The Real Housewives of Nazareth

gender of the innkeeper? What do you think male? Because I don't think women were allowed to at in BC? Yeah maybe in BC women were not allowed to be Okay, so I'm a male innkeeper. You are a You are a woman who has traversed the system. Okay, You're a boss. You are you are the primordial girl boss in the year four or five BC. Okay, okay, are you leaving a good review at the end? I own? I mean,

how did you do? I mean? That's what I'm this is what I'm saying is that when this couple shows up at your door and you basically told them that there's like no room, that does I would leave a one star review. That does sound like something I would do. I think that they were very entitled. Who who are we talking about? Mary and Joseph? Okay, so this isn't just a thought exercise. You are trying to set up

the story of Christmas. Yes, here on this podcast. You come on and you say, have you ever heard of Twilight? Have you heard of Taylor Swift? And I come on this podcast and I say, have you ever heard of the Birth of Jesus Christ? Rose? Have you? I've heard of it? Mary? Did you know? There is so much about Christmas that I don't understand as a very reformed Jewish girl who grew up in book raton. So I'm very excited that today we are going to get into

a discussion about religious Christmas and secular Christmas. So I guess like today we're fighting a battle in the war on Christmas. Yea, Well, what side are you on? The secular one? Yeah? This is like a virgin where we give yesterday's pop culture. Well, I guess today we're giving BCS culture a d S takes. I'm I'm Rose dam you and I'm Fran Toronto. So stick around. We're going to get into the birth of Jesus later, but right now, we're going to talk about the birth of a bunch

of tweets this week. We have a lot of things to celebrate and be joyful about, as maybe the angels that came to Jesus would say, among them, the end of Succession, much to your joy and tribulation. Girl. I just I'm happy that people like succession, I guess, but I'm so much happier that it's over so people will stop tweeting about it. And I understand that this is probably something a lot of people feel about things that we're interested in that we talk about when they reach

like critical mass. But I just am not interested in succession, and the way that people talk about it online has been super annoying for me. So I'm just really happy it's over and I don't have to see tweets about it anymore. But I do still have to keep clicking not interested on Succession TikTok's because I need the algorithm to understand that I don't watch it. You know, as a succession watcher, even I can empathize and honestly completely

empower you to hate on succession. Anybody to hate on Succession because there are a lot of parts of the shows that are of like middling quality and success, and it's like people treat it like it's like the second coming of like The Departed, or like of the best TV show ever created, and well, let's not give it more air time than it already has. Uh. Something on h Max that I am more excited for than Succession is the Harry Potter reunion that's happening on January one.

Have you seen the trailer for this return to Hogwarts? No? And I I love and support you, but I won't. I won't be watching the trailer. I will be watching. We will be watching it together on New Year's Day in our rental house of Joshua Tree. I hope you know that. I don't know about that. I don't know. Yeah, we will take a break from our Lord of the Rings marathon to watch return to Hogwarts. We'll see about that. Okay, um are you? Are you like and do you consider

yourself an a girl? I'm not on film Twitter per se, so I'm not I'm not going to maybe, um know the like all of the things about like what makes A twenty four a superior production company? However, I do like a lot of the things that come out of it. I think a fun tidbit about in general is that they make a ba billion movies a year, but they only mark get like of their films, and a lot of people don't know about, like all the flop movies

that they produced that no one has ever heard of. However, all of the amazing movies that they do I always adore well, such as the trailer that just came out with Um Michelle Yah, which I will be in the theater first day when I see. I'm very excited for that. I'm also super excited for The Northman. The trailer for that just came out. It's the new Robert Eggers movie. He did The Lighthouse and the Witch or the Bitch

depending on the depending on the stylization of it. And it's like a Viking movie starring lots of hot blonde people. So Alexander's Scars Garden, Nicole Kidman, Anya Taylor Joy and it like, weirdly enough, kind of seems like a prequel for True Blood, because did you did you watch True Blood? Uh? No, I didn't. You should definitely go back and watch it. But so Alexander Scars Guard who played Eric that like

bad boy vampire. His whole back st are on the show is that he was a viking, and like there's one season where he's on this quest for vengeance, and this movie is also about a viking who's on a quest for vengeance. So maybe this is the Eric Northman origin story we've been waiting for. Um. But Nicole is wearing another amazing yet incredibly clocky wig. But also Bjork is in this movie. I think, yeah, I think she's playing some kind of soothsayer, which which tracks that's crazy.

I did not. I need, I need to watch this trailer. Yeah, I'm I'm very excited. You know, we are kind of at critical mass of things being released right now. It's like peak movie release season, peak TV season. Have you heard of this Showtime show, Yellow Jackets. You texted me about it. I saw some tweets about it. I heard

that it's making Showtime gay again. What's the gift? So it's a show about a high school girls soccer team, um, who is on their way to a tournament and they're plane crashes and like, in trying to survive in the wilderness, they become this sort of lord of the flies, like cannibalistic scenario UM and then so half of the show takes place during that time period, and then half of the show follows the survivors UM twenty five years later, who are played by Melanie Lynsky, who's like an icon.

She's been in so many movies over the years, like she was in Kyote Ugly As she Wasn't ever after Christina Ricci, Juliette Lewis, and Tawny Cypriss. You know, so you know that they survived, but like not really who else And there's like mysterious letters about people knowing what happened. And it's just really good. It is gay, it's it's funny and dramatic. I really think you should watch it. I think you'd love I can't wait to figure out

how I'm going to steal someone else's Showtime access. Well, I did get a free trial to show Time, so you can use my log in. Okay, thank you, because I've definitely already used my free trial of Showtime to watch I think the L word. I still need to do an L word watch. I guess we'll have to do an episode on it at some point because I've

never seen it. It's definitely on the list. So Rose, I don't know about you, but I personally I'm just like always, always, you know, sitting around and waiting for assists heterosexual man to tell me how to feel about representation. How about you. Yeah, it's my favorite thing to to talk about truly, because you know, like it's it's more

something you receive exactly exactly. So Aaron Sorkin, I don't know if you've read um, was on the Sunday Times defending his decision to cast have Your Bard m a Spaniard into the role of the Cuban Desi Arnaz, and he somehow transitioned into talking about straight actors and gay roles and how I love when this conversation comes up. I think once a quarter at least. Yeah, it's it's

it's the best. He He basically argues that, like, you can't act straight or gay, and he says, so this notion that only gay actors should play gay characters, that only a Cuban actor should play Desi, Honestly, it's the mother of all empty gestures and a bad idea. Well you know what else was a bad idea The television show The news Room, which is the worst the worst

thing I've ever watched. And I used to go over to a friend's house to watch True Blood and we started watching Newsroom after when it started, and like three episodes in, we were watching Newsroom and I stood up and said to everyone, I can't do this anymore. This show is bad and I will not watch another moment of it. And I walked out, and from then on, every night, as soon as True Blood ended, I was out of there. I I kind of want to get

into the weeds. He y're I I fucking hate that I have to explain this, But the truth is, like most people don't understand that there's a difference between someone who speaks Spanish and someone who is Latino. And like it must be said that Javier Bardem is white. He's he's not Latin. He's Hispanic, yes, but like he was only cast into this role because he's an amazing actor and because he has an accent. But an accent does not lettin you that make and does r Nez was

also white, Like he's like a white Tino. Yeah, but more importantly, he existed during a time where he was like most certainly marginalized. Like people still consider Lucy and Ricky like the first interracial couple on TV, despite the fact that being Latin is an ethnicity not a race, and Lucy and does he are technically both white? Um So, like, in my like humble opinion, like I don't give a ship about like a white man playing like a different

kind of white. However, given the background of who does he was at the time and how that still was groundbreaking as a public figure, the role still should have

gone to a Latin actor, you know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely, And like with the queer people and queer roles of it all, like the reason we cast queer and trans characters and queer and trans roles is because like we're making up for a century of like whitewashing and straight washing, and like how we are just always giving jobs to people that are not historically marginalized the classes were like totally signing up to represent quote unquote Yeah, I think

that's that's one of the parts he's missing in all this is like it's not about acting a role, it's about like a authenticity and be the fact that you know, queer people and other marginalized folks don't have the same opportunities as white cys hetero people, and like that is the reckoning we're trying to have. Speaking of authentic storytelling, did you did you watch episode you of and just

like that, I did. And girl, let's let's talk about the most shocking revelation of this episode, which is that it was revealed that Big did get vaccinated. It was there's a moment where Carrie is fumbling through his stuff and through his wall and she pulls out Big vaccination card. Okay, well that's interesting considering how like COVID like doesn't exist in and just like that, like it's just over. There's

no doubt it just ended. I guess, like spoiler alert for anybody who hasn't watched the episode, were no spoiler alerts like yeah, we don't take your life into your hands listening to this podcast not in my house. Um, yeah, there's this whole like hubub about the fact that Big gave a postumus one million dollar donation to his ex wife Natasha. But honestly, I thought it was going to be like Big gives like a one million dollar donation to like the RNC, or he definitely he definitely does that.

My mom told me she has a theory that she thinks it's true that Big gave that money to Natasha because either one or both of her sons are his children. And I was like and I was like, no, Mom, it's not That's not what that's about. Like this story is a closed loop about like Carry processing her grief. And actually, you know, I didn't like most of the episode, but that storyline was my favorite part. And it was the part of the show that felt the most like

Sex in the City. You know, Carry having to face the consequences of her bad decisions. That was the whole thing with her and Big and Natasha. Like I just loved the reminder that Carry is fundamentally a bad person and sort of the like slapstick Hi jinks of going to Natasha's office and her seeing them in the window and then like trying to get into the bathroom and spelling the coffee, Like that felt very much like a

Sex and the City episode to me. But know what didn't feel like a Sex in the City episode was Shade As Is Comedy special slash slash ted talk about gender um I like, who, first of all the people snapping in the audience was so triggering to me personally,

so disingenuous. It's again like we said this last, but it's just like so many things where it's like these are all cartoons of what people think queer and trans culture is, and they're literally doing a set set and in quotation marks because I didn't think it was very funny. Also no offense, but like queer and trans people aren't going to stand up, like it's not not like a stand up in mass Like if this were realistic, the audience of Shaddea's stand up show would be probably mostly

heterosexuals and like white people. And that's why the material, both in world and out of world feels oriented to straight people because queer people queer people don't need to receive that. And it's like so much telling rather than showing, which is like really uninteresting and and just like bad TV making writing one oh one. Truly, I will say I'm not defending that moment, but I was pretty enraptured

by what is Shay and Miranda's first sensual moment. I am somehow here for it, even though I hate, hate, hate Shay as a character. I also think that what's happening with Charlotte's trans kid is something that I think we'll have a lot of cringe to it. But also like, I think that her reaction to her kid is pretty human, and I think it's also hilarious that she immediately goes to like the cis gay guy invalidate her trans child's

identity immediately. It's the most transpic response, which is actually realistic. I do hope that what's happening with Miranda and Shay is like part of why Miranda has been set up

so horribly thus far in the series. I did see something on TikTok where someone was doing an analysis of this, and like, basically what they were saying is, like Miranda is a very good example of this like breed of white women who thought of themselves as really progressive in the nineties and are now having to reckon with the fact that they actually are not that progressive um, and

like that is being cracked open for them. And so I hope that in this romance with Cha, like Miranda kind of finds herself again in a way that is not like obnoxious and hard to watch because I can't I can't see another stand up set. I can't do it. Oh, absolutely not. Obviously, Also, as we talk about culture and feminism and the kind of thinkers that created how we kind of view shows like Sex in the City. Bell

Hooks did die this last week. Um, an amazing feminist writer, philosopher, thinker um who has like created leaps and bounds of like thought and work around like what it means to love, what it means to be queer, what it means to be fem to be a woman. UM. And I think that you know, whatever thoughts you have on bell Hooks Hooks, Um, you cannot deny that she had an invaluable contribution to how we talk about like love and beauty and community today. UM.

And how it's all like an interactive process. UM. So yeah, I think that uh, as a little gabie who used to take classes at the Kidsie Institute, was like so thirsty for sorry sorry, I I that insufferable sentence needed to be said in the context of this, like bell Hooks was one of the first like little packets that was like handed to me in a class. Um. And I'm really grateful for her work and for others like her.

If virgins have never read Bell Hooks have never engaged with her work, All about Love to me is the best book to start with. I think it's a really great introduction to the rest of her ethos. And yeah, y'all really deserve to read some Bellhooks this weekend, the like a virgin book club weekends. Yes, I don't. I mean, do you think you could like fudge your way through it the Nativity story? We can do it together. Okay. So, um, there's this person Mary. I don't want to assume their gender. Okay,

the PC police are in here, and um they are pregnant. Yeah, Um, she is pregnant. Okay, she's pregnant Mary assis woman. Okay, allegedly that's what That's what Big Christianity wants us to think. Mary, Joseph, Jesus, they were all white and sis for sure. Jesus was sis assists white man. Okay, So Mary's pregnant, but she didn't have sex with anyone? She yes, she said she was a virgin, but but like pregnant, but like did she lie? I mean, listen, believe women. But also sounds fishy.

It sounds it sounds fishy. It's already you know. She said up what I never understood was was married. Because she's married. Mary's married to a man. I actually don't remember if they were married married or if they were like betrothed and like because because like have they Is she fully a virgin or was this just this was

this was a virgin birth? So in the biblical retelling, it's like this hysterical pregnancy and like she's basically been birthed by God and the Holy She's basically been impregnated by God and the Holy Spirit and Angel. Come. How did that work? Did she consent? I fucking hope so? But it did not make it seem that way in the Bible story, That's what I'm saying. So how did this? Um, she didn't cant because she was surprised. She was like, oh my god, I'm pregnant. Yeah, so like how did

the god sex happened? Yeah? I don't know that that that part of the story is a little murky. Was it in a dream? Was it? Like it sounds like Mary was actually like in her real house. I was back. She was actually just trying to stir the pot and she like, listen, I'm I'm pregnant, but I'm a virgin, and you know the room gas. I mean, what if I came into the studio today and told you fran I'm pregnant, but I've never had sex. Well you would

be surprised a because I don't have a womb. So okay, so yeah, maybe this is like the the version of the Virgin Mary story. I walk into the studio and I say, for him, I have been feeling really weird, and I like, I was having these symptoms. I'm the only thing, you know. I was doing that kind of movie thing where you google all your symptoms and it was like, well, are you pregnant? And I was like, of course I'm not pregnant. I was I'm I'm a

mad you know. Um. But just as a laugh, a little funny chuckle, I took a pregnancy test and it says I'm pregnant. Oh what do you? What do you do? What do you say if I tell you that? Well, I'm I guess the first question I'm going to ask is can I take you on a pilgrimage to to Bethlehem on a donkey? That's the first thing you're asking this in that situation, this scenario, that is my primary concern.

I also wonder what if if this happens, what our producer Phoebe is doing, well, she would be one of the one of the wise men, one of these. So Phoebe is one of the wise Are you bringing? What? What gift are you bringing? Gold? Frankinsense, murder? What you got is bringing? Oh yeah, let's be clear about this. If this does happen and I have a you know, like magical trans pregnancy, I'm not keeping the baby, do you know? Not? Not not right now, not until we're

doing keep it numbers. But what what if a chorus of angels come to you in a dream and they say that your child is going to be the Messiah? That sounds like so much work. Honestly, like I would rather they say, Oh, he's going to be a doctor, he's gonna she's gonna be a fashion designer. They're gonna be um you know, uh sound cloud rapper. Right. You know, I don't want I don't want to have to deal with being the mother of the Messiah. It's a lot like that's pulling a lot of focus from me. Yeah,

it is. It is that I would become immediately. That's like one of the main reasons I don't think I could ever have kids, as I would be immediately jealous of the baby. Okay, So, so fran Um in the Okay, I want to hear more about about the you know, the Nativity. So Mary's pregnant. Mary's pregnant may may have been sexually assaulted by God. Yeah may, It's entirely possible.

She also maybe is just trying to cover up a part of her story that you know, she doesn't lie out there yet, and everyone's like not respecting her boundaries on this issue. Um. They follow a star, okay, to Bethlehem. A star, Yeah, like a literal star with the star. It's like the North Star, the star of Bethlehem, or like there's a star over the Holy city and you follow it to get there or something like that. I don't understand how that works. It's the I can barely

follow Google Maps. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. It's like, how did they get this pregnant? She was probably like very very young, Like I can. I can without directions get to maybe three places in Los Angeles, which one one of which is the drive through Starbucks I go to every day, the other one is your apartment, and the third one is Target Wow. And so I definitely could not follow a star to a city I've never

been to. No, you can't. But I mean women can't drive, So that's that's maybe part of the Okay, let's move on. That's I feel like. Okay, they go to the inn, they say there's no room. In the end, they say there's been some confusion over rooming here she is. They decide to sleep in a barn because that's all they have available to them, And then I guess, so this is like this has become an Airbnb situation. Yeah, yeah,

this is an Airbnb scenario. And they say, I'm sorry, we're completely booked up for the night, but we have a guest house that on the Airbnb and listing it says it's the entire house, but it's actually on the property, and it's like, you know, you don't have any privacy at all. I hate that because, you know what, in

my search settings, I always click the entire home. But when I first got on Airbnb, I used to do like the room, like where you would sleep in the room of a household, and I would like sleep on in farms. And I actually made friends that way. It was actually kind of fun. But I would never do it. You wanted us to do that. Remember when we were thinking about going away this summer, and there was like a guest barn or something I wanted us if it's

a completely separate house. And we we are days out from our vacation because we haven't planned property properly, and we're looking at listings last minute. Yes, I'm going to get a little desperate, but no, in an ideal scenario, we're not saying staying in a guesthouse. Okay. But Mary and her man, Marry and her Man pulled up um and uh And apparently, according to lore, so did three wiseman and a bunch of animals and a bunch of shepherds and a chorus of angels and what how did

they know what was going down? Well, so that basically angels came to the wise men too, and the shepherds. These angels were kind of like they they love to kind of like send they love to kind of like stir the pot that way. You know. They were really into gossip. They love to kind of like, you know, make it their business to talk about everything that wasn't their business basically, And so they came to Joseph in a dream. They came to the shepherds, and dream they

came to Marry and a dream. They came to the wise Men and they were like, this is the scenario. God looked at Mary and said, look, Mary isn't doing it like the other girls are doing it. And so she is going to have the Messiah because like this is her destiny. And the angels are like, Okayd, like we got you. We're gonna help spread the worst. So Mary has the baby and then they're like, this is the son of God. Yeah. Well, I guess the wise

Men were supposed to basically, I guess they were. They were hired by King Herod to scout out the Messiah and report back so that King Herod could kill him, could kill Baby Jesus. But the angel because you want to kill baby Jesus because King I don't know, King Herod is like trying to you know, be a be a girl boss. He's trying to you know, really like establish his h his authority, and you know, a baby Messiah is really gonna like harsh his game, is it?

Because kings are supposed to be like God on earth and so they didn't want like actual God on earth. I think so, actually, I think that's actually a big part of like the old the breaching from the Old Testament to the New Testament. There there were a lot of like dictators and kings and leaders that were like, I'm Holy, I'm God. And then God was like, let me pull up into Mary's womb and show these girls, well I'm made of Okay, So more so than anyone,

I kind of identify with King Herod Okay. And you know what I'm actually envisioning now is a um a Nativity play in which I play all of the roles, all of share doing west Side stories, which I think would slap. There's gonna be songs as well. I'm sure, yeah, of course, of course, Okay, that would be great. What would the songs be, um? Well, would it be a jukebox musical of just like Christmas songs? Yeah? So anyone specific who we should like do the versions of the

Christmas song. I mean, I'm gonna say, hey, Days of Christmas by Destiny's Child, But that is because oh right, you were telling me that that's like a really important Christmas album for you, and like i mean not even just Christmas album, but like it was very like important in your development. It really it was one of those like rare things that like broke my parents you know, had a lot of cultural walls up, but there were these you know, rare things that would break through, and

my parents would be like, this is okay. Actually I think my dad hated Eight Days of Christmas, but my mom loved it, and so we could listen to that at home. And Destiny's Child, along with basically like every other R and B act from that time, deeply deeply believed in God and talked about it all the time, um on all of their like red carpet whatevers. And so my parents were like, oh, they dig with Jesus.

It's called Destiny. I think Destiny's Child is based on a Bible verse, right, I think I think the actual name is based on like something that something Jesus related. Um, wait, is Destiny's Child Jesus? Wait a second, I'm gonna google this. Destiny's Child. Oh it comes from the Old Testament, the Book of Idea, the Book of Isaiah. Okay, okay, So Destiny's Child was like so you were like not really allowed to us in too secular music. Destiny's Child got

a pass from your parents. Yeah, it got a pass, and specifically the Christmas album, specifically the Christmas album. It was the first time I had ever listened to Destiny's Child or Beyonce period. And then I think, after basically memorizing this entire album as a child, I was like, hmm, Destiny's Child pretty cool, Like what else do they got

going on? And then I checked out like Destiny Fulfilled from the library and like astral Projected, and like, I mean basically like it kind of like broke the mold of my childhood and I started listening to honestly a lot of Beyonce, a lot of Destiny's Child and then um, other things that kind of broke through the mold. Um. But yeah, I don't know, I think, to me, I mean this this album in general, like Eight Days of Christmas is like so um, I think people don't appreciate

it as much as they should. I feel like I, I certainly had never listened to it front to back, but because you said it was so important to you, I did. And it's a great Christmas album, Um, you know I did. I was familiar with their version of Carol on the Bells, which I do think like is the definitive Carol of the Bells right right right, oh a k A opera of the bells or rows. It is like they do really like show off what they

do best in those like harmonic vocals so beautiful. Um. I also really loved the line in um Platinum Bells where where they say something like we used to ask for dolls under the tree and now the dolls are you and me, And I was like the dolls they say that, Yeah, oh my god, that's songwriting, honey, that is songwriting. Not as good as um. I mean, my favorite,

one of my favorite songs is Spread a Little. I don't know if i'd pick a favorite, but spread a Little Love is so good because um they say, um with it don't have been a good time week clowning? Were they hanging out with Rosy o'donald? I also, what a weird thing to like drop in a song. Maybe it just rhymed. Maybe they debuted the song on a Rosie's show because Rosie Show is huge at the time.

Maybe if you weren't you weren't someone if you weren't on that's quite a commitment though to put Rosie like to name drop her on the album, like not just on her live show or whatever. Um. They also do give a nice little Hanuka shot out in that song I appreciated. Um. One thing I thought was interesting was like on their version of Oh Holy Night, it says featuring Michelle Williams, which I thought was interesting considering Michelle

Williams is a member of the group. So I guess like that's the song where she was allowed to sing lead, but like to not great effect. Um. Like you know how they talk about when people are wailing on songs and it's usually in a good context. Um, she was wailing in a bad way. It did not it did not sound great. Um it's featuring Michelle Williamson that this is the only the first and only time they'd let her sing, and she was it was the one song

where she was the lead vocalist of the group. Um. Their version of This Christmas is like kind of ravy because this very interesting production, which I really like. And when Beyonce says, uh, shake a hand, shake a hand y'all, it sounds like she's saying shake a hand job, which SHORE like really broke through to you. Yes, yeah, yeah, absolutely, I mean, like I remember, just like part I would like read all the lyrics, like you know on my fucking you know, first gen like Mac or whatever. I

loved everything about this album. And did you know that Solange I was like heavily across this album and I think she wrote cross and you're using like corporate speak. She was, she was. So I've wrote a lot of songs for Destiny's Child um and for Beyonce actually um. But she I guess she arranged their version of Little Drummer Boy, which is an annoying song objectively, but Solange made it good. So what other Christmas music do you do?

You love? Uh? I love a lot of sad girl Christmas like I love I love like Katy Perry's Do you remember? Okay? Do you remember the Hotel Cafe. The Hotel Cafe presents like all these like indy girls doing Christmas songs and it was an album released exclusively at Starbucks. I don't actually what okay? All of y'all? This is also very important. Hotel Hotel Cafe presents Winter Songs featuring the titular Winter Song by Sarah Burrellas and Ingram Michaelson.

You don't you didn't experience this, okay? So on this album is uh, White Christmas by Katy Perry and she does a completely zero auto tune just Katy Perry and like a little just like a little melody, and she sounds kind of like very flat and very raw, and it sounds really good, honestly. Well, Katy Perry, you know, got her start as a Christian singer songwriter when back when she was back when she was Katherine Hudson. She used to date the lead singer of Reliant. Kay always

comes back to Reliant to really always does. But Fiona Apple has a version of Frosted Snowman on this album as well. It's very good, So you're more into a um like India acoustic Christmas moment. I love all Christmas mus Do you like the She and Him Christmas albums? I do. I like Zoe Dishnell's voice if this was the same space No, no, no, it is. I I also album you know that you know the Weepies They have that song all that I Want? Um. I mean

my Christmas music that I prefer is very poppy. I think the best Christmas album all time is a Christmas Gift for you, the Phil Specter produced album that has like the run Nuts and like Darlene Loves White Christmas and Baby Please Come Home like that to me as the Christmas album. It's the one that I want to listen to. Like the first time of the year that I listened to Christmas music, I want to listen to that. The last time of the year I listened to Christmas music,

I want to listen to that. Then it's also I mean, obviously all I want for Christmas as you. But really I think for the in the past couple of years, Kelly Clarkson's Underneath the Tree has become my true Christmas slap. I think it's an amazing song, I make an amazing album. I think that she really could be the Queen of Christmas if we did not have Mariah carry you know what I mean. I also do like Ariana's Christmas song

Santa tell Me is great Christmas and chills. As a Boca girl, I love winter things because like that experience of living somewhere where it's warm during you know, during the holidays. She's from Florida, right, Yeah, she and I are from the same part of Florida. Wait, I didn't know she was also as a Boca girl. No one of her new makeup line. And if the Shades of Something is called Boca what? Okay? Wait? Sorry you saying

shades brought me back. I just have to say that, um, in the eight Days of Christmas, they say, um, on the eighth day of Christmas, maybe he give to me a pair of Chloe shades and a diamond belly ring. And I have thought about that line ever since I was child, and last Christmas, as a Christmas present to myself, I did buy a discounted pair of Chlothe shades. On essence, I love that. I think I've worn those clothe shades. They weren't really good, They're really they look really good

on me, I end on you. And it is no exaggeration that I bought them exclusively because of Eight Days of Christmas and album. I never would have bought them if if it wasn't for the album. But back to your question, songs that I like, I mean in recent I'm not saying these are classics because, in my opinion, and we disagree on this, no one has created a Christmas a true Christmas classics since all the went for Christmas.

You I didn't say that. I didn't agree, Okay, Um, I just I couldn't think of Yeah, I can't think of what you argue that maybe underneath the Tree transcended. But but it's a it hasn't. It hasn't permeated pop culture the way where I has. Like I understand what you mean is that like all I Want for Christmas as You is the Christmas song like, and it has only grown in popularity since it was released, and it is now I think up there with Winter Wonderland chick like it is one of the songs, and it is

maybe the song. Yes, classics are honestly far and few between. Before that, it was like what last Christmas by Wham maybe in the eighties, like people aren't just aren't cranking out classics or or Lady Gaga's Christmas Tree one of the worst songs she's ever written, but you know, still still slaps. Should we do a live reading of Christmas Tree by by Lady Gaga? I live reading reading lyrics? Yeah, I mean if people are not familiar with the song,

I mean they should. They could also just go listen to it right now. The only place you want to be is underneath my Christmas Tree. Light me up, put me on top. Let's fa la la la la la la la la. Okay, So obviously Christmas music, you know, like sound tracks, another huge part of Christmas for me because, as you know, religious Christmas was the thing for you as as a Jewish girl growing up in book ratone,

I didn't get to participate in any of that. And the only part of Christmas I got to have a part of was secular Christmas and like capitalistic right Christmas, but which I loved, Like I loved Christmas music and I loved Christmas movie. Was it like frowned upon too? It wasn't in your family, like it wasn't frowned upon to like do Christmas things wasn't. No, But it's just we didn't do it because we were Jewish. Um, but I loved Christmas movies. I loved Love actually obviously Family Stone. Yeah,

I did like it when it came out. I haven't watched it in a while, so maybe i'll need to watch it this year. Rewatch it when when you when we also rewatched The Holiday, we'll watch the Well The Holiday, I think is my favorite Chris like contemporary Christmas movie. And um, okay, So earlier this year, it was really windy in l A. And I was on the phone with my mom. She was like, oh, what's the weather, Like she always asked me that, and I'm always like,

it's the same every day, Mom, I live in Los Angeles. Um, but it happened to be very windy that day and I was like, oh, yeah, it's like really weirdly windy. And she was like, oh must be, Um, I've heard of this thing, the Santa Anna Winds And I said, yes, Mom, I've seen the Holiday too, and she lost it because, like I clucked her so hard because I knew, because I knew that that's that is the absolute only way she knew about the Santa Anna wins because my mom.

If there's one thing my mom's gonna do, it's watch whatever E is playing. And during the Christmas season, they played The Holiday like at least twice a day, three days, cycling through Nancy Myers films until they get to Christmas, and my and my mom will watch The Holiday like in the middle of the summer, like one of the favorite movies that used to be. I used to watch it so many times a year. That was definitely a favorite for me. It's still good. It's so good. I mean,

I don't know, I know it it is. Really it really sucks that Kate Winslet ends up with Jack Black. It's disarming, it's Cameron dis gets Drew Law. But that was a part of it. That was I think. I think, honestly they should have just like done an incest and Kate and Cameron should have ship. That would have been really hot. Jude Law, not just Jude Law, but Jude Law wearing glasses. Oh my goodness. That really did it. And you know, it makes sense at the end of

the movie. Makes sense because Cameron Diaz does have big stepmother energy. She does, and so do I. Honestly, I can't I can't wait to be someone's stepmom someday stepmom. Also a Christmas movie I've never seen it? Is that the one with Um with Susan Sarandon and Julia Roberts. I've never seen that. I thought you met Um. What's the one where Julia Roberts wears the bob Oh Mother's Day? Muster's Day another seasonal film? Oh my god, but not

quite what we are talking about. She's wearing this fucking but who did that to her? Okay? But I love the family, STONE love the holiday. In my family, we were like a tim Allen family, and so we loved the Santa Claus. My family obviously loved Home Improvement. Tim Allen, famously a Republican um talking about how it's really hard to be a report bligan in Hollywood. Um, yeah, not Santa Claus, isn't it for me? But really no? But Dr seuses The Grinch who Still Christmas starring Jim Carey.

I think one of the best films of the last twenty five years. Of course, well the moment when Christine Brancy comes out in her like ninety robe and she's like hello, no, no, no no, she says, here's what she says. She goes Betty Hi just oozing sexual energy. Like, how did the movie's rating not get changed to an R because of Christine Bransky with her tits out like that out? And there's isn't there a moment where someone at like accidentally smushes their face and like her tits. Oh my god,

that's crazy. That was like a whole that's like a punchling that exists across like all of the wrong comes of the air, like someone accidentally falling into someone's cleavage. Betty Hi and Molly Shannon and that movie Taylor Momson who would go into Snap and Gossip Girl and as the lead singer of the pretty reckless. She's in gossip Girl. Yeah, she's Jenny Humphrey, Little j I've never seen, You've never seen there, gonna do it well. Also, gossip Girl has

some great holiday episodes, my favorite. Well, I mean, I've really only watched the first three seasons of the original Gossip Girl, and the first season has an amazing Christmas episode. Really, okay, we'll watch the first season together. We'll get it there. Um, I did the Grin? How the Grins Christmas? Jim Carrey's

Grinch did that precede Elf with Will Ferrell? I remember? Okay, Okay, So then to me, maybe Elf is like the most recent Christmas classic added to the Cannon, because I would say, even though it's kind of a bro comedy, like Elf is like Cannon. Now maybe Yeah, I it's not really the movie for me, although, is that kind of what gave us Zoe Deschanelle. Yeah, it was her breakout and she's blond in it, Yeah, famously weird, she looks crazy

and she sings, Yeah, she sings. And then there's this movie that came out recently called Last Christmas starring Henry

Golding and the Game of Thrones. Girl, Oh my god, I borrows so many tropes from ELF, like I think she sings too, and like, okay, so Last Christmas I saw like a press screening of it, and and um, the moment where you find out that at the end spoiler spoiler that okay, So the whole movie is about how Henry Golding is like in love with Kalisi from Game With and Klisi is like this like grumpy shop girl who hates Christmas kind of and and he's a ghost as you find out, And then you find out

at the end that he died the year before and Amilia Clark had like a heart disease and she got his heart. So it literally the premise of the movie is is Wayam's Last Christmas where they say last Christmas, I gave of you my heart. It does. But also when that twist was revealed in the movie, but I gasped and then cackled, Rose, that is so dumb. But I did, But I didn't see it coming. Did you see it coming? I knew that he was a ghost immediately, but you didn't. But you never thought that they would

be dumb enough to actually make that the lyrical. The lyrical inspired twist is next level twisting of like idiot culture like that. But but to me, I knew he was. He wasn't interacting with anything, and like the first thing, I was like, well, that's a ghost. My favorite part in the song Last Christmas is in the second verse when George goes Christmas wrapped it up and said, a

song is so beautiful. Carlyway Jeffson's rendition of Last Christmas, as well as Taylor Swift's rendition of Class Christmas both very good. I really like Taylor's Christmas song, which only came out two years ago, Christmas Tree Farm, but she released a different version of it this year because I didn't see that. It's kind of like an old timey version, and it's like it's weird because like, obviously she's doing all these re recordings, but this song she owns the

the you know, she owns it. I didn't know that. But she's still made another version of it because she's just on a roll. I guess I didn't know that. Literally the other day I was like, you know what, Taylor really needs to be cranking out some Christmas classics here, like she really, but she has um she only has one, you know, like canonical Christmas song. But she has a couple of songs like Tis the Damn Season, which are

Christmas well. But the thing is she she needs to crank some more out our Phoebe Bridges is going to laugh her because a few Taylor is not gonna be lapped by anyone. I'm being facetious. I'm trying to Taylor will do a Christmas album. Actually, oh my god, I would lose my mind. Maybe when she's a little older. Oh, I forgot about Taylor's New Year's Day. Yes, that's a holiday. It's a holiday song. Holidays not one of my favorites from reputation, but I do love I do love reputation.

I don't love reputation, but I do love that song. Um yeah, I mean the She and Him Christmas. Casey Kasey Musgraves has like two Christmas albums. I actually I'm not a choice on stand but Glittery with It's a really good song. It's a great it's cute. Okay, fine, you can understell it. That's fine, that's fine. The War on Christmas was like, maybe not my family wasn't so Bible thumpy that they were on the kind of like

Megan Kelly level. We're on Christmas conversation, but things like that, like we're a part of Like I mean, why I don't know there was like such a clash between like secular Christmas and Christian Christmas, you know what I mean. Yeah, I guess I'd like never really understood any of that because I grew up with Hanukkah as the winter holiday, and like I mean, like I'm already such a My family is such a were My family were reformed Jews, so like already we are like very separate from the

religiosity of Hanukkah. And Hanika is not one of the big Jewish holidays, like it only really has been beefed up so that Jews have something comparable to Christmas around the winter. Are there any Hanukah bops? Um? I mean there's Adam Sandler's Hanakah songs like that. That's it. Um. Yeah, Nica is just like Hanaka is just not a big deal. And also I think it makes it difficult that, Um, the Jewish calendar is a lunar calendar, so Hanukah is

different every year. So this year Hanuka Honica starts today, which is the Sunday after day recording. Well, that's crazy. I like the years where it coincide it's with Christmas, but also like it doesn't matter because Hankah is not. It's not it like my favorite Jewish holidays Passover and and Passover is like probably one of our most important holidays and of the Prince of Egypt and it's impact on that. We do both love the Prince of Egypt.

That was like a huge again, one of those things that like bridges the mainstream and like you know where I was at the time. But they were all so hot and they had big titties. You know. My family we would watch it as a family, as like a group activity, and we'd be like, oh my god, this is such a beautiful retelling of a Bible story. And I was just like horn neat because like Joseph and like all these other girls have like, you know, big titties.

They never skipped cheste they all look incredible. And isn't the casting for this Wait I need Michelle Pfiffer's in it, Sandra Bullock, Val Kilmer, Yes, wait wait, it's like an insane like list of people like Martin or yeah, Martin short, Ralph Finds and Jeff Goldbloom, Danny Glover, Patrick Stewart, Steve Martin, and Helen Mirren. Wait, who got all these Not only did they get all these people, but they also got Mariah and Whitney to record their first and only duet

slash performance together. I wish they'd done a Christmas song. Yeah, it's actually a shame that. I mean, Whitney does have a really beautiful Christmas album, but I don't think this is such slender. I don't know if Whitney had a song that really popped through Christmas culture the way Sonny Maria is dead. Not to pick them against each other, but I just did Ye. Did you get Christmas presents going up? Even though you celebrated? I got there, I

got Hanakah presents. Um. What I think like the holiday gifts for me were always demystified because I always like asked for something very specific and got it, so there was no like element of surprise. Um. And to this day, I'm just bad at gift giving. I try, I really, I really love to give people things, and I love to give people things that they want, but it's really

hard for me to figure out what that is. So I have been actively trying to learn into it, and like I try, I keep a running list of gift ideas, both like things that are like specific to people and what they will want, and also just like general things that I think will make good gifts for the people

that I want to give gifts to. Sometimes inspiration does strike me and I'll like, know what to get someone Like for your last birthday, I got you about to project her and that's something that I had like thought of months before, and it was like, oh, that's the perfect gift for France, right, But it's you know, I hold space for that you are a product of your upbringing, that's in your fault. They're they're really two kinds of

households when it comes to the gifting process. And there are households where it's like, here is the list, I this is what I will expect you to deliver on these exact gifts because around my list where you just get a gift card or whatever. And then there are the families like mine that are like, we need the surprise and delight and the element of surprise, and yeah, at a certain point, my my mom just started giving me money to buy myself something I wanted. Um, I

think actually so antithetic. Actually today actually today if she I like sent her an essence link to a bag I wanted and she was like, Okay, I'm gonna send you money so you can buy no blasphemous. Okay, listen, but but I need p s A. If you are a parent, please bestow the true meaning of Christmas, which is surprising gifts, Gifts that that transcend what they thought they wanted from Christmas, like they didn't even know they needed the thing that you are giving them. That is

what it means to give a good Christmas present. That is a true meaning of Christmas. Um, friend, you are an amazing gift giver. And last Christmas you gave me the most. Last Christmas, you gave last Christmas, you gave me your heart, your heart, my heart as no, but last Christmas you gave did give me a weapon, which is the best Christmas gift I've ever received. As I got you a taser, you got me a taser which I immediately tried to use on both you and myself.

I have video footage, yes, um yeah, maybe virgins, we will post the footage. Maybe it was a pink taser, It was a girl Boss tailor and and virgins. Let us know what are some of like the Christmas gifts or holiday gifts that you've gotten that have stuck with you, like, or if you have any weird rituals around gifts like my action for you're rewrapping. Um, if you've ever gotten a weapon, I would love to know. I did apparently

find out. Okay, So over Thanksgiving, my sister in law's parents, my sister in law's mom was telling me about these superstitions that their family has, which is, um, you can't give people anything sharp as a gift because it's bad luck. So you like, I've never heard that before, So like you could never, um give someone like a knife set as a gift, And to me, a set of knives

is like the best thing I could get. You heard that, and you went to all the presents you bought for people this year, and it's just it's just it's just loosen it's just loose knives. Yeah, it's a it's a tote bag full of loose knives. Blades yeah, yeah, candy and razor blades. Um, I mean I should maybe I Well, that just gave me an idea of your Christmas present this year. I would love to know, Fran, what is

on your Christmas list this year? You know, Rose, the only thing on my list this year is unconditional love from you. Well you have that for me? Oh do I really? Rose? Thank you. That's the true spirit of Christmas. You were one of the few people who I love unconditionally for now. That's so very so. I guess it is so. I guess it is conditional love because it's unconditional for now. This is you, you descending the staircase

as Taylor Momson singing where are You Christmas? To me personally, Oh my god, Faith Hills version of Where Are You Christmas? Which the music videos on the DVD, and I have watched that ship so many times. I already got one of your presence. I'm very excited about it. You're getting me something. Oh my god, I did not expect that. Shut up, Shut up. A there's like, you know, some clothes I want. There a lot of times I like

things that I wouldn't buy for myself. But um, that is I think the essence of buying a Christmas gift. It should be something that you know the other person will like, something that they will actually use, and something they wouldn't buy for themselves and the layer that I put onto those prerequisites, which I think that is a very good Like you know, I think like a list of things that you need on Christmas gift is something

that they maybe would not expect. I think it's it's good if you can evade like what they think their gift is going to be. I mean, the worst gifts to get are things that they're they don't want, aren't going to use. Um, like you know, getting someone like, um, you know, a gross candle. I mean, candles are great gifts, but getting them like well, actually I'll take any candle. I'll take literally any candle, but I already have way

too many candles. Please don't get me, you know, like don't get don't get people gift cards, even though I will probably get my whole family gift cards is the worst gifts. Um. I will get things sent to my parents house and it will say this is friends do not open like on that that's like what I fill out on the like address line. It says like franz

do not open and they know that those are gifts. Um. My mom like brought up something that I had hadn't thought about, which is I have a nephew who just turned to year old, and now we have someone in the family that we can do one present night for again, like that is the Yeah, that is I know, but it's like it's not about that. It's about like the experience.

And and um, if I had kids, I wouldn't get them presents or they have like cognitive you know memory, Like that is the one nice part of being a kid during Hanukah is getting one president night for eight nights beautiful. Um, do you ever have like a bomb asked Hanka present on the eighth night or one of the nights where like I cannot believe I got this because for me it was maybe and sixty four and the harvest the game of Harvestman that they bought for me. Yeah, me,

And I think like no, no, no, wow. Maybe I'm gonna have to get you a Hanako present this year that'll blow your blow your tits off. I don't know. I would actually if you blew my tits off, I would like a new pair of tips. No. Oh, that is actually a great present is if someone got me just just a little baby rhino plows? Yeah, no, if what I would love for Okay, here's what I want

for Christmas. I want you to kidnap me, put me under anesthesia, get me breast implants of facial feminization surgery UM and an orchiactomy, and I want to wake up two weeks later like most of the way healed. That is okay. I want my bill Faro pastic plasty. That's when you get you make your face more symmetrical. I guess as I've googled this, this all sounds great. I'm very in the how would that that be gifted to you?

I guess that through the kidnapping. It would be kidnapping and you would pay for it, and I would pay. You would front the hoss. Yeah, we can't use your insurance or out of pocket. Out of pocket yeah yeah, I know. No copas baby UM. A good Christmas gift I usually the past couple of years have gotten for myself is fillers and botox. If you got me a half of vial for Christmas, that would be an excellent present. That is a good present. How much is half a vial?

Even for not It's you have to pay per syringe, right right? Per synge tho surrenge is like what a syringe? The place I goes four. D Oh, that's not bad. Yeah, okay, I have to do um what else? What else do I usually like get myself for the holidays? I did Um.

I think the gift I'm going to give myself this year is I might finally block the guy that I went on one date with a couple of years ago, who now replies to every single one of my Instagram stories that is um the worst, the worst genre, either with like the fire emoji or like if I'm like at a restaurant or something, he's like, why are you there without me? Like we went on one date. I had one date three years ago. One stop it. I had a horrible, horrible date with an extremely we didn't

even hook up. Wait really you make out? No? What? Yeah? You really? You really made an impact on this guy? I did, But that's that's he didn't shoot his shot and that's not my fault. And I don't know why he's I don't know why he's now like forced this like uh, synthetic digital intimacy on me. But I think it's because you have like, you know, reversed intimacy subtiles, reversed intimacy styles, because like in your head, if you

don't have sex on the first day or interaction. It's basically like it's like I don't even you know, it's you don't have anything to do with it. I feel sometimes, yeah, I think that's what happened in this case. As we're like, oh, you're trying to make things now, it's like there we go, um because like you know, we didn't even like we didn't even kiss, but you were you weren't just you just weren't into it. Um No, I was. He just didn't shoot his shot, right, Yeah, I I need guys

to play offense. I can relate to that. I mean, no, I'm I'm fine like being the aggressor. But I remember he like I think he maybe had an early flight the next day, and like that's why he didn't try anything. And then he like moved right after that, and then I moved in the pandemic. But like, none of this even matters. But why, like it's just I'm now spending more energy on this than even deserves. I went on one terrible date with a very hot MSUs, a very dumb,

very hot massus. One of the worst dates I've ever been on for so many different reasons. He and then he ghost me like I even tried to hang out, like I have a follow up to this very bad day because he was so hot, because I'm pathetic and I don't like myself. We we never, you know, meet up again months later, months and months later, he replies to one of my Instagram stories where I'm watching drag race and he says, can I borrow your paramount plus password?

And I was like the audacity of this man? That's crazy, that is this is the genre of person we're talking about. UM. One gift. A good thing to gift yourself is Christmas sex with someone. I've never had to Christmas sex. I don't. I don't think i've never nor have I gifted that to myself. What is that? Just? You go on Grinder and you you kind of yeah, you're just like make it happen. You set it up for Christmas. I don't do that. I I like someone to set it up

with me. I don't. I don't like being the person that has to. But no one ever approaches me. My mom says, it's because I'm intimidating. You are intimidating, but like, you don't, you don't, you don't think you are, but you are no, no, no, not in like a grinder's days. I think in any spaces really wow, I would never Well, the virgins canna design for us in the comments is for un intimidating or not let us know. Do you think I'm I think I am intimidating. Everyone knows you're

extremely instating. Well, we talked a lot today about Christmas movies, and next week we're going to be talking about something that is technically a Christmas movie, but I but I don't think people really think of it as one because it mostly just takes place during the Christmas season. Very incidentally, but next week, our last episode of the year, we will be talking about Moonstruck, which is an extremely important

film for both of us. So all y'all better to do your homework, okay for count Yea, So please stay tuned watch Moonstruck get a Makeover if you have a chail, of course, and you know this week we did we had some potentially contentious takes about like smith classics in the movie and music space. So if you feel a type of way about why a certain movie or like an album or something belongs in the cannon, I actually

would really like to know from you. Also, as always, you can call us and leave us a message at three to three pennants that is three two three seven three six two six two three tell us about that thing that you are still so obsessed with that if you find out someone in your life doesn't really know anything about it, you have to tell them about it. Like this podcast. You have to tell all your friends about this podcast, which, by the way, you can leave

us a review on Apple Podcasts. I'm your go host fr in Toronto, and you can find me at friends, squish Co wherever you want. On social media, I'm Rose Damn You. You can find me at Rose Damn You. On Twitter and Instagram. You can subscribe to Like a Virgin anywhere you listen to podcasts, and as Frand said, leave us a review. Like a Virgin is an i

Heeart radio production. Our producers Phobe Ounter was support from Lindsay Hoffman, Julian Weller, Jess Crane Chitch and Nikki Etor See you next week, threw Jinsh