you are a cog in a machine. I've noticed it in the workplace a little bit. It reminds me a lot of team sports. And I always say, I reckon you can tell people who played team sports and they were growing up because when you're in a team and you might say to somebody, hey, can you fill in on that shift, like because so and so sick?

Should point it.

It's the only job in the world where you finish a shift and someone goes someone it's the weirdest jealous I just clocked off people, I think many years ago, and I think I still think it's a good idea where you go out and give stanting ovations to people when they finish their job at the office.

Chairs, well done, well done. I deserve it. At the end of the day of parenting, if my daughter could just give me a round of applause before she goes to bed, that would be well.

Just put it on the screen, or like have a have a flash mob of people that just come with chairs.

They just get up with everybody.

Everyone deserves it. After the break, Rob tells us what happened after Idle when he performed at a concert I was incidentally at, and how getting the thing is not a recipe for happiness. We also chat about his frustration with the media's focus on his fleeing with a Hollywood celebrity. Everyone has something that helps them relax and go to

Well, I wouldn't say obsessed. The album only went gold, not not even golds.

There were a whole lot of people obsessed with you. How do you not turn into a complete nasist? How does that not totally?

You can tell you right now.

I've got two older brothers and older cousins, and we're a pretty tight knit family. Like I would say, my cousins are like brothers and sisters to me as well. So my oldest brother Chris, he's very good at keeping me grounded. He'd never let me get too big for my boots and just kept it real, I would say, sometimes to the point of like you can actually just give.

You some complience, like it's just some combam, it's to be nice. No, but that was really helpful.

There was a weird period though, where did I say my fame was lots, you know, during idle and I don't think he knew.

How to deal with that. You know, you have a dynamic with your sister or sibling or whatever, right one of you is more alfa.

You just sort of have the dynamic, right, And it was weird because I became the more popular person and I was like, oh, I don't sit well in this.

I'm a better kind of person right, Like, I don't know.

My personality, so I will fit whatever needs to be fit, kind of like Georgie where the pretzel, Right.

If you need a leader, I'll be your leader. But I'm a reluctant leader.

But I'm much happier being the wallflower, joky person right than.

The leader type.

Anyway, So that shifted for a while when I was sort of I don't know, knowing more about the world, but not knowing more about the world than my brother. And then it shifted back we started having kids, and then I was like, oh, great, you can now be the guy.

You could be the grown up.

You can be the grown up.

And now we've got to an equilibrium of equalness, which is great. We talk money, we talk kids, we talk all the adult stuff, which is really really helpful. But yeah, there was a weird period there which had to acknowledge, you know, years later with therapy. It was like, oh cool, cool, cool, that was what was weird, and we didn't really talk about it until years later and go on our brother walks and you know, oh, yeah, that was a weird time.

When you do have this really public success, I always think this really public success, I can imagine you go to like family gatherings and everyone's like, I saw you on the television and you're getting a whole lot of attention. Do you think it makes people around you feel like shit? Do you think it made your brother feel like shit?

Possibly?

No, he's pretty good at keeping in his strike. I think he was okay with it. I think it was kind of like he would always say, you're.

My younger brother. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not Mills's brother.

Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, Chris brother, which was always good at keeping it real. We talked about this in the past, and I think he's always been okay. Well, I think he's pretty proud, but yeah, the family gathering is a weird because also people ask you questions and you forget you.

Also have to ask questions, yep, yep.

And I think I went through a period of that where I just talked about myself and this is probably through my twenties early thirties and started getting therapy.

I was like, oh, you're not a good person.

Not a good person, but you know, like if you want more from people, you need to do the work.

It's weird because you're.

Constantly on all the time when you're doing a gig or post the show or like and then you're like, I've got an energy to I don't have any more to ask of anyone else.

It's weird with fame because people have kind of a shortcut. It's like a shortcut to intimacy. So people know a sort of surface level things about you, so it's like a fast track to ask you certain questions. And I notice it even with industry things, that it's really easy to go up to someone and say I heard you on a podcast and connect with them, and then you think, hold on, the person next to you is just as interesting as you and the plus one Yeah.

Exactly, all the plus ones out there bloody love you. Yes, and you do a lot of heavy lifting yes for the friendship.

And you think it's a bit dicky to kind of only talk to this person who you have this surface level of things that you know, did you find after idle you had that fame, you had that external success. Were you happier than you had been previously?

No, it was way worse.

Like if you don't have a good sense of self, you know, and everyone has this sort of an idea of who you are, and you're just floundering like, but you're.

Like, yeah, you're this party. I'm like, I'm really not.

And then you drink a lot and then alcohol is a depressant and then you're like, Okay, this is also not good either. I don't want to beat this party boy a very sad place to be. Also, no one knows who I am.

I don't know who am I.

That was when I had a pretty horrific moment of like, that was the very first time.

I thought about maybe just ended Robert, just end it.

In a hotel room in the Gold Coast at Indie Weekend after I got kicked the show, it was just terrifying, And remember calling my brother and just needed to hear a familiar voice and really not knowing what I just felt, but it was definitely a That balcony door was open.

And I ran to it.

I was like quickly slammed at shot and I was like, oh, this is a real panic.

Attack, this is real. Didn't tell my brother what had happened.

I just needed to hear his voice and he's like, yeah, I'm just said Indie having a good time, it's going great. Never again will I ever lie to myself or yeah, especially to my loved ones. That's why I called Georgie straightaway the other day. So it was a happier No, lots of things were happening, you know. We did a tour of like the country and all the bigger I went an amazing concert.

Right, it was so much fun. Great. I was like it was just all these kids, just it was so great.

We sold out Rod Labor, like not as many times as Pink, but then we had two sold out shows at Rod Labor. Yeah, we got paid two thousand dollars a night.

Amazing.

You would have been like eye rolling in it.

Oh my god, how much money did make off your path? Oh my god?

Have there been times where there's been negative attention on you and you've felt it in your day to day life?

Yeah?

I still feel like ack when someone mentions Paris Hilton, especially if I'm with.

Georgie or I'm just out.

I'm like, oh, this is over twenty years ago for someone I was with like a day, Like, yep, do you want to talk about someone that you were with in high school twenty years ago?

What is this for?

Even if it's like a congratulatory thing, I find that toxic.

Yeah, Yeah, there's like great.

And quite sexist, dehumanizing to her yeah yeah yeah, and.

Me and to Georgie, who's right here?

Yeah, that just always makes you go ah, yuck. And I think for a while I was like, who am I with that? It's like, I want to be someone. I want to be someone who's it, has a good work ethic. I want to be someone who performs, who entertains, who makes people laugh, it makes people feel good. That doesn't make me feel good, like I'm working towards making people feel good.

Why you why are you making me feel yuck?

Yeah, that's the only time, as I said, that happens very rare. It's usually like in pubs around blokes. Blokes, please read my book realize that this behavior is, yes, not great.

We often ask on this podcast about a time the world told you you'd be happy and you weren't. When you kind of hear that, are there any moments that come to mind?

I think this is just across the board for everyone, and it's definitely for me. When you do the thing, when you get the thing, you're going to be instantly happy.

You know.

Happiness is like sadness.

There's a fleeting thing that comes and girls, I was so happy when I got Wicked because it completely changed my life.

Right at the end of it.

I remember there's that article I made an interview about me finishing the show and was heading over to New York to go and do auditions, and the person that interviewed me hadn't even seen the show. Wow, I've done it for two years and the titles something about Paris Hilton, Rob might be catching up.

Like no, Rob, it's not catching up with her. He's not even seeing he's going to New York.

I remember, like I was meant to be so happy because I was finishing the show, like, and I was so sad.

I cried the whole day. It was my last day at work. I was like, what is happening?

Yeah, but going back to the I thing, like you will always think that you were going to be happier when you get the thing, but you're not. And that's okay, you are you should also Andally Georgie has been very good about this because I have always lived in a gig economy, so you do the gig and then you're looking for the next gig. Always She's like, you got to stop and celebrate the wins.

So when you do, like right, now we're in Anguliette. There's something fascinating about being on stage, the adrenaline rush you get, the being the center of attention, and then right now, for example, are you living on your own while Georgie's in Melbourne? Yeah, yeah, yeah, is there a bit of a calmdown?

Yeah, I'm pretty lonely at the moment.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.

Facetiming Georgia quite a lot, and then catching up with mates, but there has to be early mornings because a.

Lot of them go to work.

You can go catch up with someone on the weekend, but then you've got two shows on the Saturday and then you've got to so you need to like this is that I'm extroverted, so I do need outside energy from people energy vampire.

I'm not like that.

But then you need to conserve your own energy for the show because you need that for the show. So you need to make sure you're not talking too much because you need your voice to sing. It's a balance. I think this will be my last one for a while, just because of life circumstances, and I don't think I can do the distance again.

It's too hard.

Yeah, I've been in Singapore Perth and now Sydney, so for the better part of a year we've lived apart.

Is it tricky wanting to things at once? Because from the outside, yeah, it feels like you and Georgie are obviously two people who Georgie, for anyone listening, is a host on the project and is an established journalist in her own right, and both of you are very career focused, and your careers are in two different places. I can't imagine what that's like to navigate every decision knowing that

It's the and every psychologist will tell you this compromise. It's the common promise that you make with your partner. What is the common promise? What are the non negotiables or the negotiables? And do we need to schedule in time for us? What does that look like? Is it in a Monday morning, is it after the show on a Thursday night?

You know, what does that look like?

How much contact hours can we have do we need in order for us to maintain a healthy, lovely, sexy relate like we're still young enough to you know, like how do we do that bit of it as well?

Geordie said, do not talk about our sex. I think I shared way too much in the last podcast.

It's difficult, but yeah, it's writing your lists and scheduling your schedules, which is hard because we're both have schedules done for us, and then it's like, all right, what are our schedules? And that's yeah, that's sometimes tough because also she needs downtime and I need energy.

So so she's trying to relax and you're like, hey, hey, yeah.

And then we talked about this with my psych the other day, and I think this is really important for people who are doing long distance relationships or even just couples who can't spend as much time as possible with

So maybe that's that's all you need.

When did you know that Georgie was different slash that Georgie was the one?

I think it was like after a couple of dates, I was like, Oh, she doesn't like the thing that we're in, Like it doesn't not like it, it just is. It's not a I am not striving for more fame or celebrity or for more things. This is just part of my life, part of my job, and I love that.

And I was like, and.

You think deeply about things and you write it down and we talk about her like oh, and she sent me some books. She gave me some books to read while I was overseas. We started dating. I think within a couple of months.

I was on an overseas trip with a mate, which.

I was really planning on, you know, having a good time oseas, and I, god, damn, I've been a really good one.

She gave me on the Jellico Road.

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, and The.

Perks of Being a Wallflower and I read them on the trips, like these are very good books. Like it was the one the quote from Persiving a Wallflower.

We get the love we think we just yeah yeah, yeah yeah.

And I was like.

Round yeah, because if you think that you're not great, you know, deserve love, you're never going to get it, or we're going to get a yuck kind of love.

And I was like, oh, that's you. Yeah, I think that was it.

I was like, oh, I found her, I found it. I'm crying, thank you, thank you, thank you, so much for listening to part one of my interview with Rob Mills. In part two of this episode, Rob Mills talks about his relationship with TV presenter Georgie Tunney and gives us a sneak peek into their wedding planning. He also shares his thoughts on why it's so important for men to open up about their mental health, and reflects on his