Busting Glass Ceilings: A Talk with ICT Industry Icon, Penny Downey

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Again , the show's always free and will always remain free , but it does cost money to run this show , so you're really in for a treat . On today's show , I've got somebody really special joining us . She is a pro when it comes to marketing and running worldwide projects and actually making an impact .

And not just that this particular guest has an amazing knack for creating training programs . That's not only to inform but also to engage . I mean , if you're looking to amp up your partner and your customer relations , she is the person you're going to want to listen to . She sets apart and makes an initial icon .

She is incredibly passionate about equipping both customers and internal team members with the resources they're going to need to absolutely smash their business goals . Trust me , you're going to want to meet this and by the fact , because of this interview , I'm coming up , we're going to collaborate and do a show on vision boards , so make sure that you pay attention .

So welcome to the show . Penny Downey , how you doing .

I'm going to be moving into product management for our Wiring Devices Division , so I'm super excited about that , working with folks that need some new products from Eaton . But my background has been in ICT , chuck .

As you know , I've worked with , starting in early 2000s , working with several organizations where I was very fortunate and able to learn a lot about this industry .

And , you know , working with folks to help with communications and technologies that are coming on board Fiber , broadband back in the day , fiber optic , splice closures , splitters , all those wonderful things , helping market those , price those . I held roles in sales , administration , pricing and contracts , working with a lot of electrical and telecommunications companies .

You know managing contracts and bids and all those sorts of things , and that's kind of how I came into the industry in the early 2000s , working with those organizations . And around 2018 , my job was eliminated . A division of the company I was working for got bought out by another company .

They went through several rounds of layoffs and after about the fifth round my number came up and that's kind of how I came to be a part of Eaton Corporation . So it was a , you know , it was kind of a transition for me , but still working with a lot of the same folks , same distributors , a lot of the same contractors and people in the industry .

So it was a great fit for me and , being in this role for five years , I've learned an extremely amount of new things . You know everything in our industry is changing hand over fist . You know new technologies , new things going on all the time . So it's been it's been a wonderful experience and something I'm looking forward to for the next 15 or 20 years .

She saw a need and she rallied her troops and she , you know , really went after an opportunity to help women in this country , and I think that's a wonderful feat .

It's an astounding accomplishment for her and the people that she worked with , and she really drew attention to the things in the in the world that were not equitable for women and really tried to make a difference .

So I would definitely love to have a cup of coffee with Susan B Anthony and pick her brain over all the things that happened in her lifetime and how things have changed .

a . You know , everyone brings their own background , experiences and perspectives and I certainly want to do that , and I think it's unfortunate that women aren't afforded and offered a chance to be a part of more projects and more teams . That can , you know , bring a diverse group of experiences to a project or to a leadership team .

I think it's important that we , you know , have underrepresented people at the table . We need to have more women at the table so that , you know , every perspective and every person's background is really brought forward , and I think it would enrich a lot of our projects and make our team stronger .

So if you can't ride a bicycle , if all you have is a bunch of front wheels , right . So you know , I think I think you're right there , and you know , and our industry's , our industry's tough about having this whole glass ceiling thing , and you've actually broken two of them actually . One of them is , you know , having the college degree . That's one of them .

And then the other one is , you know , again , kind of the whole male dominated thing . So there's got to be somebody who , who has motivated you to get through that glass . What role models or mentors have you had to help you kind of get to where you are today ?

And my mom was really the first role model from an early age , you know she was a career woman , she worked outside of the home and she pretty much showed me that , you know , you don't necessarily have to be perfect all the time , but you can have a career and you can have a family , and I saw that experience in her and that really drove me to want to

do more and want to have both . And my mother-in-law , beverly , you know she had an extremely strong work ethic and she took a lot of pride in her work . She was very driven and a highly analytical woman in a male dominated pharmaceutical field . So she , you know , she showed me in many ways how you could become a strong woman leader .

And then , back when I first transitioned into an ICT organization , I had a mentor and a supervisor who really taught me how to look at business from an internal and an external lens .

You know , make sure you know who your audience is before you communicate and when you communicate , and understand what they're looking for and what they need to be able to do their job , and she was phenomenal at that . She was just a wonderful mentor to me and I still call her to this day .

The biggest problem I see we have now is an unconscious bias , meaning somebody is a bias that it comes from . They don't realize that they're being biased . Right , for example , they might .

They might give somebody a female tech on a crew an easier job because , for whatever reason you pick a , you know chivalry or they don't think they're strong enough or whatever . So there's this whole unconscious bias . Right ? What advice would you give somebody who comes across that unconscious bias ? How should they handle that ?

A lot of times we get complacent in our jobs and we're willing to do the things that we do day in and day out , but we're not . Maybe we're not ready to be challenged , or if we are , we don't ask for that . So always speak up and ask . Biases are a part of who we are , our background and our experiences .

Everybody has unconscious bias , so I think it's just recognizing that and then steps to control that bias when you do recognize it right To do , to do the right thing all the time and to make sure everyone's included .

So bias can be a good thing but it's kind of intertwined with . I don't think we'll ever get rid of it . But the key is realize when there's an unproductive one or one that's not , doesn't , doesn't really apply anymore . That's , that's the key , I think , in our industry .

You know always include , include more people , get you know your entire team or maybe you know a good subset of people so that you can all have great conversation around a lot of different topics , and get you know everybody's input . It's important .

I went to the driving range and hit a couple of bucket of balls . I wouldn't look like an idiot , right ? So we get to this golf course , you'll get a kick out of this , and this is like the last time I've been golfing , so it just shows you how often I golf . So they get , we all got our little golf carts .

We go to the first tee and everybody knows that I'm the new guy and they said you go ahead , hit first and then we'll let you play through and then we'll come up behind you .

So okay , so I hit the ball , I take the cart , I drive down to where the ball is , hit it again , did make it to the green , drive the cart again , Hit it again , lay it on the green . I drove the cart up on the green , parked right next to the hole , and then put it in . And they were like did Zeno not to drive the golf cart on the green ?

People that I worked with 20 years ago . You know I still in many ways can work with them still today in the role that I'm in , if nothing but to give them a call and say , hey , you know I'd like to hear how you're doing and what's going on .

You know , with your life and in your area of business today , you know learning from these folks that you've , you know you built these relationships with and you know staying in touch . You know always communicate over communicate . You know it's really good just to network . You know early on in my career I really didn't know a lot about networking .

We didn't hear networking until , you know , way after college . But networking is huge in this industry and huge in life to be able to make those connections and to stay in touch with folks .

And you know people want to do business with people they like but they also want to network with people , and you know people that they have things in common or people that they can learn from . Just you know all sorts of interesting things with networking . But be curious , be a project leader , you know . Set large goals but have realistic expectations .

You know those are some skills that I have found that have helped me in the industry , and always be someone that wants to learn , you know . I think an education being trained , you know , taking on that curiosity to want to learn the next new thing or the next thing that you know is important in your industry or in your role , is super important .

Networking means getting around like-minded peers within your industry and getting to know them above and beyond their professional thing , like you and I have . You know so and I just wish I'd learned that a lot earlier than I did my career .

In fact , I did an episode on networking and how to read people and start conversations not too long ago and I wish I'd learned that a long , long time ago . But the thing I liked the most about what you said was be curious . I love that . I love that and I would couple with that Don't be afraid to ask a stupid question .

Yes , Right , Because a lot of times we'll be in a meeting with other people whom we perceive are smarter than us . And , by the way , you should always surround yourself with people who are smarter than you . That's been one of my rules of life , Right . And so sometimes we get stuck in that we're afraid to ask a question because everybody think I'm stupid .

Most people aren't going to think that Most people are going to think , oh , I need to help this person get up to the level that they want to get up to . And I guarantee you , I guarantee you that if you've been thinking that question , If you're in a large enough room , somebody else in that room has also thought of that very same question .

Let's talk a little bit about work-life balance , and this is one of those key areas that I always try to focus in on with successful people , and the reason I do that is because , unfortunately , I feel that I have not been the greatest at this and I've always been super work-oriented , to the point where I think that I've missed too many softball games or

cheerleader practices . Now that I'm getting older , I'm certain realize that I missed a lot of the stuff because I was out of town on a project , trying to get something done or whatever . So work-life balance is one of those critical issues . How do you manage your work-life balances , especially when the stakes are so high in our industry ?

. So , for myself , prioritizing my health and the health of my family and my relationships is super , super important . It's not something that I've always done well , but it's something that I've learned over time . To try to build in that time on your calendar when you have to unplug right .

We have so many people in our industry in the US that don't take vacations . They lose vacation time . Please , please . If there's one thing I can tell you , you need time to unplug so that you can be your best self when you go back to your office .

Take the time that you're given to do something that you enjoy outside of work a hobby , reading , whatever it might be .

But prioritizing your health to make sure for the long haul young women who are just starting their families and young families all the way through to retirement and beyond you need to prioritize your health because that is something that we take for granted until we don't have it .

And then you have to prioritize your relationships , the people that are special and important to you . Make sure that they know that and spend time . It takes time together to build those . So you know , build in that time that you need . Unplug when you can and it will .

Just it'll be a refresh , it'll be a reset for you to go back more energized and you can do even more when you are at work .

They just might need a mental health day to unplug , especially , you know , in our industry , because we do move at a fast pace and it can be , it absolutely can be stressful .

So , as a leader or manager , if you're listening , absolutely promoted and make sure that somebody doesn't feel like they feel bad if they have to take a mental health day , because sometimes we do .

I got interviewed on a podcast recently and they said we're stale , we're pale and we're male . That's just the way of saying old white guy right . I was like you're right , because when you go to any big city conference , you'll see it , you'll absolutely see it .

But being a veteran or going to big city conference for over 20 years , I am seeing a shift and I love that shift because we talked about that earlier . We are some of all of our parts and all of our parts are different . We're just going to get better , right .

So what steps do you think the industry should take to make this industry more attractive to women or people who are underrepresented ?

Even look outside of engineering . Engineering is a huge part of what we do as a business and an industry , but there's so many ways to get into the industry outside of engineering . Then you can come on board and find out . Well , engineering may be the path that you want to take or it may not .

Project managers , leading project business there's so many avenues to get into the information field . So we definitely need to actively recruit but then also visibly demonstrate and model inclusive behaviors for this group so they know hey , we want to be a part of this industry because they're welcoming .

We need to be welcoming and we need to ensure diverse leadership representation . So if it's coming from our leaders and it's coming from our CEOs and our project leaders and our managers and it goes from the top down , obviously people are going to hear about it and folks are going to want to be a part of these organizations and our industry .

We inherently know that as parents , because we know that when you've got a young kid who's two , three , four , five years old well , actually even older than that but you act the way you want your child to act , because your child is going to see you're doing stuff you don't want your child to smoke , then don't smoke cigarettes .

That's not gonna necessarily stop them from doing , but it's gonna . It's gonna . The chances are less , right . So modeling is a big big thing , right ? So yeah , so our industry's moving at the speed of light and that's not a pun , that's the actual truth , right ? I mean , sometimes it's hard to keep up with our industry . It truly is .

Where do you see our industry going in the next five to 10 years ? And , on top of that , what roles do you think women will play in that future ?

We'll probably be floored looking back in that

time and beyond . But I think women women wear so many hats . We're really good at multitasking from you know all the different roles and responsibilities we have and I think women play a future in the part that you know .

We can come on board and lead projects and multitask and be a part of something that needs , you know , that next level of detail and understanding .

You know we all have our strengths and weaknesses , but I think overall , women are great at multitasking and being able to take on a project or a leadership position and be empathetic but also be driven by the goals that the organization sets and by the goals that they have set for their positions and their jobs .

So , you know , I would encourage women to really jump in in this industry because there is so much change and excitement going on . You know , don't be afraid of the change and all the things that are happening . You know , embrace it . You know , I think you know it's part of that being curious , right ?

You know I'm about to jump into this challenge about all these wiring devices and connected devices and this is going to be , you know , something that I'm looking forward to this new challenge that I have and I , you know , encourage other women to do the same . Very cool .

You know I'm a firm believer in mentally visualizing things . I have a vision board that I try to keep up and , you know , look at and make sure that I'm working toward those goals .

So , you know , make sure that you know and I didn't do this early in my career , I wasn't as vocal as I am now about the things I want to do , the things I want to learn and where I want to go . And I think it's okay to verbalize that with your . You know , your managers , the company .

You know and talk to people and say , hey , I'm really interested in XYZ and I'd like to learn more about this . You know , is there a way that you can connect me with some folks and I can take on a side project ?

Or I'd like to learn about this so that maybe one day I could go into supply chain or whatever it might be , you know , whatever role it might be in the industry , just be vocal and , you know , don't be timid . Jump in and make a difference .

So it's a , and you can do anything from cutting out you know old days of cutting out magazines and putting it on a board to . I just took a Word document and pulled in images from you know print screens of things that I want to do , things like that .

that's cool , that's been one of my goals for a long time , and so you know how am I actively working toward that goal . You know , right now I'm in the software Duolingo . I'm a hundred plus days on Duolingo . Every day I try to go in and learn something new on there . You know what .

You know using the different software packages that are out there and are available to me for free . I've taken a class in Spanish , but you know , whatever your goals are , you know and whatever you want to do , you know , put it on that board and you can pull it up from time to time .

You can print it out and put it in front of you and then ask yourself what am I doing to make sure that these goals that I have in front of me , what am I doing to get there ? You know .

I would have never in a million years thought , hey , I need to do an episode on vision boards , because you know I have a vision board but it's in here and some , and because I got so much stuff going on in there between you know , all my things I got going on .

Sometimes things get lost , forgotten about , and that's where that's where a vision board will come into play , because you can periodically whatever daily , weekly , monthly just kind of go back and look at oh yeah , yeah , I focused , I wanted to do something on that . So , yeah , that watch out for future content on a future show on on vision boards .

You know , you know we all grew up hearing , oh , just , you know , do the hard work and you'll be promoted . You know , sit back . You know , do the work . And you know , yes , that happens , but you have to be intentional . A lot of times nowadays , you know you have to be , you know , involved in different things . Make yourself known .

Network , again , networking is huge . It's important . I'm a part of a couple of organizations within my company Wave Women Adding Value at Eaton . It's our inclusion and diversity group .

So you know , being a leader in my area with Wave has really offered me a lot of opportunities to meet people that I would have never met before and had the opportunity to speak in front of different groups and organize events and things . Toastmasters I love . I'm a part of a Toastmasters group , right , and you know just putting yourself out there .

You know , I wish someone had told me to just be more vocal and put myself out there a little bit more .

We're doing a lot around cybersecurity . We I know that's a really important topic for a lot of folks and you know this the whole world right now to make sure that we have cybersecurity locked down . You know Eaton is an incredible company .

It's a hundred-year-old company and there's we're putting so much money into digitalization and cybersecurity and new connected products . You know , all the time . So we've got a new lithium ion UPS that just came out . So you know we're always innovating and putting out new products and you know I'm really proud of the company that I work for .

We make some incredible products . You know a lot of people know us for our . You know the electrical division , the circuit breakers and all those things and the wiring devices . But then you know the critical power piece UPS is PDUs . You know our remote management software called Bright Layer data center suites . That is a game changer for us .

You know , having that connected remote management and all the data and analytics behind it , you know that's where our industry is going . You know you can't roll a truck . You know effectively to all these places . When you get alarms , when things go down , how do you do it , and how did we need to do it during COVID ?

You know you have remote capabilities , you have people that you know get alarms on your phone , alarms at your desk , and then you can do it remotely . So that's really where the industry is going and and Eaton has got a great product for that excellent , great catching up with you , great having you on this show

. Thank you so much , chuck .

If you know of somebody whom I should highlight as an industry icon , get in touch with me . Let me know . I'll get them on the show until next time . Knowledge is power .