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We didn't get through all the skill guys yesterday, so we're going to finish up on the skill topics, get into the trenches and talk mic vendors, under the Radar guys, and surprises from the Senior Ball To wrap up our two part series with Mike. You are Locked on Bengals, Your daily Cincinnati Bengals podcast, part of the Locked On podcast network. Your team every Day, Bengals fans and welcome to another episode of the Lockdown Bengals podcast.
I'm your host, Jake. Let's go. Joined today by Mike Renner of Venner Ranks. You can find his work here on the Locked On podcast network. Going to be a lot of great draft content as we're in that part of the off season, but self dressed draft prospects that Mike Renner ranks on his show, so you can find out all the rest of what he covers.
Like I said, on YouTube, anywhere you get your podcasts, same place you can find Locked On Bengals every day, and we appreciate all of you who don't miss an episode in our every day or is this episode brought to you by the easiest and most exciting way to play daily fantasy sports Code to Prize picks dot Com, slash locked on NFL and used code locked on
NFL for a first depositive match up to one hundred dollars and Mike. Yesterday we started getting into the skill guys, but predictably, as we do, sometimes some conversations take a little bit longer than anticipated, and we have some skill guys left to talk about. We talked Lad McCaughey, we talked one of my new draft crushes, and I think a lot of people's new draft crushes and Javon Baker. I actually want to go back to Javon Baker really
quick. I just can't quit him. Where do you see him getting drafted before we talk about some of the other Senior Bowl skill players we didn't talk about yesterday. Man, after what he did there and again with his tape, with GBS numbers, with basically everything that he can bring to the table physically, and the fact that like he has great size for the position for
you know, he's heavier than Marvin Harrison Junior. So I think he's gonna be a second rounder is where I'd say I'd put him somewhere between forty to sixty and maybe even like forty to the mid fifties. That's where that's just the type of prospect I think he is and where I see him coming off the board. Just crushing my third round dreams whole sing. Yeah, he
ain't making it to the round. I would be floored if he's there for the Bengals in the third round, second rounds where they'd have to draft him. So if you're sending mock drafts in and you have Javon Baker in the fourth round, because you can still get him in the fifth round, even
I think in some of the simulators today just know that ain't happening. But maybe we'll talk about some other skill guys that could be realistic targets in the third round, or maybe the Bengals will accumulate picks in the second round. And this seems like a great draft to have top fifty, top sixty picks. I mean that's probably true a lot of years, but this year in particular, it feels like the more Day one, Day two picks you can
pile on, the better. Yeah. I think how I would describe it as this draft's about seventy five players deep, and its just like it goes fast. So once I kind of you know, once you get to the fourth round, I feel like there's less talent than usual, but you know, in that back end of the second there's more talent than would usually be there. So I do think it's top heavy, and so if you can, it just feels like a draft that people are going to want to trade
up in because of that. The NIL impact, the COVID impact, whatever it is. The depth of talent in this class is something that has been often discussed, but let's get back to some of those skill guys. Anybody we didn't talk about yesterday that really we should talk about. That could be Ben Sanat, It could be the other McCaffrey brother at the Senior Bowl, anyone else who stood out of wide receiver, tight end, even corner.
We talked a little bit about running back yesterday, But are there players that we need to bring attention to right now? Yeah, So tight end I think is mostly interesting for the Bengals, especially because they need one. Right the wide receiver you have, so you need one. But I think there are pathways to that not being a massive issue, whereas like tight end this
past year, just like straight up didn't have a guy. So for my money, there were two guys that I thought really made themselves money, really looked like, hey, you know, maybe they're not they're never going to be, you know, George Kittle or Travis Kelce that they're just there's one of those in this class. It's Block Bauers, and he's not going to be on the board at pick eighteen. I'd be surprised if he is.
But I thought Theo Johnson from Penn State looked really fluid as a pass catcher, really big wing spin, big hands, just a guy that you can I don't say feature in an offense, but you can trust in an offense as a pass catcher. And that's obviously something again Bengals don't really have. And then the other one, I thought bensonatt was far more impressive on tape at the Senior Bowl than I saw on Kansas State's tape. And now he
was actually running more diverse routetree than you have rankin State. But the attitude that guy plays with is something that I think could be very valuable to a Bengals team. Really brings an edge not only as a blocker but as a route runner, like super physical over the middle of the field. A guy who with the ball in his hands you can like legitimately throw screens to and after the catch just refuses to go down. You know, is always going
to maximize whatever catch he has. So I don't think he I think he ends up a Day two pick. Now, now it's probably back end of the third but after what he had the Senior Bowl and in a limited tight end class, I think both those guys could sneak their way into that range. Yeah, I mean third round pick tight end wouldn't be opposed to that. It depends on how free agency goes, how the first couple of rounds
of the draft go. But Ben's not a name in particular that has been interesting because of the two way ability, the inline ability where he does block at a reasonably level for a college tight end especially, and if he can tap into something as a receiver and as a refinement to his game as a receiver where he has the raw ability. But one of the common knocks I saw was, you know, route running and intricacies of playing the position,
then you might be able to get something there. Do you remember any of the GPS data on Sinat? I know I'm putting you on the spot there, but was there anything that suggested high level athletic profile. So he was I think the second fastest tight end there and it was pretty close, so Jeane Bell was the fastest, but they were like neck and neck, and Bell's obviously very undersized, not going to be you know, he's more just
like an athlete playing tight end, so that was encouraging for him. I think it's around like nineteen miles an hour, which you know it's not going to be you know, Luke musk Grave. I believe it was the fastest last year of the tight ends at Senior Bowl and he was up over in the mid twenties. And that's, you know, how you get drafted in the top fifty at tight end. Sam Laporta wasn't there, but that's the
kind of range Sam report is into. So just to kind of give a comparison, like he's now going to be a vertical threat or much of but a guy that definitely I think showed more in terms of, you know, underneath intermediate ability than I had expected based off his team. More of a solid kind of tight end who's not going to be the dynamic playmaker, but gives you something and gives you some run after catchability and can play online,
which is a package that the Bengals would certainly benefit from. I think wide receivers, any other wide receivers. I saw Vicky Parsl's name come up quite a bit. Roman Wilson obviously left the Senior Bowl early. Anyone else that was very noteworthy to You mentioned McCaffrey's name earlier as well. Yeah, I
think Roman Wilson he was very impressive. He's just very fluid, great hands, a guy who I do worry about his catch rats and the fact that kind of who he is as a wide receiver, which is more of like a downfield threat with that catch rad is just that I think could be a bit of an issue. But he's a a guy you love. Is like an ancillary piece to me. He's like a number two or three in an
offense, but super reliable in that regard. The other interesting you said there at the end, Luke McCaffrey is very interesting to me because he's super tough, a great size, really strong hands, really natural feel for run after the catch, and he's only been playing wide receiver for two years now. He's probably be playing wide receiver for much longer. Obviously, his father was a wide receiver in the NFL. It's not like he didn't know how to
play wide receiver before he switched from quarterback to wide receiver. But it's still there's still probably some meat on that bone developmentally, with only two years of actually focusing on it full time at the collegiate level to where that skill set could push at in the NFL level. So I thought he was very intriguing what I saw from on tape. The sel it's a family that has been successful in the NFL. It's good blood lines for sure. You definitely don't
with them have to worry about the work they're going to put in. Like the stories that they talk about, how psycho they are in their preparation about it. Their dad made them wear sweatpants the day of games just so that they had the mobility and their legs and like light sweatpants so that it wasn't too heavy. It's like they don't leave anything to change in terms of their
attention to detail. That'll be an interesting name to watch as well. But for Bengals fans watching the Senier Bowl, I think a lot of the conversation was honestly and a lot of the attention was paid to the trenches both sides. We talked a little bit about Devondre Sweat sweat yes yesterday, and obviously some big name tackles down there talking about Jackson Powers Johnson yesterday as well. Let's get into the trench conversation coming up next. Today's show is brought to
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these trenches for quite a while. The focus for me from a Bengals perspective is on offensive tackle and defensive tackle, although obviously there's some pretty good edge players down there. Versattle defensive lineman down there. Robinson from Missouri stands out in that regard as the guy that can move all over the place. But
let's start on the offensive line. We talked about in our mock draft that you graded yesterday, Marius Mems being the first round pick and a guy that I need to differentiate from Amarus MEM's as Tyler Geiton as a guy who had injury issues, played a handful a couple hundred more snaps maybe than Mems in college. But they're getting pretty significant different grades depending on where you look, can you talk about Tyler Guitdon's week and how you see him as a prospect
and help me compare him, help me differentiate him from Amarius Men's. Yeah, I honestly think Mims, for not having played as much football, is probably a little more technically sound, like he is just cleaner with his hands and feet in pass protection, whereas Guidan's still a little bit of working project, working process whatever. And he later bloomer later on his career two years at TCU where he didn't start transfers to Oklahoma starts the last couple of seasons,
and then tape at Oklahoma's facing a lot of three man rushes. Just with the offense Oklahoma runs, they're not getting it's not getting challenged the way you know. He's just gonna get a challenged the NFL level. So I was very impressed with what he put what he did at the Senior Bowl because again it is one on ones, and I thought he was just way more under control that he looked on tape consistently at Oklahoma, and and now he
still doesn't have like a number of sets at his disposal. I think he still needs to develop in that regard, but just as an athlete, he's more explosive than mim. He is twitched up like he is. He's got it all. It's all there, from the side from six seven three thirty to his length to just what he can do. It just needs to be honed in. So I think Mm's a little more polished, a little more under control, a little steadier, whereas Guitan is like a trends more towards
the boomer bust end of the spectrum. In my opinion, I see them both kind of in that world of possibility. Both of them kind of feel that boomer bust just because of the inexperience, which maybe is just over generalizing a little bit there. But with getten, a number of really impressive reps of the Senior Bowl, and you can find all the one on ones if you search for them on Twitter. It's a beautiful thing about Twitter and a world wars. They're pros and cons. You can you can find this stuff
pretty easily. There's a number of reps where he looks like he's moving great, the athleticism pops or you know, he looks like that. The power is really there and the ability to anchor is really there. But the big thing that sit out to me, and this is maybe too nitty gritty, is the hands are going wide quite often, and even on reps that are being passed around. Is Tyler Kighton wins the hands are both outside the shoulder
pads. Is that something that I'm making too much of a deal, too much of a big deal out of or is that something that you look at and doesn't give you any pause? It definitely that's his biggest worry rights his hand usage and offensive line for not being considered a skilled position, which we discussed earlier. It's more skilled than people give it credit for. You o
it. To win at a high level, you have to be skilled and so you know, I will say that stylistically in pass protection, some guys will keep their hands wise is just like a knowing that they can time it well. I don't guid in times particularly got I think I based off his tape like he doesn't I know, David Baktiari is the king of clamping down outside like it is a form that I don't know. It's necessarily taught,
but that can be executed, but it takes consistency to do so. And again based off of guid state He's not nowhere near close to that, so I do agree with your assessment there. Obviously, there are a number of other linemen at the scenea bole to talk about on the offensive side of the ball. Troy, Foratana, did not go, but talked about Jackson Powers Johnson. Who are the other guys that you feel it's really important to talk
about the weeks they had in Mobile. Well, I think this interior class is really intriguing, secially for the Cincinnati Bengals, and obviously just could use talent anywhere along that offensive line. Right. So there are a number of guys who I thought, based off of what they did there could be second rounders now. The one who really stood out, who I think one like
offensive linement of the week was Christian Haines from Yukon. A guy who's very athletic, as like an ideal guard build, and he's short with long arms and his anchor in the one on once was fantastic. That was what I worry about at Yukon going to a high level competition going to the NFL. Howoudy fare in that reguard passed the Flying Colors very impressed with him. I would also say Dominique Puney, the Kansas tackle who played tackle this past year
guard the year prior. I thought he had a great week in the one on ones on the interior, like I thought a lot of the tier guys pretty much handled this defensive tackle class throughout the course of the week, and now I feel pretty confident about him being somewhere in the top seventy five picks after what he put on tape there. And then Jordan Morgan from Arizona didn't
have the best week there. He's playing mostly tackle, but he's a guy who I think if he kicked into guard, would be a high level guard as well. So I think all those guys could be off the board by the end of the second round. And if the Bengals picked them in the second round, I don't think i'd argue with either of them. Talked about Christian Jones a little bit yesterday as well, the highest profile guy perhaps talays
t Lisa Kelly essay. I thought that I wasn't pronounced Okay, I'm learning so islander names the trick if there's a trick, or just like how they is you pronounced every vowel I could gets it. I looked at Oregon State's pronunciation, and I think it was okay, I'll take your word for it. Though has been inside the top fifteen on a number of boards I've seen in the last couple of weeks. Did he live up to that status?
I would get that gives me a little pause seeing those, because I do think his foot speed and sort of you saw it in this his ability to like really react to guys who can get to the edge quickly and bend back to it is I am a little worried about. But in the run game he was awesome. I mean, he's a pure people mover, is just so strong throughout his frame and just like so easy with his ability to you know, when everything you know works in unison, when his hands hips fire,
it's like you can be your toast. He's just very put together for an offense tackle. But he does leg behind I think, especially the top of the class, whether it's all Shanu or even like Mims or Giten, in terms of just their foot speed and ability to mirror edge rushers. So I I wouldn't I wouldn't put him in that kind of conversation just yet,
but I know others. Half if you're the Cincinnati Bengals or US as Cincinnati Bengals, pretend GM's with our pretend hats on and our basement, says Duke Tobin, would think, uh, we're looking for more athleticism on the offensive line. Fuago is probably Fuaga is probably not not the guy you think. Yeah, Okay, I would, Yes, he's I mean he's he's not like slower than Orlando Brown, right, I mean he's definitely not. But having two of those guys can leave you well more than you exposed, right,
And it's like he's gonna have to block TJ. Watt for the next first entire rookie contract. That's the kind of guy he would struggle against mine. Yeah, there's another side of the trenches that we haven't talked about yet. And there's some interesting defensive interior prospects down in Mobile and some interesting edge guys. But I do want to focus on the interior and I want to get your surprises and any other under the radar notes that you've got from your
time down in Mobile. We'll finish the show there coming up next. Lockdown Bengals is sponsored by Better Help. Sometimes we all need the opportunity to get something off of our chest. Whether it's big or small, certain things can really start to get to you. They can start to add up, and it makes it that much more challenging to be the person you want to be,
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you win on Prize Picks. Talked a little bit about Devandre Sweat yesterday, Mike, and if you missed that episode, make sure you go back and get part one of our discussion with Mike Renner about his time down in Ammobile Alabama. Darius Robinson another big standout, but when you're talking defensive line prospects in this class, there's also I think Ohio State's what's his first name, Hall's Michael Michael Hall, oh weird. Weird to forget that with a Mike
across from me on the screen. But tell me about those guys. Tell me about the guys that stood out to you the most on the interior or exterior. I guess not as interested in the edge guys, so to be honest, at least early, Yeah, defensive, they draft another edge he's not going to see the football field, So yeah, the interior, I honestly was fairly disappointed. So guys who came in who I thought of is
like top hundred picks. Guys like Brandon Fiskey, the Florida State defensive tackle, Dwayne Carter from Duke, and I throw Michael Hall in that mix too, as possible top hundred player, and McKinley Jackson from text A and M
I think that was it. Oh, Brandon Dorles two for Morgan. So those guys are all like potential top hundred and tts and of them, I think Michael Hall is the only one who maybe made himself money over the course of the week, you know who on what he did there really was like, Okay, this is this guy could be a player at thanks level,
but he's he's like purely a three technique. He's still way undersized in the low two eighties, but he's the early declared and hasn't played a ton of football, So he's kind of a wild card, lottery ticket type of pick because physically he's got the kind of feet that it takes to win as a
pass wrestler at the NFL level. If you're not going to be a pure explosive, get off bull rusher type on the interior, like you know, like a Fletcher Cox, you better have you better have agility behind you, you better be able to make guards and centers miss to get to the pastor and he has that. He's just you know, he's just way undersize right now. Surprised even declared early considering you know, everyone else said La State
brought back this past fall so or this upcoming fall so. But he definitely can be that impact sort of past rest of the next level, but just kind of developmental guy at this point, so not going to make a year
one sort of impact. I think everyone else there kind of just was met and the one on ones, Dwayne Carter's probably if you're looking for a versatile of those guys, he's the most versatile of those defensive tackles, but he's a little too up and down in my opinion, a little too inconsistent based off his tape of Duke and just like he's a guy who can open up big holes in the running game because of that inconsistency, but also could be
a playmaker for you. So that's why I'll probably still be a top hunder pick Devandro Sweat being the standown. I know he's a little bit three tech exactly, but we did talk about him yesterday and Robinson b Zoo. Is he a guy that I mean, he's big enough to play kind of all over the place, right, So I don't think he's a pure interior guy though, is because he's so high cut. He's just a long, big
dude. And that's why I think this pass fall. So he had been an interior player from Missouri starting his career, and that's why I think his past fall was his career year. Obviously, that's like how it happens anyway, but because he played on the edge more than he ever had before and really made more of an impact in that regard. So for me, he's more of a if he's an interior player, he's more in like the Malik Jackson mold where he's never really kicking inside inside, he's just he's playing over
tackles like a three four defensive end sort of interior player. You're not a guy that because once you get him inside at that kind of just that body type, he can really get moved off line scrimmage for stuble team. So a guy i'd probably want more on the edge, so you know, more closer to like a Miles Murphy thinking about like bass downs five tech because the
Bengals will put five defensive linemen on the field. If he could play five and bass downs and then be a three tech on pass rush downs, is that something that and occasionally I guess he could play a little bit of edge as well, like as well. I think that's a solid role for him for sure, just just trying to find the fence. I don't know that he'll make sense because he sounds like he's going to get drafted in a spot where the Bengals wouldn't be prudent or able to pick. But he's going to
go somewhere probably between like twenty five and forty five. And it's like that's right, you put right up portray backs. Let's finish with some of your guys. Any any surprises. I know that like one name that was totally new to me that I saw as a surprise for some people as cornerback Chole smith Way. I don't know if that's going to be one of your guys as well. But tell me about your guys at the Senior Bowl, your standouts, so maybe other people haven't talked about as much, or were guys
that popped to you were surprises under the radar kind of guys. I really liked Jarvis Brownlee the Louisville corner back, Okay, and I in man coverage, there's like two things you got to have. One is the athleticism to
play band coverage. You got to be able to make up ground. But two, you have to have some quick processing and ability to read routes right, because it's if you're always just reacting to what a wide receiver does, you're going to you're always going to be a steps half second late, right, You're always gonna give up a little separation at some point and leave yourself
liable. And what he did, I think better than any of the other corners there that really showed on tape, was he understood based off of releases, where they were going, basically where this route had to go. And he was jumping guys routes more so than anyone else, basically understanding where they were going before they went there, where they had to go before they went there, better than anyone else. I was really impressed with him. I thought that was a heck of a week that he put on tape, and
I think he's going to be now a top HUNDERD pick after that. So that's probably the one guy at Highlights. I'm trying to think of anyone else who really like came out of nowhere that I was a fan of. I also think there's some linebackers down there that I think are going to be high
draft picks. And at afuan ulaf o'hiel. I don't know if linebackers in the Bengals plans whatsoever or not, but the Washington linebacker, he he was fantastic in the one on ones covered against running backs and he's not like a great athlete, but he kind of has that that whatever that Logan Wilson also has where it's just like he's not going to get caught completely out of positions, not going to get jumpy and really take the bait on something and just
always under control and able to change directions at a moment's notice. And so I was a fan of his game. I thought he had a great week. I don't know the linebackers and the Bengals fans plans, but it's funny that you make that comparison to Logan Wilson, because it seemed like both of those linebackers for the Bengals this year were taking the bait a little bit more.
This is an episode that he didn't have the best year. Well, the safeties go in, the interior defensive line play in Cincinnati, those things certainly didn't help punter any any big punter notes, no nounes. Yeah, good punters come on the football field and I start talking to people around about that's the networking time, right, Yeah, make some new friends, Mike. We appreciate the time, the insight. I'm sure we'll keep in touch
throughout the draft season. The combine is the next step, of course in the draft process. Free agency coming up as well. Not as much a topic for you, but I'm sure you'll have some content on rentor thanks around free agency as well. We appreciate Mike's time and insight. We appreciate all of you out there for listening to this episode of the Locked On Bengals podcast.
We've got more Senior Bowl contact coming up with some more French conversation with Parker Blake, who has done some work for Allbengals dot Com is at the Senior Bowl as well. That's coming your way next on Locked On Bengals, and until then, thanks for listening. Who day and have a good one.
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