#067 Intermittent Fasting 101 with Victoria Hahn, MS, RDN

spk_0:   0:00
part of the area that he grew up in Italy. That just happens to be one of the blue zones. And so he was trying to figure out, you know, like, What's the common denominator between all of these areas And, of course, sleeping patterns, social behaviors, lifestyle in general, you know, fitness level. All of those things play a rule. But when you look at it diet and of course, that was his main objective is looking at diet. I found that the alternative plans, they incorporate some sort of lean protein, maybe fish, and it does tend to be more like this Mediterranean diet lifestyle.

spk_1:   0:33
Welcome to the less stressed life podcast. This is your host Krista Bigler, Private practice, Integrated nutritionist helping people across the U. S. Reverse digestive issues, Exuma and Auto Immunity via phone and video. Consult toe. Learn more. Visit less stressed nutrition dot com Now onto the show Today on the Lester's life, we have Victoria Hunt. So Victoria is really my expert on intermittent fasting because in the past she worked in Dr Vaulter Longo's laps, so you might not know who that is, but he is sort of the premier researcher for intermittent fasting in the United States. She can correct me later if I'm wrong. That's how I view it. And he wrote the book The Longevity Diet. So Victoria is the dietician used to work in that lab and now really works with kind of an adjunct to Longo's research What she can tell us about later. But she's really a clinical dietitian, has a background in nutrition research specialist, specializes in masters and nutrition health span in longevity somewhere thinking about Norman fasting, were thinking about it longevity and really has a passion for research and evidence based practice. So today she's gonna enlighten us all about intermittent fasting, and we're so happy to have her Thanks for joining us, Victoria.

spk_0:   1:46
Well, thank you. I'm excited to be here. And, of course, talking about what? The love, which is fasting.

spk_1:   1:51
Yeah. Yeah, I used to hate like I used to be such a turnoff for me because I think like, who doesn't want to eat? I mean, I'd love eating, but it's my favorite thing. So I kind of rephrased intermittent fasting or fasting to gut rest because I thought, Well, that kind of resonated with me a little bit. We'll give those guts a break. Um, and I used to be the girl who waas always packing a bunch of granola bars everywhere. Definitely. Subtitle sugar and intermittent fasting can really be kind of an interesting tool to overcome some of those kind of kind of blood sugar each things. And so we're gonna talk about a lot about it. But it's It's a very trendy topic right now that could easily get misconstrued. And I'm sure if people have been around the podcast for a while, they may have heard me mention the story. I just love this cute story had with this guy one time where hey said Krista. I was intermittent fasting today. I didn't have much and I said, Honey, that is skipping lunch, not intermittent fasting. There is a huge exactly. So we gotta get things that there is some really like a nuanced things that I don't think a story. It's kind of funny, so I'll let you break it down for us. Tell us what is intermittent fasting, and can you tell us about some of the types?

spk_0:   3:02
Yeah, definitely. So the way that I define intermittent fasting is really just fasting, in essence, not done all the time, which ends up kind of being a whole bunch of different types of fast And when you want to separate it out, like anything, umbrella term, fasting. And if you think about it in terms of duration time, either not like all the time or not all the time, it's very easy to see that most of us practice some form of not all the time fasting. However, if you wanted to make it more specific, we do actually have some amount of classifications in regards to intermittent fasting, periodic and or prolonged fasting and then, of course, timers, chicken eating, which, I would say, is probably the most popular one that I've heard of more recently. So they just to find a few of those ones I ask for intermittent fasting can be defined as a complete and or partial 24 hour restriction that's done at least one or even more times a week. Normally, it's no longer than three days so that we can usually those data not contiguous so they're not, you know, wondered after another. Now Chiari, which is like a super popular right now, it means exactly what it does it mean. It means which is time restricted eating. So it's when you restrict eating to a certain window of time. Normally, this is no more than 3 to 12 hours per day, where you're only eating during those hours. So I think one of the more interesting ones that I've heard of which I don't personally practice this. But it's the one meal a day, so they sauce for 20 hours a day, and then we'll eat for only four, which is very intense in my personal opinion. And I don't really, um I would not try to do this type of fast, but some of the more interesting kinds of fast things really take place with the longer version of fast, so periodic fasting or prolonged fasting, whichever one you'd like to use. We can acronym it by saying PS, and in essence, that's really defined his 3 to 7 days that are continuous so one after another of fasting and usually that's per month. So it's not to be done for a very one Peter time. But the duration of that fast is longer, and that has a lot to do with what ultimately can do.

spk_1:   5:08
Okay, got so to recap, we've got TR your time restricted eating, which, um, is really often Some people are doing with one meal a day, which is a bit restrictive because it's 20 are fast for our eating window. It's like the kitchen is up in four hours, closed the other 20 hours, but it doesn't have to be quite like that. Like, what are some other common ones?

spk_0:   5:27
Yeah, some of the more common ones would be like the 16 8 So fasting for 16 hours eating for eight or even the 12 12 of course, backing for 12 hours and eating for 12 hours,

spk_1:   5:38
which isn't really very weird because, honestly, um, fasting overnight for 12 hours is maybe a good practice to just stop us from, like, mindlessly snacking all the time. So that's something that's not really to crazier odd. And if you can't make it that far and you don't have a medical condition, then where you you know, which is another topic thing that's not too crazy at all? So it's kind of like there's there's so many versions, and some of them aren't really that different from what's normal. You we are gut needs a break to do its work. Right? So exactly So, um so which one is your favorite? You sad more so,

spk_0:   6:17
you know, in my personal opinion. And it's a little biased because, of course, I do work with a company where we kind of only focus in on this type of fast. But I do know a lot about it. And in my 1st 1 thing, if you're looking for the truth benefits of fasting, which I believe tend to be these stress resistance responses, things like cellular clean up and repair generation rejuvenation things within that realm that I'm really thinking of periodic and or prolonged fasting. So really fasting for days at a time. And like I said, it has everything to do with the amount of time that your action that fast. However, I will also argue that t r e, even though it does seem pretty straightforward, I mean, I think most of us practice some form of t r e, which is why I was saying most of practice fasting, whether we know it or not, Um, it does play a role, and it likely does serve an actual purpose just beyond, of course, restricting our eating behaviors. There is a natural biological rationale to tryto have periods of eating and then, of course, periods of rest. Just as you were saying, G, I rest. It is super important, and although we haven't defined that out too perfectly, it is to say that it's something that we should be cognizant of it. Let's see if we can try to control it, and we're not too extreme about it.

spk_1:   7:34
So on that note, I feel like there's a lot of technical terms here, but in my head, I if I had to summarize this really quickly, I feel like intermittent fasting is a period of eating sometimes and not eating other times, and it can either be prolonged or, you know daily, uh, it's best if it's not daily in a row too much. Um, it's something that you cycle in and out, and so you can correct me if you think anything different than that. That's kind of how these are some of the things I think of, but with intermittent fasting. Also, you you, when you give the proper definition, you said complete or partial limited food I think this is kind of interesting because kind of the company you work with, you get a prolonged fast, but you're still eating. So it's not like you're not e t f for those times. So can you explain that a little bit, cause that's kind of interesting and unique, and then maybe we'll talk about some other benefits, but that's kind of that. It would be a misconception. I think for a lot of people, that's like, kind of the the We're

spk_0:   8:26
definitely, definitely. I mean, aside from other things, I would I would definitely argue that one of the biggest misconceptions is that fasting is exactly what we think of it when we look at the dictionary, which is the absence of food or drink, maybe for religious observation. But it's really not just that it has so much more to do with a biological process. And whenever I think of the word fasting or just passing on, the whole I don't think is that common definition. I tend to think of that biological definition, which is to say it's reprogramming if you will of your physiology, so you're triggering a very specific type of response. But which became categorizes fasting and I could get into more technical surrounding that. But in essence, when you started to think of it as a biological process, I mean we could manipulate many biological processes right. Then you can start to think of it as something that maybe something initiates it and that something tends to be what we would call the nutrient sensing pathway. So there's very specific genes into play with this matron, something pathway that you could actually try to target and with that being said, technically have ah similar or spruce mimic that same response that you would get with the omission of food. But of course you're still introducing some amount of nutrients, so it has a lot to do with the amount that you're providing. And, of course, what types of mechanisms were thinking of at that point in time. But really just trying to shift that framework from oh well, fasting is completely not eating anything. It's so much more than just thought. It's actually a physiologic process that can be controlled by very specific amounts of macro. Of course, micronutrients.

spk_1:   10:06
Totally. Okay, so let's do I'm you know, I'm convinced by what the benefits are. So let's talk about benefits of fasting, first of all, and then maybe the contraindications. So where do we see the intermittent fasting like, what are the main benefits? And then what are some of the other things that we've seen as benefits as well?

spk_0:   10:24
Yeah, kind of. I want to run of the mill benefits of most types of fast, although it is very specific, and it depends on the kind of fast. But just generally speaking, if you look at any of the articles that are being published today, more often than not, they're showing that he's fasting. Patterns are related to a maintenance of healthy levels of a multitude of metabolic markers, things like glucose, tracklist, arised, blood pressure, especially in regards to the S. M. D. That something that we did observe in clinical trial but also, of course, some amount of weight loss. What I will argue against that is that technically, fasting should not be used as a standalone way off therapy, and that's a huge misconception to try that, you know, circle back to another question. It is to say that fasting can be an ancillary to support an overall weight loss program. But what we're seeing, especially in regard to the five to die, which is one form of fasting. So it's five days of normal calorie intake in two days of fasting. Sometimes they're together. Sometimes they're separate. It just depends on the individual and what protocols they're following. But what we've seen is that that from a fasting when you compare it to just continuous kala restriction of the same duration of time, there's no significant difference in between the two. So at that point in time, it just depends on really what you want. But we do see. Of course, weight loss is being an additional benefits. But when I start to think about the more interesting benefits and Soc was fasting, it does depend on the duration of the fast in order to trigger these processes. So when I think of the S M. D or a prolonged slash periodic fast, I really look at those types of fast helping to support the body's natural functions. Thio one course enter into a protective and stress resistance mode, but also to remove damaged tiles and tissues on then the last thing, which is probably the most logical part of this. It's promote self repair through cellular regeneration and rejuvenation. So has a lot to do with what you were kind of saying a little bit earlier. That G I rest. It's almost like a body wide system. Wide rest.

spk_1:   12:26
Yeah, So let's is there, like, a good analogy for cellular repair? Is it kind of like garbage cleanup, you know, do you? Yeah. Let's talk about that.

spk_0:   12:35
Yeah, normally, whenever I just that, um, I'll try to say that, you know, for yourselves they you could think of it like a house. And let's just say that there's like, a person who in this house that could be an organo, whatever you want it to be. So yourselves over time, you know, as with your house, you have to do some spring cleaning. You may accrue some, you know, trash everywhere, depending on how clean you are. And unfortunately, this is just a part of yourself. They accrue a lot of trash, so they're just trash all around. And if you don't give it proper time, actually clean up. But it's just going to keep all that trash around him. Now it's fasting. You're actually giving it an opportunity. You're literally permitting it. Hey, you know what today is Spring cleaning day, so you can start taking out all that trash. And so that's exactly what it's going to do. We call that process of Takaji. It's a form of cellular clean up, and not only just that, it even goes like the extra mile. So it's not just taking out the trash, but your recycling it. So you're re utilizing the little trash particles trying to repurpose them into something more functional and better while you are in that stressful state, which would be fasting.

spk_1:   13:40
So

spk_0:   13:40
that's kind of the analogy for that cellular cleanup phase is really you just taking out the garbage, which normally you wouldn't be doing If you're just eating all the time, It's the process that really occurs when you

spk_1:   13:53
So the technical word is a top Fiji and is there. The body is using the utilizing a ta fa jee otherwise, but fasting makes it much more efficient and creates that more frequently. Is that correct or incorrect?

spk_0:   14:06
It is to say that other things can up regulate or stimulate that process. But one thing that we know definitely does is fasting, and the reason for that is because when you are fasting, don't have enough nutrients that are coming into your body's kind of like an owl. My gosh, like I need to start figuring things out like I've my bank is empty like I'm losing all the money sort of issue. And so what it's going to do is start to sell off things, if you will. We can try to use the trash analogy against Let's say that you know it, trying to clean up things, and it's been a stressful environment than what it'll do. While it's in need of new nutrients or sing to utilize during that stressor, it'll utilize what it has available, which would be less functional components of you of the cell or other misfolded proteins. And so fasting is one way to be able to trigger that process, although other stressors can also trigger a Takaji. But those air, of course, a little more gelateria on serious in nature.

spk_1:   15:06
Okay, so actually, this reminds me because we're thinking about like the body's saying, Oh, I need Thio cleanup in unload junk because I can't take everything. It makes me think about. Let's talk about some of the contraindications actually for fasting and where it's not indicated, and then we'll go back to rapid fire you on other benefits and how fast infect something. So I always say, there's some things I want people to never forget about fasting you might be missing. You might be skipping a meal, but I think it's important to not skip nutrients or to try to be especially nutrient dense when you are eating or to consider that piece. And I think that some maybe possibly a place where people could kind of fall into a problem because our people's dyas completely nutrient dense as they should be otherwise like unless unless they're very cognizant about it. So I mean, to me, that's a contra indication. But what do you see? His contraindications. And there's others as well, of course. But what do you see? His contraindications or reasons or thoughts on wife? Someone shouldn't faster special considerations that hey, let's not forget this piece.

spk_0:   16:04
Yeah, no, definitely. I know that for our fast, even making diet, we do have considerations and, of course, safety precautions and go over some of those because it would still be in line with intermittent fasting patterns as a whole. So those that are kind of in this region, where I would say you're in a pro growth mode. So let's say you're a pediatric individual or you're pregnant or you're lactating. This would not be a time for you to fast. You need to grow in fasting. You can think of it as course stress resistance, but you could also think of it as anti growth technically, so if you're fasting, you're not going to growing. You're gonna try to, you know, utilize what you have available, and although that's a gross oversimplification, it's still kind of true. So for anyone who's in this growth phase, we wouldn't want you to fast. It's something that you can wait for later on, when you're more stable and when it's a little more appropriate. In addition to that, individuals who have an active infection or have a fever, diarrhea, nausea, vomiting, any of those things you're ready and distrust er, you don't need to add more stress to your life. This is not a time to be fasting. You got to get better and, you know, support your immune system is with that being said, Of course, anyone who is a well nourished, definitely not a time to be fasting. You got to figure out why you're malnourished and of course, get to a mourner ST. And I know you're familiar with this, Krista, but in case your listeners or not, you could be of, ah, multitude of B m. My range is always from morbidly obese to very malnourished. And of course, meal nourishes the whole because my creations are still important. So it is to say, If you know that you are or if you as a clinician, you know, you see your patient is this is not a time for fasting. And then, of course, if someone is experiencing some sort of immuno suppressor, the pressing type issues. So if someone already doesn't have a fully functioning immune system, then it's not a time for them be fasting. Now I can also get into some medical conditions where it would be a risk too fast. But ah, hold off on that. As there are special considerations, if the one does have a medical indication, whether or not they should be fasting or what kind of fast would be most gelateria for them.

spk_1:   18:24
Okay, um, I'm gonna tag on a couple of things from what you said. So I'll summarize is Well, so anyone in the growth phase? So we think about and you and growing and Children, pregnant women. Anyone else crap Trying to grow natural fits into that. Those the 1st 2 people have popped into my head. Anyone infections, right, Because those infections are actually gonna damage. They're going to work on making people nutrient replete as well. And mel nourishment. I think there's a broad spectrum of what that can mean sometimes. And it might be a different term. I might use a different term than what someone else might. So when we think about malnourishment in a hospital or clinical setting, look at certain lab markers, we say, Oh, yeah, this person just not really nourished. But I think in general there are people out there walking around with, like, a lot of nutrient efficiencies. And I just have a bias, right, because I look at that, um so I think in general it's just a matter of okay, So if I started, you know, I'm coming from places like crappy diet. Maybe That should be my first stop before I try to experiment with fasting a little bit. Um, depending on how you approach it, it's just a possible I'm just throwing that in there. Just food for thought here. So, uh, let's talk about some of those medical conditions because actually, this is the piece where we don't have to get into real depth. But, you know, you've got people with blood sugar and balances or more diagnosed blood sugar issues like diabetes and some other things. And there are programs out there that work on fasting in relationship to glucose or diabetes levels. So can you speak to anything about that? Like, do we? How do we see that those improves? I'm sure we always want someone to be monitoring. But the tricky thing is, how does someone find someone who can help them monitor that? That's the tricky thing that we may not be able to answer today. But that is kind of the the challenging piece with something that's kind of newer in science years, or at least in medical, like how it's being applied in medicine years. It feels like you're practitioner may not really know a lot about this. So what do you say to those people

spk_0:   20:18
so far is trying to find Resource is for implementation of fasting. If you are someone with a medical condition, no matter what type of medical condition, it is Laura. If you are on medications, that is always best practices to find a clinician that can supervise you while you go on a fast, mainly because, of course, a fast does. It can alter your physiology, and with that being said, that can happen only your medications, but also your medical diagnosis and how that paso physiology works. So as a whole, it's always best toe. Try to find a practitioner. Now, if you don't have a practitioner more often than not, there are resources available out there. I would say that most clinician to function as either an integrative and or functional medicine practitioner. They tend to be some of the individuals that actually adopt fasting in their practices. There's a wide right of resource is I know that there's a whole group with the academy and nutrition dietetics where they actually will find a practitioner portal so they may be a hope, and those are all registered dietitians who would really be kind of the expert teeth that you'd want to go for. But in addition to that, um, the company that I work for Al Neutral we do also can provide you with information in regards to clinician that practice at least the type of fast that we have, which would be the Boston mimicking diet and or prolonged flash periodic fasting. And we can give you, like, a little bit of a recommendation as faras some local practitioners, we'd of course, some several names and reactively can provide you with some information surrounding fasting. And if it's appropriate for you or not, although we don't diagnose. Um, we're doing that here on, and we can actually talk to you too intensely about your medical condition if you are calling about that. But at least we can try to point you in the right direction.

spk_1:   22:11
Sure, and we'll talk about Canelo Children. What prolonged fasting is here and a little bit. So, um, you know, medical conditions. Contraindications kind of won over that, um I think another one that is not it's not that I feel I feel like you're so good at like the the warnings on the box like you're very appropriate warnings on the box. But for me, I'm like, if someone has, like, a bad food relationship, maybe fasting is not a good fit for them. Because there could be so definitely

spk_0:   22:40
no, that that is something that I should have totally mentioned. If someone has a history of an eating disorder, definitely. So you in for sure? You're gonna want Thio speak with your clinician prior to doing fasting at all?

spk_1:   22:56
Totally. Okay, So we talked about intermittent fasting and it's in, You know how we're seeing benefits in the research around metabolic markers meaning triglycerides, cholesterol markers, blood sugar, Marco's etcetera and sometimes weight loss, even though that shouldn't be used as a standalone weight loss. Um, piece. But I do have some, like rapid fire questions. So there are whole programs that are focusing on weight loss with intermittent fasting. Let's just talk about whether I have, like, a whole pile of questions here. So is intermittent fasting more effective for weight loss if you work out fasting and so, like people talk? I worked for a program for a while where there was a big, intermittent fasting piece of it, and people would say, Oh, can I work out when I felt like I think it's how you feel? Do you have opinion about this or do you know the science on this?

spk_0:   23:44
The kind of little bit of bulls I definitely haven't repeating in, although I want to stick with facts, Um, as faras what we know, it's honestly, super hard to say. Exercise physiology is a whole arm of research in its own right, and I would argue that we need MAWR in order to figure out not only what type of extras are you doing both duration with intensity. Who are you? All of these things play a role in how fasting is going to interact with course you're exercising and ultimately, ultimately the amount of weight that you're going to lose now in regards to just thinking about it from a medical perspective on and in the interim of having that type of information. Honestly, it's risky to exercise if you are fasted, mainly because that can help to stimulate, of course, things like dizziness, possible fainting and, ultimately, a workout related injury. So with fasting physiology, you're naturally going to be in a state where you don't have enough nutrients to technically fuel the workout that you're going to do now. Of course, if your ultimate goal is way lost, yes, that's going to help stimulate some out of fatty acid breakdown, because that's what you're gonna partially you're gonna use other things as well. But that's partially what you're going to use toe. Feel your work out out, depending on what kind you're doing. Lover. There's a lot of risk associated with that. And even when you consider the fact that with working out technically that's going, although initially in line with fasting, ultimately could be against how fasting truly work. So really thinking about the benefits of fasting so it could be counterproductive and even retesting lean body mass loss, depending on what you do after the workout. So there's a lot of gray area in regards to fasting and, um, exercise, and what I say is right now we don't have a lot of information surrounding that, Um, and it can be very risky, so I wouldn't recommend doing that.

spk_1:   25:41
Okay, so on that same kind of know does Are we concerned? The intermittent fasting in general causes muscle loss I feel like this is also great cause it depends on how long you do it, etcetera. So what do we know about

spk_0:   25:53
Yeah, so definitely still gray. But what I can say is that there has been a few studies out there to show that, unfortunately again, it depends on what kind of faster doing but the shorter term past where they're like a day or two. Then you kick yourself out of it real quickly. Those have been linked to lean body mass loss on DDE. Part of the hypothesis as to why this is occurring is because we know that when you start to fast at least pure water fast, I'm going, of course, to degrade your glycogen reserves. But another process that happens early on in the fastest amino acid degradation and the main reason for any of these processes to make sure that your blue coast is being maintained in the home of static level. As a tip or miss, it's not compatible with life. And so it is to say, early on in a fast there's nothing to really curtail that amino acid degradation. And if you were to kind of go in and out of a fast. It's possible to let some of that I mean, it lasted, maybe lost. And so it's possible that that's the translation of that lean body mass loss that some of these studies are reporting. Somethingto also note, though, um, you know, nicely and a little, uh, a little bit something that we had it necessarily considered. Although we're thankful for when we did our clinical Charl with the F m d. The vacuum in making diet, Um, we did, of course, measure weight loss, and I can get to that at a later point. But one thing to know is that in relationship to wait. We did not observe anyone body mass loss and, of course, with the f nd at least one that we were utilizing that global trial. That was five days, five consecutive days off. Fast and

spk_1:   27:33
well. You've mentioned the F M D a couple times, so I think it's a good time for us to define it so people aren't saying What are they talking about? You were willing to gratify in that part. So let's talk about what is a fasting mimicking dia. It's like you get the benefits of asking, but you get to eat. So tell me what the catch is here.

spk_0:   27:50
Yeah, So it pretty much is that it's literally exactly with the name says. It is a diet that mimics fasting. So as far as the kind that we have out, we only have one on. We did have a clinical trial to show its efficacy, but in essence is five consecutive days worth of food. So you actually get food with this fast, and that food is in such a specific macro. Nutrient is much cooler range, that which helps to circumvent the activation of the nutrient sensing pathways. I was mentioning earlier so that ultimately you can promote and mimic up same physiology of fasting without having to fast. So there are, you know, three square meals a day for the most part, snacks in between, you have meals such a I'm not based for chocolate Christie bars. There's a variety of soup, and we also have some herbal teas in there, some kale crackers and whole green olives. So it's Ah, it's pretty dense meal, especially when you think of fasting. And if you think you have the common definition, it's like, Wow, How can it be fasting with this? But just going back to that biological definition, you can definitely hope to promote saying physiology of fasting. But you have to be very specific about the macro nutrients as well. The cork ranges, which is what Dr Long ago had done. And this is how we have the diet today,

spk_1:   29:12
right? And it's very specific and there is a diversion in his book. And then you guys have kind of like a pre done version, and I have some links about kind of some different intermittent fasting things and links to where we find these things. I'll put him in the show notes to make it easier, But this is this is something I have used as well. So let me go now, Thio. I don't think we will put this kind of in some of our I didn't even tell you that we were gonna talk about this, but I think sometimes in my brain, soon as we try to mix intermittent fasting with ketosis and it can be a method to get two key Joe's is, and we don't need to talk about ketosis exactly. But is there something that you want to say here about how these air kind of different or how they complement?

spk_0:   29:53
Oh, yeah. Um, so full disclosure. I do have some amount of experience with the ketogenic diet. Of course, it's mainly clinical work and utilizing it with a pediatric patient that has apple. It's unfortunately, but you do have to say that they are different now with fasting. Uh, real raisin, where you're perpetuating ketosis is because you don't have new trains coming in, and you're trying to maintain that blood sugar from US static level. So in an effort to do that in an effort to, in essence, curtail the use of glucose, you're going to start, do burn more fat and by way of saturating out certain types of processes, you'll start to see key toned bodies rise, and basically they're just more available form of fat molecule. You can think of it like that now, with the ketogenic diet, it's much different. The reason why you're stimulating ketosis is not only that we have a very low amount of trouble hydrates and also proteins combined. Proteins can convert into carbohydrates, and in essence, you can a little sugar. Two point we want to key tones, but also the fact that you're pushing in your prime ing the body to not only not have enough carbohydrates to really get certain met about processes to occur, inefficient rate to be able to use them. But you're supplementing with such an abundant amount of fat that you're starting to push forward and drive that fat burning process. So it's not necessarily that you're burning your own fat. Rather, you're burning the fat that you're feeling your body with. Although it can be something to be said

spk_1:   31:26
that

spk_0:   31:27
maybe it's also stimulating some amount of fat burning process by way of you already being in a fat burning mode, if you will. Um, it's really because of that low carb, very high fat nature.

spk_1:   31:38
And to be clear, just back to 101 Ketosis is really burning fat, right? Essentially, like using fat for fuel and carbs for fuel. And fasting is not, you know, reducing the complete or partial limitation of food. And so, in theory, you're not taking in food for energy, and so then, if you're fasting for a certain length of time, which would be different for different people because it's going to matter how much glycogen, or basically like store joker is essentially hanging out in the liver, like so, if you like, start before you went on a fast, you just ate a bunch of cupcakes. You probably have more glycogen storage that would actually take a longer to make that shift into fat burning mode. Just I just wanted to share that, cause I think people would want to end up, like, how long would you have to fast in order to go into ketosis, like in theory, to start during that, you know, burning fat instead of carbs. Well, it depends on how much you have a story, which means he doesn't know you're depends, but that's okay.

spk_0:   32:34
I know, I know. I mean, hey, is something that I learned early on with nutrition. Is that? And I guess it can be said for everything, right? The more you know, the more you know, you don't know,

spk_1:   32:43
especially

spk_0:   32:44
in regards nutrition because we told it. It seems kind of straight porn. It's like, Oh, well, we're just eating here in eating leads to the living. And so therefore, you know, I should probably eat things because I'm gonna get the nutrients they need to feel my body. And, you know, these are all good things. However, it can get so complex. So she was there to try to answer these very specific questions. You get really granular about it. You have to realize like, Oh, wow, Well, I don't even know how this process works. I just know that we kind of say this broad statement, and we have a lot of assumptions, but it's so difficult to try to find how and why it marks is mainly because boots are complex. There's many different things in the world with truth, a single carbohydrate that you're eating. So, yeah, without things that it's, uh, it's always fun to say that it depends because it really does.

spk_1:   33:34
It does so, so more rapid fire questions. Um, if you're fasting is the best to ah, let's pretend it's like partial fasting like Is it best kind of cycle? Um, intake and general energy and take up or down and change it up or keep it the same? Or do we not know that

spk_0:   33:52
honest to goodness, we don't know that yet. However, what I will say is that If you look at more of an ancestry, A ll approach to fasting. You know, there were periods of feasting and then period of fasting. So it's not like invader force onto us, right? So we didn't have a choice like a You know, I'm gonna fast today. It

spk_1:   34:09
was more

spk_0:   34:10
like, Wow, there's no food around us. And so therefore, I'm gonna have to figure this out in the more fast of like sun. So with that being said, there probably is some logic to not be nothing fasting all the time, in essence, especially when it's more of that type of prolonged periodic fast. So you don't want to be doing that for, you know, several times a month or anything like that. Likely, it really only cycled on once a month. So

spk_1:   34:36
Well, I

spk_0:   34:37
would argue that there's a cyclical nature toe thing.

spk_1:   34:40
Yeah, I mean, the concern is, and this is what maybe someone would say, like just Joe Schmo would say, is that if you're limiting your intake, you could be slowing down your metabolism. What do you think? Like, how would you How would you answer this?

spk_0:   34:55
So I feel like metabolism. It's It's such a fun topic only because it is just that complex and yet simple at the same time. So it's hard to say truth be told, but if I want to just think of it in terms of, you know, basic physiology, your metabolism is controlled by many different things. So your hormones or one, um, you know your muscle mass is another. And of course, your genetics and environmental factors of the hold.

spk_1:   35:21
I just

spk_0:   35:21
say one thing like Let's say that you're fasting. Technically, if you're losing weight when you lose weight, you got less well, So you have lost the Dipper sites. And yes, there's a difference eyes, even though, you know, they make us look a little bit heavier, if you will, they do use energy, and there's a reason why they're there. It's because they're storing the energy, so they had a lot of energy, and now they're they're storing it, but they still burn energy. And so if you were to lose some of them, then technically you're losing cells. And if you're losing sellers, you with Mike Andrea, which is the energy powerhouse of yourself, and so therefore you're just using less energy of the whole. So technically, in that sense, you would be if you're losing weight. However, it's not that easy, and it's not that clear. So it's hard to say because some will argue that, you know, wow, I'm a talisman that shot up after I started fasting. But maybe they also started working out. And maybe we also have, you know, more lean body mass on lemons. We know that muscle mass takes a lot of energy to have to maintain. Some of those people need a lot of food to help maintain that musculature, so it's a complex topic. Unfortunately, it's hard to say whether or not yes or no. But at least what we can say is that it's possible that something is happening. But there are other things to consider when asking a question about metabolism and really, what happens to it, especially regards thio, fasting or anything

spk_1:   36:45
else, right? And I think this may be why when some people design protocols, they changed things up in the cycle things because if you keep things different, then in theory or not in this like Platt Toad Place or this budget, that's kind of like just some It's applying kind of an old school concept to, you know, this newer, newer thing that we do, right? I mean, kind of Oh, yeah. So you have slept funny because you said, Well, metabolism is influenced by hormones, genetics, et cetera. Great segue way. How does intermittent fasting effect you're gene expression? I feel like that's a hard question, because I need a preface by, like, you get genes from your parents. But how they express or how the light turns on in life depends on what's going on in your real life right now, like a lot of other factors. So how as fasting effect, how your jeans, air performing and how they work.

spk_0:   37:33
So I I won't necessarily say that it makes your jeans perform better or worse or anything like that. But what we can do is that, of course, James code for certain proteins. And when you're fasting, you have certain proteins that are technically being less active and other proteins that are being more active or other genes that are being expressed. So with that being said, what we do know is that fasting consciousness, genetic expression, in essence to promote fast a vino type Laura. Fasting physiology, basically. And what we can, I say, is that Dr Longer has helped to categorize what this actually looks like. So this would be those pro growth and or nutrients sensing pathways of talking about which I want to be more specific. I'm really thinking of things like M tour or mechanistic target myson I just won, or insulin like reflector one. And then also piquet or protein kind of eggs. In essence, with fasting, we are kind of circumventing their activation and subsequently we're seeing fasting occur at all of those are key factors that are turned on by nutrients and, of course, helpless to grow.

spk_1:   38:38
Did you give us a quick, Um, can you tell us when we're talking about M. Torrent? I g f and P k? Um, tell us what that is. Essentially. So that way we can bridge the gap here.

spk_0:   38:48
Yeah, so basically, you can think of them as these pro growth proteins. So they're all related to functions that cause our bodies to want to grow, to divide, to proliferate. And those are essential functions or not our bodies rather ourselves, right? So those are central functions. We need to be able to conduct cell cycles and grow and cause our bodies thio, differentiate or at least our tissues to differentiate. And that's compatible with life. If we did not have that, in essence, we would we would die. However, of course, was fasting. It's a time we're not growing, which is, in essence, kind of an anti growth stage. And it's really tryingto up regulate these other processes that are involved with stress, resistance and really a stressor type response where your body is like, Oh my goodness, I have nothing coming in. I need to preserve myself and in an effort to preserve right off, I'm gonna stop growing right now because, hey, this is not a time to grow like I don't have enough building blocks to be growing. So I'm going to try to capitalize on what I already have. And, of course, do things like theater hostage, you know, punching well earlier so that you can try to stay in a stress resistance mode so that you can live another day until course nutrients are readily available again and you can start building again. So that's really what their function is to basically help you grow.

spk_1:   40:14
Okay. Talk to me about what we know about intermittent fasting affecting hormones, which you and I know it was a loaded topic. But it makes people's ears perk up because they were like, Oh, what normals Eso talk? Um,

spk_0:   40:27
it yeah, it is a little bit of a low topic, isn't it? Well, what we can say And I can really only talk mainly about f m d. A similar types of faster. It's a little more difficult to delineate, but it was with Snd. What we've seen is that it has been scientifically demonstrated to supply the body was, of course, optimal nutrition without triggering those pro aging pathways that was mentioned earlier, including I Jeff one. So insulin like growth factor one which technically is one of the many different types of hormones that we'd be considering in relationship to just how fasting works. And so that's one of the ways that I ask, Can I suppose early period casting can interact with your hormone levels? It basically can shunt them towards an area where you're stimulating counter regulatory hormones to be able to, and so if you had a higher level of these growth hormones in the sense of like I just won and just pro grows the progress ideology. Then you would not be in a fasting mode, so it just wants it more towards a fasting physiology.

spk_1:   41:39
Got it? Okay. I like doing got health stuff, right? And so some people kind of say, Oh, you can use intermittent fasting too. Got healing stuff. And I'm like, Okay, not directly, exactly. But let's talk about the physiology of what happens in the gut when you're doing intermittent fasting.

spk_0:   41:55
So with intermittent fasting and with the gut, what I can say is that there is a lot of information out there right now in a relationship, too. Animal studies. But we don't have enough in human studies actually say what's really happening. What we can say is, you know, we know that diet can, of course, impact our got micro flora, especially in regards to fibers and insoluble type types of biologically active nutrients. Do it is to say liking something may be occurring. We just don't know exactly what it is, nor do we know to what degree, And you know, of course, if it's actually happening, so there's not a lot of information on Yes, but it's promising, because I know that we are actively looking at that. So I I'm sure more information will be available soon. And a lot of it is in, you know, animal trials right now. But that doesn't really tell us a lot of what happening.

spk_1:   42:56
The bio hackers want to know that if they're using intermittent fasting regularly, is there a specific food pattern? A k, a dire diet that seems to be most supportive in control. Bio

spk_0:   43:08
hacking.

spk_1:   43:09
Uh, I'm just I'm just saying I'm just saying people I always, uh, just stereotyping. People are into intermittent fasting. Might be those that are more pro into their health. And I always Sometimes I talk to people that are calling bio hackers right? And they're kind of into the top Fergie stuff, et cetera. So for someone who's really into things and they are really interested into the health effects of intermittent fasting, they wanna be supporting with a complimentary eating pattern or diet. Is there one that seems to work? Well,

spk_0:   43:38
you know, honestly, if you were trying todo bio hack fueled, and I would argue that probably one of the things that you're gonna want to do is a fascinating making diet. It's very straightforward and simple to do now, if you're thinking of. And of course, I would be in a relationship trying to do a periodic prolonged fast. If you're trying to think of something ancillary so you know you already faster, you're ready the F M D. And now you want to do something. Post FMD. Usually what we tell on individuals is you look to your medical provider. Whatever diet they think is best for you is really probably the diet that you need to be on, so we'll leave it up to them. However, if you don't have one, if you're already pretty healthy and you have just kind of wellness schools in mind, then I would argue that Dr Longo's longevity diet is honestly one of the healthier dice it I've heard of recently. And in essence, it's basically a Mediterranean plant based pesky Terrian diet. So we already know that training diet is super healthy. There quite a few clinical trial to show that

spk_1:   44:43
answer

spk_0:   44:44
efficacy and fish. Of course, they're dense and healthy fats now, their arguments against fish. So hey, you know, if you don't like fish, you don't have to have them. But Fisher, you know, we know that they have healthy facts on them and then, of course, plants, plants, plants, plants. I mean, probably some of the best information I've ever received was from a single sentence, which is Try to eat the rainbow a day in plants. And that's actually pretty hard to be honest with you, But it's super good advice, and it has a lot to do with the fact that we know that the colors of plants have a roll with the types of biologically active components within those plants. So it behooves tried the fort, diversify the types of plants that were eating, and so really that diet as a whole. The longevity diet is one of the healthier diets have seen out there, especially today in the midst of other dietary therapies that are just very extreme in nature.

spk_1:   45:39
And he's really pulling that. It always goes back to Mediterranean, doesn't have some version. Yeah, he's really pulling that because he grew up kind of in the Mediterranean ish area. I mean, really, Yeah,

spk_0:   45:49
I mean it. It's like a little biased. Although there is some rationale. So part of the long W diet really has to do with him looking at these areas that calls them blue zones and medicines there these areas where people live to be 100 plus. And he was very fascinated by that part of the area that he grew up in Italy. That just happens to be one of the blue zones. And so he was trying to figure out, you know, like, what's the common denominator between all of these areas And, of course, sleeping patterns, social behaviors, lifestyle in general, you know, fitness club. Will all of those things play a rule? But when you look a diet and of course, that was his main objective is looking at diet. I found that they all tend to eat plan. They incorporate some sort of lean protein, maybe fish, and it does tend to be more like this Mediterranean diet lifestyle, although not limited to. But of course I met a training that was one of them that was featured within the centenarian areas that he was looking at. So it was some rationale there. Of course he's Italian, so it probably also have a little bit to do with the fact that you know it is home,

spk_1:   47:02
right? Exactly. Okay, So I know when you're doing the prolonged fasting mimicking diet. So you're getting the benefits of this prolonged fast. You are including some supplements to cover some bases in general. Are there other supplements that support the health effects of intermittent fasting that we know of? Not really. Eyes it just really making sure we have nutrients there. I mean, if you're if someone's practicing and fasting, do you think they should have a good multi? What do you think they're?

spk_0:   47:30
Yeah. So we do have a multi vitamin well, funeral on and, of course, meal service, deejay supplements in a magazine, fatty acid. And yeah, that's really just to cover the bases of micronutrients. And I would argue that you know, all that we know shows efficacy during a fast. I've read a few studies where they've shown that if you do introduce some specific types of dietary supplements that might actually counteract, tell the fast work, and that does make some sense because most of these very, very well moment I mean, there's a lot to be said about them. But let's just assume that they all work and they're exactly as described in their label if they are working exactly as described to work. Usually that relationship to normal physiology when you're fasting, that is an alter physiology. So if you were to try to introduce them during this new alter physiology, very possible that it may actually negate how that physiology is working. And that has a lot more to do with the fact that our body's natural have these character regulatory system so negative feedback loops. And let's say that, you know, maybe you're taking a supplement that's trying thio perpetuate some sort of beneficial property. Maybe that's already been perpetuated when you're fasting so mean when you introduce him when you're fasting, it's actually kind of negating your body's natural ability to perpetuate that type of function. It's not very well documented at this point. There are only a few human studies right now, but it is to say it's just something to use with caution that, hey, we don't know enough about it. And if you just wanted to try to, you know, use the most readily available knowledge that is to say that you'd want to use any of those things with discretion.

spk_1:   49:08
What were the supplements that were? Ah, that's where it was, negating the effects of it. Do you remember?

spk_0:   49:15
I don't have them specifically, but I know they were antioxidants.

spk_1:   49:18
Okay. Interesting things. That's how war cool. Uh, kind of fascinating. All right, Cool. Uh, okay. So let's say you pick someone to interest today and that kind of interested in just dabbling and sticking their toe in with intermittent fasting because they were like they said I to also like to eat and did not want to fast. But it sounds kind of interesting. Maybe I should play around with this and I will say that there's that's a wide open ballgame to How would you suggest that someone gets started if they're interested in giving it a try?

spk_0:   49:50
You know, it it gets it depends on what kind of fast you want to do. But if you want to dio say something like the fast team and making diet, we do have a website in its sexual prolong FMD depending on if you're foolish or not, we do have an alternate clinician site and that would show you everything that you need todo about the fact he mimicking die. And of course, you can always call in. Were more than happy to help you.

spk_1:   50:13
So, Victoria, to be cover some of the big ones. Did I miss anything? Is there anything I should add?

spk_0:   50:18
No. I think you really did cover all the big ones. I mean, we got through a lot, especially honing in on how fasting works and different types of fasting strategies and benefits. Associate was fasting.

spk_1:   50:27
So we got we got the definitely hit the intermittent fasting 101 victory. Thanks so much for joining us and for sharing your knowledge is intimate. You know, you work on this every day, so I'm hearing it from you is a little different than hearing it from someone who's kind of intermittently working on fasting, huh? Pun intended? I guess so. Thank you so much for joining us on. And, Ah, Victoria is visiting my home state for our conference this fall. Look forward to seeing you then.

spk_0:   50:54
Thank you. I look forward to being overly in South Dakota. Shoot. I have never been there before, so it should be fun. But thank you so much, Krista, for inviting me to talk. I do. This was super fun. And I hope to see you there.

spk_1:   51:09
Yeah, thanks for coming up. One of the best gift you could give us at the less stress life is your feedback. We are paid in podcast reviews. If you enjoy this or any other episode, please leave us a review in the iTunes store or from your podcast app. Just search for less dressed life as if you're not already subscribed. Click on the banana face image scroll to the bottom where it shows the text of other reviews and write a review while you're there. Hey, make sure you hit. Subscribe for android or stitcher users. You gotta go to the desktop site and search for less dress life and then scroll down to leave a review. Stitcher doesn't load Apple reviews on their site. So if you want, you can leave a review in both places. Your feedback means a lot to the success of the show. Thanks so much for taking the time to do that. You rock