Finding Love in Your Second Act with Jennie Garth

Hi Catherine, Hi Chelsea, how are you?

Greetings for my winter Wonderland. It's snowing, snowing, snowing. I'm happy, happy, happy.

I love your background when you're there, it's just like beautiful snowy trees.

I know.

I love coming into my house and seeing my whole podcast set up at my dining room table. So if you have to eat anything, which I never sit down to really do anyway, I just stand at the kitchen counter and eat and then. And I had a phone call the other day and I didn't know how to disentangle any I had a sorry, a zoom, and I didn't know how to disentangle all of the podcast equipment. So I just did it like I was doing a

Know, I mean, you know what, go above and beyond whenever you can, right, Chelsea, always Always.

My new book is ready for pre order everyone. It's called I'll Have What She's Having. You can pre order it now on Amazon.

And they can find live mean greets right on your website.

Oh yes, I'm doing I'm doing some live events for my book. It's very exciting. It comes out February twenty on my fiftieth birthday. Everybody, so help me celebrate. And I have two shows left this year. I have New Orleans at the Mahalia Jackson Theater on December twenty eighth, and then on December twenty ninth, I am in Atlanta, So if you are in those areas, get your tickets because I am wrapping up the year. Some good movies, you guys. I've been watching lots of movies because that's good.

Oh, I cannot wait to see it.

I'd like to have sex with him, and he is so good in that. That's a great movie. Another one is Baby Girl Nicole Kidman's movies really good.

Yeah, that's really good. She just is so brave. She does everything she does.

Yeah, she's like basically dry humping herself on the floor. What else did I see? I saw the substance would do me more very disturbing.

Did you.

I loved the substance.

I just like cracked up the entire time. It was so like I was like giggling in the movie theater. By the end, everyone was giggling with me, just like it's so overwhelming. But I know two people who threw up when they watched.

Oh ah, no, I'm not a week like that. I don't have a week's stomach like that. I should say what else? Oh, but Doug, Doug has been I did discovered bones. My friend brought him a bone, and now he is so funny. He has three bones and he puts them in a basket and then when people come over, he goes and gets the bones to display his bone collection to all the people that come over.

I said, I go, what is he doing? And my friend's like, I think he's showing off his bones. And then he takes this big.

Bone and circles the whole area and brings it and shows everyone how big his bone is. Oh I'm my god, Oh my god, Doug, you are so fucking adorable. I would never have pieced together what he was doing had someone not told me.

Oh my god, what a cutie. I know, so funny. I love he puts them in a basket. Yeah, he has it like and he like hid one in the couch the other day.

I'm like, no, thank you, And I mean he goes, he hides it and then he checks. He circles around. It's like three or four times to make sure it's there. He is such a dog.

He's got a big personality.

Yeah, he does. He goes.

He does have a big personality. I have a great dog walker here. It takes him out for like two or three hours.

I'm like, thank god, Well, and he needs that too, right, because he's like he's a snow dog, like he's got all that hair loves.

So he just jumps into the snow, buries his face in it, and then wiggles his body around it.

He'll do that for two hours. I mean, he's so lovable. Well, I'm so glad you're having so much fun.

And we have a really exciting guest today that we recorded with in.

La Yes, our guest today is an actress, a designer, and host of the podcast I Choose Me. Please welcome Jenny Garth. Okay, Jenny Garth. Here you are, I'm here.

I'm late. She's we're in her car still she just pulled in. You're late, I'm late, we're all late.

The four h five was four h fiving. It was a lot.

The traffic in Los Angeles is so not even worth discussing because it's so disappointing on every level. I was telling my friend, the only time that I don't hit traffic is when I land at five pm to go home, And five pm you would think is the worst hour.

And for some reason, when you I.

Land at five, I get home in thirty minutes, and when I land at one in the afternoon on a Monday, it takes me an hour.

I'm like, this is so so stupid.

First of all, they need to build like a double decker highway somewhere or everywhere, or gytrail or like, I don't know, some.

Sort of public transportation public it's a little late for that.

I think it's a i'ven off for a flying car.

Okay, Jenny, you have a lot of things going on.

You have I choose me, me, I choose me again, and then I choose me. I love that you're choosing yourself so much.

It's a message we all need to hear.

I know, well, tell me about it because Okay, so you have you have a live.

Event coming up to that I want to talk about at the iHeart Theater, which is on January eleventh, and it's all about women and women choosing themselves. It's about female empowerment. It's about feeling good about yourself and feeling strong about making decisions that benefit yourself.

Right, So let's start with that. Okay, Yeah, I'm very sad put this event together.

It's my first.

This is my inaugural event, and I hope to be able to do it in other cities.

That's my goal.

And it's just about bringing a group of fabulous women together to converge and share and inspire one another. I found in going to events like this, or being in groups of women that I don't know, so empowering and so insightful and just like they fire me up and it makes me want to be a better person and do better for my own self and my own life.

And I'm very excited about it.

So what led you to?

I mean, I feel like we probably have similar stories and like awakening our desires to please ourself rather than go around pleasing others. But you probably have a little bit of a different background because you are a mother, you've been married three times, right, or that you're on your third marriage, hopefully this will be the last.

I mean, that'd be nice.

I'd be nice. Well, third times of char am I thing I think if even if.

It doesn't work out, it will be my.

Last A great answer, great answer. So what led you to did you you start therapy? What happened to when did you become more in touch with yourself and more in touch with helping other women become in touch with them?

So I think it.

Started when I had my divorce from my second husband. Yeah, Peter, we were together for seven times.

It was her last time I think I saw you.

It was with Peter Fetchinelli in at my birthday in Cabo, like my thirty third birthday or something.

I was trying to remember the last time I saw you.

And it can't have been the last time I saw you.

No, I don't think it was.

But that was significant because I just remember dancing in a cage.

In Mexico.

Yeah, there was a lot of cage dancing on that.

It was like it was it was my early days at Chelsea Lately, and we decided I decided to just throw a fiesta in Mexico and everyone flew down and we had like, I don't know, one hundred and fifty people there and we got blotted all weekend.

It was fun.

It was very it was very fun.

So anyway, I think after that that divorce sort of turned into my awakening of like what, who, how?

All the things?

You know, because you're just sort of flattened, and I to know which way was up for a while, and.

It took me a great, a great period of time, with a lot of therapy, a lot of just searching.

I'm a very curious person by nature, so anytime, you know, someone would say come to this you know, gathering and we're going to learn about this, I'm there. I'm ready with just an open mind.

And so I think that was the.

Beginning of like really trying to figure out who am I if I'm not this wife, or if I'm not the matrix of this family, or if I'm not I mean, I was still the mother of my our three daughters, but they would leave me every other week and so then I would be left alone with just me, and I had no idea who that person was because I was always busy fitting or fulfilling someone else's needs.

How did that Because I think for some people who go through divorce and then they split their children up, like for some people, it's a huge party.

They're like, oh my.

God, I have some free time, free time, and I have an opportunity to have my own identity again. And other people, I think feel more lost when they have that they don't have their children all the time.

So which was it for you?

It was both?

At first I felt lost, I remember just it was agonizing when he would take them away from me, and I think it was even more agonizing because there was another woman that they were going to be with with him, and it was just really not fun for a good minute. And then it became like, hey, look at I have free time. I can focus on my own needs, I can do what I want. And it was just like this experience that I had never had because I had a kid when I was twenty.

Three years old.

That was when I first started, and I was working all the time and always you know, being on schedule and running the ship, and so I was like, wow, a whole week of me time. And then it just started to fall like what do I want to do?

You know?

So what was that period of time For people who are listening, who are experiencing that are going through a divorce that's traumatizing or upsetting, which most divorces are, right, I mean, it's kind of unusual to go through a divorce and be.

Like that was a good that was great. I guess that's a conscious uncoupling. But even a conscious couple, I.

Don't think so. I don't think they a divorce of any kind can be called fun. But yeah, I started traveling on my own by myself. I went to Bali on a women's excursion where I knew no one, and I went to San Miguel, dan Though and did some just soul searching and fell asleep in the back of a cab in Mexico and woke up in San Miguel.

I was like, Wow, thank you God for keeping me alive.

But you're like, wow, am I going to another Chelsea Handler birthday?

It could have been, but just like really getting so so quiet with myself and not partying and not being around a lot of people from my past, but just really being alone.

And that was like eye opening for me.

Yeah, I think that's true for everyone.

I feel like the biggest telltale sign for people who are are in need of that or the people who are so scared to be alone.

Right, you know your first reaction is like I don't want to be alone.

I don't want to be alone, And like I talk about this in my book too, my new book, like it is so important. That is where the truth is. When you can be alone with yourself and find yourself and find out who you really are and what you're really interested in, when no one else is impacting your decisions.

Yeah, like what do you like to do?

What do you want to do?

What brings you close to yourself and actually not doing anything but being with yourself, which many people who haven't done that don't even understand what that means. It's like, what do you mean? And it's like actually sitting outside and looking at the trees for an hour and a half, not talking, not reading, not looking at your phone, but actually just being with yourself and nature is where you find out, Oh this is a different kind of vibration that I'm tapping into.

Yeah, it's the best feeling. I recommend it to anyone. Just go be alone for a minute.

So out of all of this and out of like your self work.

Every time you went, you would get more in touch with yourself or become more more deeply aligned or attuned.

To I would just be.

I would feel myself settling into who I was because also being an actress and being an actress so young, you are thrown into other people's shoes. You know, you're living other people's lives on the daily all day long as you act. And then they're like, okay, bye, we're wrapped and you leave, and you're like, wait, where do I go?

Who do I talk to? What do I do? Should I go to the bathroom or should I eat dinner? I don't know.

So there was a lot of just me figuring out myself, and I think it was the best work that I've ever you know, the best time that I've ever had is that growing. And then I started to like date. Everyone was like, you got to start trying to just date people, and I was so against it. I said, I'd rather lick the bottom of my shoe than go

And so that led you to your husband now that you're with, Yes, and you guys also, you guys were separated for a while, right, And what was that?

Can you talk about that?

My god? We got married in like five minutes?

How long after you, Matt? Did you get three months?

We got engaged?

Six months we were married, okay, And it was like a big wedding and all the girls and you know, everybody was like.

Okay, let's jump on board this train.

They were used to I can make some quick decisions, let's call them. And they were used to that. And so everybody felt good about it, and everybody liked Dave a lot, because nobody doesn't like a Dave.

There's no Dave that people don't like. I don't think.

And he's really special. He's a good guy. He was very young, He's nine years younger than me. And I remember telling him I see so much potential in You don't say that to a guy. They don't want to hear that. But I didn't mean it, like in a condescending way. I minted in, like, I see what you're going to grow into, and I love that, Like I love who you are right now. But what I see for your future and how that connects with my future,

That's amazing.

It really is, Like I don't know how that happened, but we worked. We went and started, you know, going to therapy individually, figuring out our shit on our own so that we could come together and share it and grow together in that way, And.

When you guys met, like the two days before you were going to file for divorce, what were your intentions going into that meeting with him?

Were you ready to.

Call it or were you still hopeful that you guys could remedy the or rectify the relationship For situation.

Most in most instances, I'm usually not a good breakup, Like I hold on tight, I attach, and I get like, I feel like, what can I do?

How can I fix this?

I don't want to be a failure, And I certainly didn't want to be a failure in this my third marriage. Like I was like, that was one of the big things that I had to get past, letting go out of my girls. You know, there were so many things that I had to get past. So in the beginning, I was very just trying so hard to make it work all the time, and I kept getting met with just like a wall. He was not there. And the

Yeah, But that's the art of letting go.

Like that's another great example of not holding on so tightly to things when you do release it and back into quote unquote the universe. I don't know why I'm saying quote unquote, because we are in a universe, but things will come back to you if they are meant for you, like once you really like let it go, because we all have we attached to ideas all the time that we think are right for ourselves, you know, whether it's a relationship, whether it's a job, whether it's

Yeah.

I had that horse poster up in my room. It was like, let it go. If it comes back to you, it was meant to be you, don't you know, Yeah.

And if it doesn't, it was never yours to begin with.

Right, Yeah, So I think that And that's weird too because now there's so much discussion about not manifesting, but it's a little bit more than manifestent, like thinking about what you want in your life and visualizing it and then they say it happens, like if you have just a clear definition in your mind of what you want, it happens.

And I think that's really.

True when it's just you, like you like setting yourself up for something. But I think when you put those expectations on a relationship, it's different because there are two energies involved, and so maybe you want different things, maybe you both have different visions. You guys have to get really clear on is the vision that you see for your future mutual.

And also but when you get your energy flowing in the right state, when it's like in sync with the universe, you are going to attract other energy that is like that, right, And so then that takes out the kind of equation of making sure you're on the same page because you kind of what you put out is.

What you get back.

Yeah, so did your girls notice a big transformation in you, like when you started doing the work once you guys broke up when you used broke up with Peter, And how long was it in between the two husbands?

Oh?

God, eight years maybe, Okay, that's fine, fun, that's a long time.

I can't remember.

But yeah, my girls have seen me, I think because I was so young as a mom, they've seen me go through that divorce and they've seen me just at the bottom of my barrel and they've seen the worst. So they knew that, Okay, this is going to be hard going through another breakup. They were very helpful, but also at the same time, like, let me do my thing. They would go to their dads and not worry about me, and I tried to keep it really like compartmentalized for them.

It's just such a fascinating thing to me to think of being a mother and dealing with all of that stuff, right, Like mothers don't get enough credit for the fact that they're living through their own personal life. Human you're also having to be a parent and be the person with all of the answers to your children.

Yeah, that's the thing, and we talk about My youngest actually said to me one time she was being an asshole, and I said, we separated from while, and she came back to me She's like, Mom, I'm really sorry. I just kind of realized that you're living your life for the first time too. You have no idea what you're doing. I was like, exactly, I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm making this shit up as I go and I'm

We're in it together, yeah.

And also we're alive during a time where that is the norm rather than the you know exception. People are always like God, everyone's too open. It's like, you can't be too open. There's no such thing.

Yeah, I mean that's how we're all learning and growing. That's how we're all becoming more aware and open.

Like, I think it's a great thing that everybody's talking about everything now.

So your clothing line is me and it's available on QVC. Oh, I hope you make a fortune on QVC. I was just some I just was with some woman who sold her makeup brand that launched on QVC and she sold it for one point two billion dollars.

Oh my god, so yeah, that happens to you.

Amazing. I'm just really having a great time. I never saw this coming. I didn't I never wanted to be a fashion designer, and actually, when the opportunity came to me, I was like, why me? I don't think I can do this, and everybody else does this?

Not me?

All those thoughts came pouring in, and then I had to really just set those aside and say, why not you. You've been wearing clothes since you were born, You've been fitted all your life in different you know, by different stylists and wardrobe people. So I just sort of said, I just I always say why not me? Let's keep going, keep going, pushing myself forward to whatever the next challenge is. And I learned I learned that very recently that why not me? Like that's the force that keeps me going.

With her and run it with her.

So it's just like it's the gift that keeps on giving. And when I see women wearing our clothes, I feel so just proud and they feel good about themselves in them, and that's that's the ultimate goal.

And so what kind of clothing is it?

Like?

Is it for It's for everybody?

Yeah, it's it's everyday, very wearable streetwear that it's not too high fashion, it's always comfortable, and I really work to work with sustainable materials and so we know we have big goals within our company and things that we're working on, and it's just really exciting to be at a at a place where there's that kind of future.

You know.

Yeah, that is exciting. Sounds like everything's going great.

Yeah, the clothes are really comfortable and people are loving them, and I feel confident about talking about them and encouraging people, you know, to look and feel their best every day.

And so where can people find them?

They I'm obviously easy.

And we have yeah me by Jenny Garth or Jennygarth dot com.

It's all okay, it's all great, great, and I know we're going to take a break and we'll be right back with Jenny Garth.

And we're back. We are back.

We are going to start with some callers today.

My favorite, we have live people. Jenny, did you pull up in a pickup truck today?

I did?

Oh.

I love that. I don't have a car, very unexpected. You don't have a car. I don't have a car.

I gave my car back because it was a Tesla and I don't like him anymore, so I gave my He just creeps me out.

Did what you mean? He just creeps you out? He's so creepy.

I gave back to it was like, get it away from me.

I mean, I can't imagine how many people have returned their Teslas.

Yeah, so I don't even have a car.

Now.

That's my husband's car and he had to get a ride to work with his business partner. But I love driving a pack. I feel like a badass.

We saw a like tan brown, like the worst color brown you can imagine, cyber truck today.

It was like diarrhea. One of those cyber truck.

You know what I got say?

I am fascinated by those and I secretly want one. I'm just like I secretly wanted a Hummer when it came out. But it's just because I like big things that protect you.

That car, though, doesn't even seem like you could see out of it.

You can't. You can't see out the bag.

There's like a camera. Oh spaceship.

Yes, well, Benji is our first caller, and he says, dear Chelsea. I've been a performer since the age of five, when I did my first church skit, and haven't been able to get rid of that itch ever since. But I did get rid of the church part. I went to college for a BFA in musical theater and spent the majority of my twenties performing at Universal, Disney and

Adore you always at Benji? Hi, Benji, Hi, Hi, you look like a performer.

Oh that's me. Yeah.

This is our special guest Jenny Garth is here today.

Hi. Oh my god, Hi, it's so nice to meet you. Guys. Nice to meet you. Where are you, Benji. I'm at Daytona Beach, Florida, but Orlando, Florida as well. Hope I'll come back and forth.

Okay, So you've been working a desk job most recently. Yeah, yeah, and you feel unfulfilled. Is there any way you can do some performing or some stage stuff on the side while you're working at desk job.

I don't know why.

My boy work at Universal and I recently got back working there from being away for a few years. But unfortunately i'm union actor equity, so it's hard to do like fun side projects because I have to do it union, and so in order to do performing, I have to basically do a union gig versus you know, like ever I want to do a fun right, no communator show or just something fun for that just to fulfill that need.

Yeah, and union jobs are a little more time consuming, right, a little bit more commitment.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

And now that I'm doing a full time office job, it's hard to take time off to try to do a full show because the show requires so much commitment.

So you're not going to be able to do both things at the same time, basically, And are you and what about financially are you able to? I mean it sounds like you have to work, right, Yeah, so you.

Have to work forty hours a week doing the day job and then you know, a lot of people do like side fun projects and that kind of thing. But because I'm a union either I have to drop the union and kind of commit to working full time with the office job and then doing performing for fun or performing full time as a union worker.

It's different.

Yeah, I mean it sounds to me.

I don't know, Jenny, You'll tell me what you think or tell us what you think, but it sounds to me, like, I don't know if the union aspect is as important as your creative outlet, Like if you really want to need your creative outlet and you can't afford to be a full time performer in the moment, you can either

That's kind of where I'm leaning towards you. There's like a badge of honor to get union, to fight for it, to get to the projects where you've grown enough credits so you can get union. But you know now that I'm not performing full time and committing to that full time, like it's I feel like I'm unfulfilled.

Right, I hear you, do you have any at all opportunities that you where you could quit your best job and do a union job full time, and.

When I move back to Florida, no, like there's only like a couple theaters that have union work.

I see.

Yeah, it's hard, it's so hard. But I have to say, Benji, you are exactly where you're supposed to be. Even if you're not performing in this very moment, You're doing what you're supposed to do. And I think if you just know that you are exactly where you are supposed to be, doors will open before you and then you'll be like, it'll turn into this magical experience that you didn't even see coming, and you know, who knows what will come next.

If you are just open.

If you try your best to stay in a really grateful place. You're so grateful for the job that you have now because it's paying your bills, and you're really open to whatever is out there. I mean, that's all you can do. Because we all have these situations where we have to pay the bills and we have to and there are things out there we'd rather be doing or things that we love do to do more. But you are doing exactly what you're supposed to be doing right now.

I also wonder if there are some other creative outlets that you could take advantage of, you know, and expand your horizons with that. Like maybe it's joining the Gay Men's Chorus if you're a singer, or joining a club and.

I want to join the game me too.

It's fun, it's the most lovely.

There are other things that you can do outside the union that are not, like I said, like at the theme parks. Sure that's union or non union. You can do that if you're a union or non union. So that's what I'm trying to do right now, and I'm working my way back into it. But I just, yeah, I wanted to know what you guys have your thoughts on that.

Are you committed to staying in Florida or is there any thought about going back to New York.

No, not necessarily. It was just the path that seemed the best forward. You know. I've got older parents, grandparents that kind of help the time, and so I wanted to come back to be with family for a little bit. And I've been here for like a year or so, and so I want to maybe pursue going somewhere else after this.

Well that sounds good. I mean, it sounds like you have a lot of options there.

Like I agree with Jenny, and like you know, being very grateful for the position that you're in. You're making money or you know, earning enough of a living to support yourself, you are close to your family.

Make sure you're taking all those things into account.

You don't have to constantly be living out your fantasy dream in order to live out your fantasy life.

This is what you need to do for the time being.

And and take our advice about whether to do some stuff on the side that's non union, I wouldn't really worry about that. I mean, people do that in this industry all the time, people who are union work and non union jobs.

You know, it's frowned upon, but you can people do it.

So And if it's a matter of just getting your juices flowing and getting a having a creative outlet, then absolutely do little things on the side. Do some stand up comedy, do some writing, do some singing, do whatever it is that gets you going and makes it feel a little bit like. This job isn't the end all be all. It's kind of a temporary thing. And when you're ready to leave Florida or you are, you're ready to look for a more permanent opportunity.

Then then I think that will also reveal itself.

I really appreciate you guys, Thank you so much.

Yeah, Benji, have fun in Florida while it's still on top of the on top of land.

It's still not that yet, so don't worry.

It's not going to get cold again, so don't worry. Global global warming is here and we're living it.

You guys are amazing.

Thank you so much.

Were taking the time and talk to me. I really appreciate you guys. Thank you. Bye.

Happy And he's not even fulfilling his dreams and he's in such a good.

That's good.

I'm fulfilling my dreams and I'm ready to fucking kill myself.

I asked my sister she could euthanize me the other day. I'm like, you can do that.

You can do you careend it when you're ready where I don't know that my you're creating a plan.

Well, you can do it in Oregon, but you have to go through this whole testing situation where you I believe I haven't researched it because I'm not. I am sort of serious, but not quietly. Yeah, but what I am like, if you have to be diagnosed with some sort of fatal disease in order to get approved. Oh, you don't go through the suffering, you can't.

Just thought.

It was just like, I don't think you can just make.

A plantively opt out, even though I mean, you have a cousin who's a doctor.

And he said, if I really feel that way, he will help youthanize me.

Exall, excellent.

Well, our next caller is Adam Dear Chelsea. I'm a thirty four year old male living in Orlando who's recently out of a situationship and who knows what the hell it was at this point. My therapist lately has taught me the concept of attachment styles and relationships and helped me realize that I have an anxious attachment style. The guy I was seeing has a dismissive, avoidant attachment style.

Oh good, this is our special guest Jenny Guard today.

Hello, oh hello, how are you? I want to be best for with them already I can tell you. Look, you might probably have the same attachment style. Maybe I don't even know what mine is, Adam.

I think there's avoidant, and there's avoidant, then there's anxious, and then there's secure.

Right, Yeah, those are the three.

I think there might be more. I think there's for me, you know, dismissive awaiting kind of stands out because one thing I learned from my therapist is that being in an anxious attachment style I attract DA's and so I'm like, this is so interesting, Like I've never really learned about this concept.

But he d dismissive avoidant.

So there's a lot of hybrid I thought Eve meant like a lawyer.

You could be.

You could yeah, you could be anxious avoidant, you could be just avoidant, you could be yeah. But I think listen, First of all, the identification of it is your first step.

But that was the combination of the two of us together, you know.

So you just have to be like alerted in your thinking and aware, which it sounds like you are, and that you've worked through this with your therapist about what your kind of pitfalls are, and then you're more easily able to identify other people's kinds of styles. And I think just by knowing it, you're going to make better choices. Like you're gonna go, oh, this guy is not the kind of guy for me. I have this one guy who hits on me all the time, right, He's constantly blowing up my dms.

He'll show up whenever I'm doing shows and he's cute.

I'm not really interested, but like, even if I were interested, I understand what.

His style is and it's not my style.

I'm like you, he comes in and out every couple months, and then it's like full court pressing me. And then you know, in between those months, I'm sure he's got a girlfriend.

I'm sure he's got other things going on. I'm not at the top of his list.

But then when he sees me or he's reminded of me, he's always like trying to say, Chelsea, we got to get together, we got to go out. I'm like, I'm not interested in you. I can already smell your number, you know what I mean. And so I think you just have to understand who you are before you can understand who anyone else is.

And it sounds like you've done that work. Yeah you think, Jenny, I think that.

Yeah.

Acknowledging what where you are and what you want is so so important. What you want for your future, and because of your experience in your past, you know what you don't want, and so being able to be very straightforward with yourself in those moments of whether it's temptation or you're at a crossroads with choice, you can tell yourself that's not the life that I want, that's not

And also, you know, when you meet people, every opportunity, every person you meet romantically is an opportunity to break a pattern. You have an opportunity here to never make this kind of mistake again. No sorry, it's not a mistake, but to never date a person like that again. You want to break your own cycles. And I'm really big into that. I like to not make mistakes multiple times because then you just start to feel like, what's wrong with me? You know, So make that the last type

Yeah.

Absolutely, you know. I think there's a good learning experience in the sense that, like you know, these types of people are very independent, and so it's a good learning experience in terms of like learned me to kind of you know, take the moments for me. You know, when we were kind of chatting in this situationship or whatever you want to call it, but just take some self care time and just making me appreciate that independent time.

I know it's hard, but like, seriously, is it that hard. It's not that hard when someone's not right for you. There are billions of people on this planet. There are over three hundred million people in this country. You will find another person that you were interested in. It's really not that hard to set a boundary and keep.

Yeah, you need to be tough love, You need to be tough with yourself, you know, and just remember that you are the only one that's taking care of you. He's not taking care of you. So whatever is in your best interest is what you have to keep in mind. That you got to keep your eye on the prize and you are, yes, exactly, well.

Thank you.

I appreciate that.

Okay, Well, good back with everything.

Bye, thank you, bye bye.

I like good luck with everything. Bye, goodbye.

Listen.

We're trying, We're trying out.

We are we are. You're giving great advice, Jenny. Yeah, and your voice is so soothing.

Oh I try, Well, that's my voice. I can't.

Yeah no, but it is soothing. It's probably very soothing to your girls.

I would imagine they like it.

Yeah, that's good voice for podcasting. Jenny also has a podcast, Well I Choose me too too. I found out a different podcast.

Yeah.

Well, and I'm producing a third one call I Do Part two, which is about finding love and your second act. Oh, we do that one and I did it with Amy Roeback and d J.

Holmes.

Amy Roback the oh Amy road Back.

Yeah, I know you're talking about. Okay, great, oh part two. That's perfect for our listeners too. I'm sure there's a lot of women who are looking for their Part two.

Yeah. Well.

Our next question comes from Isabelle, and this is a co parenting sort of question.

Okay, ah too.

Yeah.

On Isabelle says, Dear Chelsea, I'm a thirty six year old woman and have been dating a great guy for six months now. We're super compatible in many ways, and although we've only known each other for a relatively short time. I feel like this could be a longer lasting thing. There's only one thing that bothers me, and that's his ex.

I normally wouldn't care if a partner keeps touch with an ex.

I sporatically text with my ex husband, who is part of my life for fifteen years, but we also had a no contact phase for two years after separating, so clean break and we both moved on and can be happy for each other now. My boyfriend, on the other hand, has kept in touch with his ex this whole time, and his main reason is that she wants to see their dogs. Sometimes he drops them off at her place, but they've also walked the dogs together, and I always

Ever since then, he.

Hasn't brought her up at all, so I'm assuming he's just avoiding conflict by not telling me about their dog parenting meetups anymore. I'm not worried he's sleeping with her, but I am jealous that he won't let go of that relationship because, on top of everything, they're trauma bonded, and I feel like he will never reach this level of vulnerability with me that he has with her. My question is, how can I open this conversation again without

Isabelle, Isabelle, Oh, isabel the Flag.

I know, I know, I hate to be like you know.

I don't ever want women to act in jealousy or out of jealousy. But there is something that's so codependent. I guess we learned interdependent. It's the opposite of codndent, but codependent that is.

A red flag.

Like that is like, okay, he's he has to go be with her and and you're not exposed to her at all.

That means there is something Is.

He doing it for the dogs or is he doing it for drop off?

I don't think the.

Dogs really care.

I don't think dogs care either. That dog he never saw me again. I think he'd.

Exactly he finds somebody else to write, right. I think that that is the biggest thing here. I feel like he's got to put his money where his mouth is. And if that means that he needs to end a relationship that is not serving your new his new relationship, well then that's a choice that he has to make.

And it's not an easy choice, you know.

But if I mean, you seem to be kind of okay with them being friends, but you just want.

To be in the loop.

Yeah, but be in the loop.

You were in the loop and you didn't like it, and now you're out of the loop and you don't like that.

So you're not going to like either one.

And it's like he's got one foot in his old relationship and one foot in his new relationship, is what it sounds like, So I would I wouldn't be worried about his reaction to you stating what your boundaries are. Either you have boundaries or you don't, and if you have them, you have to be confident in stating what they are, which is, I don't feel comfortable with this relationship anymore.

If you do feel.

Comfortable with the relationship, then you just have to accept it and stop asking questions about it.

Yeah, it's kind of like it's one or the other. It's black and white, really.

Right, And I wouldn't I think if you say to yourself, Okay, I'm fine with them being in a relationship, he knows how you feel now, so he's going to avoid telling you anything about it, and that then it works.

That's going to.

Create more tension and more of a chasm between the two of you. And I think it's important to say, like, this doesn't feel right to me, Like I don't think you want me to feel this way, And if you don't care that I feel this way, then that's a bigger issue.

Right.

The fact that it caused the argument, that's the biggest or.

Because listen, if I went to someone that I was in a relationship with and I said, hey, this this bothers me.

This isn't a man.

It's not like we're talking about your relative that you have to go see. This is an old flame that you're sharing a dog with that you never officially ended a relationship with.

That doesn't make me feel good. That makes me feel very like.

I question that, and I question your motives for seeing her because is the dog telling you that he needs to see her?

What's going on exact?

Or like drop the dog off and then you know what I mean, it's it's important to you walk kid.

Yeah, my ex husband would drop the kids off and then leave. It's not like we hung out. I got anything out.

Of seeing walks together.

No, no, no, this is You've got to definitely speak up and fight for your right because this doesn't sound like it's it's beneficial to you in the long.

Run, especially if you have not been exposed to this woman, then that's a secret.

If you're not in.

The relationship, then there's no open dialogue about the fact that you are in a relationship and that she's aware of what the status of your relationship is. So, yeah, how you would bring it up again without it resulting in that. I think it's probably going to result in an argument as it did the first time. But I think you do need to be honest and just say everything we said and be like, listen, this doesn't make me feel good.

I don't feel secure.

This isn't what I'm looking for in terms of being in a trusting relationship.

You just need to put it on the table and you need to define what you want and if he can't give that to you, then you need to figure out what your next move is.

Hit us back when you come up with that.

Let's hear.

Yeah, well, let's take a break and we'll come back with one more question and my.

Pub Okay, great, we'll be right back and we're back with Jennie Garth. Jennie Garth, who chooses, She chooses her? I choose me, Catherine, you choose you?

I sure do, I sure do.

It's all about choices.

Yeah, it's all about us and choices.

That's right.

And I do love that you're having, like a women's group. Some of the most important decisions in my life have been made after going to a women's group like that, like a meetup sort of thing. And I remember there was one that I went to where I was like sort of toying with moving to California, and it was like a big sort of deal.

But I was like, maybe this is what I'm on fire about and excited about.

And then the rest of the weekend, all the women were like, you're the one who's moving to California, and it became a truth while we were together. There's so much power in getting women to oh that's interesting.

What's like a crazy story that you've heard or or an inspiring story that you've heard from a woman.

A common theme is not.

Knowing how to choose yourself, having been taking care of other people all your life, or taught to be a people pleaser, or put in this position that you aren't be able to breathe in or shine in. And I think it's it's very very scary to break out of a mold or a box that you've been put in, especially if you're doing it alone.

Well, even just our last the person that wrote in about her boyfriend and the dog and the ex that's just like, how do I bring up this conversation again without it turning cantankerous or it's like, but that's not your problem, Like you're stating what you want. If he

Lindsey says, dear Chelsea, thank you for your unapologetic, intelligent, bravery and unwavering support you show to women everywhere. You're welcome as a female physician in Texas. I needed some levity and light after the recent election, and I was thrilled to discover you had a podcast. I've been devouring all the episodes now for the advice. In short, my brother filed for divorce a year and a half ago,

The details of her behavior.

I gave him advice STD council and also educated him on personality disorders, of which she has I think at least one. The month he filed for divorce, we went on a family trip, and while we were away, she got into his iPad and read every single text exchanged between us. She did a one to eighty and went from telling him she was miserable in the marriage to

Have been made.

But my sister in law never showed signs of shame, regret, embarrassment, or remorse. She instead has been on a war path to cut us out of their lives. They've decided to seal the deal with a pregnancy, of course, and two of us siblings have been excluded from their lives because of the advice we gave him a year and a half ago. We dropped it and have only sent loving texts, but those texts are met with long, angry texts back, demanding we recant our prior advice and make a grand

So what is my ask?

I'm not sure I know. But during the holiday season, this rift has become a huge problem. As you can imagine, they tried to make me unwelcome at my parents' holiday table last year, and this year the sentiment is more of the same. I've been told by my brother and his wife that the only way we can move forward in our relationship is for me to meet with her so she can rate me for the sentiments I shared

What would Chelsea do?

Lindsey, Okay, I'm going to use mel Robin's advice right here. She has a new book called Let Them, and that's what you need to do.

Let them.

Let them go have their family and their toxic relationship, and let them have their babies who will most likely will hopefully not be toxic.

But let them.

There's nothing you can do. There is absolutely nothing you can do besides go on with your life. And it's so sad that you don't have a brother really right now. Hopefully that won't be permanent. But there is no point in getting involved with them in any way. It is so toxic and now that you have to kind of say goodbye to your brother in the relationship that you had with him. And while that sounds harsh, it's true, Like there's no point you're going to torture yourself.

Yeah, she just needs to step back.

Step back.

They can't take away your parents. You have your own relationship with them, and if you have to suffer through them on the holidays, then so be it. But don't get involved in their drama. Don't try to negotiate anything with them.

Just back out because your.

Brother needs to understand also that he has been isolated by his wife, like she is making sure that everyone in his life is not there for you to sit down for an appointment to get berated as one of the most ludicrous things I've ever heard, Like, fuck off. You were his counselor and you were his helper and now you're getting punished.

Why don't you understand how he's allowing this to happen.

Well, he's brainwashed too, He's like, you know how you know how women and men alike can do that to women, to other people, like if you're an easy going, really easygo and she said he was kind of like a Labrador retreat or something like that. Like you can easily be manipulated by another person and then kind of get brainwashed by them.

It's not dissimilar from being in a cult.

It's just one person that's controlling you, and it's all very controlling. Anyone who does that and tries to isolate you from your family is that's abuse.

By the way, this.

Specific type of behavior in the UK, they call it coercive control and they've actually just made it illegal. It's not illegal here in the US, but like you actually can get in trouble legally for controlling your partner in the UK.

That's great.

How do they define it? Like the gaping point, I.

Mean, it's it's these elements of like cutting someone off from their family, and there's a whole lot of things that go into it. But these like toxic boyfriends, are toxic you know, girlfriends or wives, these sorts of things.

There are consequences for it now at.

Least well he's there are consequences to what he's experiencing too. When she's experiencing, he's going to lose a sister, somebody that's looking in right, looking out for his best interest, and he's losing more than you're losing, probably because he's caught up in this cycle of listening to the wrong person instead of listening to himself.

Yeah, so that's I mean, that sucks and I'm sorry, but yeah, I would get yourself extricate yourself from that dynamic.

Is there like an emotion or a mantra that you would send her in with when she does see them at holidays and has to sort of be a sivolt just it's mel Robbins.

Let them, let them do their thing, let them be toxic, let them have a dysfunctional relationship, let them be angry, let them be abusive to each other.

It's none of your business anymore.

Okay.

And on that note, we're gonna thank Jenny Garth for being here today.

I'm so happy to be here. Thank you.

I know, it's so nice to see you.

Her podcasts Choose Me podcast and there's part two podcasts, then there's an another one.

What's the name of the third one you're producing.

That is a it's called Nino two one og.

It's a oh we even talk about nine or two one oh, but we had too much other stuff to talk about. You can also find her clothing line on QVC. It's called Me by Jenny Garth, or you can go to Jennygarth dot com and find it.

And then what day is your Women's group? January eleventh?

January eleventh at iHeart Theater in Los Angeles.

Okay, that sounds fun, It'll be fun.

Well, was nice to see you, Thanks to goodbye everybody.

Okay, guys, stand up shows that I have coming up December twenty eighth, I'm coming in New Orleans right before New Year's and then I'll be in Atlanta, Georgia on December twenty ninth. And those are the rest of my stand up dates for this year. It's over New Tour New Year. If you'd like.

Advice from Chelsea, shoot us an email at Dear Chelsea podcast at gmail dot com and be sure to include your phone number. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Catherine law and be sure to check out our merch at Chelseahandler dot com