I you know, I'm Jewish, but I'm an American. I believe in America in my core, and there are no chosen people in America. That's the thing. If America is actually going to function, the point is what we get is a level playing field. Is it ever going to be perfectly leveled?
No?
But what we should want, what we should all collaborate on as Americans, is a level playing field in which nobody has special access, nobody has special protections, and we don't need them. That's that's the objective of the exercise. And you can say, well, Brett, you're being naive, but I don't think so. And you know, if that's the argument, if that's the argument, is that America is naive, then let's have it out. Let's have that conversation. I'm fully
ready for it. But let us not pretend that America works and then quietly undermine it by saying, well, but there are certain groups that need special protections, blah blah blah, that's not how it works.
Welcome to Liberty Lockdown. This is Clint Russell. Today. I'm joined by doctor at Weinstein.
He is.
Just an incredibly brilliant guy. I have been fortunate enough to do a couple panels with him, and I am thoroughly impressed. I think that he's one of the great minds of today, and not to say that he's the most brilliant man on the planet, but I think he is very brilliant, and he's also most importantly courageous. I think that's what we lack most of all, is intelligent people that actually have the balls to say something truthful
when it matters most. Brett has demonstrated that courage in a way that very very few people have, and for that reason, I am thrilled that he was willing to have this conversation. We go about as deep as I can take him on every topic that you're not supposed to talk about. Everything that you're not supposed to say, we do so for that reason, I am asking you to hit the like button, subscribe and share this around because I have a feeling based off of the context
of this conversation. The algorithm will not treat us kindly and it will be left to you if you'd like the world to hear it, So please do. We just hit twenty seven thousand subscribers, and as you know, the
more subscribers, the more viewers. The more listeners, the higher profile guests I'm able to have on, which is why I was able to get Dr Weinstein on, which otherwise I would not have been able to because I've been doing good views thanks to you guys, and he was willing to give me about seventy five minutes of his time and it is well worth your time. So I hope you guys enjoyed this one. Enjoy I am thrilled
the day to have on doctor Brett Weinstein. He and I have done a couple panels together over Freedom Fest and I have always been impressed with his analysis of the past five years. I have gone from a passive observer of his too, I would say friend, and I think that he is an absolutely brilliant human being. So thank you so much, Dr Weinstein for joining Liberty Lockdown today.
Awesome to see you, and I'm looking forward to.
This absolutely man. All right, so let's start here. I think you and I are both I would say pragmatic, cautiously optimistic Trump first time, I would imagine Trump voters, I don't know if you voted for him many other times. This was my first time, and I got to say even though I don't think my expectations were extremely lofty. As of now, I feel relatively disappointed with the outcome.
I'm curious what your grades are for him. I know that you were kind of more in alignment with him because of probably RFK Junior and maybe Tulsi or something like that. What are your thoughts.
I am confused by what I see. Me too, I am completely comfortable with having voted for Trump. It was my first time because of the apocalypse that was represented by the Blue ticket, true, and so I I just don't think there was any rational choice. We had an absolute emergency on our hands, and this simple ability to vote for something that was in some way authentic made
it the only game in town now. As for what is transpiring under the Trump administration, I am aware that there is a labyrinth of power and a hidden priority list. The administration presumably has things it wants to accomplish. The labyrinth of power sets the ground rules as to what can be accomplished at what rate and in exchange for what I know. I'm not privy to that, and so the real question is how does this stack up compared to what was possible given the cards that President Trump
held on inauguration. I don't think any of us are in a position to answer that. So, you know, is the disappointment the result of the fact that the constraints on the president are greater than we hoped and maybe imagined. Are they the result of the priorities not being the represented priorities. Undoubtedly that plays some role. But you know, again, in light of what was you know, we had President Biden was not the president in the meaningful sense of
that term. For them to have attempted to run him again and then at the point that that became implausible to swap in an empty shirt is such a dire commentary on the state of the Republic that I think every conversation about how the Trumpet administration is doing has to begin with the fact that there was no alternative.
Yeah, there's no disagreement there. And I know I've told people this and my audience gets mad at me for it, but I still don't regret voting for him. I think that Kamala Harris is if you thought that, you know, Joe Biden was a puppet, she was no better than that, for sure. And I do think that there has been at least efforts by Donald Trump to de escalate with Russia, which was my biggest concern with the Biden administration in terms of existential crisis. I thought that we were really
on the precipice of World War three. And well, lately it seems as if the relations between Trump and Putin have been chilling. At least it seems as if he's trying. Russia today hit Kiev with missiles and drones.
More than one hundred people kids Russia. I think it's disgusting what they're doing. I think it's disgusting. This is Biden's war, it's not my war. But I said, if I get in, I'll try and get the thing stopped. But I think what Russia's doing is very said, a lot of Russians are dying. You have a lot of Russians. More Russians are dying, but Russians are dying, Ukrainians are dying. You know, the United States isn't really involved in that war.
It shouldn't be.
And by the way, I made a deal with NATO where NATO pays US for everything that we send. We send them ammunition, missiles, etc. And we're not paying anything for that war. But I will tell you this, it should be stopped. It's a disgrace. And the ones that are dying or so, they're losing seven thousand now was five thousand, they're losing now seven thousand soldiers a week,
Ukrainian soldiers and Russian soldiers. And they're also losing people now in the towns and cities because Putin's hitting them with rockets.
So I guess that's what I was asking for, is someone to actually push for peace and to try. I am deeply concerned though with much of the So there was all these campaign promises. We expected, to some extent there to be COVID justice or to be at least reforms in the vaccine world. I think RFK has delivered on some of that, maybe not as much as I would like. I would like to see real investigations, indictments, prosecutions, and we'll probably talk about that in a little bit.
But then obviously just the vast corruption that I think has come to the light or at least become much more obvious to the general public. And I don't just mean Russian collusion, but certainly the lockdown paradigm, the yeah, I mean obviously the spying on Donald Trump was crazy, the vaccine mandates. How dangerous that was. There was just so so many opportunities for a real attack strategy against the corruption that exists within the government, within the deep state.
And what I see the Trump administration, particularly Bondie RFK Junior, Donald Trump himself, their focus seems to be on like hate speech laws for Israel. When I see them talk about issues, they get really like the teeth come out when it comes to defa Israel, And I'm just it seems like a strange priority for a guy who campaigned on America. First. What do you make of that? I mean, do you notice it at all? And what are your thoughts?
I mean, I can't help but notice it. And it's terrifying because it can only be the result of either leverage or delusion, and I tend to think it must be leverage. But either way, it is bizarre that we are placing the interests of another nation ahead of the interests of this country, especially under Trump's banner. So I'm never endingly troubled by indications in this direction. I don't think it's good for Israel. I don't think it's good
for the world. I do think something has a set of priorities that it has not shared, and it has the leverage to make those priorities manifest under an administration that campaigned under the inverse. It's very troubling and I don't know what to make of it. I think it is telling us that we have to find out why we can't escape this paradigm. But I did want to go back to one thing you said earlier, though. I think the de escalation with Russia has two components, and
you nailed one of them. We do have somebody who does seem to be interested in de escalation. It's not a smooth road, but I think, maybe even more importantly, we have a person who, old as he is, is in possession of his mental health faculties, who can respond to an emergency phone call about things spiraling out of control with Russia and can de escalate in an emergency. One of the things that I hold the Democratic Party responsible for, and that I would argue means the Democratic
Party cannot be resurrected, It cannot go clean. Now I will not accept the Democratic Party. One of the reasons is that they put a non COMPASSMENTUS figurehead in a position where he was the failsafe against a nuclear escalation and then even more insanely, they escalated with that figurehead
in that office. And so that seems to me so reckless, not only with the well being of the Republic, but with the well being of the entire planet that even if I had seen no insect stinked towards de escalation under Trump, which is not true, But even if that's what I had seen, at least having a human being who presumably does not want to see a nuclear war in a position to take the phone call, to take the various options put in front of him by his deputies,
and to evaluate what the best way forward is in a crisis, even that is just a night and day difference from what the Democrats handed us.
Oh, no disagreement, And I think, I mean, despite the fact that I'm a very harsh critic of Donald Trump, particularly in his second term. Oh, I was a much harsher critic in his first term with the lockdowns. But yeah, I mean, the freezing and shutting down of major aspects of USAID was a godsend. I was very you know, that was a shocker to me. I think RFK Junior in tolls, you have delivered on many levels. So I'm not it's not as if like it's all doom and
gloom here. And I completely agree with your assessment that it's very important that when you're playing footsy with nuclear war, you have a someone wielding the feet that actually is able to, you know, pick up the phone in the middle of the night and not being asleep at six pm. So and Donald Trump may never sleep. I'm not even sure if he's a human being at this point, but
I am very so. I think the reason that, at least I'll just speak for myself, the reason that I ended up supporting Trump is because after so much abuse, after facing seven hundred years in prison, after having a bullet grazed his head, after having the FBI spy on him, after having multiple, you know, trumped up charges that were placed against him, there was just so and then then the media twenty four to seven just hit pieces against
him for eight years straight. And then also understanding the nature of the COVID era and how much of that was done under the cover of darkness and without his understanding, and kind of concluding that that was probably utilized to Austin from power the first go around. So take all of that in its totality and I think it's rational to come to the conclusion that Donald Trump is a real outsider, Like this guy is not what the establishment wants.
You had, I mean, we just had all of these disclosures over the past forty eight hours, which you and I probably already knew about in detail. But Obama, Hillary Clinton, Steele dossier, the whole Brennan Clapper, the whole lineup. It's like, yeah, this was all true. Like they worked from day zero to get this guy out or at least to undermine him. So anyways, I say all that to say this, I come to the conclusion that this guy is a real outsider.
And then he's making trade policy based off of whether or not Canada will acknowledge the statehood of Palestine, And I'm like, I'm like, this is so strange to me, Like where is the you just the juxtaposition of like, this guy's got to be an outsider renegade, and then that making trade policy based off of foreign relations of nations that are not our own, that are six thousand miles away. I cannot I cannot get these in alignment. And I just wanted to circle back to your point
earlier about it appears to be leverage. What is the leverage?
I don't know, and I guess I'm less certain than I once was that Trump is definitely an outsider, And in fact, I'm not even sure we've got the framework right, because I think he has to have been a true outsider, that the insiders truly feared for them to have unleashed some of the amazing law fair against him, for example, that they clearly did. But that does not mean that there isn't a contingency plan in which so you would imagine think of this the way the deep state must
think of it. And I don't even think the deep state is the right description. The deep state is clearly some super national cabal. You know, it contains elements of, or maybe the entirety of the five eyes. Maybe five eyes isn't enough eyes to really describe how many parties are in play. But imagine how they must think of it.
They must think, assuming this wasn't theater from the beginning that fooled you and me, assuming that Trump truly was an outsider that frightened a certain extra constitutional elite, they must have thought, we can stop him. Here's how we're going to do it. And if we fail to stop him. Here's what we're going to do to arouse him, and
what I'm concerned. The most parsimonious explanation for what I have seen so far is that he was an outsider who has now surrendered on a couple of different fronts, possibly in order. You know, you could imagine a conversation in which somebody sat down with him and said, mister President, here's what we've got, and here's what unfolds if you go out this like the new sheriff in town. On
the other hand, you beat us fair and square. We're ready to accept that you have the legitimate right to change a certain number of things in your direction, and we won't stand in your way so long as you recognize that these things aren't to be touched. And if they were touched, the following would unfold. Right, you could imagine a speech like that, and then you could imagine that it would cause the temper tentrum that we saw President Trump throw over Epstein. President Trump was tweeting at
us about letting Epstein go. His point was, look how much other great stuff I'm doing for you, This is nothing. Let it go.
Now.
That doesn't make sense to me, because it appears that Epstein is the label on an architecture for extra constitutional control of the United States power structure. So my feeling is there's no higher issue, and it has nothing to do with Jeffrey Epstein. It has to do with what Jeffrey Epstein was doing and what role that is currently playing in terms of what we are and are not able to do in the US, all of which is offensive to the idea of the consent of the government.
We are supposed to govern ourselves, and we are not governing ourselves for reasons we don't understand until we get to the bottom of what Epstein was, who he was interacting with, what he has on them, what they've been doing for however many years that leverage existed, and pretending that this is about the individual and that his death, assuming he died, is therefore the final story in that tale is nonsense. So I'm agnostic about what's really going on.
I think there's a range of possibilities. There's a very remote possibility that Trump was, you know, an alternative narrative, you know, where we've been given the ability to choose between tide and cheer, and that it's not a real distinction. I don't. I really don't think that's what happened, But I think we have to leave it alive as a
a formal possibility. Sure, but then I think what I'm reading looks like leverage was brought to bear and it is now shaping what the Trump administration will and will not accomplish from the priorities that I assume it had coming into office.
Yeah, I agree with all of that. I think it's a very fair analysis. I have to wonder if the Butler Pennsylvania attack wasn't some sort of an inflection point where you know, they got that close to taking him out and he's just like and maybe it requires a phone call, maybe it doesn't, but you just ultimately there is a shift in. But also the shift happens once he gets into power. So it's just very hard to say. I can't really establish a divination point or whatever the
word is. It's it's just very frustrating, and I think, you know, just to kind of lay my cards in the table. The reason I'm so I don't know, exhausted, is that I just recognize what I think you probably recognized too, is that this is just such an existential moment for this country. And not just for this country,
but for the planet. When it's like America represents such a important pivot point for human freedom and prosperity and capitalism and all of these things that I really hold dear self defense, free speech, and just the lockdown COVID era, which Trump did preside over, at least in large part, was such a huge diversion from that path of this country that I love so much. And it's just like, and then you have these proxy wars all over the world,
but particularly in Ukraine, which really disturbs me. And it just feels as if in the censorship apparatus that was rolled out during the COVID era, and it's like, just all of this right, and then you have thirty seven trillion dollars in debt. As a libertarian Austrian guy, I can't help but pay attention to that. And it's just like, the dollar is on the precipice of collapse. If that happens, dollar reserve status ends, then the chickens really come home
to roost. Inflation can like basically I'm just laying all the cards on the table to say, this is a really important point for real leadership, not a puppet not a guy who's seventy percent a real boy and thirty percent not. Like we need a real hero. We need someone to risk something, and I mean major And it's not to say that Trump hasn't something, but we just
we kind of need a hero right now. And he's not acting in that heroic level of courageousness that I would I would like to see, particularly from someone who's only got ten or twenty years left on the planet.
Yeah, I exactly agree with that he is not doing what I would hope a patriot would do in his shoes, with the acknowledgment that I don't exactly know what he's facing and what he's been what's been revealed to him. But I also have the sense that the various threads are not individual, they are not independent of each other, That somehow Ukraine is very important for some reason, like it's a money laundering operation that is not entirely distinct
from what's taking place in the Middle East. There seems to be a kind of necessity to keep the Ukraine conflict going, and I don't think it's entirely independent of any of these other structures. I don't know if it's connected to trafficking that you need. You need a location
with sufficient chaos to shield human trafficking. That you need a place that you can get the US Congress to send American tax dollars where they will become untraceable and will circle back into elections and conflicts, and you know, they become a black budget for whatever entities are wielding power. I know that Benjamin Netanyahu is a diabolical figure, both in the context of COVID and the context of the
war in the Middle East. He is also connected in a way that I think is completely unforgivable to October seventh itself. That his funding of Hamas means that Israel's number one priority after October seventh should have been removing bet Yahu from power, and having done priority one, its second priority should have been getting to the bottom of
how exactly that failure could possibly have happened. You know, whether that was that you know Hamas or Iran had moles inside of the Israeli security apparatus, or there was collusion or whatever it was. They needed to get rid of Benjamin att Yahu and they needed to get to the bottom of that, and having done neither, it creates a stench surrounding the events in Gaza that I can't
look past. But again, my point is, I don't like the sense that the calamity of COVID and the calamity of Gaza and the calamity of Ukraine are all part of some story that no one's ever told me. I think they're not independent. And given such a thing, we need to know there is no higher priority. And Trump can't tell us hey, get over this or that and
I'll do some other cool stuff for you. This is really about whether or not there is a United States of America that functions under a constitution that we can all go read.
Right, It's like, hey, you just have to let us continue to let the intelligence agencies traffic children to the rich and powerful to blackmail them, but you get no tax on tips. It's like, that's not fucking good enough. Okay, excuse my language, but it's just not it's just not acceptable. I mean, it's it's absolutely insane to me. I did want to ask you your Your brother Eric actually said
something very interesting about Epstein. He gave this lengthy, kind of cryptic answer where he hinted at Epstein being more than just about compromising you know politicians in corporate America, figures even, but rather big tech, and he didn't. He didn't clarify much, and he kept it kind of vague.
Jeffrey Epstein conducted a conference called Confronting Gravity. I don't know who Jeffrey Epstein was, but I would certainly bet money that he was a product of at least one or more elements of the intelligence community. I desperately want to know why Jeffrey Epstein knew so much about my work, and I want to know why he was connected to my graduate program. I was in the Harvard Mathematics department. Jeffrey Epstein was absolutely connected to the Harvard math department.
I want to know why. I don't know who he was. I don't know who ran him. He certainly was not a financier in any standard sense. Really that was a cover story. Yes, he wasn't a financier. Of the day I met him, he was a weird guy. Didn't seem to know a lot about currency trading.
What the fuck was he doing talking about buddy Gravity.
It's very important to get Nobel laureates and some of the smartest people on earth to come to the Virgin Islands and talk about gravity. Stephen Hawkins was there, David Gross was there, Lawrence Krauss was there, Lisa Randall was there right before his conviction.
So I'm not asking you to read his mind, but I'm just curious what your thoughts are, if you've seen that, and if you have any thoughts as to like. And I'm not asking for a firm answer, because I realized neither of us know. But what do you think Epstein was really a doing? I mean, because I do. I think it was much bigger than just trafficking.
Yes, I think you know, trafficking, if you understand it correctly in the context of Epstein, is a means to an end, and the fact that Epstein and whoever he was partnered with were willing to do this in pursuit of some other objective is ghastly. But don't lose sight of the fact that it had a purpose. The purpose was not perversion. The purpose was power. And I think what, of course he was seeking to create leverage in every realm that's meaningful. Why wouldn't you? Of course you would.
And so I think the thing is we have been left with the job. You and I are doing the job that the FBI is supposed to do right. We're supposed to be trying to figure out a theory of the case, and that's not our job. This is why we elected this administration. This was one of the things that was a high priority. And it isn't like we assumed that when they got into power they would do this. They told us they would, and having now told us
they won't, we got a problem on our hands. What we now know is that the leverage generated is greater than we assumed. The leverage, whatever its nature, is sufficient to deviate this administration from that priority, and it means that we should elevate that priority, and in fact, we should, in my opinion, hold Trump to it. We should tell them we're not gonna jump. We're not going to assume that what we're seeing is true. In the age of AI,
we have to assume. As you know, the longer we wait to get that evidence, the less useful it is, because the less we know what part of it is real. So this is this is a five alarm fire right now, and I don't see a higher priority even though there are lots of you know, it will not materially change our life in the immediate but the ability to get the dirty people away from the levers of power couldn't possibly be a higher priority if you understand how power works.
No disagreement. I think that's that's exactly right. And I also think that's why the COVID justice is so important, because if I'm right, and I don't know for sure that I am, again, like you said, you know, this is better left to the FBI if we had a legitimate functioning FBI, but we don't, so podcasters are now trying to figure out former mortgage brokers and biologists are trying to figure out, like what the fuck happened here?
But I think that it was a bioweapon. I think that COVID was, and I mean there's a question as to the v and the solution as to whether or not that was also a web, but whatever, I just think that it's obvious to me that that also, as you were saying earlier, like all of these stories seemed to be intertwined, or at least certain fabrics of them
are intertwined. I mean, Tulci Gabbard has acknowledged this. You had Victoria Nuland acknowledges under direct inquiry from Marco Rubio of all people Secretary of State, who I think was asking this question expecting her not to acknowledge it, but she did, which was that there was bioweapons labs in Ukraine.
Brain has biological research facilities which in fact, we are now quite concerned Russian troops Russian forces may be seeking to gain control of. So we are working with the Ukrainians how they can prevent any of those research materials from falling into the hands of Russian forces, should they approve?
And it makes me wonder if that's not a big part of the reason that Ukraine is so important, that these labs might actually uncover the genuine origin story of COVID, as opposed to the Wuhan, which I think may have been the finalization phase of the creation of it. Again, I don't expect you to have a firm answer on this, but I'm curious what your thoughts are as to that. Do you think that that's accurate at all? Am I a lunatic? Please tell me I'm crazy?
I wish I could. I would say we are beyond a reasonable doubt that sars Kov two was generated in the course of bioweapons research. Was it a bioweapon? I don't know. It's possible that it is an escape and that they didn't get to what they were looking for, and so it is not a weapon in that sense. But it was bio weapons research that added the fern cleavage site. I believe I know what they were thinking
at a general level. They were looking for weaponizable pathogens in viral clades that are not capable of infecting and certainly not spreading between humans. They were trying to create a bug that did that. For what purpose unclear. Were they trying to create something deadly enough to be used as a weapon in the battlefield sense. Maybe were they trying to justify a shot that they had created for other reasons. Maybe. I find the fact that the mRNA
shots trigger the production of IgG four extremely troubling. This suggests that they may have inverted the normal expectation for a weaponized pathogen. In other words, in general, if you were a weapons a bioweapons person, you would want to create a deadly pathogen and an immunity generating vaccine. You could deploy your vaccine to the population you wanted to protect, release the pathogen, and thereby do selective damage. But in
this case, the vaccine creates vulnerability. Not only does it not work to prevent contraction and transmission of the disease, but it tells the immune system to stand down in response to the spike protein. So instead of a vaccine that creates immunity, which is the definition of vaccine, it creates a vulnerability. So if you just simply imagine that, you don't know who's flag doctor Fauci actually flies. Well, what he did was he created an emergency that caused
people to take an immunosuppressive shot. So, okay, here you've got a bioweapons maker, highest paid member of the federal government, who just gave every American who would listen to him a shot that suppresses their immunity to a pathogen that is now circulating. That sounds to me like a very successful bioweapons planet, just targeted against the population. I didn't expect to be targeted by doctor Fauci. Now, maybe he
accidentally did that. I just don't I don't know what's going on, and I think I will say I think COVID, much like Epstein, is the story we have to get to the bottom of in order to understand what world we live in.
Man that was heavy and I agree with all of it, and I've asked myself that, you know, in my my scarier hours of introspection, that is which was the weapon? You know, because when you really look at it, like COVID was relatively benign, especially for the young and healthy, it was like almost entirely benign. I got it. It was not much more than a flu. Whereas you know, my stepdad, who was very healthy after his second you know, shot,
he had a heart attack and nearly died. And it was very very close after a few weeks after, which apparently is like the window when a lot of people have negative consequences. And I hope that I'm safe to talk about it at this point. I think it's just beyond the pale reprehensible that we weren't allowed to talk about these things when it mattered most, when we had, you know, when everybody I knew knew somebody who was
either hurt or dropping dead from this stuff. But it really, I mean, the origin story it comes out of it looks as if it comes out of unc Chapel Hill, and then you have these murmurings about biolabs in Ukraine, and then the official story now is that it came out of Wuhan, but the official story prior was that it came out of the wet market near Wuhan, which John Stewart did a great joke on that. But setting that aside anyways, point being, this thing is like global
in scope. It seems to migrate. So there's also been reports that Canada Canadian labs were involved in the creation potentially. I can't make heads or tails of it, other than to say it's obvious to me that this was very important to the government on some level. It looks like DARPA actually rejected it because it was too dangerous. Fauci offshores it to circumvent the laws that were put in place under Obama to prevent this type of shit, and
then it still happens. But everybody is given immunity as the corpse, as the cadaver of Joe Biden is wheeled out of the White House, everybody's given immunity, including Fauci. And it's just so obvious to me that like this was whatever ran that operation really runs the world. Is that fair?
Yeah, certainly the implication, And I would point out there's something very odd about the fact that Israel was explicitly Pfiser's laboratory colony that surprises the hell out of me. Yeah, zev Zelenko, before he died, told me that Netanyahu had burned an entire warehouse of hydroxychloroquin, which is highly effective against stars Kobe two. So there's something very strange going on, and it circulates, you know, Yeah, bioweapons labs in Ukraine,
Israel is Pfiser's laboratory. What the hell is really going on? I did want to add a possibility to your to your speculation earlier about what the weapon is. Third possibility is that the weapon isn't the virus, and it isn't the shot. That it's a virus that oh is engineered to have the spike protein that will trigger those who were vaccinated to suppress their own immunity. Because you can now take that spike protein put it on. Any virus
doesn't even have to be a coronavirus. It just has to fly that flag in order to get the immune system to fire off this response that has now been encoded into the immune systems of a great majority of Americans. So the whole thing requires people who are beyond reproach, delving and going as deep as they need to go to find out what this was and telling us we need transparent across all of COVID. The story doesn't make sense.
We've made great headway on figuring out elements of it, but we have to get to the bottom of it. I don't care that people are sick of talking about COVID. This isn't about COVID. This is about next time.
Yes, oh no, I could not agree more. And it's I mean, it's just bizarre to me that, like, people aren't sick about talking about JFK, you know, sixty plus years later. But like the large just even if you take away all of the human suffering and loss of life and loss of freedom, it's also the largest transfer of wealth in human history. We're talking about trillions and trillions of dollars that were transferred from largely the poor
and middle class to the uber wealthy. Then you have the audacity to hear democrats lament income inequality, and it's like, you guys were the biggest proponents of the lockdowns. You didn't give a shit about the small business devastation that was the consequence of these behaviors. I mean, it's just that's just a small fraction of the inhumanity that we dealt with during that era. As you can tell maybe
my show being Liberty Lockdown. I still take this very seriously and I think it's I think it's the biggest, most egregious infringement on so many levels I've ever seen in my life. And I just can't believe that people are like, let's move on. It's like, I honestly think it's so severe, it was so serious, it was so brutal that people don't want to think about it anymore.
What do you think about that? Is that like the primary driving force between or by people that want to move past this or are they just really they don't care.
No, it's not that they don't care. I think there is a lot of shame and fear. People are ashamed of what they participated in, and they fear what they did to themselves, and both of those things have them wanting to not talk about it. And again my point is, this isn't about history. This is about next time, whatever it's going to be. So my sense is you either have made eye contact with the fact that COVID was two things. It was as successful as the tyrants have
yet gotten in controlling the global population. And it is also the best window we are ever going to have to understanding what power is really up to. Because we made surprising progress, mostly in podcast land, fighting back and unearthing the truth about viral origins, about repurposed drugs, about vaccine safety and effectiveness, we have a leg up on
this story, so we have to pursue it. If you understand what COVID was, you understand why we have to pursue it, whether or not you ever want to hear the word COVID again. And the only thing that competes with it in terms of importance is Epstein. Right, these are the two places where Goliath showed his hand, and having showed his hand, those are the things that we have to pursue wherever they lead in order to get
back to consent of the governed. Right. If you surrender on either of those issues, you're effectively saying, I'm okay with election theater, but I'm not I'm not going to die on the hill labeled consent of the government. And my feeling is if you're not going to die on that hill, it's done.
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code lockdown, let's get back into the show. Yeah. Well, and I think it's it's funny because there's such a huge percentage of Trump's base, who are, you know, thoroughly convinced that he was robbed of the election in twenty twenty And maybe it was, I don't know, but they there are also some of the same people that are like,
let's move on from COVID. And it's like, bro, if you if you think that the election was stolen from Trump just at the ballot box, but you think that COVID wasn't part of that, Like what are we even talking about here? Just seems like a kind of a myopia or myopia, like they're just not they're not seeing the full scope. If you think that, you know, a lot of the same people will be like totally convinced that the deep state tried to shoot Trump Butler Pennsylvania,
but they can't imagine this COVID thing being rolled out. Anyways, I did want to just kind of swing back to a broader picture question, and I'll grant I know you're already going to say, you don't know what percentage of this was just about Donald Trump? The COVID era because to me, I struggle to imagine, no matter how depraved and sick the people that actually run this country or this world are, that they would do that just to get rid of Donald Trump. It has to be a
bigger plot. I do think it's very interesting, very confusing. I'm sorry, I'm gonna throw multiple questions at just simultaneously. But the fact that the creation of it seems to as we already detailed, you know, American labs kind of the origin, Canada, Ukraine, China. China is kind of the talked about enemy of America, at least from the GOP
side of the aisle. They talk about that all the time, and yet we we still talk about them being involved in the creation of this virus that killed millions of people, but we're not at war with them, so that that automatically there's a conflict there. I'm just curious, what do you like if you had to guess, and it seems like there's multiple factors, but if you had to guess, what was the purpose of it? And do you think China was in on it with America.
I've I've gotten better at thinking about this issue as i've abandoned the idea that you can look at a map and you can see a place labeled China. That's a good point to it as one thing. And I don't think you can do it with the US either.
You know.
I know because I'm an American and I pay attention that if you had looked at the b behavior of the Biden administration and you had said, well, the Americans are trying to do X, you're not speaking for me, right The Biden administration was my enemy. And so my sense is China is multiple things. One of them appears to be partnered with something over in the American deep state,
the Democratic National Committee. I don't know why, but there's something odd about the fact that we're doing bioweapons research in partnership with the Chinese. Explain that one to me right now. It would make sense if you had a cabal that had a Chinese element that wants a bioweapon for reasons that are not in the interest of some nation but are in the interest of the cabal, that would make sense. But I think China, I think the
Chinese Communist Party is a hazard to us. I think the Chinese Communist Party has some kind of a factional war going on within it as you might expect it would, and that if you don't understand it, and I don't, I'm not an expert on this topic at all, it makes the entire situation perplexing. But I would also point
out the following observation about domestic policy. I know that I voted for an aggressive removal of aliens who came in through the border that the Democratic Party opened up, that the Democratic Party had some purpose in inviting a huge influx of immigrants. And I'm not anti immigrant, I am I'm very troubled by anybody who crossed while we weren't taking names, had no process, and were inviting them
using international organizations to facilitate their transit. I mean, as you probably know, I went to the Dairien Gap and I watched the invasion taking place, and my sense was that not only needed to stop, but that so many people came in so quickly without us assessing whether they were here to join us or to burn the place down, that we needed an aggressive reversal. And I've seen aggressive immigration policy, but it has targeted lots of people that
I don't think are a security priority. But what I have not seen is did we go looking for the large number of military age Chinese males that we know flowed into the country. I haven't seen any of that. Did I miss it?
And I haven't seen a single report.
You would imagine that not only would that be a focus of the Trump administration because it would be because it's alarming for good reason, but you would also imagine that it would be a pr victory for them if they were to find out where those people went and send them home. And so the absence of that story,
it's a it's a clear dog that didn't bark. Why is the Trump administration not pursuing the vast number of people who came from the Middle East or Asia over our open border after having campaigned on the horror of that very thing?
Yeah? No, I agree. I Actually I had Chris Martinson on my show of like right after I think, did he go with you too? The day gap?
Will?
Yeah?
Yeah, yeah, And that was one of the scariest conversations I had ever had because I that was totally off my radar at the time. I was doing the research on the NGO networks that were behind some of the mass legal immigration that had largely destroyed Europe if I'm being honest and was being utilized to I think undermine
and destroy the electoral process in America. I wanted to I wanted to circle back to your broader point about how not looking at these as nation states has helped in your analysis, and I actually agree with you on that, But it then begs the question of, like, if if this is not a nation state US versus them type of analysis that were participating in, how how do we distinguish friend from foe? Like how do we know who's
on our side who's not? I mean, I think this is like the biggest challenge of the past year for me is that, you know, like I've got my close circle. I got like and Dave Smith and Tom Woods and Scott Horton, and you know it, I'll includes you and Angela mccartil. It's like, I know these people are for real, and then everybody else I'm like, I have no fucking clue. Like these people could absolutely be plants. They could be
FBI informansts that are trying to take me down. Like you start to get paranoid because it's just there's so many examples of people talking to talk like cash Battel. I did the panel with Cashptell and you and and then he gets in there and he just like is not delivering. So I'm sorry, the real random tangent die try. But how do you distinguish friend from foe? Especially if Nation States can't even assist us in that process?
There is no perfect answer to that. Nor if this, I believe you could almost prove there's no perfect answer, because let's imagine for a second that there was a perfect answer, there was some set of characteristics that nailed it well, and in a sufficiently significant situation, somebody could arrange for those characteristics all to show up in some entity who would then five years later, you know, pull a fast one. So there cannot be a hard and
fast rule. However, there are things that increase one's confidence and things that should decrease it. And I would say a long track record is hard to fake. In other words, let's just take me as an example. You can go back and you can find you know, the Evergreen story is twenty seventeen. Okay, so that was very public and
I've been a public person ever since. Not only that, but you've got me and Heather talking, you know, once a week at length on many different topics, and you can see that the marriage is real, Like you can see that we get annoyed with each other and you know it. So the point is, what would happen to be.
Like a very happy and healthy marriage. To be honest, I'm you guys, give me hope.
It's it's the best. But I guess my point is how long ago would you have to have been planning in order if you wanted to fake such a thing? Like you know, you ever watched the show The Americans, which the Russians create a phony family of spies, right, Well, the point is that's not inconceivable, but you have to have played a It requires a very large budget, it requires extensive training, and it's not perfect. You know. The whole premise of the show The Americans was that they
were always sort of in danger of being exposed. You know, the FBI guy moves in across the street from them, and their story isn't perfect and all of that. So anyway, a long track record, an unlikely track record, those things increase confidence. The most important one is have you paid
a price for integrity? In other words, in a case where you had an opportunity to profit more, have you forgone profit in order to do what was right in a context in which we can check what actually took place that kind of thing.
Is there an obvious sacrifice at some point in the origin story?
Yeah, obvious sacrifice. I would say. One thing I've learned personally from having been canceled now multiple times on multiple different topics.
Is.
I lost friends each time this happened. And what that tells you is that those weren't really friends in any deep sense to begin with. Right, if a friend is going to walk away from you because a bunch of people who don't know you are accusing you of racism, then that may have been somebody who was pleasant to be around. They may have been a good cook, but
they weren't a friend. Because a friend knows you well enough to know that what's being said about you is bullshit and to stand up and say, well, you know, I don't care who you are, you're wrong. So I think everybody would in some sense be sadder, but I don't want to I take back sadder, but wiser. I am not sadder. I am much wiser having been through this multiple times, and my friend group is much better.
Why because all the people who weren't up to being friends have been purged over multiple different topics, and so what I'm left with are people who don't frighten easily and who do the right thing, even when it's painful and expensive. So soldiers, Yeah, people, Well, I mean my joke is, you know, I'd share a foxhole with you anytime. Look, a foxhole is not a pleasant place to be spending your time, but the quality of people that you're in the foxhole with is everything.
Right.
You can endure the horror of you know, the mud and the cold if the people who are in the foxhole with you are you know, ready to back you up. So anyway, I guess what I would say is most people do not have the benefit of having been under fire and watched a bunch of friends flee and a bunch of other people show up and do the right thing. If I could, if I could give a gift to
the average person, it would be that experience. Right, You don't really want to be investing in the people who are going to flee if somebody hurls a dumb act usation at you, It's not worth it. I don't care how much fun it is. Yeah, that is not somebody you want to invest your time in. So anyway, I would just say, pay attention somebody who showed up late to your world, somebody who hasn't demonstrated a willingness to sacrifice for integrity. Those are, you know, not necessarily fatal.
A good person could show up anytime and you might not have seen them have to sacrifice. But it means what you know about them is a lot less than you'd like to. Now.
Look, I may get you in trouble here, but I don't think I will. I gotta say everything that you just described in terms of a checklist of people to be questionable of jd. Vance. Jady Vance is the guy who immediately springs to mind. Seems to have been kind of just launched out of relative obscurity thanks to in part Toker Carlson having him on a lot, but also Peter Teel and his five million dollars that got him into the Senate.
Yeah, my political advice to the Democrats is continue to tell everybody who thinks Sidney Sweeney is attractive is a Nazi. That appears to be their actual strategy, and I mean it actually reveals something pretty interesting about the Dems, though, which is that you have like a normal, all American beautiful girl during doing like a normal genes ad. Right, they're trying to sell, you know, sell jeans to kids in America, and they have managed to so unhinge themselves
over this thing. And it's like, you, guys, did you learn nothing from the November twenty twenty four election. Like I actually thought that one of the lessons they might take is we're going to be less crazy. The lesson they have apparently taken is we're going to attack people as Nazis for thinking Sidney Sweeney is beautiful.
Great strategy, guys, that's.
How you're going to win the mid terms, especially young American men.
What are your thoughts about jad Vance? Is he is he a something to be keeping an eye on for good or bad reasons?
Well, I say, I don't want to convict somebody who hasn't done anything wrong that I can see.
On him.
Now. No, Yeah, I think you're you're you're asking exactly the right question. And in a case like JD. Vance, I am absolutely ready to discover that he's a great guy with integrity. But I am aware that in terms of what I actually know about him, I have no security that he's a good guy. So again, that's not his fault. The fact that he comes to my awareness late is just a fact of history. But it means in terms of how much weight I'm willing to put on that ice, I'm not willing to put any weight
on that ice. I would love for him to turn out to be a high integrity, courageous guy because frankly, we don't have very many of them in positions of power, and it would be wonderful if he was one, because he's now in a place where he could take over the range of power exactly real. So let's put it this way. I'm rooting for him, but I'm not a believer.
Yeah, yeah, no, same boat, And I don't I don't want to give up all hope all electoral outcomes, especially with the description that you gave about, you know, not being able to identify nation states anymore as to like friend and foe. Yeah, it's you know, if you really pay attention, you can probably establish or suss out on an individual level, which of these political figures you can put some trust in versus those that you should be
very suspect of. But I was more just thinking about, like how how hard it is, Like, I mean, just talk about it Israel, you know, Gaza. It's like, if you can't distinguish if if the if Hamas soldiers are not wearing uniforms, it makes the battlefield just pure chaos. It's it's I mean, this is why it's illegal an international law to you know, have ununiformed participants in battle, because it makes it so that civilians are then jeopardized.
And it feels as if, even though we're not in a hot or kinetic war, it does feel on many levels as if we've been in a war for the past five years, with our own government kind of punishing us uh, and then how to distinguish who's friend and foe in that environment, or who's even a domestic participant
versus an international one. It's just it's all It's like that, you know, I thought I was playing chess, but I was playing checkers is kind of how I feel with my analysis, and and now I'm like, oh, maybe I'm playing chess now, but I'm like, I am not equipped to play who I'm up against, And I guess that's
how I feel about it. It's just such it's so hard to analyze all these things, and particularly when you don't even have a team, because the people with the power to force disclosures, to force testimony, they don't seem to have the courage to go after it like the rabid dogs that we need, you know, we need like Tucker Carlson to be the ag you know, we need someone who's actually willing to risk something. Anyway, Sorry, that
was a totally random tangent. I do have another question for you, but if you have any thoughts on that, if what do you think?
Well, I think we need to start recognizing the pattern, which is we beat the odds, We get a certain number of our people advanced to the positions from which they should be able to do our bidding, and then it fails to happen. And that pattern could be that we are naive and so the people that we keep elevating are somehow being fed to us and they were going to disappoint from the get go. Or it could be that something happens upon arrival that causes them to
lose their appetite for doing the right thing. And it's probably a mixture. Yeah, but but there's no higher priority.
No, No, I agree, And I mean that's that's what's so frustrating. And I mean if if the threats or bribery or whatever that people that get into these positions of power, because they can't all be scumbags, like some of them have to be for real, sincere, decent people that get in there, and they ultimately fail to deliver, And it's just like it must be it must be overwhelming, because there's just there's just no one that actually or other than Thomas Massey is like the only guy I
really think of that pops to mind. That's like I have a full faith that this guy is un compromisable, Like he's just he's going to go after it doggedly no matter what, whether you're threatening them or whatever. Like he just doesn't give a shit. And we need we need two hundred and fifty people like that in DC, And I think I feel like we could really take this this country back. I did. I did want to.
I know we're running out of time, so I did want to ask you a kind of a deep philosophical question almost about the the Jewish mindset when it comes to the Holocaust. And you know, as you know, I'm good friends with Dave Smith, and he's talked a lot
about this. There's kind of a like the kids of Jewish family are like raised into thinking about this probably more than is healthy, even you know, in the I don't know if that's true, but that's just what he said, and it makes me wonder if Israeli behavior in Gaza is a product of kind of a broadly traumatized people like that they have been so convinced that the world is out to get them that when they had their own kind of mini nine to eleven, that they have
now essentially gone mad. And I'm not saying Jewish people broadly, but like Israeli's specifically. What do you think of that?
Is that?
I mean, is that crazy or is that play a part at all?
It's a difficult question for a number of different reasons, and I will ultimately come back to the view from thirty thousand feet, which I think is the important thing for us to pay attention to. There's no question, and I think this is probably less true as time goes on, or at least it was. There's no question that Jewish
homes have focused development around the Holocaust. I don't think it's incorrect to do that, because in some sense, the message when I got loud and clear, was something happens that causes the world around you to melt down into
a very dangerous place and you don't anticipate it. If you grow up under circumstances where anti Semitism isn't an important factor in your life, knowing that there is a phase transition that happens that causes it to become the dominant factor in your life without you having trained for it, that's an important thing to know. And I believe it
is true that said. Part of the reason I think there's one aspect of anti Semitism being an important recurrent feature of history that has to do simply with Jews being a diaspora, and that diaspora means that Jews are typically living amongst some other majority population. And it is frankly, I think written into the genes that when austerity hits, if you go from good times to bad times, there
is a question about who has resources that they can't protect. Right, So, if you imagine that suddenly food stops showing up in your town and somebody had stored a bunch of food, you could imagine people going and storming their garage and taking their food. Right.
That's why bullets are more important than seeds in the apocalypse.
They both play a role. But so anyway, the point is a diaspora population is in trouble when the music stops and there aren't enough chairs. Sure, so that has nothing to do with who Jews are. It just has
to do with how they've existed. Yeah, so you need to know if you're Jewish, that can happen wherever you are, and you to think about what that will look like, because frankly, the Jews in Europe who died were the ones who told themselves it was bad, but it would eventually pass and get better, and that was a deadly misapprehension.
On the other hand, once you have this feature of your culture that says those people that you are living amongst will seem like your friends in good times, and then in bad times, something happens that causes a distance to be created in the mind that then sets up the very pattern in question exactly right. So anyway, what I see is a I can find no word other than tragic, self fulfilling prophecy.
Well, that's exactly the premise of the question, is like, that's the that's what it feels like to me, is that this is self fulfilling.
It is self fulfilling. And now I want to go back to the view from thirty thousand feet because I really think this is the important piece. There are two bases on which a civilization can function. One of them is shared genes. The civilization in which people are closely related to each other has a reason for people to collaborate,
that is rock solid. The other reason for people to collaborate is reciprocity, right, the fact that I'm wealthier and you're wealthier if you and I pool our efforts than we are if we go it alone. That is also a perfectly reasonable basis for a society to function. What I call the West, which I really think, you know, it certainly has antecedents in ancient Greece and elsewhere, but
the West really begins with the American founders. The modern West begins with the American founders solving enough of the conflicts in the colonies to get them to confederate, and in doing that, they created a blueprint for a reciprocity based civilization that was so much more productive, so much fairer, so much more rewarding to be a participant in that. It spread like wildfire, as long as economic times were sufficiently good. Right, once you saw what a reciprocity based
civilization did, you wanted to be part of it. The problem is, the reciprocity based civilization is better in every important regard than the gene based civilization. The gene based civilization is bloody at every level. It sees only this one kind of payoff in the long term. But the gene based society, the lineage, the genetic lineage, is more stable than the reciprocity based civilization. And so the point is.
And can the reciprocity based civilization survive if importing the gene based.
And I think the horror that took place at our southern border and the horror that has taken place in Europe is the same one. You had some massive influx of people and you didn't even ask them whether they liked you and wanted to be part of your society. This, to me is insane. I don't care where you come from, if you earnestly want to be American or British or whatever. I think we should be open to the possibility that
it's a good idea. I don't think it's automatic just because you want to be American, doesn't mean that it's good for us to let you in. But if you want to be an American, maybe it is good for us. And every time you do want to be an American and it is good for us for you to join, we should allow it. But if you let people in who hate you, of course you're going to get Mayhem. Of course it's obvious. How did we possibly miss it? So anyway, the punchline to the lineage story is reciprocity
based civilizations. The West are better at doing all of the good things, but they're fragile. And when the music stops, when economic austerity kicks in, when the corruption gets bad enough that there isn't enough to go around because it's being hoarded by somebody, they break down into lineage against lineage violence. And so what I really think is going on in the Middle East, and what I have said from October eighth was we are in danger of being
dragged back in. And when I say we, I mean the entire world is in danger of being dragged back into lineage against lineage violence by what is taking place in the Middle East. And if you love Israel, what you should want is to make sure that the faction in Israel that earnestly wants to be part of the West and to put lineage aside is dominant, and that the part of Israel that wants to drag us back into the Old Testament is not right. That's the question.
Are we going to be dragged back into lineage against lineage violence of the sort that the Old Testament is written about, of this sort that is riddled throughout the Quran, or not. And my feeling is, once you've seen what the West can do, the answer is, Look, this is us in them. It's the West versus lineage against lineage violence. Everybody should want to be part of the West. I don't want the category of them to contain anybody, right.
It's not that I have people I want to fight, but this is really the us in them that matters. Do you want to be part of the West. Do you want to put aside people's genetic background and collaborate with them because they're good people to collaborate with. That's what the West is about, and that's what we should be fighting for. And anything that threatens to take us back into the Old Testament, no, thank you.
Great Ranton. I just got to add one point is that my deep concern is that, you know, when I see the Randy Fines of the world, RFK Junior talking about, you know, anti semitism on college campuses, Donald Trump doing the same, Bondie doing the same, Patel but like all of them doing the same. Is that if you, if you come into America, and if you're a politician in America and you and you start to create laws that differentiate between the people, and you make a category that's protected,
it's ironic. I even need to make this point. I certainly don't need to make it to you, but that after the woke experience or the woke era, and James Lindsay being such a great advocate on this topic, that like, I think we all recognize that if you create special categories of people, it will breed resentment, it actually leads to racism. Like that is the path that we're taking
when it comes to Jewish people now. And this is why I think that the woke right label being placed on people like me is totally misguided, and that it ought to be being placed on my friend James Lindsay because it seems as if he is more interested in protected classes, and that protected class is Jewish people well
as everybody else's, you know, equal. I just think this is a really dangerous paradigm, and I think it's going to give rise to like if if James is fearful of Nick Flentes, Nick Flentes will be your president in twenty years if you don't listen to what I'm saying right now.
And now he says, if you're not on board with the Epstein cover, oh I don't want your support.
You're a weakling.
Fuck you, fuck you, you suck, You are fat, you are a joke, you are stupid, you are not funny, you are not as smart as you think you are. You are and honestly, I'm and if you watched my show, you know I've been very critical. I've never been this far. This just goes to show this entire thing has been a scam. When we look back on the history of populism in America, we are going to look back on the MAGA movement as the biggest scam in American history.
And the liberals were right, The MAGA supporters were had.
They were like, that's how I feel about it. Sorry for the crazy ending to this, but I genuinely think that this is a very dangerous paradise, especially when it comes to censorship and all this other stuff. And then and then you think you're going to you think you're going to crush descent of people that think that Jewish people control America by creating special laws that make it seem as if you can't say anything about Jewish people
in America. It's like this is doomed to fail. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills any less thoughts.
Yeah, let me just say it this way. I you know, I'm Jewish, but I'm an American. I believe in America in my core. And there are no chosen people in America. That's the thing. If America is actually going to function. The point is what we get is a level playing field. Is it ever going to be perfectly level? No, But what we should want, what we should all collaborate on as Americans, is a level playing field in which nobody has special access, nobody has special protections, and we don't
need them. That's that's the objective of the exercise. And you can say, well, Brett, you're being naive, but I don't think so. And you know, if that's the argument, If that's the argument, is that America is naive, then let's have it out. Let's have that conversation. I'm fully ready for it. But let us not pretend that America works and then quietly undermine it by saying, well, but there are certain groups that need special protections, blah blah blah.
That's not how it works. We should level the playing field as well as we can and then play the cards you're dealt. That's the game that is superior to all of the alternatives that came before it. And you know that it is simply the objective of the exercise once you understand it.
Well, I've kept you longer than I planned. It was an absolute honor having you on, and I think that you know in the friend faux distinction conversation. I am confident that you are in the friend category. So thank you very much. If anybody wants to check out your work, obviously the Dark Horse Podcast, in any other links or tips that you should give.
Them, Yeah, you can check out A Hunter Gatherer's Guide to the twenty first Century book that Heather and I wrote about hyper novelty and what it's doing to us. You can find me on Twitter at Brett Weinstein. You can find Heather and me on locals. All those are good places.
Dr Wannstein, you are the best. Anytime you'd like to come back on and go deep down the rabbit hole, you were welcome. If you guys enjoyed this episode, please do it the like button, subscribe, share it around, and if there's any great rants that either of us went on, feel free to clip them and share them too. We're out here peace, all right, Thanks?
Brother?
Was I lying? I wasn't lying. This was a damn good episode. Sorry, I'm backlit. So you saw the water for a second and then you saw my ugly mug. If you enjoyed that one, please do it the like button, subscribe, and as I said, share it around. But most importantly, let people know, you know, like if you want people
to know the truth about this stuff. We didn't come to hard conclusions on a lot of this because it's I mean, we're talking about like deep deep deep state multinational not even state organizations, and who the hell knows actually at the end of the day, who's who's pulling the strings, who's calling the shots on this some of this stuff. But I think that we're close, we're close.
We're getting closer. And if you enjoy conversations like that, the easiest way is to spread it around that Yeah, more people know, more people know what's up, so you don't sound like a lunatic. Give this to your most blue billed friend and and blow their mind. Thanks again, guys. See so