Are You Struggling with Church Communication? Let's Grow Together with Marlene Lamb

Each podcast confronts real-time struggles facing the local church and a post-Christian culture . Step into the action with the ULC at uniteleadershiporg . This is Lead Time .

Marlon is the communications director for Christ Greenfield and before we get into kind of specifics about what Christ Greenfield does , this or that , and even models say the church engagement model or meeting felt needs we must start out by saying this as it relates to communication models and strategy you can have whatever model you want to have .

You can have whatever strategy makes the most sense in your context , in your culture . But to not have a strategy , to not have a model , is not a best practice . There must be and the models will evolve . You know , as a community evolve , this is an infinite game that we're playing .

Context evolves , the mediums of how you communicate , all of these things evolve . So if you're a learning organization , this podcast is for you . If you're there sitting and saying , you know what ? We've kind of figured it all out as it relates to church communication and engaging people's felt needs .

Well , this you probably aren't listening to anything lead time related anyway . So God bless you . This is going to be a good , good conversation , jack , as we enter into this conversation with Marlon , you doing well man .

We just got out of some nasty rainstorms yesterday and it's like everything has come alive in this beautiful day and uh , we're just in this beautiful season . That , I think , just makes everybody very cheerful here , right and uh , just soaking it in while it lasts .

And , marlin , you know , as we go in through this podcast here , if you want to to , if you feel like venting about how you're terrible boss , you can do that . You're free to do that .

Opening question , though , to get us going Did you ever imagine , marlon , that five , six years ago you'd be communications director at a conservative Lutheran church in Gilbert Arizona ? Did that ever cross your mind ?

Paid or non-paid , either way , you need them on your team . What do you love most , marlon , about your work ? And what is kind of the hardest parts about your work as communications director ?

We get to use whether it's words or graphics or photos and use that as tools to share reminders of God's love and goodness to our community , our church congregation and beyond our community , our church congregation and beyond . Also , we get to support and serve ministries and leaders in our church community and help support the vision of our leadership .

So that's probably some of my favorite parts of the job . One of the hardest parts is also that church communications , or communications in any organization , as Jack and I have talked previously , it's an ongoing process of improvement .

Like you know , it's always there's always a way to make it better , and so it's about finding systems that fit best for the specific ministry and the season that we're in . So it's ongoing work and it yeah , it touches a lot of ministries and people . So , yeah ,

that's complete .

So I had an opportunity to interview a whole bunch of people in a gathering where there's a lot of other churches that had already been doing this for years and said what is your number one challenge ? And it's not finances , right ? It's not facility management , it's not . Those things are relatively straightforward .

The thing that's always a challenge is figuring out communications . How much of that is driven by the local campus ? How much is that is driven centrally ? It's always being negotiated , it's always trying to be figured out . There's always things that people feel content or not content about .

Based on the quality of communication that goes out and it's rare that you'll have a member like that you'll create a communication model that all of your members are going to be delighted with , right ? So there's always somebody that says , well , I wish you did something different , right ? So we're always dealing with that .

And so , from that perspective , what Marlon does here , in my opinion , is one of the most difficult ministry jobs for a large , complicated ministry , and I always want to try and draw attention to that because we have to have a lot of grace with that .

But I'm also delighted that we have somebody that's a very strong systems strategic thinker in that role , while at the same time being very humble and willing to receive feedback from people .

So talk about communication channels and helping us engage various audiences . Marlon , yeah .

But connected to your question about the audience , I think that's so important and that's probably where we have to start to determine what works well for our specific congregation , and so it's really important to know the audience of your community , to see where they're at .

It helps us to know where they spend most of their time at right , because Sundays we meet , you know , maybe an hour , an hour and a half once a week , but then there's so many hours I think it's like 167 hours the rest of the week , right ? So where are people hours the rest of the week , right ? So where are people ?

And we know that it's an ongoing ministry , whether it's an email reminder or social media , and that's where most of us spend a lot of time , right . So how can we meet them where they're at ? But also determining something that , as Jack was saying earlier , it has to work for the majority of the community right .

We have to make decisions that will help the vast majority of the congregation , not just like one or two people

.

very connected to what I just said , it's really important . It's something that we're currently fighting , I would say anywhere in the world is distractions and attention . So we have to like fight for people's attention . We live in an age where we like quick things , right , like we have microwaves . We want things to like be done in a minute or less .

So we're constantly fighting for people's attention . There was a study a few years ago that talked about how I think the average like attention when you're online is about like seven seconds or less . And this is really true to social media , right the stopping the scroll . People are looking for the next thing .

So we got to be very intentional about what we're feeding to people , right ? So , as an example , I'll give you an example . Church announcements is something that you know .

Everybody would love to have a church announcement and I think that in the past and it depends on the congregation , right , it depends on the size of the congregation and what's going on in the ministry , but in the past it may have been easier for Christ Greenfield to say oh , this ministry gets .

The question is this specific announcement part of the intentionality and the vision and the plan that leadership wants people to go through at this particular time ? Also , does it apply to over 50% of the congregation ? Does it apply to over 70% 80% of the congregation ?

This did apply to over 70% 80% of the congregation , because we also don't want to have like six announcements at the same time . We try to limit three at the most , because people might tune out , and so we want these to be reminders and to say , hey , this might be the first time you're hearing this , this is what's happening .

Go here also for more information and , like , use that as reminders . Um , but yeah , it has to .

And what happens , marlon , is when that happens , when you have that many announcements , you basically you're not communicating anything . When you communicate too much , you're basically communicating nothing . Right , because at a certain point , as it goes on and it's just like one commercial after another , people just start to drown out .

So you know , I wouldn't really do anything different per se . What I would do different is get to a communication strategy quicker . Yeah , fair enough To say yes in the right way and then to give the respective leaders the permission to communicate to their respective audiences through the appropriate channels .

So why don't you go a little bit deeper into how we view the website , how we view the app for us , and then how we view social media and how we engage with groups and pages and everything there ? That'd be really helpful , marlon .

But something that in the past few years especially , I would say , around COVID time we learned that our website is like a front door for people , like what used to be the physical front door , where you may maybe in the past you put like a poster or a bulletin or something . You know that that would be the first thing that people would see .

Well , people are spending more time online right now that they are physically visiting churches , so our website is truly that front door . Pictures are sometimes like the windows to the building right , so it's important for us to make sure that our website is visitor friendly . We are a welcoming community .

That's what we strive to be , so we wanted to serve not only our congregation with information that would be helpful for them , but mainly visitors that may be getting to know Christ Greenfield community for the first time . Now , our CG app is awesome .

We are partnering with a couple of awesome companies that help us enhance our app and make it very personable , very personalized to our audience , to our members ,

personalized to our audience , to our members , and so our CG app is truly a tool that we use for our congregation , our community , those who are already a part of Christ Greenfield and want to know more things , want to take a next step , want to know what's happening .

So that's how we view those two things Our app we just try for it to be a supporting tool for our people . And then social media . It's so great , I would say it's such a huge mission field .

If we are viewing it just as a way to put an announcement or something about an event , I think we may need to reconsider that perspective , because it truly is the place where not only Gen Seers but like millennials and everyone is truly spending so much time there . If you look at screen times , you know Instagram , facebook , tiktok .

Wherever your church is , it's an opportunity to spread the gospel and spread the good news , to share valuable content that would help people and meet them where they're at . So that's how we view it , not necessarily that we don't promote or announce anything on social media , but our approach to it is more of an outreach focus .

What content can we put out there that will bless people , that will meet them where they are and will talk about Jesus , yeah .

The website is get and retain Hopefully we're getting them over to our website and then disciple and multiply is largely driven by our app . So what would you say to the church ? We got a lot of church leaders who are listening , who are in churches of 70 to 150 .

And when you talk app Marlon , they're like I have an app like my congregation's 65 average age . There's no way I'm going to get them to go to a stinking app . So what would you tell them ?

In making kind of the incremental because let's do the 1% rule here as it relates to changing your perspective toward your website what invitation would you give them to start to move toward ? Because I think they could all make the website be more guest friendly If that's where we're driving people .

Most churches , regardless of size , have some sort of social media presence , but the app may be a stumbling block for them . What would you say to that ? That congregation Marlon ? Yeah ?

I think it's important to find whatever the channel is that you want to spend your time in and you want to send your people to and truly work at it and develop it .

But asking also , like what is important to us as a community , what is our vision , what do we value most and how do we want to see people grow in our community spiritually and taking their next steps , next step . So I would say I mean it's just so important to to really have that awareness that our website could be an opportunity to welcome a visitor .

You know , and even the language that we use , what we have on the website , is important . They say it would someone that has never stepped foot on your church understand what you're saying on the website ? You know like , or is it insider language ?

Because I think , not only as churches but as Christians , sometimes we can falter in that , and we were so used to using insider language . So I think we just have to be a little bit more conscious and aware of those who may not be a part of not only this particular denomination but our faith even .

You know , and that's hopefully who we're trying to lead- so you mentioned insider language .

Are these or are these mainly for the people that are in our community and , and your homepage could be one example ? Right , are these or are these mainly for the people that are in our community and and your homepage could be one example ? Right ?

If we , if we focus on the homepage is , is every section in that homepage like a bridge , an opportunity for people to say I want to learn more about this or I'm intrigued about this ? Um , but we talked about how much stuff we have on there , right , so it's it could .

It's very tempting to want to put everything that we that absolutely happens like a link to absolutely everything , um , but sometimes that scares people away or that overwhelms people . So you have to be very intentional and selective to know what things you're putting up there , even like the menu bar , right , that we have up top .

You know what are some things and how are we saying that . What are some words that would be easy to understand for people ?

We've categorized them as small groups and so if you need to find them , there's a small group finder that you can find that , but they're not getting a web page right . But we do know that , generally speaking , guests are interested maybe in like hey , what does your men's or women's program look like ? They know that we're going to look at your youth program .

That's something that families look at , right , exactly . So we're curating that right .

But , um , we briefly talked about photography , like photos are so important . Um , it's really easy sometimes to just use stock images , because sometimes that's the only thing that we can access or can feature on our website .

But I , I would really encourage everyone to try their best to find images , pictures from your community , because people nowadays are really visual when they're online and a picture is worth more than a thousand words . Right , it's not the same , but that also helps a lot . It helps to see your people .

So I think if you're the smaller church the printed material , older congregation it's still very , very practical , very , very viable . Smaller church , the printed material , older congregation it's still very , very practical , very , very viable . And we now have a weekly communication piece that we produce .

That's slightly more well , remarkably more insider , if you're a member here . Here's some good next steps , good next steps . So the printed word is still in our world and we had to kind of say okay , for a time we thought we could go fully digital , covid et cetera , but now people are more in person and some people really want that printed material .

It's kind of it's kind of long ways , I think , in in uh , calming some fears that we don't care about the next generation . Nothing could be . Nothing could be further from the truth . Go ahead , marla .

And so in the early days of Israel , we had the spoken word was how the word of God was passed down to generations , so people would share the stories of what God had done in the people of Israel .

And as time progresses , technology progressed , we had the written word , and so we have Paul writing letters to the churches , and so it's truly wonderful to see how God meets us where we are right and he speaks to us in a way that we understand , and so we get to use whatever tools are a blessing to our community and to our times to share that gospel , and

that could be digital , but that could also be written . And that's why it's so important to know your audience , cause if you , if you have an audience that they're they're not online that much , then maybe the best fit is printed materials where they are .

I don't even remember what they were promoting , but it was , like you know , the stereotypical elderly woman and she's sitting there complaining about how things have changed and not in my day and stuff , and then she pulls out her phone and takes a picture and says I'm going to blog about this .

Marlon and then Jack , I know you both have big thoughts about next steps .

So , um , next steps are areas of engagement , something that like a journey that we can give our congregation and our people as , uh like as a path , a discipleship path , to know . Okay , um , we know that people grow spiritually and in community in different ways . Right , it's not like a copy and paste for every single person .

So we try to have these areas of engagement that would help people in our community grow to whatever it is that God is calling them to step into . Next , and so that it's an ongoing work , an ongoing process .

This is step one , step two , step three , and in these various steps you're clearly moving from a consumer relationship to the church to a contributor relationship to the church , from a less connected to more and more deeply connected both of those things being true , is it going to be the case that everybody's going to follow every step exactly the same ?

No , but you have a logical process laid out for people and that makes it easy for you , as the church , to say well , it looks like you're doing this and so now a really great next step for you is to do this . You've been worshiping . Come check out our starting point , or come meet the pastor . Hey , you met with our pastor .

Check out our membership class or whatever it is that you're doing to onboard people into your ministry . Hey , you've done this class and you become a member here . Here's things that we'd love you to do as a member . Right , and you've got that . You've got that . You know ready to go , and you've even built systems around that .

You might even have some automation around that , and that's a great thing . When we think about our app is that , when you think about using an app differently than a website , you know why is it such a great portal for the member site . You know why is it such a great portal for the member .

Number one is that it knows who you are right and it's tied to your database . So your database knows like what kind of participation a person has , where are they then on their discipleship journey ? And it's able to offer them a customized next step just for them .

You want to talk a little bit about that , marlin , like how that looks like at Christ Greenfield .

They're a great company and it helps us basically connect our database , our church management software , to our app and it helps us have a more personalized journey information for each member in our congregation .

So , as an example , let's say we have a woman in her 40s she is a new mom , and she started coming to Christ Greenfield , and so we'll have we use it with badges , so each batch reflects a next step of our discipleship journey .

So she's been coming to worship for several Sundays , so her worship badge will be lit , but she hasn't done the meet the pastor class , our starting point . Meet the pastor class our starting point . So we'll know that just by seeing that information .

So we'll have some messages that are customized for her that say hey , we think that you would love meet the pastor , you should come for our April class . We've also noticed that you're a young mom . Hey , you should check out MOPS . It's a great opportunity to be engaged with our community and with moms in our community . So that's how our app works .

Most of people , your members of your church , are baptized already , so it's not a relevant communication . But there's a tiny percentage of people who are not baptized and if you know that , it makes a lot of sense to highlight that , messaging to them in that app .

And I mean , is it successful Then ? I guess , in brand awareness and congregational awareness , sure , positive goodwill in the community , sure , but in terms of helping them take their next step into a relationship with Jesus , especially if they don't have a church , maybe not so much .

Greenfield has . But maybe there are some groups that they're not aware of .

You know , even though they're somehow a part of the Christ Greenfield family ministries community , they might not be aware of some groups like mops or a particular small group or a CD care class that could benefit them mops or a particular small group or a CD care class that could benefit them .

So we want to always make sure that we offer something else , like an on-ramp to something else where they could get further connected , whether it is to Christ or other members of our community .

And no one would ever look at you and hang out with Marlon as you're listening to this and say you know what Marlon sounds like ? A meanie , marlon's a mean . No , no one's ever going to say Marlon's a meanie . But you have kind of risen with your kind of leadership voice , especially as it related to our culture guide .

We were in a retreat and you said I think we may be missing something , especially in onboarding our staff into the CG way , if you will , the Christ Greenfield way , and we needed to double down .

There had been seasons where we had like live the journey or join the journey or something like that , but we really didn't have that rallying statement for our family of ministries . And you helped develop , taking a template with some other churches .

We didn't start from scratch per se , but you helped develop something we're super proud of now in our CG Culture Guide . Why did you do it and how is the Culture Guide really starting to bless us as a ministry ?

Rich Wilkerson has this phrase that I really love when it comes to culture , but he says that culture happens either by default or by design . So we are either intentionally working towards creating the culture that we want to see and the people that we want to be , or it's just happening because it's always happened that way , right ?

Or it's just happening because it's always happened that way , right . So I think that , just seeing at the values that we have at Christ Greenfield and who we are , our mission and our vision and where we're going it was important to start having those conversations of okay , there are certain things that we really value and that we really want to embrace .

I think , as believers , we can have a similar analogy to our day-to-day life with Christ . Right , we have the Word of God and we have something that we can always go back to the blueprint for life according to Jesus .

So we could have it there and it can just be there and there's a difference with going back to Jesus so , um , we could have it there and just it can just be there , and there's a difference with coming , uh , going back to it and asking the Lord for grace and help to live that way , to live the way of Christ right and to follow him .

So , similarly to that , you know there are some values and things we value and embrace . We want to be more like that right we value and embrace . We want to be more like that , right . So can we put those things together in a booklet , in a document , and just put our culture guide together ?

We begin by , as you said , like researching , knowing more about culture guides and what churches do . Also , a shout out to Ryan Brado . He's someone in our congregation who really helped us in this process Our team , Kate and Adam . They were crucial to this and we began with asking questions to our staff .

We began asking , by doing surveys or different things , to inform ourselves a little bit more of where we are , where we want to be right , but truly to help us have a culture guide and a set of values and sayings and things that would be very fitting to who we are and who we want to be right .

So , yeah , that's the story of our culture guide , and we truly want to embrace our vision , embrace our mission and where our leaders are , you know , saying , hey , this is where we're headed for this season and this is what we believe God has put in front of us , and so we just Truly want to live that way .

Right , you can be technically good at your job , but are you going to fit into an organization by adopting the values of the organization ? And having that document , both for members and for leaders , has been just a tremendous tool for us .

It actually allows us with greater clarity to articulate hey , when we've got problems , here , here's how we're going to go about solving problems . And when we have to make decisions , here , here are the filters that we're going to use to make decisions .

And it just provides a lot of clarity for people , and I see that new people they're very interested in that document . It does a lot to shape the brand of our organization .

And so , as an example , like RESS could be one that we've recently I mean Christ Green Pulse , since I began working with it has been a fast pace , like let's do it , let's go , but I always loved how , like on Fridays , most of the staff that work on Sunday they say our Sabbath day is really important .

So we're really going to make sure that those who need to take the Sabbath are taking the Sabbath , because , you know , a lot of people work on Sunday . Right , and it's a commandment . The Lord has called us to embrace and rest the Sabbath and Dolores has called us to embrace and rest the Sabbath .

But sometimes we need a reminder and Sabbath rest is a part of that culture guide where we can go back to and be like are you resting ? Make sure you are resting , and so we know that's something that we value and it's really important to us .

The word is how the world changes . The word is what creates and sustains faith , and we are not adding to anything connected to scripture . All the words are there . We're just communicating them , understanding our context , understanding the culture that surrounds us and you know aesthetics . Let me just go to this .

Like God is a God of order and beauty , and if we , as leaders in the church , say you know what ? Like those people out there are aesthetically pleasing but they're selling out .

Like the church should be one of the most beautiful artistic places where we steward the words that Jesus have given to us very , very well , listening to the people and then , as leaders , casting vision for how we're going to live together for the sake of those who are not here .

So brand , just talking about brand what people say about you when you're not in the room . This is simply wise , and if you're not focused on that right now , you're really , really missing . You're really really missing out because you're getting crushed , if you will , in the marketplace , especially as it relates to beauty and customer awareness .

Because let me just land this right here Unless you view folks as initially , they are consumers , you know and this is deeply theological I come with nothing before God . I bring only my sin , only my brokenness , and I need to be consumed by grace , to eat and drink the goodness and grace of God through word and sacrament .

I am consuming , but then I'm being filled with the Holy Spirit to follow Jesus on this mission . I really want to have a vision that goes beyond simply consuming , to contributing in the greatest divine love story of all time and leaders who don't steward how that story is shared . This is brand , this is words , this is culture we're missing out today .

So I just felt compelled to give that sort of a justification , because a lot of leaders say I don't play . I don't play like that .

Let me also say this I bet there's folks in your congregation , pastor of a church of 70 to 200 , somewhere in there there are people who would love to be at the table with you as you take a look at your website as you explore . Maybe an app could help serve discipleship here as you explore .

Do we put together a culture guide to name clearly our mission , our values as an organization , as a congregation ? They're there , they're just waiting to be invited to the table for sure .

He is very , very concerned about the reputation of the community , of the church , and this is necessary to create space for the gospel , right , yeah , so this is an expression of our Christian freedom , the freedom that we've been given us , right , not that we're , you know , this isn't the horizontal righteousness , but this is branding the church .

When we sit there and we say we love each other and we respect you know , we're respectful and we're orderly and we do all of these kinds of things and we refrain from things even though you may have permission , right and freedom to do it . This is your brand . He was very , very intent about that , right , yeah .

We work toward resolution . We maintain the unity of the bond of peace here . So it really is just naming those character qualities that we must value , which are all , as you said , jack , deeply rooted in scripture .

Anything more to add to , not just with the words , marlon , but maybe say a little bit more about the aesthetic of how we present our congregations ?

And so it was scrolling and scrolling down through a lot of information and we said we got to find a way for this to connect with people .

And we know that , because it's a written document , we're going to rely on colors , on branding , on graphics , on the way that we structure these words so that it's easier for the eye , for people to read it and to feel some emotion , right , Not only through the words but what they're seeing . And so we're so blessed to have an amazing graphic designer .

Her name's Kate Ness . She's awesome , and so we just share the vision of what we were . You know what we were wanting to see in the document . This is how you know which colors we should look at it .

And then she worked her awesome , beautiful gifting into it and it ended up being this document that , when we showed it to Ryan , who was helping us with this process , we showed him first the content , just like the Word document , and then we were able to show him the finished product , with it already being branded , and the reaction was completely different , Like

when he was reading the branded document . You could see the emotion and you could see how it spoke to him in a different way than just all the words in one word document . So that's just a beautiful example of how , as he said , art and colors and all that is a gift from the Lord . I mean , we see it every sunset , we see it all around us in nature .

God is a God of detail and he uses beauty to convey love and convey messages that are important for his people .

And this is to your wonderful husband , adam , as he's listening to his awesome wife talk . Maybe he can make our culture guide very , very accessible for anybody who's taking this podcast in today . We would love to offer that to you and we'd also love , through info at uniteleadershiporg .

If you've got questions , if you'd like us to come alongside as you put this together , we would be honored to do so . Okay , last question here , marlon , this is a ULC podcast , but it also speaks into the culture and the values of the Lutheran Church , missouri Synod . You're newer to the Lutheran context . What do you like about the Lutheran tradition ?

What parts of our tradition are still weird to you ? And we want you to speak freely , we're not going to be offended . What are we still true ? And I'd love this last question is huge what do we have to learn as you look at the broader landscape of confessional Lutheranism here in the United States of America .

What do we have to learn from the wider church ?

I am very passionate about multiculturalism and worship and body of the Lord , so for me it's a beautiful experience and it's equally challenging experience to get to know different groups and different denominations , and I've been blessed . I grew up in Guatemala , so I grew up in different denominations contexts .

I went to a free Methodist college in Illinois so I went to a free Methodist church during those four years , loved

that congregation . And now I've been at Christ Greenville almost five years , I think in a Lutheran context my first time ever experiencing this community . My husband grew up Lutheran at Christ Greenfield , so it's been a learning experience and I'm very thankful for it . It stretches me . I learn more about God's people .

I learn more about Jesus and the mosaic that is his church . Something that I really appreciate about the Lutheran context is that they're very zealous about the word of God and just how important it is to really really go back to it .

I think we live in a world and age where some circles may not be very paying attention to that , paying attention to that right they go enough to on their own , or maybe not as solid food , from the word . So I really appreciate that and value that . And then , something that's been maybe a little challenging is understanding .

You know the relationship between you know some people not all may not be as open to different contexts . You know different denominations , different groups of faith that have been experienced Jesus and His love for centuries and for ages .

So maybe some I don't know with've um , with some people I've encountered um and this is again the framework and that the lenses that they grew up with .

So also approaching this with grace , right that this is everything that they've known , um , maybe even some people that I've met um may not know , know or may know a little bit more about and this is maybe coming from my ignorance but may know a little bit more about Luther than Jesus , and so sometimes I have to ask myself the question or maybe how they're

saying it . It portrays that way . So I'm and I have great friends and people in the Lutheran context that helped me understand the lingos and helped me understand , you know , when I come up with those interactions . So they helped me break it down , man that you're so polite , you're so kind .

The Lord's Supper is a big deal for us , but then I really I think what we have to learn is this growing awareness of intercultural dynamics and how context shapes absolutely everything and how the biblical story .

Do we trust the word of God and the grand narrative enough to say you can have this was the struggle in Acts , the book of Acts for the Gentiles right , you can have these different customs and it's not necessarily going to go counter to the word . I'm not going to put all of these respective cultural laws , even in the way we worship , upon you .

There's some , there's some Christian freedom there and I think we're struggling as as a church , on a variety of fronts , to to not be closed and to present ourselves to the wider church and to pre-Christians as a closed group of people . If you look like this , worship like this , then you can belong here and I think you know with us at Christ Greenfield .

I mean , we're trying to be the change we want to see .

We want people first to belong to Jesus before they come alongside all of our sociological customs here and some of them are customs rituals that are deeply rooted in scripture , but they may not be customs that have been received in various cultural contexts and it's just about awareness and having the humility to share with an open hand rather than make judgments upon

that person because they don't do it the right way , which is obviously my way , the Lutheran way yeah , Anything more to add there , any Christian group .

That's just our human condition , Like , and that's why the Lord's first commandment is , you know , he is our , our Lord and God . Like we have , we should have no other gods but him . And so I think sometimes the lenses or even traditions can get in the way of the message of Jesus .

But the reason it's working is because the Holy Spirit fills you in a beautiful way . The humility of Christ rests upon you and you are a learner who just continues to want to offer your whole life to Jesus . You're a professional worshiper . For those of you who don't know , she is an amazing worship leader , singer-songwriter , coming alongside your husband .

We are so grateful that the Lambs are a part of the ministry team here at Christ Greenfield . We're so much better . If people want to reach out to you , how can they do so , marlon ?

This will help us share the common confession of Christ , and we just want to communicate it in winsome ways to those who are far , most especially to those who are far from the Lord . The days are too short to do anything otherwise . Thanks Jack , thanks Marlon . This was a lot of fun , god bless .

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