"Who's At Village?!" (w/ Kate Berlant)

it's April. I think it's it's a Q two development now convention where it's like now everyone's over the forehead, bring me the wrist. Why don't you bring me the wrist? Why don't you can? I say, famously knew about being able to take a pulse on her wrist. You know, I'm I've been around. You can take a pulse on her. I can't. I can't feel my own can you my own? Beyonce? Um? Wait, yeah, she's not as not as good as this guy? What where you kind of put it on your sort of

next slash throat. This is a universal vascular accessibility point right here, right here, on the next now is that from your history as a premed student that you use that language just just general working vocab for physiology. Well, speaking of hospitals, what, oh my god, what are you talking about? You want to talk about? I want to talk about this is what? This is the temperature ture I wanted to do? How raw? How raw and real should I be today? Because there's something going on. Our

guest is nodding raw does she know? She says, she's now think the words wrong. She will now so basically, okay, live readers, there comes a time in every young boy's life when they get a medically necessary ryanoplasty, and unfortunately that time has come for me. On Thursday, I'll be going, as they say, under the knife, yes, to get my nasal dermoid cyst removed. If this is this turning everyone on. This is not elected. Can't describe how badly I don't

want to do it. And our guest is sort of asked this sort of you know, pondering whether or not that's true, sort of skeptical energy. But I will say, darling, dear, it's at the point where if if this sucker in my nose gets infected, it could absolutely kill me. So It's just like, I have to get this thing out of my nose, everyone, and the cyst is located so

far in my septum. Again, hold the boner's down. I know you're absolutely rocketing off your couches where you obviously listen to a podcast sitting on your couch, well bellied down the stomach sleepers so that they get the boner and then well, you know, you know who's not going to be sleeping on the stomach for a while, this gal,

because I got to sleep rocket it up in the chair. Basically, everyone, the plastic surgeon who get this put Mary Joe Buda Fucos face back together after Amy Fisher shot her in the face, so you know he's great. So you know he's good. Is taking a scalpel to my schnaws. I can't describe how much I didn't want to do this. In fact, I've put it off for many years. It is now no longer put off of ball and gotta go. So basically what I'm saying is like, this could be

the last episode I do. No, No, Matt, what I'm reading about anesthesia is true. No, Matt, this is this is Have you had other kinds of surgery before famously my wisdom teeth or let's just say no longer there did they put you under for that? Okay? And it was fine. It was fine, except I came out and looked at my doctor in the eyes and said, you're not fucking McDreamy. That's an amazing post anesthesia line. Oh my god. The fact that you even remember my mother,

she was there. She said that she looked at the doctor, he looked back at her, and it was sort of that. It was like two thousand and ten, so it was like my son's gay and made a joke, you know what I mean. So yeah, God, some some anesthesiologist doubt there has to put out a book like within Medically Ethics. That's what we need. Well, you know what they could do is they could do a ghost right name. So many people are doing it. I just want quotes. I

wanted to be like FML style remember that site. I wanted to just be that I am so sorry that you are that you have anxiety about this horrible. I think this is just like a crucible you have to walk through and then and then and then you won't have to think about it. After the recovery, I felt I had to be honest about it because there is a possibility that it will look a little touch different. I told you I want to look as same as possible.

But if it comes back, if it's like I disappear for a month, I come back with a different nose, I don't want to not I don't want people to think I did it cosmetically. Not that there's anything wrong with that Signfeld. You have one of the group, you have one of the great Greek noses of our generation. I'm not upset with it, and so the fact that it has to leave feels very sort of coming of age, my God, in the way that someone should. And that's

some enthysiologists write a book about everyone. Um, if you're if you're the praying kind, please pray. Take to your name. I'm not even I'm not even saying this, like ironically, I think people, if if you are, if you like to pray, you should pray for man. And also, don't damn me with your story about the time you woke up from anesthesia during a procedure, like, keep that to yourself. I guarantee I I am already handling for everyone the

doomsday googling the doomsday googling has We're well on our way. Damn, damn, damn. Well, I think it'll be great. I hope come out of it very happy. I hope it comes out snatched. Yes, and thank you for sharing and being wrong. I had to be wrong because I just feel like, you know, the readers deserve it. They deserve transparency from us. Do you want to say one transparent thing before we bring in our incredible guests. Yes, go ahead and be transparent.

The transparent thing is that the reason why we did not have an episode last week is because Matt came over. Mai was in town, he came over to my apartment. We had a wonderful guest booked fifteen minutes before we were supposed to go on Zoom Go just record. I broke down into your sobbing um for for many reasons. We don't have to get into them. Yeah, our collective health has not been good. No, but it's but I think this is actually perfect. You had a hard week,

It's fine. I think this is a perfect segue into introducing our guests because it's about wellness. And now here's the thing, Well, well, very much is very much is. But I think she um, she is someone who is just She's she's probably so sick of hearing this, but like what an intellectual healer, healer, intellectual healer, just just her and and her co host Jacklin Novak, she's been

on the podcast before. What a true perfect lens to examine wellness through that they have in the podcast that they host together, which is called we should say right now, it's called Poog Poog. We're network siblings. Were so honored when I heard that we were going to be network siblings with this duo. I said, we made it. Only at that point did I say we had made it before I didn't care at all. I didn't care at all before that. No, um, we love her so much?

Oh my god? Can we say first of all? And I was like thinking back, do you remember when we watched five and like basically put it put it on again right after we were done. I literally And also I went watched the whole thing twice. And our guest doesn't really know, but I've sought out them performing live many times. I saw them that lyric. I even asked a question during the show. And I don't think the guests knew who I was at all, because I was kind of just like hiding in the shadows. But I

asked the guests a question. The guests give an incredible sufficient answer. UM, an incredible sufficient Yeah. I got what I needed and she got she needed. I felt it was symbiotic. Both of you were fulfilled very much, UM and a true genuine honor. Oh yes, yeah, And it's one of those guests where it's like they haven't been on humiliating for us. Yes, humiliating for us. UM. I'm so excited. Chee's here. Everyone, Welcome, Kate to become audible. Welcome,

Thank you for that beautifully generous introduction. Welcome, Welcome. I'm honored to be here. Before the before we were rolling, I was saying, you know, this is a true top shelf podcast there in my digital cat will be reflected in the real world. I'm overjoyed to be here. Listen. It's it's it's it's truly it's I would consider it a peak of our lives. And we haven't we haven't really even really met that many times. But we met in Palm Springs when we went into each other at

a restaurant. Of course, of course, that's the one time that's so sixties like we ran into each other in a and Palm Springs at a restaurant. I mean, that's such a glamorous can I tell you that to have happened. I had just touched down that night. I had flown in from New York. From New York into into Palm Springs. I was told to go straight from the airport to this restaurant to meet Matt. I sent something back that night, and I never send things back, and I did it

very well, and it's a formative memory. Continued. I think you mentioned this to us. I think you mentioned this to us when you when you came in, said high knowing myself, probably ran at top speed to you, crumbled and told you everything. But but I have to know, was it a drink or a food? I never sent back?

It wasn't that I did it beautifully. So this is one of the burden of growing up right, which is kind of the theme of my life ring And I think that sending things back, you know, of course, it's scary, you know, we're told to feel wrong about it. I do it very rarely. You do great, You do it with love. You're not You're not there to some people send things back, you know, in a horrible way. They're being abusive. Of course, no one's sitting on this zoom

is going to do that, right. I of course go overboard. I go too far, you know. I like, I'm like, let me wash a dish, you know, I like go to I like really want to know that. But I overcorrect. But why do I keep dropping into this? I feel like that's the sort time I've done that. You spend five minutes. That's a tick. I don't want to take it to you. You want to know what it is.

It's a it's you judging yourself because you feel you're you're talking about yourself doing a monstrous thing, and we want to tell you it's something that it needed to go back. The app needed to go back clearly, or wouldn't have also doing like Martin Shorts. Yeah yeah, but the okay, but the app, I just want to say it quickly. It was with melon, so we all are high summer melons should be succulent, they should should be fresh, they should be fresh. A shoot on melon can be

more simple. What arrives at the plate, the shudo is is crispy, it's been cooked. So right there, I'm like, that should be on the right. You should tell me cooked for shooto, it's not. And then and it was over what can only be described as the most rigid melon that I ever encountered, flavorless and by the way, it was like a seventeen dollar app Do you know what I mean? This isn't This isn't. These aren't spiced cash shows for six dollars. You pop them back, you go,

you know. So this was and I felt I had already established our poor with the with the server, of course we were close at that point. I felt comfortable and I said, God, you know, I'm so embarrassed here, but I just would you just you know, would you this This isn't the actual memory, but I was. I'm proud of myself. I think I was really able to with love be like, would you hate me if I

sent this back? Ice? And I sending things back as a huge I think it's been discussed on poop, but I'll just say quickly it's a huge topic for me. And I once was so anxious about setting something back that I did an audio recording on my phone, thinking of the power performing for my phone. Then I would be able to do it and rise to the occasion, I still panicked and I said it was I was like, this is my greatest fear. But you know, and they

don't care. Right, you're being polite. They're not gonna, don't you. I and not not not to move away from the discussion about sending things back, but I think I talked to you in the past about um, you using sort of voice memos or however you record on your phone as a way to like as like some generative tool in your not in your work. I just in terms of like you're you're playing to the phone in a way.

I don't know, I don't know what it was specifically, but I feel like this is like, actually, no, this And I don't mean to um point that out to just to be like this is something that cape Lant does. But I'm like, oh, but that that has helped. That is like very self aware of you to be like, well let me, actually this is a helpful thing and let me do it. So I don't think I mean, I think you. I think you're handling this. You're you've handled all of these situations so well. But how many

times have we done it? Total? Do you have we do we have account of back? Yeah? That's unfair. I you shouldn't answer that question. It's definitely under ten. We're clocking in it maybe five times. Did you did you evaluate the protudo with melon? This is purely aesthetically was it was it just like you looked at it, You're like, this is not good enough? It sat down. I said, oh, that's not what I'm expected. But I was still prepared to fully dive in when when the melon hit my

mouth and I thought, I mean, it just was. And I didn't say to her like, oh this is inedible or this isn't right. I just you know, I just you know, a lot of handwringing. Oh god, I it's been a hard year. I don't know what I did. But it was gone. And then there was I believe or something, and I was and we were back in business.

And so this is the deal. It's like, So I was a server for many years, and so you have to understand I've been on the other side of this many times, and I feel like I was retailed and so that's that's I guess where the rub is. So that's that's I guess where it is. So so when I'm a server being told like I need to send this back. Usually it's something is being sent back for one or two reasons. One, I ordered this and it's not satisfactory. That's one too, This is not what I ordered.

So the fact that you said, I ordered this, but it's not to my it's not to my satisfaction, it's not to my taste level. Quite literally, I think there's a lot of power in that, because it's just it's just you are the type of person I want to be dealing with, because I, as a server, know that this person knows what they want and wants to come here and have a great experience mine do. I haven't been a server in many years, but I just sent something back last week and it was a cocktail, and oh,

cocktails are classic. I mean I I can barely order a cocktail because it's just it's never unless you're getting a goddamn Tom Collins, something that's been written, you know, fixture, unless you're getting like this is a Manhattan, I'm getting ato growning. But once they start going, oh it's made with you know, once they start experiencing or like the

craft Margarita's that they're fucking whipping up. Now, let me tell you something, darling, you just got it to keep it straightforward, because sometimes the thing about these craft cocktails is you've got a lot of ingredients, like there's a lot going on in them, and you miss one not drinkable, and they sure are heavy with the it's honeytown as soon astown, it's honeytown out there. And I and so I don't want a sweet cocktail and never ever in my life. Let me ask you a question, and I

know the answer because of what you've said. But mimosa or bloody mary in the sort of wars of the mimosa and the bloody Mary, what's what's for you? I very wildly drank three mimosas yesterday in my home. What yes, it was. I'm sorry, but didn't we just say that sweet cocktail? Nor jumped out? I went here we go? I contained multitudes. Life is if i'd by paradox and I don't want a sweet cocktail. Yet I would say twice a year I wanted my most and yesterday was

one of those days. Freshqueeze or o j okay, this was this is craft o jo, you know, very like an expensive thing of and a top shelf cova. And I also want to spell rumors. Oh, a good bottle of Cova is going to run you. At least you're gonna go bottle whatever you want. How you're feeling for Grand Crew? But I drink. I drank it and it was huge for me. So anyways, I have mostly but bloody Mary. Typically, I'm more for a bloody or bloody Maria because we loved Maria. And you know what, Bow

and Yang. Have you ever tried a gin bloody Mary? I've not try to jim bloody Mary. Sometimes someday people that talk about Juniper when people are like always quick to be like, I did, this is Martin, This is Martin specifically, it's Jiminy just doing a bad king had some you know, she was you know, people loved her, you know, and through hadn't really found that role yet. And then and then we went back, we came back from COVID and she was just doing Jiminy. That's where

we lost interest. She had such a thing, you know, she had such a thing. She lost it. I saw Martin short once outside of a restaurant, and he really is a god to me. And did you approach No? I could never approach. Actually that's not true. I could but I was too overwhelmed. I just I smiled and through the smile that it was translated it and he received, who have who have you approached that question? Love that question?

I love that question. So I have I had did a terrible approach and I was I want to say, sixteen fifteen sixteen, I approached Owen Wilson, who was in a boarder's book. There was a CD section and I was very Rushmore was huge for me um and I went up to him and I was like, I'm so sorry to bother you, but bottle Rocket Rushmore. I'm just

I'm just a huge fan. He looked around very nervously, uncomfortably, but in a way that and even as a as a teen, I felt in his looking around, dare I say a performance of Oh I'm being bothered because there's no one in sight, you know what I mean? There was a little bit of a guy. I don't I'm not even trying. I'm not throwing him under the bus. I'm not even saying he was rude. But I just remember in the moment, I was like, oh, he's acting like a famous person, but he was a famous was

coming up to him. But I did the unthinkable, which I was a child, would never do this. Now I reached my hand. See they don't you can't do they don't like that. Again, I was a child, and we're out of border. So what's the year like two thousand five four? Younger? Can I can I just say this might be like my own self selection bias talking. I feel like the rules for um famous person engagement, celebrity engagement were not widely set or known at the time.

It's why the line was being crossed so many times. Really in that era of that era of let's just say it Perez Hilton, okay, he was sort of encouraging every want to go up jut their hand out at Owen Wilson and the like in the borders wherever I tried to shake it. I tried to take Jerry Seinfeldt hand. He told me he doesn't do that. Second side the reference of this episode. Don't know why this is happening.

It's a competition between him and short. Yeah. I just remember he gave me, he handed me his very limp It was a very very limp hand. And immediately remember the shame like filling me from my stomach up to my shoulders and I was like, what have I done? And then I you know, I'm sorry about ran away? So I did that approach? Um never recovered. Clearly, who else have I approached that thing? That might be my

only approach? No, no, no no, no, no no. It sticks It sticks out to you, and I find that beautiful. Well it's because it sticks out because he made it a bad experience. And I'm gonna say terror, So you know what that's like. That's like, And this is where this comes from. And I'm diagnosing you don't like to send things back because you don't want to get an Owen Wilson response to that, because you were doing a perfectly lovely thing and you were saying, I enjoy what

you do. And you were saying, as a person, that's engaging here and you when you go into a restaurant, and everyone at home, all the readers, when you, I want you to know, when you go into a restaurant, that's engaging. So kudos, you are engaging. And you if the waiter was to be like, well what are you talking about? Yeah, well then we'll have some fun, sweetheart.

But isn't that isn't that what you're afraid of? That the waiter will sort of feel like that's the way it's supposed to be, that's the melon, or that they'll yeah, my fears that they're interpreting me is some you know princess who like can't my palette? I eat ship all the time. I know isn't good. And I pay and I and I do my I do my citizen duty, and I get out and I keep it to myself and we talk in the car. I I deal with it. I take it home with me. I don't I don't

put it on you. But every now and then there's a hard melon at the peak summer season, and I'm not I'm not paying seven. No. I can't even believe that was the o G price. I really think it was seventeen. Of course, having the urged cross refords the money that I want. No no, no, no no, probably season as we can't reference it. I want to ask you, K I feel like this podcast poog. I thought about this, and I hate to use these words, but I find it to be very brave and ready vulnerable that you

guys are like that. You guys have to you guys have to like talk about your own experience with some wellness topic in order to engage in some meaningful conversation about it, and and every conversation is meaningful. But I'm always like, okay, so we So they had to both share that, like they, um, you know, don't like waking up at a certain Now that's a terrible example, but

do you know what I mean? It's like, you guys have to sort of reveal something about yourselves and it is deeply, deeply personal in order to like have the discourse that you guys want or the tone that you guys want to have. Thank you is would you? Would you? Okay? So no, I love that. I love that reading of it. Yes, I think it's like also because there's something so embarrassing and vulnerable about being like I want face cream because that it's like, oh, you want to be pretty bitch.

You know. It's like just in doing these things, which you know most of us do do, most of us are in some way inscribed in this system of trying to better ourselves, you know, from Nivia to I don't have that, but like these from Nia to clinic. Yes, yes, I'm sorry, keep going, keep going. But yeah, we all uh desire, we all have desires. We all have you know, some aspirational vision of and then just the kind of magical reality that's attached to products and that it's very real.

Yeah yeah, And you know it's interesting you bring up face creams because really this year it's the first year that I'm really diving into them, and I wish I could tell people, like some people are like, hey, your skins looking a little better. What are you doing? I buy everything, everything I buy, I put it all on my face at one time, so I don't actually even because because I guess I get in my head like it's the crisis of so many, it's the what do

they call it, the plague of plenty? They don't call it that, but I'm calling that um plenty. It's like great books. Yeah, some mathysiologists should get on that. But but basically, I'll get all this ship and I'll feel like, well, I have to use all of it to make sure because something will work, and then I don't know now

what works or what doesn't work because it's all on there. Yeah, that can't be good if you if you want to go, if you want to emerge like Korean Eastern skincare with like Western like dermatology skincare, The steps are cleans, clean's, toner's, foliate, serum, moisturized. And then if it's today, ESPF, if it's night, you do another sleeping mask or an I cream. That's the general order. You just want to like dinness to thickest. That's that's the guideline. And I don't claim to know,

don't anything. That's the other thing. Well, you're saying, sin to thick change my life. You know, even just isn't it isn't so funny? Is that simple? And only just now was it ever really said for the consumer out there? And I dream of a life of you know, the woman with one cream like my my mother has has aged beautifully, she's seventy six. She like her skin is great.

She doesn't really makeup. She uses drug store products, you know, and I'm like, why can't I like like she Now she's like she e'ts kind of whatever she wants, you know, she drinks at night. She has like a problem. But but no, but it's but now in this we have too many products. But but the fantasy of having no products is also its own magical reality. Right, It's like, I know, but you meet those people where they're like

all I put on is perfume. It's like they're like, I use water and bar so, I use Irish spring under my eye. It's a whole It's a whole scene in Madman, like Megan Draper being like, yeah, my mother just washes her face with warm water and then like touches her face with the tips of her fingers like that. I don't remember it. I'm mortified that I do. It's one of the only scenes from Madman that I remember vividly, and I'm like, God, why do I remember that scene

of Jessica Parrow. That's the scene that stirred you. Oh my god, this is when your first meeting Megan and then like who is that? Who is that character? And then and then and then they make you love her and they really you who the who the hell was I I hated her because she was young and beautiful. You know, they really turned it on. You Know what I've never like sort of been more shocked by but also seen myself and more is the performance of Zoobie

Zoobie Zoo. I really was just like so shocked that it was happening. And then by the end I was like, yeah, but you And like I was like what is this show doing? And then I was like, no, wait, you want to know what people take? Big swings? They do so just because we don't see this like a recognize this in nature, I'm like, no, but there is a world where this woman has done this and we're watching it. Yeah. Yeah, the big swing that is the sending back. Big swings

are embar As saying. I mean, I think we're remember when there was like a little period of time, maybe a few years ago, where everyone was like sincerity, like earnestness is about to like have a moment in comedy is specifically, and I was like really, and then I guess that kind of came true. But now I think depend the period the frequency on the swing back is so quick now, you know how to you know, it's like, oh, like fashion trends recycle every thirty years, and now it's

like twenty or ten. Like I feel like that that cycle is that the period literally is shrinking so that it's like, Okay, we're gonna like rock back and forth between these two poles every year now maybe like in a few years. And that is actually so so so upsetting and horrifying to me. Does that Am I making sense? Yeah, No, I don't know what I think I'm everyone can't wait to see what's gonna happen the next five honutes. It does feel, but it is kind of I don't even

know how I mean. You two are you know you you're you talk about culture and I feel so currently not outside of it, but like I can't even I don't know what we're doing anymore. No neither Joey. Oh please. That's why it's so crazy, because like I feel constantly out of the loop, Like like I feel like I opened the newspaper and front page is middle parts and it's like, I'm sorry, you can't get me to part my hair down the middle, Like it's not gonna happen.

That was something that actually did come to the surface for me. Somebody was like, oh, side parts are for old people, and I've been doing a side part since nine two, and I was just it hit me so hard and I tried to do a middle. I even doing it. You've done a middle, terrified me. I've done a middle. By the way, this could never happen from it, what I said was a lie. I'm lying on air.

I'm lying on air. But I did center forever and then right before the pandemic, I think I started feeling flirty and I started going to the side and I this is me now. I was loving in the privacy of my home, and then someone told me that it was a sign of being. I feel like for men, a middle part is such a bi crazy like not like it's right thing, Like who do I think I am? Devin Sawa? Like is that even how you say that? I think it's good. I think that is. Of course

it looks looks fantastic with the middle part. You yeah, you have modern Well, I gotta say, like, it just feels like such a hard pivot, like you don't think you think, like, oh yeah, I guess that's true. Side parts, the middle part doesn't feel like a big deal, but it's really a face changer. And in terms of like what's popular in like comedy, film, television, whatever. I have no idea whether we're doing Fleabag or are we doing Austin Powers. I just feel like, is it both? Can

it be both? I hope? So where do you found that spectrum kate between Fleabag and Austin Powers. Well, I recently tried to rewatch the spy who shocked me because it was. It was big when I was, however old, and well, yeah it wasn't. It didn't slap. The highlight of that film is the end where Fraud is counting. I didn't finish it, but Fraud counting down to the rocket is genius. I don't know if maybe that holds up. I don't know. She's great, but again didn't get that far.

I also, we watched The Mask and I thought, oh, yeah, I know, I don't like broad like. I know, I don't like really broad like in Austin Powers. I like a lot of it because a lot of it feels like specifically dumb like. But the Mask is literally just and I like Jim Carrey, but the Mask is like someone looking at camera and saying, somebody's that me, And I'm like that to me is like Toddler humor that I hope doesn't return. What I was couldn't believe is

the Mask. He did Mask and Ace Fintura the same year. Oh my god, can you imagine that career, the stamina, imagine the calls they were coming in. We got a know one for you, you you know, I just and the offers. I just can't imagine the offers anyway, Cameron introducing again Never Forgot, which was I couldn't believe it. That movie has made me so horny for her to go from the mask to like the next year, like my best friend's wedding, Like there aren't careers like that, or maybe

there are the greatest film. No, there are. Oh my god, Martin is in the room. The spirit is here. This this is good about haveing a good exorcism, and we will never return. You will never return. You know who's had a Cameron Diaz? Is I feel Margot Robbie, Yeah, yeah, Margot Robbie is the spiritually, the spiritual successor to Cameron Diaz sort of comes and splashes onto the scene and then is prestige but also big budget because you know there's another one of them suicide squads coming out. Was

Cameron ever's prestige. Cameron was prestige and being John Malkovich, and she was prestige in the Thank You and how dare I had that not been at the front of my mind? And she was prestige for a hot second there and she I believe she got awards for her performance in Vanilla Sky or awards nominations, and she was also prestige enough to be in Scorsese's Gangs of New York. So yeah, I didn't know I had the bibliography on

Cameron d Has but apparently I do. Um. But my best friend's wedding, She's genius, my best kiss, genius and being John Malkovich one of the great films. And I mean I was thinking on my best friend's wedding today because Julia in it is stunning. The only woman that I ever knew. I didn't know what a woman was until Julia Roberts. That's a great way to put it, explain that I just when Julia Howfords came on the scene, I don't know, I don't know the first time I

saw her. I will say Aaron Brockovich was a foundational text for me. I was like very obsessed with it, and I used to at that point, I would put on high heels and I realized, like, oh, I can do homework at home and high heels. I can dress up like I'm a lawyer and then middle doing homework

and it makes you better. I would dress up, so I would dress up to do homework, and I'd be like, God, dammit it, you know, I'd like walk around my heels, and it really helped, which became like a tool that I continue to use in my life of like, dress up for it, do what you can to make it easier. Pretend someone's watching you be the actor in the movie, Pretend that you're doing the thing, and then you'll oops,

now I'm actually doing it. It's very helpful. Yes, I think maybe this is generationally specific, but that movie, the line readings on like a on like a like a musical milaw audical level, burned in burnn burn Five is my phone number. Yeah, and I'm guessing that zero is the number of times you're gonna call Oh my God. Doesn't matter. That's all You've got, lady, too wrong, fucking ugly shoes. Yes, And actual chemistry. Also, I'll say actual chemistry.

When have we seen chemistry? Not even with this? I mean this, This is a fucking deep cut. And and okay, here cut us, I got fire. What have you been working so hard? Doesn't matter, doesn't make one fucking a bit of difference. I just got chills. She's driving, right, she's driving. No, no, no, no, that's he's fixing her pipes. And the baby and the baby says a word and the baby says it were The baby says the word is she's driving, Yes, and she said he says ball

and she's driving and she gets her Oscar nomination. There also that the nomination. Also, we're also forgetting. We're also forgetting when the cockroach runs through the thing and she goes, who lives like this? She's unbelieving football, she's unbelievable and you know what, it's funny, it's suspenseful, are unbelievable. Her hair changed everything for me. She's a whole lot. That's

why it's like, it's amazing. She's harnessing so much to give a performance that feels so real and it's just like that a real movie star, like such a movie star, but somehow a movie star who actually can then disappear and do a role. It's crazy. I mean, don't have disappears the right word, but but it was. Yeah. I love her. I love her and my best friend's wedding.

She's amazing, amazing and the character is so like evil yeah and does crazy thing No I would say calling to get your are like and you can see her way at one point. But my favorite thing is when a reshoot is obvious have you ever seen the proposal with Sandra Bullock, another absolute queen of the of the cinema. You would you would like, you know, it's really really stupid, but also it works because Sandra's just doing it. She's just like, I don't know how to describe it, but

Sandra's She's just doing it. So there's a there's a moment at the end, but do you know what I'm talking about where she's like packing up her stuff. The whole point of the movie spoiler alert is that she is like this like dragon lady of a Boss. Ryan Reynolds is her assistant, and uh, she has to pretend that they're getting married, just staying in the country because she's getting deported to Canada. So she gets like skip

to the end of the movie. She's getting deported. She's packing up her stuff and she's like, all right, I need these boxes taken here, I need this, I need that, And in runs Ryan Reynolds and she turns around and her hair is parted to the different side. It is such a fun continuity or it's so bad. I have no idea whether it was shot eight months later or what, but it is so funny. Everyone just go Google. All readers should google proposal ending scene and you'll see it's

like she turns around, Ryan Reynolds is there. They cut the head and they cut back to her and she goes Andrew and her hair is completely it's not caught on catching that. Well, it's like, who's that village? Yeah, who's that village? Who's who's script supervising video village readers? People watching things happen as I always thought it'd be funny to be like, we met it, we met it video village. It was really casual, and then before I knew it, there were sparks in video Village that night.

Maybe sparks in video Village is titled of app I'm a fan of Who's that village? And immediately transport its transported? It is for us in a very deep way. All right, So listen. So we've sort of like stumbled into the area of like foundational texts, and so this is where we sort of feel like it's a good opportunity and we take opportunities here. Sorry to ask the question, Kimberland, what was the culture that made you say culture was for you? Do you understand the question? Yes? I love

this question. I think it's a profound gift to give. Listen and the participant call us Santa Claus. It's a hard question. It's a hard question because you know, I feel like I have a two pronged answer. Use both problems, please thinking, okay, but both prongs engaged. Um. Very foundational for me was watching the Oscars with my mom. Yeah, and like my mom having a glass of champagne, being

very the excitement, really caring. I think because I was growing I grew up without religion, like I grew up like just very like secular. Like. There was not never a mention of sports in my home. There was never I know, the child, so um I had to create there was. There were no bottles first my parents. So I'm blinded by the light. It's okay, it's it's right, blinded by a light right now, it's crepuscular. The second became very noir where she is and all of a

sudden we're transported. Yeah. And so because of the absence of kind of religion or maybe ritual like just more like more, I was craving ritual. I was craving religion. I think I was craving something to like punctuate the year something to have meaning something that was like that my that I was like watching the television with my parents, like you know, something to to to idolize, and the oscars are right there and so and I just loved

the glitz and the glam. Of course, It's also the first time that I felt like my favorite thing was to watch the actors watch their clips, their nominates, right, and the kind of split between Okay, so that's a character. This is the actual actor, but the but the knowledge of the actor is still acting because they're on camera and they're at this psychotic ball where they have to perform themselves. So it was kind of like just I just it was very interesting to me and exciting and

also just fun to watch. I mean, you know, Hollywood and and all of that, but that was that did a lot. And I think just the speeches and kind of like knowing when I was watching certain speeches, like they're lying. You can see you can see the artifice from the beginning you feel. I mean, it sounds preposterous even then, but I just think it was I didn't I don't think I knew what was going on, but I just knew, like I'm interested in the social sort

of display. It is like an interesting social experiment, right, It's like you get actors to compete with one another. Then you find out later they've campaigned for this, and it's so interesting. You bring up the watching of the clips because that is my favorite part, is the moments before the winner is announced and they're all watching a clip that I don't think they picked, and it feels like they can do one of I'm gonna say three things.

Act embarrassed by it, Dyon Keenan, Dyan keanan right, or like anyone being like, oh, who, like, come on like that clip. I guess I'm here, or I guess that wasn't right right, Or they can solemnly watch it well and be like that was my work. Most people do that. Or and that's like a Nicole. That's like a cat. I'm trying to think of examples. Yeah, like Nicole. They looks up and then directly to the I'm always the partner. It's really about they bring and the the acknowledgement of love.

The performance of the partner is always like that's more now and I felt so raw after making this film and etcetera. And then there's a third sort of way I think people can do it, which is to pretend it's not happening and sort of still be having a conversation with whoever is next to them if they don't know.

The fourth thing is a bit like comedy bit about it, like cross your eyes like you look at it, or they cut back to you when you were in funny glasses, like you'll often see it reserved only for the Indie Spirit Awards. I mean that's like to make such exactly exactly, but it is interesting that's Golden Globes only. Yes, never the Oscars what they dare. Do you remember specific ceremony because I feel like, you know, I know, I'm thinking, I really for me, it was from it was it

was Titanic. That was the year that, like Key, I think a bunch of kids in our generation and I think like Titanic, Yeah, that was. I was thinking about Titanic today because I was like Titanic was and that was the first time I feel like there was a movie like that was the culture was feeding you so aggressively.

I was like, this is the movie and I felt somehow kind of maybe a little more adult because I was able to enjoy Titanic and then it won Best Picture, and it was like, well, look at me and enjoying

it exactly. Yeah, it's funny that, like it's true. But you know, they've even tried to, like the Oscars have even tried to become part of the monoculture of certain things in recent years by like making there be ten nominees or they'll nominate like Avatar, which is truly laugh out loud that that it would get so many Oscar nominations in watching it now, but it still feels like it's a good rewatch um because it's a laugh a minute,

but it's funny. But because like they really do try to get these bigger movies nominated by doing more nominees for Best Picture, and it feels like no one's watching them anymore, Like did you hear how bad the ratings work for the Golden Globes, Like it's like, really, people don't care about these award shows anymore. In a way that's like obviously important, right, Like in a Stiroids, it's like obviously like yeah, they're they're like a horrifying element

of the culture. And then now some of like college is also like well that's fake too, you know. It's like oh he gets to go to college. Who gets to participate in this system? Right? And similarly, like these award shows are being revealed for that. But and like kind of as they try to like do the right thing, they're like further revealed to me, like you don't understand or something like it's very but rewatching Oscar speeches. I I do that, Like sometimes it's very comforting to me.

YouTube clips of watching old acceptance speeches and what stands out Julia Actually, my god, she does a little bit. It's when she wins for Aaron Brockovich. I think she's she's doing some excessive laugh acting. Yeah, I agree. And

that's so hard. Yeah, a lot a lot it's at and it's hard because to be I mean, can you imagine listen, when I was a little girl, Okay, I thought I'm going to be a big star daddy, right, and then you grow up and you go I'm not, and thank God, or like it's like I'm never I'm never gonna have to be Julia, Like I'm never gonna have to be here like blessed be the character actress, Like I'm never gonna have to be To be honest, I'm never gonna be I won't ever have to be

in the gown and everyone going, isn't she the most beautiful? And here's your award and everyone's looking at you. It's

like that. Then that produces the fake laughter because then you have to be humbled, which is the Anne Hathaway kind of that it came true and then we all jumped on her throat for it in a way that it's like this, of course, but also we have to cut her some slack, like that's performance hell, receiving an award like that and then having to act like you are being and also just the embarrassment of being overwhelmed by an award. Right, It's like there's so much happening

at once, so much. It's a lot, and it is a thank god I don't have to be a Julia Roberts thing. Right, It's like, I don't know what that walking personal hell is. It's I mean, well, you can't win. Julie is a friend and yeah, no, no, it's so hard. I would kill for her friendship. I would kill for he even even if she is like clean, please, I love.

I would sign up for the abuse. Um, I feel like you can't really win either, because yeah, nicest lady on the street, um down similar in two weeks apart, they had a rule continue I've done the research, continuing Danny motor Um. Yeah, it's like if you're too casual, like if you're SuDS, like a few weeks ago, like at the Goal Glows when he was like obviously baked

and won an award he didn't expect. Everyone was like, well fuck him, because you know what, women have to get dressed up, and it's like if you're being like my dream came true tonight, everyone's like, well suck her, because it's like you you're it's either side of the spectrum. No one has no one can go up there and kill it unless you're like Jeff Bridget truly like where it's just like some older man that's like really deserving.

It says someone, Yeah, but if if if, but if you're a woman, if you're if you're winning Best Actress right now, the person who has done the best datic quote unquote I think has been like a Bree Larson going up taken award being like, well this is so lovely, thank you all so much, and just yea beautiful but to even have to perform that she probably had to like process that be like I gotta be fully exquisite acting. Ye, yes, yes, it's hell because I remember the Life is Beautiful to say,

what's his name? Life is beautiful was a real problem in my house, Like my dad was like, you could never have made the Holocaust fucking play, like there was like a then I didn't. I still haven't seen it. So then I remember like just being a child and being like that movie is bad. And then and then his big standing on the chairs going crazy and I was like, oh, he's full of ship, right, and like no, but did anyone ever hear from him? Again? I don't think so, because he was like now I get to

yeah he did it. And that also watching the Oscars now, watching those montages of the nominees, it does give you this comfort of like a right. It's also like fleeting or ephemeral, like even you can be nominated for Best Actress for an Academy Award like ostensibly the peak right all you could ever and then you're watching it going hey, who's that? Like who are people? The movie you've never

heard of? And then it's it's like, you know, there is something comforting about about watching Yeah, I think it's just it's I don't know. I feel like as the media gets more and more sensitive every year, it all just falls away, Like I don't know who Elisha vik Candor is. I can't pretend that I ever did. I don't think she's the only person who has top line, huge box office films and won an oscar that I don't think I recognize on the street. And this was recent.

I feel like, though, the only way to really nail it is if you just don't see it coming, like when Marianne cotre one like and she was just coman or like right when you're just so like sharked and friends, like when you're like, thank you life, thank you love. It's just like a perfect god. Can you imagine if someone who just no, we need that for for drag, for life, for food. I'm so glad you say that

because it is still possible. Right, And then this happened to like no, I won't give us a little magic,

like yes, there there there should be some magic here. Sorry, I was I was growing earlier because I was thinking one of my most top offenders, Eddie redmay Oh, I can't toss him out with the terrible, terrible, and for what I I returned to it to to mutilate, to self mutilate, you know, just and the stumbling like I am very very you know, it's he's just I mean again, I hate it, but he's just too um, too over joyed by himself. But it's tweet, it's it's it's you

know what it is. It's like, there's nothing funnier to me than people that take themselves that seriously and then like for that to not even be funny because it's so continuing to be so serious. I'm just like, it's like when Casey Affleck won all those awards, it's like, not only was it like we're awarding like a ray this here, it's also like he couldn't be more boring.

And I get that his acting performance was good, but we're like like why why why I respect the audience, respect my mother and myself watching with Champagne, like give us something. That's why it's important to have a dull sim That's why that's important. Yeah, that's why it was the best moment of my life and the number one moment in culture history. That's true. Uh, I just just

to put it. I guess we can we can keep discussing this, but I do think that we all agree that the only way to avoid performing authenticity or the self or whatever is to actually be genuinely surprised along with everyone else, along with the audience. And what a magical for that to actually happen. Happens. There's not the hardest thing to act is being surprised and laughing, right, Oh, I love that you guys talked about this on the On the podcast, I was like, you guys were talking

about what was it? It was laughing, but there was also like was it like, uh, something else too? But laughing is like, oh, I know, I think what it was was. I was saying that my greatest fear is to have to is acting being cast as like a funny persons actually like impossible, delivering a zinger or some like you could be like, look at this funny charming and that's it's interesting enough. It's what I have to return. I've been meaning all year to return to sexon City,

like the beginning, just watch it all again. And that's kind of like the crisis of Carry, the crisis of Carry, because Carrie needed to be funny and we needed to she was there with the Zingers. We needed to and it was an impossible it's an impossible space to occupy. Did samanthis Si? Did Kim Cattrall succeed though? Oh yeah, she's enough of a character the protagonists carry, we are supposed to be carry, and so Samantha was able to deliver Zinger after Zinger and it's hilarious. She didn't have

to be the surrogate for the audience. No is crazy. Samantha is giving you her opinions. Like whenever Samantha is saying something funny, she's she's usually saying because because she feels it, whereas Carrie is often commenting on what the other women are doing and saying so she's literally making jokes like her action often is making a joke about things, which is I think a testament tes JP that she was able to carry it through. Yes, it would have

been so annoying on someone that wasn't so likable. Also, great awards speeches from that girl, Oh for sure, for sure. Um, I don't think I have the staminate to watch it from beginning to end, but I did read I mean carry o'donald wrote this piece. I think it was in the cut about how the last season is actually genuinely still great and like, oh, I have to watch and I think I do that from six to six b Split, Sex and City was huge in my home, and that

was another thing. My mother loved it and my dad really loved it. And remember that was something where I was like, oh, interesting, Like my dad was like a phenomenal to hear it, because for me, it was one of those things that I had to I obviously like closet and a gay child that couldn't be like, we're watching this like and so my parents would leave and whenever they were gone for the day, I'd watch as many on HBO on demand as I could and even like and this was like and then I remember the

last season. And you know what's so great about the last episode of the last season, which is almost like why I wish they wouldn't even do any of these movies, is she has a monologue in that last episode which is so good when she's like, let me be clear about who I am to the Russian and she's like, I am someone who is looking for love, and it's like she arrived thereat she realized what she wanted. Indescribable can control it? Whatever it is in convening menient cats

live without each other love. She's all on the chest, she's always in this beautiful apart, beautiful in Paris, in Paris. I'm sorry, really excited, shouldn't have come here? And then she leaves and she never her hands never leave her chest, so right, and then we're laughing and big No, it's oh yeah, it's huge, deeply formative, deeply formative. What is them? Was there a second prong that we haven't touched? Lost

the problem? No? No, no, oh no no, it was again of course like rosy lead back to my mother, who's like a very dramatic person. But like I think, also, I don't know if this counts. I don't know if this counts, but my like, it's kind of connected to what I was saying, but like this performance of self. But like dinner parties, that was really also something where I was like, oh, I get this, like being alive stuff,

like you're alive. Do you have people over? Yeah, you make you serve food, you wear something, you buy flowers, you make the lighting nice, you decide, like you create an experience for other people. That was very like immediately I was like, I like that I was like, that's important.

And I think also seeing my mom be like it was it's a creative act, the generous, a generous act to have people over and feed them or and so that was and also seeing my mom like the panic, like the pre hosting and like the you know, the like not those chairs, you know, and all of that and kind of and like the anxiety of that and the preparation for the guests to come, and the kind of like that and my mom, Now, this is so funny to My parents would throw a holiday party every

year and my mom would spend like six months playing it or whatever. It was a huge deal. It was a great party. She's so get in the house ready, all the thing, and then the guests to start to arrive. My mother nowhere to be seen. My mother would be in the bedroom. My mom would be getting ready, and it was this thing of like her and it was where's Helen. It was like the guest It was always

a chorus of where is Helen? Where's Helen? And my mom would be like held up in the bathroom with a glass of champagne, like putting on some lipstick and being like what am I wait up? You know, and even though I'm kind of like, you knew what you were going to wear to this, you know, and it was a little bit of like now I think people kind of having me come out, come out, and I really see myself in her. This I'm painting as a much more psychotic portrait of what it actually was like

in the lived experience. But I see that now and also happen. This is a live revelation. Folks haven't talked about this ever before in therapy, never before, but like, but that was like seeing her kind of shift and seeing that, like the anxiety of performance, which you know you feel when you start on a set. You feel that when you start to a dinner party, right, and the vulnerability of hosting because set the stage and everything

has happened and everything is right. But once she steps out into it, then she has to become part of it, and then the installation is truly complete. So it's really you that thing of like it doesn't exist until she's actually out there and she and when you've built something up so much, it's tough to say, let's let's have the curtain go up. You know what I mean is

that thing and to insist in your own creation. It's like awkward to be like, oh, yeah, no, I planned this particulously and like, you know, like there's something that that like showing care, showing derris say it's a hot word, labor, you know, showing it like showing like showing that is yeah. And then and they're just like telling stories like that's

you know, being funny, being like captivating. And again, I was an only child, and I was really it was really important to me to make adults laugh or be chicken seriously because you would be yes because I were present. And yeah, there was no there was no kids table or anything no, because my parents friends like truly did

not have kids. And so I was really with a lot of adults and I yeah, I was like, I don't want to be a kid, like I want to you know, make someone laugh and I and so that was that was a big that was big for me. And then of course you know strictly ballroom and you know that stuff too. Did you did you find that? So so in order to make them laugh, you were never performing kid. You were performing as if as if

you were yes or something. I don't even really know what I was doing, but I recognize now that I think they probably also were laughing because I was trying to be like, you know what I mean, like at the time, and I can't recall like, of course, when I was really little, I was kind of like clowning or something. Remember, like I did like some magic tricks once or like something like that. But um or like

famous Sam Mom says. You know, I would go around and ask, you know, what kind of wine do you want? Red or right? But you know, but I made a mistake and I said red or blue. I was just cute. But I was very young at that point. But yeah, I don't know. I just remember the extreme satisfaction of like of like making them laugh, like actually making them up. Yeah, yeah, I want to I want to bring up something. I love it. Yeah, there was like your whole family died.

I I hesitated to even bring this up because it feels it feels so pilot the pilot about I was going to say, of course, so I'll say I'll give you a perfect Okay, we're cutting in here, um, which we which we love. By the way, you guys sent it to us and we watched it together, and we watched it together and we showed it to our friends, like and then we love different. We were just like

this is a perfect there's a perfect pilot. Yeah, anyway, So yes, I've always been obsessed with hosting and John early, and I think we sort of, you know, fell in love with each other because of like the shared sensibility of like understanding like that and kind of having always been interested in that, and then that like the crisis of personality, like the crisis of like presenting yourself. And so we made a pilot that did not air, did not air. It's it's truly an honor um to hear that.

But and the pilot that we made was, um the shows about believe, are you ready to best friends? But but the pilot was all set around a dinner party and these two people who are kind of married but they're not, but they um act as they're married essentially, and it's them throwing this dinner party and kind of all the steaks and kind of the kind of crumbling

around it. And I loved the ending though, when it was sort of revealed that they had just met, Like I thought that there was something so interesting there and like people that can become codependent very quickly, Like I love that about it, and I'm always trying to I'm always trying to find a way to put to really get because codependency, like it's only I haven't seen it really explored in like a way that I'm like, yes, yes,

yes yet. But then it was really getting there, and I thought it was so interesting like that everyone was like, yeah, they don't really know each other. It's been like it's been like three or four months. And I just thought that was so that's just like a funny smart because also that's like true to John. People like when we started being friends were like, oh, did you guys go to like they we went to acting school together. Of course,

was rejected from acting school. I repeat, rejected girl. Yeah, And I was like, I'm gonna go in through through the under ground system and so I but everyone assumed that John and I had gone to college together and we're long friends, and then we were always kind of en humiliated we met last year, you know, and so we because we also when we met, it was that psychotic thing of like kind of having like a shared sensibility or like we're like fully falling in love, like

it was falling in love, and we thought it looks like it will be good on that. Yeah, I didn't know my and I can say that now, but but yeah, that thank you for referencing the pilot. That was hollywoods Hollywood's tough. You know. They tell you a we're going to give you. I call myself that that was not it was. Let's get the Gemini counter up here. But no, you know, I say this for the listener. If you think about moving to Hollywood, just be careful. Tells you

the moon. It's sweetheart. They say you're going to be available the next big thing. I'll pick up your pilot. I know, next next next big thing. That's Sandy Kenyon.

That man's doing. I want to quote to you because it's just it's just reverberated for years at this point, but the wonderful scene of like the dinner party actually happening and the conversation being wild, but at one point your character goes, I forget what leads with the lead up into into this line is but it's like, um, you know, like like like in linguistics, you don't have

the word, you don't have the concept. You know. Oh my god, that's such a genius, just like way to like I don't know, um, just put a cap on like this wild run of like dialogue from this person and then and then and then but then that that did like sort of light up something. I mean where I was like, oh, yeah, that that is like what

linguistics is. And oh I've truly it's so nice to hear you talk about it, because I I forget and you know, you know, our hearts break and we have to pick up the pieces, you know, we get her and then for lucky we get lucky again. Yeah, oh yes, yeah we will. I mean yeah, no, of course, and you know the joy of creation. Cut the mic cut the mic got lost it no, but it's um, yeah, we're yeah, we're trying to make something else. That of course also was appended due to covid um. But you know,

we keep going. We keep going in this industry and in this world, and you'll always have each other. And also and the thing about it is like when you're trying to do this, you realize that never ends. Like the pitch process. It's like so like I'm pitching something right now, and I swear to God, I wake up, I wake up. The first thing I do want to open my eyes to sight. No, no, no, I don't

want to do it the eternal. It's just because you feel like, um, like I still I feel like they often like go fine and then whatever you move on, but like I never know, Like like you think like, oh, I'm never gonna have to pitch something like what am I in marketing? It's like no, no, no. That happens literally all the time in the in the biz. And it's you never really know because you can't see yourself

like you're not you're not hearing yourself doing it. It's just it's such a heady you earlier, I was so grateful. You also referenced five five, which thank you, thank you, And actually I should say here this is a scoop.

This has not been announced yet um because it's behind it's been behind a paywall, which is in literal and possible amount of money to play, be easier to pay twenty nights and exactly where you're like, so it's basically free, but it's not and I have to enter in something like the paywall will soon be lifted to when anyone can watch it. It's going to be free, so hopefully

then some people will we'll be able to enjoy. But I was gonna say in that Christ and Johnston and like it was in we were lucky to have her in an episode of five five and which John and I were playing actors and she's an acting teacher and she was John's acting teacher in real life. Yes, Oh my god, I think maybe it was Atlantic that lives

in the file cabinets in my brain. That's one of the I like fell in love with John, Like was like him telling me like incredible stories, like just doing her and like saying and she we shot that it

was like a very crazy shoot. We had like almost no money and it was very chaotic, and she just like we didn't have that much time, and she just delivered the most beautiful monologues about like the nature of acting, and it was like hell that the whole thing couldn't be an hour, like it was just and I remember, I don't remember if this this didn't I don't think

ever make it into the final cut. But she talks about, you know, how she was a huge star, she was on Third Rock from the Sun and she was you know, and then she talks about, you know, wanting to kill herself, like she was deeply depressed and kind of how hard it was. But then she talks about the biz and she's like, there's no joy in this industry. There's only a relief, which I was like, oh, that's so true.

And you're like chasing chase and you're like okay, and then you're just kind of and and hearing her talking just like there's only you're just waiting to be relieved. Yeah. Wow, that's so we have to pull joy from other things like friends and family, coming in a living right, getting the melon right if you're lucky, setting it back with grace, and and then buying around for the whole the whole restaurant. I didn't do that. I longed for that, Yeah, to

be able to walk it. You know what, Sometimes I think like a really sort of it's pretty old school and even a little sleazy, but like if anyone ever did it to me, I would not be mad. Someone sending over a drink, Oh my god, someone sending over this from the gentleman in the white suit. Has this

happened to either of you ever. One of the coolest things I've ever done is when I was in high school, I was at a diner that I saw that I always go to my friends and I and there was like a hot guy there, and I sent him a single Friday across and then it was like washing like this over and like point at me, and I was like, I mean like topping him from across the room. And

then of course, like not a word was exchanged. I mean, it was a joke for my friends, but to have that bravery, I think about that now, I'm like, I can't believe I did that. That's that's phenomenal. No, I've never been sent a drink from across the room. Tragically, I sent what a friend didn't know I was in the restaurant and I sent over just like a rude beer, just just as a funny joke, and the waitress spilled it on the table. She was like, this is from

oh my god. I'm so oh my god. They didn't know it was coming be it was like what it was. It was like that thing. It was like an Applebee's, truly, and it was such a chaotic moment. And I don't know if she ever got out like it's from that kid over there, like it's just just a spill of a random drink that was riving at the table. She sort of got through the sentence. But that's the thing. Here's here's another thing with drinks. They get spilled too often.

Class can rarely contain no, no, no, I think it's time. It might be time. So yeah, but this is when it really gets started, to be honest. So this is this is where it starts a kick in. This is I don't think so, honey, And this will be your first what that's literally not right? I feel okay, but but this is listen, we we have our whole. It's so true and not would that the anesthesia actually goes okay? And can I say one before we get into this,

can I say one more thing? You know, Kate, as you know, this morning we had an earthquake, So oh my god, are you both okay? Didn't did you feel it? This morning? I woke up. I woke up completely nude, as I often sleep, and I was like, do I have to go get on a big shirt in case I have to run into the street. But then I was like, you don't run into you don't run into the street. But it lasted long enough that the shaking was continuous where I was like, do I it was

like an eleven second thing. It was like it was like an eleven second thing. And eventually my famously always missed the earthquakes like they happened, and like, I'm like, oh, really, like all my friends will be on a group text like you feel that one whoa scary hated that, etcetera. And I'm like, oh, I didn't feel it this time. Fully woke up because I felt it. It was like eleven seconds of it was like a four point oh um, and uh, I thought to myself. Yeah, I thought to myself, Oh,

you know what's gonna happen when I'm under anesthesia. That's when we're going to get the earthquake. And I'm just gonna be a flopping anesthetic corpse while everyone else that the hospitals are on wheels, Matt, they're on isn't rollers?

Is that? Is that a real thing? Yes, they're on rollers, and you're gonna be literally, there's no one you'd rather be than a hospital during an earthquake, but particularly under anesthesia, because then you won't know what's happening, and then you wake up and they go, you're never gonna believe it's sweetheart. You know you're gonna be fine. You're gonna You're gonna

be totally fine. I feel it in my bones, and and it's always scary, you know, it's you know, it's like why kids don't want to go to sleep because it's you know, it's a suspecter of death. But you're not going to die. I feel so confident I'm not going to and you're gonna have reliefs then you won't have to have this. You know, it's ultimate. And I mean, like literally, it is. This thing in my nose is the bane of my existence, and it must go. So

it's finally happens. Lived many of these years with me, and I constantly I'm talking about it, and so it needs to go. But I did just like I had to be honest about it on the pod because what if I don't come back next week and they say it's a rhinal plastic gone wrong. I refuse to have that be the narrative. I had to be the one to say it, Okay, you're ahead of ahead of it.

It's it's the kid. It's the kid logic of of just putting out like the worst case scenarios that as as its own proofing insurance policy if it not happening exactly, it's me. It's I'm earthquake proofing this situation. I read all about this morning because I mean, like I said, I'm in that doomsday Google sort of mindset. So I did sort of google for the very first time the Big One, and I sort of found out all about what will happen when we get the Big One. I

started listening to the Big One podcast. I got twenty minutes and I was like, this is so upsetting and disturbing. I can't live my life with this information. I can't. Also, i will die with my neighbors. Like I'm like, I'm not. I'm not a fighter in that way, Like I'm not. Yes, of course, have water, do the thing, you know, know how to shut off the I'll do the bare minimum, But you am I. We can't devote our lives to to to protecting ourselves against something like that. Really, I

mean truly, I become full God at that point. I'm just like take me like it's like if if that's what's going to happen, because I'll just I'll just a briefly paraphrase something that happened in the podcast. It was so horrifying. Was there's a woman in it who's obsessed with the Big One or some psychotic earthquake. She was in one something. She's like, it was a huge thing in her life, maybe she lost someone in an earthquake,

something crazy. And then one day she's in and she was actually, I'm aborting this because I truly forgot it.

It's like, the point is she found herself amidst a huge earth and it was like, so it's like, you can live your life to find by fear and stuff, and then it just happened to you exactly, we can't and but and then also my I know somebody who works for FEMA, not to Brad and um, but they told me that they worked in San Francisco or the Bay Area, and that like, for example, one of the numbers is they're like when the big one hits, if when it hits, there will be between twenty tho and

forty thou people in elevators trapped. So that's a number that they know, Like the people that are elevators alone are going to be a crisis that we can't get to. So it's like we're hanging on you know what's crazy about you know what's crazy about a phone? It will happen. Yes, here's my feeling. Hundred years will be gone the next It's like it's like years again. This is part of my research today too. It's like push it onto them

like a hundred years from now. It's just sp real um, but it's it's true, like it's really gonna be that I saw, like this is how deep it went, Like I saw like a visio. It's like a visual like um sort of simulation of what it would looks like. And it was truly like when a kid is like at a bar mitzpidanza, like where that was that? Whatever this is? That was the earth, that's the plates. No, it's it's really bad, but we just have to get

a little water. You know, how to turn off your you're don't run because they said if you run during say, you're going to break your legs and ship or something flies off the thing and hits you in the head. I remember because I was in bed and I remember reading that what they say, if you're in bed to do is to roll into your stomach, so that takes two minutes and then roll onto your stomach and then

you protect the back of your neck. So in that moment, I was like, Okay, if the shaking continues or if it gets greater. I'm just gonna, you know, and cry into the pillow and yeah, it's fine. What's crazy, though, is that it is regional, like it didn't have to be us if we didn't live in this fucking city. It's so sci fi you just have to go, oh God, and and but then is it even worth pointing out that the dark reason why you guys are in that city is for this industry? Toph who's gonna say no

to me anyway? Why am I risking at all? All? No? I think it's you just have to, you know, we we have to make our shows, and it's worth it for the place in the weather, you know what I mean. It's just like I need try humid, etcetera. Um, anyway, this is I don't think so, honey. And truly I don't think so, honey. Earthquakes, No, you're it's it's just not over, okay. No, No, I got excited. I was like I almost forgot hello when you said that this is not I mean, we've reached the summit. This summits

really the climax, the emotional climax, spiritual climax. Um, I don't think so, honey, which is of course a minute long sort of um feverish rant really about something in culture that is not it and we don't like and we have to we feel compelled to speak about even and there's really been so much to talk about bowen. But um, I do think I have what a good topical one for me? Anyway? Oh my god, thank god yours is topical, because mine is certainly like topical for me.

But you know, well's still topical. Okay, this is um Matt Rodgers is I don't think so. I have in the clock and it's time starts now. I don't think so, honey. Anesthesia, diet restrictions. Let me tell you what. You can't eat fish? I'm fucked my favorite food fish, hon. I so, my mother's coming in for the surgery. I make a great um two person reservation for us at Yama Shiro, this incredible sort of you know, Japanese restaurant right by my house. I look at the menu, all sea food. Now I

have to cancel. I don't think so, honey. Also, you can't eat potatoes, what the fuck? You can't eat vegetables? What the hell? Nothing? Nothing fiber. Maybe I'm over doing this and just kind of going for it. But also I don't think so honey, surgery in general. You're gonna cut into me with that, you honestly. Also, I don't think so honey, anesthesia. This is people's whole job. Let me say something. It sounds like something you can get pretty bored out doing and make a mistake because you're

sitting there, just like toddling levers. You don't know me, You don't know my body. I don't think so honey that I can't eat or d a goddamn cocktail aforehand, honey, I can't smoke reefer. I don't think so honey. This is I didn't even really get to the meat and potatoes shocked. I had no idea. Oh, when you see the list of things you avoid a diet rich and seafood, Avoid fibrous foods, avoid a document sent to me by doctor by my doctor's office. Alright, alright, alright, and let

me tell you something I could have done. I don't think so honey, Captain, I mean falcon I win our soldier, because nothing's happening on that and I could have done I don't think so honey, um Final Fours because on reality shows, I don't like a final four. I think we need to do a final to that's that's from Justin to Justin and Kelly. That's what we need. But I feel like this is just taken over my life in such a way where I have to say and

speak out about the anesthesia diet restrictions. I mean, because get this, if you eat within eight hours of doing anesthesia, that food is going in your lung starling deer. Oh, you're gonna be breathing in your food like it's always all. This is something that I think you up on poog. Why food isn't in our lungs more? I don't understand. And when you're choking on something, when you when you inhale and you went down the wrong pipe, well what pipe? And where to go? Oh it's down the wrong pipe.

It's really crazy straight to the heart. Well, if you ever tell you something, if you want to be breathing in some food going to anesthesia, oh god, that's that's absolutely nightmarish. But you're gonna be completely fine. You're gonna have some you can't have vegetables. It was like avoid fibrous food you eat. I literally was like what my mom was like, Well, I don't want you eating get anything fried. I'm like, girlfriend, the list is so long.

It's like what I guess I'm gonna eat like um, like starches, like carbs, but pasta and here's and here we are in l A. They tell you to avoid carbs and then you have l A. I'm also you know what else I never said about, like the three week recovery period where I'm just gonna be sitting in my apartment like just like just like the stagnancy. Anyway, listen, this is the best time this could possibly be happening, right, But you know what I mean, Yeah, it's it's true.

And and you finish. Yeah, you're you're between things. You're gonna watch My mother will be here. We already had a fight. She was like wi she called and she was like, I'm coming and I'm staying on a cot in your living room. I was like, first of all, the word caught like air I must and I was like, it's not big enough. I was like, for eleven days, mother, I don't know the question I sent a snuggle. I sense some people are gonna be snuggling, so I hope

can we end the stigma around snuggling with mom? Oh? I literally curl up in the bed in any chance I get. I love, I love, I still do, just like a little sneak up and kiss around the cheek and squeeze her. M Um, well we do think so honey, moms and the cuddling of them. But I'll tell you what we don't think, so honey, whatever and Yang is gonna say right now, so um this is his I don't think so honey. Are you ready? Bow? I'm ready

good because your time starts now. I don't think so, honey, physical keys, it is this weight that we all carry with us, and it is it's this it's this crazy like Sisiphian like way of like having to like sort through. It's like it's like stuff that you have to like sort through and like you have to carry the knowledge of like what you have with you all the time. And I find it to be very very very crazy, Like I need other cerebral real estate for other things

I could be. I could like I could I could remember the movies that Cameron Diaz has been in and and just and like knowing that she was a prestige actress at one point, like I just think, Key's I know this is seconds like bringing up like this quotitian thing, but like, I really don't I welcome like the surveillance state as far as it left enter buildings with just a phone or um a little a little bluetooth action. And so I've been saying track me, daddy for years.

I don't care. I used to think I had an inch o I look at me. I belonged to an interesting subculture, and my Discover weekly knows me so so specifically I am nothing like that. They already know me taking well, you know, you know what they're going to

start doing everywhere is the eye recognition. So it's like that thing of like how your phone doesn't like when you stare at it and unlocks apparently like you know whose Disney World and Disneyland, of course, the most forward thinking minds the imagineers have thought up a world where you can just it's like not gonna be ticketing. It's like that you can kind of just like I and also get this and get this. This is where I heard.

It's heading that based on things you've done in the park, certain characters will know to interact with you a certain way because the eye scanning is going to have followed you. So this is something they were talking about for the Star Wars Galaxy's Edge is, however you did on the certain Millennium Falcon Ride, if you scored a lot of

points or whatever. Because it's like a video game, you would be approached by people in the park being like you are a great warrior, you're a great space fighter and we respect you, um, and that they would know Kate is Kate is mortified. I went really dark with this. Yeah, no, this is very dark. That's that's mostly I'm just like I just honestly, I just got sad because I was like, oh, yeah, because now games are about Star Wars or something, you know.

Like I was like the teacups, like yeah, well, I don't know when the last time you've been to Disneyland is, but they really take in a hard right turn into video game screen land. I've essentially never been huge wound. It was a huge childhood wound because my parents never

took me Disneyland. I went once. I pretended to be diabetic because I had seen it in the babysitters club and terrified and my friend's birthday and then the mom flipped out and was like your parents, and tell me you were diabetic, and then I was like and then I tried to carry on and I was like, I'm not. It's like it was fortifying. And then I went for senior night in high school. But you know, my friends and I were cool, so we just got stoned. We're like,

we're not going on there. But the hack is be stoned. But go on the rides. Yeah, yeah, I would love to. Oh it's so good. I mean, we the thing is you go, you're spinning around and letting it happen to you. But yeah, there's served alcohol that they do now, so they've just this is this is my this is how you know? This is more doomsday googling me knowing where they serve alcohol. And Disneyland they serve it at the Blue by You now, which is at the restaurant at

the parts of the Caribbean ride. So there you go. Wow, it does sound fun. I'm actually kind of surprised that you haven't been. I almost went a few years ago, and then I didn't. And that's where that ends. You know. Jacqueline like Disney, I know, I think you're right. I should ask her if she would like to go. You know, we were once tagged and they said, um, Bowen is the Kate and Matt is the Jacqueline, which is why I feel like maybe she likes Disney. Oh my god,

Oh my god, how did I miss that tag? I always searched my name every morning. Anyning um that shocked? Someone said that, Wow, that's beautiful. Beautiful. By the way, I just want to say, I'm terrified for my I don't think so, honey, like I really blacking my brain. Terrified too strong a word, but in fact, just like, no, I know you. I hate myself for even see this. It's below you to have to hear that, to have, for you to have to encounter my fear of not

being interesting enough, for funny enough. Has anyone ever I'm not saying that I'm going to do this, but has anyone this is probably cheating, splitting them minute into two? The form has been ways. Yeah, of course, has anyone ever done this? Really? Stradulating over here? What's what is this? I'm like COVID. I blame the year of isolation. It did make me a more anxious, careful person, which I love for me. I know, No, it actually has done that.

It's it's horrifying. Okay, I'm just gonna do one. And it's kind of something I mentioned earlier a little bit in different continents. Right, well, this okay, paper lance, I don't think so, honey. Time starts now. I don't think so, honey. Prosecco, I don't. I for years was hypnotized by the culture, and I thought that I wanted prosecco. I thought that I needed it. I thought that if it's bubbles equal prosecco. You know, I didn't know at that point. I was young.

Champagne is a certain certain retail France, right, all champagne, blah blah blah, prosecco. It wasn't until I would say, maybe a year and a half ago I started to go, guess what, I don't like prosecco because it's sweet and the bubbles aren't dense enough, and I don't want prosecco, and I'd rather start the meal with give me a comma, give me a cremont, give me anything but the prosecco. It's it's a it's a it's an invention of bourgeois,

you know. It's like it's this invention that was forced at our throats, and we're all hypnotized and we think that it's good, but it's not. And the flavor it's not, it's it's it's it's not good. I'm sorry, it's just not good. And I'm not gonna lie anymore. And going forward, I won't be seduced by by the eight dollar prosecco and I will just go straight for something else. And honestly, I rather I'm not even getting that's one minute. I

want to tell you something I have done. I don't think so honey prosecco because I don't think so honey prosecco. I hate it and it is and oh being bad with prosecco, no or not know. What you're doing is getting corporation. You're getting a headacheade getting and you don't want two glasses of prosecco. I mean, it's just I'm sorry, it's not good. It's sweet, it's sweet, and I also, I don't want to people there's a thing about sweetness, like no, they're cond be sweet undertones and wine and

it's gorgeous. But this is not what I want. It's not about the sweetness for me. It is about the fact that there's something about prosecco where you're like, I'm not I'm not going to have a second glass. No, I don't think if you're listening to this and you've had a second glass of prosecco, something, something's the mass, something's call someone, call your treatment. What's what I feel is like like prosecco is supposed to be like your hands in it. It's like a celebration. No, who are

we celebrating the big prosecco. That's what it is. Also, can you say it's so fizz forward? Oh god, I feel like there'sn't enough fizz. I feel like it's always flat. It's like falling out of the it's it's just drink to be bubbling. I'm sorry, and I say that as someone who likes you. I'm not that much. I want bubbles,

and I'm and I won't do it. I can't. I don't know, even Champagne, I'm something like, because you know what it is, I've kind of had prosecco and now I have that sort of disdain for it, so that even the nice bubbling whites, I'm like, I can't. I'm here to bring you back to bubbles, back to Cremont, back to Cova, back to a gorgea you know, you keep you keep sort of saying cova, and I'm like, maybe it's the Maybe Cova is the way I think. I think doesn't have Spanish, but the Cova is the way.

It's the way, let's do it. And I hate that I'm quoting a fred Armist and character from an SNL sketch, but this is Regie. And at one point it's this living room set up. Someone brings up prosecco and then Fred Harmison as this woman goes, what are we celebrating? Me average, oh my god, that's hysterical, And here I am. I didn't even know prosecco. I thought I was somehow being a revolutionary No no, no no no, and I know you're you're not. I don't feel insulted. I'm just saying

that I feel honestly that I found yes. And I'm saying I I felt like when when you said it, I was like, oh my god. And I feel like people looked at me like I had two crazy heads when I did it. And so now to sort of like hear a sister sort of rage on about prosecco, I was like, I must tell her that I feel this way. I'm so glad to hear that you that you also feel that way so bad and no more. You know, I know people that like exclusively drink prosecco,

and I have a level of distrust for them. It's sinister. It's you, you know, I have to they don't know what they want, is that they're afraid of what they want. There's that, there's that genius You've got to listen to, because it is just these two people who are just just it's it's it's they're having the most engaging and this sounds so like whatever, but like the most engaging conversation. It's it's fantastic. I'm thank you. I mean, that's that's

deeply flattering. My must just say often imitated, never duplicated. Okay here and they're they're trying to be Cape blank. The kids are trying to be Calan. They're not doing it like them. Oh my god, this was this truly lifted me. I'm soaring. I'm taking this into the evening and i just feel like I'm looking at a bowl of citrus and I'm thinking, are you, oh my California. I don't know, I feel I feel really I feel bright. You really restored me to be looking at a bowl

of citrus. Is it fresh? Yeah? Oh, to think and think and think about this morning when that fresh bull crust of shaking. What beautiful nature. We have to love each other because we're shaking out here. We're shaking out here, um and so listen to Poog. Obviously are our sister pod. We are so happy to have you here on the show. I gotta tell you this was I was so thrilled to do it. You're both so funny and great and I just had truly had a blast and for symmetry.

So for we've had Jacqueline on for symmetry, we'll have we had you on, and then we'll have CROO. Would love a little crossover thing down the line. Right before we logged on, I was tagged, and I too, always check my tags. I was tagged in a thing that said where is the poo last culture crossover? Oh so sweet it happened that night. You should do a crossover live event in Vegas just if anyway, if any like deep pocketed producers are out there, they are, we would

love to do it in Vegas. Host does in Vegas hostess that you know, like the Bellaggio or whatever. What I want to do is us for in front of the phones as they dance and us talk and no one be able to hear us because of the waters are going. I think it'd be great. Imagine yeah dance, Um so listen bou famously, Uh we do end every episode with a song and uh take it away, shack it up a chick. Hey, just gonna tell you's gonna play play and I'm just gonna shake shake it up,

chick it up. Bye. Thank you Taylor for that one. Bye.