Building Relationships with Photographers w/ Allie Siarto from PhotoFieldNotes

spk_0:   0:05
you were listening. Episode 11 of the level of your wedding film business podcast. Today we're going to be talking about how you can build valuable relationships with photographers and why those relationships are an important part of running an effective business. I'm your host, Taylor Petrovich, and at the core of the show, I want you to feel inspired to take your business to the next level, and I want to give you the tools and practical advice to help you along the way. So let's level up together. The one person that we work closest with on a wedding day is the photographer, and building a relationship with them is so important for several reasons. First off, having good working relationships is going to make your job a lot more enjoyable on a wedding day. We're more likely to stay in this career long term if we're doing it alongside other professionals that we enjoy to be around. Secondly, it's going to make the wedding. They run a lot smoother. If you have a good relationship with the photographer, that's going to make the vibe much calmer, and it will also allow you to make the most out of your wedding day instead of spending your time being frustrated and behind schedule. Finally, those relationships can lead to referrals down the road, which is super awesome because that, my friends, is free marketing for your business. And luckily, the wedding industry runs largely on referrals. In this episode, I have the pleasure of interviewing a photographer named Allie See Arto Alexi Ardo leads a team of editorial style wedding and portrait photographers based out of East Lansing, Michigan. She also runs the Photo Fuel Notes podcast, where she shares advice to help photographers thrive in their businesses. She's a wife, a mom to two tiny, energetic daughters, a newbie Lake Michigan sailor, a desert addict and an endless explorer. She's also a 2017 editor's Choice Award winner and a 2018 in 2019 Best of Weddings winner. Before I get into the interview, I just want to start off by saying a few things. I am a huge numbers person, and I love looking at the data in my business. When I was preparing for this episode, I was curious to see the impact that photographers made on me and my business directly. It turns out that over the last 12 months I've made over $13,000 just from direct referrals from photographers. If that alone doesn't speak volumes as to why having relationships for photographers is important. How? I don't know what does and just one more thing. And then I will get into the interview. I'm currently reading a book called Atomic Habits by James Clear, and in the book he talks a bit about. Habits in your life will compound either for or against you. And he talks a bit about the habits surrounding relationship building, He says. People reflect your behavior back to you. The more that you help others, the more others want to help you being a little nicer. And each interaction can result in a network of broad and strong connections over time. So just keep that quote in mind during this interview with Alexi Arto. Hi, Ali. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I read your bio at the top of the episode, but can you tell me a little bit about your business and maybe when you started and a little bit about your business model?

spk_1:   3:16
Sure thing. Absolutely. Okay, I'm a photographer and I originally started out as like most photographer is a solo photographer. So when I first got started, I lived in Chicago. I actually worked in public relations and like market research and had a company doing that. I had a whole separate life at the beginning, and I guess I just all my friends worked in public relations, and I wanted to branch out and do something a little bit different and creative on the weekends. And so I originally took photography classes through the Chicago Photography Center, which was a nonprofit that, sadly, doesn't exist anymore. But once I got through that, I basically just went on the knot dot com, and I found the first photographer who was advertising that had the side advertisement, and I contacted them, and I was like, Hey, do you need a second photographer? And as it turned out, they they were a pretty big company. They were actually a long established company with, like, 20 employees or something like that. Oh, and it was. So it's completely different from what we kind of are used to nowadays, and they didn't necessarily need a second photographer, but they hired me as essentially like 1/3 photographer assistant. And so the photographer I worked with was actually very established with shooting these amazing, huge, beautiful weddings and typically, like downtown Chicago, are all around Chicago. And he was just a master with lighting. He would light everything. I would help him carry all his gear and set up his beauty dishes and his lights and all those things. And so I learned everything I know at least like to get everything I knew to get started from him in terms of lighting. And that was how I lived in Chicago. Thought I live in Chicago forever, and then basically, just kind of, like, got really tired of the cold wind and the craziness of trying to get anywhere in Chicago and ended up back in Michigan, which is where I was born and raised. And so I was kind of starting from scratch. I decided, Okay, I'm gonna take this out on my own and build my own photography business. And so the first thing that I did was I took out an ad on the not because that's what I thought people did at the time, and it actually worked out for me got me started and ah, you know, I thoughts on that. Now I'm like, using the not actually have different opinions on it now, but at the time, it was a good start, a good place to start, and I just I kind of did it part time for a long time. And it was like my alter ego I did on the weekends. I still ran my business for many years, and then when my first daughter was born, she just turned six. So six years ago, I kind of hit this, like, turning point where I just couldn't do both at the same time anymore. And I realized that I was kind of burning out from the other business, and I really loved photography, so I kinda swung into a full time at that point. And, you know, it probably took that year to really build it up. But I got to the point where I then added associate photographers on my team, and by the time my second daughter was born two years later, I had booked almost 50 weddings for my team, which actually was too many with a new warrant. Theo lot until I was the last of manage and I was kind of I always just kind of I like to call everything, experiment it. So he went into it like an experiment. I said, you know, I'm gonna make this work, whatever way. I'm gonna learn some lessons. I'm gonna make changes as I go. But it was a really good experience, and I learned a lot from it. Um, and I learned that I didn't want to take on 50 weddings and no matter what, whether it was me shooting them Army leading them. So I've kind of found a really nice balance. Now, um, where I do still work with associates, and I kind of, um very between one associate a and 123 associates at any given time. Um, so right now, I'm kind of back in the upswing where I'm looking to boost up my associate team a little bit more so that I can step back personally and shoot a little bit less on those precious summer weekends. Because here in Michigan, summer is very short, and I want to enjoy every second of it, another cat, and just shoot a little bit less in the summer. So that's where I am now. I am running my company mostly focused on weddings and portrait CE and having just a small team of associates. Actually, just this morning met with another person to potentially grow by associate team. Um, and they're actually and they're just contractors, so they take what they want to take. They usually have their own businesses, too, and they don't have to do anything. They're not employees. They're just contractors who kind of work together and have a great relationship that way.

spk_0:   7:32
Awesome. So do you do the editing when the associates shoot for you? Or do they do everything?

spk_1:   7:38
No, I actually, I do the marketing and I do the editing. I did the client management. So all they have to do is typically they might take on one meeting like I'll do the initial meeting and sell them in, and then once they're basically ready to book, But they just want to talk with that photographer quickly, they'll either set up like a coffee or a quick phone call, make sure everything sounds good, and then they'll book so it's pretty light on their work on, and then they of course, lead the wedding day. So I send over the schedule, see if they have any questions, and I have pretty high expectations that they're going to match my style. I give them a lot of feedback after each wedding. Um, they need to know they're lighting. They need to know a lot of they just have a similar style to me. And then after the wedding, they deliver their memory cards to me, and I do all the editing and all the post sales and all the everything. Basically, besides actual shooting of the day, I manage for them.

spk_0:   8:27
Yeah, that's super cool. I love that business model idea, especially having two young kids like you said, Time is so valuable. And so it's awesome that you've been able to kind of branch out in your business and make it work for your life in your family. That's really cool. Yes, it's often helpful. Yeah, so a big reason that I wanted to have you on the show is because as videographers, we worked really closely with photographers on a wedding day, and we don't always have many opportunities to talk candidly with photographers. It, like in a non high pressure like scenario on the wedding day. Um, but it's super important for us to be able to work with you. Well, because how the day runs is largely determined to buy kind of the relationship that we build a photographer's. So can you tell me a little bit about your experience? Working with videographers at weddings?

spk_1:   9:17
Assure can. Okay, so first of all, I like that you said, You know, you don't get a lot of chances to talk with a photographer outside of that high pressure time of day. But the videographers who I have actually ended up recommending I was thinking this through as we were talking about having this conversation, and I was thinking OK, often I not every time but often I have the opportunity to refer videographers so a lot of couples will book their photographer, and then they'll go to their photographer and say, Hey, do you have a videographer who you work really well with and you really like? Because they're kind of catching on that they want that team to work well together, and so they prefer either the photographer to recommend the videographer of the videographer direct mint the photographer. And so I think, as either I mean, that's the person that you really want to treat very well on the wedding day because we both have the ability to potentially helper for each other. And so the people who I've referred it interesting. Actually, the people who have referred have not been people who I am extensively familiar with their work. That's not why I refer them. I'll obviously check their work and make sure that it looks really good and professional. But it's not because I'm necessarily like a big fan girl of their work. And I think that their work is the best I've ever seen because probably just like videographers feel about photographers you might. We might not see things that you might see it like. We'll be like, That's really cool. I can't do that like I don't get it. So we're just like This is cool. This is cool. So I don't refer. I don't go out and search for videographers like a couple would and have my list based on who I think has the best videos I've ever seen. I absolutely based on my experience working with that person and so the people over the years who I've recommended it started out. So here's my first thing. Um, Originally, it was a videographer who ran a local networking group where he would organize with another photographer they would organize, just like bar nights, once 1/4 for everybody to get together in the wedding industry and, like DJs, photographers, videographers, et cetera. And he would coordinate that for the community. And I really valued that. And I really liked him as a person. And I ended up both hiring him for personal work and also recommending him for weddings. So it was totally based on personal connection and just like him, be invaluable to the community and being an awesome person. And then he got a full time job, so he was no longer available. And then I shared us, um, kind of a studio with other photographers and a videographer. So we all paid in and rented the studio, and the videographer worked upstairs and what edit his work. And I work downstairs and like, took turns with the photographer. So if there's an opportunity where you as a videographer can reach out to a photographer who you know has a studio and maybe like pay a small amount to use that studio for meetings. You're not just paying to use that studio for meetings. You're also paying for a really great connection with the photographer because as soon as we were sharing that studio, I got to know him and really loved his work, loved his personality and started recommending him. So think of that as an investment potential opportunity to look for photographers with studios who do weddings and see if you can share the space like pay a small amount to do a couple meetings a month. You're probably not gonna have that many anyway. Um, also, since then, those two have gotten full tables, have done full time jobs, and so then I was like, uh, who do I recommend now? And so the next one, who I really got to know with somebody who reached out and we think he was a part of Tuesday's together the rising Tide community so he'd come out to meetings and meet us personally, and then we ended up like getting together for various, you know, beaten, seen each other, a networking event, so it's really kind of out like face time with the local community and meeting people getting to know them. That really built those relationships that then led into recommendations. And then he also stopped, although a lot of them got over well and it wasn't a bad thing. They all still work in video, but they all now working like commercial corporate video. So there they have full time jobs doing either full time jobs or they're running their own company's not doing weddings, but doing other really cool video stuff. So they haven't left the industry. They're just doing. They've moved on. So league, different things. Um, So anyway, so since then, the people who I recommend one is somebody who also, um, came out to Tuesdays together, and she actually volunteered to lead a meeting where she taught a lot of us just the basics of video so that we could use it for our own marketing. And the other guy had done that, too, at one point, and I so valued that she took the time to do that, that I started recommending her, and I had never even worked with her before. I just knew I liked her, and so I didn't get a chance to work with her for probably Ah, full year after that, they finally got to work with her and enjoyed working with her. The other guy was probably the only one who I actually worked with first and met at the wedding and then started recommending him. And the reason I liked him so much and recommend him so much is because he he e mailed me and called me. I can't remember which order if we look set up a quick five minute chat, but he actually called me and just said, Hey, we're working together the first time, you know, And he does it every time. Hey, we're working together. I'd love to know. Basically, he's asking me this question. Um, how can I work well with you? Like what would make your life easier if we when we're working together, like, what can I do to to make this work really well? And I so appreciated that because we could go through and I could say, I love this. This this this which now will get into the actual day of kind of been long winded on the other

spk_0:   14:56
side. No, it's great. It's great. So one

spk_1:   14:59
big thing is I coordinate the schedule ahead of time, and it's usually, you know, the wedding day. You're always kind of fighting for that time. And so I scheduled it based on the time that I need. And if there's a videographer who needs some time, I really want to know that ahead of time so that I'm scheduling enough time into Portrait's or whatever time of the day. Because what I've scheduled that and sometimes, unfortunately, a couple dozen communicate. Oh, by the way, the videographer needs this time. So they call ahead of time. Hopefully, well, in advance, we could make sure that there's time for that. So if you need, you know, whatever number of minutes to do your own special thing or to record something, it's really nice to know that ahead of time so that I could make sure that they have still booked out enough time to do what I what I need to do to get my job done and make them, you know, happy with my work takes. We all want to be happy at the end of the day. Um, the other thing that this guy did. That was just like the most incredible amazing thing was this is so small. But he had already set up his gear at one point, and he offered to carry one of my bags for me, and I was like, I love you so much. So just that simple act of him, like carrying a bag for me was enough that I've recommended him to, like multiple weddings and he's booked weddings based on that. So just that, like, how can I make your day easier? And I mean, I hope I do that for people to if they need me to. If their hands are full and my art, I'm gonna make an effort to try to make their life easier instead of just sitting back and whatever. Um, so it's it's personality. It's way more than just the video, Um, and then another little thing that's really simple, that's really helpful, is so I do this. I try to tag all the vendors. When I share my work. I try to tag them so I might share just photos or like a sideshow photos. But I'll be like here. The other vendors who made this day awesome, and I'll include the videographer, and so the videographer can then see my work. But I'm also giving them credit so that when a couple comes through on their mother on my page and they're looking for a videographer, they can, like, click through and see that. So when a videographers was the same thing, it allows me to see their work so I might never get to see the final video if they don't share it with me. But if they tag me, they're both giving me a shout out that gives that little bit of marketing love where someone could click that link and check me out. But it's also letting me see the video that, like I was a part of that day and I want to see it and then hopefully even, you know, share that that you don't give them a little bit of extra love. So just that simple act of tagging all the vendor is not just the photographer, but when you share your video, say, like, here's a shout out to the vendors who made this day possible, tagged them all so that they could all see the video showed the video get credit for the work that they did. And I know as a photographer, I didn't effect that Like florists for sure. The dress designer, the venue, like they should all be tagged.

spk_0:   17:41
Yeah, hair makeup, Everybody get out.

spk_1:   17:43
All of those. Absolutely. Because they, like you, actually affected the way that the day looks in the video where the photographers more just like, Hey, come see my video and share it just really good. I want to see it for sure. So they're the big, like, great things. And I think that no nos air pretty clear to most Well, maybe not, but it still happens. But, um obviously, like not communicating the schedule ahead of time and then be like, by the way, I need 30 minutes to take you away and you can't come like I've had some videographers say, um, I need this much of time and the photographer can't come. And that's kind of frustrating, cause I would never do that to videographer like, I know that we could work together from different angles and get great video and great photos at the same time. If there's like this great action happening like we should be working together. There should never be a time where one is not allowed. Um, obviously, like getting in the way. It's one thing I know that we both need to get in there and get our shots. And there are times when we're probably gonna get in each other's way. Um, here and there. But when videographers air just like, you know, setting up in the aisle in a way that's so in the way or just really out of here, I'm getting in the way. Um,

spk_0:   18:52
yeah, I will say the tripods should never go in the middle of the I'll ever, ever, ever, ever, ever

spk_1:   18:58
basically, basically that Yeah, and then yeah, And then, like I said, like putting, putting things behind schedule because we're all we're all judged on keeping them on schedule. And so whichever one of us puts us behind and this is the same with, like, hair and makeup, like if I'm not there and hair and makeup is an hour behind, I'm not gonna recommend them because it's so even if they do a beautiful job. Time management is a huge part of the day because it's just like a go go go kind of day. So that's important to

spk_0:   19:23
you. Could never get ours back on that wedding day. And each minute is like, so precious to make the most for the couple of like, for us, it's a job. But for them, it's like they're one day that they're gonna, like, think about forever. And I actually personally had kind of a negative experience with timing on my wedding day. Did you? What happened? Yes. Um, I don't know. The dynamic was between the videographer and the photographer, but for whatever reason, we spent like 30 minutes on a bridal party like photo and video, and then, like, had hardly any time to get, like, just me and my husband like together. So I literally have, like, five photos, 50 of just the two of us, like that's it. So it was like time management. So and that's

spk_1:   20:09
and that's another thing like this is a bit of an aside, but I totally feel when you're on a tight schedule, Um, I absolutely prioritized the photos with the couple over the photos of the wedding party, and it's all about communicating expectations. And so, as the photographer, the videographer. You know, you have to say, Listen, we have this much time or were this much behind schedule already, And so I'm just gonna take one. Really great, like not one shot, But I'm gonna take your wedding party photos in one great location. We're not gonna take wedding party photos here and here and here and here at the expense of having the photos of the two of you the wedding that I just did. It was an early January wedding. They we're really behind schedule, coming out of like the ceremony. Just a lot of things had run long that we're out of our control. And so they had this schedule where they wanted to go to two different locations for portrait. It's and I could have said yes, like we're 40 minutes behind. That's fine. We'll just get you to the reception late and everybody will eat late and everything will be pushed back. But I really didn't want to do that. And so I just said to them before we left, I said, Hey, we're this far behind schedule. We can still go here, but just so you know, you know, we're supposed to already be here. This next spot. So what I can do is I can get you back on schedule by skipping this location going here. But there's a spot right by it. It looks kind of similar. So I can still get you really different by using one location will take some shots this way, some shots this way. And so I just, you know, I over communicate as much as I can so that I'm not disappointing them, because then, you know, they've made that decision instead of me. You basically I've given them the option I've given them that the choices And it's not something that is out of control. So you just have to really communicate. And I do the same thing even when I'm shooting. So this may or may not be relevant to videography, but, um, if I am kind of directing a shot and I'm quiet, they're going to start to worry that they're doing something wrong. Yeah, focused on getting my settings and getting everything like, is this OK? Ok, so I will be like, Okay, hang on. I'm just gonna back up 10 feet. You guys are doing great. Just give me a second to backup. You don't to do anything yet. Okay, I'm here. I'm just gonna get my setting style because it's a little bit different here. All right, We're good to go. Are gonna do this. So, like, I don't have to communicate all that, But it helps so much because they know what's going on. And they're like, Are you? Do we do we need to do something right now? Are you ready? Are you shooting? You know,

spk_0:   22:33
so, So awkward. It's so awkward for them. They have never been in that situation before. So, like any feedback you can give them. I did something when directing. Like, I may have the groom, like, brush the bride's hair back and I'll just be like, Yeah, that looks so good. Like, keep doing that. Okay? I'm just gonna go over here, get the different angle, because, like, otherwise, they just, like, get that scared puppy dog look on their face. Yeah, so

spk_1:   22:55
yeah, it's so literally. Just even if you're just kind of feel like you're rambling, it's really helpful to them when you're like, you're like, Oh, yeah. Keep going. You're gray. I'm just moving over to get a different angle. It's gonna look really different. Like you could do that without telling them that. But they're gonna be like, Are you done talking? Just keep keep talking all the time. I

spk_0:   23:13
totally agree. Um, do you have? I mean, you mentioned the tripod in the center of the aisle, but have you had any, like, bad experiences with videographers on the wedding day? Besides, that thing you mentioned?

spk_1:   23:27
Um, it's it's really I mean, in general, it's just like that getting in the way or getting things behind schedule. So if they I don't think they keep jumping, it's I know you have. It's such a tricky balance because I know you have to, like sometimes, like, jump in and get close, and so do I. And so I think in the same way that you have to constantly communicate with a couple, you have to constantly communicate with each other because I'll say, Hey, I need to just pop over there and get a shot. Is that okay? Am I gonna mess up your shot? Or like I know I'm going to be in your shop for a second? Or like for me? I know what you have to use flash in certain situations, and that's gonna kind of like they're going to see that their videos, a video, obviously flat. And so I'll try to communicate that. So it's the same thing, just everything you're doing, You know, if you can communicate, get up there and communicate and then, you know, use like use the reception and the quieter times in the dinner time to really get to know them and and just constantly say, like, Hey, here's my plan. I'm gonna set up a camera here and here, and I'm gonna be here like we always talk this out when they're coming down the aisle, I'm gonna be here. Do you want Is it okay if I'm here? So it should never be There should be no surprises. It shouldn't be like the bride's coming down the aisle and then you're like, Wait, what are you doing? Like they should always both people should always come together and say, Here's where I plan to be during this key shot. I'm going to need to jump in. So even if it's something that, like photographers might get annoyed by, like you're like, yeah, I'm gonna have to, like, jump in during the first dance and get a close up. And I'm I'm like the first dance is long enough that that's totally fine. Don't do it the whole time, but like, it's totally fine. But it's even better if they say, Hey, this is my plan. I'm gonna do this. So is that cool like, it's not gonna mess you up and then I'll be like, No, it's fine. Do it like do what you need to do. Just don't be there the whole time. Like, get it, Get your shot, Get down back. Yeah, yeah. So a lot of like are you shooting? You know, how tight are you shooting? What You know, just, like just communicate

spk_0:   25:26
Munich, everybody? Yeah, yeah, I think that's so, so important. And I think that you mentioned the first dance and that's like one of the few moments during the day where I think that there is, like some wiggle room, but specifically with, like the ceremony I try to be so so like open with the communication with the photographer. I usually run four cameras during ceremonies, so I just like, take a minute. I pull the photographer aside and like Point teach one because I helped three on a tripod and then, like one like on a gimbal. And so I just tell them like it's okay if he was need to stand in front of one of them to get your shock a little bit, I can cut two different angles. It's no big deal. Just, um, if you're not taking photos, just please don't stand in front of them if you can help it. Um, but, yeah, I think it's so important. And then it takes some pressure off of them, too, because being a wears so important,

spk_1:   26:12
that's such a great idea, because I have that. I've had situations like that where a camera is set up and I'm like, I really need to, like, get there just for a second. But I feel like I can cause they haven't told me so I love that you do that, that you actually communicate that and say It's fine if you decide to jump in for a second. But like don't just stand there the whole time you wear that they're here like let's work together and you know, most professionals they're going to know that and they're gonna do it. But it just it never hurts to tell them ahead of time and like, show that you're friendly and that you're not like, Hey, and then the other thing is like, just like don't say offensive things like I've just had videographers and I don't know, I just had videographers like Six say it'll be like a dinner just making conversation and they'll just, like, say, offensive things that I'm like. I just don't be negative like, don't sit there. We all have things that we want to complain about and we can set their dinner. We can complain about some of those things that don't like, complain the whole time. Like be a likable person,

spk_0:   27:08
huh? Yeah, I think that especially on a wedding day, it's That should be supposed to be such a positive day. And I think any sort of negative comment is like super unnecessary, even if it's like, totally warranted. Um, I think that it can totally drag the morale of like the entire team down, and it's just don't talk about it until you're packing up your gear to leave. Like no one needs to talk about how the maid of honor's drunk and fallen down, spilling drinks like, you know, any me like you don't need a sitting dwell on that. Um so for me at the videographer, one of like the the best parts of the day for me on the wedding day is filming like the couple at the romantic session. And that's the kind of like the bread and butter to my highlight films. And I know that that applies to a lot of videographers. Um, I personally do not like the idea of like having to set aside 15 minutes of my for my own like posing after the photographer goes. I prefer to kind of like jumpin like intermittently. Do you have any sort of like input on? Like maybe you do three poses, and then the videographer jumps in and, like, slightly moves them like, Can you talk about that at all?

spk_1:   28:21
Yeah, it's again, just like communicating out front. That's what I think, either sending an email ahead of time like not it's nice if you could send it a few days before the wedding, but it's even better if you can send it way in advance and, like kind of include the couple to make sure the couple knows. Hey, like, this is our plan. So you know, we're gonna kind of take turns posing because I found this is kind of like, totally personal preference. But sometimes I find that video it tends to work. Maybe this would be wrong, like better. Some of the more romantic poses might work better for video. And my style just isn't like super romantic like I'll absolutely have the romantic stuff. But mine tends to be. I'll use prompts that have them laughing together like saying things to each other that will make them laugh. And I use I use motions That's good for video. But, um, I do think like having that balance where you can take turns is really useful. So because sometimes those romantic poses, if that's the couple of like, oh, great, this is so pretty. This is beautiful. These are great shots I wouldn't have otherwise gotten. But I think it's also understanding, you know, if you can communicate ahead of time with the photographer and find out what their stylists and, um, and also the couple's personality, because I sent out a questionnaire to my couples, and I asked them In a lot of times, I'll have an engagement. Sessions will have a chance to get to know them, but I'll ask them questions about like, What's most them? Are they romantic? Are they goofy? Are they like homebodies? Cozy? And the types of couples that I work with often are not like, overly. They don't consider themselves like to be on overly romantic couple. They consider themselves to be, like, goofy kind of. And so I think that that's like both as a service to your client and also in working together. If you can send a questionnaire or you can work together to gather that information, that's really helpful, but definitely again just communicating so that it's not, like all romantic or all goofy like that. It's a good balance for what the couples looking for.

spk_0:   30:10
I have tried to make it a habit to just kind of snoop on the photographers Instagram page to get an idea of their style, but I hadn't really thought about like how that would apply to posing. So I think that's super smart and just like pay attention to what they tend to do so that you can kind of fill in the gaps where necessary to kind of get what you need on the wedding day. If you have any other takeaways that you just kind of want videographers to know or any other ideas, well,

spk_1:   30:39
don't be afraid to use the phone. I know that like some of us are very afraid of the phone these days on, don't be afraid to like. Pick up the phone and call the photographer ahead of time. Just look at the phone as soon as you book them. Since he booked the couple, find out who the photographer is. If you really like, you, can just email them, too. But it's really nice. It's really nice to have that quick. It can be a five minute call. They were just like or set it up and just be like I'd literally only need five minutes of your time. But it's just a really nice way. The sooner you can coordinate, the better. I think it's it's great to communicate on the day, but it's even better if you can spend like five minutes can make all the difference. If you could spend that five minutes ahead of time to make sure the schedule is totally set. And then you can also communicate with a couple. How does I'm here? Here's our game plan. The couple is gonna love you for that. Like, imagine you said you had the issues with schedule. Imagine if your photographer and videographer had, like, co email, do together, and they're like, Hey, we totally have a plan. You would be like That's awesome. I'm in such good hands. I love that you guys took the initiative to do that. And then you're more likely to then recommends both of them as a team to other people.

spk_0:   31:45
Yeah, that's that's a great point. I love that. Um, I guess I haven't really thought about that. One of the first questions I'm usually asked by clients before they book me is How well do I work with photographers? And I have such a hard time answering that because it's like we're all individuals, and so it's different. But I just trying to, like, reassure them that we're all like professionals and we're all there on their team, like we want to make your day the best possible, and so we're both going to do what we can, but I think it's a great idea to kind of strategize together to make sure that that's transparent with the couple.

spk_1:   32:18
And then it gives you a good answer when they ask that question, be like, Oh, yeah, I always try to make a point to connect ahead of time so we can work together as a team. And I found that it just makes things so much smoother if we know each other and we have a plan and we come in, like really as a team, so that you feel like we're meant to be there together instead of these two individuals competing for time.

spk_0:   32:37
I love that because I think that's like a huge fear with couples. And, uh, I think that's totally going above and beyond. To and that reflects really well on your business. And, um, like the client experience so great. Great takeaways. Okay, Allie. Well, thank you so much for coming on the show. Yeah. I hope you guys enjoyed listening to my conversation with Allie. I'm going to give a few key takeaways from this episode. But first, I want to tell you where you can find alley. If you want to learn more about her, you can find Allie at Alice's yard. Oh, I will link that in the show notes for you as well, and you can follow along with her podcast on Instagram at photo Field notes. I do highly recommend. Checking out our podcast photo field notes was one of the first podcasts I started listening to when I started my business. And even though her main audience is photographers, I think that she offers a lot of valuable information that we as videographers can apply to our own businesses as well. And, like I said in the interview, a huge part as to why I wanted to bring Allie on the show is that she's able to offer insight from a photographer's perspective in building relationships with photographers is so important. So to recap all of the information from this episode, photographers are more likely to refer you to their clients based on how they get along with you as a person, so do your best to be kind, be helpful and keep an open line of communication with a photographer before and during the wedding day. It could be really helpful to also attend local networking events and meetings so that you can start meeting local vendors in your area. Build those relationships and they will only end up benefiting you in the long run. If you are enjoying this podcast, I love it. If you would leave me review wherever you're listening. Those reviews go a long way in helping other filmmakers find the podcast, and it's my hope that I can help as many people as possible and until next time friends keep pushing forward.