This episode was recorded on Cameragle Land.
Hi guys, and welcome back to another episode of Life on Cut. I'm Brittany and I'm Laura, and today's guest is one that I am so excited about. Now she may or may not need an intro, but if you happen to have come to one of our Life Uncut Live show tours last year, Tony was one of our guests at the Perth Show and she didn't disappoint. She's an author, she's a writer, and she's one half of the astronomical podcast, the Tony and Ryan Podcast, which is
huge in Australia but even bigger overseas. She's one of the funniest people I have met.
No pressure.
Welcome to the podcast, Tony Long. Oh my god. I also love the use of the term astronomical. You just do not hear that enough. I throw that term around like this is no Tomorrow, because it's like it really hits home. When someone says astronomical, You're like, wow, they mess be really good.
I think what you meant to say about that, Britt is that Britain never uses it and she only reserves it for people like you, Tony.
That's what she yeah, I was gonna say. I mean, it really cuts deep that you're just like, yeah, oh my god, that coffee was astronomical. I'm like, okay, that's how I use it, Tony.
I reckon, you told the funniest accidentally unfiltered that we've potentially ever had.
And so I mean there's a bit of a setup to this.
So last year we did the live shows in October, we released some of the interviews from the live shows if you guys were across it last year, but then we didn't release Tony's because we always intended to have you on the actual podcast and interview you properly.
And then I played hard to get for too long. And it's been a whole fucking year since we've been able to nail this down. She's been like ghosting, breadcrumbing and zombie. And she comes back, she reels me in and thinks we're in a relationship again, and then she goes to me again. Yeah. I just love the attention. To be quite honest, I've never had two ladies quite as beautiful as you guys in my DMS. I'm like, you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna like, hold onto
this for as long as I can. I want to know.
You said you've got a new accil unfielded story, but I'll take whatever embarrassing story you've got.
Well, I feel like you've pumped the tires up of the other one. But basically, for yeah, anyone in Perth you would know that there's this ride at the Adventure World like theme park. But basically it's like this big pirate ship and it like is on a pendulum and it kind of like swings left to right and you kind of like swing up into the air and then back down and then it kind of goes the other way.
And I actually I was just saying to you guys, like I get videos from people from around the world whenever they're at like a fair, because this ride is just like exists everywhere, so you would know it. But basically, I'm like sitting on this ride and it kind of like swings up and I'm like, oh, oh, that makes my dummy feel a little bit funny. And then it swung back the other way and I was like, oh,
I don't know what that was. And then I realized that like I didn't know what it was because I maybe wasn't supposed to know yet, and I'm like swinging on this right and I'm like, oh oh my god, it like swings back again. It really like teases you this ride. You really get your money's worth. And anyway, so I'm pretty sure I did my first come on a theme park ride. And who else can I say that did my first come that because you haven't done yours yet, not on.
A theme park ride. Put it that way.
I first come on the Pirate ship on the pirate ship thing, and I was just like I was stunned because I didn't really know what it was. I didn't know why it felt the way that it felt, and you know, like, how do you like? It was astronomic question?
The real question, Tony is how many times did you go on? And after that you were like.
Well that was she signed up to the VIP membership frequent flyof Well it's like seasonal. So Adventure World in Perth is only open from like October to March. Like it's only open during the hotter months, so when it's cold.
I mean, I'm just imagining your mom's like, God, Tony spent all day on that fucking pirate chip ride.
Yeah, who just travels with the World seasonal to like Female seasonal, I Go North to South. But you did say you actually had a more recent embarrassing moment too,
Do you want to share that while you're here. On the podcast that I make with with Ryan, we introduced this idea that on February twenty ninth, so on that like leap Day, we introduced an episode where we could say something like own up to something, but then we couldn't talk about it until the next leap Day, kind of like a purge almost, And I introduced it because we'd only just started renting this studio space that we're in now, and so it was really new and we
hadn't really like gotten a lot of furniture yet and didn't really like know the quirks of the building. And one morning it was early and I was like, there's a delivery coming today. I'll be the one to like go and accept it. Like I'll go and open the roller door. It's like a factory unit kind of thing. I was like, I'll go and open the roller door and I'll figure it out, and that's fine, I'll let the guy in ru I'm like, great, I'll stay late
for a different delivery. We're like awesome. I'm like, great compromise. I rock up here early and it was like early in the year, so I was still on the green juices, like I hadn't given up on my resolutions yet. And I walk up to the roller door and I like, my remote fob things not working. And then I'm like, okay, I will go over to the door, and my key in actual like my physical key in the door isn't
working either. The lock had seized uff and I'm like, oh my god, like this guy should be here any minute, like and I'm not going to be able to accept the stuff. But then I realized that the bigger problem is that I've had three quarters of a green juice. I can't get into the building and I am about to violently shit myself. And so I'm sitting in my car and I'm like, what do I do? Like do I go to a Maca's around the corner and use
the bathroom? And I'm like no, because this delivery is about to come and like then what's getting Like he's not going to be able to get in, He's going to leave and I'm just going to have to come back another day. And I'm like, oh my god, I'm panicking the Pooh is like about to escape my body. And I realized what I had to do was park my car kind of like across the front of driveway and fling the door open to kind of like try
and cover me from the street. And I shot in the garden out of the front of our new building.
I cannot believe.
And then I called my boyfriend Torfs, and I was like, you've got to come and help me, and he was like, well, I'm on my way to work, so i'll swing past your office and he goes, all I've got in the car. All I've got in the car is like Pooh bags from like our dog. And I was like, okay, well, all I've got is like plastic wrap from like a
package that I'd picked up from the post office. So I scoop up as much as I can into this like plastic like postal bag, and Thorbs rocks up and he grabs the rest of it and we managed to We ended up being able to get into the building, so we kind of like scrubbed it away and like managed to clean up the crime scene before anybody saw us.
And then Thorps was like, all right, I will take the rubbish and he's like, I'll drop it into a random bin at like a Macason the way to work, and I was like, oh my god, you're such a life saver. And then when I was telling Ryan this story on the pod, he goes, Tony, that has your address on it. Because I'd picked up the parcel. You might open up the letterbox and someone's mouthed your shit back to you. Wait, I think you get away with
the crime scene. But it's got your full name, address, post code page and I'm like, Tony Lodge, like my tax file number, like you know, like everything.
Is on there. The part of this takeaway that I can't get over, though, is that your partner is such a fucking good guy that he will fish around in the garden after your poo and take it with him.
He will take it away, Like I know.
This is unfathomable, is what it is?
Astronomy unreal, It's astronomical.
That's an astronomical shit, it really is, Tony.
I you know, I loved interviewing you at the at the Perth Show. And one of the parts of your story that I find so fascinating because we are in the world of it now is that you came from a very traditional media background, like you were working in radio, but you're working kind of behind the scenes, not on air.
Can you talk us through a little bit.
About what that experience was like for you and why you left radio and a fiery dumpster to go and do podcasting and have your own show.
Well, yes, it was just an audio producer. And I think for when I first started in radio, I was literally just making commercials. Like I wasn't even on a show. I wasn't even like allowed to be with the famous people or anything. Like I was like tacked away in the back corner and I was like started doing crossers in the morning because I was like, oh, you know,
I think I could be really good at this. And I was kind of told like in no uncertain terms, like you don't really look the part, you don't really have the qualifications for this, and it's just not going to happen. And I think, like I really am easy to accept a no. Like if someone says no, I don't really accept that as a negotiation. I'm like, oh, that's it. Like I kind of just accepted that that was all. So I was like, you know what, I'm really happy just being an audio producer and that's fine.
And then like after moving around, so I was living in Perth and then I moved to regional radio in Wa and then moved to Sydney for Metro Radio, and I was kind of like, okay, like I'm just an audio producer and like I'm actually obviously pretty good at this because I keep getting these new jobs. And then when I moved to Melbourne, I realized like I was audio producer on like a breakfast radio show, and I was like, God, I'm like twenty far four at the time, and I was like and have I kind of peaked
like is this it? Like I'm already doing the dream job, Like there's probably not really much more that I can do. And then I was I just really enjoyed comedy. I really enjoyed being part of the show. I loved that Jason PJ was the show that I was on. I loved that they kind of let me have my moments with them, and I was like, god, like there's just this thrill about getting to be on air and getting
to go and do things. And so I started going and doing their stunts, which is I think the way like a lot of people kind of start getting like to dip their toes in a little bit, and I was like, oh, I remember going into the bos and being like, oh, you know, like I think I'm offering a lot to the show, and you know, it's quite hard doing my full time job and doing that, and like the guys really like it, Like is there any way that I could get a pay rise that I
can kind of manage doing both things, or maybe take on a bit of more of an on air roll. And they were like no, like, if you like doing the on air stuff, you do that for free because there's a million people that would kill to do your job and they would do it for free. Blah blah blah. And I was kind of like, oh, like that's just it then. And then Ryan started working at the radio station and he was like, oh, have you ever thought
about being on air? And I was like I tried, and they said that I couldn't, like because I just accepted that and I was like, that's my lot in life and that's fine. And then when we started, he was like, why don't we make you up a demo to try and get you on the air, And like this whole podcast started as me trying to get make like a demo to be on the radio. Yeah, we started making it and then we like recording the video and then we're like, you know what, Like the video
is pretty good, the audio is pretty good. Should we try posting that on TikTok or whatever? And we did, and like, oh my god, I'm so glad we did, because yeah, I was like able to quit my job and now this this is my full time job and
I get to make this podcast. And I guess the biggest thing was that, like, had I just accepted that no, and didn't have someone in my corner like Ryan that was like no, Like you don't have to accept that, Like you can keep fucking going and you can keep trying, like I just I wouldn't be here, yeah, and like it kind of makes me emotional that I'm like, wow, I was just so happy to accept that, and like, yeah, had I not had a champion like that, I would still be there and I would just be like this
is just it. You know, It's funny because I mean I was getting emotional then for you, because it's this idea of you're the captain of your own ship and we all know it, but sometimes it's not as easy to put that into practice, and so you know that now, but you would have just kept cruising through life.
I'm so interested in coming from the backside of radio, the back end of radio, and like all the behind the scenes as well, And then I think that there's a real and I have to be careful with it because obviously we work in radio now, but there is a real disparity between like on air talent and how it works behind the scenes as well.
Well.
What was your experience of being a female working in radio and how do you kind of see the opportunities that were presented for on air talents to work.
I mean, first of all, like in that most recent job that I had, there was a guy doing the exact same job as me and who was getting paid more, and we had like pretty similar experience, and that like there was just no interest in like meeting that pay disparity or even like the emotional responsibility that like I feel like I took on more than they did. Like I felt as if the work kind of came to me and we were kind of splitting it up rather than us both kind of taking responsibility for our days.
And that was really hard because you, like, I just felt like I was carrying them mental load a lot. I felt like I was really caring about the outcomes of things and didn't really necessarily feel like other people were meeting me in the middle, like with that stuff. I guess working behind the scenes like that. There really
isn't many females in especially in audio production. I think it's changing now, but the way that it all works is like, I mean, regional radio is not even really a thing now, So in terms of people getting up in radio like that quote unquote traditional way of like going to regional radio and things like that, I think that now it will most naturally go to people who like already have their foot in the door some way, you know, Like and that's not me like trying to
hang shit on Like you guys obviously you like had a huge profile and then you got into radio, but like you work fucking hard. I think it's more the people that go like, oh, we'll just put them on because they're having a bit of a moment and it flops and it goes nowhere, and then you go, oh, but there's all these people that are trying really hard, that are willing to do the work and do that job and like, and you guys can agree and attest to this as well, like it's actually a hard job
to do. I think that people were like, oh, you're just talk into a microphone, you have fun with your best friend. How hard could it be? You know, I wanted to be on the radio so bad and they wouldn't let me. And so instead of I guess accepting that, like, well, we created this job for ourselves. You know. I think there's some statistic of like only zero point three of podcasts in the world make any money, Yeah, which is
just insane. So you kind of do have to carve your own path and think about like multiple income streams. Like it's not as straightforward as you think it is just like oh, I make this and then I get paid, Like it's just not like that.
I also find it really fascinating because I mean to lift the curtain a little bit on the sort of radio podcasting world. If you're working in radio, usually if you start a podcast, it has to be housed by the radio network that owns podcasts.
So for example, we work for ARN.
They have a podcast network called iHeart, even though we independently own Life on Cut. As you guys all know it's our podcast. We sell our ad space to ARN, so it kind of works in like a mutual arrangement there. But when you are employed by radio and then you start your own podcast, were you independent or did you
have to be underneath your network? And was there a conflict of interest there when things started to go really well for you in the world of podcasting, when you've been told by your bosses, sorry, you're not on air talent.
So we were both lucky enough that having been in the world a little bit and both having had podcasts before, we did have a little bit of knowledge, because, I mean, you hear these horror stories about people who have these amazing podcasts that then all of a sudden they don't own them and they can't move them somewhere else, or they can't continue making it and stuff, which is so scary, and we had both seen that happen, so we were
both a bit wise up to that. But like you said, we were working for ARN, So our podcast for the first year was with iHeartRadio, and we made sure that we owned everything. We made sure that it was ours and a podcast I'd had before had a feed, and so we said we don't need a new feed because we're just going to archive those old episodes and start
like posting Tony what is now Tony? And Ryan onto there And so I owned that, like Tony Lodge owned that, which probably ended up being quite lucky and worked out for us, because yet some people just like don't get to keep making their stuff when they want to leave. That was only a year, and then after that we ended up getting an offer to become exclusive with Spotify, which is just the wildest thing that could have even ever happened. Like that's just like Spotify knows my name,
Like what that is so insane. We moved on and we joined them, and now we are independent. Our ads get sold by acasts the same as you guys, Like it's a completely it's our arrangement and whatever, but we own everything and it's all ours and like no one gets to say what we do or say or have on or yeah. So it's like pretty amazing. And you've got a big enough audience. This is the thing that as another fellow podcaster that like, I look at you
guys and I admire so much. You have a huge audience in America and overseas, and it's really hard in this industry to do that and to break into another country for those people that might not know what's it. Like, Like I saw you guys go over there to America recently and do a tour. Is that mind blowing to you that you can go to such a foreign country and people recognize you, turn up to see you, know
your name. It's the wildest thing. Like it's just so like even you're just saying that then has given me goosebumps. Like just the thought of that is is just fucked. It's just a fucking yeah. Like it's just so strange, like the thought that people are willing to turn up. And I think there's just so much content now, Like people have so many options. Like when I was growing up, there was channel seven, Channel nine and Channel ten and like that was it. But now you know, there's so
many ways that people can get content. So I think the thought that all these people around the world are like committing half an hour of their precious time to us every day. I don't ever want to forget what that means when I think about how crucial, like a half an hour of my time is at night time before bed, I go if I'm putting on a TV show, I want it to be really good. And Ryan's and
new dad. So he's kind of going through that at the moment where he's like, I'm not getting a lot of sleep, So whatever time I give myself to enjoy something, it has to be really, really good. So he listens to himself, Yeah, it's like, it's got to be quality. I'm just going to listen to our room. He's like, I've been listening to laugh Uncut before.
But also like, you work with one of your closest friends, Like, what is your relationship with Ryan like now? After spending so many years? And I asked this because there is this kind of like interesting thing that happens when you come to podcasting and that I'm still in the room. Remember, yeah, but you make you make content about your own personal life. Your job is to talk about your personal life, and the lines can sometimes get really blurred, like what's your relationship like now?
So when we first started doing this, we didn't really know each other that well at all, and so it was kind of like learning about each other, learning the limit, like learning what is cool and what's not and knowing as well, oh, I don't know anything about your life outside of what we kind of new from working together briefly, so we were getting to know each other as co hosts,
as people and friends. But then also all of a sudden, you throw in running a business together, and we had to shift from these modes of like, well, we're recording right now, so we're having bantam, it's all fun, and then we go, okay, and now we have to like figure out what accounting is and like how to pay tax, and that's like the business owner part. And then we're also like, okay, well, after all that, it's five o'clock. Should we go and have dinner and like try and
get to know each other a little bit more. I guess like it's been like a long distance relationship where you kind of like everything is sped up and everything is just like ten X because you're like, we need to figure out if this is something that we can do, we want to do is possible? Do I hate you? And I just haven't realized yet we haven't had enough time together.
Yeah, it's like going on a first date.
Right, You've realized you've got chemistry and band to there, but you don't know if you just want to fuck or not it's the same thing, like you don't know if it's a long relationship or if it's that night sent So you fucked and then you're still here. So we fucked and we still figured out. But it's kind
of like we also were just really different people. We communicate really differently, and that has been I think a bit of a superpower for us, because I had someone that, like I was saying earlier, was like would champion me, and we'd be like, no, Tony, Like don't fucking take no, frienands, like you can do this, and so having that is so powerful. But also as someone who's not naturally like that, when I need to not be pushed, I'm like, you need to fuck off, Like this isn't a time where
I need to be bucked up and gassed up. I need you to shut up and like give me a minute. So it was also like learning how to push each other and when to push and when to like hang back.
And give space.
Yeah, exactly, like a relationship. We just kind of fell into this, and I mean it's worked out well and we have like persevered. But had he been someone I just met, like, we probably wouldn't still be friends. Like, you know, we probably wouldn't have like stayed in touch, and you know, like which is so strange because now we're like part of each other's lives in this weird way. He's got a baby that I see all the time, Like I'm friends with his wife, he's friends with my boyfriend.
You know, I just can't imagine he came to the auction when I bought my house, Like, you know, he's just like the most supportive person and I love him to death. But it's just crazy that under any normal circumstances, like would we still be mates? Like maybe not.
So interesting, isn't it.
And it's also interesting because like you can have two people that can be so different, But then the thing that you share that's really unique and special is the chemistry. Like the chemistry that you can have in that dance that you can do when you're on air together is something that is really hard to find with just anyone. Like that's the thing that makes the product so incredible. People also forget too that it is a relationship.
It is a relationship, and people have different communication styles like Laura and I do like you guys said, and like different things that people need, like words of affirmation, or time or whatever.
Physical touch, yes.
Always to change she feels me up. But it is one hundred percent another relationship that you need to manage, just not well, maybe your but it's just not sexual. You and Torbes, your partner, have decided we'll ah for now child free by choice, which is, you know, it is becoming more popular, but it is still against the grain. It's still against societal norms. Is that something you always
knew you wanted to be childless by choice? Is it something you've discovered along the way, and is it something that has changed slightly since Ryan has become a dad. I think the childless thing like when as I was growing up, I just always assumed I would have kids, because that's just like, so rather than it being a choice I would, I just assumed that I would because you grow up and you have babies and did that classic thing of like, oh, by the time i'm twenty two,
i'll be married, I'll have three kids. And then you're twenty two and you're like doing acid in a warehouse and you're like, oh my god, I'm like not doing what I thought I was going to be doing. You're getting off on a pirate ship. That's about it. Yes, yeah, no, that was much younger. But I think it hit a point where I was just a bit like, oh, maybe I won't do that, and yeah, Teorbes and I like, we just moved in together literally that day, and we're
laying in this beautiful new house. It wasn't actually it was like some shit share house and we're laying there together, and I was just like, oh, I don't know if I'm ever gonna want kids. Well, the worst timing probably because we just moved in together, and I was like, should this be of something that we talked about? But I think I like realized and I just said it out loud. I think because us living together was like the beginning of our life. And I'm like, oh my god,
does this mean that you know? Is this the house we're going to have kids in? And then I was like oh nah, actually, and Teorbes said like, oh, well, I would rather have you than a baby, so that's fine with me, and we check in like once a year.
I guess it normally ends up being around like if somebody in our life has a baby or whatever, I go, oh, like, cause we both love kids and we've got nephews that we adore and Ryan's baby is in our life now, and I just think about all the great things about enjoying kids and like love playing and hanging out and having them in my life. But I just think all the other stuff that we get to enjoy and the freedom that we have. I guess that that's just our
preference for now. But I think everybody just assumes that if you don't want kids, like you just hate them, and it's it's really not that at all, Like it's I probably now as I'm growing up and realizing that me not having children is like sacrificing the great parts about being a mom and like being a parent, but knowing that there's parts of it that I wouldn't be very good at and that I wouldn't want to subject a child to. Like I'm like, that's not your Like,
do you get what I mean? Like it's hard to articulate.
No, I think you're articulating it perfectly.
And I also think the thing that's really remarkable is when you find a partner that's on the same page and that you've made that decision together and you're doing this together, and you know, we talk about it in relationships all the time. That like where the pinch in the pool happens, is when one partner wants something that the other doesn't. But I think a lot of people have children and it's the best thing that they ever do.
And a lot of people have children because it's the thing that they expected that they should do, and it hasn't really been a conscious decision. It's just been the next thing to do in life. And I don't know whether that's the right way to go about it, because it's definitely something you can't give back once you've made that decision and it's happening.
Yeah, it's so funny that people go, oh, are you sure you don't want kids? Like you can't take that back, And I go, I can take that decision back much easier than I can take back having a child and wishing that I didn't.
Yeah, yeah, it's so true.
I have a question for you because it's something that I think about all the time because I'm the same as you, where I shouldn't say the same as you, but I often think I don't know if it's for me, and it's the path I want to go down, But I'm getting to crunch time, you know, I'll be thirty eight this year when I'm getting married, but my partner I talk about it all the time. Do you ever mourn the decision to not have kids? And what I mean by that is you so confidently then say like,
it's not for me. And sometimes I'll say that to myself. I'll be like, Okay, I think it's not going to be for me. But then I get really sad thinking about the fact that it's not for me, and I try and picture my future, and I'm like, it makes me upset to think that a child's not going to
be my future, even if I've made the decision. It's really complex emotions because you can feel comfortable in what your decision is, but then I guess it's the unknown of how you're going to feel in ten, fifteen, twenty years. So do you ever sort of sit in that feeling of being like, I know it's not for me now, but fuck that makes me sad in a way, Probably less about it making me sad, because You're right, it's
really complex. But I think where I've landed with it is like what I was saying, like, I probably now consider it I'm sacrificing the great parts about potentially like being a mom and having a baby and like experiencing that love and joy and all of those things. Like I'm sacrificing that for you know, the fact that maybe I wouldn't be that good at it, or maybe it wouldn't really be for me, or maybe I do prefer my freedom. I think, Yeah, what it comes down to
is that, like I don't hate kids. It's not like I don't want them. I'm just saying, like, you know what, I think that it's not the right choice for me or for us. And whether that makes it better, I don't really know. But there are I think, especially like around the holidays and whatever, I go, oh, having kids would be so special because you think about how much like kids love Christmas and kids love stuff, and you
just think about spoiling them and whatever. And then I go, yeah, but so what once a year, I am cool with it. But you know, like, and I think that's almost like how I have realized that like the times I feel sad about it are like minuscule compared to the times
that I feel really comfortable with the decision. And so I feel like what you'll say, like that to me sounds like you know exactly what you need and one in your life because if it gives you that like gutt or feeling after deciding, like I feel like you know exactly what you need?
Yeah for you, Yeah, I mean curing you guys.
Unpack that you asked the question, brit I was like, I feel like the response would be very different. I feel like most people who've made that decision are at peace with the decision, and when they've gotten to that place, it's like, well, it's not a thing that creates distress or upset because it's like why would it.
It's what I want, which is worse because I don't have peace. Yeah, but that's what That's what I mean. Like even the way that you ask that question, then you're like, don't you just feel so fucking devastated about it? I'm like, no, paid I don't like and yeah, that's like it's just as simple as that, and it's I mean,
it's not fucking simple. While I say that it's so complex, it's like the craziest thought that I'm like, hang on, if I'm put on this earth to like repopulate it, I'm like not doing my one thing that I don't really know what that means.
Yeah, no, I think you do, and I think you've explained it perfectly, and I do think that there is also a lot of like, when someone has made the choice, you've got to explain why, which is crazy, you know, And I know we asked the questions, but it's because the conversation is not had as frequently as the choice to have children. No, no one's like, why do you want to have children? Talk to me about how you came to the decision to have kids, just expect nobody ever
asked that. But the alternate seems like something that needs to be queried. And I think that there are so many women now who are making this decision. And the reason why we talk about a lot on this podcast is because it gives voice to alternate ways of living life. And it doesn't mean that one is better or everything is just it's just different. You've spoken a bit, I mean the book that you wrote I don't need therapy
and other lies I've told myself. There's so much in this that you unpacked, but I would love to know. And one thing we're gonna talk about, which we spoke about live show, is your mom and when your mom passed away, But then writing about it and putting that out into the world and having everybody else tell you their experiences of grief as well. What has it been like to share so personally the massive grief and coming to terms of what that grief meant about losing your mum.
So there's a lot of people that message me and go like, oh, thank you so much for sharing that, or I've just read your book, thank you for sharing the way that you did about your mum, because I feel so much less alone now. I don't think that people realize what that gives me too, because I'm like, I've just put myself out there in this crazy way, and I'm talking about these feelings that people either haven't experienced yet or may never experience, depending on their relationship
with people in their lives. But I don't think people realize that reflecting back to me and saying, oh my god, it made me feel so much less learn I'm like, thank God that I'm not the only person feeling this in a good and a bad way, because obviously I'm heartbroken when I can relate to people in that way. But I think people think like, oh, well, you wrote it down, so you must feel really confident, or you
must know everything. I'm like, I really don't, and having the freedom to write down all my feelings was amazing
and really cathartic. And I mean it doesn't have to be in a book that goes on to be published and become a SOLA and an award writning book, Like I think it like really showed to me like the importance of journaling for yourself, without judgment for what you've written, and without thinking that somebody else is going to read it, writing for yourself, and that's kind of what that book is. It's like amazing that there's this version of my mum that lives in the world. I think that is one
of the coolest parts. That she's not here, but people get to meet her because I've shown them her. Yeah. I found one thing you spoke about really interesting that after your mom passed away and you were only nineteen, so you were so young, but that you felt like you couldn't talk about her after Can you elaborate a
little bit on that. I found that I was at this age where you know, people were still living at home and things like that, and they would I would be talking to someone, they'd be like, oh, hang on, sorry, my Mom's just calling me or oh I was talking to Mom the other day about X y Z or oh, hang on, like I've got to go, Like my Mum's
picking me up in fifteen minutes whatever. And I was like, remember just feeling this like hot rage and jealousy that people could just like so easily drop their mum into a conversation. And aside from the fact that she wasn't with me anymore, the casual nature of talking about her and being able to just like bring her up or mention her just fell away. And I think that there's just like so much stigma around showing your feelings. You know, if you say that you're struggling, you just are begging
for attention. If you say that you're happy, you're rubbing it in people's face. If you say that you're grieving, people like, oh, get over it, like change the record. And so I felt like there was just no way that I could ever bring up my mom without it seeming like, I don't know, attention seeking or things like that. And so that was the hardest part that I was like, this crazy thing has just happened to me. My favorite person in the world is gone, and all of a sudden,
I just have to like shut up about it. And people all of a sudden aren't being like, oh, so, what was your mum's favorite food or whatever? Like you know, nobody's asking that because how strange.
But also no one asks it because there's this real fear and when it comes to grief, there's this real fear around upsetting the other person. So instead of asking questions that would allow for that person's their greatest loss, the person that they love the most, to continue on in conversation, we avoid it. And we avoid it because we're like, oh, I don't want them, I don't want to make them think about it. But the thing is,
you're thinking about it all the time anyway. It's not like it's very far from your brain or very far from your thoughts.
I mean, what's a piece of advice that you would give people listening right now surrounding that, because we speak to different people all the time where they say that they're like, I would love people to continue the conversation or ask me how I am when I'm going through my biggest loss.
What would you tell people?
I would love to cancel saying sorry because being like, oh, yeah, my mum's just passed away, people going oh, I'm so sorry. I go, well, you didn't kill her, and I feel like there's all of a sudden, this like power dynamic shift of I am feeling heartbroken about whatever, whatever it may be, and then you go I'm sorry, and I go, oh, it's okay, and all of a sudden, like I'm comforting
you because you feel uncomfortable. I just kept found people just kept saying they were sorry, and I was like, you don't need to be sorry, like you didn't give her brain cancer, you didn't do this to me, you didn't do this to her. And so the path I now go down is that fucking sucks because all you want, well, all I wanted was someone to just be like that really sucks, and there's nothing I can say, but that's really shit because you just want people to acknowledge your pain.
And I think that this is true for so many situations in our lives, like we just want to be heard. We just want people to be like, you know what, that really sucks that that happened. Whether you're worse thing today was that you missed the bus, or that you dropped your berries and go get on your T shirt or that, like you know your mom is dead, like whether it is one extreme to the other, Like everybody's worst thing is their worst thing, and they just want
to be heard. Like people just want you to acknowledge that, like they must be having a shit day because XYZ happened.
We struggle so much with death, like we struggle so much with grief, and like we don't like the discomfort of potentially upsetting someone else. And it's a very Western
culture thing, but we dance around grief. And I think one of the things I loved about your book and something you just mentioned in terms of the casualness, I also like how you speak about grief in a casual way and hear me out when you're like, hey, this really bad things just happened, but I got to get up in the morning and make toast or I'm watching TV. These things feel normal, but nothing feels normal at the same time.
And it's this, it's this really like life goes on. Yeah, and it does.
And I think for a lot of people, they around you for like two months or even less. Sometimes you know, you get them, you get the messages, you get like you know, some niceties, and then a lot of people you don't hear from anymore, you know, and it's like that doesn't just stop for you.
You're still left in the grief.
You're still working through it, like it's such an ongoing process. And I think people, unless I've experienced themselves, they don't get it.
And I think that was another really challenging thing for me because I was nineteen, like you said, Britt, and I didn't know what was going on, and neither did any of my friends. Like no, I didn't know anybody
that had lost a parent or anything. So all of a sudden, I felt like such a burden on all of my friends, and I just felt like they all pulled away from me because again, like they didn't know how to sit in that discomfort, and they didn't know what they were doing, and you know, they were going to Europe and drinking and having fun, and I was like, well, I'm at home because I've left UNI so that I
could care for my mom. There's so many things that as you grow up and you learn stuff, you can apply it, but no one that I and you would learned anything yet, Like yeah, it was just fuck, we still haven't. But you know, you just don't have the like emotional maturity to try and talk to somebody about that. So I felt like all of my friends ignored me. I felt like they ignored what was going on and just thought that I would be able to figure it out,
and I didn't. Like, I don't think of it. I don't have an ounce of pride in me that I handled it well. I don't think I did.
What's your relationship with those friends? Like now?
I don't really have a lot of friends from that period now, like because it was a lot of school friends that I still kind of saw and whatever. Yeah, so I think that mostly now it's like uni friends or friends that I went on to like meet working in radio or whatever, just because it was just too hard for them and it was too hard for me. Yeah, sometimes you need to, I hate to say it, start fresh, but sometimes like having attachments to different parts of your
life is not what you need. Having said that, how has grief evolved for you now? When you're hitting these like huge milestones and you have huge successes and like you said, you've written best selling books and you've got hit podcasts, what's it like experiencing that where you still grieve your mum and your loss but also you've just gotten on with it at the same time, Like I
imagine that is a very conflicting feeling. Yeah, Like I just wish I could tell her because I just know that she'd be so happy, Like I just know that she would be so so pumped for me, and I know that she would love it. And I know that every morning i'd get a text at five point thirty being like, all loved what you said about this today
on the podcast. Like, I just know that she would love it, and I know that she would love Ryan as well, you know, And there's just so many parts of my life that Yeah, like I've now got a partner who I've been with for ten years who didn't meet her, Like I've been with him for so long, and that was after she died. Like how how are those two things on the same timeline. Yeah, Like it's just so wild to me, and it just makes me
so fucking sad. Like, but I'd say that the way that I've grown with the grief, like they say that the grief doesn't get smaller, your life just kind of learns to surround it. And I think that there's probably some guilt for me associated with like having this amazing life where I laugh every day and I don't laugh all day every day, but I laugh every day, and I'm like, oh, so you don't care about your mum. And there's some times where I feel really guilty that
I have this great life when well, how dare you? Like, oh so you reckon you're so sad about your mum, But like you go and you enjoy your life. But I think that I've just learned that like my life is for me, it's not for anybody else, And it comes and goes in waves. And there's parts of my life that make me really sad because I think about my mom and I wish that she was here. And then like in the car on the way here this morning, our song played on my Spotify and I had a
boogiy because she really loved that song, you know. So I think it's also just, yeah, the waves of knowing that I'm allowed to be happy, I'm allowed to enjoy my life, and I give myself permission to enjoy my life, and I give myself permission to be sad because two things can be true at once. Yeah, do you think there is any link tenuous or not for you with your decision not to have kids to losing your mom and going through that when you were almost still a kid.
I don't actually know. I think like my mom loved being a mom, Like her biggest achievement was that she loved all of us and she looked after all of us, and like, so there's four kids in my family. I've got three siblings, and yeah, she just loved it. And I know that that was just her biggest achievement. I guess.
So there's parts of me that's like, oh, but for me, like my career is such a huge thing, Like I don't want my kids to feel like they're competing vuying for my attention for my job, you know, which like wouldn't be the case, but maybe I wouldn't be able to juggle that. I don't know. I don't really think that there's I mean, somewhere there might be a link, but I think sorry, might need to go back to therapy for that one. I probably should have last like, yeah, no,
that's a that's a tough one. Nah, But I think it is actually a really good question because they're probably somewhere. Is I also just think I love having money, and I've heard that parents don't have a lot of money.
It's kids are expensive, they are there.
What's the reaction like, because I want to say this now because I just laughed when we're talking about grief, and I don't want people take that the wrong way, but you handle grief with humor.
What's the reaction like?
Mainly when you use these I mean comedic timing surrounding talking about your mother's death normally pretty split crowd. I feel like some people just love it and I'm like, oh, you have a dead parent a they go, yeah. There was like a video that went viral not that long ago, and it sees two sisters and they're sitting at the table and they're laughing because one of them did was pregnant at their mum's funeral and like, do you remember
this video? Like we've seen it and they lose it and they're like they're laughing and they're like, so I just want to say, Mom, I'm so sorry for doing this at your funeral, but like I couldn't help it, and they're like laughing, and I was like, here's a good social experiment. I'm like reading the comments and there's all these people like, oh, you just you know your mum better? Than anybody of course, like you know what she would like and this is so funny and I like,
thanks for the laugh. Then there's people are like, this is so disrespectful and how dare you? And I just think I'm actually allowed to say it because it's my lived experience. Would I say that on behalf of anybody else, Absolutely not, But for me, that's what makes sense. And for me, I know that my mom would love it. I know that she would be laughing. I know that she would think it's so funny that she's part of my life still because I get to laugh and joke
about her. And I don't think that people understand how powerful that connection is, like getting to laugh and joke about my mum when normally, like I'm expecting, what you're telling me is you can only talk about that if you're sad, Like the only the associated feeling with your grief should be sadness and embarrassment and like wanting to hide yourself away and like feel ashamed. I'm not ashamed to have grief. I'm not ashamed to like want to
laugh about something that happened to me. It's my experience. I can do what I want with it. You know I'm not hurting anybody.
We had a similar experience recently and I'm going to laugh saying the story again, but fuck it didn't go to plan. My grandparents were like real parental figures for me, Like I grew up with my grandparents, I live with them, and we've waited to scatter my grandparents' ashes together. They were married for sixty seven years and Nan passed away. Yeah, it was really sweet, but scattering ashes is not sweet. And the plume of dust that covered everyone that was there was not.
Sweet when it shouldn't have gone.
Down my top and there's all these people that look at like it was just it was like a comedy show. It was like something that you would expect to be on, like a black comedy. It was not funny, and it was so funny at the same time. And I had this real moment where we were telling the story in the podcast and I was like, Fuck, someone's going to be offended. Someone is going to be offended because this wasn't their version of scattering their loved ones ashes.
And also because we leant in.
And we laughed and we made jokes, and I was like, and you know, like for us, yes, it should have been a very reverend day, but everyone was laughing. And it's because I know Papa wouldn't have given a shit. He would have been like, Haha, that one's for you. I know you can take that, Laura. When I was like covered from head to toe and ash.
He was down her pants, it was everywhere.
But yeah, grief is complex, and like there's moments where it flows you, and then there's moments where you do find the funny in it, and it's not the funny in the grief, but it's just the funny and the absolute absurdity of how extreme.
The emotions are.
Totally and I think that anyone who's experienced it will absolutely be able to understand that part of it.
I would love to know.
And I mean, you know, we touched on a little bit around the successes and also like how life takes a different path and then it continues and you have these things that happen after the person you love passes away, but one of those things being your partner of ten years. How did you guys meet and you know, how do you find a man who's willing to come and pick up your shit on a Monday?
You don't really matter to pick up your ship.
He would.
That wouldn't never, Ben would? He would? He would. Ben would hold the bag for me while I shat in it. Yeah, I reckon like he'd hold it out. He might. Actually, I'm going to ask him once his podcast.
Test him.
That's healthy, test him. Yeah, give him the situation. What would would you a no, hypothetically, babe, hypothetically? Yeah, listen to today's episode and let me know what you would do. We met at UNI actually not very original, but like very casual and normal. I guess. We were studying sound engineering together and he was like a year below me, so we kind of worked on a couple of like projects together and whatever, and he like lived on my
way home. We would be in the theater till you know, like eleven or twelve o'clock, and I'd be like, oh, well, what are you going to do? Catch the bas like, oh, I'll drop you off. And we kind of just like got to know each other and it was a really just easy person to talk to. And at that time, like my mum was alive, but she was really sick, and so we kind of talked. I remember like vividly this one conversation being like, oh, no, I'm so mysterious.
And he's like, you are the least mysterious person like I've ever met in my life. And I was like, nah, like you don't know me, you know, like I'm just a snotty, like nineteen year old and he's just like, nah, I know that, like your mum's about to die and that you're probably gonna leave UNI. And I was just like, okay, cool, so you have been listening to what I was saying. And then yeah, like she passed away and I left UNI and then I rejoined and I ended up being
in his year, so I got dropped down. I had to do second year again kind of thing anyway, and yeah, so we just kept dropping him home and you know, like all of these things, we just got to know each other really well, and we had so much in common. But there was also so much that he knew about that I didn't know about. And it was like the
exact relationship I needed. And I don't mean romantic relationship necessarily, but he was the person that I needed in that time, Like he was just really caring and willing to listen and like funny and wouldn't let me wallow in my bullshit, but also let me wallow my bullshit when I needed to.
I think it's really important to have people that really know what you need and can assess the situation and not just like write things off like it's not like, oh, well last week he cried and I did this, so this is what I'm going to do again. He's a really thoughtful, really caring person, and I think I just
really needed someone that could hear me out. And yeah, and then we actually just like started sleeping together, and we was sleeping together for like nine months to a year or something, and then I was like, I actually really like you, will you go out with me? And he was like okay. And it was the most awkward thing because then I was like, cool, I've got to go to my shift at Colt's like with a boyfriendly, Like I've got to get to the Delian. So I asked this boy out and then I'm like cool, bye,
like I've got to go shave some ham. Ah good, you knew him when your mom was still here, but you went romantic until after she'd gone. So was there a part of you that did she ever know about him as a friend? Like? Ah, right, because he was just one of the boys I went to UNI with and there was like two girls in our course, so there was it was mostly boys. So it wasn't like, oh, there's a boy in Uni. It was just like yeah, like all the guys, you know, Like it was just
it was nothing. So nah, she didn't know about him, which is it's it's shame, Like I'm really sad she didn't get to meet him, because I think that they would get along really well. Tobes has got like a really dry sense of humor, and so does my mom, So I think that they would have You know, when you hear about those couples where the boyfriend is on her mom's side, they would gang up against me. I think, yeah.
And then what is next for you? Because I feel like you've ticked so many boxes and kicked so many goals, Like where do you dream of going individually? Because personally I see you on like a comedy circuit, that's what I see. I think you're so funny and you're so brilliant. But where do you see yourself individually? And Tony in right, I don't know. I just really want to be happy. I just really want to keep doing things that make
me happy. And I think rather than try and come up with what that might look like, I think that in this kind of job, you can't really ever predict it, Like things just come up and you have to say yes or no. And I actually, like a few years ago, wrote down this list of non negotiables, which I really fucking recommend if you have never ever sat down and being really honest with yourself about non negotiables for your life,
I recommend it. Five things that, like, before you die, you know that you need to do, rather than a bucket list of like I'd love to get these things done. Five things that you will not leave this earth without achieving.
What were your non negotiables?
One of them was being on a billboard, which I did.
Fucking that is so good, And I will not leave this earth unless I'm on a billboard.
It's so funny because I've been pushing for a billboard, Laura to Laura, I mean, the thing about a billboard is that the billboard doesn't do anything, but how good's the photo of you in front of the billboard?
You know?
That was one of them. And actually the last thing that I have to tick off or excuse me aside from living overseas. That's one of my non negotiables. The last thing that I'm going to kick off actually this year is hosting family Christmas in my own house. Oh nice, you're so cute. I love you. So we are Toms and I. We're hosting Christmas at our house. My sister and her husband and their boys are coming. We're cooking,
we're doing everything, and I am so thrilled. And I think that the most exciting part about that is that It's been a really, really really long time since I've had a goal that wasn't work related. Yeah.
It's really amazing, isn't it.
And it's so easy to have work related goals and not have those like family moments.
Because they just feel so tangible, like a work thing you're working at it every day, whereas I think I've just like left myself behind a little bit. And so I'm really really excited to do that. Yeah. Like I'm just I'm fucking pumped. Where do you want to live overseas? Oh? I don't care, just that experience. Yeah, I just want to know that I've done it. Ryan and I actually at the moment are very obsessed with like TikTok BALI
real estate. Like I don't know if you guys get those videos in your algorithm twenty five dollars, yes, and so it's like this amazing villa and it's like live here for six dollars a day and you go, oh okay, Like so we're really obsessed with that at the moment. So maybe BALI, I don't know. I don't really care as long as it's somewhere that my French bulldog can come. And that's basically my only requirement.
And you've got two more are the other two bucket list things.
So I had also one of them was to actually just be famous. I didn't really know what that looks like. I love that you said that because people feel like they can't say that. People feel like if they say out loud, I want to be famous, especially in Australia, in the Australian landscape, we hate feeling like anyone takes ownership of what they want, especially something that is about being famous. But I love that you just like I want that. I want people to know who I am for whatever I do.
Well, I think it's the being famous for what it's like, the having the what you know, like, do you want to be famous because you were that girl who shut on the street. You made it to the news, Like, or do you want to be famous for the thing that you're proud of?
Like, there's different types of fame, and.
I think that's something that I unpacked as I kind of got a bit older, and that it wasn't really the fame part of it, but it was the fame was like the avenue of doing a job that I loved, because you know, you can't like be a singer or be a dancer or be a comedian or whatever if there's no audience like that just then is a hobby and not like your full time job, Like that can't be your full time job if there aren't people watching
you and paying to see you or whatever. So I think that the fame was just the easiest way to be like, well, if I'm famous, it means that I'm doing something.
That I love and I'm good at it.
Yeah, exactly, and I'm probably doing like a very non traditional job, you know. So that's what it looks like for me in the end, was that it meant that I could, yeah do a job that I was really good at and that I loved, and that made me really happy where you've ticked that off because people know your name. Spotify knows your name. It's astronomical, it's acually real.
Tony is such a joy and we love I mean where it was a long time coming, like we said, a year of waiting to get you on the podcast. We absolutely adore you and everything that you guys have achieved. We love the podcast like Tony and Ryan. If you haven't got to listen to it yet, go give it a listen, but also get around to everything else that Tony does, because you are genuinely just one of the most and I hate the word authentic, but that is
exactly what you are. You're one of the most authentic people. And yeah, you're a joy to speak to.
We heard on the podcast the other day that you guys took some I shouldn't say took some. You use some content from the lifelun Cut discussion group and you're having a little laugh about it. We absolutely love hearing that. I love to know that you guys, especially Ryan's lurking in our Facebook discussion group. I know I get tagged in stuff sometimes and I have a little nosy of whatever people have tagged me, and I love it.
Wait, what have you been tagged in?
People just tag me in random stuff. I think that there's like a bit of a thrill in being like she's in this group because I'm also in this Oh my god, this is hell dark, but I think you'll like it. I'm also in this like dead mum discussion group, and I get tagged in stuff all the time. People are like, oh my god, you know that girl who's got a dead mum, she's in here, and then just like tag me, like tag Tony.
That's awful.
It's awful, but it's wholesome too.
You know, you found your group.
It is really lovely and the connection, as we were saying, like it just really beats everything else that I thought, you know, like you go, oh my god, it would be so great to get to do all this stuff, and then you go, wow, there's actually all this other stuff that is so amazing about this kind of job, and like reaching people that you just never could have dreamed would ever hear what you had to say in the best way.
It's so true. We absolutely agree.
You're an angel. Thanks Lendon. I love you guys. Thank you for having me.
Thanks Tony, I thank you.
There were four bays stoking