A Lot of Things Happen for a Reason with Glennon Doyle, Abby Wambach & Amanda Doyle

so cathartic. Yeah, I mean you really went there, you know, you unloaded it all and talked about your growth and and how where you're at right now, and I thought that was so powerful. Well, thank you so much. It felt really good. It's so nice to you know, have the type of personality that I have in times like this because I'm never shy about being real, you know,

like well over sharing. I love that. I mean that's been like the theme of my entire you know, career and life, like the two are so intertwined that it feels so good to share with so many people because you just really don't understand the impact that you can have on like the messages and the d m s and all of the stuff and the people you know who get to hear that, and like, your pain is never your own, you can always just like by letting it out, you are healing yourself and healing others. Yeah.

I was thinking about this sort of separately, but in relation to you, I've been rewatching some Kardashians lightly, just as my junk food TV. Why are you rewatching or is there a new season there is? I like, I'm rewatching it in order chronological, so I'm waiting to watch the new season. But I was just like, you know what, I just feel like I need to know what's going

on in the world. But one thing I really appreciate, especially as someone who has a couple lot of immune issues and these sorts of things, but it is really nice to see someone else who seemingly have you know, people who have these seemingly wonderful lives and they have migraines or sosiasis or whatever the case may be, and I just really appreciate them sharing things like their fertility

journeys and you know, health issues. Yeah, so Open has migraines, Chloe, Chloe has migraines, and who had the fertility issues Kim and I think Chloe, like I thought she was going to have some fertility issues or maybe dead and then naturally I didn't know that. Yeah, but Kim had all kinds of issues with her first too, pregnancy, that first baby that was not Yeah, I remember looking. I think we flew somewhere on Ryan Seacrest playing at some point and her ankles. I was like, oh, oh, oh, it

would look too painful what happened to her ankles? Just but it's just nice to see that, Like other people go through that and they're scared when they get diagnoses, and you know, they work through them. And I don't know if there's something really reassuring about hearing what somebody else has gone through, just like you shared. And it's also nice that that whole clan has each other, you know what I mean, Like there's so many of them with the mother and the five sister you know, every

day they have someone to lean on all the time. Yeah. Absolutely, And I mean there's just like this gaggle of kids who are growing up in the limelight and they're going to all have each other, which is kind of a cool thing. Yeah. Yeah, So I am coming to Vancouver two shows Friday, August twelve. I'm coming to Calgary auguste and then again August. I am coming to Saratoga, California,

October one. October eight, I'm gonna be in Niagara Falls, and then I'm coming to Long Beach, California, and Bakersfield October October one and twenty two, Passa Robles, California, and I will be in Vegas October two, Yeah, the Mirage, and then October twenty nine Wheatland, California. And then I have a whole bunch of other dates. Tampa, Fort Myers, Daytona Beach, Florida, Hollywood, Baltimore, Maryland, Riverside, California, Pennsylvania, Wilkes Barry.

I finally learned how to say that after my fiftieth trip there. Anyway, All those tickets and more are available at Chelsea handler dot com. So our guest today is Glenn and Doyle, Abbey Wambach and her sister Amanda. Amanda doesn't have a last name, according to me, Hi, guys, Cissy, are you nervous? This is our first podcast we've done together. What yeah, like off of our own podcast. This is our first ever experience like this. Oh my god, I'm

so I love to di virginize lesbians. I'm just happy to be starting in the minor leagues, you know, for my first I feel like it's important to get my get my feet wet before I do like some real

big ones. Oh my god. Well, guys, I mean, we're bonded for life forever, okay, because we had an incredible experience, all of us together the other day when we did we can do hard things, and we talked a lot about my life and my personal experience, answers of late and all of that fun stuff, which was super cathartic and helpful. And the response from everyone is just always blows me away. Sometimes I sit there, you know, I

was this morning. I had all this Mexican food left over, and my housekeeper was making me some like delicious Mexican breakfast situation. And I was just like scrolling through Instagram and my d M s and I was just reading and reading one woman after another after another, and you just never, ever, you can never overestimate the impact being honest and sharing has on other people. It's been magic for us today. I mean, I'm I've had I've had friends call me today crying. I can't. I've never heard

someone speak about love like that. I've never heard someone talk about not abandoning them. Something magic happened during that hour. For real. I actually texted your editor, who you're writing your new book with, and I was like, I'm telling you, something new is happening with this conversation that Chelsea's starting right now. I can feel it. I can feel it.

Well you've been You've been incremental in having the conversation as well as anyone familiar with Glennon's books and Glennon's podcast and everything Glennon does as well, because you are all about learning about yourself and opening yourself up. So I thought today what we could talk about before we give advice to strangers, which is my favorite thing in

the world. I wanted to know from all three of you about your relationship together and what you find to be the most valuable insight from you to sy see about their relationship individually and together that you value in each other, and what you've learned about yourself by being in this kind of healthy relationship. So Abby, I'm gonna start with you. I want you to tell me what is the most one of the most, because I'm sure there it is endless what is one of the things

that you admire most about Glenned. I mean, this is tough, and I don't mean this in like a Google Gaga way. I just think that the way Glennan, the way she approaches life in truth is something that I have, First of all, I needed to learn when we first met. I was like in the pro sports world where I didn't let any of the outside world really know what

was going on with me personally. And when I first talked to Glennon, you know, I had just gotten a d u I and I was asking her if I should put it in my book, and I was like freaking out. I was like really having a hard time, and she just shamelessly was like, just tell the truth. The truth is where the normal people live and where they where we want to have good connected conversations. And so the way that Glennon lives in her truth and her work ethic is something that that I'm marvel at.

I mean, I'm a naptaker and um, she isn't. I'm a nap shamer. She's a nap shaker. Yeah. And then I would say for a sister for Amanda Doyle, are I mean, literally we're all doing life together. You are the person in our life that just gets shit done. And I know it comes at a personal cost to you. It's stressful, it's hard. You you just are the best. I feel like all three of us have like really fabulous parts of a personality that make up one perfect human being. Yeah, you know, like we we feel like

we're like body, mind, and spirit. But like it's like body is Abbey, and mind is Sister and spirit is me. So like on our own we're kind of lost, like it's it's it's not good. Together we make one fully functioning. But sister and I have been Amanda and I have been inseparable since she was born three years after I was born. I always I feel scared about those three years, like what the hell was I going? Except for when I was really bad, lost in addiction. She had to

put up some serious boundaries during that time. So when Abby came into my life, it was really interesting because when it's a boy, it's like all right, whatever, Like there's nothing threatening there to a sisterhood, you know, but bringing a woman into our life was like interesting to recalibrate, like is this so she she's she part of our sisterhood now is she the other sister wives? Sister? What? And man, just like, do I have to have sex

with her too? What's going on? I was never on offer, Chelsea. Yeah, I remember that being a tricky time. Do you remember, sister, because I feel like I just was. I never knew if you were going to feel uncalibrated it during that time. I always assumed and and all roads would lead to that being the case. And I remember being completely shocked that that was never a factor. There was never. I mean,

it's surprising because that's not my character. I'm jealous, I'm jealous of everything, and I it just never was so, I mean, for me, I was shocked by Abby. I'm always shocked, but um, I was shocked because I never knew that I could love someone like I love you, Glennon, and I do. I love Abby that much and so and Abby plays a very specific role in my life. I was talking to my therapist the other day and I'm very I made it into a therapy exactly for

the good reasons. I'm not usually the reasons people make it into therapy. And I'm a hyper monitor, so I'm always like looking for problems. I never I never rest because I'm always just anticipating three steps ahead and figuring out what the world and situation needs for me. And my therapist was like, can you think of any time Well, she meant like times, like wide swats of time, and I was like no, She's like, can you think of any particular moment where you haven't felt like that? And

I said yes. With my sister in law, when I'm with Abby, she is this perfect blend of having things under control, of knowing what's going on, but without being manic or anxious about it. And so it's this secret sauce of the only time that I can feel like, oh, she's got it, and it's the only time I'm like RESTful. Ever, Yeah, that sounds like you guys are just I mean, it's

like your everybody is right where they belong. It does feel that way, and and for me and I kind of don't under and how we got along sister with before Abby like she's such a delightful had so much delight and lightness. Well, we got along, but we weren't having fun. We were That's what it was. We were miserable. Loved each other, but we were miserable, and we hated

our lives. Misery is our comfort zone. That's so funny because that's what exactly when I referenced watching one of your Instagram posts the other day, Abby of you, and when Glennan was just like, I have my feelings suck.

Everything sucks. I suck. I've never been happy. I was like, I thought that that very thing, Like, thank God for the lightness of her filming this to take away, you know, to lessen the blow of the seriousness of your feelings, you know, and the despair, like her presence alone takes brings a little bit more light to the situation. Yeah, we did a camera in your face. I'm like, can

you what could you be? Really? She's like, based, people are going to believe this ship when I have to listen to so can I just use this at least? So great? It's like taking up a collection for herself. Every time she posted something like that, she's got a whole library, She's got an editor on her own. She's like, can you get through this ship? Because I don't have time. There's not a time in a day. But sister, what do you what do you have you seen in your

sister that has blown you open? From her relationship with Abby, just the audacity and the courage to go for it continues to blow me away because she was in you know, all of her little baby ducks were in a row, and it was a little bit you know, they weren't ideal ducks, but they were still quite in a row, and she just went in and blew it all up. Two on a hunch, by the way, on a hunch that it would be better, like they weren't together. They weren't.

She just had had this experience of meeting Abby and knowing that she couldn't go back to be in her marriage that she knew was so much less than that. And so sometimes, frankly, it scares me because I'm a very logical thinker and not a feel feeler, And so I think all the time, what are all of us as I see them today, five years, six years later, what is the thing that seems absurd that none of us are doing, and how does that change the course

of our lives? Because it seems impossible that they would not be who they are and living the life they have now. But actually that was the least likely thing he looked back six years ago. So I just admire her courage and I admire her just presence and confidence in herself to be like I understand this looks ridiculous to everyone around me. It only matters that it doesn't feel ridiculous to me. I think that is always in

the back of my mind. Yeah, we are going to take a quick break so you can hear an ad and then we'll be right back. Lennon, I've read and spoken to you firsthand to hear about your experience meeting Abby, but I've never had heard Abbey's version of it. Would you mind sharing that with us? Sure? So we um. I was releasing my first memoir, and I doubt that I'm going to write a second month. So I was

releasing my memoir. I'm not like you people who like to write books six number one New York Times bestsellers. I know. That's how I introduced myself, you guys, I would too. I ended up showing up late to this gathering that we were supposed to go do this book event to sell our books to the librarians of America, and we were going to go on stage. You got to say, you know a little speech about what your

books about. The librarians will buy up your books, and I walked back stage age and I looked at the roster of like other authors who were going to be there, and I was struggling with alcoholism. I was like a month sober at the time, and I saw that she was a recovered alcoholic and I was like, oh, that's super interesting. I want to talk to her. So when I walked into the room, all I see is this vision across the room just like standing up and like stretching her arms out into a t And by the way,

this room is like really small. There was tables inside people were eating, and so now this one person stands up in the other side of the room and I'm like, well, now this is super awkward. I have to go greet this one person who's acknowledged me. Everybody else is just kind of like eating, and so I have to like scoot around the entirety of all of the other people who are eating, all the other authors, and I we hug and I was like, wow, like something was different

for sure, Like my blood pressure went up. I got like the little, you know, butterflies in my stomach, and then I couldn't get over the fact that I wanted to sit next to her the whole time, and I got seated next to this like children's book author, which was like, he was great, but I was really wanted

to sit next to Glennon. And then when we found ourselves up on stage, we ended up sitting right next to each other and that was wonderful because I was so nervous for some reason, I couldn't really figure it out. And then that night I went home and I read Love Warrior and I got to the end of Love Warrior and I was like, what because we stayed together at the end, How can this be? I like, I shut the book. It was like two o'clock in the morning. I was so pissed. I was like, oh my gosh.

And then two days later I got an email from Glennon. I found her, I found her assistant. Well, her assistant came up to me at the little table in front of the thousand librarians, leaned over with tears in her eyes and said, I don't know what's happening right now, but I feel like Abby needs you in her life. Like all these weirdass things happened that at I know everyone needs that. That's your sister working your magic for you. You know, seither your sister or your wingman, like I

don't know. Apparently it's your assistant too. I hope my fucking assistance listening to this. Yeah, so I just like found her assistance email and sent an email that I had written out for Abby, and I wrote it with

like lots of spiritual wisdom about recovery and everything. But I think it was like my I don't think I for sure no, that it was my way of being like, Hi, would you like to start something, but it was couched in a lot of mentorship and friendship in the beginning, right, yes, And I was like, yes, I want to be friends with you, like, yes, I want to be mentored by you immediately, that's right. In the matter of Glennan, did

you write did you acknowledge the book? Or you're the status of your situation because you were still with him, right were we were? Yeah? Absolutely no, it was just all about recovery. And I do know when we look back at the email, subtly the first sentences, I have never watched soccer before, maybe some guys games, but I'm really over men. Yeah, in the first paragraph, I was like my lesbian Gaitar was like, it doesn't take a

lot of gaydar right to say, she just I'm over men. Yeah, so subtle as usual, a little crack you can squeeze through there, yea yeah. And then we started emailing back and forth so much, just letters and letters, and oh, that's so much fun, isn't It's so much fun to be excited about an email and opening up an email when you're gonna have crushing on someone. It's like, it's

the best zone in life. It's the best. Wake up the five in the morning to see if there's anything they're like, oh my god, before coffee even that's how you know. And then I don't know if you know this, but we didn't. We decided we were in love and told that to each other via email and like text messages. Right, So I told Craig that our marriage was over. We never we're together again. Besides that first evening when we were just in the same room with a bunch of librarians.

We were never together again. She until after I broke up my marriage, until I flew to you months and months later in l a And it was the night of the SPS and she but nobody knew. I had to wait back in a hotel room and she had to go do her sp thing where she got her

and I got to watch her on the television. It was all very romantic, but I had never kissed a girl, never touched a girl, never, and I had broken up this marriage and we were starting this thing, and I had to go to a hotel room and be like, I guess we need to try this now. I hope it works. Yes, so I guess last night was the anniversary of our first sex. Yes you've heard You've heard it here first on Chelsea Handler. We can call it of July. I mean it was like for the first

ever real sex for me. I feel like it. I was like, oh, I see what the hubbub is about. I love I love that you officially became a lesbian on the night of the SPS. That perfect, I mean,

is there anything more perfect? First of all, I have my hand is on my arm is standing out because it's such a beautiful story for all three of you and for your whole family and everything you've created together is just so heartwarming and beautiful, and and it really does is such a strong reminder to people that your person is out there, you know, and when you have feeling to not ignore that feeling. But people are always

saying to me why I think it's so interesting? And I've been thinking about you NonStop, literally NonStop, But people always ask me, would you have it's wonderful that you've left you're good enough and found your person because that was a courgeous didn't it was? But would you have done that if there were no abbey? Would you have You're good enough if there was not something else to

jump to? Because for certain I had that knowing right that this isn't this can't be all there is, that that I was made for something different than this, and I don't think it's always better. It's not like I don't think of settling as like I'm a turn and he'sn't for and so I'm not going to settle. Settling is like I know this isn't exactly right for me, and I'm doing it anyway because I'm more afraid of being alone than i am of being with the wrong

person right. So anyway, I think it's a new thing to expect the more want, the more want the right, and leave the what's not it even when there's nothing else to jump to. That's the most brave, amazing thing and That's what I keep thinking about with you this week, right, right, and I think that you would have done the same thing without abby, even though there's always you know, sometimes

we need a catalyst. And that's what that's what energy is, and that's what magnetism is, you know, that's why the things happen. That's why you can be in the middle of an airport in New Delhi and walk into a bathroom and and somebody's walking out of a stall in the same exact moment that you went to high school with and you bumped right into them. It's like, that's a magnetic thing that is supposed to happen, because there's too many people in this world for that coincidence to

happen on its own, you know what I mean. There's like a charge of electricity that we're all surrounded by. And you know, the less in touch you are with that, you know, the less in touch you are with that. But when you realize, like, oh, keep your eyes open, you know, looking at look, make sure you're always looking, because you don't know what you're supposed to see, you know, and when you're supposed to see it. And accidents are just not accidents, you know. I mean some of them are.

I don't believe everything happens for a reason. And when people say that, I'm like that that's a little bit much. But a lot of things happen for a lot of things. The reason great title for a to check and make sure that for a reason to check and make sure that one's not taken. Okay, but I'm not gonna let you off the Hooklen And you have to tell me what you what an Abbey brings you the most joy? Joy? Sure,

I mean my life. Sometimes when I walk into a place I just told you this recently and Abbey has has not been able to come to the thing, I

feel like such a disappointment. I feel like the whole rooms like looking behind me and it's like, oh hi, Like she's the joy and she you know, the last night we were sitting at our our family at our dinner table, and there was this moment, sister, I told you about this this morning where Abby just started she looked at our youngest and she started asking her like really pointed questions and it was about like drinking and

like all the all these things. And I was like, Okay, this is uncomfortable and weird, and we shouldn't be talking about this just all my like out of my comfort zone. We ended up having a two hour conversation where all three of these kids opened up in ways that they have never I mean, it was it was like a

family shifting conversation. Would you agree. She just has a way of making every single person she's talking to, whether they're ten years old, eighty years old, whatever, feel completely seen, completely safe, and because of that, people open up to her.

And as that, you just it's like I never knew people before they sit down with her, and so because of that, every experience is better for for for even just people that are watching or hanging out right, it's like and then I don't know, she's just like you know how they have those soda streamer things where you just like put the bubbles in. She's just like the putting the bubbles in. Like I'm just always like the whoa, whoa.

That's still true. That's not true. I actually I have to push back a little bit because we talked about this on our walk the other day. After our conversation with Chelsea about her housekeeper sitting her her staff sitting here down and saying like you're our person, that made me cry. It made us We've talked, we've been, we've been non stopped talking about it because I was like, that's how I feel. I feel like everybody loves you more and and everybody only loves me because of us.

You're the solar system that our little world's revolve within. And the same with Chelsea. Yeah, that's what she said on the walk. That's that's the way it is. I love that I can totally relate to what you're saying, Glennon. I mean, but yeah, exactly. Everyone is their own well we're all our own little galaxies. That's just the way it is. But you know, when we can team up with another galaxy and work off of each other, like Abby you said the other day, like a Venn diagram,

that is where the magic comes in. Then it becomes a magical experience, not just a one on one. And I think you know that gift that you have, Abby, of letting people be seen and heard. It's just so heartwarming to even hear about that because so many people don't feel that way. They don't feel seen and as children especially you know, and they don't feel heard. And it's amazing what you can discover about the people who've been in your lives forever when somebody else has a

different line of questioning, Yes, yes, exactly exactly that. Well, on that note, Captaine, what do you have to say for yourself? Oh my goodness, well I haven't. We have callers today, tell us what we're in for so many different things. A lot of these questions are well they're all in each of your whalehouses, but a lot of them have really specific things that apply to you, know, the things each of you have written about. And so I'm very excited to get some awesome we love collars.

We'll take a quick break and we'll be right back with collars. Okay, we're all going to take a virtual bath and we're back. I can't believe you two snuck into Los Angeles and didn't let me know. What funk is that about? When did you move that for a year. We'll talk about that in another pandemic move That sounds like a slight. You've been in love. I know, I know, you know it's like time consuming. Love is kind of a big deal. I know it is. It's a very time,

a lot of free time. Now, so hit me up, perfect now, enter perfect, Well, our first question comes from Alex. Alex says, do we get married or save the money? Dear Chelsea, my name is Alex. I'm a gay man living in western Pennsylvania. Please stop introducing yourself as gay men. There are no straight men writing into this show. Okay, now one needs to say you're gay. My favorite is when people will be like, I'm a male or I'm a female. Like we can just say like guyer gal,

that's I doesn't have to be so medical. I'm twenty nine years old and work as a real estate agent. I've been with my partner, Johnny for almost seven years. He's kind, patient, and truly my best friend. Almost four years ago, I proposed to Johnny while on a cruise. I was planning on a nice dinner and an elaborate show of affection, but I was so excited that as soon as we got on the ship, I took him to the bow, got on one knee, and he said yes.

Johnny and I live in a beautiful lake community and are very fortunate to have purchased our home before the market went crazy. Needless to say, buying a simple home was extremely excited for us. We've delayed planning a wedding for some time. We love slowly putting money into our home and enjoying life. We're also not picturing a traditional

wedding growing up. We were both raised in Christian households, so never in our wildest dreams did we think that we could be able to get married and live out and proud as we are. We both feel it's silly to spend thousands of dollars on one day and don't have the means to commit that much money. We both feel that a non traditional, fun wedding is what we want. Anyway, We continuously toss around the idea of a destination wedding, but are afraid that it would put a financial stress

on our families and friends. They're continuously asking us when we're getting married and wonder why we're delaying a good thing when clearly we want to be together forever. Should we have a destination wedding with family and friends in Mexico despite some not being able to attend, or should we continue to invest money into our home, delay the wedding and hopefully get a return on our investment. All

the best, Alex, this is a serious financial question. Yeah, I love it, you take it go abby, I mean, get married in your backyard, have all your guests, bring some food that ship, like you'll be done and done, like it'll be beautiful. Like the thing about for me, I've had two weddings now, and I did the destination wedding first go around, flew my whole family out there. It was a big hullabaloo for fucking nothing. What a waste of money. And then you know, we just like

we just completely did it totally differently. And I don't know, I I think of our marriage now like we we talked about it. It's like this is second marriage ship, Like we have learned stuff that we're bringing into the second marriage. And the wedding is about the love. It's not about where you're doing it. It's not about and they love their how they love home twelve times home, backyard, pot look, backyard out look. And then when you're making

the list, this is what we did. Okay, we wrote down we had like everybody we love for something, everybody we love, and there was like hundred and fifty people on it. And then we were like, okay, no, now we got to take it to everybody we love and like. And then there was like forty people on it, and as the one of them was, we both had to know everybody, yes that came. We didn't want any strangers there,

and that took it down quite a bit. Yeah, and then it was everybody we like, love and trust and we ended up having twenty people and it was twenty people and it was the freaking best and there was no stress and there was not a million bazillion details. And sister, remember when you came and how calm we actually were. It was eerie. It was so weird. And this was what they said. I was freaking out because

nothing was done. It was it was nothing. They were like, we're all getting together just for like a beach weekend, and it was spirit and body, all right, we had mind had not that applied to the template. And she and Glenna just said, you know what, we've decided it's not going to be perfect, so we can be happy. We are going to be happy so it will be perfect. And wow, that is a great way, because nothing's ever

going to be perfect. And if you're waiting, if your happiness is contingent on it being perfect, you will always be very, very sad. But if you just decide that you're happy and therefore it will be perfect. That's that's a nice way to do it. I'm going to write that down from my book. Write it down for from from from something's happened for a reason. That can be your apeth. I would like to one of what these

girls all said and say, have this. Have a blowout in your backyard, Have a great, big, fun, casual affair in your backyard, just like these two had as many people as you want. You can have twenty, you can have six or whatever you guys are down with. You want to celebrate with your whole family and invite a hundred people, go for it, and then take that Mexico trip just the two of you as your honeymoon. Just go away together and and then celebrate your love alone together.

That is where love should be celebrated. You're not on parade for everybody. You don't have to have a big show of a wedding. I think everyone who goes to a wedding appreciates so much more the genuine vibe of two people and being happy for them. You know that no one likes a formal I mean, some people like a formal affair, but these guys don't sound like they do. And I don't think anybody here that is. You don't want to be a presentation, you want to be a celebration. Uh,

let me write that, souf. We're just like writing Charlse book. We're gonna be at chapter two by the next question. This is great, but at home you can be absolutely yourself. You can make it so much more about who the two of you are, rather than you know, the same chair as everybody used for their last wedding at some location, the same flower as the last person had. Does it

make it exactly you? You could just pick one thing that you and Johnny love about the wedding generally, like what's your one thing, and then just do that like for our I also had two weddings, and I very much recommend that people have two weddings because the second one you get to just everyone says, like, what you're not inviting You're inviting one uncle and not the other uncle, and you just get to say, oh, it's a second wedding, and everyone's like, oh, I guess, I guess you could

do whatever. But my favorite thing about weddings is the night before the rehearsal dinner and the toasts and so we just said, our whole wedding is going to be that we're just doing the actual wedding night. We're doing whoever wants to give a toast does it. And it was so special because that was my favorite part of anybody's wedding, except when sister you got up and spoke first at our wedding, and you did so good that

everybody else was so scared to stand up after. My family was like, Nope, not me, not going to follow that ship. Most beautiful wedding toast I've ever heard. I would love to hear that. That sounds great. You can put it in your book. Chelsea actually sending me a link so I can add that to my book. Just a lot of things happen for a reason. Also, I guess our advice is for both of you to get married once before and then do this. Make sure that

that is an addendum. Well. Our next question comes from Katie. Katie says, Dear Chelsea, I tend to want to get intimate with a man after three to four great dates and then end up getting ghosted. If I feel a connection with a guy, it's utter bs that I can't explore that intimacy without looking like a slut. After a few great dates, I end up feeling tricked and also disappointed in my own self destruction the one to two

times a year I actually like a guy. I'm on a year sabbatical from alcohol, and one of my goals this year was to not sleep with guys so early. But recently, I did get more intimate after the third date with a guy I was really excited about and he had seemed excited about me. I'd love to hear your advice and thoughts on this topic as a fellow openly sexual woman. It may just be that I need to learn to control myself more and hold out longer

to see if a guy wants to stick around. But sex is important to me and the double standard drives me insane. For context, I'm a thirty year old single woman who's never been in a relationship. I date a lot, but feel this self destruction I caused myself around date three, four five is likely why I've never had a relationship. This most recent guy, I think might be the final

straw to break the cycle. I'm sad about what almost was, disappointed myself for feeding into desires in the moment and looking like someone I'm not two men who might have wanted a relationship with me otherwise. Thoughts Katie, M Hi Katie, Oh my god, Katie. Oh this is a real life She's like Deil. We have so many people for her to talk to you today. I'm so excited. So Glennon and Abby and Amanda say hello to Katie. There are guests today. And Catherine you've spoken to so nice to

see your pretty smiling face. Thank you. Okay, So this is a perfect question for all of us, I think except Abby. So I mean, listen, I understand you're being sober for a year, Like I think that's probably you. You know that you knew yourself well enough that that needs to happen. I don't have a lot of judgment about sexual behavior. I think there's probably behavior that's coming along with that sexual behavior that's coupled together that you

might not be aware of. That's kind of sabotaging whatever you're trying to accomplish, which it sounds like you really want a loving relationship, right, so let's talk about that, like what happens around date three or four for you? I truly, this is what I'm struggling with understanding. Is I seem to have a trend of being love bombed and then ghosted, just like future talk. Let's I'd love to help you move furniture, Let's get coffee, and then

it's a full ghost. So I I've played around with the idea of like, maybe I'm attracted to narcissists that are very good at tricking me, But I'm also aware of that the constant in these is me. So this year I've been trying to turn the mirror on myself and figure it out. So I don't know if that answers your question. Well, no, I think well, in part it does because good for you, because that it does sound like a type of person. What's the book Attachment? Yeah,

attached Actually just thought that I haven't read it yet. Yeah, that that's all about avoidance, anxious, you know, attracting the same kind of person, and and you have to just disrupt the pattern, you know what I mean, you have to disrupt that pattern be because that's that is a youth thing. Yeah, the love bombing is a narcissistic thing.

People love bomb, blah blah blah, bomb and then pull away and withhold right, So I mean when you're looking inward, you sound like you're already on the right track to figuring this out for yourself. It's just going to take.

In my experience, you really have to take the weight off of dating somebody and that early on, like you have to take the weight off of yourself to try to make this and predict the future and make it something permanent, because really that is what that beginning nascent period is about, is about falling in love, flirting, and getting to know who a person really is. And sometimes that doesn't come to the four right away, you know,

sometimes that could happen six months down the road. You think you know somebody and then all of a sudden you're like, wait, what's going on here? So I mean, I feel like you're already on your way to doing the work, and I don't want you to tie your identity up with being valued by some guy that you barely know. Like who gives a ship If somebody doesn't call you back after three or four days his law? Now next, what's up next? You know? Yeah, what do

you girls think, Katie? Do you have a religious background or something that? I mean, I grew up Jewish, but that's more cultural than religious, because there just seems to be so much like inner. You seem to be so judgmental of yourself about giving you're about having sex at all. Is that something you feel? No, I think it's that. I mean, Chelsea's right. I've done a lot of work this year, and I'm really proud of who I've become,

and it's still just not working out. You know, I do know, I do know what sobriety been like for you. This the first year is often fresh hell so well. And so here's what I'll say. I don't think I had a drinking problem. I wanted to re establish my relationships, so I've kind of been drinking like a pregnant lady. I have SIPs here and there. I'm mostly sober. I still smoke, I still do mushrooms, but I just and I have re established my relationship, but I just kind

of want to finish up the year. And dating sober has been awesome, like telling guy, I'll get drinks with you, but you know I'm gonna get a mocktail and watching guys be like let's go for a hike or let's go to the park, or really just seeing that has been great. So I may continue to not do drinks as the first date to really spend that sober time with someone. But I guess I'm just reeling back from like partying, drinking, or happy hour three days a week,

all of that stuff that's cultural in our society. It sounds like you're maturing a little bit. And the way that I am hearing it is it's got to be a change in the perspective of not just like who you're attracted to, but what about them? Like what about that attraction? What is that saying about me? What am I needing in this person? Who? Over time, I know that this keeps happening, they keep love bombing and then ghosting me. Maybe like date somebody that is totally opposite

of what you've normally dated before. Maybe go down that route like a woman hadn't. I'll never say never. I've thought about it so much and I just don't think yet. But you know what, who knows? Yeah, seriously, who does know? Nobody? Never? No money. But I also want to say what you said was, it's not happening. You're making all these changes and you're expecting to see the results of those changes. That is a number one that doesn't happen when you

want it to. Happen. The results of your efforts and the work that you put into yourself doesn't show up at the end of that work. It shows up way later, and it phases and in phases and then again later, and you're like, oh, Ship, you're constantly relearning what you've already learned, and then you have to apply it to your life over and over again, and then by repetition,

your life becomes different. That's right. And I also just feel like it's so sad that there's just culturally so pervasive this idea that there's an change of value in sexuality. Like what what I hear you saying, Katie, is what I want. What's a value to me is a meaningful relationship where someone continues to show up with a real connection, and what I presume to be a value to them is sex. Because after they've retrieved that value from me,

they go away. And so there's a real reason that you feel that way, because our world is built around the idea that women's value is in their sexuality, and therefore they lose value, they lose their virginity, they you know. So I just think, if it's possible to really think about that for a second and like, think about what if that wasn't your value? What if you just took the currency of sex out and say, when I want sex and when I want pleasure, I'm going to get that.

That is a separate thing from this relationship structure where I am going what I want over there is someone for a real connection, and those things can parallel track. But it isn't that your currency is beyond your sexuality.

And I think by cultivating and bringing to the forefront, realizing what really believing in your currency being your brain and your spirit and what you're doing with yourself, then that value will come to the forefront and you what will be attracted to you is the people who value that currency. But go ahead and get some over here, if that's what you're looking Very doom man, sister, a man, great sucking advice. Yes, Chelsea, did you get that? Oh? My got it? Got it? Are you kidding me? First?

Of I mean, that is so well said and just so poignant because it's so true. It's like, of course, don't deprive yourself of sex like I'm so I'm so sick of that too, you know, and judging ourselves like no, we can't judge yourself Chase. Yeah, you want to get two months. Yeah, I don't need eight dates. I want to feel your penis and feel if it feels good. That pretend to pretend like I'm not gonna have sex with you, so you can, oh, now we're gonna have sex.

Done with that, Just go get what you are. And I'm thirty years old. We've gone to dinner three times, We've done fun things, we enjoy each other. Let's see if this Because sometimes you have sex and you're like, oh god, no exactly. That's why that's why it's important to get it out of the way right away, to see if there's anything else to talk about. You know, like I always like to have sex immediately because if your penis doesn't work with my Pikachu, then we don't

have anything to say anyway. You know, if you're into some six ship, I want to know about that too. You know, I don't want to find out later that like you're gonna expecting me to put a ball gag in my mouth or some ship, Like I'm not down. I'm not down with that. So it's important, you know, for a lot of reasons, but I think for your

own sexual health, like you know, and psychologically. I think what she said is so right on for you, Like you need to go out there and empower yourself and know that that's not attached to your value at all. And the guy that is going to be the guy for you isn't going to give a ship whether or not you have sex with him on the first date or the third date. Yeah, yeah, that's right. And also,

is anyone worried about Katie was worried about you? Just like full of joy and transparency and presence and your precious as the day is long, and so just worry, just do A sister said, I think she said have sex and then don't worry about it. You said basically that you could be on your date and then you could go meet somebody for sex after your date. You can have a whole choice of activities lined up. Yes, sounds great to me if it helps at all. My husband was a first date and here we are sixteen

years later. H yeah, there we go. Love that. I mean, technically, so we're abby and glenned that first time they were ever together after they met. I feel like that's also a trend. I know like ten people who have said I slept with my husband on the first date, so maybe I should just be sleeping on the first date instead of the third. You just throw out any rules around any of it, you know what I mean? Just throw out rules and paaradigms like and just do what

you feel you should be doing in the moment. You're clear headed right now. You know you have a clarity of mine. Use it, use your instinct. You know when to do something and when not to do something. You know, So just trust yourself a little bit more and you're going to be fine. Katie, Thank you, I appreciate it. Thanks for keep us Hie, Katie Bye. She's so cute. She's like, who the funk are Glenn and Abbey in a man's I can have my money back just talking

to Chelsea. Charge people? Oh my god, that's a great revenue stream. Why do we charge callers? Who needs ads? Yeah? I don't need to read anywhere ads for fucking better help. I'm gonna start charging callers. That's that's that's the phone. That's the way to put my best foot forward. Well, our next call is from A and Brad. Do we have a on the line? She came back, Yep, I'm ready to go. Okay, great. It was having some technical difficulties and Brad over here was texting me and he said, oh,

she dropped off. I said, well, yeah, she's having issues. He goes, isn't that why they're all writing in almost lost it? Good job, Brad. You know what, before we get to this call, let's take a really quick break and we'll be right back with Glennon, Abbey, Amanda, and Chelsea.

Well A says dear Chelsea, I'm fearful about moving back to my home city, somewhere I really want to live, because it means I will almost certainly have to face someone who have been successfully able to avoid for almost twenty years, someone who used to abuse me as a child. I am in therapy for this, and I still have a lot of work to do. My day to day is not significantly impacted by the terrible things they did

to me. That being said, I'm feeling very anxious about the possibility of seeing them when I move home, and it's tainting my excitement about being back in a city I really want to live in again. This person is in my extended family, and I've never told a single other family member, only close friends and my therapist about

what they did to me. I'm anticipating having to navigate more holidays and other family get togethers with this person because we'll be so geographically close after decades of not seeing them. My family is very small, and I'm afraid it would completely sever the family. There are people close to my abuser who I do care for. I feel so torn well. One side of me finally wants to

come out with all of it. The other side of me wants to just try to continue to avoid situations where this person will be, even if it makes me look like a bad family member. I have also considered writing my abuser and email telling them that if we're ever in a situation where we have to be in the same place in the future, to not talk to me or engage with me. Am I just keeping the peace for everyone else's protection and comfort. How would you

come out with news like this? And if I decided to keep this to myself for a bit longer, how would you go about gracefully avoiding family situations where this person will be in attendance, especially during holidays like Christmas, where I can't really blame it on work. If I eventually get stuck having to attend to function where this person will be would you confront them? Sincerely? A oh god, Hi A Hi, Hi, Hi everyone, Hi to meet you all. This is amazing. I know it's a huge support group

for you. Yeah, so many people. Thank you for having me. Well, thank you, thanks for calling in. I'm delighted that you did. Okay, so let's talk what uh we're talking about sexual abuse? Yeah? Yeah, okay, girls, Glada, I know you have a little bit of experience with this discussing. Yeah, do you want to take the lead on this and I'll follow up? Oh, if you're comfortable with that. One of the things I thought of right

away was, first of all, A, I'm so sorry. I think that one of the possible reasons that you're feeling so much fear and anxiety is because, of course, this is taking you right back to being a kid and not having any way to protect yourself, right, and so that is not what's happening right now. Okay, So you're returning as an adult. Okay, so you are going to

be able to protect yourself. You do get to do things that nobody did for you as a kid, and you do get to use your voice, and you do get to make yourself safe, and one of the ways, there's there's several ways that you could do that, right, there's there's no way that you're going to not be safe. We have to figure out you have to figure out how to re enter this situation in a way where you have built what your little self did not have, right,

But I think there are many different ways. One thing to know is that when there is a sexual abuser in a family, there's usually not only one victim mhmm. Every time somebody is certain that they are the only victim in a family, it very rarely is. Okay. So when you say, if I tell the truth, it will sever my family, what you need to know is that your family is already severed. Okay, your family, that's not You're not protecting a whole, healthy family right now. You're

protecting a family where you have been severed. M hm. So if you do decide to bring the one part of life that protects us, which is truth, to this situation, you very well might be saving somebody else in your family who then gets to come forward and say me too, and me too. And this is how this works mm hmm. So, when you think about taking the ideal future scenario for

this extremely less than ideal situation. What does that look like if if you weren't afraid of anything of any consequence of any buddy's feelings, if anybody, what would it look like to step back into this and have your ideal outcome? It would? I think it would be kind of a combination of things. Both a confrontation where I feel like I'm the person with the power and in control. Also telling a few family members, maybe not everyone in the family, but a few who are particularly close to me.

And then I don't know, some sort of maybe a strange that sounds forgiveness in the sense that I just want to let it all go and feels may feel best for me, But not until confrontation and some truth. Because there's a process right forgiveness. It can't happen until we've re established the boundary that was crossed. Right, we cannot feel forgiveness at all. It doesn't come because forgiveness

comes with safety. You will never ever feel forgiveness until you have safety, done what you need to do to make yourself safe. Mm hmm. Are there people? Is there someone in your family that you would start with? Probably my siblings, even my brother, my one brother doesn't know, and then probably my parents. But then it just seems like, get there. I couldn't tell my parents without them having

to tell some other people. It just seems like a never ending sort of trickle down stream situation, which is not your responsibility. Just the fact that you would be starting that drop of water does not make you responsible for the waterfall that happens. The person that's responsible for that is the person that hurt you. All of the

things that are impacting you. I think you said, I just want to let it all go, and I think it's important to just take a moment and identify and moren all that you have had to carry because of this. You're a person who was hurt so much so early, could not tell your parents, could not tell your siblings. You were carrying that burden and that secret as a kid,

and you undoubtedly brought it into other relationships. Undoubtedly that's an integral part of why you're not living in the place that where you want to live right now, because you alone are carrying the burden of someone else's actions. Everybody else is acting the way they always have. They gave it to you to carry, and now you have it, and that is just deeply, deeply unfair, and you changing the status quo is not you causing a problem for

that family. That family has already has a major problem, and you're just the only one who's been carrying it. H And that's just I don't have a solution for it. But it is deeply, deeply tragic that you have carried that and that you still view this as your problem that you have to solve when it was never your problem. It was somebody else's the whole time. And I also think, like, hey, this is your story, and you give him power by withholding it. You're giving that person the power and the

protection by withholding your story. You're not trying to blow your family up. But this is your truth, and you can't be responsible for what happens when you share your truth because the family members that love you and know you are going to be with you and are going to be horrified by what happened. Hopeful you know that would be the normal reaction. And I think that you're suffering by not telling the closest people to you at

the very least. But you definitely don't owe this whole family, and you know, relative in community anything but the truth. This is your truth. You are suffering by yourself. You know. Yes, you've told some friends, and I'm sure you've been to therapy at some point, right right, Okay, good, that's great. But you're only protecting him. You know you're protecting him. I mean, you're gonna have a huge catharsis by even sharing this with your brothers or your sisters or your siblings.

That's gonna be maybe might be even enough. You'll never know until you do it, but you should do that. At the very minimum. Talk to your brothers and sisters. You have close relationships with them. You can trust them. They will be there for you. And if you if you guys all decide together that it's too much for your parents or whatever, fine, but I bet you it's probably not. You know what I mean. It's if this is your story, this is not for you to suffer alone.

That's not fair. Because somebody did something to you that you carry it with you and protect him. That's the dynamic of what's happening, you know, and you have every right to not want to be in the presence of him ever again. Why should you ever have to face that person when he violated you? You shouldn't and your family should know that. That's how I feel. You're not

a burden. You aren't a burden. And I think so much of what we try to protect our family from we feel like it's a protection mechanism for them, but really it's a blockage of connection. And I think that your family would prefer to know you fully truly. They

know something families know. We all think, we all think that it's the truth will destroy our family, but it's always the secrets that destroy families because trauma, these stories, they're passed down generation to generation, even when they're not spoken right. Secrets families affect everybody. We all we know something's up, we know something's up, and then the truth is revealed and suddenly things make sense. It might hurt,

but things make sense and we are more connected. I mean, my friend Liz said to me at one point when I was deciding whether or not to tell the truth to my family that was going to blow everything up. She said, every truth you tell is a kindness, even if it makes other people uncomfortable, and every truth you don't tell is an unkindness, even if it keeps everybody comfortable. Right, because the truth moves everybody forward, even when it upsets

everybody first. But also, ay, you don't owe anybody the truth either. You don't owe anybody a goddamn thing. The only thing that you owe is to yourself and your safety and your health. And if you decide that not sharing this is what is going to keep you safe and healthy, and you know that is the truth. You don't owe anybody a goddamn thing. Like you are supposed

to take care of you. And so if you think your family at the end of the day is not trustworthy of this is going to weaponize this against you, is going to gaslight and confuse things. You don't owe them that either, Like you just have to know that you are doing what you need to do and you're not paying the price by staying away from that town where you want to live in order to keep everybody

they're comfortable. Yeah, those are all great points. I think I need to reflect a little bit more because I do see this, this fork of decisions, and I'm still stuck at the base of which feels right to me, whether it is coming out with everything and potentially losing even some people close to him that I that I do like and care for. They probably wouldn't stay in my life either, or, like you were saying, keeping it

to myself because it feels safer for me. I'm still I'm still stuck at that base of the fork, and I think I just need to keep reflecting on what feels best. Yeah, I know you told me on our pre interview that the move is is set in place,

and I think it's happening in a few weeks. So I would just say, don't put yourself in any positions to make any decisions or have to have those conversations until you're ready, even if you're in town, even if everybody wants to have a big party for you, you know, take the time that you need and let me ask you one more question, a do you what does it look like to you? Like when you think about revealing this to your family members, Like, what does that look

like to you? Does that scare the ship out of you? Does that feel like it does? Yeah? Yeah, I mean not so much my siblings, but my parents absolutely, and then ultimately some of the other family members that would need to know. Yeah, it's it's I don't even know where to start except for with my siblings, and I guess it is maybe one step at a time. Definitely,

one step at a time. That's definitely how you have to test the waters, you know, because I know that if my sister was going through something like this that did it tell me, I would be devastated, you know, I would be so upset. So I know if you have a close relationship with your siblings like that is the place to start. And to remember what Glennan said. You know, you're probably not the only victim in this scenario, and that's something to consider. Also, what do you all

think about confronting him? I mean, I'll go first. Who cares about him? You know what I mean? I care about you. You're gonna say all the things that you wanted to say, like you're talking to a doormat. In my opinion, he doesn't even deserve your time. I care more about how you're gonna walk through this feeling secure and safe at every family gathering that you go to. And a confrontation while you know, we can all fantasize about the thing we're gonna say, and da da da,

You're not going to change somebody. You know, You're not gonna change him or make him see the light. I mean, who knows he's probably he could be scared shitless that you're moving back. You know, he might be like, oh fun funk fun. But like confronting him, if it's therapeutic for you, like how do you feel about that? What do you what do you think when you think of that? What would you say? It does feel therapeutic, but it could also be just as therapeutic to write a very

long letter that I never said. But there is a sense of me that wants to have this sort of almost face to face this is what you've put me through type of interaction. As long as that interaction and the value that you imagine getting out of that interaction is not predicated on any particular response of his, then

go for it. But if you're interaction you imagine him saying or doing something that then leaving that would make you feel more vulnerable or upset than before you win in that I think being really honest with yourself that that everything you have to say has no relation to how he might respond. Mhm right, because the it's likely response is going to be gaslighting and and all of

those denying. I think a therapist, a trained therapist, in this way, we'll probably have really good answers here on what the best script is to talk to your family about and how to talk to your family about this. I think that that would be really helpful to like work workshop that with a therapist. And I don't know what it's like to be you in the circumstance and

you just have to make the call about confronting this. Dude, if you have one person in your family that's your that could be your closest ally in this, is there

one sibling that you could start with? Yes, my brother maybe that's the next straight thing is the one and then it's the two of you, right making the next steps together, because this can't be just you and the waterfall, right like slowly one brother maybe and then figuring out the first sentence you're going to say, mm hmm, that's probably the one person in the one sentence is where I would start. Okay, I think I think that's right.

I think that's right. I think you should at least reach out to one person because I can see the heaviness in you. You know, you're carrying this too much of this on your own, and family is meant to share share the grief, the pain, the love and the joy. All of it is supposed to be spread evenly throughout all of our lives and all the people in your life. Are you in a relationship? No, not anymore? Okay, well yeah, I think that you should really strongly consider talking to

your brother as your first move. And I think you're gonna be really surprised with how therapeutic that's going to be for you. I can see you're in pain, and you have every right to be and there's no reason to suffer through that by yourself. Yeah. Yeah, your family can't come alongside you and lift you up until they know so does that? One step is is all you need to think about right now. We're with you. Thank

you so much. Hey, will you keep us posted and let us know what happens please whenever you do it. You know, no rush obviously, but whatever happens, let us know. Check in with us. Okay, yep, I definitely will. So grateful for all of you. Thank you. I'll be thinking about you. It was great to meet you. Bye bye.

What a sweetheart. Oh my god, you guys. I hate to see people that are suffering the heaviness in the you know, all of it is just like palpable and I know her brother is going to be there for her obviously. You know, I can understand not wanting to tell your parents because some parents aren't going to be able to deal with that at all, you know, and the blame game and all of that things that go

with it. But your siblings, if you have a close relationship with your siblings like that, is they first stop. So yeah, hopefully we will hear back from her at some point about her taking her power back. One of the strangest things was the week that she wrote in I had an almost identical email from someone else as well. It just was so interesting. We haven't gotten a question really like that before. And then in the same within two days, I think to almost ident like, I'm moving

back to my hometown. My abuser is there. And I told a that and she was like, wow, it actually makes me feel so much better to know I'm not the only one going through this, that there's someone else who even wrote in you know, yeah, she also might want to consider getting into I just thought of this, getting into a support group. Yeah, absolutely, support groups. I

mean we're big, we're big support group people. And nowadays, like everything is online, you can get on Zoom, you can turn the video off and you can just listen to a lot of support groups online thinking about secrets and like, it's just so whatever the secret is. You know, if if a only ends up with truthful, honest relationship with that one sibling, that's enough, right, right, We actually don't freaking need our whole families to put we don't

need Most of us don't have that. And it's a rare family that is healthy enough to handle that well anything, well, yes, handle Christmas much less that. And also having that teammate, like you guys said, you know, having that teammate you like, once you tell one person, then it's the two of you. You're not by yourself navigating. You've got another set of eyes and another set of ears looking out for you as well. And that feeling is so much less isolating

than what she must be feeling now thinking about going back. Yeah, sure, Well we'll take a quick break right now and be right back after this little break and we're back. Well, I'm not sure how you want to do this, but we usually have our guests we see if they would like any advice from Chelsea. We all have questions to you.

Go first, is yours gonna be about we'd oh no, but okay, okay, I don't know if I can't believe you aren't going to ask about we Okay, go ahead, okay, because you said a couple of things on our podcast a couple of days ago that I can't stop thinking about. Chelsea.

You described this personal evolution that has improved your relationships and your life, and you said you used to have this perspective that if someone disagreed with you, they didn't know what they were talking about until they agreed with you, and then you would explain to them some more truths, which I understand on a cellular level because that is a little bit how I am. But then you moved

away from that to be more bentable. But then later on in the pod, you said you have a very strong relationship with telling the truth even if it hurts, and that's something you're not willing to modify because it's

part of who you are. And my question is, how do we determine whether our truth that we're feeling as part of the first bucket this kind of unevolved in transigence that the way you described it, or the second bucket, which is like this is an important part of my character and I need to hold onto it for my own integrity. How can you tell the difference, Well, I think when you're when you're when you have a need to be right all the time, it's because you're not listening.

When you're telling the truth, it's because you've listened. You know what I mean, and you've heard. So I think the two things, while they can be confusing and sound analogous, they're different because you can bend, because that's everyone should be able to bend a little. You don't want to bend over and break your back for somebody, but you want to be able to bend and manipulate so that you're not just stuck right like you want to move for people and be like, yeah, I could do that.

I could go to a shopping mall in the middle of the day, Joe Koy, of course. I mean, I'm from New Jersey, so it's a bit too soon, but sure, I'll go to a fucking shopping mall because it brings you joy. You know. I can bend a little and do you know what I'm saying. But I'm not going to change the core character of who I am. I can change my actions, and yes, telling people the truth in a loving way, not yelling at them and going

why don't you listen to me? I mean saying it in a fair handed way, like this is the truth of the situation, always being available for that. So I think the two are kind of different in that way. If if I explained that, well, I love Mr. Chelsea's gonna go to the mall. She's gonna go to the mall, she's gonna bend, She's gonna go to the mall. But as she's walking through the mall, she's gonna be saying,

I fucking hate this. The truth is malls or trash. Yeah, I've listened to the I'm gonna say, yeah, I'll go through the mall and I'll be like, like, here's a great example. Joe's birthday party. I threw him a birthday party in Vegas when we were together. It was a three day bonanza. I do not like to go to Vegas. We went. I had activities like it's you to day. We had dune buggying for everybody. It's like a hundred people or whatever it ended up being. We and we

went dune bugging. And I don't have enough sports bras for that activity. And I. We were Joe and I were due bugging and he's like, God, you're amazing that you're out here doing this. And he's like, are you having a good time? I go, absolutely not, you know, but I'll go I'm not gonna bitch and moan, but I'm gonna be honest about it. I'm not gonna pretend I'm having a good time when I'm miserable wondering like what was going to happen to my body after I

get out of that dune buggy? You know, like where did my boob go? Because it's no longer attached to the front of me. Also a really stupid activity. Just want to put and skip that anyone. Not that anyone listening to this is going dune bugging, but uh, you know what I mean, Like, I just think, you know, you have to be open to compromise, but you guy can't compromise your character. I love it. It's good I have advice that I want to know. I love it.

So Chelsea, I've I'm kind of an advocate for equal pay. Women's soccer team didn't make equal pay when I was a player. I didn't make men's pro money. And now that I've stepped away from playing professional sport, I'm making more money than I ever did and nobody. What I like about you is you are fearless and having a conversation about anything. And so now that I'm out of soccer and earning money, I don't know everything, what to

do with it, who to talk to. It seems like all the white dudes are behind like this locked door, and they like hold the keys to all the financial questions and information, and they try to make it sound so confusing, and so my question might though it might seem shallow, is you know, I do believe that money and power are very closely related. And so what do you do about your finances and your money? And who do you trust? Like? And where do you what do

you How have you learned about it? Because I know that you've had it for a while and you are really independent, strong, successful businesswoman. Well thank you. I mean I first of all, I only have female business managers. I only work with women. Women are only allowed to handle my money, no men, just because I like to work with women period. You know, but I don't know,

like I don't know a lot about money either. You know, I'm looped into lots of different groups that t teach you about cryptocurrency or you know, but I'm I don't have that kind of money that I'm throwing around investing hundreds of thousands of dollars into different ventures and stuff

like that. The one thing I do know, and the advice that I got a long time ago, is to always invest in real estate because that is never going to ever go away, you know, like the value of that, like the value of the dollar can go away, you know, but I'm not going to sleep with a bunch of gold bars under my bed. I mean, the reality of that is unlikely. Also, So I just buy up properties, you know, when I have a cash flow or an influx, I buy up a property that I can rent out.

You know. I have a few houses and a few rental properties, and that's a great source of income and it's a great investment and it's simple. And I invest in companies to like I just invested in the you know you as women's volleyball team. They're starting their thing,

you know. I invest in makeup companies or whatever. When I get a good tip from somebody in my circle that says, oh, we're putting money in I'll you know, send it to my people and invest because I think you always have to be investing, right, you don't ever know what's gonna what's gonna hit. And you know you have a financial advisor that you do you not have one of those yet? Financial yeah we do, but like white men right right, make it seem so fucking complicated.

It's like, these are not the spreadsheets you're looking for. I know, and I quite honestly, when I talk about finances, like they'll try and update me on a phone call, and like halfway through, I'm like, let's speed speed this up because I am not interested in the ins and outs. Just I have enough money to survive, and I do you have money to buy this house or not? You know,

like investing things? I think you know, if you give him a directive like listen, these are the kinds of companies that I'm interested in supporting, female owned, minority owned. You know, like, let's focus and give him something to zero in on so he's not just coming back with you and you're you know, looking at Warren Buffett's portfolio going oh, well, I guess these are all the things that are going to make me money, because you guys are this is an opportunity for you to walk. You walk,

you know what I mean. You guys do all these amazing things, and now you have an opportunity to do it with financially and put your money where your mouth is on top of it like that's all the power in the world. Right, Yeah, it's good. That's good. Okay, what's your question? Is there an edible? I feel like you've already asked me this question. I know I want an edible that will calm me down, but it's not doesn't count as drugs, So I cannot not a psychoactive

that doesn't count as drugs. What about CBD? Okay, can't you have that? That's doesn't count as th HC th HC. And first of all, a lot of sober people take marijuana, but I know that you don't want to do that. But cb D without the th HC, the th HC is the psychoactive component, right, So that's what you don't want to be around. And with your personality, you don't

want to be around that. You want to be calm, something that's going to help you not make you run in the corner and hide anymore, you know, So you need a c b D gummy And actually, you know what, I think I might have something for you because this is my good friend doesn't like that at all, but she had. She just wanted to calm down, because it's a body calm and you know, like it doesn't matter

if you're calming down your brain or your body. The other one will follow, right, Like everyone thinks that you have to treat this thing, and it's like, well, you can treat either one because we're it's so interconnected. You have a brain in your stomach, you have a brain in your heart, and you have a brain in your head. You know, there are three brains working in our bodies. So and everyone just thinks this is the only one that matters. It's not, you know, it's our gut, it's

all of our things. So but I will put it together. They're an array of things that do not have th HC. A gift basket for you now that your local. A year later, I will put together a gift a basket of things that have no th HC. What about Hemp? Great? Love him? Okay, great, I just I just invested in another company, this Hemp drink company. That's perfect. I'm gonna send you some of that. I'm going to send you a couple of other things. I'll put together a nice

care package as soon as I get home today. I have a refrigerator filled with cannabis in my gym from top to bottom for every kind of user. So I will go in there and personally figure it out. Yeah, just make sure it's not it's not psychoact. No, I know what we're dealing with. Abby. Okay, well, because you also have three teenagers in this house who are like this. Yeah right, well, we'll put this in a special case in the bedroom and the big girl's bedroom. This was

so delightful you guys. I love all three of you. What a great couple of what a great week we've had. Seriously, I just feel so honored you have been part of this week to week. It was big week. Yeah, it was a very cathartic week for me, and it was transformative. I feel so much lighter after our time together, uh the other day and today again. Same. We love you, We love you. We will be in your corner forever. Me too. Likewise, also, we're going to be in your

house soon. I am I inviting us over. Sorry, Okay, well, my house has been built right now, So you'd have to invite me to your house because my house is I'm in a rental and I'm not trying to show that off. Then come to our house. I will. I'll come over for sure. And so nice to meet you, Katherine, Thank you for having us, Thank you bye. If you'd like to ask Chelsea a question, email us at Dear Chelsea Project at gmail dot com