¶ Lockdown the Legacy
Welcome to Lockdown the Legacy stories from the inside out . I'm your host , remy Jones .
And I'm co-host Debbie Jones . We are a husband and wife team here to bring you the real life stories , experiences and questions around the American criminal justice system . We do advise discretion with this podcast . I think we should put that out there first and foremost .
Yes , we are going to talk about experiences that happen inside the prison system , outside of prison systems . We will use language that might be offensive , but we intend to keep it real . And if that's not for you , we totally understand , but please do what's best for your listening ears .
Oh , we're about to keep it real , son . Our goal of this podcast is to share the inside realities of the American prison and criminal justice system , from pre-charges all the way to post-release , from the voices of those who've experienced it firsthand , including me .
That's right , we're going to get into it .
What's up everybody . This is your host , remy Jones , and today I am by myself . I do not have any . Yesterday and this has kind of been prompt too I kind of had some stuff on my mind and it kind of made me feel bad man .
I kind of felt guilty , and so I figured I would talk about it with you guys , you know , because it has a lot to do with the theme of the podcast . But no worries , you know we will be having more guests . We'll get back to the Summer Legacy series to wrap that up this coming month .
And , of course , you know I'm going to try to get DJ back on here because I know she's busy , but I love having her . I think you guys do too . So , with all that being said , there's something that's been kind of weighing on me , and that something is that I do a lot of work , man .
I do a lot of work both on the record and off the record , in trying to help people , especially people who have been in prison before , and you know I'm trying to help them find whatever it is that'll work for them to keep them out .
You know , I use my own example , and a lot of these people are close to me , they're friends , they're family and stuff like that , and so it's easy to use my story , because they know where I came from and they know how far I've come , and yet somehow it feels like that's not enough , like to know somebody close that's going through it too .
Somehow , people still either feel like it's something they can't accomplish or they feel like , you know , hey , maybe it's just not for them . They don't want to put in that hard work . They don't want to .
You know , maybe this life is too boring , you know , whatever it is , but on my end it's really lonely , you know , it's really lonely to have found success and to be trying to help other people , but the people that's closest to me are not getting it , you know , and by not getting it I mean they're going back to prison .
So just recently , about three days ago , somebody who once I considered to be a really close friend actually , all these people that I'm going to talk about today are actually , at some time or another , I consider to be like my best friends , my best friends , which is a big statement . I don't have many friends .
So a few days ago , this guy that I was locked up with , we both got sentenced in 2008 . We both did 10 years , we both got out , we both relocated to Columbus , so a lot of similarities here .
And so I had met up with him like one or two times and I was like yo man , dude's not living right at all , man , like I shouldn't be hanging around him , and so I just never came around again and it was kind of sad that just a year later he was on Crime Stoppers you know , he was on TV for stabbing a guy and just a few days ago he was sentenced .
And he was sentenced to 20 to 25 and a half years . And that's really sad because I mean , stu was really smart , he had a lot of discipline when it came to self-control and stuff he was . He would like fast and he will work out like three times a day Like he would read like crazy amounts of books .
You know , like dude was just , he was so smart and he has so much potential . So to see somebody that was close to me , like that and to extend that help and advice and they not take it like willfully not take it and then to see the consequences that came just a year or two later , like that's messed up , man , that's messed up .
And he's not the only example like that . You know Another friend I was locked up with , you know he did 11 years and within two years , you know , went back to prison . It got seven and a half years . You know another guy , he did 14 years . He's I've been home five years .
He's been back to prison five times in those five years and no matter what , I'm like yo , I can help like what's up , and he's like man , I don't want that shit . Like , I don't want to do that , I don't want to do this .
Like it's like , even still , after living this hard of a life , you know , after bumping your head so many times , it's still like nah , that way is too hard , I don't want to do that .
Like I'm looking for the easy way out and every time getting caught and not realizing that the problem is the mindset , it's always like , oh , I shouldn't have got this sentence , I should have got this . Oh , they over sentenced me . Oh , they , you know , whatever .
And I started feeling like a bad friend at this point , you know , because with all three of these people that I just mentioned , I got nothing to do . Like I've given all the advice . I've opened , you know , extended the olive branch like yo , come on , I can show you I can help and I'm willing to like put in on it .
You know I'm willing to help in more ways than just advice and they just be like nah , you know I'm cool . So then I just like well , we can't hang out . You know like I got shit to lose now .
You know I've built something so and that's something that those are people like like no offense , you know I still got love for them , but I can't have them around my family . You know I can't have them around the thing that really matters most to me , and not only that , but also by going around hanging out , I can't afford for that one chance to pop up .
Where I come in the car with them , we get pulled over and they got something you know on them and we all going down because I got to be honest , man , I live by a lot of streetcodes and all that . No snitching . You know we're going to hold solid , we're going to take it to the box type shit , take it to trial .
I can't say that I'm with that anymore . You know I'm one of those like yo , that's yours , you better tell them that , sure as fuck .
You know like , and you know , fuck it , that's how it is , I can't say nothing else about it Like I shouldn't have to snitch in that situation , like especially knowing them , knowing what I've built and what I have to lose now . But so not only that , you know this , he didn't get his sentence .
I was kind of , I was kind of glad to see that he showed remorse at trial . You know he apologized to the victim's family . It could have been a lot worse , you know , because we are talking about a murder case which just got , you know , my dude Murph , who just got sentenced a couple of days ago .
So it could have been a lot worse for him , you know , and I'm glad that he chose to apologize . But at the same time it's like , you know , it's too little , too late . So I wish that would have never happened . Another thing that's kind of weighing on me is one of my old friends who I actually got in trouble with when I was younger .
And you know , it's like this is one of those examples of where the system tries to impose justice but fails everybody . You know everybody involved . It fails the victim , it fails the whatever . You know the defendant , you know the person who committed the crime .
And so here , you know , this is a story of an 18 year old kid who , you know , when I was 18 , me and him were like almost inseparable , you know , and we ended up committing some robberies together and we didn't get the same judge , we didn't get listed as co-defendants or anything , and he ended up getting such a worse sentence than me .
But at the same time , it comes in where he also didn't have the family support I had . He didn't . He really didn't have anybody , you know . And so he ended up taking a plea deal , and his plea deal was actually better than mine originally . But then , you know , they came . It was like , hey , man , we think you were involved in this too .
And Instead of just shutting up or , you know , waiting for his lawyer , he decided to plead no contest to everything that they were accusing him of , and by doing so , it's basically the same as saying you're guilty , you're saying you're leaving yourself at the mercy of the court to , you know , impose whatever they want .
And and so they really fucked them around , man Excuse my word choice , because nobody thought of this as like a continuation of the case that had already went by . They Considered it to be a second crime . You know , even though it wasn't , they considered it to be like oh , he's a Repeat violent offender , a menace or whatever , which was not the case .
And so on this second Goal at it , they ended up Sentencing . I don't know what it was . I think they gave him like an extra 27 years or something on top of what he already had , and so by this one court case really that they decided to split into two , he ended up getting like 30 somethings , like 35 years or something . It was crazy .
And here I'm thinking like man , an 18 year old kid who can miss robbery is 35 years . I literally know people who have committed murders and gotten 15 years or 20 years . You know , and I can easily throw out some . You know cases . I mean heck , in the one I just said , you know , guy commits murder and gets 20 to 25 and a half .
Guy commits robbery , didn't physically harm anybody in the process , and gets 35 . So when we talk about unjust sentencing , this is a prime example .
And To make it even worse , oh , they students andkar Played in no contest in Ohio is Pretty much like pleading guilty , like you can't appeal , you know , when you say you did it like you know , like a pill it or overturn it , or withdraw the plea , and they've all been denied . So at this point , you know , uh , this all happened back in like 2008, .
You know , at this point , he's not even halfway finished with the sentence , you know , 15 years later , which is crazy to me , um , and so , once again , uh , I'm not trying to like , uh diminish the responsibility that anybody has to take for the crimes they committed or like downplay the severity of the crime .
I mean , we were young , we were stupid , um , which is the case , you know , with a lot of people and uh , lessons needed to be taught . But the lesson here is like long gone and lost . When you take somebody that goes in at 18 or 19 and they come home and they're five or six years away from retirement age , like , what lesson did you teach anybody ?
What good did you do to anybody involved ? And so now you put somebody in a position to where , like , I don't care what anybody says , if you go into prison at 18 and you come home in your 50s , you are not rehabilitated . You can't be in my mind .
It's like you've stripped me of anything that I could have learned any lesson , because and this is all just my opinion , you know when I go
¶ Reforming the Prison System
from my experience . When I went in my first two or three years , man , I was mad . I wasn't ready for any growth . My fourth year is like one of my eyes kind of opened , like yo . I'm always still fucking up and I can make my situation worse from in prison .
So I was like yo , I gotta start moving a little different , which is not easy to do when you don't have examples and the system's not really there to point you in the right direction and give you the opportunities .
But let's say you do find out like how , and you put in the work and you make that change right , you can own like , yeah , you carry that and you implement it . For what ? Five , six , seven , 10 years ? After 10 years you're just mad again , all over again , like man , fuck them , like why don't I get a chance ?
You see people coming in , going home , coming in , going home , coming in , going home and in prison . Everybody compares cases . You know , oh , what you ain't here for , what you ain't here for . You start seeing dudes that came in on manslaughter and they going home before you .
You just saw them start and finish their sentence and you start thinking like man , I ain't even hurt nobody , I ain't even do nothing . You know like it wasn't that bad and you know it's real fucked up and it's hard like being out here and having had some attachment to all of these people .
man , haven't seen people go to prison , leave prison , not really get the lesson involved and go back you know , and then come home and go back and come home and go back and constantly reaching out like yo , I can help , but they don't , and then to see people that won't get their chance , you know , or their chance is so far away and there's nothing really I
can do to change that , that's hard , you know . It's like being in this situation here , like trying to help people , but knowing that there's some people that just it's out of my power to help , like that's hard , and I guess it's one of those things that's like .
That's when you gotta kind of think of it as a business , like you can't serve everybody , which , once again , is hard , because I know these people , I know their stories , I know the situations that got them where they are and so I don't know . That's just .
That's something that's really been weighing on me and it's really kind of it's kind of a lonely life man to be like .
These are people I grew up with or these are people that you know I was really close to a sometime or another , and I would really love for us to like all come together , take these opportunities , put in the hard work and make more opportunities , not only for ourselves but for other people , because collectively , I mean , hell , I got a pretty compelling story
myself , but collectively , like we got a hell of a story . You know , which is why I wanted to do the Legacy Series is because , like , yeah , it's impressive when somebody does it on their own , you know .
But when you start highlighting all these stories together of people who have been at the bottom , people that were the worst of the worst , people that committed some like really you know whether they were caught forward or not like committed some really fucked up acts , and to see them all come together and change the succeed and promote positivity and instill that in
other people coming behind them , like collectively , that's amazing , that's something that can't be ignored , you know . So it really kinda pains me to be like man , these dudes have so much potential and in their stories they have so much potential to impact people , and yet , you know , they gotta go the hard way .
Like I love Warren the Deaf man and he , believe me , is more deserving than anybody to be out here , and I'm just glad that he is still taking it upon himself to impact people positively from behind bars , and so , of course , I'm going to do everything that I can to help him do that , and there's many other people that I wish I could , but I can't .
¶ Challenges of Post-Incarceration Life
But really , that's really all I wanted to talk about . Man , it's because I remember , you know , one of the things that I could never do is forget what it feels like to be behind bars .
That's one thing I would never allow myself to do , because I feel like for some people it is easy , when they find success , to forget where they came from , you know , but one of the things that's one of the things I'll never forget is like calling everybody on my phone list and nobody answers the phone .
You know , writing letters to people when they never respond , or having some corrections officer tell you basically everything . They dictate everything about your life . You know when you go to sleep , when you wake up , when you can take a shower , when you can talk on the phone , when you can eat . You know where you can go , how long you can stay there , like .
You know when you can have a light on , when you can have a light off . They can literally walk up to you and just like strip naked right where you are and you have to obey that command , like . I remember that , and so when I think about these guys , you know , hell . My best friend Chad . You know he's just going back to prison .
You know , when I think about these guys I'm like that's fucked up . You know , especially once we got out and we had like good times . You know me and Sharon ride motorcycles up in Cleveland . You know me and Chad out here , you know , like to know that they're back in there , like that's not living .
You know , and like I know their families , I know their , their passions and I don't know . I'm kind of just really rambling here like this was not really playing . But I know what they're capable of and I'm seeing them back in there and I can't do that about it . So , anyway , I'm gonna cut this short man . I'm .
This is just going to be something that's like hot and in quick man , this is something that I would love to hear back from my listeners . Man , like shoot me an email , shoot me a comment on Facebook , whatever , like if you got somebody that you know of . Like recidivism is a real thing , it's a real problem and it's not always one of those .
Like you know , people are addicted to drugs or people just don't give a fuck . It's really like sometimes people get in their mind that those options aren't available for them , even though they see them right in front of their face like , yeah , but that'll never work for me .
So I don't know if you one of those people that have been kind of like struggling , or if you one of those people who know somebody and they're struggling , you know , like right in , I'll be more than happy to talk to them to try to help to figure out what it is that they're good at and Maybe do some job referrals or something .
Because really and I'm a true testament of this like it only takes a real good opportunity , like a job . You know , once you get a job that actually is Capable of providing for you and your family , all of a sudden you start looking at things different .
Like , of course you want to go back to the streets when you're sitting here making ten dollars an hour and at the end of the week you got 300 bucks .
Like Like , yeah , I might go back to the street , but really , if , like , Somebody gives you that opportunity where you can make good money , stable money , and not have to look over your shoulders , all of a sudden you start looking at shit different , you know .
So if you guys know somebody or if you just got a story , like you know , whatever , like drop a line . I mean I'd love to hear from you , especially since , like you know , I'm kind of down right now , so this really might help lift my spirits a little bit , you know . So that's , that's pretty much it , man . I want to keep you guys too long .
Next week I will have the regular episode , so I'm sorry if you were expecting that and this is a disappointment , but I just really kind of wanted to talk about that , like .
So it's kind of lonely , man , it's really kind of lonely and I love what I do , I love my family , I love my life and I really wish that I could give this to other people , you know , and if I can , I will so Share the message . Man , have people reach out to me . Like I got some advice for a few different industries .
You know that are a felon family , you know school , whatever it is they want to do . Man , even if it's just like being in that situation and having to make a different decision than you would normally make , you know the right decision , like I can help , all right . So with that I'm out . I'm gonna cut this short . Love you all .
Thanks for listening , especially all of my dedicated listeners , man . I know I got Some , some people hell , we even oh , man , listen when I get to talk about listeners , man , this kind of makes me happy .
So we have , like some dedicated listeners and like Germany , asia , I mean , you know , even here in the States , like Chicago , washington state , like we , we got listeners in places I've never been that listen regularly . So I really appreciate that , places that I don't even know people in and I just see that they listen regularly .
So shout out to you guys , man , because that really makes me happy , really trying to Make some moves to you know , promote the podcast and and get it out there a little more .
But really , more than anything , man , I'm asking you guys that listen to share it , like if you got Facebook , if you got Instagram , if you got LinkedIn , whatever , like we got all those pages , like share the episode , share links to the page and Try to try to get the listenership up . You know it's doing good .
It's got some good organic growth and I'm really happy about that , I'm proud of that and Just trying to keep it going . You know , if you guys got any ideas , like suggestions , please let me know . I'm all open you know I'm not trying to go at it alone , but I do try to Spot some opportunities and implement them where I can .
All right , so once again , for the third time , with that , I'm out peace .
The lockdown to legacy podcast is proud to be a part of the bus sprout podcast community network . Lockdown to legacy is recorded at co-hatch in their lovely audio file room . Thanks for your scholarship . Audio engineering is done by our very own Remy Jones .
You can reach us with any feedback , questions , comments or share the love by emailing stories at lockdown , the number two Legacy comm , stories at lockdown to legacy comm . You can reach out there too for a free sticker , and you can find us on Instagram and Twitter with the handle at lockdown to legacy and on Facebook at the lockdown to legacy podcast .
Thanks for listening .
