Getting Better at Marriage with Anna Faris

want more. I just want that face in my face, that fucked up, scrunchy face. I do know which time I spend on TikTok and Instagram looking at chow videos. It's so pathetic. And then the and they come in so many different colors and sizes. There's white, there's black, there's orange, there's brown ones. Did I ever tell you I had a chow mix growing up. Yeah, he was a German chopherd chow, but he looked much more chow. His name was Buster. I think is a dominant thing.

Child's have any child that it's the dominant trait, just like you know, he had like the purple tongue and everything. He was just there, just the cutest dog. So that's my latest venture is to find a dog because I've spent so much time at home that I can just give the dogs to my bell to finally this it'll just repeat. Talk about repeating a cycle of abuse, I'm basically repeating a cycle of just not being considered a

real parent exactly. But now you have Joe in your life, so he can like help co parent and you know, yeah, more experiencing parenting it than I do, so I guess he would be a good po co parent. He just doesn't like when the dogs sleep in our bed, which I you know, I do, Like you want that, I want that body. I like when I hear Bernie's snore in the middle of the night age. I frecking love that. It makes me laugh. In the middle of the night.

The other night, there was like I don't know what was going on, but she came up to the doggy steps and she was whining like she do and she never does that, and I look up and she's like, can I come in? And it was basically like can she come into bed? Because Joe wasn't there. I was like, yeah, bitch, get up here, let's do this. I was like, I

will staple you to the bed. You have to. I even like when Mimsy like kicks me in the night, like she wants to sleep in between my legs and she like kick to Like, I want someone who wants me all the time. That's the kind of dog I'm looking for. I thought I didn't like that because I had that in Chunk, But I'm ready for round two of Chunk exactly. Well. We have a quick update from Tara, who called it on one of our episodes, and she

was coming out. She was married to a man, but she was coming out as a lesbian and I was gonna like talk to her family, and she was on Lily Saying's episode, Yeah, yeah, I remember. So she said, things have been going well for me after I told my mother, which turned out to be somewhat of a heart crusher. I did take Chelsea and Lily's advice and basically stopped giving a shit about who I had to come out to and how I was going to do it.

I took the same approach to coming out as I do when people ask me why I don't have social media. My life is none of anyone's fucking business. My advice to anyone else in the same situation as this, your life is your story, nobody else's. You will share different chapters with different people. Some will be great, some will be not so great. But you choose how it's told and who you tell it to. And always remember, when it feels like you're turning your life upside down, you're

actually turning it right side up. Tara, Oh God, lovely, just look at this little ripple effect this podcast is having, giving people time to share their problems and then them taking advice and making changes in their lives. What a nice, nice development. You guys, We love the feedback. Always send it in and if you want to send in any questions, it's at Dear Chelsea Project at gmail dot com. Mmm, let me just put my bifocals on. Okay, let me mention some show dates I have coming up. I am

winding down my summer dates. I'll see everybody in Hawaii July first and July three Honolulu Cahuli, so I'll be on Oahu and Maui, and then July I'll be in Montreal. The just for last festival and August twelve, two shows in Vancouver, and then Calgary August and August four, and then I just added another twenty two cities after that. If you go to Chelsea Handler dot com. If I haven't already been to a city near you, I'm definitely coming to a city near you then, so check Chelsea

Hamdler dot com. Four tickets. Today's guest is Anna farm Ship. Today's guest has her own podcast as well. It's called Unqualified Please Welcome on a Forest. No, today's guest has our own podcasts as well. It's called Unqualified. Please welcome. Anna Ferris Hi. Hello, Hello, Oh my god, look at how the tables have turned turned turned. You were the first original person to ever have a podcast, right well after Mark Maron. I was the first original. You invented podcasting,

and boy do I regret it. I know, look at what Look at what a ship show? And now everybody has a fucking podcast. People, unborn babies have them. Oh my god. Like in two thousand fifteen, I was able to say I think I'm starting a podcast and people would inevitably be like, what is that again? And I would say, like, cereal, you know that's thing that's going around and now here I am, and you know, well, you should just remind people that it was one of

the original podcasts, you know. Yeah, I've actually had one since. Yeah, I'll remind all my guests. Yeah, I think that's a good actually opening statement and opening thesis, if you will. Can I be a guest and open with a clunty you're going to pull some ship like that on us. I knew it. I fucking know your ship and I knew you were gonna go yeah, because I know you just had my lover on Joe Coy. He was on your podcast recently. I adore him. Who doesn't, Oh my god?

He was so to great guest. So wait, though, when you guys had known each other forever, when when did it turn to romance? The first penetration happened last August. We were friends forever, but we hadn't been hanging out for many years. I hadn't seen him, and then he resurfaced, and then he would not get the funk out of

my face, you know what I mean. He was on it and on it, and he kept re resurfacing, and even I went away for three and a half months, and we kind of kept in touch and then it just turned into like, all of a sudden one day, I just was like, oh, wait a second, I think that this is my guy, Like this is it. But that's a major shift in mentality. I mean, he probably crushed on you forever. That's because, you know, because it's a it's a little I don't know in my experience.

I guess that most guys who are friends with me back in the day because I don't have any friends anymore. But that's so Anna, so you you're always talking about you have no friends, which is ridiculous. I think, well, that's a it's a different subject, I suppose because I think I'm lazy and I'm a hermit. I kind of enjoy my own company. And also we have three kids. Now this is all born I want to talk about.

That's not boring. This is your life. The last thing my listeners need to hear is more shit about Joe Koy and me, because that's all we talk about. So we do need to talk about you. Act. I'm just so happy for you. I'm so happy for you. I appreciate that, like, and making that mental switch from friend to lover is kind of difficult, don't you think, yeah,

I do think. I mean, it's not difficult because the ease with which you can be yourself with that person outweigh any difficulties that surround that kind of transition, because it's really not difficult, you know. I mean, I suppose if we were having it had a fair that would have been difficult, you know, if one of us had been cheating on somebody or whatever. But it was just so pure and nice and like everyone was rooting for us.

And that was also one element that I wasn't ever expecting because if you know, you had told me I was going to date somebody else who's well known, I would be like, no, no, now, I'm not doing that. That's the last I wanted, like a finance guy. And then I found out how fucking boring finance guys are.

So it's much better to be with somebody that you know, you think is cool, Like I think Joe is cool, Like he everybody thinks he's cool, you know, and he's definitely cooler than I am in terms of my family dynamic, like all my nieces and nephews now just think Joe is like the coolest, and I fucking love that. Because

pressure is off. I'm sick of being cool. I want to like a time out, you know, I just want to be alone and do my thing and smoke a joint on the beach and not be asked too many questions. My enthusiasm for life is different than it used to be. Like now, I really enjoyed my solitude. So I can relate to what you're saying about being a bit of a recluse. When you said that it would be like difficult if there was infidelity involved. You do not seem like a person who is a cheater. Is that right?

You know I wouldn't cheat on somebody. I would just break up with them. That's so mean. Well that's because that's how I've always perceived you as being. Maybe proud is is incorrect, but sort of the idea of like proudly straightforward. Yes, I'd like to be direct. I don't like to mess with Like if people have a decision, if they want to be around you, you know, you give them the information that they need. Here's the truth. If you don't like it, I totally get it, but

here it is. So if I were to do that, I would be very upfront about it. But I'm not like that, like, I just wouldn't even get myself into a situation where I mean that's maybe when I was younger, Yeah, when I was a little bit more reckless. Now I'm like, I'm not going to hurt somebody in that way. I don't want to be responsible for anybody being in pain. I I think that's amazing. So anyway, that's enough about me.

On a we're near, we're here to talk about you, and then we're gonna give advice to callers, so you don't even have to talk about it, so you don't even have to talk about yourself for so long. So just I want you to think about that as we go into this next phase of the interview. I love it. But you did mention that you are with three children now, and I know that you have one, so the other two I'm assuming came from your new husband. Yes, they're teenagers,

fifteen and eighteen. Oh whoof, that's a far cry from what you were dealing with. Oh man, And I am the youngest child. I was a camp counselor, so I had that experience, and I was a really shitty babysitter. There's a peanut allergy story. I didn't believe in allergies. Anyway, whatever, I almost killed a kid. It could have been a whole different life for me, But being a step mom

has been I'm still learning, I really am. I felt at first like I wanted to be kind of like this wild, new, reckless person in their lives because I was also going through a divorce, and so I had that Now that I'm like a divorce veteran because I've been divorced twice, there is this kind of shift that happens. Especially it hit hard the first time I turned into somebody that I didn't recognize, Like I was always the kind of person that had their fridge filled and I

hosted a lot of dinners. That was back when I had friends a time, long, long, long time ago. But then I found myself in this apartment with just beer and mustard in the fridge and I and I was going out all the time. I had no one to text or call and say, hey, can I do this? Essentially, it was incredibly liberating, and I reverted to you know, like seventeen years old. I went to a bar. I was like, yeah, dangerous. I would have done something like that at seventeen as well. I was down to get

busy with whatever. And I also took a lot of pride in knowing that I could handle more drugs than anybody else and I would still be able to like get us home or navigate something some situation to get us taken care of. I took a lot of pride in that, And that's rebellion and recklessness. Obviously. I never I was never promiscuous, though. Is that like an old time term? I think so. I think so. I was never promiscuous, but because I was terrified, I was terrified

that I wasn't a good lover. I was terrified that, especially young. When I was younger, I was so self conscious of my body. I didn't want anybody to see it, but I would dance on the edges of it. I wanted to be desired desperately. Right, How long was your first marriage? Two and a half years? So dollars? Okay, okay, poppy that? And then how long was your second marriage? Ten years? About ten years? Was it? You're getting better at a year? Eight years? Yeah, you know, it's kind

of how I feel about Chelsea lately. I don't know if it was eight years or ten years. So you're getting better at it. Though a ten year marriage is is not not success. It's not a it's it was ten years. I think it was like seven, but it wouldn't. Yeah, but we were together for ten years. But anyway, Yeah, I think there is it's slow growth on my end. Yeah, well,

some of us are a little bit more. I feel like there's areas in my life where I've matured in a short amount of time as a little kid, and then there are areas in my life where I'm still acting like a little girl. Chelsea. I feel like you and I might have this in common. I don't know, but I think this time it has been easier for me to accept a lot of love. It's still it's like I still kind of struggle with it. But are

you like that though? If there's so much love, like I think just when I was younger, if there was a lot of love, like I must have subconsciously liked a chase or something that I don't know. It feels healthier though, whatever it is. It feels like I can be loved. Yeah, right, which is such a It feels like a corny thing to say, but it's true for

many of us. You know, it's the same way we feel about compliments when people are unwilling to receive compliments, like you know, I don't know if those two things are related, but like I don't like a lot of adulation. I don't like a lot of people telling me to my face how great they think I am. I love it. For them to be doing it behind my back, that's fine, but don't involve me in that, you know, Like it's it's uncomfortable. And then I have to say thank you

and thank you and thank you. And I've spent to I'll like in an ordinate amount of my time saying thank you to whether it's my fans backstage at a show telling me, you know, nice things about myself. It's like that becomes too much and then it loses its meaning, right, it doesn't affect you in the same way it should each time. Joe Coy is very good at receiving adulation and adoration. He loves that. And I know what you're saying about that, but I wonder if that is connected

to the love part. It could be, yeah, because for a while, it would be annoying to have somebody adore you that much. It's like there's a revulsion there. But that revulsion is a protection over your own person. You're trying to preserve yourself and not get hurt to the point where you would have be vulnerable to them, right. You know, my mom is an but was this stunning,

stunning woman. She grew up dirt poor, she had to get like all her teeth fixed and stuff, but she really like, I kind of want to show you a picture. But she never complimented my physical appearance. And because I was such a late bloomer at chubby cheeks, I wore headgear for fucking years. I think my parents did that to me because they wanted me to stay a virgin, even though even though their atheist, I it was that was that was one of the struggles of my life

for sure. So I think that I can accept compliments that are about my work well, and I'm very grateful for that. But especially in Hollywood, like fear at a thing and everybody looks beautiful and someone is like, oh, you look so beautiful, I can't absorb that very well, at least it's a little too much. So I just you know, got fake boobs and mayor. That was my strategy, and I decided to have no more friends. She's like, that's it. It's me myself and I that's right. I

feel like i've met your mother. When I have met your mother, maybe yeah, maybe there was a party at my house once, and I believe you were there with your mother. This was many many years ago. God was I there with my mother? Why would I do that? Oh? My god? Where else would I have met her? Or maybe I met her when I when I did your podcast when year at your house, it was definitely in a house setting. That feels right. I think that's right.

I think that's what it was. That was when you were still married to Chris, because he was outside drinking a beer. There was another guy, and then you and I were at your old house recording the podcast. Ok, this is my mother on her honeymoon. Like she has like she looks like something from that movie, that surfing movie, Gidgets surfing movie. Totally, she had like that whole look,

but she didn't know it. She's very uncomfortable. I think that because it was her identity, Like it was kind of how she broke through and she met my dad. But she never played it up. She was always I mean, as far as I know, they've only slept with each other, you know, getting back to my parents weird philosophy about sex, But what's your relationship with your mother? Like now we're

really close, We're really close. She had a tremendously difficult childhood, and as I get older, I can see how that really affected her, and it's kind of it's really remarkable that she is is as great as of a mom as she is. I think, I mean her parents. I just never told this story. I'll tell it if you guys don't mind. Her parents One Easter when I was nine,

they had this really dumpy family cabin. They lived in a you know, a very very modest home that was kind of falling apart, and they also had this really dumpy cabin on an island, beautiful islands in Washington State, And we were all there for Easter and I was using the bathroom in there was one bathroom and uh, I could hear a lot of shouting and then the door gets kicked in by my grandpa and I'm like on the pot And he's always been weird anyway, always

made me incredibly uncomfortable, and he said get outside, I'm getting the gun. So we're all like my aunt like shoves us all into the station wagon where we're all hovering, Well, my grandpa has this massive gun that my uncles are wrestling away from him. And I think about, like, it was scary. It was scary, but I didn't even know how scary it could have been. He was such a violent, unpredictable man, and I think he had this hold on my mom and her sisters. It was so she came

from that and I admire her so much. Yeah, that's pretty scary stuff to deal with as a child. As an adult, it's scary, but as a child in not knowing if you're safe or not, I think it's like the number one thing that we all wrestle with. And to stop perpetuating that cycle, right, like to put an end to that cycle, so that that cycle abuse doesn't continue,

because that's what happens with families. You know, somebody does something and then the kid does it, and then the kid's an abuse it and then it's like, well fuck. I mean, I guess our whole if you want to be like thinking of it on a really spiritual level, our whole entire existence and purpose should be into creating new imprints, right, and new memories and stopping any cycle of negativity which is impossible to do because you're a

human being. I think that's an amazing sentiment and important for parents to remember. Yeah, parenting is a tough you know, a really tough job, and a lot of people go into it thinking that it's like very one dimensional, like I can't believe I'm gonna love this thing as much as I do, or I'm gonna be loved as much as I want to be loved because I didn't get the love that I needed. You know, it's one of those two things are usually the basis of wanting a

child is to give or receive the love. And it's like, if you could take care of that on your own before you have a kid, then imagine how healthy you can make that kid. It completely, completely. I'm really proud that Jack, the son that I have with Chris, he's nine and he is such an even keeled kid. He is hysterical, he's smart, he's and he's just and he's confident but without being a jerk. That's that's the key for any man being raised is to be confident without

being arrogant. Yeah, I'm really proud of that. Well, that's good. I'm glad you have an adorable son with him, and I'm glad that you guys are able to co parent in such a nice, healthy way. That's going to be great for him as he grows up. And I'm sure, actually that's probably what we're going to turn to. I'm sure we have some parenting questions. And since since out of the three of us, Anna, you're the only parent

on this podcast today, you better get yourself Yeah, buckle up. Truly, I live in a community that makes me feel like a terrible parent every day. Well, I think that's the community and organic and like the what you didn't know the assignment was due? Yeah, maybe helicoptering less than some people, you know, Definitely. Yeah. I tried helicopter parenting with my dogs and that backfired, So I no longer I am a helicopter parent. Well, we'll take a quick break and

we'll be back with some questions. Okay, and we're back with Auta Faris and Catherine my co host. Hi, Hi, Hi, Well. Our first question comes from Liza. She says, Dear Chelsea, my husband and I have been successful stoners for many years. My chronic depression and anxiety took a turn for the worst this past winter. And I decided I needed to get sober and clean for my mental health after drowning myself in cannabis on a daily basis for two years. I've just hit my thirty day clean mark and I'm

feeling better than ever. We're discussing starting a family soon, and I'd like him to refrain from using for some time before we conceive, to try and have the healthiest baby possible. When I quit initially, he took a short break, but is back to daily usage. When I brought up my concerns, he got very defensive and told me he supported my journey but wanted no part of it. Am I overstepping by asking my husband to quit while we

try to conceive? Liza M I don't know. Medically speaking, I mean, I'm sure there's merit in that finding that marijuana causes weak sperm or the sperm that you get isn't going to be top notch. Well, there's less, right, it like suppresses the sperm count. I think, oh, well, I have no problem with that, but um, hon, you

go ahead. Well, I think the important information I think is his behavior, right if he's kind of checked out and if he's not connecting with her in a way that she likes, you know, or if they're not having enough sex it feels like there's If it sort of reassures and a firms her journey, that's one thing. It's another thing if she's annoyed fundamentally that she's clean, and it's another thing if his behavior changes lies that we

need more info. Yeah, we need that's true. And if if he is kind of like a dune and doesn't get a lot done and isn't that motivated, fine, and that's his own issue. But I would also say that, like when you do something in detox and like go on a clans or a diet, you really shouldn't be trying to corral other people into it. If that's not the way to get anybody to join in, the best way to do is to exhibit your behavior and your changes and let that person catch on if they want,

you know, let them go, oh wow. It's like Joe and I go to the gym every morning. I have to work out every morning. That's my routine. And sometimes he comes with me, and sometimes he doesn't. But the only reason he comes with me is because when he feels like, well, ship, you do this all the time, I want to level up, Like I want to be

like that too, but I don't make him go. Your analogy is funny because I was thinking, it's like there is a layer here, I don't know if lies A feels this way or whatever, where if somebody has a new workout routine and they got to tell you all about it, Yeah, that's annoying. Yes, it's like someone telling you about their dream every day. It's like you felt these things. But this makes no sense to me, and I don't think you should really fucking read into any

of this ship anyway. So I think that Liza needs to kind of figure out what elements of his usage makes her kind of irritated and to gauge it. And maybe it is like babe, can you wait till five pm or I don't know, or or take a couple of days off before they are like trying to conceive he has to do it the rest of the month.

I mean. The other thing there is like if somebody is defensive about having to stop doing something, then I think your answer is right there, like if you're so freaked out, which so it's two different arguments, you know, like if you say to someone, oh, stop smoking, weed for a month, and like, why why why I don't don't have to, Like I've say, they don't want to because it's going to be a problem for them, which

is even more reason to do it. Like it shouldn't scare you to have to abstain from something for a set amount of time. I did that alcohol cleans and I was like, oh, this is so long. But I had to do it so mostly so I probably wouldn't have to do it again, you know what I mean. I was like, okay, okay, everybody, but yeah, unless it has there's a medical component. Do you think that's the

whole thing? So I just looked it up and there's a University of Chicago study that says using marijuana can affect the sperm count and alter the shape and function of the sperm. So yeah, it can lower fertility. And maybe the conversations even bigger than this though, because according to the letter, Liza said, he was pretty straightforward. Good for you, babe, but not me. It's not for me. There could be what if he's not quite as enthusiastic about having a kid, or what if I don't know,

I don't know. It's like a there there's a bit here. Well, yeah, but you should also try to get pregnant, and if that doesn't work in three months and you think it's because of the sperm count, then you can revisit the conversation and talk to your doctor about it too, because your doctor may say, like, yeah, he needs to cool it for a week before I'm her doctor. Katherine, excuse me,

I'm sorry, it's accurate. Have you guys ever heard, you know how sperm is the indicator of sex, of the gender of a baby, like the one that chooses yes, they have either an XX or an X y okay, or we have you know, we just have the X. They either have a Y or next Okay, Okay, I'm gonna sound like it's the earth flat around Somebody tell me first before I asked this question. It's it's on the map. I just want to come back, but on the map it's flat. So on maps, I just want

everyone in the world is flat. So when Sherry Shepard asked that question, she was not alone. I'm just gonna put that out there. I just I just found out about the moon in the sun and their whole situation recently, so you have to bear with me on my knowledge. Of basic fundamental information that is available at a fingertip a fingertip away. This is what I believe, but I haven't checked its accuracy in a while. So we're x X as females, the boys are x Y. Whatever. Why

am I giving a biology lessons? Fuck? I thought it was I thought it was X and Y. It's an x X and X Y. I don't know, I don't know. I'm really gonna back what if we're I think we're probably giving so much false information on this podcast. This is this is this is on Fox News, you guys, you're listening to Fox News. Okay, totally totally from what I read, though, the male sperm tends to swim faster but die sooner. The female sperm swim slower, is like

more resilient through and steady. Right, yeah, whatever, whatever business we've got that tries to like prevent them. So there's a whole theory about if you want to have a boy as your eggs is like traveling down, are you making a jerking off motion right now as we Okay, okay, I like to do that. Yeah, yeah, you can use I just want to I just wanted to make sure that I was talking that. Yeah, I'm terrible at hand jobs speaking. Who is this hand jobs about? We were

just talking about how handsjobs? Like? Who is giving hand jobs? Who is it? Are these girls in high school? Like because they don't want to give a blowjob that I can get behind. But a hand job as an adult is an insult to both parties as far as I'm concerned. Yeah, I completely agree. Who's doing that? Like what it's so? I mean, sex is animalistic as it is, obviously, but jerking someone off that just even the hand gesture is so upsetting. Like I wish you Coo could do it

with my fun you know what I mean? Because that's how far away I know. I know I got some guys would like a foot job. How deeply into sex should we get? Probably not, I don't know. I mean, we'll see what the next caller has to say. Maybe it'll lead to a sexual conversation on it. Okay, all your dreams could come true, Chelsea. I always felt like you would be the popular girl in high school that would sort of befriend me because I was like, just

because you had no friends weird enough. Yeah, I would totally, I would totally do that. I I love helping people out or saving people. I like to make sure people know that they're not alone. You told me on my podcast that you said, Anna, you were so fucking weird, and I took that as such a compliment. Yeah, as you should. You should. You said it with love in a weird way. It was really nice. I think about that. That was a good compliment. Oh well, I'm so glad.

I'm so glad you don't. Yeah. I like weirdos. I think it's much cloler to be a weirdo than to just be a follower. That everyone's a follower. I'm even a follower. We follow, and there's like we do so many things without even thinking because other people are doing them that it's nice to have originality. So that's what makes you unique. Thank you. Sometimes I feel like I do this purposeful disguise because I sure don't feel do

you guys ever have like a serious brain body disconnect? Yeah? Like, man, this is a costume. Yes, absolutely absolutely, because everyone has a multitude of different things that going on in their brain. You know, in one moment you can be your confident, best version of yourself and and totally secure and everything you're doing, and then two days later you can be completely self doubting and not sure what you're doing or

having any confidence. I mean, I think that's what's so complex about like the human brain is we could get up our own asses, and we have a hard time staying out of our heads. And so I I like to think of things anything that keeps you out of your head. That's why I love reading books like that requires my attention to something that has nothing to do with me. I always felt uncomfortable being a woman, like

the idea of femininity. I mean, it's not a struggle for me anymore because I'm forty five and I wasn't exactly a tomboy, but I really prided myself on not being afraid, like I really always wanted to be brave, like we had my brother. We keep belonging to the Washington Herpetological Society. What does that? What does that mean HERPETI I thought it was something harpies. Okay, there's a society for that, well, I heard, yeah, yeah, for animals

with herpes. Okay. So we had we always had tons of snakes and tarantulas and piranhas and parrots and lizards, and the house had a very particular smell, and there was always like one loose and I felt really proud of never being scared of bugs or kind of overcoming whatever. I was like this little feisty thing. I was incredibly short, and I was really angry for a long time that I wasn't born a boy. Yeah. Well, I mean, I think what we're all learning is that it's not one

or the other. There's this whole spectrum of like masculinity and femininity as we know it. I certainly didn't feel like a girl for a very long period of time, but I feel like one now. I feel like a woman, you know, and I but I feel very masculine. I have a lot of very masculine tendencies. But does that get in the way of like your female friendships. Yeah,

sometimes I'm very yeah. Yeah, I mean I have a terrible history of friendship ending, so I am like that is the one thing that I can't seem to shake no matter how much therapy I go to. It's just like I have a very steadfast desire to let the truth be known and not to pussy foot around anything and not to ever be insincere. So that gets you into trouble. Not everybody likes to hear the truth, and I understand that's part of my personality and it's not

something I'm willing to like forego. Like if you came to me and you said I need to know the truth about something, I would I would have to tell you this is the truth, even if it were going to hurt your feelings as a sister, as a woman to another woman, even though you think you're a man, I would say to you, Hey, Anna, this is what I see and this is what I know because I think that's what you That's like, the best gift you can give anybody in your life is the truth. No

one benefits for being lied to. I am not like that, funny, No, I'm much more like my female friendships are always like dancing with awkwardness. Oh well, that's just you. That's you. You're awkward and you're in your but that's your thing, Like, I mean, who cares, Like that's your personality. It's not something to resist, it's something to embrace. I have no choice. I know you are you, so you have no choice. Okay, So what do we have next? We have to get

through some callers on him. We can't just sit here and focus on you the entire We have to help the masses make better life decisions. Right, that's right. Well, before we get to all the fun stuff, we'll take a quick break. Okay, sounds good. We'll be right back. Well, our first caller today is they're gonna be online on to get Kay's joining. So Luke is a rarity on the show. He is a straight guy. Wow, right now, listener,

that's that is unique. Yes, he says. One of my friends has been in a relationship for two years with a girl that's not good for him, and I'm struggling to help him see that. There are three main issues. One extreme jealousy. She consistently does phone checks to see who he's talking to, and does not let him talk to or hang out with any females unless she has met them and given her sign off. This has sadly led my friend to abandon a lot of long, completely innocent,

and platonic relationships with female friends. She also restricts him hanging out with the boys, which has caused a strain and our main friend group number two gold digging tendencies. A year into the relationship, she moved into his apartment but does not pay any rent. She then persuaded him to get all new furniture for the apartment because she simply didn't like his stuff. I get furnishing an apartment together. But when she's not paying rent, why should she have

all the say. She's made several comments in group environments that she needs to marry someone rich and praises others for doing so. May have been said in just but concerning nonetheless three pressure to get engaged. The girlfriend comes from a more traditional family. We're getting married young is the norm. My friend, on the other hand, has told me assistently he wants to focus on his career and wait until he's ready to get married, potentially in his thirties.

His girlfriend has consistently pressured him, saying she can't risk being single in her late twenties or early thirties and trying to find someone else all over again. My friend is not ready for engagement, but when confiding in me, he tries to see it from her side and thinks maybe he should compromise on his engagement timing by a couple of years. She currently has given him an ultimatum that it needs to happen by next year. I've tried having a few talks and raising these red flags, but

he sort of justifies or rebuffs them. I'm trying not to be too aggressive and ruin our friendship over this. How can I prevent my friend from making a lifelong mistake? Luke Hi luke hilu hi Hi. Anna Faris is with us today along with Catherine, my co host. How's it going? Man? Great? I am really excited to talk with you. That was a letter like you care about your friend? I really do. I'm I'm not sure to do turning to you guys. First of all, I want to say congratulations on being

the first rate white Uh well you're not white, are you? Yeah? The straight, first straight man to call into this podcast. That is a feat that you must be very, very secure in your masculinity and manhood. So mozelto to that. Yes, well, I feel like my whole family grew up watching Chelsea Lately, big fan, Anna, do you want to start? You seem like an eager beaver. Well so when all the detailed information she truly does sound atrocious for sure, But all

the detailed information, how did you get that? Does your friend tell you? Like? How how does these conversations work? Yeah, it's it's a mix of me spending time with her and then him sharing with me a little bit because he clearly sees some concerns and so I've tried to talk with them about it. So a mix of both of those things. So when you hang out, like, what percentage of the time is he like, man, I don't know what to do about this thing. Does that dominate

the conversation? No, I would honestly say, it's like only a handful of conversations I've had with him about it, Like I've tried to be careful of not always bringing it up to him. If he brings it up, happy to talk with him. I brought it up maybe on my own one or two times, but it's not like a frequent conversation with that. Are you close? Is he

close with his family? Yes? Very close with his parents, And I've actually asked what it was parents think of these things, but he hasn't really opened up to them about these things. M M. Does he open up to others they don't like her? Yeah? Maybe? But do you guys have a group of friends. Are there another couple of guys that also feel the same way or is it just you? I'm definitely close to him, So I don't think he's opened up in the same way to

those other friends, really only to me. But I don't want to necessarily go around and like spread all of his personal stuff unless he's That's what a girl would do, So don't do that, because that's yeah, that's how females behave We're like you also hate. The thing is, it's like, listen, you can have one really like serious conversation with him out of love and for your friendship and for your caring and you can say you could put it all out on the table in a way that's thoughtful and sweet,

but you don't want to lose your friendship. You said that. All you could do is say it once out of love. He's probably not going to listen to you, but you never know, and at least then you have a clear conscience. But don't go just it's got to be out of the love for him, not the hatred for her. You know what I mean, These are the things that I'm seeing. I know what kind of guy you are, and she

doesn't represent to me what you're looking for. Like calling her a gold digger isn't going to be helpful, but you can put that in another language that seems a little bit more just that you've noticed, and and just by noticing is a demonstration of your friendship by paying attention. You know, I think girls and guys react to these kinds of conversations in a different way, And I think men are are definitely less emotional, and I might receive it a lot differently than a woman might receive it,

don't you guys think? Yeah, like just leveling with him and then not bringing it up again, like you said it, I'm just gonna say it once. I support you whatever you do. I'm always going to be your friend. This is what I see. And I just had to tell you because I know you would do the same for me. So I think here's the tough thing. I think I've kind of had those conversations with him and he always just like plays it off or rebuffs it. And so I've had two or three of those conversations, but I've

been very careful not to be too strong. So do I just lay off at this point and say it is what it is? Or go more strong into it. I have a question about the timing is do you feel like a proposal is imminent? Yes, I feel like it could happen like in the next couple of months. Okay, so he does. He has very strong feelings for her. Is this his first girlfriend? Uh? Yeah, first real serious one, and he may I think he had one in high school. I mean that's high school. Yeah. I totally agree with

Chelsea and Catherine. But the problem is he's vulnerable. This is his first thing, this is his first relationship, and he's going to need you in his life. But there is a risk potential of those details, especially sticking in his head. It's like when you can paint the entire picture, those things get seared into his head. So if you back up your hesitancy about this woman with actual specifics, there's a risk of you, guys not being friends. He

will remember these things. He'll associate you with that kind of imagery, you know what I mean. So I wonder if the approach is if you open with like, hey, you know, maybe you guys can grab a beer or something, something along the lines of, like, hey man, how happy are you? Because you're a great guy, and I don't want you to have to go through like the financial pain of a divorce if in three years you're pretty miserable.

I just I want to check in with how how you are as opposed to getting into her a bit, which will immediately put his guard up. What do you think about that? Yeah, I think that makes sense. I think when I bring up things about her, he definitely first instinct he gets defensive, like, what can you give us an example, Give us an example of a time

you brought something up. So the gold digging part, I didn't call her a gold digg or anything like that, but I brought up there were a few situations in like group settings where she made those comments about marrying someone rich or like praising others for doing the same, and it didn't seem like a joke. But so I brought that up to him, and his first reaction was, well, all girls say that, Like it's not that serious. It's like, at those comments, it's not a big deal type of thing.

Does she believe that she's more attractive than he is? I don't. I don't know. I don't think so. Okay, that's a good question. Is that something you're curious about? Is that something you're curious about in your own life? I like thinking about the power balance in this relationship of Luke's friends, Like, how does she view herself, how does he view himself? And thinking about the imbalance there.

If someone feels like they have more power, like I could do better, that is a that's that's a hard kind of that's a hard idea, you know. And she definitely wears the pants in the relationship. I'll say that, and he makes more money he does, Yes, I can see where it comes hurt. Yeah, I think Also, what was his reaction when you said that? Like back to when I said, what did you when you brought it up to him and he said, okay, what was his reaction when you said he gets defensive? It's almost like

he's brainwashed in a way. Like the jealousy part he kind of acknowledged, Yeah, okay, maybe it's strange. But then he turns around and be like, well, like I don't really need female friends, Like I don't I don't care that much, or like he asked me, like does your girlfriend let you hang out with girls one on one

or talk to girls? And then the engage stuff one end, I'll be like, yeah, I don't know if I'm ready, but like I don't know, it's unfair to her if I keep her waiting, like I think I should just compromise and do it like it's always like back to like she's right justifying it. Yeah, I think that you're probably I've already said what you're going to say, and it doesn't seem like he's in a place of like he's going to be able to receive anything you're saying anyway.

And unfortunately, this is just a part of life watching friends do things like this, marry people you're not that into. And while it's a huge bummer, there's really nothing you can do about it. He's not your kid. He's not going to listen to you. You know, if he's in this state of mind, he's in love with her, he's about to propose. It would really take something big for him to get off track. So I think you're just

time is just better. I think you've probably he made yourself clear, Like if he's defensive when you've brought it up, then he knows what you're doing. Are you close with his parents? Like friendly? I wouldn't say you guys aren't Like I wouldn't like pull pull them aside. I would ask like, are you happy most of the time with her?

Because from what I hear, it only intensifies one way or the other when you're when you're actually married, or because even if he won't know how, he probably won't know how to answer it, but at least till think about it, you know, he'll think about like, man, she makes me miserable, I am bummed out most of the time, or trying to do damage control most of the time, or at least maybe he'll it'll start to roll around in his head. Yeah, leading him into this self examination

maybe a better way to go. My sister in law, who I love, is a little bit of a judgy person. She's also usually right, so it's okay, but when she doesn't think someone's making the right decisions, she will ask them a series of questions to help them re examine

the choices that they're making. So like for your friend, it might be something like, well, how do you feel about, you know, maybe compromising some of your financial and career goals in order to get married a little bit earlier, and just bringing up those things in the context of a question like Anna said, might be a little bit of a softer delivery and help him keep percolating on

them after and probably the engagement will be awful. There's going to be like there's nothing like an engagement for people to just spin out. So maybe there's hope they're yeah, it's just it's like it hurts me, like it's one of my best friends, Like I want to be so happy for him if he gets aged. So I get what you're saying, Chelsea, Like, at a certain point, you just have to yea, he's not my kid, he's out and my family like, yeah, he's the best form. Yeah

you have to, But I mean you could. I you know what these girls are suggesting, which you might be a good different strategy and see if that gets you anywhere. But I wouldn't double down on what you've already said, because you want to make sure you're happy. You want to make sure you're making the right decision. But you know I would want I'd want you to check in

with me. Are you married, Luke, No, I'm not okay, Like if you were going to do the same thing, I'd want you to check in with me and just make sure that this is a big, big decision. I want to make sure you're in the best possible spot and that you're making the right decision based on what you want and your needs, not somebody else's yeah, I think that makes sense. I think it's a good, non threatening way to bring it up again. Okay, cool, Well

let us know how that goes. Yeah, you're a good friend. Yeah, you are a good friend, Luke. That's nice. Appreciate it's really nice, A good one. You can tell how much you love him. It's nice. Appreciate it. All right, Okay, well, good luck with everything, take care, Thank you. I who won? I feel like I did? I think you did. While you were giving your advice, I was like, this is not a good idea because you're saying exactly what I'm

trying to say, but in a different way. But then as I digested it, I think you did give him better advice. So you wont Yeah, you just you found an easy round. Just picked a side, don't You picked your side? That's how you won. Chelsea. I miss you and Catherine. I miss you too, miss your two. I know Chelsea. I would love to like someday when the kids look gone, when we're at an old age home Holland Hills together, we can have a coffee or a cocktail.

Coffee I don't even drink, We'll have a cocktail. Dad, you can hit me up any time on. I'm right in the neighborhood. Well where do you live? What neighborhood? Pacific Palisades. Oh yeah, that's why I like, of course I don't fit in here. Who does? That's not even a real place. It's like it's just like white picket fences, white. Everything's like a makeshift mall. That mall up there. You're like, what kind of happy camper land is this? It's like

the Truman Show. We are going to take a quick break so you can hear and add and then we'll be right back. So this call is coming from Anne, she says. Dear Chelsea, I'm twenty nine years old and work at a startup. I've been with the company for six years, and I'm the longest tenured woman there. I also happened to be their highest revenue producing team member. Not to brag, but kind of to brag. My boyfriend of four plus years also works there for almost as

long as I have. Last week, our CEO invited my boyfriend to an NBA game because our investors gave him box seats. He then proceeded to invite multiple other employees, but not me. He even invited a few people who no longer work for the company. I felt so excluded and left out. I also felt mad at my partner for not sticking up for me. At the end of the game, our CEO apologized to my partner for not

inviting me. This isn't an isolated incident. Our CEO has routinely devalued me while uplifting and investing in my male partner. Despite the fact that I'm continually out earning all the other men at our company, I'm so frequently ignored and underinvested in. And I think it's because I'm a woman. Am I being too sensitive? Or is it time to look for a new job? And Hi, Anne, Hi An Hi Hi. This is Anna Faris. And then this is Katherine, my co host. It's not nice to meet you, guys.

Thank you so much for having me. Oh, you're so welcome. No, you're But it's because you're a woman. I mean, this is the story of the century. Everyone tells this story. And yeah, what did your partner say when he apologized for not inviting you? He recommended to like reach out to me, But when he came home, I've been crying for hours. When you feel left out, like then not even like get a text like weird you're not here

so soon because we lived together. Also should mention that, So I had to leave our shared home to go to this thing and then kind of ignored it for a while, very non confrontational, very different communication stuff. So he got there eventually, but it did take multiple days of me explaining why it hurts so much, the layers of it, all the they chose you and actively ignored me despite totally it can't not feel very personal like this. You can't ignore that. It's like, this feels very much

about me. Yeah, And it was just like why did all these men sit around thinking like, isn't it weird that? Like he came like, we've been dating for five years, all of which have happened at this company. Well, and another thing came up when we were doing our pre interview. Mentioned about the Christmas gift. Oh yeah, so small. I didn't even realize it. Full months later. They give us these Christmas gifts classic like start everything. They gave out

gift baskets. We got one gift basket to share. Yeah, that's gross too. Yeah, I didn't even think about it. Have you addressed this yet at all with your boss? I have a little. What's really nice is like my direct manager is also one of my best friends. It's a very any company, Like when you work at the start of you become super close with everyone, so she's

like one of my best friends. I did end up like sobbing on the phone to her the Monday after, and she kind of like immediately ran it up a flagpole and kind of sent up an alert of might leave, like she's so upset, very badly, she might quit the company. So I got like the most awkward five minute minute phone phology. Yeah it was bad. It was like a not to make excuses, but so what was the excuse? The event got away from him, Like he only had

a few tickets, only invited a few people. Then I saw more people were around and was like, oh crap, let me find more tickets. And then it just he kept inviting other people without realizing, like, oh I should have stopped gone back over here, which I get a lot did. It sort of stemmed down to it wasn't intentional.

It was a total blunder. He felt super embarrassed and bad, but like all these things were happening, like my son has pink guy, my dad is cancered I'm so sorry, but it was just like an all boiled down to like it was unintentional and you should forget it. And there was no like nothing done to sort of correct that mistake, Like no extra gift basket, no extra tickets. I I get a month, I'll have like lunch with him, like once a month. Do you like your job? I do?

I built it. I was this like tenth person they hired, and now we're at like a hundred and fifty, So of course this stings even harder. Yeah, it's personal and like my boyfriend is the golden boy, and you like your job and you're emotionally invested. So how do we how do we get you? How do we get you feeling good, appreciated and special and acknowledged. How do we

do that? Guys? Well, I think it's very important for you to point out that if they're going to treat you as one person when they're handing out Christmas gifts, they should treat you as one person when they're handing out invitations. You know. So I've think you can be a little bit more assertive on the back end of that phone call and say, just so you're clear, this is how I see it from moving on forward, Like

I expect to be invited to these events. I was with the tenth person hire to work at this company, and I feel ownership in what we've created. I have a piece of that I was a part of that. Don't underestimate your value in this situation because women have a history of doing that. And don't say I just

want this. It's I want this, you know. And don't diminish your role in what you've created that remind him of how integral you are in this company and how valuable you are, and based on that value and based on your seniority, here's a list of things that you expect to happen when there are invitations that go out. Please do not invite my boyfriend without inviting me, okay, and please do not send us one gift like we

are one person. We are two people. Did your boyfriend start working there before after you, like two and a half months after. It's the whole package. But the only thing you can do as a woman is to be be assertive, you know what I mean? Without being a count. Be assertive and just say I'm just here to remind you of all these things. Please keep this in your consciousness when you're making your next round of invites to

whatever event that may be. I can't wait to experience that with you so that we don't ever have to deal with this kind of conversation again. Yeah, it's no, You're clearly right. It's a When I was screaming about this to my family, they all stopped and we're like, do you think that there may be like intimidated by you because I'm not quiet? I am like very direct. Yeah, and men don't like that. They don't like that, so

they probably want you there for that reason. But you're going to tell them that that is Sorry, that's part of the package. We're not living in ten anymore. I have to be included. I'm a founding member of this organization. What are you talking about? And along with what Chelsea's saying, I would list the reasons why you love working there, what you believe from the beginning, and be you know what I mean, Listen to me. Be positive. I'm like from ninety two when you have to trick them if

they're gonna no, that's true, you do. It's like you have to flip the wool over their eyes and be like, come with me, you fucking idiot. I mean honestly, because that's probably what it is. It's like, oh, you're she's too much or she's got a big personality. We don't need her. They're sorry. That's the workplace. You have to deal with all the people that you work with, because that's what adults do. I'm sorry if I'm not your perfect cup of tea, you're not mine either, But I'm

gonna be at this event. And that's why you're so good at your job. That's why you're like crushing all the goals and blowing everybody else out of the water.

And the other thing too, is you know you can phrase it I like this like being really direct about it, and you can phrase it like I'm trying to help you be better because I know, like when it's a startup, it's a little messy or it's kind of like figuring things out as they go along, but like there are probably other women at the company who are feeling similarly undervalued, and you can express it that way, like I'm trying to help you do better because some of this could

be seen as overt sexism, So like, let's fix these things as the company grows, so that by the time it's really really big, You're not getting sued by a bunch of your employees. That's one of the biggest issues too, is that a lot of the team they look to me because I was like the first I'm the longest tenured woman at the whole company, and so there is a sense of like they outwardly appreciate what I do

because I bring in like the revenue. Right, it's one person just sucking cool and I'm really proud of that. But like that's what like tripled my anger, being like if there, if I'm getting treated like this, in what world does absolutely anyone else have any ability to be valued and appreciate it appropriately and not just have been like good, jum, you're good and you're cute. Shut up. How aware is the CEO of this? He's aware now,

Like I was very brutally like this sucked. I was so upset and really hurt, and I don't think I deserved it, and like he intellectually got it, and I know that there are other steps being taken, but it's just one of those things where it's like I really don't think it's actually gone yet, and it really was salient to have to explain to so many men, like the textbook definition or definition of sexism is you did something to me, you apologize to my boyfriend, and he

didn't apologize to me and just expected it to get there as though that isn't any way, shape or form, Okay. And then when I finally told my boyfriend like he didn't do anything. He has my phone number he could text me. He was like okay, and I said that's sexist. He was like, like that was too far, and I had to be like, I you have to accept my Definitely. You did have a conversation with him after the fact, Oh yeah, it was like it escalated pretty quickly to

me being like, I will call five women of our company. Yeah, I asked them to favor. Do you want me to he said, know when he accepted so, and nothing's changed slightly. No, that well, there hasn't been an event since though, right that that? Yeah, honestly, Like you can wait for that letter until something happens and then it's going to be a different letter, or you could preemptively send it and go this is what I expect moving forward. And if they fail that, then yeah, you do have to look

for a new job. If this is that important to you. I will throw him a bone and say that when the Alito opinion dropped, we are enough like progressive, small enough company that like we were all pretty open about hop said it was see it was totally radio silent. I had to call him and then he answered and I'd be like, you have to say something to our team about this. And within like ten minutes he had created a video. He had like built something sense something

out so like he did listen to me. There was like one really positive change of him being like that's something. Yeah, Okay, well good, I think you know what you're doing. You're gonna be just fine. Maybe he's a little scared right now, but as as time goes on, he'll slowly start to become more good for you. Yeah, you could be the change to be the resource. Yeah. Yeah, I do a lot of emotional labor. Yeah, don't we all. I think at the time comes to to send an email, l

I think I would say I love my job. I love my job and this is why. And I am an incredibly valuable team member in that way. When it's in writing, I know you've already said this to him. But if it's in writing, like that's strong, but passionate and complimentary and but demanding. Maybe that's a better way for him to digest things instead of I don't know it was a face to face. Uh, that was a phone call because like we're I can go into the office.

I mostly remote because I'm literally just like on zooms all day with clients. You probably like intimidate him. I know, I do. I've had a lot of people tell me that. Take that into account. You know, when you're writing out letter, take that into account. Yeah, so that you know if he's going to be a big pussy about it, you want to make sure let you treat him like a pussy.

Does it cause strain between you and your boyfriend? It has less so now I think, like my the intensity of my reaction to what happened, he was super not prepared for, because it did like fully melt down into like a oh, I'm gonna start looking for another job, to which he was like, honestly, fair, that was bullshit. You were treated poorly, like he did objectively know, like I do get that that was so not cool and it was unfair. I think that's good. I think you're

already on the right track. I think he's getting the picture. I think you're all set. You made your point, and let's see what happens now moving forward. And if you want a new job, and I'll hire you to do something, that would be very cool. I love to work if it helps, because you are really impressive. We would complement each other because I'm a little more lamb like. That's okay, it's completely fine. I'm very aggressive. I'll go after it

for you. Okay, it's our Farmers Market Knitting which Sister Sisterhood of the Traveling because by um to keep us supposed and let us know how it goes. I will thank you guys so much. I really appreciate it, both of your shows. Thank thank you, Thank you guys. Thanks Anne. Wow, isn't she a powerhouse? She's great. Yeah, she's going to be just fine. She Oh my god, yeah really I thought she was wonderful. But what a doozy of a problem.

My god, Chelsea, I loved what you said. Oh good, good, Well great, let's take a quick break and we'll be right back with Chelsea and Anna. What do we have now? Anna's going to ask advice to me. Yes, Anna, do you have any advice you want? To ask me for Chelsea. As you know, I quarantined hard right, Like nobody quarantined harder than I. So that for something I just like hermited like I didn't see any you know anyway, But I've always had a tendency to hoard. However, my shower

looks like a sorority house shower. There's so many products, and my closet is like like I've I've really I've adopted a wartime mentality essentially, like I'll never be able to procure these items again. During quarantine, I bought ten pounds of Velvita, a cheese that I rarely use. Yeah, so you're trying to stop hoarding, right, Yeah, I'm trying

to stop hoarding. You just have to get one of those closet organizers to come over your house and just release and let them fucking figure it out for you, clean it out for you so that you're not watching, you're not sitting there. There's nothing in any of those places that you mentioned that are going to have a life for death impact on you. Let somebody come in and organize your life for you and just do whatever

you have to do to allow that to happen. Because your life will be you will begin anew and you are going to feel good about it, not bad. I promise you. I believe you. I do. Yeah, there's all those girls on Instagram. Everyone's always posting about closet organizing that it's not hard to find. Just find somebody and let it go. Just clear out the energy, clear out to all the ship and just say you do whatever

you think and let me know when it's done. Because it feels very psychological at this point, Kelsea, do you have a favorite face lotion that you feel loyal to? Yes, Liz Earle. I like the serum and then the lotion or the face cream. I put it on in the morning and at night. So do you have oily or dry skin? A combo like I still break out on my chin a bit. Okay, So then you wouldn't want the serum. You just want the face cream. But it's a it's a British company, It's called Liz Earle, and

it's the best thing I've ever used. It keeps to my skin very very dooey all the time. Okay, Yeah, you guys, thank you so much. I don't did I say anything of interest? No, you did not. You barely you barely said anything. No, you said some things of interest, absolutely as we all did. You were a great guy, Anna. I totally appreciate having you on. I love you, I love spending time with you. I love you too. Thank you, and thank you guys so much. This was awesome. Thank

you Anna, Anna, Anna, Anna. It took me ten years to say her name right and now I say Anna. I just said I fucking ruined it right at the end, Like truly, if I see someone with a name tag that says Anna, yeah, I will call that person Anna. It is my this is my parents fault, and I don't hold it against anybody. And make sure you tune into Unqualified on this podcast. Thanks bye, honey, Thank you bye guys. By