Hi, guys and all, welcome back to another episode of Life on Cut. Now. It might be a bit confusing to some of you because it's a Wednesday and not a Tuesday, but we have a very very very special bonus episode for you all today and we are so excited to bring you this. But before we get into it, I'm Laura and I'm Brittany, and god, we do love a bonus episode, don't we, Laura, We've been thrown about left,
right and center lately. But the reason why we're bringing you this bonus episode is because a few weeks ago now you might remember, before we went on to Break, britt and I did an Ask Uncut episode and we spoke about a woman who was asking about labiaplasty. After that episode, we had hundreds of you message arson slide on into our DMS to tell us that we needed to interview Ellie from Comfortable in My Skin Now. Ellie is a photographer. She is a wonderful, warm woman who
spends her days photographing volvers. The reason why she photographs a whole variety of different women's volvers is because she is working to destigmatize conversations around body acceptance. Conversations around LaBier acceptance, and also conversations around menstruation and just all things that we as women experience but maybe feel too self conscious to talk about. Before we do jump into that, we do want to just thank our sponsor, which is
Bond's Bloody Comfy period Undiase. I think it's just the absolute perfect time because periods can be uncomfortable. We do want to make sure we are at the most comfortable that we could possibly be, and Bonds Bloody Comfy Undies do that. They're environmentally friendly, they're easy to watch and reuse,
and they hold up to four tampons worth. As women, a lot of us use non reusable sanitary items, whether it be tampons or pads, and the statistics around the number of those in landfill every year are just absolutely mind blowing. So three hundred million tampons are sold in Australia every single year and five hundred million pads are sold every single year and every single one of those ends up in landfill, which is just crazy. Now, Brett, before we get into speaking to Ellie, I have a
question for you. What is your opinion? And we have Okay, we speak about so much in this podcast. We have shared so much and I actually can't believe that we haven't covered this yet. So I'm going to throw you straight in. They want to know your personal views on this. What is your opinion on sex during your period? We actually haven't talked about this, now that you say it, my ideas around sex with my period, I think it is absolutely fine. I actually and I mean it depends
what your period is like for yourself. Some people's periods are so painful and so heavy that the last thing they want to do is have a penis come anywhere near them. For me, I love it. You're like, bring that penis that made my period. I'm very lucky. I don't get it heavy enough to be in a lot of pain, and I get like one day where I'm uncomfortable and that's it. I've been very lucky with my periods in that sense. So I love sex on my period.
I probably get HORNI or on sex my period, and I've heard a lot of women say that, and I think it's just up to your partner. I think you just have to throw it out there and say, hey, like I'm horny, you want to do this? And I can guarantee ninety nine point nine percent of men are probably gonna be like hells, yeah, yeah. I mean I've definitely dated some guys who are not into it, who aren't interested in having sex during like when I'm on
my period, when I have my period. But at the same time, it almost makes me mad at them, Like and I know that that's not fair. I know that everybody has a choice and it's completely up to them, But at the same time, I'm like, this is something that is so incredibly normal. It happens to me every fucking month. Why not. I mean, there's a ways around it, of course, Like there's some tips and techniques that you could probably implement if you don't want to ruin your sheets.
If you do the math, I'm just gonna quickly do it here right now. If you're doing one week a month, so that is three months worth of you not having sex or not being able to have sex a year, and that is too much. That is too long for me. I'm all for it. I don't think it's a problem, but obviously your partner has to be on board. You are absolutely robbing yourself if you don't have sex during your period. And I know that a lot of girls will maybe have sex at the very beginning or at
the end where their flow is lighter. But for me, I don't think that that really makes a difference because usually if I'm having sex at the end of my period, when my flow is lighter, it just brings that bad boy back on. I mean, you can also just have sex in a shower if you like, which I think is great anyway. But the fact of the matter is this, I know this is what it is for me, and I know this is for a lot of people because
we've done the research. It can actually relieve symptoms. It can make you feel better, It can help with cramps, it can help with headaches, and there are a lot of articles on that. And I personally know that when I have had cramps for whatever reason, sex has made me feel better. And don't I don't know why. I don't know what kind of witchcraft and wizardary that is, but that's what's been happening to me. Don't let anyone here think that we don't do our thorough research before
doing these episodes. But there are actually some differ Oh, I had a lot of sex to do this research. I put the research in. No worry, Okay, so there are actually a few health benefits or benefits of having sex during your period, which if your partner or whoever you're dating or seeing or whatever doesn't want to have sex during your period, you can now whip these out and be like I think we should. It's actually better for me. Just linked in this episode, having sex in
your period, it can actually make your period shorter. So having sex may make your period shorter because the muscles contract during an orgasm and actually pushes out the uterine contents faster. Which is kind of the same and this is going to be a bit too much information for some people, but when you breastfeed after having a baby, it actually makes your uterus contract and that's what makes
your uterus gow back down to size faster. So every time you breastfeed often you'll have these they're quite painful. You'll have these painful contractions that happen at the very first couple of weeks after having a baby, and that's actually your uterus going back down to the original size. It helps to release hormones which contracts your uterus. Now a similar things happened during orgasm as well, which is why some people can have a little bit of pain
after having an orgasm in their uterus. So it also increases your sex drive. Your libido can change during menstruation, which is because of hormone of fluctuations. It's a natural lubricant, so like, don't be scared, ladies. And also it can help to relieve headaches because of releasing endorphins. So if you've been sitting on the fence, you've been scared, or you've been embarrassed, gon't give it a crack. Do you ever find it embarrassing, brit Like, is that something that
ever worries you? Or is it just doesn't even come onto your radar, not at all. It doesn't. It literally doesn't even cross my mind because it's such a natural thing.
And I wonder if this is something maybe that has come with age, because we didn't speak about it a lot when we were younger, these sort of conversations they weren't being had, so nobody really went and spoke to each other about their periods, and we didn't have other women that we look up to that we're talking about the fact that they go and have sex on the period, or that this has happened, or that they've walked through
the park and they've had blood on their pants. You know, these sorts of conversations weren't being had, and periods were essentially tied to embarrassing moments. I just don't feel like that's the case anymore. So for me, I'm super open about it. I would just be like, I'm on my period. You want to have sex? Jordan will be like, yeah, right,
I don't get yeah. And Matt, Actually though, I think when Matt and I first started dating, I don't think that it was something that he not that he cared and not that he was like, you know, no, we're not going to do it, but it was definitely not I think he would have a little bit more of an adversion to it. I think he would be like, oh, I prefer not I could wait. But I really hate
that mentality. And it's not like a pressurey meant having sex with me or anything, but like, we have had conversations about it, and he has become way more open to it and way more understanding. I think that for some guys, it is a conversation that hasn't been had because maybe they're ex girlfriends or other people that they've had sex with in the past have been too scared to have that conversation, too embarrassed, and so therefore they have this idea that like, oh, I'm not supposed to,
I shouldn't. Then there's a little bit of fear factor there. But you're so right, like having a period is not something that you should be embarrassed about having to, you know, have a conversation about having your periods is not something that you should be embarrassed about. So I do think that like maybe it's an age thing as well, and as you become more comfortable in your own body, that having those conversations with your partner may become easier as well.
If anything, Jordan's probably distoked because he knows I can't get pregnant at that time. Hey, so no, that is a complete misconception. You clearly didn't do her research. I know, I didn't know that it's not your one omulation day, So I'm confused. Actually, do you know what you can? But look, I mean it's meant to be incredibly unlikely that you can get pregnant during a period, But I think, like with all things, or on the side of caution, you also can get pregnant from the pull out method.
Let me tell you that ladies, gentlemen, and everybody, Okay, while it's also extremely unlikely, I did do my research on this. The simple answer is, yes, you can still get pregnant when you have your period. Women are not able to conceive whilst they have the period, but sperm
can survive with this is I'm reading this, guys. Sperm can survive within the female reproductive system for up to five days, which means that there is a tiny, minuscule fraction of a chance that women who do have a small chance of becoming pregnant from unprotected sex during this time. So I would just say, maybe it's not worth risking it for the biscuit in this instance, Like if your pint has got some sperm, it's like a real hanger on her own is sitting in there for like ten days,
God help him. That's Maths, You're a risk, Matts. This is just like gone for goal, hangs around. Mats just hangs around for a month. I have been I have been pregnant more in our relationship than I have not been pregnant. That's literally where I'm at right now. That's insane anyway, guys. So we absolutely loved this chat with Ellie and thank you to every single person who recommended her, and I mean, I honestly cannot tell you it was hundreds and hundreds of you. This is a conversation all
around just having more acceptance of your own vulva. And when we say vulva, we do actually get Ellie to unpack what that means, because I know that there is probably going to be some people who probably may have not even heard of that term before. A lot of people would refer to it as a vagina. We're calling it a vulver because that is what is anatomically correct
in this conversation. The reason why we wanted to have this conversation is because there's still so much stigma around what your vulgar should look like or could look like. And I think that there's a comparison that happens even though we probably don't have a very good idea about what our friend's vulva looks like or what is normal on that spectrum. So I think in order for us to be more accepting and to be able to love ourselves a little bit more, this conversation is really going
to help a lot of people. If you've ever thought about having Laby aplasty. If you've ever ever had a moment where you've thought like, ah, fuck, you know I don't like my vagina the way it is, or I don't like my vulva the way it is, then this is one hundred percent a conversation for you, and I really hope that you walk away from it feeling incredibly empowered. Today we have the woman from behind the camera and the vulver and the creator flipped through my flaps and
comfortable in my skin. Ellie, Welcome to Life Uncut.
Thanks girls, I'm so happy to be here and be a part of your podcast.
It's an absolute on us.
We're so so excited to have you. And I know I mentioned this earlier, but when we did an ask Guncut section, this is going back quite a few weeks now, and it was from somebody who had written in in regards to Lavia plasty. And I cannot tell you how many of our listeners sent me your Instagram, sent me your details and said you have to get Ellie onto the podcast. So it is truly just like such a joy that you have joined us to do this today,
and we have so many questions for you. But before we get into that, We do a section on every single podcast episode with every single guest, and it's called Accidentally Unfiltered, and that is where you tell us your most embarrassing story, and it's very relatable, it's very humanizing, and we all laugh at you together with you're at you, no with and at it's both with and at Well.
I have a story, but I was thinking, it's not totally embarrassing for me, but this just happened last night, and so I was thinking.
It's pretty beautiful what actually happened.
And I was like, I don't know, I just want to tell this story because it's just happened. About two weeks ago, ended up hooking up with an Israelian guy and they're so hot.
They're so hot.
We decided to meet up again, and so we went out to a bar in Byron Bay, and while I was there with him and a few other friends, I actually met a girl there playing pool and her and I hit it off straight away. Then my roommate invited both of them back with a few other people. So I was just in all sorts because I was like.
Oh my goodness, how am I going to do with this?
What am I going to do?
Because I connected a lot more with her. But anyway, I was kind of on a date with this Israelian guy, and so we get back to our house and she's telling me that she had never been with a girl before and that she was really nervous.
And anyway, so we ended up going to this.
Room and mak him out and kissing, and then I said to her, you know what, this is probably not the best time for you to have your first experience with a girl, because I absolutely wasted and I've Israelian guy waiting there for me, so it's a bit sneaky, weird. And then anyway, she was super, super embarrassed about the whole situation, and I think she maybe felt like I'd sent her home, but I was like, no, I just don't want your first experience with a girl to be
like this, That's all it is. And then last night I'm sitting there at dinner at this restaurant and I see her walk in with a friend and she sits at the table behind me. And as this happened, I was showing my friend her Instagram on my page, like oh, when she walked in, I was going like, she's so beautiful, and we were looking at her eyes, zooming in on her eyes and anyway, suddenly I'm like, oh my gosh, she's right behind you. She's right behind you.
She's just walked in.
And my friend Lulie's going, well, say hi, say hi, don't be so awkward, and I was like, okay, just give me a minute. I need to calm down because I was feeling weird that I was showing her page. And then she sits down, and as soon as her friend sits down, she goes.
So friend says to her, so show me this girl that you hook up on. Yes.
At this exact same time, Lily still has my phone with her profile up. She pulls up, well, actually she was taking screen grabs, so she'd screen grabbed from my Instagram. She was just in her photos, not on my Insta, and she's going through all these photos talking about me. And it was such a weird situation because this is
something you do with your girlfriends all the time. But I was watching it happen to me in front of me, and I could hear everything she was saying and she was zooming in on everything, and I was.
Like, it was such a weird, weird experience.
She was like zooming in on my breast because I have really lost tits, and she's going, you.
Know, they're just so big.
I wouldn't know what to do with them and all this stuff because she's never been with a girl.
Is that what she said, Ellie? Did she say? I don't know what to do with that?
She zoomed in on my breast. I was in a bikini in the date.
She forest this photo that she'd taken and she's zoomed in on my breast and she goes, they're just so big.
I wouldn't know what to do with them.
This is outrageous. So hang on, I need to know what happened with this girl. You're crushing on her. She's a table away crushing on you. Neither of you know what's happening. Did you speak to the girl? Are you getting married and doing it happily ever after? Because I feel like the universe has just thrown you two together.
That's exactly what That's.
How I felt. I'm so such a big believer of letting the universe. Guy, do you like I have total faith that the universe knows.
What's up for me?
I absolutely do too.
I was saying, my friend, Okay, I've kind of let this go on for too long that now when I say something, she's going.
To be like, why didn't you say high earlier? Because I was listening and I was loving it.
I was like, this is the dream, Like you get to hear everything that someone has to say about you.
But imagine if it wasn't good. Imagine if it was just like you were listening to someone say something awful. How awkward would that be?
I know?
Or even like when you use show your friends like a photo of guy and you're like, oh, oh, he's much better looking than that, that's not his best photo, and then you're like ten like you're like ten years deep in their profile trying to find the best photo of them. He's really hot in person. I swear so hot in person, and you.
Know where they all are, you know where the best photos are on their whole grid.
So what happened, Well, I was quite like you said.
Then I ended up saying her name and she died. She was mortified, She was horrified. She was so embarrassed. She was like fanning her face nonstuff, and I just said it's fun.
I joined her. I said, why don't we all just.
Join tables like we may as well, this is just two walker, we're sitting too close to each other, just not join. And then we ended up going out to a bar and yeah, we ended up going home together at the end of the night.
That's what we want to hear. Success story. Yes, girl, that's what.
You want to hear.
I won't go into too much detail, but yeah, it was just a very strange experience. And if we ended up getting married together, I'm just like so excited that that's our love story.
Ellie, tell us a little bit about who you are and how comfortable in my skin started.
Okay, so I'm an Australian girl.
I guess my story starts in high school in a maths classroom when a boy in my class tapped me on the shoulders and he said to me, he gave me a note and I opened it and it said do you have an Innie or an AUTI?
And hang on? How old were you?
I was about fourteen and he.
Asked you if you had an inny or an OUDI. Okay, first of all, I would have been like, are you talking about my belly button or what? Because that's what my mind at fourteen would have been, like an Innie, drop me to show you.
Definitely, That's exactly where my mind went until I was like talking with all the boys and they were laughing and they were like, no, they called them vaginas back then. They were like, vaginas can be innies or audi's. And that's when I learned that, yes, some inner labia can protrude below the outer labia, or you know, I'd learned that there was a different all different kinds, according to some people, somewhat more beautiful than others, which is just
absolute bullshit. But anyway, I surfed a lot in high school, and I was always really self conscious of my laby are showing in my bikini.
It was like bulge.
And I had guys say things over the years, like one guy said, oh, it always looks like you have sand stuck in your bikini, and just all these.
Really rude comments.
And I can laugh now because I have done a lot, a lot, a lot of work, but as a high school you know, fifteen sixteen, seventeen year old girl, you take things to your heart, and I just built up this insane insecurity of my volva. Every time I slept with someone, I would cry the next day. And it happened all the time, I just couldn't talk to anybody else about it, because there's this weird insecurity with talking about these parts of your bodies that it's like, it's really taboo.
So why were you if you don't mind me asking when you say you cried the next day? Is that because you were in yourself thinking about what he would be thinking, or would he be talking about you, or did he say anything to make you feel uncomfortable, or like, where did this sadness come from? The day later?
It was a few things.
So I did have some guys say something to me after I slept with them, and then that created from then on paranoia that the guys would say something to their friends. Also, when I was hanging out with all the guys I did spend a lot of time with, they would often talk about other girls that they had slept with in great detail.
That's where the sadness came from.
I was like, I don't want to be one of those girls that they talk about. And it just got worse and worse and worse as I got older. And then when I went traveling really young, and I came back from traveling and I had been sitting in a park with my sister and I'd slept with someone and I was crying again to my sister and I was like,
what if they tell what I look like? And I was so upset, and my sister said to me like, Ellie, come on, you are in your twenties now, like you surely are over this, and I was like I'm not.
I just it still took over my whole life.
And so that's when my sister introduced me to laby plasty and was like, maybe this could be really good for you. It might help you because she'd seen how many years I'd lack traumatized myself for and so she was like, I think this could be good for you to look into. So that's when I started this journey of like looking into labia plasty.
And how long did you look into that before? Like, so we know and you can tell the story. We know that you went for your consult and you were you know Dad said, on going through with this procedure, how long and how in depth did you do your research before you went to this doctor?
The first time, I went quite quickly to a doctor in Sydney, And the thing that scares me so much is, yeah, how quickly they just booked me in. They didn't even look at my body. They were just like, it costs this much, you can come in straight away. They were even because I was so young, helping me try and
get it on medicare. They were like, oh, if you say you have reoccurring thrush or like, they were giving me options of ways I could maybe try and get it cheaper, but there wasn't really anything for me to claim it under medicare. I think if you're in a labia protrudes down eight centimeters, I think you can claim it back.
But there was nothing for me. And so then I.
Had another appointment, and that was maybe a year later. And then when I had the money, I was living in India, and that's when I went to the doctor, like with the money, to the cosmetic surgeon, and I was just like, give me the baby of blasting, but I didn't.
I was calling it the wrong name. This is the thing.
It's like I was so self conscious and awkward and I couldn't talk properly.
And I said to this doctor like I.
Want liposuction, and I was just pointing down at my legs. So I got myself in a really uncomfortable situation where I had this doctor drawing the highlight on my legs and I was standing there just being like, what is going on?
So he was ready to do lifeosuction on your legs?
Yeah, I was like, and then and then he asked me to show him my vulva, and I was really lucky that he talked me out of getting labiaplasty.
And he was like, this is just your vulva.
So what did he say? What was his reaction to you asking for that surgery?
First he said you poor girl, because he could tell how uncomfortable I was. And then he ended up saying like madam, like this is someone who sees you down here, should love you. And he's like, may I recommend that you get a surgery on your chin? Like he told me to get a chin extension because he said it was the same price and that a lot more people are going to see my face and my chin then my pussy.
And I was like, oh, don't know about that.
Now.
I'm jas like, my chin's fine.
You're like, thank you for another insecure that I can take it into my other life. That's great.
Yeah, Well, me and my girlfriends we always like tuck our chins in and do double chins and send selfies all the time.
So I was like blown away.
I was like, what that's like my best quality is my lack of a jawline.
So then anyway, I ended up.
He went and got a side mirror and held it next to my face and I put my jawline forward, and I was like, having this moment with this surgeon how I could extend my jawline. And I was like, this is fucking crazy, Like this is insane.
Why would I do this?
And then I started thinking like, well, if I wouldn't change my face and people love me for my face, and I can love myself for how.
I am, then why would I change that part of me?
And he said, the doctor said to me, you know, I think you should go and see what others look like before you change yours, because it's just your labor. And so I've taken it a whole lot further than what he probably ever imagined. But I've photographed a lot of people.
Crazy that, Like, it blows my mind in the fact that when I was reading about your story, I was like, Wow, this is so incredible that you a young, impressionable girl that obviously had low self esteem has gone to a surgeon. You're like, take my money, cut my vagina open, do what you need to do, and he's talked you out of it, and I thought, wow, that's really incredible that he has done that when he could have just booked
you in. But then he threw a spanner in the works and you're like, but then he tried to change your chin and I was like, well, he's like contradicted himself.
Well, he's still wanted the money. I mean, he lives on he's a cosmetic surgeon. He has to do something. But I think I was really lucky that it was happened in India and the culture over there is maybe I don't know that this is a lot more of a sacred part of your body and he I don't know, maybe he just thought that it was better I changed my face. I just can't work it out. But I still would have spent the money.
So also I think as well, Like I mean, and this is one of the things that we touched on, Like there's such a huge spectrum of what is normal, and we have been kind of conditioned to think that having an inevolver is more cosmetically pleasing, but that really equates for what like twenty five percent of the population. You know, the majority of people don't have that and so and I read as well that labia plasti is one of the fastest increasing cosmetic surgeries in the country.
You know, more women are coming forward and asking for it in the world. Crazy, isn't it? And it's like, how is it that something that the spectrum of what constitutes normally is so varied? But as women when not one, we don't even really talk to our friends about it. We don't really say, like, what does yours look like? What does mine look like? You know, how do you know what and where you sit in that and whether it's like you're wanting to get something changed for a
functional reason or whether it's just completely cosmetic purposes. And we're going to go into a little bit further down the track, but I know that there are so many complications that can arise that people don't even necessarily know when it comes to labia plasti as well. But before we get into that, can you explain to anyone who doesn't necessarily know the terminology or the difference, what is the difference between a vagina and a volver.
So it's the vagina is the canal inside of view, and then the volver is everything on the outside of the body, So like the cletorus, the labia, the vaginal opening.
So it's just the names of the body terms.
Everyone uses the word vagina to describe the volver, which just shows the lack of education on this part of our body in high schools and in just in general.
How did you start photographing? Because I feel like this went from zero to one hundred real.
Quick, real quick, super quick.
I went onto Facebook and I put up a post saying I want to photograph.
I was doing what.
The doctor said and I should see others. So I said, I want to photograph ten and make a coffee table book.
And I guess I've always been.
A very approachable person, maybe like I'm super open, naturally just kind, and people often do come to me with pro and so I just got this influx of messages being like, I'll do it, I'll do it, I'll do it, And then I started doing it and I the first person I ever photographed was a midwife that I went to primary school with.
I was so nervous.
I was photographing her standing up and she was like, surely you want me laying down with my legs open, And I was like just being instructed by everything that she said. Then she taught me all these things that I didn't know about my own volver because she was a midwife and she was like.
My own anatomy.
She was teaching me different names, like exactly what we just talked about. And I just learnt so much from her, and I was like, Oh, I want to teach the next person. I photographed this stuff, and so then it just was the next person that came, she had a story. The next person that came, she had a story. I started learning about vaginismus, I started learning about bacteria vaginisis
all natural remedies for thrush. It was like every single person I spoke to, I was just learning, learning, learning, and.
I just wanted to share it.
And that's when I started creating the Instagram page because I was like, people need to hear these stories, and people need to realize that they're not alone.
You know, we're all going through the same thing.
And two of my best friends had had labiaplasty that I went to high school with, and they came forward and I had no idea. I was like suddenly realized that there's this huge shame that comes with labya plasty. Like you might go to your friendship circle after getting your breast done and be like, look how great they look.
But if you get lavier PLASTI, it's this big secret that you don't tell anybody.
And it's true because I never told anyone except for my sister, and I'm very comfortable socially talking about anything. So then all I wanted was to create a place where people could come forward and talk about anything and nothing was off limits and they could share the I mean, I created the herpes support groups and I've got twenty six of them now, and it's incredible because it's so common, and that's like all these things that we suffer as
volver owners and we just don't talk about. So it's really just like a place, and that's what a photoshoot is as well. It's a place where someone can come forward and feel safe to tell me anything, which is really good for your mental health, getting it off your chest and not bottling it up.
Why do you think there is so much shame surrounding this? Why do you think as women we feel so much shame around our volvers and around you know, any sort of conversations around what is happening, whether it be through about menstruation, whether it be something like bacterial vaginosis, whether it be around you know, STIs. We've done a whole episode talking about herpes, and like, there is just so much shame around anything that's kind of to do with
sexual health and wellness for women. Why do you think that that is so attached to it.
I guess it's because society doesn't let us talk about it. And then the only times we do see or hear about, for example, STIs is in the media and in Hollywood when they're making fun of it, or if it's school we were looking at something, say example, genital herp is, they showed you this horrible diagram and it was like, this is for life.
You know.
The school's actually taught us.
That it was dirty and we got that stigma and then so we carried that on through. You know, maybe people laugh about it in front of their friends, and so then if you do you are suffering from anything of the sort, you just keep it quiet. And that's
the worst thing you can possibly do. And I truly believe that talking about anything with your friends kills the stigma, and that's why I'm always encouraging people even on my platform on Instagram, I'm like comment publicly about whatever you want to say, because it's adding to.
Killing the stigma.
Well, it's highly likely too that the second that you finally open up to your friendship circle about a problem that you're having, or something you're self conscious about, or something that's on your mind, chances are at least one other person in that group is experience. It's seen the exact same thing, but nobody knows because everybody's keeping quiet.
But in relation to your friends, Ellie, that you said you had two friends came forward that had labiaplasty, did you chat to them and did you find out why they had it? Like what was there insecurity? And were they happy with the procedure at the end, did they regret it? Did they have any complications? Was there anything that you can tell us about that?
Yeah, they're pretty crazy stories. One of them is actually up on my blog on www dot come to themiskin dot com dot au and you can see the photos of before, during, and after of her labiaplasty and her story is written up there. She was the same as me, it was going to the beach in her bikini and seeing the.
Bulge that made her go to Labiaplasti.
She dated and one of my friends and they had sex for four years and she never took her underwear off.
She'd just pull it to the side.
And wow, Yeah, that's how self conscious she was. And the second she turned eighteen, her mum wouldn't let her have laby plus, even though she asked a lot of times. So the second she turned eighteen she went and got it done, and my other friend her mother let her get it done when she was about sixteen. Your mom has to take you if you're under eighteen. So her mom took her and they pulled down the inner Lady Labia cut off, but then they didn't sort of trim upwards.
This is the thing, is like to all these doctors are just doing it and they're not asking the volve owners exactly what they want and how they want done. And the Volvo is sixteen, so she has no idea what she wanted.
She probably has never seen any other vagina.
Either, never and never, And her mum actually said to her when she said I want this, blah blah blah, her mom said, I felt self conscious my whole life about the way mine looks, so I'm happy to take you so you don't spend your life worrying like I did.
So her mum was coming from a good place, but she wasn't happy with what the doctors did, so she went back a second time when she was eighteen and asked them to continue cutting because it was sort of she felt it was like still flapping, and she wasn't happy with it.
So the one that got it done.
When she was eighteen says that she can't orgasm, and she doesn't know if it has to do with having a surgery. I personally feel like you can get labiaplasty and you can still orgasm because I've interviewed people that have, so although it is cutting off a lot of nerve endings the surgery, you can still find pleasure from save vaginal light penetration, and you know, there's all different ways that you can have pleasure. But I think it's her
mental health. She still hasn't built a great connection with her volva, and she still hasn't recovered mentally from the surgery, so she's you know, you can't orgasm when you are feeling self conscious and flight or flight or danger. So she needs to work that out through her mental health.
And I mean, we all know there are a certain number of people and I'm off the top of my head, I can't say statistic, so I'm not going to, but there are a certain number of women that will never, unfortunately, have an orgasm, and that is regardless of laby plasty, regardless of anything. There are some women that it's a smaller number, but they just will never get there. So
I guess we'll never know in her sense. But of course it comes with complications, and of course it comes with risks like any surgery, but we are encouraging of anyone to do what they want with their body with
for the right reason, under the right research. And I think the platform that you've provided is incredible because you've just you've given a safe space for women to know, like if you had found your own platform when you were young, before you went to a surgeon, it would have changed your lives.
I pretty much created what I felt I needed when I was at my worst stage, and that was always the plan. I was like, I don't want younger people to go through what I went through, and if I had have seen how different.
They all were.
I would never have been so self conscious. And I'm not at a war against labiaplasty. I'm just there to help people having more educated decision before they go through and cut off part of their body. I just want them to go in knowing what labyplasty is. Because now I've done so many interviews with people that feel mutilated. I can show you guys some videos of people that
have had the surgery. When Lady was fifty and you know she should She's like, she feels that she should have known better because she's fifty, But how was she supposed to know when there's no resources for us to go and find out what normal is.
I remember when we had this question with ask on cut and like we answered this question. I'm not sure if you listened to it, Ellie, Like we kind of like talked around like what our thoughts were, and then it wasn't until right at the end where we were both like, ah and fuck it, we've got audies as well. But it was like it took us so long to be okay with even saying that because like exactly this whole conversation, which is that there is so much shame
around it. Yeah, that like even for us and we have this platform and we're all about being in you said, when we're all about talking about the full spectrum. We even had a moment where we were like, oh, do I want to put that out there for you know, three hundred thousand people to listen to. I don't know.
It took me a second to be okay with that, and then I realized how crazily hypocritical that is, and like the irony of that in and of itself that I didn't feel comfortable talking about myself and what I look like because I was worried that someone might judge me, whereas the whole reason that we've got this platform is to try and help to destigmatize it. Like it. It made me realize how hypocritical I was being. I guess
one of the things that I really like. So we've talked about all this, the photography that you've been doing, and you have photographed how many evolvers have you photographed? Do you know?
Or it's definitely over three hundred for sure.
There's a lot more Vaina's than in evolvers than I think the most people will get to see in their lifetime unless maybe you're a doctor or re sarchon or in the medical industry. You have also photographed volvers at all different stages of a woman's cycles. There are photos up on Flip three flaps which are of women when they're during their menstrual cycle as well. Why was it important to photograph volvers at every stage?
Well, this is a funny question because I want to be like, it's to normalize all everything that we go through. You know, whether it's bleeding discharge, we all go through it, and it's again a taboo topic that we can struggle with alone. I remember the first time I saw discharge and I thought I was dying.
You know, it's by discharge, like it's oss how I die.
You know.
I want to I really really want younger people. And because I'm actually a preschool teacher, so I nanny a lot a lot of young volver owners.
And actually my project.
Is equally for the boys as well, because I feel they play such a big role and they go through things themselves anyway. But I just feel like the photos showing all the different things that we go through is a perfect conversation starter. So someone might open it up and see that the girl is quite Oh well, Evolvo owner is you know, got the discharge, so then that
can start a conversation between them. But I want to say that this was the reason why I started doing it, but it was actually because I was teaching at the time and I was struggling to fit in photo shoots and people would book in on the day and then they would message me and cancel and I would have taken a day off work to photograph and they'd be like, Hey, I'm just letting you know I'm bleeding, so I'm going
to cancel my shoot today. And I was like, no, you can't, Like you have to come as you are. And it was happening quite regularly because people would be like, Oh, I've got thrush, so I'm going to cancel. I've got ingrown hairs, I've got to cancel. And I started just being like, this is actually crazy, like how people don't
want to come when we're always going through something. And so then I started getting my friends and I was like, can I photograph you while you're bleeding with a tampon string in so that I can put it up and then I can say to other look, I've done it already, You're not going to be the first.
Just come as you are.
And so it originally was so that people would stop canceling on me, But then I started realizing how important it was to show representations of everything.
There's like, if you look through there, there's one.
Girl or a few actually that have scarring from laser hair removal. And so I found that in itself is really interesting because we all think we're going to remove the hair, and then we end up removing the hair, which you know, could be a fashion that dies out pretty quickly. We might all want bush again soon, and now you've made this decision. But also I had no idea that there was a possibility that you could have
such bad scarring. And I was actually speaking to this girl yesterday, even though I photographed her quite a long time ago, and she was like, oh my gosh, I would kill to have.
My bush back and not have these scars.
So it's important that we see all the things that other people are going through so we can make decisions for ourselves whether we want to get laser, you know, whether the period photos start conversation around the pill and what the pill's doing to our body and why it's important to bleed and how to build a better connection with your cycle. And oh my gosh, I've learned so much about my cycle through doing Comfortable in my Skin.
And when I photograph people that are bleeding, it's just a way to lead into a conversation about you know, when you should exercise during a cycle, what you should eat during a cycle, and.
The medio sis.
Like, there's so many conversations that need to be started and they can all lead from these photos.
So out of curiosity, how busy are you photograph involvers? Like do people do you have to advertise now? Or do people just line up to get this photograph? Well?
I actually ended up just getting a PA because my Instagram was so active and engaging and I was dying in it. I not dying, but I was just drowning in how many I mean, you guys probably understand you've got a manager because there's so many people that now reach out to me. Like sometimes people will ask if they can send me a photo of a blister they have down there because they're like, I think, can you.
Tell me what this is?
Like?
People feel really safe with Comfortable in my Skin, which I love so much. But I got to a point where no, I don't actually at all have to reach out. I got to a point where people are just dying to be photographed, which is so beautiful and I'm absolutely honored.
But yeah, I ended up getting a PA. And so we have a weight list which you can join.
Because I travel a lot, well before COVID I did, so we have all around Australia, all the different states, and you can join the weight list.
So I do all different kinds of things.
So if I go to Melbourne, I might advertise for Comfortable with my Sexuality workshop, a volver anatomy workshop, a photo shoot, a group photoshoot, individual photo shoot, so there's all there's a weight list, so you join that and then when I come to your town, I can send you out an email of everything I'm going to do for the week that I'm there, and then you can join. And yeah, I am really busy. I just went to Darwin. I did loads of photo shoots. No matter where I
go now there's always people, which is incredible. But the thing that I struggle with, which would be great if any of your listeners want to be photographed, is cultural diversity. If you go through browse through my breasts, you can see there's a huge lack of cultural diversity, and age diversity and weight diversity. I am seem to be getting in a certain type of person, which is absolutely not my There's no criteria. I let everybody come that wants
to be photographed to come and be photographed. But I really am struggling with cultural diversity.
Why do you think that is?
I guess some cultures maybe this is. You know, even when I was in New Zealand, I was hoping to get a lot of Mallori people and there's one woman that I photographed she said, it's actually really sacred this part of your body. So maybe a lot of cultures don't approve of the work I do. But also I think it's just unfortunate that I did do most of my photos on the Northern Beaches totally where maybe there's not a lot of cultural diversity.
I mean, definitely there's not a lot of culture for diversity. But I would.
Love to have Indigenous women, Black African volver owners.
I'd love to photograph all kinds of body.
A company for Netflix, they're doing a show on pleasure, and they reached out to me and said, can you send us eight photos and we'd love diversity. And I looked through my photos and I actually felt really sad. I was like, I can't send a representation of everyone around the world because no one's come forward. So sometimes I call out and saying, you know, I'm encouraging it, but it's really hard for me to I can't push for anyone to come and do this, so I just
do the best I can. I just say everyone's welcome.
Obviously everyone is anonymous, Is that right, Ellie.
Yeah.
I photograph a lot of lawyers, teachers, and they'll say to me, don't put me on the Instagram page or the website, but I want to be in the book. So there's a consent page that I send to people and they get to choose, like whether they want their head to be in the photo or they just want purely their volver.
And anything is fine.
They also get an option to share their story next
to their volver. So when the Comfortable Masking Coffee Table book does come out, there's going to be feature pages, so someone that has a story that they would like to share can go next to their photo, might say their age, how many babies they've had, how many sexual partners they've had, and that's purely just to show that your labia doesn't change how many sexual partners you've had, so get rid of those myths that say, you know, you might be loose or tight because of your having
so much sex. But I try to debunk all those myths during this project.
So, but if you don't want.
Anything to do with that, and you honestly want to come for when I do a photo shoot, I'm with you for four hours usually, and we talk and often the people cry, and I teach them to ways of how they can build a better connection with their body or how they can become more comfortable naked or in the bedroom.
So sometimes people literally just.
Want to come for the workshop and they're like, can you not do anything with my photos except for.
Send them to me?
And I'm like, absolutely, there is no pressure for me to share your photos.
It's completely totally fine.
But also, I guess, not just if you're someone who's listening to this wanting to come forward to have a photo, to have your photos taken, but just if you've ever and I feel like every woman has felt this at some point, if you've ever felt self conscious about the way you look, if you've ever been unsure if it's something that you know, you would like to just be able to feel like there are some reference images, go and have a look at flip Through or Flaps, and
it's just I felt like, I'm pretty okay with my body and how it is now, and I've had two babies, and it made me just feel so comfortable, and it made me feel so supported that there are so many other women and that there is so much diversity and that everybody is so completely different. And I think that a lot of people who have insecurities will get a lot of solace by realizing that there is no normal
in this spectrum. Yeah, I just I think it's really really powerful and I really recommend everybody goes and has a look.
When I started the project, I originally wanted to do it for teenage people to not go through what I went through. And I've actually noticed that a lot more the age demographic of people that is coming forward is mums that have had babies and they're struggling to connect with their new Volver. So I encourage mums all the time to go and check Outflip through my Flat Totally.
It changes so much as well. Like I mean, it's one thing that people I mean, people don't talk about this stuff enough as it is, but definitely don't talk
about it enough after pregnancy. I mean I did a little bit on the podcast, but like even from when you're actually pregnant to after you have babies, like it changes at every stage along the way, and that can be really isolating because like, at one point you feel like you know your body, and then you also feel like you've surrendered everything about your body to create children, and that I know, like there's parts of me that feels a bit insecure about that, because I'm like, well,
two years ago, everything about me was different to how it is now, and I'm really proud that I have my babies, but at the same time, you still can feel a little bit like like you're not in touch with your body anymore. And I think that it's really powerful to know that there's other women who feel exactly the same and that this isn't You're not isolated, you're not on your own. There's every single woman who's had
a baby probably has had these thoughts and feelings. Definitely, definitely, And Ellie also photographs breasts as well, so you can go on and have a look at the flick through my flaps and there's like every single volver you could ever imagine. But there's also so many breasts that I love. I love that as well because so many women and I have friends too that have always talked like, I want to get a boob job. Look at my boobs. They're ugly. Look at them, they hang low, look at them.
They point it aside, like there's always something. And as soon as you go on your site and you're like, well, no one is unusual. Everyone is unique their own right and everyone everyone on the planet is different. So it's nothing to feel self conscious about.
No, And it's funny because the things with the what I've noticed from photographing breaths is I photograph quite a few people now that are getting there implants taken out. And this is the thing that's like our beauty standards is always forever changing, so doing these surgeries, like you can get your breast implants taken out, but once you cut off your LaBier or your clatoral hood, you can never get that back. And I had a girl in hospital message me. She was in Perth and she was
absolutely distraught. She'd had the surgery and they took off way too much LaBier. She sent me the images there. They're just heartbreaking, and they'd cut her raw and she was she was messaging me being like, I've had I'm up to my third surgery now to get it glued back up, and you know you can't, actually you can't
get that back. Like I said, body standards understands that are always changing, so you have no idea what we're going to want in the next ten years, and we might want our lavy you're back.
But also it's not just beauty standards in this respect. The other thing is like it has a function that has a purpose, and like female pleasure is so important, and then when you go to the point where you're removing so much of your labia that you don't have any protection over your glotorus, which we all know is like a really really sensitive area for all women and
it's really fundamental in actually enjoying sex. I just don't think that people necessarily who are opting in to have labia plasty understand fully or that everybody who goes through this process understands fully just what the side effects and what the complications can be, and that you know, yes, you may have what media and the porn industry and men think is that's the perfect looking vagina afterwards, but you may also completely compromise your ability to have pleasurable sex.
I know which one I would prefer for sex any day of the way.
Me too, Like, fuck, it's funny that you said the porn industry then, because I got a message, an Instagram message from a porn star who I won't say her name, but she's a very successful porn star, and she wrote me this really really interesting message saying that she's starting to feel quite upset that a lot of sexologists and people, you know, there's this big movement on Instagram blaming porn
industry for everyone going and getting labya plastic. And she's like, go on to any of my videos and look at any of my photos and you'll see I have very long laber. And she's like, even after looking through flip through my flaps, I can say I have very long LaBier and she's like, it is so sexy and people love to see me having sex.
So proof is in the pudding.
There is this.
Weird stigma that all of this has come from porn industry, and I never watched porn, and I felt heavily like this obviously, but yeah, it's funny that the porn industry is getting such a blame for this whole laby plaster because I also feel like, if you if us so we wanted to do a porno right now, all oudis we could.
Easily billow over zoom a zoom porno.
Yeah, by zoom, we could make a porno. There's so much admature porn now.
Well, we were talking about this before we jumped on this call, and like, I don't think it is just the porn industry, I think, and I don't know if the legislation's changed. We were actually trying to do some research into it before we jumped on this Zoom call, but we couldn't find the most current details around LaBier censorship. So basically I know that going back in Stort of twenty fifteen, there was rules around how a vagina in
a swimsuit could be presented. So with the Laby was showing, it had to be photoshopped out.
It had to be single creasey.
Yeah, so it had to be one crease in the photo. It couldn't be any more than that, and no bulging, no outer Laba, and that was sort of the standardized expectation across all media publications. So when you think of like, you know, if you were doing a swimsuit shoot for Cea Foley, for example, if there was more than just
the single creep showing that needed to be photoshopped. So we have been conditioned our entire I mean I'm thirty five, My entire viewing and my entire consumption of media from when I was a teenager until recently has been that that's what a vagina looks like, not knowing that actually a majority of people's vaginas in modern media has been photoshopped,
which I just think is crazy. And I think that that is also what's added to this feeling from people who may have longer labiers, or have asymmetry, or that makes them feel like, oh, I'm not normal because I don't look like that girl in the photo. That girl in the photo doesn't even look like that girl in the photo.
She's photoshopped. It happened to my sister.
She did an ad and for it was a bikini brand, a big one, and they photoshopped off her labia. When she bought the photos home to me, I was so excited. I was like, Oh my gosh, this is so exciting, Like maybe they do that to everybody. I remember being like so shook and mind blown, and I was like, they've like, we'll have these photos. We laughed so much because my sister was never self conscious in a bikini. She was always just rocking it. She did surfboat rowing
and surfing. And yes, they completely made her look like she had absolutely no LaBier. And I did do an interview with a girl who worked for a magazine company and she her job was editing, and she said I spent like the past ten years editing off people's lavier.
Imagine if men's dicks got edited out, it would never happen. They would never edit a whole penis out of board shorts at the beach, So why do you have to edit a lavier so like a natural part of women's body. They put fucking socks down their swimmers to make their dicks look bigger, Like that's the crazy thing. If it's a jos ad, they will literally put an insert in to make it look like they have a more pronounced not like a sexually hard on penis, but like they'll
make it look like it's a nice round package. Whereas for a woman, you have to be a perfectly flat box with no identifying factors that you have a vagina or revolver or anything going on between your legs. You got to look Amy do Bobby Yeah, Bobby barbies, we don't that's baby. Yeah, it's wild now, Ellie, let me know.
I mean, for somebody who has seen so many volvers in her time, what do you think women can do to be more comfortable, to be more confident, and to sort of be able to accept themselves for who they are and what they look like.
I think it's really important to reach out for help. So if you are struggling a lot, reach out to honestly, go and see a psychiatrist, go and see a sexologist.
Talk to your sisters, your.
Friends, your mom's, your dad's, talk to everyone you can, because, like I said, people are definitely going through the.
Same thing and you're not alone.
And when you realize you're not alone and you have people to talk about anything that you're suffering from, it
makes you realize that we are all different. And I'm a big advocate for positive affirmations, mirror work actually being normalizing nudity going to neud events, go swim naked at the beach, you know, just embracing the body that you have and surrounding yourself with positivity towards nudity and pleasure, and honestly, reach out to me, because I do do phone calls with people, and I have so many groups.
I have groups for like people self conscious of their labia, people self conscious of their breast.
I have a group for.
People with any inverted nipples like on my Instagram page.
I have literally got a group for anything.
So reach out to me with whatever you're feeling self conscious with and I can help you.
You just mentioned something then which I would love for you to explain a little bit more. What is mirror work?
Okay, So I do mirror work every single day. So it's when you look in the mirror. It's looking at your body with appreciation and talking to yourself like you would talk to your best friends. So every single time I apply moisturizer, I do it really slowly, and I watch myself do it in the mirror.
I just instead of.
Being negative, being like oh, I've got like moles there or whatever you would naturally think, you give love to that part of your body and the language that you use is so important.
So I might, like, you know.
Brush my hair and I'll do it really slowly, and I'll brush every single little bit and I'll think like, oh, it.
Feels so nice to touch my hair.
My head's feeling really soft today, or as if I was brushing a friend's hair, and what I would say to them, you just do it to yourself, and it's kind of like it's just giving yourself love. And I had this really really really beautiful moment. I was living in Tamarama on the beach not long ago, and I was looking in the reflection at myself and I started dancing just.
Where they could, just lifeguards can looking back at you. I know.
Yeah, well it was nighttime. It was nighttime, and so I was watching my.
Reflection and I started dancing like really slowly and just really gently touching my body and watching myself do it.
And it's funny because I used to teach.
Mirror work in photo shoots, and I feel like I hadn't got to the point yet where I was doing it naturally. I was sort of like, like I said, fake it to make it, like forcing myself to do this kind of work and then I just had this incredible night where I just did it naturally and I was watching myself and I was turning myself on and I ended up having pretty much the best orgather I've ever had in.
My whole life. But it was well, yes, it was like I.
Have gotten to such a good place in my body and my relationship with my body because I have done insane.
Amounts of work.
So I tell people all the time, I'm like, you have to actually do the work on yourself. You're not just gonna like one day wake up and be like, oh I fucking love my body. You have to spend time doing these things and eat healthy, masturbate, meditate, you know, exercise, All these things go towards this self care that everyone needs for themselves. Allow the time to love yourself and put the work in, and that's how you get the results.
Okay, so I've got to go look in the mirror. Yes, if you're currently in lockdown, I want meditate and masturbate to be on new mail trop Yes, I think it is. I think that's literally what everyone's doing.
You know, it's a gift to get a dildo or a wand or a sex toy and to experiment with yourself so that you can learn what you want, and then you can teach the people that you're sleeping with so you're having good sex.
It's so important.
Also a gift to your fellow woman, because that guy's going to be better off, like you've just set him off into the world better than he came to you. That's the goal for everyone, right Go forth now and do better for all the other women out there. Ellie, thank you so much for coming and being a part of the podcast. Thank you for sharing all the work that you're doing. Guys. If you haven't heard a flip through my flaps, if you haven't seen Comfortably in my Skin,
go and check Ellie out on Instagram. Ellie, can you let us know? So it's at comfortably in my skin?
It's comfortable in my skin with an underscore at the end. And I'm shadow band because of the content I put up. Instagram hates me, so you have to type in the whole word or else you can't find me.
Instagram hates volvers, so you need to go and find her. Dig deep, guys, keep fighting the good fight. Ellie, thank you so much for joining us on Life on Cut. Today, we loved you. Everyone, go and check out her page and anybody if you are feeling self conscious, if you have had those questions which so many of us women do, please reach out to Ellie or jump on to Comfortable in my Skin. Thanks girls, Well that is it from us. Guys. We hope that you have loved and gotten something out
of this little bonus episode. A massive thank you to Bond's Blood, Cumpy AND's for making this episode possible and we will be back tomorrow with our Ask Uncut episode. Guys, please keep those questions rolling in you can send them to our dms on the Instagram Life Uncut podcast. We love, love, love answering your questions and please remember it keep your embarrassing moments coming in. We love the accidentally unfilters and we need to get another fresh bunch for the coming week.
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