Welcome to Beyond Sunday. That's the way Joe introduces it. When he does it, he goes. Welcome to Beyond Sunday you. Got to have that cool cadence. Welcome. Welcome to Be on Sunday podcast that is based on the preaching ministry of Leamington EMC. I am Jonah, and I'm joined today as always by it. Joe's not here. So today, I'm joined by two guests who have been on the podcast before. One of them is Ryan Fair. Yep. I was going to say Kyle Barch first.
And then I was like, that might make your head too big. Yeah. And so I didn't. No, you're right. I didn't want to give you too much pride in your life trying to trying to help you. Yeah, man, he's working. Yeah, we all need help with humility. God's been humbling me in ways that I never could have expected. Good. Kyle's got a real face for radio. I do. Watch it. You're making like now you're making Yvonne's judgment. No, she.
Knows what she's doing. OK, yeah, so Joe is on vacation and Pastor Jake is out this week and so I have asked for the B team to come in. No, they're not. They're great, Ryan. The reason? Well, it was great because it worked out really, really good for that to happen. Because Ryan had family night. He did the little devotion sermon at sermon, whatever you want to call it. It was a good sermon, 2 pointer, 2 point sermon in Colossians chapter 4.
And then Pastor Jake preached sermon from Nehemiah, which we'll talk about first. His sermon was from Nehemiah, chapter 6, almost at 7:00. Again, we're talking about 7. I'll be preaching from Chapter 7 next week, so that'll be fun. But yeah. So Pastor Jake's sermon was called Don't Give in to Threats and Distractions. Was that the name of the sermon? I'm so. Familiar. Yeah, that was it.
He had four points, the attack of deception, the attack of fear and intimidation, the religious attack and then vindicated by God. Yeah, So in the in the book, he said he did give us a quite a bit of context as he opened discernment, which was helpful giving like the whole overview, like where we are to this point. And then he this is when we get that that the wall is finished in 52 days, which is is incredible to think about, like he it hadn't been finished.
Over a century had passed since they came back it. Was a month and 1/2 and. He did it in, yeah, 52 days. That was pretty incredible. But yeah, we get we get a famous verse. Nehemiah 6 three is like he's sending messengers back to Sambalot and he says, he says I'm doing a great work and it cannot come down. And I think that like, Pastor Jake picked up on that, like being like, we can't be distracted. And now I think that was his main point. Don't be distracted from your main mission.
And so, yeah, I just felt like it was, it's a it's a great passage. And I think Pastor Drake said that, too. He's like, this is a great passage of Scripture. Anyway, what do you guys think? Yeah, I really liked it. It spoke to me in a way that, like a lot of, you know, sometimes you kind of just idly sit through a sermon or whatever because whatever reason in your life. But I don't know, like I've been feeling particularly distracted in my own life recently.
And so it kind of felt like it was just really good timing, like trying to distract. Sorry, could you repeat that because I was a little distracted? No, yeah. Absolutely. I can. No, I don't know. I think that like he talks a lot about like specific distractions that take away from ministry or like from the spiritual growth of your life and that kind of stuff. And I think that he gave some like tangible examples at the end, you know, things like worry and like anxiety and fear.
I don't remember him saying it, but specifically I'm thinking like comfort recently or just like idle kind of like little, little pleasures here and then you. Don't mean comfort, like comfort in a hard time. You mean like I'm just taking the comfort of my life too seriously? Right. Yeah. Like surrounding yourself with comfort kind of primarily, you know, seeking after, you know, that next Netflix series instead of seeking after that next, you know, chapter of the reading plan.
You know, I don't know, I feel like it was a good time for me to hear that sermon because I'm kind of in a weird sort of groggy season. Yeah, well, maybe some like, I don't know, it's cold in Ontario right now. And so and and so you feel like you're stuck indoors. You just go to work, you come home, you don't really, there's nothing to do. So it's like, you know, maybe the Netflix is the next thing, right? So, yeah, that's good. That's good. What about you, Ryan? I liked it.
It was, yeah, it was good. He, I I really liked his second and Third Point, the attack of fear and intimidation and then the religious attack. I like how on the second point, it really pointed out, like, we shouldn't always stay silent. Like Nehemiah, he was constantly sending messengers back and, like, countering, like they claimed, like, oh, hey, we're gonna go tell the king. Like, we're gonna tattle on you, right? He's like, OK, like I didn't do
anything wrong. Right. So I thought that was kind of cool. Like, you know, sometimes people always say like, oh, you know, religion is separate from whatever. Like, no, this is, this is our whole life, right? Like we, we should, we should want not stay silent. We should like stand up for what we believe in, right? Like first Peter talks. About. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I think like that. That's good.
Nehemiah had a conviction. Yeah. Like, and he had, he felt like he had like a job that was given to him from the Lord. Yeah. And that's why when he says I'm doing a great work and I cannot come down, he's like, I'm not going to let anything distract me from what the Lord has called me to do. Yeah, especially, especially these guys. Like these guys have been the troublemaker since the beginning of the book, right? We've learned it. We've heard Sambalot's name several times.
Yeah, it's a kind of a weird name, Sambalot. So. There's no way that's how it's actually pronounced, but like. Well, for sure, because I'm from the deep, Deep South. We're from the the cold cold N so. We we got it all wrong. Yeah. But but, yeah. So I mean, he the, the important thing is like he's not distracted and like the application for us is like, what? What is the thing we should be
focused on? Yeah. Something I really liked about the Third Point too was like I never really thought about the idea that like distractions can come from a religious sort of point of view, like people, that people can weaponize what seems pious to cause distractions or to interview with God's plan, which that blew my mind a little bit. I don't know why.
It seems kind of like self-explanatory, but like, I don't know, you just kind of think that like if someone's saying to you like, hey, we're a part of, you know, the religious body, you know, we have this idea. We just want to meet with you about, you know, specifics on things. It's interesting to see the perspective of, like, that could be a distraction in of itself, pulling people away from doing the actual work that's actually
happening. And I think that especially being in, like, in the church setting, that can tend to happen with like, you know, meetings where it's like, I'm not in these meetings, but yeah, you are. And I just can't imagine, like, I just in my mind, see these meetings where it's like, all right, we'll pray about it for another six months, or we'll pray about it for another eight
months, you know what I mean? And prayer is a good pious thing to do. But I sometimes wonder if like, it's used as a way to kind of prolong the work that needs to get done. You know what I mean? Yeah, I mean, a lot of people, like, I think that goes back to
maybe fear as well. Like people will put things off out of their own fear, like not, they're not trying to like use fear to intimidate you like in the past year, but like they use like this that, you know, fear that like a lot of people just I'm not one of these people. I'm just being honest, but a lot of people are really afraid of change. Like and so and that's, that's completely understandable. Like because you've seen something the way it's always
been. And then like, there's this guy that comes and he says we should do it this way and like, without like taking the time to process it and really figure it out. And that's a lot of people are just afraid of change. Oh. Yeah, well, and like, even for me, like I, I am not very like, quick to change.
Yeah, even in my personal life. But it goes back to what Jake said too in the sermon, where it's like that fear is that it's almost like the fear is like the motivating distraction that leads to like the physical distraction. It's like the fear and the anxiety that he mentions the end of his sermon. It's almost like those all three points ultimately those kind of boil down to like a core reason, like where it's like the fear a person has or the anxiety that a
person might have on something. Those bring out the physical aspects of distraction, whether it be through like being devious or what was the word deceptive? Deceptive. That's the one. Like the the Decepticons you know. Like they were like Transformers. Yeah. Well, like, yeah, exactly. Like whether that ends up being coming out as deceptive or whether it comes out through intimidation or whether it comes out through false piety.
I know that even too. Like the last time Jake preached, I remember him saying too, that like, how many people go around and just. We'll tout off, you know, pious platitudes. Does that actually meaning anything, right? It's it almost like those three things can kind of boil down to like those fear and those
anxiety. Responses yeah, I think honestly, I think that like, I mean this in the in the MI, I think like the the motives are definitely nefarious, right like like, but he was they were acting out of fear, right. Like if Israel did become more powerful and they did reestablish themselves in the area in the region, then their economic whatever they've got going on would would decrease. So I mean these these guys are acting out of fear for their own
like livelihood as well. And so but I think like like my wife tells me all the time that you know Jonah, I know you get really excited about new things and you like new, new things and change what you got to dial it back a little bit because you're making me a little bit crazy right now. And so like, you know they're people like me have to recognize that that people who are slow to adopt or or maybe are afraid of
change. We have to we have to like slowly think like step back and we do have to allow some time. But on the other side, people who love like are they like the things keep the things the same way all the time myself. Yeah. Don't like change. They also need to like step like into it and think about it. Like give give it some like some real thought, not just like put up this hard wall. Yeah, exactly.
Well, yeah, meet in the middle or just like both of you have to sort of like understand that there's something on the other side that has like real reasons for what they're doing. Yeah, yeah. And not get. Frustrated with each other from the perspective of someone that's kind of worried for change. It's easier said than done though, for sure. I I don't know, your process is probably the same thing. It's probably easier said than done to kind of hold.
Off Oh yeah, yeah, you wouldn't you just hate life most of the time it's like, oh, can't we just do whatever I know will work and then yeah. So you just get, you get. It's it's difficult. Well, it's hard to because like from this, from the other perspective, it's like, why do we have to do, Why do we have to deviate from the things that we already know will work? And you have the same place where it's like, I, I'm pretty sure this will work too.
So I don't know, you're right. It's kind of, it depends on, I think that there's a, there's a fear on both fronts there that you have to kind of monitor. But I think it comes back to the conviction. So like what? What is the conviction of the work that you're doing? So like that. That to me is like the the reason, Like who? Whatever side, like if there is two sides, whatever side comes out on top, like the conviction is going to be the strongest. Yeah.
Like that conviction is the strongest. And so like in Nehemiah here, I'm doing an important work, a great work, and I cannot come down to bother with you like I'm doing this. And so like, like we have to be willing to to be conviction about certain things. And I think like Pastor Jake was in his sermon, he was talking specifically our convictions are around the gospel, right?
As a, as a, a Christian Church, as an evangelical church, then our, our goal and mission is to give the gospel to as many people as as we can hear it, right. And so I think that's what we we have to be dead, like dead focused on that as a church. And, and I, I thought it was a really good sermon. I honestly, yeah, it was, it's something that's well needed. Like we don't need to be distracted. For sure, 100%. Yeah. And be aware, like, that's the
other things. Be aware the attacks can come from from all different angles. And then like from inside, from outside, from like, what you think, like you said, Kyle, like for what it might be, what you expect to be very, very good. Yeah. Right, well, and not only that, like sorry, Ryan, I want you to talk to, but like from the inside. Like it's interesting he mentions that too, because like obviously we anticipate attacks
from the outside, right? Because of the world, we to an extent, we also anticipate attacks from the inside of the church because churches are messy. They're run by people. Yeah. But the reality too is that like attacks from inside our own hearts, right? Like we are, we are constantly fighting the flesh. Yeah. Like we are new creations with a new with a new. We're new creations and we are fighting the old self
constantly. And so kind of speaking to myself for someone who isn't like more adverse to change, I've been really trying to be more open to things and trying to like change that perspective because I understand that like, you know, there is a, there is something inside of me that I have to fight against to actively in scripture or like in the spiritual sort of sense because I'm a Sinner.
And so sometimes these are, I know you heard it here first, folks, but like, you know, but you know what I'm getting at, like sometimes being comfortable and kind of let's goes back to the season that I'm in right now, kind of huddling in for comfort. It's it's a desire for me to
stay to like my fleshly side. And so sometimes the adverse to change that I feel and the fear I have from it, it comes from that same place where it's like a desire to stay comfortable, a desire to not have to fight those fleshly desires. And so I thought that it was a cool distinction to think about attacks from the outside, outside of the building, inside of the building. But I think it's important also for all of us to recognize that there is also attacks from
inside of our own hearts. No, that's good. And it's biblical. I was. You made me. You had me thinking about Romans 7. I know I was distracting you when you were talking as I was turning my Bible here. So you're good. Sorry about that. But like Paul says in Romans 7, he's like 7/18. For I know that nothing good dwells in me that is in my flesh. For I have the desire to do what is right, but not the ability to carry it out. For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is
what I keep on doing. And then he says, now if I do what I do not want, it's no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. So yeah, you're a Sinner. You point. You picked up on that. It's almost like you've read this before and you thought on that before. So I find it to be a law that when I do what it that when I do, excuse me, when I want to do
right, evil lies close at hand. For I delight in the law of God in my inner being, but I see my members another law, waging war against the law of my mind and making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members. And it's not to say that like remaining the same or liking the liking what you got going on or like maybe being adverse to change is necessarily wrong. It just goes back to what you said. Yeah, what it like, what is the motivating?
Factor. We have to have that conviction. Right. Yeah. What's the conviction behind it? Well, and at the end of the day, too, like our conviction as Christians is it's God's word, right? So like, no matter whether you're adverse to change or whether like I'm, I'm more with Jonah, like I'm, I'm willing to change anything in my life, like good for you. But but at the end of the day, like, is it scriptural, right? Is it scriptural to sit back?
Is it scriptural to move? Well, we got to do what? What God's Word. Tells us to do our convictions need to be based on the word? And that's what we see Nehemiah doing, right? He's just constantly like, no, I'm doing what God has instructed me to do, right? Yeah. That's right.
Yeah. We're going to see in seven that he sets up, He's setting up, he's setting something up because in chapter 8, we get one of the like most famous passages in the Bible where Ezra stands and they all get together and he reads the law. But he can't do that without what what Nehemiah does in Chapter 7. So that's a teaser for next week. And then yeah. What are your guys final thoughts on Nehemiah because we got to move to what you did on family night. I like Nehemiah.
Nehemiah. Yeah, Nehemiah. Yeah, I thought, yeah, it's great. Great job, Pastor Jake, on the sermon and it's really helpful for all of us. So yeah, so we'll move on. Yeah, is good with you guys. Yeah, we don't edit on this podcast, so if you're ready to move on, we can move. On Thumbs up man, I'm happy. OK, thumbs up or not, it's not a video. It's not a video podcast. So yeah, so thumbs up. OK, we're moving on. Pulled up. My notes.
Although if you are interested in video podcasting, I have had someone ask me, could we put it on YouTube? And I'm like, I don't know. My, I have a like again, Kyle has a face for radio and so do I. We can't all be like Joe Penner and Ryan Fair, you know, the good looking handsome guy. So some guys get it all exactly. Ryan, you did preach from Colossians 4. I'll try to turn there if I can find it. Colossians chapter 4 verses 2 to 4 verses 2:00 to 4:00.
So why don't you give us like a rundown of what you talked about last night? Yeah, I mean. Today's Monday, by the way. This will be dropping on Wednesday. So last night is, yeah, that makes sense. Just making sure that everybody was on the same page. That's good. So yeah, it's, I mean, 3 verses, but basically, yeah, there was two points. One was our posture and prayer and one was like specific prayer for missionaries and church
leaders. And so just kind of flushing that out on like how we should like, act in our prayers and then, yeah, who we should pray for. So who should we pray for? Everybody. Everybody. And this. Passage specifically missionaries and church leaders. Yeah, which was the reason for our gathering last night, right? Exactly. And that that's why we chose this passage. The missions committee mentioned it to me. And so I thought it was a great
idea. Yeah. And so yeah, it because, yeah, I was specifically for the missionaries that we would end up praying for that are. Conference sports. Yeah, that's good. I liked how you opened. You gave some good context about prayer. Like I didn't know these stats, so I thought were really helpful that 300 plus times prayer, pray, praying the words, specific words are mentioned in the Bible and then there's 650 recorded prayers.
It's pretty awesome. And then we have 25 of those that our Lord Jesus prayed, which is really, really, I thought that was that's helpful context. Like believers should be praying people, right? We should be praying people. We should be talking to the Lord. So I I thought that was really, really good context to set up for, for it. Yeah, Yeah. Go ahead. I was going to say I read this book not that long ago by JC Rile called the Do You pray? Great book.
And I just thought of this quote, which was like, you can be very sure that people fall in private long before they fall in public. And like, I don't know, I, I really like the emphasis that we have on family nights that's like geared towards prayer because it feels like that's like the one discipline that everyone knows they should do, but because everyone has easy access to it, nobody does it, you know what I mean? Yeah, it is. It is the easiest and the hardest thing to do.
Well, that's what I mean. It's the easiest to do. It's the hardest to discipline. Yeah, I, I, I find it hard to do as well, like because of my pride and the, the sin in my heart, right. Going back to Romans 7, that war inside me, the flesh and then the and then the spirit that's in me that that are that are battling it out.
Yeah. So I find it to be it is easy like I would, I like I it is easy to do, but it's also very hard for a prideful person like myself to do like to because what you're doing in that moment is you're you're submitting yourself to God and you're saying I'm you're God and I'm not right. So, yeah. And really, yeah. JC Ryo, RYLE, for those listening. Exactly. Look that up. What's the book called? Do you pray? Do you pray?
Yeah. And like going back to that quote, it's, I like it because it's true. It's indicative of like the Christian endeavor, right? Like when you aren't in your private life in prayer, seeking the Lord publicly, things are gonna start falling. Yeah, like it. You fall in private far before you fall in. I think it's self-explanatory, but I like it. Yeah, it's good. Yeah, no, I really like the prayer nights too, like you said, like, and I know I was thinking about using this quote.
I didn't, but it's a quote from Spurgeon. Charles, Charlie. Charles Hadden. He he said I'd rather teach one man to pray than 10 men to preach like he just like prayer is just so, so important, right? And like preaching, preaching is super important, and that just shows how much more important prayer is in our lives.
Yeah, well, it's the like, it's prayer is like the thing that Christians can do in their private life to connect with God, you know, in a way, Like you can read his word, obviously, but prayer is like direct communication with the Almighty. And so like it, it works.
Like it just, it just works. Like, I don't know why people like even for myself, I'm talking to myself mostly here where it's like I can go through a season where I'm praying vigorously and everything I'm praying for is happening exactly as it I I want it even. And then all of a sudden, like the next thing pops up and then it's like, oh, but I don't know if God's going to hear me on this one, you know, even though I have this whole backlog of answered prayers.
But yeah, no, but you did a really good job. Like your sermonette it. Was it was good. Unfortunately, we didn't record it. Oh, no, I feel so bad about it. Like I feel bad because we've started recording and and then it was a busy, it was a busy Sunday. And then, yeah, I just didn't didn't think about getting someone back there to record so well. If I didn't hear it, you missed. Out you missed out, believers pray. That was one thing I wrote down. The other thing I wrote down was
like, be awake. Like are we? And I asked myself the question, am I awake in my prayer? Like, am I really being watchful? I thought, I thought you did a good job, like taking that sentence and two, I think. Yeah. And breaking verse 2 apart with the three points of like being steadfast in prayer, being watchful in prayer and and doing it all with Thanksgiving. So I thought that was a good exegesis on your part. You broke that down and made it like you made your point centered on that.
So I thought it was really, really helpful. Yeah, and on a. Practical level too. It's like, how many times do you just kind of idly lay in bed right before you go to sleep and you just kind of rattle off some list of things you need or want and then you just kind of zonk out. Yeah. Yeah, well, in that, like that was kind of the illustration
that I use, right. Like me, yeah, me and my wife praying before we go to bed and me falling asleep, which happened so. Yesterday, yesterday I was convicted twice about not praying, like about my, my, my habit of not praying before I go to bed with my wife. OK, so the sermon that you preached and you talked about like falling asleep in your own prayer, which is fine. And then you got the elbow to the ribs, right?
Yeah, but that's fine. You were, you were you were disciplining yourself, you guys in your marriage of discipline yourself to like this is something where it's important we're going to pray before we go to bed. So that was one of them. I was convicted. But that was the second one. The first one as after church on like the morning service, I was driving to the superstore to get some groceries and I was listening.
I've been listening to this. Colin Hansen wrote a book on like an autobiography, not an auto. It wouldn't be autobiography be a biography, sort of a biography on Tim Keller, his spiritual and intellectual formation. It's a really, really good book. But in it he talks about how Tim Keller didn't have a habit of praying with his wife either.
And so he tells a story about Tim's wife saying, you know, hey, just imagine if you were if you were dying and the remedy for it was to take this pill every single night. If you miss one night, you're going to die, Would you do it? And obviously the obvious answer is, of course, I would do it. And and she was convicting him about it too. It's like, OK, so that so basically, we're not going to make it if we don't pray together. So they made it then then they made a early on in their
marriage. It was early, they made a commitment to each other that they would they would pray every night. And so no matter where he was in the world speaking, no matter what time zone it was in, they always prayed before they went to bed and and made sure that they connected and prayed together before they went to bed. So that was that was the first time I was convicted yesterday about it. Second time was your sermon. And then of course, I went to bed and didn't pray with my wife.
So, but no, it's, it is convicting. And now that she will listen to this on Wednesday, right when it comes out. And now we'll have to and it's good. But no, Kyle, I'm really worried about you need to stop talking to yourself so much. We need to get that thing. You know, maybe we should talk to somebody else about that, but we're talking to yourself all the time. Yeah, I do talk to myself quite a bit. No, it's good.
Well, I was going to say too, that like, it's interesting what you're saying right now between like that and like your conviction with you and your wife. It it's interesting that like prayer doesn't just connect us with the Father, it connects us with other believers.
Yeah. And it's interesting to see the connected, the connection power that happens, A, between like a married couple and they're praying or B even in a church setting with a body of believers, how we can form and connect with each other relationally through the act of praying to God. Yeah, it does draw you closer to each other for sure. Really cool.
Yeah, I'm always moved on the family nights when we when we spend time, it's just 1/2 hour like because we have like 1/2 hour of like music and a devotion and then we just spend like it and it's really almost too short. It feels like I feel bad because I'll eat it most of the time. You let it last night, which was really good and I appreciate you doing that. But you feel bad when you step up there and interrupt people praying. And I'm like, can't we just keep this going?
But then there's there's all sorts of temperaments in the room. Like there are people who won't gather in a group. Have you noticed that? Like there are some people, because we want to gather in like groups of three or four pray, but there are a couple who just won't. And so that's a timber. They're just praying on their own. And then there are people who want to pray and they pray a lot. And then there's people who get together and then they they pray quickly and then they chat.
And that's it's natural. But like, again, I think if we could keep it going, like what you're doing is, Kyle, what you mentioned there is you're connecting and you're bonding together over prayer, but you're also teaching each other how to pray. Like you're teaching each other like the posture of prayer, right? Like our posture is one that's steadfast, one that's with Thanksgiving and the one that's being watchful about like what we're talking about and like and guarding the church.
And so, yeah, I like you're we're teaching each other. Pray if you just, if you're just also it's just me and Jesus and I'm good. That's not the Christian life. No, the Christian life is meant to be done in community. Yeah, well and to like speaking to the lengths of prayers I it. Doesn't even. Did you say length or did you say? Length of prayers for Yeah, well, I was going to say was that like they don't necessarily have to be long, they just have to be biblical true, you know
like they. Well, yeah, and Jesus warns us about long babbling prayers, right? Exactly. Vain repetitions, right? And so on. The years are long enough. Another Spurgeon quote as. Ironically, the example he gives of how to pray right after he says stay away from vain repetitions has become a vain repetition, which I think is kind of hilarious. Yeah. But. It's funny too that you bring that up like the disciples didn't ask how to like, preach,
how to do all these things. They asked him how to pray. Because I think like, like I kind of mentioned that passenger Mark where he would go, go off and pray in the wilderness even when there were crowds gathered. And I think like they really saw him praying all the time. They're like, what do you do? Like how, how do you pray? Right. And that's like. Yeah, that's a good point.
Well, in praying alone is of benefit as well, like but in a church setting though, it is important for us to kind of cultivate those relationships. For sure, yeah, I wouldn't. I wouldn't say that you couldn't do any spiritual things alone. I don't. I don't want to make that. That's a good distinction. Yeah. Because that's not the point I was making. The point I was making is like Christianity is not meant to be done all by yourself all the time, like it is supposed to be
done in community. But you're right. I mean, I pray all we all do. We all pray alone all the time. So. And yeah, in fact, Jesus models that he went off alone to pray. So yeah, it's good. But yeah, I thought, I thought your sermon was really helpful. I liked how you talked about. I just wrote down mysteries of the mysteries of, of, of Christ. I don't know if you you said mystery at the end. Yeah. But it wasn't in my notes, actually.
OK, but it kind of came out because it is in the passage, right? Yeah. But it I mean, the mystery of Christ is really like the gospel. Right, it's it's him revealing himself to us, right. So anytime you see that Paul talks about the mysteries of this of the gospel a lot and he basically just saying this mysterious thing that God would do this, right? Like that's the that's the mystery. It's not, it's not a mystery anymore. It's not, it's not like we can't
figure it out. It's not like unsolved mysteries. Do you remember that show? I do. I love way before your times, but that gave me nightmares. That is a side note. That music at the beginning of that show gives me side notes. But that's not the mystery in the like in the in the Gospels, right? Or in the, in the epistles that Paul's talking about, he's talking about the Gospel, right?
So. Yeah, and like, that's actually something I've been talking with my D Group A lot is like the mystery of Christ in the Old Testament 'cause we're back in the Old Testament, right? And like that, that was like everything in the Old Testament points to Christ. Yeah, right. Like Colossians, actually it's in chapter 2. It says these are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.
Like everything in the Old Testament, like, was like a shadow of Christ. But now we get to see the true right thing that is casting the shadow, and that is Christ. And that's what that mystery is like. Yeah, exactly. You said yeah. Yeah, you got me thinking about how am I going to preach Christ from Nehemiah 7? So I'm just that's where my mind is right now. So anyway, pray for me. We'll we'll get there eventually. But yeah, Kyle, you want to say something?
You look like you were going to say something. No, we're good. I just I've been reading this book and with Ryan. Oh wait, what are y'all reading? Yeah, we read this. Book, hang on, you guys have been talking about even JC Ryles, a Puritan, Yeah, maybe Presbyterian, I don't know. Yeah. Then you got you've been you quoted like Chapter Spurgeon for like 7 things 17 times in this podcast. You you're quoting Timothy Keller anecdote.
Presbyterian, Yeah, anyway. And you were going to talk about another Presbyterian, I think. Spurgeon's a Baptist. Spurgeon is a Baptist. Yeah, yeah. It was. I was going to talk about this book we've been reading called Daily Doctrine, Daily Doctrine by Kevin Deyoung. And also press, I mean also press material that's. True. Wow, fair enough. I'm just being silly. Yeah, I was going to say, it's not like it matters. Takes all. Kinds, right? They're all Christian evangelical Christians.
Heaven, Christ is our center. I think that's all that matters. Yeah, but like I was, we were reading it together and it's interesting talking about like the mysteries of Christ. We just read a whole chapter about like the attributes of God. Well, tell us what the book is first. Yeah, that's a good point.
So the the book is a it's like a devotional style book where each day there's meant to be a reading and instead of it being a specific Bible verse or a Bible like an excerpt from the Scripture, it's a theological idea or point. So it's a systematic theology essentially. So he's taking systematic theology and breaking it up into like bite size daily doctrinal. Daily doctrinal points. So Daily Doctrine really good, yeah. It's helpful five days a week, like it's.
So it's 260 as well, Yeah. Yeah, so it's good. I've really enjoyed it. But one of the things he mentioned this week was talking about the attributes of God. Attributes of God talking about the incommunicable and the communicable ones, right Incommunicable being like the traits that are for God alone that he possesses things like omnipotence, omniscience, and then the communicable ones.
Well, actually, we can talk about it later and then the communicable ones, which are like the ones that we can share. And so like Lovejoy peace, those kinds of things. And one of the things he mentions about is is attribute that God has, which is like that he's the invisible God, right? That he is invisible, not because he's like, you know, this one transparent ether, but that to define him by the space in which that he resides. It would just it wouldn't be
comprehensible. Like he transcends space and time in a way that we cannot fathom. I don't know why, but you said mysteries of Christ and that just I thought of that. No, it is. That is actually like, that's the thing about God. It's like when you start to think on him, Yeah, you realize really quickly that you will never exhaust the amount of thinking that you can do. Yeah, to understand. And you will not understand at all. And I think that's that to me is like, it's beautiful.
And I I mean that it's it should do what it should do is it should cause us to be humble. Yes. And not proud. Yeah. And to worship, that's right. And to pray, like to know that this deity, this invisible otherworldly expanse of God hears you. Yeah. And like enjoys hearing from you seemingly, which is and loves you. I don't know. It's just like it should make it should make you want to pray all
the more. Like, that's something that I thought too, even going through your sermonette last night was I was like, man, I just, I have to say this sermonette, I'm sorry. Because yours are so long less. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's right, yeah. But like going through Ryan? Follows instructions? Oh, not so much.
Yeah, it's true. But going through that, just thinking about like how much of A desire I want to pray more with the context of knowing who God is, the attributes of God that we read about in this book this week, and then hearing about his desire for us to pray. It's, it's humbling, but it also makes me want to draw closer to it, to him in, in, in our, in my communication. Yeah, for sure. No, it's good. What have you been thinking about Daily Doctrine? It's it's really good.
Yeah. It's a great book learning a lot and a lot of these things are like going over my head a bit. Like he definitely used some big words like it is systematic theology, but it's it's not unattainable for for like the the layperson, I guess, right. And, and really the one thing that like, you know, you hear people say like, oh, theology divides and it's not important, whatever we're doctrine divides, but like learning about God, like that's what theology is.
It's the study of God, right? And it, it really should just drive us to worship God, right. And I, that's what I've been, I've been noticing, like reading about the attributes of God or like learning just about theology, why it's important. It just like it starts to make you realize like, like you said, like you are God. I'm not like, thank you, Lord, for everything. Like, yeah, you start to realize how small you are in a good way, right?
In a way of like, man, I'm so glad that you're God. Yeah. Well, and something I really appreciated about it too, is because is that like you said, he's the author of this book is Presbyterian. Jonah, you I'm pointing, sorry, like Jonah mentioned that he is Presbyterian. So there are things on a theological level that I disagree with him. And even in the past, the chapters this week, there are things he said where I was like, I don't know about that.
But the beautiful thing about it is that theology is meant to be explored in a way where even if you're not 100% sure or agree with a person's take on something, learn more, right? Dive deeper and you know what? And like, maybe you'll come to a truth or some sort of revelation that maybe this author or speaker isn't Privy to that changes the perspective on
things. Yeah, the thing about theology and when you start to study theology is you are studying God, Yeah, who we cannot fully comprehend. No. Therefore, you're going to be challenged. And so you have to be, you have to be ready for that. And if you're not willing to be challenged, don't start reading theology books.
Oh, 100%. Because even if you, even if you think you agree with someone that you're reading, you're going to find out that that there is something in there that that challenges you and actually makes you super uncomfortable and that you just like, you don't want to feel like, you know what I mean? Like, because honestly, that's what happens. You're studying the, the, the, yeah, the topic of study is incomprehensible. Yeah. On some level, right? Yeah. And so, like, there are things
that we can understand. I'm not saying that he has revealed himself to us, which is a very, it's beautiful. Like God, the creator of the universe. I, I have a hard time saying the deity or the, this God or like, I don't know. I've, I've said it before too, like, but we are studying the one, the only right, the the everlasting, the God. And he has made the way, not a way for us to, to know him. He's made the way for us to know him. And that is, that is the word
that we have. So, but you're studying so you can comprehend some things, but the things that are made clear, we need to understand it very clearly. And the things that are not made so clear, we can hold with sort of like loose, like grip and like say, yeah, there's tension there. Like like free will and the doctrine of predestination. There's tension there. They're both in the scriptures and we have to hold them loosely and say, OK, somehow little word makes it work together.
And that is a mystery. Well, that's a. That's a Spurgeon quote. Why rectify 2 friends? Or why reconcile 2 friends? That's right. Yeah, they're already, they're already friends. And so, oh, there we go again, Spurgeon, one more time. Sorry, I was gonna say too like. Spurgeon's my favorite Baptist. It's fine other than other than yourself. Everybody loves themselves, right? So if you don't. I was gonna say like another quote, it goes perfectly. It's from Daily Doctrine.
I don't remember what chapter this was in, but it's also it's Kevin Deyoung. He says that like in essentials unity, Yeah, in non essentials liberty, but in all things charity. Yeah. So we hold to the we hold to the essential of the gospel, of the person, of Jesus, of the triune God, in a way that we are unified behind those. Things, yeah. And that's one actually, we make that point in our first steps
class. So if you're listening and you haven't taken first steps, that is the first thing we talk about is, is like holding things that are very important. Like there are some things we have to agree on in order to like have fellowship together. Yeah. Everything else we can sort of like just be charitable with each other. Well, and same thing with and then it goes like into the non essentials liberty, right.
But like, you know, we talked with the tension with the free will and the the model of predestination that people hold to no one is really certain on how they work, how they work together, how they're reconciled. And so we can have liberty with that. We can we can be kind to one another. Exactly. We have our understandings because none of us have the full answer or no. And then lastly, in all things charity, be charitable on it.
All right, Like in all the disagreement and all of like the seeming ways that we can find disunity, be charitable to one another, give each other the benefit of the doubt, I think that that's probably the best way to operate, right? Yeah, it should be. Well, and like we do all things in love, right? Like, yeah, there's so many passages in Scripture, like First Corinthians 13 is the famous love chapter. And there's so many other passages that just like talk about loving your brother.
Like even Paul talks about loving his loving the weaker brother. Like if it means that I won't even meet again, I'll I'll do it. It's like he does anything to make sure that people love God. Yeah, right. And like, I'm like, even between us three, I'm sure there's something that we could disagree on. Oh yeah, and if there's not I'll I will encourage anyone to ride in the car with Kyle for six. Days. To I. Was gonna say shortly after this is like done recording.
We're gonna, we're just gonna start fighting. That's. Oh no, we're not. I'm just. Joking. I'm joking. I'm joking. But yeah, like there's, there's always something. But like we always are rooted in the gospel. Right where the. Roots are and everything that comes out of that is just good conversation. Yeah, for sure. That's good. I like the book too. I've been reading it. I'm behind you guys. You have. Yeah, I'm behind you guys. But yeah, it's really good.
Joe and I, we, we have always, we always have big plans and we're going to do this together. We're going to read this book together and like then we have a million other things that pop up and we put that on the back. Burner such as the life of a pastor, though, right? Happens. Yeah, things happen. So on that note, we're at like 40 minutes in our podcast now, so that's good. But on that note, we talked about things happening. We had Pastor Jake is away this week, Joe is away this week.
Joe had a planned vacation and then Pastor Jake had an unexpected emergency of the death in the in Anna's family. And so yeah, I'll, I'll just take a minute or two and we'll pray and we'll conclude the episode. Is that OK with you guys? Yeah. Any other comments before we conclude? Well, any anything on your sermon? No, not yet. Teaser. No, it's Monday. I just found out I was preaching yesterday. So he. Just finished writing it. No, yeah, it's it is a hard
chapter there. The 1st 4 verses are the only narrative and then it just runs right into a list of names and numbers. And so it will be interesting. I will try my best to to to pull something out of it. I don't have to work really hard there. There is stuff there. All scripture is and that that's where I'm going to start is that Paul's instruction of Timothy that all Scott, all Scripture is profitable for for teaching. So we're going to learn that right now.
Let me pray for just for our church and for Pastor Jake. Father, we are grateful. I'm grateful for Kyle and for Ryan for their willingness to come on and to fill in and just to have a conversation with them. It's always fun, but it's even more fun when when we can do it in a way that may build others up. And so where I pray that that would that that's what we've done today that we've we've been some sort of encouragement to someone who's listening the father right now.
I just like, like we just mentioned that things come up in the life of any, anyone, but specifically in pastors lives. And, and I pray for, for Pastor Jake and for Anna, specifically for Anna now that that you would give their, her family comfort, that you would give them the ability to minister to others in
the midst of their grief. But I pray for, for their travels and I pray for, for all the conversations that we had that they would be focused on, on giving the gospel each and every conversation that they have the ability to. And just like helping those in the family that they're, that they're seeing down in Texas, that they're just able to give comfort through the gospel, through what you've done through
your son. And so Lord, we just, we, we grieve with them, but we also, we thank you for the opportunity that they have to, to go into, to be with their family and to, and to do that. And so I also pray for Pastor Joe as he's out on vacation. I pray that it's a restful time and that they, they all return safely. We just pray that you would be with our church, LAMC.
Help us to love each other. Help us to to to be unified in the vision and to not be distracted so we could take Pastor Jake's message from Sunday to heart and then we won't let anything distract us from getting the gospel out into our community and beyond. I pray these things in Jesus name, Amen. Thanks for joining us. We will see you next week. Thanks.