None of us know when a child goes to any school anyway, any of us who you're going to meet in any classroom, let alone in the whole school. It's a bit of a raffle. And in this raffle, you drew the joker you didn't draw.
I try to say to him, and I say it over and over again. Every person's car, you steal, every house you go into, you're hurting someone like it. You're not physically hurting them. And I don't believe he would physically hurt anyone. But you're hurting them, You're giving them trauma.
I'm Andrew Rule. This is Life and Crimes Today. In the studio, we have a lady that I don't know, but I spoke to her at length just yesterday. And I did that because a friend of mine met her husband recently. He's a hard worker, he's got a good business.
They have a teenage boy, so he's only a schoolboy who's never had a shave theoretically, and yet they find themselves as the parents of the youngest boy that they now see in the last twelve months as someone who's sort of on the road to being a young criminal. They are devastated by his actions, he has essentially run away from home. He's joined a gang of lunatic carthieves and burglars, as they say, and he and others they
use drugs. That's sort of part of their motivation. They are addicted not only to drugs in this instance's ice, but also to the adrenaline surge of crime. Welcome to our podcast. It is so kind of you to come and talk to us. And I was so impressed with the rundown that you gave me about how your life, your family life has devolved from a very good place two years ago to something that's really quite desperate for you now.
Yeah, thank you, Andrew. Yeah, it's all been a bit of a whirlwind twelve months for us. Never a million years expected my child would be doing these type of things.
Tell us about yourself just briefly.
You I'm a married obviously to my husband. I have my own business. My husband's got his own business in a lovely house, and we're go on holidays every year and we're a very solid unit family.
Right and until you know, last summer we're saying last summer with me, Yeah we are. Then, Yeah, it was all pretty good.
It was excellent we were overseas, just prior to all of this kind of exploding.
All together all together. How was she? Youngest spoke We can't name him here, of course, and we won't, but you're youngest fellow, the kid, the boy, the lad. What was he like there on that trip away? Great?
Was his normal self like? He was out for dinner with us, We were doing all the touristy things. There was no signs of any kind of of this kind of behavior. Anyway. It had a bit of a rough time time at school, and he didn't love school, which you know a lot of kids at the moment don't. So we had moved in schools.
When did he move.
He moved last year. We moved him onto the new school and he was seemed to be settling in quite well. They had some good programs available for him. The school were brilliant, and he unfortunately started meeting some new kids at that school that just little things started. He would go out to see a friend and he wouldn't be there, and he'd be elsewhere elsewhere.
Yeah, I'm but he's really down the street.
And a couple of times we picked him up at odd places and he would ring us to pick him up and he was in the middle of kind of national park type things, and we were kind of like, you know, what is going on? And then that kind of developed into he left the home under pretty extreme circumstances. There was lots of arguing and tears and fighting and trying for us, trying to keep him there.
And what was his excuse for leaving home. I'm leaving home because.
He wanted to see his friends. And I was effectively saying, you're not seeing some of these friends anymore. So he was hellbent that he.
Was one friend in particular at the new school. Now, none of us know when a child goes to any school anyway, any of us are you're going to meet in any classroom, let alone in the whole school. And that applies to the pupils and bloes to teacher. Yes, you know, one bad teacher, one good teacher.
That's right.
It's a bit of a raffle. And in this raffle you drew. You know, you drew the joker. You didn't draw because he fell in with one particular buck. You think that was a bad influence, Yeah, a stronger personality, Yeah, I.
Think what do you think this boy had been already kind of into this scheme of things, and probably then it was just starting with some drugs and some maybe shop thefts type behavior that I think he met him and then very quickly met his friends, and so it escalated very quickly with a small group of them at the time, and that group just grew.
When you met that boy, the scallywag boy, and he came to your house, yes, and you been the friendly, positive person that you obviously are. You were welcoming. At the back of your brain, you thought, I'm not really love kid, yeah, but you know, he's my son's friend. I'll be nice to him. You also met that boy's mother.
Yeah, I did. And when I met his mother when he came to my home, I thought, oh, I'm not really sure, but I was like benefit of the day out, you know, my son's friend. And then one night, while I was actually searching for my son, I met his the friend's mum, and she warned me and said, you know, it's probably best that you keep your son away from my son. My son's not in a good place at the moment, right And I just as mums do you know to her back and reassured her that now I'm
sure you know, they're just boys. You know, they'll be okay, they'll be okay, and now at.
Stuff, all that good stuff.
If we say yeah, looking back, I think, oh wow, maybe I should have listened a little bit more. But you know, trying to keep him away from this group then was just impossible. He was so drawn to them.
That is a very good point, and it's something I've discussed with other people, you know, at my place of work here at the Herald Sun and a colleague of ours who's got teenage boys. He said, it's all very well, people saying, you know what, what are the parents doing? Why aren't that at home? He said, If a fifteen year old fifteen sixteen wants to just head off and go somewhere and they're willing to defy you, what do you do? Do you handcut them? He said? It's not actually that much you can do.
There isn't Physically, Yeah.
Once you've lost the sort of mental it's like controlling you know, a horse that weighs a ton or a or a rott while a dog. Once you've lost control, you've lost control. You can't actually force them physically.
No, And even at the time when he was away from the home, and I think he'd been away maybe just a week at that time, and I was, you know, all night looking for my husband and I would be out all hours of the night looking for him, my older children driving around, will just search for him. And when I got him back this particular day, I had said to the because obviously the police were aware that he was missing. As such, I said to the police, I'm going to lock his door, like I'm going to
lock him in his room. And they said, you can't lock him in his room, and if you do, and if he has a way of contacting someone, you will be the one in charge because you're ultimately locking him in there. So I'm like, what else am I supposed to do? So he came home this one night after we picked him up from the police with a allegedly stolen vehicle, and he was just a different kid.
He was.
The next morning, I woke him up and said, you know, get up, you're not sleeping all day just because you've been out all night. And it just turned really really crazy after that, and I took his phone from him and he got really really agitated about that, and you broke it, I did.
I broke head mind you say you would have paid for the fat phone.
It was my phone to break, and I did because I was just so distressed, and all he wanted was the phone because obviously that was his contact. Once that happened, he just completely escalated and was screaming and yelling, making threats of to kill us, making threats of violence in the home. We called my eldest son home to try and have a bit of help from him, perhaps as you know, the cool big brother like you know, and he was going at him and my son couldn't do
anything to help us either. And anyway, it was I remember the day. It was about forty degrees that day, and he left in track sit pants and a jumper and he ran up my drive and jumped out gate and he just ran. So obviously the police and all the rest of it were involved in and about two hours later, his school at the time rang me and said we've got him here and he's in a really bad way. He's really hot, and I said it was
because he's run from home. But then he took off from there as soon as he got word that I knew, and then it just started. It just started escalating and he was not coming home at all, we did. He was just sleeping at friends' houses on couches here, there and everywhere. Then when he was spoken to by the police, at some point he had reported that his mum had snapped his phone in half. So the next call I get is from child protection.
Which did he tell people at school or was it the police?
I think you tell people at school and then obviously the police as well, which you know, the police are almost a bit like, well, it was your phone anyway. But when he told the school and then it got reported that to child protection.
Took it on themselves to report a snapped phone to child protection.
I'm not one hundred percent sure we can.
Turn up with two black eyes.
No, never, No, that's right.
It turned up. Yeah, mum broke the phone that she paid for.
Yeah, that's right. So once child Protection were involved, you know, because I was quite shocked that they were involved totally with it all, and I was kind of a bit confused about the whole thing. And that was their explanation was because that's seen as a form of abuse, that I've broken his phone, even though it was my phone. So they got involved, and of course then they wanted
to investigate me and my husband. So they came around and they talked to him about how is it so bad living here and all the rest of it, and of course he was just like, no, everything's fine. Like so we've constantly, unfortunately, have to deal with them, which is, you know, for this whole time that they've been involved.
They've because my oin goal in this is to have him home with us at one point, and they have promised me the whole time, for twelve months they'll organize remunification counseling, all the all the good sounding things have been offered to me, but not one thing has ever been followed through. Up until this day, I still don't have any sort of contact with family counseling relationships Australia,
nothing from Trump Protection's point of view. But yet they take me to court once a month and try and get me to sign my rights over to make him a Yeah, water the state, the state, which I will never do, which I will never ever do.
Surprise. So really, the state, in all its wisdom, that's all it's done for. He is trying. He's basically trying monster you.
Yeah, oh absolutely, the.
State, like everybody else, finds it very hard to deal with the problem of hurting cats. That is, yes, boys like this, Yes, too hard. So let's go, let's go around, knock on mum store. You know who she is. That's right, and we'll.
Have and the you know, through the whole process. As after that time, he just slowly but surely escalated crime after crime after slowly. Well no it's not. It wasn't really that slow. No, but there was just constant court dates. Court dates are coming up. He wasn't showing up to court.
Now, tell us what life he's leading it this date. So by the middle of last year, he's basically CouchSurfing around the place. God knows where, squat's anything you don't know where, yep. And some relatively unsavory you imagine, yes, and with unsavory people, some of whom are selling drugs to these kids, and of course the kids in the end, they might get some drugs free here or there. Yeah, but it's not going to continue. They're going to have to pay their way. And how do they do that.
Well, as far as I know, from what I've read between the lines and seen, it's a lot of the stealing of the cars or property, anything anything they can sell on. So there might be PlayStations or phones, or often they'll get credit cards, but the cars the probably the biggest problem.
The biggest problem. So they break into house is to get the keys essentially yep, and then they steal the cars. And then where do most of these Now? I know they like doing them and speeding, but there is an end thing for what happens to them.
They end up they end up leaving them at a point where they've organized with someone else, and then that person, that next person they'll leave the keys wherever, and that next person will then take the car on. So whether they get paid very very minimal, if any money at all, it's very rarely money they get paid for it, They usually get paid in drugs, get paid in drugs. Then
those people take the car on. So the problem is when he gets arrested for a car and he says, I'm going to I'm going to plead guilty, and I'm going to say it was me. They know it was me. All the rest of it is what he says to me. When his lawyer gets hold of him, he says, no, you need to do no comment because those cars potentially could have been stolen weeks before and they're the fourth or fifth or sixth person to have that car handed
onto them. So effectively, if he pleads guilty to that car, he could go down for all the previous God knows what it's been doing in the past.
So you say he could be picking.
Up a stolen yes, yeah, yeah, I didn't realize that. Yes, so they rotate them around kind of yeah.
But so a delivery mechanism.
Yeah, almost, Yes, he doesn't. I don't feel like he often rotates them around too often. He seems to do the break He goes for the breakings and the cars. But I've been told on several times he you know, in one night, he might get six or.
Seven cars and deliver them here or there.
Keep them for a while and drive them, drive them around, and they drive them around like they're their own cars.
Yeah, he learned to drive very young.
He had never driven a car until NI started doing this. But it took him a little while, from what I hear, to work his way up the rungs a bit. And at the start you can't drive, apparently, and then eventually you're allowed to be a driver. So he's now a driver.
So sometimes this is the sort of theft ladder.
Yes, yeah, so now he can drive them. Often he'll have other people steal them and then he'll drive them. So it's kind of a way. Yet they have to almost work their way up to be a driver.
Right, and he'll drive them and flop them somewhere. Now when we see you know, gangland hits, Gangland arsons, et cetera. They're always driving fast cast good cars like the hit the other day of the kickboxer abdul Rahim. It was a portion mccarna. I think a car probably worth north of one hundred thousand dollars. And this is sort of standard fair you know, good out. He's good beamers. They're very road where they go fast, they go on well, and they're the sort of thing that can maybe get
away from the police or at least have a chance. Yes, and then they torch them. But all those cars come from somewhere, and I'm here to suggest that they come from kids like yours.
More than likely he only steals luxury cars. He's not I know, there's kind of seems to be at the moment another sort of group doing commodorees. He'll only steal luxury cars and good cars, and he'll openly admit that he just loves fast cars. He loves good sounding cars. You know, he's quite picky unfortunately in his cars, which then brings him to areas where he steals those cars from. Obviously well heilled areas. Yeah, good area.
And to do this, they need to get into the houses to get the keys by luche unless he hasn't got some else why electronic stuff, So it's just get key, get cars.
Goes into the house monkey. Yes, that's right, as far as I'm aware. He goes into the houses. Often there'll be a door left open that they will check.
There's a tip there.
Lock your doors, He'll y, They'll check for doors. They'll often find a door open, they'll go through. They'll pretty much just focus on getting the keys. They'll get as many keys as they can, and then they kind of come out to the street and they just start buzzing cars until they find which one matches. It's the same with if they go into a gym, they'll often get the gym keys. People's lockers.
Yeah, these lockers are locked.
No, a lot of the gyms have open lockers, so you just pop your drink bottle and your keys on them, and then you go and do your workout. So they come in. They've got a lot of the group have swipers for every gym that they've stolen along the way, so they can swipe into a gym, or they sneak in behind somebody. They'll take the keys and they'll again go out to the car park. They'll buzz the keys until they find the right car and off they go.
Yeah, okay, so he did a feb of that the gym thing would be at least avoid confrontation with Yes, with householders.
Yes, he's done quite a lot of gyms. He went through a bit of a spat of the aggravated birds in houses. Then he went to gym's and he did them for quite a while. And when he was reminded once after the gym episode, you know, I spoke to his lawyer and we both kind of said, not that there's a there's not a good outcome to any of this, but if anything, we were preferring him do the gyms because people weren't yeah, having they weren't having trauma from being in their home.
You're not getting the confrontation, that's right, which is very badly one way or the other.
Yes, that's exactly right.
Do you think your son went armed?
He says not, But he says not. There was an aggravated berg and car theft of a very expensive car in Williamstown area. He drove that car around. That car was I'm going to say, from what I remember, about one hundred and twenty thousand dollar car. He stole some other personal property from that house which was of very
high value. He drove that car around. That story made the news, and when I saw the news, it was said that they were armed with machetes, and I lost my mind because he's never ever been armed with a machete before. But the group he was with did have machetes. My son always says to me, I would never hurt anyone, Mum, I would never hurt anyone. You know, I would never hurt anyone. But I tried to say to him, and
I say it over and over again. Every person's car, you steal, every house you go into, you're hurting someone like you're not physically hurting them. And I don't believe he would physically hurt anyone, But you're hurting them, you're giving them trauma.
So he once in a week moment stole a little cheap car Okaia and he told you about this? How did that come about? Yeah? How come he was talking to you about it?
Well, I followed quite a lot of these pages on Facebook and things, and you know, you don't think you'll ever follow these pages, But now I'm on every stolen car's page there is, and when I see them kind of local or in areas, I think that maybe he might be I kind of follow it up. And then I was notified by the police that he was seen in this particular car. So then I piece all the pieces together of the Facebook posts and him and I just ring him now and I'll say where are you?
What are you doing that it are? And this particular night, he was pretty rattled and he wanted to get rid of this car because he knew that it was hot with the police. The police are onto him. The police have been in contact with me and my oldest son as well, and seeing if we knew where he was. And I said to him, just he was quite frantic and obviously under the influence of drugs, and he said, I need to get rid of a mom I need
to get rid of it. And I said, mate, just pull it over where you are leave the keys in it, close the door and walk away, just walk away. And he said, no, I need to not too hot, and I need to get rid of it. I'm going to torch it. And I said, no, you're not. You're not going to touch it. He's never torched a car before, and I said, no, you're not. I said, because that person's car has a chance of getting their car back in one piece if you just walk away. If you
torch that, you're destroying someone's car. So I try to try to help him do that. He eventually that day got arrested in that car.
Anyway, So when did he first get detention and what was your feelings about that he got locked up at some point? Yeah, he did.
It was a few months of me kind of I was almost begging. I was. I was begging the police please please help him, and prosecutors, and he was in court and we're fortunately got to.
You're begging for him to get it get out. You're begging for him.
To go in, yes, because when he's in, I know he's safe and I know where he is. So back in those early days, it was I wanted him in to stop him doing this crime and stop taking people's cars and for him to have consequence, you know, because there was just no consequences to anything he was doing. And finally he did get remanded for a two week stint, and I was just devastated. I cried and cried and cried. I couldn't believe he was, you know, after all of this,
that he was actually going to go in. Unfortunately, when they go in, half of their friends are in there, so it's not really a bad place in their eyes. Yeah, it's kind of they catch up with everyone. And the magistrate we had the first time he was put in, and obviously she knew. I was quite relieved. She said to me, Unfortunately, it's one of the worst places for them to be, which it is. I agree with that,
she said. And for every person they meet in Romand is potentially another twenty new crimes on the outside when they all get back together. Cathy's Yeah, when I went, I went to visit him the first time he was
in there, and in Parkville. Yeah, in Parkville, and I was sitting in the waiting area, and you know, I had to have ID and all these crazy tests and eye scans and all the rest of it done, And I was sitting there and I must have looked like a deer in headlights because I just couldn't believe what my life had come to. And there was another mum there and she's just leant over and she said, I
was it your first time here? And I was kind of like yeah, and she was like, oh, it won't be your last, and I thought, yes, it will, it will be. He's not coming back here. He's going to you know, he's going to do the right thing. Now where on our he's on his sixth time in there.
At that time in there? Now, how long is he serving? This time? He's on Remand because he rammed a police.
Com he did he was charged on Monday with four counts of aggravated berg, four counts of theft of motor vehicle. And I can't ever remember the way they say it, but it was endangering emergency service person's car life, right.
Okay, So they'll take a pretty dim view of that, the police will. But what the magistrates said and lawyers say, of course, there has some validity that you go inside and it's a big petri dish of commonality and turns bad kids, naughty kids into baggs, and bad kids become crooks, etc. However, the flip side of that is for you is that while they're outside doing things, they're risking other people's lives
and their own lives. Absolutely, and you as a mother and as a parent, thinking, well, it's not great in there, but he's not doing drugs inside. But I know he always comes out looking better than he went in. Yes, and he's eating three squares a day, he's doing some school work and going into a gym arrangement and doing some exercise. He actually comes out a bit better than
he went in, which is often away with jail. See people come out of jail, they're clean and shiny, and that's right, well muscled up, and after six months outside they're not.
They're back to it. And that's my you know. While I think any parent would want to say they want their child in there, but I want him in there to stop him endangering or hurting anyone in the community. I would never live with myself if someone got hurt by him, or also if he ends up killing himself in as one of these high speed chasers. So lightly he went in. Now that the drug use has escalated so much, he went in. He did a stint for three months.
He missed his own birthday. Yes, he missed your birthday.
His miss Mother's day, Father's Day. And when he went in he weighed thirty five kilos, thirty five kilos, thirty five Yeah, he was so the suitcases. Yeah, he was so unwell looking. And when he came out, he weighed I think he ended up weighing about fifty eight sixty heroes and kidding. He just was like a different kid. He was He looked healthy, he had color in his skin, he'd been swimming, he'd been to the gym. He goes to school when he's in there, he goes to school
and attends classes. And so he's then has been out for two weeks since coming out from this three months day, he's been out two weeks. So he came out at about sixty kilos. And when I saw him, I obviously haven't seen him much in those two weeks because he's out and about. When I saw him at the police on Monday, he's back down to about I want to say, probably forty maybe forty two kilos.
When was it the yacht you to take a picture and show him that he could see himself.
Yeah, I walked into the police station on Monday and he said. I said to him, oh my, I just instantly saw him and he always gives me a heart and a kiss and love your mum. And I said, oh, mate, look at you. You look terrible. You look awful. And he said, oh, can you show me on your phone? And I showed him. I always hold my phone because I'm never sure if he's going to try and ring
someone or message someone. And I showed him the camera on my phone and he was like oh, and he kind of was turning his head back and forth and he goes, oh, yeah, I look like a bit of a junkie. That's what Ice does. And I was like realized, Yeah, he's realizing others do. Yeah. And I've taken photos of him each time he's been remanded, and so I can keep an eye on kind of track the changes in him. And yeah, sometimes he's just skin and bone.
That's a visual thing that might be useful at some point. Look at this, that's right now, you said Williamstown. But he's gone a long way in the other direction too. He has Do you get a phone call from South Gippsland.
Yes, I did. I got a call from one Faggy police, and when I answered it, he said whatever his name was, and from one Faggy police and I said pardon and he said, oh sorry. I said no, no, I heard what you said, but one faggy police and he said, oh, yeah, we've got a phone here we believe might be your son's. Do you know what the picture it might be? And I told him what the picture was and he said, oh, that's the phone we have. He's been involved in an
aggravated burg and theftomotor vehicle down here. I just couldn't believe it. I was just like what and that particular one he when I had contacted him a couple of days later, my son he had told me about he sore wrist and I said, what happened to your wrist?
You know?
He was messaging me about it. He had jumped off the second like the double story little veranda out the front of a double story house onto the ground because the people in the home woke up to find them in the house. So he jumped, dropped his phone and also left his shoes behind because they'd fallen off on the jump. So the police also had all of those belongings which tied him to it.
Tied him to it, so he's not a master criminal.
No, no, I say to him often, you're the dumbest criminal.
I know.
Yes, yeah, absolutely.
And what do you think about that? Not thinking?
Not?
You think?
No, he does. He's not old enough to think. He's too he's too young. And I constantly try. You know, it's like talking to a brick wall, though, and sometimes I've had to change my approach of how I talk to him about things. And you know, I say to him, I know you're not thinking about now, but I'm thinking about when you're twenty five and twenty six and an adult and you're doing all of these things now, but it's just setting you up for jobs and everything.
Like he went well for a start. When he wants to get a head ticket one day and go to America, that's right. I won't be able to go, that's right.
He's not good to leave the state now, that'll be that.
Yeah. You know, I have a relative who did silly stuff when he was very young and he's now very middle aged and respectable. Yeah, but can he go with his American wife to America? He can't know because of one stupid thing.
That's right, and they just don't think of that now five or something, And you know, I feel like I'm I'm constantly trying to get my story heard, and I'm trying to talk to people, and I speak to anyone that will listen. I don't think there's one person of Parliament that hasn't got an email from me about everything. And I just because I'm just one, I'm just one of the parents of these kids. There are so many kids doing this.
Looking for probably hundreds of mothers and hundreds.
Because there's so many that this is happening too. And sadly, during this whole journey, I have met two mums in particular that are so so similar to me, and they just don't know what to do anymore, and their kids are doing the same thing, and we're just at a loss. You know, there are lots of parents out there that enable a lot of this behavior and allow a lot of it. But the parents that don't want it to happen and are trying to stop it, there's just.
Help sweat up in it. Yeah, yeah, I mean, and it's very hard to make generalizations. Yes, yeah, you and your husband and model citizens, I presume the rest of the family. Yes, yeah, sort of rack bag kid. Among his friends, there are other kids like himself. Yes, yes, you've told me about one that's right, whose parents you think are much like yourself. Yes, and they're pulling their hair out. Where do we go?
Right?
What's going on?
And just don't know what to do?
Yeah.
So it's not as if you know, they're all being produced by they're not being abused and I brought up in very poor dire circumstances and all the rest of it. Yes, that's not true of all.
Of them, that's right. And my son's aware of that too. He knows, he knows the good families and the bad families. And I think I said to you yesterday, I asked him about one of his friends, and I said, you know, are his parents? Are his parents good people? And it was really nice to hear my son say to me, yeah, Mom, his parents are just like you and dad. They're really
good people. That's when I reached out to this particular family and I met with her and she was she was just like me, And it was just like listening to my own story. And it's kind of strangely weird that you take a bit of comfort in knowing that there's another family or too in particular that I know of that are going through the same thing.
Ye're not a freak.
Yeah, we're not just this random kid that's gone off the rails.
No, it's a shed thing to some extent. You're in here today talking to maybe one hundred thousand people something like that, and you're telling them what it's really like from where you sit stand. You've got a message for them, or for the politicians, for these senior police. Yeah, what are your thoughts?
Like I've always said with anyone I talked to, the police are just amazing. They're so supportive of me. They helped me incredibly, and we're engaged now with a crime reduction team and the two people that run that are just always checking in on me. And it might even just be checking on me. It's not anything to do with him. It's just checking in if I'm okay.
That's good.
And I've got some local members of parliament that helped me out and keep in contact and talk to me. And I met with Peter Dutton two weeks ago and told him the story, and I just you know, it's easy to sit and watch the news, and I was watching the news and I was seeing these kids, and I'm like, where are their parents? They're just bloody braw, you know, I said. But now I'm living this, it's so easy to say, where are the parents? Because we were those parents that we made sure he was safe
at home. He was you know, he had a good life, he had a great upbringing. But where those parents that we don't know now where he is and we've got no control over it. And it's just I just want to try and make it seem that it's not always. They're not always coming from neglectful for homes or neglectful families or bad parenting. Sometimes they're really good kids. And deep down he is a good kid. And I hope and I pray daily that he will turn around and
he will come back. And all of my friends and family say he'll come back, don't worry, you know, you've got this. He'll come back. But it's hard to see that at the time. It's hard to see anywhere past. You know, I'm already now stressing about the next two weeks, like what's going to happen in two weeks time?
Yes, first of all, he has to survive.
Yes that's right. Then, Yes, that's it exactly and I just feel like every time he's released from from a prison stay, there's nothing set up for him. Like Crime Reduction Team was saying to me yesterday when I was talking to them, almost he's being set up for failure because there's not enough in place for when he comes out. If they don't bail him on bail conditions, which he doesn't abide by anyway, if there's nothing in place for him,
he just goes back to doing what he's doing. So I really need things in place for him when he's released, whether that be a rehabilitation program he's admitted now to having an addiction to ice, a rehabilitation program or something that he has to go to every single day and check in and say here I am, and do the test, do a test, et something, you know something.
You've got to stick to it, yim.
Because that's the problem. There's no consequences for these kids. You see it on the news every night, six arrested, but five arrested already on bail released.
You know, it's just in your view, would be better to use facilities and lock them up, even though it's an imperfect solution. Yes, it's better than just running them back onto the stop.
Absolutely, I would prefer him going into some sort of program where he was you know, there's some places I think in New South Wales. I haven't been out to find one in Melbourne, but kind of like a boot camp, you know, where they've got to get up and they've got to work. But there's nothing here that is available for him to do that. And if I considered the New South Wales one, but I have to have a residence there to be able to happen. There.
There's an opening for someone.
There is, that's right. Absolutely, the I think it's such a long prison is sitting empty.
There is a prison down there's an opening for sort of some very tough ex military guys, yes, running.
Yeah, and just maybe to have more of that rehabilitation side of things. Yeah, that's what I'm hoping for.
Well, that is so kind of you to share that. What is a very grievous story from you to tell you, being very frank, very fair and very friendly, you're not really blaming anyone except no in a sense. In a sense you're blaming your son and others around him.
Yeah.
But as you said, if kids of their own age were put together so they're not in with older, more hardened people that that would be preferable, had them off the street, like a sort of a tough boarding school with a lock on the door.
Yes, that's right, exactly, something like that, that we're just and just having some services available to them in there. Often he'll sit there if there's no school, or if he goes in on at school holidays there's no school, so he often just spends his day playing a PlayStation or watching TV, you know, instead of I would prefer him having maybe some mental health help, some psychology, maybe some counseling things like that, some drug and alcohol rehabilitation.
But a lot of that's not offered in there at the moment, and they're quite understaffed as well, apparently, so it's hard for them, which I get.
So yeah, tricky, yeah it is. But you don't see him as somebody who's got a mental illness. No, really, he does silly things and self destructive things, but you see him as someone who's addicted not only to the drugs he takes, but to the adrenaline.
Yes, he's addicted to crime, I think, yes, Yeah, he's addicted to the thrill and he so.
If he were parachuting or you know, doing wild extreme sports. Yeah, that might fill the gap.
Yes, I said to him last time he got out, I said, do you want to go? What do you want to do? Mate? Like, I'll take you somewhere. Do you want to go in a I said, I'll take you to Phillip Parlam. We'll raced around the with the those fast cardsitars or whatever. He was like, oh no, because I like driving. And I was like, okay, well, what if I said, jump out of a plane every day? I'll pay for you to jump out of a plane
every single day. And so we ended up deciding we'd go to Gunby World because there was roller coasters and things like that, and I thought, great, I'll chuck him on a roller coaster all day. And we had planned it all and I was going to hate one of his friends with him. And when I got there, when I got to the day, I couldn't find where he was. He was out and about, more than likely in a stolen car, and so I didn't we didn't get to take him there, right, Yeah.
You can try, that's right, yep. And you're still trying.
Still trying, and I'll have to give up.
Well well done you. And he's so kind of you to come and talk to us. Thank you, and we hope that he sends happily and that it ends happily for a lot of other people. Yes, and also that it draws attention to what is a growing problem everybody. I was talking to my own wife an hour and a half ago, and guess what is when a home invasion in X Street?
Yeah, that's right.
It's everywhere a few meters from where we live.
Every day.
You hear about it in every postcard.
And they do it in broad daylight now too sometimes, so it's terrifying.
It is. Thank you so much, Thank you for having me, Thanks for listening.
Life and Crimes is a Sunday Herald Sun production for true crime Australia. Our producer is Johnty Burton. For my columns, features and more, go to Heraldsun dot com dot Au, forward slash Andrew rule one word. For advertising inquiries, go to news Podcasts sold at news dot com dot au. That is all one word news podcast's sold. And if you want further information about this episode, links are in the description.