Okay, so alive. Welcome back to the Magic Minds podcast. I'm Matt Bourke. You're watching and listening to the Liberties number one podcast. Yup the Liberties Yup the Flat. So we got through this series of Yup the flats. We had some amazing guests, Tony Mae, Maisie, Paul Kyo, uh who else, Andy? Jeez, we had some they were so brilliant we can't even remember them. Mick Flanagan. Mick Flanagan Mick Flanagan.
Fucking the ginger, doesn't matter. Mick Flanagan and then we had Leo Connor. Some amazing guests. I truly believe that uh we have some inspirational people in the flats. We got rave reviews about that series. So we're back to interviewing people with amazing stories, nearly back to where I started off. You know, I have a huge passion for people stories, specifically around trauma, grief, loss, how people survive after such events.
And on today's show I'm interviewing a local lad, friends of the show, friend of Andy, friend of myself, Darren Cranton. Darren, what's the crack, pal? How's it going, man? Absolutely honoured to have you on the show, buddy. Guys, I've asked Darren to come on the show. Darren has lost two kids. Dale was mortared, and then the passing of his daughter, Danielle.
This is going to be a difficult episode for me, for Darren to talk about it. You guys that are going to listen to it. So mind yourself when you listen to this. Mind yourself after. And if there's anything in here that triggers you. or brings anything up for peace getting please get in contact with us. We'll maybe point you in the right direction for supports or
Or talk to somebody in your family or your community. So that's just a a warrant to mind your little self'cause these conversations as much as I like to lean into the sharp edges of pain, I've done a lot of work round this so just be careful and gentle with yourself. As all interviews that I do now, uh there's no preparation. I I know some stuff around Darren's uh story with the with his kids, but I want to hear it force off. So look, wherever you wanna start.
Just tell us a little bit about life for you. Life's been difficult in the past couple of years. As you know, I was murdered in 2014. Absolutely, as a father, as a human being, I can't even imagine. what that's like. Do you do you mind sharing us around some of the details or whatever you want to share with the Well Dale was murdered in twenty fourteen, seven lads and one girl kicked him to death and
Tallet on the footbridge in Tallet on New Year's Eve. I was in work that night. Got a phone call the following morning saying Dale was in Balmouth near took a book, went out, Dave was in the office, take And uh the next day then just decided that was no activity, no brain activity and they decided to turn the machine off. It was devastating for everybody. Everyone, everyone Horrendous. It's a nightmare you never want to go through.
Yeah, yeah. And and here's the question, how did you get through it? What what was what was it like? Give us an insight to what life was like going through s something like that. Back then we kinda think it just blocked her out. We didn't think of pain or anger or anything like that.
Garamura delivery and then we had Danielle, we were just thinking to Danielle trying to get through it, just day by day, it was step by step. It wasn't just um instinct thought, just j just I had to get through it. Right. Yeah, like you know when the when the when the the the the pass of Dale, the the the court case and all that, like every year, every year since
with them getting locked up and every single year just one of them has got out. So every single year since they has passed and we've had a Dragged back up again. Between the court case was years later, then he got locked up. And then when he was locked up ever since that, every year every one of them got out. Now they're all out walking around now free. What did w so they all got done, gone to court. Tell us a little bit about that there. Well there was they all got from a year to seven years.
And then s that meant for the seven years then after Dale's passing we had torture of them getting out of prison every time. Getting a phone call or seen it on social media, they're out Why so why so little of a sent a sentence? Why a year till a seven year talk? The justice this country. Justice Murphy decide that's just a sentence they deserve. But at the end of the day the drag tail up and down that bridge dig more than
And they got sentence like that, it's just tremendous. How did they justify that? How do what was the what was the rationale for a year? What was their what was their their case, what was their defence, what was the the It's ridiculous. I didn't want to offer a new final. He said he hadn't got me, but he had got me.
Kangaroo caught over there. Yeah, there was talk about uh that Dale had a knife or something like that, wasn't there? Yeah, but it told out he hadn't, the transfer Dale hadn't. So Dale had cuts on his hand from holding from dragging a knife. Did he know any of these people or no knew none? He was wanting it back after a party, New Year's If Talavilla.
whatever happened one word left another they started chasing him chasing him over the footbridge he fell and when he fell they dragged him down the steps by his by his feet his head hit every step going down Jesus Christ.
It was all captured on CCTV, the whole lot. So we had to go and watch that and tell the police station before the trial because they reckon you have to see it because there's no point in looking at it in court to upset you too much. It should upset you every time you watch that.
So everything we're saying, then picking him up, throwing him on the ground, dragging him down the steps. We watched a whole lot of it was on CCTV. And then she still gave them that sentence even after saying it. Like she still took down words for how good they are. Mae'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'n rwy'. Ac yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna yna
Yeah. Yeah. No remorse. No, Jesus Christ. What what what kind of ex what kind of feelings, emotions, what was going on for you around that time, like seeing seeing your your child in this video and as a father Anger, frustration. We should not have been in the courtroom with them that family. We should have been separated from everybody else. Not saying that we're special to everyone else, but we should have been kept away from that family.
Yeah, th like human the humanic thing to do would be to put you through more trauma to to do that. Oh the court was a nightmare. Court was a nightmare. Listening to everyone's statement and having to watch everything and Going over everything. Was it like hearing it again and again and again and again? I had to stop from a couple of days going'cause it was just too much. I wasn't able to go every day. Yeah, you couldn't sit through it. I couldn't just sit through it.
Good family, good friends, that's basically. Yeah. Family, friends. Mostly family but Did you uh did you get counseling, support? I went to counseling for a couple of weeks, didn't really find it found it okay but Kind of a, I wouldn't say a loner, but like my own self, not to try to sort things out rather than trying to sort them with other people. But yeah, I did go, I tried it because I went a bit off the head.
It's just a family basically. Yeah, when you say after head you might ask and just drinking running and mocking, you know. Usually just trying to avoid the trying to avoid the pain, yeah. Yeah, true. I mean a good partner as well, so she kinda reins me in, so we say. How how were you treated by the the police, the guards, how was how was that fit? Well the guard in in question was a guy called Carol Claim.
And he was the other officer, he was the resting officer, he was the main officer. And another officer, I see if I get his name out, and they all said to me, Please don't do it and please please, leave it to the police, put put faith in the justices. So the day I heard it, they all just looked at me and went, what can I do, I'm sorry. I'm really, really sorry.
I said, look, it's not yours a fault either. You s they tried everything to get them into custody, they tried everything and every every door they opened the judge slammed it back in their face. She literally done What I I'm still trying to get my head around that. Why? I don't know. I really don't know what. I really don't know why she saw justice fit to get them there. And you see one punch victims and all, it's just stupid, you know? Yeah. But the sentence they got wasn't right.
So it's not as if everyone was making it up. Yeah, like she would have saw what was going on. In the beginning when I heard that many people don't know I don't know, was as a father you'd like to think someone was gonna pick up your son. Yeah. So I thought with that many people there
One of them had to try to stop the other fella from kicking. Which is natural. If you were with a gang of people out drinking and someone was kicking someone in the head, you'd stop that other fella from doing it. I'd try it anyway. There wasn't any of that. There was none of that. They all just jumped. And they were pushing each other aside to kick him. Yeah, to my pushing you to the side. Were they was there not the excuse in this, like were they, you know, drunk, drugs?
I'd say both you'd have to be. No, that's not excusing the behaviour and there's no excuse for just like a wo you wouldn't do it to an animal. If you'd done it to an animal, you'd be locked up for the RSBCA. And there was no there was no there was no grievance with him, there's no history, it was just a random attack.
Just some fellow he was out with his girlfriend. He wasn't even out with his girl, he was he was out with his girlfriend earlier on, yeah. Yeah. And uh just same and had just attacked. Yeah. Well, they were known to do this in that area, you know what I mean? Ah, right, so they just hang around with any of those boys, they jump on them? Bullies. Was there an appeal or anything like that? Like, was the... The fella who got the seven, yeah, he appealed it, he said he got too much.
Yeah, he said he got two. Was he done from manslaughter? Manslaughter. He got seven years. What did the other lock yeah? What what were they giving? I have it all but down um from a year to from a year up to seven. But what was that just uh Do y'all got ten, yeah? All of them got ten. But then she's saying, like, do I get jobs? Do I go and get probation? Anyone can do that.
I'm woke in the past year. Oh well they give him two years less. Yeah. But they got ten times mandatory ten for manslaughter and then it's down to the judge to see fit where everyone else Takes off the biggest. So if he had a kid he'd get a year off, you had two kids you get two year off and go to base probation you get another year off. Before you know it, you're five year off, you're tenure. That means you're only doing probably four.
'Cause the privation in this country are to leniency here as well. Yeah. Unreal, isn't it? How did how did you just wait? So what happened tell us about the appeal. What was the Well he only appealed, he went to court and uh he got I think he got a year or ye to year and a half off. Because the others got less than him, he said that they were the same as him. But he was the ringleader. He was the one that picked them up and dragged them down. There was two of them in particular.
None of them even had any remorse. You could see it in them. And they're all out now? They're all out now. They're living their lives. We're not. No. There's birth to the 14th of August. Every 14th of August. Absolutely. Don't get me wrong, you think about my day. Every single morning you wake up you think of Dave and yeah. That's it that's what I was gonna ask you. D is di is there ever is there ever like a a gap, a peace, a quiet no. No.
Do you only get a quiet one it'd be if you're say you go for a point with your friends or something? Rydw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw i ddw
You know, you'd say to yourself, well, that should be there. Marked events like Christmas, birthdays, twenty four. How old would he be now? Twenty seven. Twenty twenty when he died. Yeah. Twenty one that year. So we didn't even get twenty four swim. Right. I'll never get to see grandkids. Never get to see...
And that's on your mind day and night, day and night. Day and night. And then as we know, when I work in brain injured, I work in trauma, that doesn't just affect you, that affects your brother, your ma, your your partner. It affects everyone,'cause some days you have good days and you have bad days. And the bad days is when everyone else gets a bad pace.
And then they they are in bad humour'cause you're in bad humour. Yeah, I was only saying this to Andy, you know, we were talking about Gio and I says, I'm sure there's bad days And there's really bad days and then there's days that there's not bad days and really bad days. It's just one of them days. So I don't think it's all sunshine. No. You never really get a good day anymore. It's just is not as severe as the day before. Yeah, well they say time heals all we once put.
There's not enough time at the moment though. You you talked about, you know, uh leaving it to the justice system. Was there ever a point where you wanted to take it into your own hands and every day when they're over there to looking at them, every day when they're over there looking at them and they're laughing and joking and sneering, you know, it's kinda
bitter, you know, it's very hard for you to look at. How did you stop yourself? How did that how did you'cause every police over there stood in front of him. All the police made sure to stand around you. You know even to this day does that s does that still harbour inside you, is there's still anger? Oh, there's a lot of anger. The anger never go away for the likes of them. I'll never forgive them. As I said yet before, they took they haven't already took tails like they took hairs.
It took my whole family's life. Yeah. Like it affects my brothers, it affects everyone. Partner. It affects everyone. Absolutely. Absolutely. Did the did a family ever did you speak to them? Was there any apology? Was there any No remorse over anyone? No remorse. There was, they were one out of one. I forget a letter now, I forget, actually I could look her up and looked up the card response. One of the letters, they read, they read, I'm sorry if I don't let the dial.
Not even a sorry to the crying family or To put it in grammarically. I'm sorry for doing it and I didn't mean to do it. The stuff you written there was just mad. Like I'm sure the solicitor should look at it and go And did he not like check it? No, that's it. Does it not does it not go through him? I thought it was Did he read it out? No, the Oh, he did read it out, yeah. I think he did, yeah.
Yeah, you'd imagine it would have been, but no. He let it go through. Absolute shit show. Yeah. The whole lot of it was. It's an absolute joke. I still can't get my head around the George. Yeah. You know, like how did they think this was okay? Like these obvious as you said, the videos. Well she said she had looked over on the weekend on the weekends before sentencing, she had spent the weekend looking over all these evidence and all this stuff and all
So I think they'll sell they are drinking the glass of wine looking at this. Looking at what sentences they're gonna give them. But she's not looking at those in court, like his mother is father, family again. Birthdays, Christmas, they'll have kids, christenings, communions. We'll never have any of that. Never. And as I said to you earlier, you'll always think of them things. Always stupid things you'll think of. There's no release from it. There's no getting away. No. And as you said, and...
Few few points helps to ease it a little bit and it numbs it somewhat. But then as you say you'll see what's going on, not to drink. Yeah. And even when you're out having a point you're you're you're you're triggered by people in the in the pub, you know, whether they're celebrating or who did he support as a football team as you're watching. Are you a pool supporter as well? Jesus, that's all right. Uh did you find any support
From people in our own area, from around here that have lost children. No, I don't know. Not to say it's not p you know. But I find a lot of people from around didn't know what to say. They just kinda turn their head when they say it and they don't know what they really don't know what to say. It's not that they don't want to talk to you. Yeah. It's just they don't know what to say. And the people that you would be close to turn around and say to you, okay.
I don't know what to say to you. It was like they were avoiding me. Of course, of course. I probably don't understand myself. And I'd always get people saying, look, you're always on me mind. I'm always... And even the girls from Shannon's Hopeline, Lisa and Sandra, you know, and the passing of uh Shannon, you know, they say that people cross over the road, you know, people that they know to avoid'em not to speak it.
Oh, you find that. Yeah,'cause'cause you know, g standing s or sitting or standing taunt to you, they're going to be faced with pain. They're going to be looking at your pain and it's hard to hold for people. Yeah. I mean, you know what that's like now and the vibe is to lose a family member
It'd be a little easier for you because we have something in common. People like, I don't know what to say to'em dee. They feel if I but you just don't know how to express it. I find that though an awful lot. Yeah? Only family behind the ones that And then even at some point the family look at you go, I don't know what to say.
I really don't know, so I don't know what you're out to know. Because they're I truly believe that people are they're so wanting to help that they don't know how to help and then they're just they're just stuck. But as you know yourself, there are no words that can ease the pain. A pain is going to be there no matter what to say or do. What would help?
I don't know. I really I'm I'm I I really don't know. Do you find it awkward as well when people come up and talk to you as well? Not so much now as what I did in the beginning. But I don't think anything would help. The pain is there and that's it. As you say, but nothing nothing'll help. If they got life it wouldn't help.
Det vil ikke hjælpe, men de har lyfet. De var alle knyttet af en bus til morgen. Det vil ikke hjælpe. Det vil ikke hjælpe. Det vil ikke hjælpe. Det vil ikke hjælpe. Det vil ikke hjælpe. Did you feel did you feel guilty? As a father, you know, I know he was up there and you were down here that you didn't protect them or was there was there guilt, shame that you've lost that bit of guilt like I I was saying that I was finished I was walking in drunk holding that night down to walk.
And I finished work, I think about two, half, two. And I was driving home from Drunk Honduras, had the car parked over there, so I drive home. I didn't have to drink around. And I was kinda always said to myself, if you would have rang me and said, Dad, look, I'm in a bit of bother here, can you drive up to the village to me and get me? I would have drove up. Instead I drove home and had a drink in the house down with a grin. It was half think about half two and a grin. Three even.
And uh I'd always say to myself, if you would have rang me, I was driving, I wasn't even drunk that night. No norm, you don't know you would have been out for the bells, you would have had a few drinks. Yeah. Just know you happened to be woke.
So it would have been sober and I could've picked them up. So there's loads of them if maybe. Loads of ifs and butts in your head, loads of ifs and butts. Does that keep running over and over again like a train? Yeah. Ruminating, thinking, what if, dah, dah, dah. Loads of what if loads of them. Yeah. Full of what?
Full of them. Just keeps choring and choring and chawing and chawing and chawing and chawing The last day I seen him I think it was Stevens the day you came down and I actually dropped him home then and I went to work then I didn't work all that Christmas. I spoke to him since on the phone. Even that night I text him Happy New Year, Padley says same to you that I have it as a tattoo on my leg there.
Right. Because it was the last phone call, the last text I ever got on my leg there that was a tattoo. There's stuff like that. And the conversations, does that bring you some ears? Does it Some days talking about them helps a little bit, tell you the truth. The bit of ears. And then other days whatever's in their mind you just you can't talk. Yeah. You know, some days you can open up and some days you can't.
It depends on your whatever humour you're in. Yeah, true. Did you ever think about starting a support group or did you attend any support groups or fathers and no. Like even this process is this like this is hard. This is extre extremely hard as well. Yeah, it's it's hard for me and I can only imagine what it's like for you. Yeah, this is hard.
in order to when you talk about it you're gonna bring the feelings up and the emotions up and it's like experiencing again, like what you said, watching them videos. It's like you're replaying and replaying and replaying it. I would have loving how to do pieces with a guy in uh Paul Heaney and a star. I tried to get the video footage for him. I'd love to put it into the style and let people view it themselves.
And let that judge be judged for what she does. And can you not? I've tried, I'm gonna try again again. I'd love to put it in. Like say for instance you go onto a website and the stars pay So it's down to every individual if you wanted to look at it. Do you have the piece? No. Or you're just trying to obtain the superintendent has it. And can you not get that often? Well I was I was told after they were all out I caught
So the superintendent's gone now that told me that. So I'll have to reopen the whole case again and try to get it back. And are you going to do that? I want to try ya. I'd love to do it. I'd love for everyone that looks yourself or Andrew. Just to sit and look at it and go, Well, how did that judge see fit to get him two years after doing that? My stomach is torn and even the thoughts of having to watch that video. So I can multiply that by a couple of million for you.
To sit there and watch that? Well yeah, they said you had to because when you go to court, it was played over and over and over in court. So if you're sitting there, now a few of the family members had to go and walk. But I'd love for other people to say it to let them see what he went through and then for her to turn around and go, Well, no I think I deserve this.
People do less and go up and get tidier. Yeah, absolutely. And I'm sitting here going like how do you sleep at night? How does that judge? Like how do you how how is a p like I work in in trauma and I work in as a professional. How is a professional? eccoci lie at night and go, I got that right. But does she do does she honestly think that's I I it just sound it was what bro it sounds it sounds dodgy. Yeah, well, do you do you think it's a bit dodgy?
Well when they got the sentence I says, I wonder if anything related to the fucking the judge or something, you know something. Like I can't accuse anyone of that or that, but to me it just sounds rope, it smells smells fishy. Yeah. Like Especially with it being a video. Especially with the video. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny. Rydyn ni'n gwneud hynny.
Jesus. It's really inconsistent, isn't it? Like the whole judicial system, like it's And then you have another fella put a robbing a loaf of bread or something and milk and he get a year or two years, he gets the same sort of woman that I get. Like it's not bad enough that you you lose your son, mortared, and then having to deal with that. You know, the the inequality of that. Yeah, well as I say it was it was up and they got sentences up.
But still it wasn't changed. No. I thought the DPP would have brought it back and said no it's not right, but they never even bothered. Did she get moved or did that happen or she's still over there? Så jag vet inte, kanske jag fick den videon. That's crazy, isn't it? Yeah, but that's that this is why I wanted the video for people to see it.'Cause when they see it you go to self
Hell like how you're saying what I'm saying, so how are you justifying that? How'd she rationalise that? I don't know. As I say, like probation reports and they have kids and they're getting jobs and so if you get an apprentice so you can be You can get off for it. I know I remember a mate of mine, he lives around who he's not made anymore, but he was uh a drug dealer when I was doing my shady dealing, but he was in court.
And d the thing got it adjourned. She was doing sentencing delay on. I went out and I rang someone that I know to give me a letter to say that he's starting a job there. I went off to a printer, I printed her off and he was due to get three years for for a load of gear he had. And she suspended the sentence because of this letter. Yeah. And it was just a bullshit made up letter now. Yeah. That was ten years ago. Like Well if you remember ten years ago people used up to the local pre
Besides, the priest gave us a letter to Father Creek. I couldn't tell you where wrong. Which? The local priest was giving a letter years ago. What? Yeah? He counted the court too. Jesus Christ. And that counted for something because he was a pillar of the community. But now it doesn't because obviously over the years...
Yeah. No. Yeah. Away you go. But it's the way it is and that's what they do. They played the game. They played the system. It's terrible, isn't it? It's just fucking shocking, isn't it? Played it, they played the system. Yeah. Yeah, it I just can't get my mind out. And then if that wasn't bad enough, uh, Darren, uh your daughter Danielle. Danielle's been gone through a lot of her own personal issues. Right.
Danielle was she had her own little demons in her head. Right. And uh Danielle decided to take a life trade in October. Gone. I'm not doing the right things right now but I don't know, I'll never know. But I reckon Dale's factor was a big factor in Danielle.
family splitting up, things like that and all. She just there was a lot of things going on in the political girl's life and Look, it's never one thing, is it? It's usually an accumulation of it. Accumulation, yeah, but I think the main factor was Dale. Didn't feel she wanted to be here, the demons kicked in. Right. She let her feelings take over.
Never let your feelings take over your mind. Your mind is what tell your feelings what to do. Right. If you gr wake up in the morning, go on to work, your feelings will hell ya ring in day and guests, ring in sick day, we lie on for another hour. Your mind will tell you now grow up, come on to make money.
So don't let your fail feelings overrule your mind. Wow. And she always struggled with mental health difficulties. She but I always struggled but she wouldn't have been the strongest when it came to mental health. She had our battles. Yeah. She had demons. We all have demons, but it's learning how to control the demons. Yeah, absolutely. Jesus Christ, I can only imagine what that was like for you, for whore. Um
You know, people say, you know, after you know, losing children and how do you go on, did you d has it ever crossed your mind how will I go on or or do you know what I don't want to go on? Well well some t see basically I wouldn't have the balls to do what to hear the through.
It's something I wouldn't have the balls to do. Now maybe if a demon came into my mind, it's a different story, but for now I haven't got it. Right. I don't have them demons, lucky enough I don't have them. But people in Lobosmoop say, How do you do it? How do you carry on? How do you do it and how do you carry on? I want to know that. No, no, it's just a daily thing. You grow up, you go to work. It carry on. Have you always been like that? Was that always your attitude in life?
I'm not going for crippling and criminal scrum, you have no choice. Where's that come from? Where did you b where did you get that from? What do you attribute that to? Yeah, look, I I I truly believe that this area has given me so much resilience. I have a lot of trauma as well in my life.
But it's also taught me a lot of resilience, uh, strength, character, personality call, whatever you want it. I I do attribute to being from here. Do you think that's a big factor? I think it's a big factor for being from here. Yeah. Everyone around here's just corrupt grammar. No one sits and cries about things, just you get up, put the breakfast on and shut up. Go for a point. Yeah. Yeah. You know stupid things like
God gives us b hardest battles to the strongest soldiers. Is that something that you practice it were you interested in religion or No, not me, you know, we we're all altar boys now, in fairness, meet street and small, you know, but I don't think you ever wanted to pursue the career after that. Yeah, I hear what you are saying. But, look, I don't know. I don't have an answer to tell you, like, how do you grow up in the morning? How do you not?
That's what I'm saying. What do you do? Don't get me wrong thinking about the LDL. There's not a morrow they don't wake up thinking why they're showing in the bedroom with their ashes in it, in the wardrobe, and if I ever want them they're there.
I know it could be a bit heart wrenching for other people but No. I used to have them in the sitting room but every time someone came in, every single time someone come in they go, Ah, look at them So I moved them into the bedroom and I built a little press for them, their own little pr shrine basically.
stuff people give me over the years, you know, dialing that. Yeah. And I just put them in there and then then when I want them I go to them.'Cause as I said I couldn't deal with the grief of every every single time someone came in. Someone comes in for a drink and then last orders in the pub and we all go back to the house.
Yeah, yeah. I'm not listening to this now we've leaded time. And here's the thing and I've noticed this and I heard this uh and just talking to me Matt tonight about this very same subject, you then did you then feel like you had to mind people? Like you know, like you're going through your trauma, then they see it and then they start falling apart and crying and Well sometimes you would but not all the time, you know what I mean? It's just no one really shows the weakness now.
Ze zeggen altijd, je hebt genoeg genoeg genoeg genoeg genoeg genoeg genoeg genoeg. Sound with you. Like that dump and that shit on you, knowing that you're going through enough stuff. No, no, everyone always tells me, no, look, you've had all the trouble. Don't be worried about mine. Everyone says that. Wow. My whole family has had it. Yeah? Yeah. I have enough, don't be worried about it.
Really? Yeah. You say it to me, you know what I mean? As I just said earlier, we have a good death, we have a bad death. Now we have more bad than good, but that's the problem. But, look, the ground and barely have no choice. Don't have to go around and jump the lippy. Yeah. Fucking hell, it's bleeding scruffy and it's freezing. Yeah, uh saying it's myself and I want to take my life by suicide and my make goes, Y you just want the paint to stop and I says, Yeah, I do actually.
And he goes, Plus he says, You don't like the cold and the chances are you won't die straight away and it's gonna be fucking cold in there. I was like, Ah, not gonna jump in there then so But uh No, as I said earlier, it's not really a thing I have at the moment. I don't have them demons. Look, five years now, you could have the demons in five years. And you could have the demons in five years. For now, I don't have them.
Yeah. And you as you said, you were on the gargle and you just pulled the plug on that, you didn't still have a few gargles in the game. I I don't mean that you give up, but I mean but you stop going bananas on it and Yeah, you don't you don't just ease up a bit and control yourself. She wanted to go, he didn't want to. So I have one side of dealing med trauma and one side.
'Cause it's two different two different type of things. He didn't want to go. Right. Dale would have been still here at nine everyone. Yeah, tell us tell us a little bit about Maxley. Tell it like what he was like. Funny, funny. Lively, bubbly, never sat easy. I was up there or something. Not like Sean, he's not fucking very funny.
Lighting up a party, see. Good bit of crack. Yeah, good bit of crack at the party, yeah. Deadly. But, Danielle was very quiet. Very quiet. You could put Danielle in the room, she wouldn't talk. You could put Danielle in the room, she wouldn't talk.
You know, the talk talking cheese like but they go on great. Well they didn't really go on great but they dig in their own way, you know. Yeah, yeah. Just like siblings, you know, I mean they look out for each other but then fucking want to kick the head out of each other. Like years ago when you'd be watching Delph if you couldn't watch Delph together.
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Kids being kids, isn't it? Yeah. Ah yeah, brothers and sisters are like there, aren't they? Just fucking they kill anyone if they touch them, but they kill each other as well. Yeah. That's the way they wear them. Yeah. Uh There's another question I wanted to ask is to slip in my mind. You have a cycle coming up for Shannon's Hope line and Yeah, Darren Gray is Tell us tell us a bit about that work. Darren Gray was doing a cycle for his dad. His dad committed suicide there a few years ago. Um
Sabrina rang me and said it to me, I said I wouldn't mind my partner. If Darn had let me uh jump on board with'em. A few sponsors, I think Shannon's Hope Line I think is one of the best places around here. Rydyn ni'n ei wneud. Rydyn ni'n ei wneud. Rydyn ni'n ei wneud. Rydyn ni'n ei wneud. Rydyn ni'n ei wneud. No, I'm not fitting with the cycle as you know. Alvy, Sean, and Derek is doing it. Well they said he'll do it, so we'll see what happens. It's a big cycle.
It's a big kind of put onto someone. Where is it from? Dublin to Kirkenny? The top of s to Kelly's Bridge there. Not at Kelly's bridge there. It's a long cycle. So I'm gonna drive in the van and every ten K we'll stop and we'll have a bus. How many have you got going on it? I think it has forty so far. Right.
You'd have to have fifty ones. Andy, you ready to get your three wheeler out? And he's shaking his head there. I'll learn the same. So I said I'll just I'll bring the water, I'd set up a say a table every ten, twenty keg. Yn ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud ymwneud
Rydyn ni'n llawer yn ffwrdd. Rydyn ni'n ffwrdd. Rydyn ni'n ffwrdd. Rydyn ni'n ffwrdd. Rydyn ni'n ffwrdd. Rydyn ni'n ffwrdd. Rydyn ni'n ffwrdd. Children's hostel now I'll be jumping in the van. How much have you raised or what are you hoping the raised are? I'd say over 10 grand, that's how you're hoping. What have you raised so far? I'm not sure though. I think that's my science as a good bit. Do you have a GoFundMe page? Do you have a sponsor, the sponsor card?
Knocking around at people's door where the pencil get the sponsor and just rub it out. Do you remember that years ago? Uh yeah, yeah. Yeah, they do amazing work, don't they? Like in the area like grassroots mental health support and yeah, and again it's true it's true trauma. Like they have experienced the the loss of Shannon and out of that it's the as I call them, they're like alchemists, they've torn lead into gold. Yeah. Do you find doing um
This kind of work, this work that you're doing there. This is the first thing I've done so far. This will be the first one I've done. Does it help? No, not yet. Fucking do you know I I love your honesty. No, not yet.
I love it. I was I was I was expecting you go, Yeah, yeah, yeah, fuck it, dad and you were like no, it doesn't. It's shy. Like it's like No, it's fucking no, it's uh deadly I I love that. No, it's not it's not helping. It's fucking I'm doing it'cause it's a good thing to do and other people. It's far shannon as we know. It's called Hoss and
If it raises money for Shannon's headline, I'll just vote it, but no, it's not helping me at the moment. A lot of all sorts. Danielle's anniversary isn't even up yet. Danielle will be passed on the 21st of October. The cycle is on the 22nd. Just the way things were planned out. It's like it was planned.
Yeah. So be see only a year on the day we'd be down there. Passing that before anniversary and we're down there. And what do you do on though? What what do you have a certain thing do you do on those events like whether birthdays or Christmas? What do you do specifically on them when you're how do you prepare for them? Like why am I snap listeners audience gonna be listening? You don't prepare, all of a sudden you're just sitting there, you remember Jesus next week.
We could go through a stage of putt counting how many months Danielle's gone. Yeah. Yeah. Daniel Estelonium. Right. You know, so Danielle is still very, very raw. Danielle hurts me still. Danielle hurts me more than that. But Danielle hurts me more because she's... Only gone. It's like a cycle, you know what I mean? It's like since since two thousand and forty no you have not got a break. Rhywng. Rhywng. Rhywng. Rhywng. Rhywng. Rhywng. Rhywng. Rhywng.
So every single year since fourteen we've had tragedy. Yeah. W w b before the the the passing of uh Danielle Tager on life Were you worried about that? Did di did you ever have them fears that she might do it? Did you think a couple of years ago, yeah, but not now. Not n not leading up to I didn't know, I hadn't a clue. Right. 한글자막 by 한효정
I was never told, I didn't know, I didn't know what was going on. Right. Danielle didn't make sure to come down here to me, she'd hide everything, you know, I was never told. Because you'd only get to see her on weekends or wherever. And she again obviously didn't want to be troubling you with the shit going on. And Danielle would be like me, she wouldn't be...
Great mind. She was a head accountant. Really? Yeah. Great job and all. It's it's just it just blows your it blows your mind, doesn't it, to to think that she wanted to end her life. And yeah, and people, you know, y you would perceive Are doing so well, I sure sure she's a head accountant, she has this, has that what would you be worried about? What have you to be c complaining about? Sure grand.
You know, and then you're you're giving out'cause you've a job and you fell out and a a career ahead ya. And you're only young. Hey, you've got the whole your whole life head of had you kids? No. I've no grandkids, none. Right. Oh yeah, sorry you said it to me. So nothing. I've no more. It's mad to think that. But something we always look forward to, you know. My granddad was always good to us, so it was like something we wanted to do for mine. Yeah, and then that's been taken away from me.
So yeah, it is raw. Raw as fuck. For someone or family's going through a similar position like you. What c if you can, what kind of what could you what kind of words of wisdom could you offer them? What could what could help what's I just try I don't know, it sounds mad but put it into the back of my brain it says that maybe one day it'll come out.
I'll end up bleeding hospital sick or something, but for now it's at the back of the briar. Just push it down, push it back. I haven't dealt with them, I haven't dealt with them. Maybe it's the wrong thing to do, I don't know. Other people could be crying all the time or but mine just goes to the back of the brain and I leave it there.
It's what you Now, as I said to you earlier, morning noon and night it's not a day goes by that I don't think a day anything. Yeah, like when people hear that I push it to the back of my mind and It's not the case, but you're not getting rid of it. I'm not pushing them aside. I'm pushing the pain of them aside. I'm pushing the pain of them to the back of the brain. I'm not pushing them. I was the greatest, you know, that game years ago, bopping.
Bop it. So I was a world m master bopping my feelings. Get down there, not listen to that, not listen to you. Get down, get down, get down. It's just just not ready just not ready to process it yet. Not ready. Like as you just says you're raw as fuck. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? You're still raw and it's just it's just it's so it's like as as uh uh Irving Yallum, a famous uh psychotherapist, it's hard to just stare into the sun.
You're in the pain, like you were going through trauma. Do you know what I mean? So Well, that's what I do, as I say, is d just thought of a hot blank damn I never will. No. But with your feelings and your emotions, you're just not ready to deal with that, yeah? No.
Maybe it's just there's a there's probably a counselor out there that you could possibly work with or find uh you know, someone that could help. I don't know. I haven't haven't looked down that road yet. N not yet. No. I'm not saying I won't, but for now I haven't. Tried it, didn't work and look I am where I am now.
It's just about like any kind of tragedy or trauma or difficult period in your life. It's about just and who was I taunted late in the job today? It's just like a success is just one foot front of the other sometimes, isn't it? Yeah. It's just waking up that's moral. I just I just think I I get that Andy and I just think
Time. Like like you know, time is a healer, time is something else. All of us need more time. And that and then and here's the thing, you you can't just you can't rush these things. You know, people say, Oh, you should go do your counts that you'll go when you're ready. You'll do when you're ready. You know, you're you you are doing I truly believe you're doing the best you can right now with what you have.
Like you know what I mean? And then when you get to another point you'll do whatever you need to do right then. And as I said, I have a partner there that'll write me in anyway. Right. So I remember her as a kid when we were growing up. No better than the hook. Takes no shit. No, that's what I'm saying. So Takes no shit. So she'll she wouldn't let you away. I actually I actually remember you were in the we were in the fountain one day uh good few years ago. And we were in the Monday Club.
And I think you got dragged out. I don't I don't drink the Monday Club. Not anymore, you probably don't but you fucking did me and my mate D Collins are India Fountain and uh you were there having a few points. awake bender awake bender and i think i might come in then and i think i got dragged out Dem Dem's where the day is. Bring back the fountain, yeah, yeah. Andrew knows she always be shuss. She what? We had a joke last week, I think.
On what? I put up Sabrina, won't let me out so she hit me. Are you in a WhatsApp group? He was, I'm on fire, where are we going? I got the one that Kevin Bardy reunions with who's Kevin Barry? Dead Oh the comedian. No dead IRA fucking Republican right then. Oh okay. I didn't know this. The statue won't veil veiling at him. So I'm gone with them but he had up, he was in having a point on it Monday. It's our running joke.
It's not a running joke'cause I've no shills. Come here. What's the one thing you'd like people to take away after listening to this interview and listen to your story? Eh. I don't know, it was probably a life-harter tragedy. As I said in the beginning it's good family, good friends, that's what you need around you. And that's what's bringing each other to tunnel. It's like they're all the driving the training and I'm coming through it. They're the ones driving and trying each other.
Uh yeah, I I've I'm not doubting that and I think it's fucking fantastic. But after spending I've never spent this amount of time with you before and hearing you talk and your attitude and your Your determination, you're a fantastic human being. Uh your attitude like your I know people are saying you're bopping down your feelings, but
No, not Papin, I have feelings. Don't get me wrong, I've more feelings than anybody else. But I mean I just you your strength of character, your resilience, your you know, I'm not saying you're denying your feelings and emotions, I just think you're an incredibly strong human being. And I think you're You're probably helping your family through more than you know, we either as well, you know. But they all took a hard, you know.
What do you think about it? Like even doing this, like even coming out with your daughter and past not so long ago, the that's hard that's the hardest one. Yeah, like I mean that that that That takes serious courage and resilience and you know, the fact that you says that we or what did you say it was a cracker? Why would you not carry on or how do you not carry on? How do you get on and you know how do you not? Yeah. Like how do you not get up and lace your boots in the morning and keep going?
See that you say that f like so flippantly. Other people don't do it. For you and I. Yeah, when you wake up in the morning it's bright out, you get up. Yeah. Some people don't heat from your hair and get up to walk. Brush your hair. He has no house, don't we? Yes. It is incredible. Some people don't. They just give up. They go and they guard. Exactly. You don't do these things. You went on the battery and you had a few points a while ago.
to get you through a tough period of the tunnel as you call it. And now you're fucking Hopefully now it's gonna start coming out. Yeah, but you've got an incredible resilience and incredible attitude. Your attitude is phenomenal. You know no you know no different. Yeah we're survivors. Survivors back to Meat Street again. We're survivors back to the liberties. Back to the liberties.
Other people are spoiled growing up and they feel that the world owes them something. The world doesn't owe you anything. No. The world owes you nothing. It's down to you to take you out of the world what you want to offer. No one's going to come along and hand you a job. No one's going to come along and feed you. So you go out and make your whole money feed yourself. So here's the thing and I done a workshop recently where I did
the name of the or the the the title for the workshop was Nobody's Comin' to Fucking Save You. Yeah, that's exactly No one's coming to Save You Eddy? No. No, even not even God. You gotta ask. And actually I put up a post about this and somebody was giving out to me'cause he said, Jesus is coming to save you, this Jesus loving person and I was like, Look, you have to ask you.
It's why we had your door, you know what I mean? It's it's not you have to ask, you have to be wanting. You have to go out and make your own. Yeah. Like if you fell into the liffy, in order for you to save it, someone's gonna throw you a boy and you have to take it. You have to t you have to grab it. You have to grab the help, you have to ask for the help. You have to do it yourself. You know, y yes, as you say, my family, my friends, my community, we work together, it's a collaboration.
But they're not gonna come kicking in your door and dragging you out to help you. Everyone helps out if you in the beginning. Everyone helps it in the beginning. When a tragedy is a tragedy. Anyone dies belong to you, you have everyone around you. So once they're buried and that's it, a week later you sit in the house and you're all looking around going
Changes this time last week I had fifty people around me, this time this week I've known. Well I always have people around me, don't get me wrong. Yeah, but you know it I know I I get what you mean. But I mean other people, you know, you don't you don't know. The only way hell of it is, get up and fucking carry on. Yeah, I'll try.
I personally don't have any demons. I don't believe I have an anyway. Maybe they are there and they're trying to pick away at my brain at the moment, I don't know. But for today I haven't got any demons. For today. For today, yeah. And that's what this is all about, Darren, isn't it? Day by day. Day by day. you feel like you wanna be out this world damn team within ya you're gonna be over. Nothing's gonna save you.
Look, uh honestly I I'm I feel privileged to sit here and do this interview. Uh thanks very much. Thanks for your courage, your honesty. Your honesty was deadly. Uh yeah, just and sharing your pain with me. uh in service of our community, not just the geographical one, the liberties, but people all around the world that listen to a show from here to America.
Like that's inspirational'cause these skills that you talk about, these get up and go, get on with the attitude, this is transferable to anything in life. Whether it's a career, whether it's a trauma, grief, hobbies. No. Same skill set. It's just an this is an attitude, you know. Yeah. People say to me, How do you do that? And I says, Well I don't know any other way not to do it. A guy was struggling the other day.
Och jag sa, vad ska jag göra, ska jag ställa i beden? Nej, jag kan inte göra det. Jag har inte kämpat. Jag har inte kämpat. Jag har inte kämpat. Jag har inte kämpat. Jag har inte kämpat. Jag har inte kämpat. Ja, dus never let your feelings rule your head. Ja. Never let them, want when they start ruling your head, you won't be going to work on Monday morning, you'll be going to film.
Get get the felting back home. We know the new owner, John Foodie. Uh we're hoping to do an interview with him. Listen uh Darren, you're an absolute Deadly human being. I wish you well. I send you prayers, love, kindness. I know you're not a a god lover like myself. I'm adding to the Jesus. But uh uh I send you love and kindness to you and your family. Thanks, thanks a lot, and I really appreciate it. Uh fucking phenomenal, Andy.
Absolutely phenomenal. Uh and even got a bit of stick in there. Look, as I said from the from the start of this uh interview, If there's anything within this story that triggers you, brings up any uh pain or trauma or memories, please, please, please speak to somebody and get help. If you wanna reach out to us, we'll point you in the right direction for professional support.
We spoke about Shannon's Hopeline, uh, Pieter House, Mental Health Warriors. There's there's lots of support uh in your community, some really, really good people. You know, uh there's loads of forced aids, suicide forced aiders. I'm a suicide forced aider trained by the HSE. There's lots of uh splattered all around different communities if you need help. Uh
Y y your friends are ch uh cheaper than a psychiatrist sometimes. Just telling a pal, getting it off your mind can really help, you know. Don't carry this around alone alone, we say that. Uh as we did talk about here, you have to save yourself. Asking for help is saving yourself, raising the white flag. You know, um
So that's all I'd say about that. As always, I want to thank Noel Royley from Runew Media Graphics, Andy from Liberty Media Hub, uh the girls from Shannon's Hope Lion do amazing work in uh mental health grassroots uh mental health. If you enjoy our show, please support and spread it with your friends and family.
If you really, really love it and you wanna support us, we have a a Patreon page. You can send us over the price price of a coffee. If you don't have the price of a coffee, you can listen for free ninety nine, no problem. Yeah, just mind your little self. Darren, thanks very much, pal. Thanks, thanks, thanks. Guys, thanks a lot. Mind your little self as always. Bye bye.