"Debates with This Bish" (w/ Dylan Marron)

Because you know, some of the commenters, you know, they're done with me. They think that the show will be better without me. So, first of all, no one's no one's explicitly said that. No people they had one. There was one commenter who said that he had to stop listening to the show because of me. And so I feel like, you know what, we've always engaged, and so I should go. I think you're letting the online comments

turn the negative comments turned into negative feelings. All right, Well, I guess like I just care a lot about the listeners and I want them to come first, and so if I should go, But unfortunately I hear we're in a contract, and I have to hope you guys, we're sort of bound to this contract, Matt sort of you know, has to are both of us. Unfortunately, I have to keep posting, We have to keep posting despite your feelings

about us. But this is just to say, we're giving too much acknowledgment to the people who have problems with either of us and we shouldn't do that. And you know what, first of all, this is all I We were very happy for all the love. It's just that, you know, sometimes people they have an online comment and it can be a little nasty. And that's why we have our friend joining us today. Well that's not really what,

That's not why. I mean, we we've been getting we've been like he because he claims that he's been campaigning to be a return guest on the show for months and months. I've he's been top of mind for me, and you can you can vouch for this, bitch. I've said, we need to get Tom back on. We need to get Tom back on, and finally and then the stars in line and here he is. And it's because there there's a momently, there's a moment that's happening right now.

There's a ground swell. Not that we wouldn't support and expose this bitch even if he let me tell you something, if he had nothing going on, come on, you know, we'll see what happens, right. But the thing is he has he always has something going on. That's the thing with Dylan. It's so frustrating. He always has some ball

in the air or two or until then. To look so cute while he does it too, and to have and we'll talk about him, and to have such an incredible charismatic aesthetic personality, yes, of course his his His whole aesthetic vibe is in his own words, rich white woman running errands. You keep wearing us a Dylan Dylan. But which Dylan? There are, of course several in the world. So of course we are talking about the Webby Award winning host of the podcast Conversations with People Who Hate Me.

You've heard us two ads for it. Oh yes, yes, cross promotion has in fact happened. Um also, and this is the real gag, because how many people can say they have a fucking Ted talk our guests can. If you go on to ted dot com, you will find turning negative online comments into positive offline conversation with our guest. The incredible the resplendent, be charismatic, the debonair, the chisels, the well dressed, the stunning, the sexually appealing, the amazing,

the crucial, the importance, the married. Dylan Marion that you were married, because then I make you sound very appealing, and then will hunt, the wolves will hunt. I never have felt hunted, to be honest, really and well, I feel like individually, I feel like people, but I actually feel that people, um are are more wolves around me when they know that I have a husband. Very no, no, no,

but it's not in a dirty thing. It's almost like I've known what it's like to feel like totally invisible in the gay world, and then having a significant other. They're sometimes like, oh this is more interesting now. Yeah. They get bolder when they know they can't have Oh my god, I think that tracks you're married, honey. That is true. You didn't you didn't have the big one,

the whole idea of going out there. Yeah. No, I'm saying it's it's not that I wanted it, and I love We're down um dragging to fill drag and clapped back and gay know fag about six seven. Of course, we're pulling a reference from the TED Talk. Yes a reference from the Ted Can we talk about the instant standing ovation? But did your heart explode out? It was

like really surreal, Um. I wanted to be present for that moment, you know what I mean, Like I didn't want to like kind of fake a demure like oh no me, you know, I'd be like I wanted to be like, whoa, thank you? This is so cool. So I forced myself in that moment to just stand there and look at them and say thank you with my eyes, and then I also said thank you with my voice. Seven of culture, you gotta thank you with your eyes.

And I think I don't think there was a drop of like saccarin anything in that And in that entire talk, it was just you claiming that space and occupying that and just telling what you were saying, what you were there to say. And I think it's I've watched it several times now and it's truly like as I paid you to do, as you paid me to do. This is a sponsored thing, this is it is a time.

It is a fucking Tyne daily master class. I say Tinan daily because she started master class on the West End, oh absolutely, and on the Broadway and then on the Broadway. But that's great that you said west End first. Thank you so much. I feel you know, what I feel really good about is that I and I've talked to you guys about this both individually off Mike, but let's

talk about it. I feel like I straddle genre worlds, which is to say, I really don't feel like I squarely or fully fit into the comedy world, even though you've thrived in that space, like like you and Joe have like proven yourselves out in that space. Oh you mean like with with Richfield well and just in general, like like we've done shows together. But no, no, no, I I do feel like I've done successful things in

the comedy world. But I I feel often like when I do a show with stand ups and then I try and do something of my like when I fully do myself, it pays off. But whenever I try to like be someone who is in me, do you know what I mean, You're like, let me try something out. Maybe I am a stand up, you know, it's like, no, sister, you're not. I constantly have that do you feel that? I know? And we literally have talked about this off off Mike, but like, yeah, I mean, it's it's what

a weird sort of like existential thing to occupy. Well, I would say, remember that those boxes are just in our head, you know what I mean. Like, you know, there's a lot of stand ups out there who won't respect you as a stand up unless you Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike, Mike. Gosh, you camp in that world. And that's very much like if they feel that way and justified feel in that

way in their community, that's great. And also like I understand the respect of like the work, you know what I mean, And the same thing with sort of like you know, I'm from this at world. So when someone comes up in the sketch appears in the sketch world, and you know, it's it's not exactly like as academic or as classical as some of one else's education, Like

that does show up a little bit. But here's the fucking deal, babe, good is good, And when you have something really important and unique and fun to say, that comes through anyway. So I think it's actually a gift to be able to say, you know, I actually don't fit into any of these boxes. I am my own thing, and that's why I'm interesting and I think that's what keeps people coming to you because I hear what you're

saying about. You know, you've got one foot sort of in this like online like social justice world of like you know, it's almost like educational and then in other world in the comedy world. And you have talked to me about sort of like the question of what you want and the question of what you are becoming, and that's something I think that everyone deals with this absolutely.

I mean, this is interesting. I don't think we ever talked about this, but you know, this podcast, the success of it is a total surprise to me, to me and to you, I think. But but you know what I mean, Like I and I think you had what you were starting out in one direction. I was kind of starting on another. But I was sketched characters, UCB down. I wanted to be an actor. I want to be writer. I still do. I still am. But this sort of

um success as a personality, that's different. And I sometimes think you can't help what you're becoming or what you're good at and what you're meant to do. And I think you do have to respond to like what people are responding to that you do. Do you know what I mean like I but and I appreciate all those things you said about like I, I do like the comedy world, specifically like the people I've met in it, Like I feel like I just love watching people do

their thing. But I always felt like like some of my stuff is like so serious, like many episodes of conversations with people who hate me don't have a single joke or laugh at all, you know what I mean? But totally totally, and and I like kind of gravitating

towards that. I like gravitating towards um. I think just like, yeah, I think I know what I want to do, but I I get stressed sometimes when it's about fitting it into a box, which I think realistically we have to talk about that we have to do in our world because you know, you have to. People will put you into boxes, and especially when you're like, you know, talking

about new projects. Yeah, they always do. I also feel like, and you tell me if you disagree, but it would be almost impossible to be as good at everything and have every answer and have every skill all the time. And sometimes it feels like and I really wanted to talk to you about this because after we have Francesca on the show last week, Miss Francesco Ramsey and get

that book. Well that escalated quickly because it's out right now. Um. But in the book she talks about how she felt almost put on the spot in the beginning when she when when she was first thrust into the spotlight to

have all the answers. And I would think someone in your position, who really who started out like pretty much doing comedy and then like you found something else and found that you were really good at something else, does that feel kind of people look at you and I think, well, he is the smart figure, and he's intelligent, he has all the answers. I was thinking about this so recently, but in a different context, which is that when you are making social justice content. When you were talking about

social justice, you were expected to be the expert on everything. Yes. And then also and then the really dangerous thing is when you are expected to always say something on Twitter on social media about anything that has happened, and your silence is taken as um, you know, affirmation or or

a tacit endorsement of this thing that happened. And it's like that is so problematic because I think what I've actually tried to do more recently because I definitely I think I've found a lot of success in fact, in making videos like the unboxing series I did. I was taking a new topic every single week, and I think, you know, I'm not, you know, bad mouthing. Now I'm very proud of that I did that and it's over now.

But um, I through research, I tried to be a momentary and temporary expert on everything, and um, and that's impossible because when we try and do these things, as everyone now thinks that they're all experts on everything political just because they watch Matt Out, you know, but I I have so regurgitated talking points because I'm like, well, um, I heard this thing, but I'm gonna now repeat it as if I've known this all along. I studied this, My thesis was on this in college, and it's like,

no bitch like this for myself super early on. But now but but I just think, like what I want to instill in people is like, just focus on the thing that you really know much about and you actually it is impossible to know in depth much about everything, right, focus on the one thing. I think that's like and and and that's why I like the podcast now, Like I think what I'm getting really good at and what

I'm choosing to focus on. I don't want to say whether I'm getting good or bad, because that's up to the listeners. What I feel that I'm getting good at is communicating with people who think really differently for me, and that can I don't have to then also weigh in on Russia. Like in fact, I think it is so powerful to to acknowledge what you don't know, Um, do you know what I mean? It's important that there's a conversation about that too, and I think that that's

something that's really sort of prevalent in your talk. And also because you do say stuff like you know, empathy is not endorsement. Um this what you're doing is not a call to social activism per se. It's all just it's about communication, and I do believe the communication is everything.

And sometimes that doesn't mean just a communication with other people it's whether they're different from you or not, but sometimes a communication just with yourself that's just like, Okay, I can I'm self aware enough right now in this moment to understand that, like I need to step back, and you know, I might not be able to weigh in right now. You know, it's just a it's a very kind of interesting phase of this discussion that we're

in publicly. I was just gonna say, also, think about the optics of the tools that we have in terms of building out Internet content, meaning from the nassent stages of vlogging, of youtubeing, a podcasting too. It's like so much about like hear my opinion on this thing, and I think and that is not to knock the Internet.

That is not to not content. I we have met incredible voices through these new mediums we have I think the three of us at this table, the four of us in this room, have been able to crack through with these new tools. Is that fair to say? Absolutely? And but I think think about it like even a vlog itself. And again love logs, in fact, I watch many of them, but it's like it is a direct address to the camera. Um, the Internet did not invent that.

That's been around forever. But um, there's not necessarily like a listening element in that. It's it's let me let me talk at at you. You know. Um, I want to be super clear, I'm not knocking no, no, no, yeah. Is that that's I think what you're the reason you bring that up is because, um, it just seems sort

of like, uh, intrinsically explained. But I think what you're doing is through the podcast, you're showing people how to communicate with people who think differently than them, and that sort of intern it's like a movie, a strip manifold thing where it's like that loose back it on itself in this way where it's like people don't have to confront you, in this way that like you know, it feels entitled with like that that entitles them to your knowledge,

like where they're just like, well, Dylan, why don't you know, Like why an't you speaking on this thing? It's and then that you can just sort of point to the podcasts this thing of being like, well I don't, I don't. I don't have to have all the answers. You just you just gain this understanding by just talking to people.

We are right now, and I just want to make sure that everyone knows that we're talking about the podcast Conversations with People who Hate Me, in which Dylan will call up somebody who has posted hateful or negative or you know, sort of super highly insensitive, hurtful comment about him or or his work or a guest, etcetera. And they will have a conversation wherein Dylan asks why they posted that thing, and through those conversations often very meaningful

lessons are learned. And so that's what podcast is. Yes, I just wanted to make sure that everyone knows the yesse of conversations of conversations. Yeah, um, so yeah, that's that's a podcast we're talking about just too quickly. Um. The thing about like the new tools for the Internet is like, the great thing that the Internet has done is that it gives so many new people on microphone.

But I think what we forgot in the shipment of a microphone is that everyone else needs like a receiver to like for the metaphor, for the metaphor, for the extended metaphor. It's actually real of culture number fifty. You need to give and received. Yes, okay every medium, Yes, in every medium. Um and then um, Matt, my love

my queen to what you were saying. So so yeah, the podcast is about, Um, I'm talking to people and it's so funny because all of my guests when I'm speaking one on one two people have said something negative. They're like, okay, so are we going to debate about and I stopped them right there, and I'm like, it's not a debate, But isn't that so telling that the thing even even my because now that I moderate conversations between people and then the people who have sent them

hateful messages and hate for more negative messages. Um. Even my institute guests were like, so it's a debate show, and it's so interesting that the only the closest word we have to conversation across divide is debate. Like that's all we can think of. We think like tear each other down, not like conversation is like kind of out of the lexicon, because like and shutting down and clapping back. And I feel like that is it's unfortunate because Mike or maybe I did it. Maybe they're going to be

Burp Truths Conversations with Burke Truther. Yes, maybe it's my next podcast. Thank you, then you sell the I um but I UM. It was like saying, like the language of the conversation is out of the but that's like

that's like all we have. I mean, here's a question for you guys in your own separate families, because because our I don't know that there's much disagreement in our community that we exist in professionally together, right, I mean there is of course disagreement on drag race well about yes, but that's the only real disagreement in the gay community between he and I on that's the only one ever.

I think the gay community is oddly so unified except for one weird glitch and I just we just don't can't see the only the only two gay people who have ever ever disagreed. And I'm sorry, I'm sorry, commune, I'm sorry community, but we're tearing from with it yea, yeah, yeah, um is but yeah, Jim Booster tearing from within god culture whatever, because then his next album, I Love, I Love. But I was just wondering like, like, are you do you guys have like difficult Well, let me ask more pointedly.

You were talking about the lost cultures just commenters, how do you read them? Yes? Um so? And are you

cool to talk about this? Talk about this? And actually it's very very I was, we were having conversation about this, and it's so funny that you're coming in now because over the past six months, like this sort of engagement has changed a little bit where now it feels like and I'm so thankful and grateful, so everyone engaging, and it's so nice and the vast I'm talking night percent of the comments are so positive and going, and we

encourage you to make them. We love when last culture, He says, Listeners comment and exchange thoughts about the show and every positively, negatively, whatever. But the thing is like when someone comes out and says something like, you know, Matt Rodgers is a problematic bully who never lets anyone speak on the show, not Bowen, never mind the guest. And he had to stop listening because I can't let go of my toxic masculinity from Long Island. It's like,

remember the whole thing, and I can't. That's all that stands out, that's all you. And this is my very first um sort And then you know, I'll just go ahead and say it. Bowen was speaking truth to something that he has experience. So I left an opening for people to say some rude things. We'll say what it was. So I tweeted yesterday even I said, I posted this gift of of Lisa lying just give her saying oh wow.

And then the tweet was me when a white gay follows at Matt Rodgers though, and at lost culture is just but not me. It just does like a little like sly wink that really carried no weight at all. There's a comment on the fact that like there is a lot of It was an observation of like it just sort of like you know whatever that I mean, look at the followings of the disparity and same with with queer and talk about all the time and so um.

You know. So I brought that up and then left and left nobody for a lot of people to say, well, I don't who, well I don't follow him anyway, Well like he like not as a platform to be like let's talk about racings right right right, It's like no, let's a drag mat And it didn't feel good because this is something that Bone and I have conversations with where I understand the sort of absolutely understand and completely think it's ridiculous that that there's this you know, sort

of like this kind of like when white gays allow themselves to be as capital w capital g white gay as they can. It's really gross and it's disgusting and I don't like it and I don't like to be emblematic of it. You know what I mean, like hearing the word and you know, I'll just be very honest with you, like the word that freaked me out the most about that negative comments was problematic and he said

some white people things is what the comment said. And I was like, oh my god, because that freaks me the funk out and it it speaks to um the sort of thing that happens when I think you become a more public voices. You know, there's a lot of scrutiny and uh, like I said, the success of the podcast is a total surprise to me, and so there is. And that's why I think is my fascination with you know, needing to have the answers and needing to be able to say the right thing at all times because what

I'm sort of experiencing. And we actually sat for an interview that's UM about queer voices and comedy and queer perspective and comedy, and it was the first time I think we've really sad for an interview, and I found myself like really thinking super fucking hard about what I was saying, and like, not that you shouldn't think hard, but I'm wondering if like it's got in the way of what authentically I wanted to say, or if I'm

speaking insanely because I'm not thinking clearly. And it's just something that, like with you a little bit, just can't have. I love social media. I depend on social media for work, but like you can't have nuanced conversations on social media. And that's that's the thing. So like if this person, I don't know that this person would actually necessarily say that to your face, which is literally all but but what I'm saying is like maybe you'd have a really

fascinating conversation. It's just that's not a conversation starter, you know what I mean. And if that person, I don't know. If that person was a close friend, of course you

don't you talk to them about it. And and this is kind of what's frustrating about like clap backs on social media, like the snarkier you are and dangerously for our world or you know the world that uh, you guys definitely occupies like the funnier it is, like you know that you know that um cartoon that's floating around like um, it's a it's it's it's a New Yorker style cartoon and the father is comforting his son, and he says, son, if you don't have anything nice to say,

make sure it's devastating. Do you know what I mean? Like, um, make sure it's it's something in devastating. And it's like that, that's what social media is. It's like you're if you say something mean and you're not funny about it, it's awful. But if you say something mean and it's funny, it's like, well they got him there, and it's like, oh, that's still you can also be hilarious and just not be an.

I also just want to make very clear it was a few comments, but it was like you had over of something that was small, and so I would be insane and to think that, like I'm actually facing adverse. Know your mind does that, your mind, my mind does this all the time. I'm sure your never very balance never. Um So this is just really I'm not in therapy. Absolutely love my therapist. I love my therapist. Um well,

but it's it's like it's the same thing. It's also the same thing in negative feedback in life, like when if five people can say like, wow, that you were incredible up there, and then one person is like, I didn't love it that much. That suck. I'm a trash monster and I'm going to go be the queen of the trash. Yeah, head bobs. Yeah yeah, there's a head bob. It's but it is, it is, It is very true.

It's it's just I think a better conversation is just like the boldness that people feel when they are uh just detached from the comment and how it affect someone. Well, that's the thing, and you were saying, how like that comment was like represented, um, you know whatever unearned way people feel like they can approach you. But I think it's it's going back to a dylancing. Is that that common represents how there's no there's just no tenor to

any conversation here. There's no conversation here. It's just this culture of well I'm gonna fucking o that, and then you know it's just not I mean, where do you go. There's nowhere to start except to go back and recede into Okay, well let's actually have a conversation, which is what I'm I was thinking about this all day leading up to tonight. Um, because we talked to Francesco last week and she has this whole great part in her book where she talks about calling out and that's what

we can talk about that. But then she she has these anecdotes about the times when she has given her you know, quote unquote haters the benefit of the doubt and just like you know, tried to open up conversations with them and tried to let them in. And you know, she's she's running to like this troll online at conferences who like was very gravelly an apologize to her and was like, please forgive me. You know, you seem great. I didn't mean to, you know, say these uncouth things

about you. And she was like, okay, fine, well, like you know, I'll I'll forgive you. I'll give you a second chance. But then it always ended up being something and he was like we're best friends, etcetera, etcetera. Wow, everything's great, and she was like, hold on, now he gets like a free pass for everything, and and now he's using me as a prop to you absolve him

of all this stuff and ends up getting worse. Well, I think just in the same way that like, well, the the question, like the actual core of what I'm trying to ask is like where like what is the what is is there a danger? And even just in like initiating that conversation in the first place, like about seeing through some hateful thing and just trying to start

from some common ground. But then like it also but just making the situation was I mean, but there are there are many episodes in the podcast where there's no resolution, you guys, just well that's what I say. It's like not necessarily common ground podcts. Sometimes the only common ground is that we're like on the phone at the same time. Imagine, yeah, like we're adhering to the same clock, and we have agreed to be on the phone together, um, and that

we've consented to recording. But um, I to that. I mean, I can only speak to my experiences, but you have to you can only be really speaking to people who earn your time, you know, Like and I it's pretty self selective in my podcast because when you get to like the point where people are like, yeah, I'll be on the phone with you. Um, yes, I'm cool that we're recording. Yes, I'm going to be vulnerable with you about me and who I am, so that you can

be vulnerable with you and who you are. That passes, that passes through so many filters, So like I'm not getting people who ever feel abusive. I'm still in touch with almost all my guests. I was going to ask

you that because I have a question. So basically, you know, I was just thinking, I'm sitting here thinking like this really is applicable to I think everyone that's on social media, because we're all having exchanges, We're all exchanging ideas, and sometimes those things start uh sort of negatively or they go awry based on like a misunderstanding, and it can almost feel like this is like an impossible mountain to climb. So I would ask you, or my question for you is,

what is your goal with the podcast? Like what do you want the podcast to achieve? Because it can almost feel sometimes like God, because of the nature of social media, how are we going to get over this? How are we going to start getting to a place where universally we don't this doesn't happen anymore. And maybe that's not literally not achievable, so it's not the goal. But what is the goal? Like, what do you get out of it? What do you want the listeners to get out of it?

In general, so when we get those comments on social media, it can feel so scary, like the walls feel for me, the walls feel like they're just closing in on me, right, similar to similar to you, I'm like, I'm only going to focus on the negative, never the positive. The calls themselves feel amazing to me. I feel like the world is an amazing place. Everything is possible. Look at us. No one's going to change their mind in the course of an hour long phone call. No one, No radically right,

you can't undo decades of the way people think. But like it's a start, right, So I see the podcast. My goal with the podcast is like, this is just a seed. I am carving out a space where there can be nuanced conversations that come from spaces on the Internet. But it's also a podcast, so it depends on the internet, so it is a space on the internet as well. And I also think and I've kind of like, um, I'm essentially have tailored this answer because of what I

see people use it for. But so many people use it to like gain courage to have their own conversations, whether it's with their parents, or whether it's with their siblings or you know, family members, um, people who have said their own things. And I'm very clear that it's like I'm only talking to people I feel safe with. I am not talking to people who have sent me death threats. I am not talking to people who have not earned my time. I'm talking like and and surely

we must. We must distinguish between someone who calls me a piece of ship and someone who tells me to says well, or someone who says that they're going to kill me. You know, like, um, yeah, I mean there there is a distinction. There's a there's a difference there. So it's about promoting conversation. It's promoting conversation, and it's like it's and it's like I just want to show to you know, our listeners, which is a small slice

of the world. I want to show like conversation across difference doesn't have to be a debate, and you also don't have to compromise your own deeply held beliefs. Right, even even in early recording, empathyist no endorsement. Even in early recordings of the podcast, I was thinking, like, how do I like shut down what they're saying? Right, And it's like, of course I get that inclination, because if you hear something you disagree with, we are trained like

shut it down. And I think there is real value, especially in a public platform, to identify what you disagree in about something. But like why just why shut it down? I think it's so much more valuable to listen to why they think what they think, meaning like I fully disagree with it, but what is driving this? Like that is how we're going to like get to the bottom

of it. So when people ask me what they need to prepare for the podcast, I'm like, well, you're the expert on you already, Like I'm going to be asking you about why you think this. I'm not going to be asking you about FBI statistics and how that plays into like life right now, because like, unless you conducted those FBI statistics and can tell me why you were inspired to do that, I want to hear about why you're the type of person who you know, um, who

who believes that trans people shouldn't be in the military exactly. Um, just I want to say that you should book. I'm an FBI statistician. Yes, yes, yes, FBI statisticians listening. They're they're all listening. Um, well, guys, it's a Webby Award winning podcast. It's it's it's phenomenal. Another question, Yeah, it sounds like you're wrapping up with it. Sounds like you are on your hiking backpack and headed to the woods.

You asked, I have one of questions because when I was watching the Ted Talk and you know, you explained that there was what the very first example you give josh um he was going to be graduated high school. I was gonna ask. I was wondering, is a theme that these are young people? Or no, there's no theme, and this is this is there's no theme, and this is what I always tell people. It's like a yeah, so anywhere what I want to want. This is at the end of Mean Girls, Tina Fe was like, do

I say the limit does not exist? Or there is no theme? And they went that's what Lauren said in the notes. Um. But um, it's so funny because people, mostly people who really don't listen to the podcast, say talk about these people, right like, I can't believe you talk to these people. And I always stop them and I say, well, there's no such thing as these people. They're actually all different and we can't fit them into

a narrative. And I understand why we say these people because I was saying these people when I was just getting the comments like fully understandable, but like when you dig a little deeper, like everyone has a totally different reason for reaching out, and everyone is totally different. And some people have never made an internet common effort and this is their first, you know. And some people this

is what they do. They rail against people on the Internet, and I think it like soothes our brain to think like, oh, like these these mean, mean people, and it's like, oh, well, the challenges listening to the podcast is like they're not necessarily mean people. Full disclosure. I've reached out to many people to be on the show and some people have

like blocked me immediately and been like can I curse here? Yes, I wonder some fuck you just like I've reached out to people and they've been like fuck you, Like this is a setup, like get the funk out of my inbox, and it's like, oh, sister, not too nice. Nice Actually just attached to an audio gift of you on Luke. Um I guess the humble opinion and yeah, imh not too nice? Um but I um so yeah, So like

you're you're hearing the people who like really got there. Um, we're opting in and they know what they're going for. And that's the thing, babes. And I don't mean to spoil Dylan's closing line of his whole ted talk, but it's truly so fucking gorgeous spoiler that he goes, um, so yeah, I feel free to comment, call me, call me a faget, call me a gay wad, say that

I'm the worst thing about liberalism. But if I reach out, but I might want to talk to you, and if you say no, one block me, then you they are the snowf Like I mean, I'm paraphrasing, but it's gore almost almost exactly right, I think. And I just love that you didn't. I love that you whatever. Just take this compliment, accept it. I'll take it accepted. It sounds

kind of gross. I love that you didn't make the talk about empathy necessarily, but it's about sort of knowing, like knowing your own place in these conversations and having that conversation. It's also the fear of empathy. We're so scared that we're if we empathize with someone, we're like, oh my god, no, I am this person support what they think, because of course that is what Twitter makes

you think. Twitter makes you think like, if you see the humanity behind someone who disagrees with you, it's like, oh, you might as well be their side. Yourself is a prevailing fear as a prevailing theme now is like people being like, no, it's not time to say we we have empathy for Trump voters, like we're past that point, and some commenters on the top of and like, no,

this doesn't mean I'm going to empathize with Nazis. And I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa whoa whoa never said like nobody ever mentioned that, and like it is going to be valuable to us that we distinguish between um, yeah, but people who would who would, like you know, endanger you, or who who have it out to endanger in people who just who who disagree and express that in the way we now all express things on the internet, like

look at look at yourself. I'm I'm gonna own up to this, but like the way we I myself have expressed things online, it's like, oh, like I would never say that in person, and I'm like, oh, I'm a month. Yeah, I don't think I would say to Donald Trump's face, fuck you, but I did want tweet at real Donald Trump so like troll, no, no, no, no, I think I might, but I don't even use the word troll.

I specifically don't like to use the word troll because like I like to use person first language, and you know, person who doesn't agree with Trump, And I think about this, but like we always like we say what we would do it. It's the same psychology that's like, oh my god, when I see that person, I'm going to sing pummel them and that's so hot you can't see podcast. We love masks, energy energy, but though I also do feel like, just for the record listeners, I feel like what I

really looked like was a muppet. So yeah, but I um uh. It's mentality of saying like, oh, when I see this person, I'm going to see you outside, man,

I'm gonna suck you up. I've never said that. I've never been said that too, but it's that thing where you lose your spinest students, like yeah, and then it's like it's like so when we say things like oh my god, if I ever met Trump, you know, and it's like, well, actually, like think through it, like if you actually were invited to the White House, Like what would you say? How how would you like? Meaning also, if you start saying things, you will be escorted out.

Sorry about it, but like, how how will you express like I see this country as in need of a different kind of leadership? How can I help you? Do? You know what I mean? Like it's just all of that fades away actually in front of the person. I have a living example of that. We've talked. I thought, um, you've heard my Trump story. I went to I went to his That Center episode which was just like it

just it just happened. And then at the after Trump and Trumpee, and then at the after party, Trump leaves and I like, get out of his way, and then I'm ship faced and he's leaving. Billy Riley leaves and then Donald Trump follows him, and I go, great show tonight comment of the President on his comedy, Yeah, I mean listen, it is. It is. And that is like an extreme example. It's also like using Donald Trump. I mean,

but like but it's the same thing. It's like, oh my god, I'm gonna own him and someone's gonna be filming it and I'm gonna really own him on camera. But like imagine if that were on camera, I mean, I would I would like share that with the world, like me being a fucking idiot. Well or it's just like it's just like we we get to be my dealized version of ourselves, some idealized version of ourselves, and I and and sometimes that's good. Like honestly, I'm going

to own up to it. I feel like an idealized version of myself on Instagram. I mean, were we all self edit? Yes, but on like what if we're being the the like bad idealized versions of ourselves when it's like only the nasty rises to the top and only the cutting rises to the top. And I just think, like there are ways, there are so many ways we think that to be entertaining and to be funny, we

have to be mean, right, Um. And it's like you can also have incisive political commentary that isn't a takedown, but we don't even know what that looks like, right, Um? How can we talk about sociological issues without like totally fucking owning someone for this awful thing that they've done? Um? And so yeah, so I I you know, met my sweet queen to like go back to your question. The goal I see it as is like I want to

create a space where where there aren't takedowns. Yeah, so we should probably change I don't think so Honey to babe, I have a suggestion, no, no, no, I love. I don't think so Honey that, I mean that's art. You know, you can't change art, you can't trained are well. I don't think so Honey isn't necessary. I see, I've thought about this a long time. I'm like, are we just like building this whole thing around negativity? And that's like

the fire like that's yes. And also I think my favorite I don't think so Honey's like, are are like um kind of commentary on is ms? Do you know what I mean? Like my favorite, I don't think so Honey's And you know I'm on record. And then my first time on this podcast was a person that I don't think it's okay we all have all for where is where is your ally ship? For Black Lives Matter? When you were so, do you feel that it's come? No? Because I brought up Antel Dann it was like what

about Angel? Dana was about Trayvon Martin and Dylan said no, there needed to be something more over and I was like, yes, well, also just like she released that in sixteen, Trayvon Martin was killed. Like it's just like has had time to congeal where that doesn't feel I mean Trayvon Martin and and um, you know the story of Trayvon will always be relevant. But I'm just saying, like, devastatingly he is not, um the most recent example. That's horrible to say, but

he's not. It's horrible to say that. She has plenty of material to go off. But but I know, I I really, I really love I don't think so, honey. I mean, listen, listeners, you don't know this. I am like sycophantic when it comes to you, guys. Know I do Like after every live show, I text you to tell you how incredible it was. I tell you how much I love this podcast. I really like. I'm tickled by you, guys. Like, just I'm being paid. This is

a sponsored I know this already. Um, this is a sponsor that I'm paying you with the money that you paid me to watch your Ted talk about. Yes, I have a question, did are they paying you to post? Did they give you that trip for free? And you did a sponsor thing today? I just like that shirt. No, she gave me the shirt for free and I was just who was is not directed? This is Massive Gay, a clothing line that celebrates Asian porn, Asian gay, Asian query. Um.

She's fantastic. Um, she's a purveyor of Asian um. You know, cute, a vintage Asian pornography. But she no, she sent me this for free and I was like, oh my god, guy, and she didn't tell me to do anything. I was like, I'm gonna I'm gonna wear this, I'm gonna post I'm gonna post up on this because it's and I'm promoting. I got a cute box from World of Wonder, Oh Wonder girl. They approached me and they said, you would you want to try this out? It's a wonderful World

of Drag from World of Wonder box. I got Michelle Visage just like the Diva Rules. I got a little makeup bag that says her spers from Bob the Drag Queen. And I got Sasha Valore playing cards. It's awesome. I didn't get it in the World the Wonder. You're in the doghouse with b I don't think, well, I'm allowed to have a nice box. Sure, Um, I love it. It's great. Hi everyone. This is Matt Rogers and I have a confession to make. I vape. I like vaping.

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I think we should start asking our return guests. Um say that louder say that last one. I want to know what returned to guess. And you know, there's been a lot of controversy online with Pat Regan and his obsession with being Last Culturesa's first return guests. Pat needs to set the funk down. His Last Culture Rasas Icon award is in serious jeopardy right now. That's going to strike a chord with the listeners because he has a quote unquote fan favorite. As disgusting as that is, that

you would endorse his behavior. But all I'm saying is Pat Regan, he better check herself. He better check herself. I want to ask Dylan a question we should ask her because they've already answered the question what is the culture that makes you think culture is for you? I want to ask Dylan, what is the culture that makes you say, right now, culture is amazing? Wow? What is which is another way to ask, what is culture that you love right now? What's your media diet? Take that

anywhere you want? Oh my god, Um, I just saw the Ruth Bader Ginsberg document. I got a lot c G. Oh that is my media diet RBG O MG. Listen. I am like fully acknowledging that I like earnest Ship and God for Thank God for earnest Ship. Like literally that you like Sally Field. Yeah, I love Sally Field, but like I have cried every single time I've seen the eighth Grade trailer. Okay, oh my god, I can't wait to see that. Actually, I n ironically love the

troice Savan has a song about Bob. Yes, I bloom just for you. I love the trailer for the Mr. Rogers document. I love you know what I live for in culture right now? That Mr Rogers is having a cultural renaissance, And I love Mr Rogers. I love um he ran a whole fucking town out of his house. I wonder how much that people were paying and rent, I know, the puppets. In terms of the landlord perspective, drag, he might have been a great drag. I think he was a great landlord. I would, I would, I would,

I would imagine him as a great landlord. Um, what is the culture you're loving right now? Oh, she's deflecting and turning the question back. And no, she answered, and is opening the floor to the opinions of people I love. Oh my god, that album is incredible, untouchable, untouchable. Wait really quickly, I want to say that Mr. Rodgers trailer documentary trailer played before the Avengers, Like on the first night, it was this room for the Avengers. It was it was.

It was interesting at Alamo. We love Almo, but it was just room full of like Broie like comic book folks. And um, it played in guys, I mean it just it it broke through to all of us. Well, here's my fear is that people love you when you're gone. Like it's like like you get to be an icon unless you're Pat Rigan getting me a kind of word raining you get to be an icon when like only in retrospect can people really and ironically and fully love you, and that's so sad to me. Like I love when

people love things that are happening right now. Um, like Jelle, like Janelle, Yeah, but actually this was gonna be my I don't think so, honey later, but I'd rather go into it now because I'd rather have a discussion about It's crazy to me that only like less than two million people have watched her Emotion album, like really yeah, like no one's watching it on YouTube, and I'm just like, let me tell you, if Beyonce I did this, we the world would be stopped, like forget about if Taylor

Swift did something like this, Like it's just crazy to me that And not to say that she doesn't get the credit or the respect that she is due, because there are so many people out there that love her and I've been loving her, but it's just like this work that she's done on this last album and the the um I guess she's calling it um Emotion picture. Um. It's so good and it just uses so many of her incredible, vast talents that I just wanted to get the respect and I want the eyes on it that

it deserves. I love everything about this and I think that more people should be watching and listening to it, and I've never understood why she wasn't like a bigger, mainstream deal. And then someone said to me, well, there's too many hooks in her songs, and I was like, said that there's too many hooks in her songs. I was like, too many hooks in a pop song? No bit, go back to school? Can you just imagine? And it won't happen, but can you imagine her super Bowl halftime performance? Now?

It will be incredible? And also she's so fucking good at everything. She's an amazing actor, very good um, and there's acting in Have you watched the Emotion Picture? Yes? See. I don't think so, honey, that you don't have forty six minutes. I'm a monster. I'm gonna watch it now tonight because I feel shamed. You clapped back. You just raised your arm high in the air as do But don't you tried to hit me? Don't you lord this? Oh? I saw dirt a computer. I saw the Emotion picture. Honey.

I've been in on the ground floor with Janelle since then. You would have put minutes in and respected huh. I think it's amazing. Everyone's talking about Donald Glover. But now don't just move on because there's only room for one icon. Right now, let's talk about Janelle as well. Let's talk about everybody. Everybody can can do that. Um. Speaking of which, another thing I'm living foreign culture is just lean away

and she was killed. She was serving you it all at the metal Oh my god, let's chat about the Metcal. Do you guys live for the metgal? Is that like a staple for you? Um? Like? I have complicated feelings about that. As a comedian, I fucking I'm obsessed with the metal because I think the concept of it is so fucking funny, and I think one of the funniest bits that happens every year is John Early talking about

what the themes of the medical got. I mean, just like go to his recent like tweets and Richard Jenkins, the theme of the mecal is just dot dot dot. He's just got so many jokes. It's but it's just the most it's the It's I normally hate non sequitory humor where it's like a random thing, but it's this

is like nonsecretary humor just sort of perfect. But it's not nonsequitary humor in that you still like it's it's also sort of commenting on the pretentiousness of this thing, that it is all these sort of like already pretentious things like sort of right, and it's just only following it as such as the dress they already want to wear. Yeah, I also love nonsequito humor. Yeah, okay, well I don't think Well he tried to hit me when you problematic white pose my white tears raised his arm. Yeah, you

try to hurt me. Let's talk about lead away. She certainly wore a great fucking what would you call that a cape cap? Honey would call it one baby girl throw. I sometimes call anything I'm wearing over my t shirt a throw. Say that HPJ thought that was funny, not accurate. I think you're cute, even the flannel a throw. Yeah, this is my throw that I think the throw is like just like a velvet blanket you throw into a couch. That is the actual correct the patriarchy. I can't have

a throw. It's my way of protesting to call everything a throst. I'm not thinking of shaw at all. Yes, I never once thought of shaw. I've only thought of throw. Okay, alright, I thought that the best dressed person at the med gala was Rihanna, which I know is redundant to say, but that's what she always she always why she's the co chair, Honey, she's a co chair. My personal favorite was Greta. Oh my god, gret overblown nun love outfit.

Oh so funny, so great. Todd gasped when I when we when we saw it, because he was like, Honestly, when Todd gasps, when Todd that's the name of my first novel, When Madonna looks pretty fierce too, but that it was okay, but it was fun. Who was really

first thought and boring. The person who like raised such as a dumb middle finger for me was Kendall Jenner, just showing up in like a white like whatever, just like so nondescripts like and she was just you could tell she was being smug about I was like, Kendall, stick to the theme. I'll tell you something. Who is like so, another member of her family who is like so, it's almost like you. Tina Fame makes a stunt that you could make her in a lab like, but Kim Kardashian,

it's so insane. The proportions of everybody. Her waist is small. Her like hips are so her ass is huge. She is an hour glass. She's a walking hour glass. I'm sure there's like witchcraft of wizardry that goes into making her what she is all the juda day. But the thing is, oh my god, she is. She's got she's got a body like an hour glass. To quote Jesse J yeah, six more like forty eight sixty eight. That any normal? That's how that see what I did there?

I loved a little bit bigger, loved it, very good, very non secuity humor sequitor that's context y. Yeah, Dylan would say you about non sequitary hum I love it. I mean, I just like, I don't know, and I just I like it when it tickles me and then I know. I just I don't think that anyone is saying that non sequitar humor is like acceptable all the time time. But I'm just saying I do love a good non sequitur. Yeah. I also love a good strongly

played games. Sometimes when someone is like and then a bear with wazers came out, was oh that was, oh my god. Imagine a bear with lasers h J everyone bow and one, oh, no hand against if not to

be too self returning. But I think Patti's Ellen Degenera story was like a master class in how to like be amazing and nonsecuity that was I see, I don't I wouldn't don't know if you wouldn't call that non s because we all we did was set a world for her, and she filled the world in her own way, and so it was grounded as surreal from the very what would you call nonsecuitary humor, I say non scutary humor. ADVI just said, Oops, a diamond just fell out of

my little ass. That's funny. Told you I'm the New York City and perhaps the universe is premier non secretary comedian an end prem listen just fell out of my eyes. I'm gonna laugh about that all the way home. Bowen just lifted his whole leg far up to the sky and he whispered to me, See, but this is a strongly played a game. That's the third beat in a series, and I guess what, I won't do it again, Oh, don't do it for Matt thinks of himself as a

little Patty Harrison. Now you know, I would never claim to be as funny as Patty. I would claim to be more beautiful. Okay, passionately that's what I call her. Do you guys know she's passionate? Why would you tell her? Why wouldn't you just call her her name? Because passion new is the endearing phrase I'd like to call her. When they were coworkers, we were co workers, had a job, they held insurance. You know what I called many things. Don't you worry my cobra is about to rent? Yeah,

health interns is terrifying to me. Yeah, for sure. It's the only reason why I still do certain things. Are you guys guilded little babies? No, no, no, no, no, not by any means. We're builded. But we don't make enough money in the guild too. So that's my scary thing. Like I was scared to like pay to become a member. This very inside baseball. I apologize, but um, it's it's scary to pay all that money and then like I

always have to make enough money too. Well. Yeah, that's a common misconception is that people think when you're in the union or whatever that you're just like protected by the union, but you have to make a certain amount of money. And SAG and the Writer's Guild and all that stuff too, in order to benefit from all that stuff. So but we and we are not there yet. One of us is probably closer than the other because one of us. It's so funny Dylant books at all and

that is oh my god, he's gonna hurt me. He just took his big paying us out and he's he there's a spike on the tip and he said, I am the Ellen this week. Yeah I did say that. Um, yeah, yeah. Do you feel that when you're especially close to someone? This is something that happens with me. When I'm especially for someone, I feel like a special kinship to them, I will commonly make up a name for them. Oh my god. Example, Yeah, that's what I just said. Um,

that was what you just exemplified. I um, passion, new Passion, New is Patty. Okay, yeah we heard that. Bonina Bonina Jackson Jones. Well I called Bob. But yeah, I love that, and it's you, of course, all the things I've Actually, I'm glad you bring this up because I feel like there are ones that I wanted to try out with you. I am just got your number. This is sad ridiculous. And I said, okay, I gave my umber the very first day I was born. Oh took the off. I'm

gonna hear those popped pas, Matthew R not even my name. Okay, this is a start, but we're starting with Okay, okay, it's a game. Well, let's go. Let's hear the names that you want to tell me. I'm just well, there was actually something else that I wanted to bring up. This is my own non secretary, but it's not humor. You got my number, rama drama. I sent you guys a YouTube video song shut up of a song that I love. I have a confession of name. Neither of

you listen to it. I have a confession to make, and this is for anyone in my life. If you send me a YouTube video in my texts, it will open the YouTube app if you have it when you're in wife, and then you can watch it. I don't know. I just don't really. I don't do the thing like like even in Instagram, d M or whatever, like what have you like? If you send me a video like, I don't know, it's something about me, it's something weird,

like it's problematic, it's problematic. I just don't always listen it to them. Right then, and there, like, if you send me a video, you gotta give me a little bit. Okay, Well, and I sent it to you because you are arbiters of culture and people. I am in respect. I'm sure I like it, And yeah, she's great, it's great. It's just a song that no one here is because I'm watching something in culture that I guarantee you none of your listeners are watching what American? I don't know. I've

seen a couple episodes of it. Can you believe in a box? Um? I have to be honest with you, Dylan. I don't think that she's as talented as everyone thinks she is, and I do think that it should be based on I loved her. I actually think who's the who's the like? And I look, I'm just gonna say this, and you come from me like the wolves that you

can be out there? Um, I think that, Like I've only seen a couple of performances, but then when they did Disney Night, I really didn't want to feel this way, but I felt that her performance was extremely screaming and like I've seen a Circle of Life be done so many times so amazingly that I don't understand picking that I do understand it as a choice of a drag

queen to sing and perform. I get it. Vocally, it didn't do as much for me as like even that lily white blonde girl singing Colors of the Wind, which I thought was fucking insane, but she gave a better vocal. Well, just like my podcast, there is not necessarily common ground to be found here. But I still respect you as a person. I respect you too. I just I just also like feel that in terms of in terms of in terms of in terms of my notes being hit, there were more of them, and there were many more

of them in the other performances. Okay, well, I loved all the notes, but I also find it's very problematic the way that the voting goes. And this was my I don't think so, honey. I mean the Dave Mazony episode the Live which I have. It's not just voted white people through, that's what that was my I don't think one. It was just that it stacks the deck for people that are watching live and still have cable, it's watching after and it absolutely, oh god, it's unfair.

It's laughable. When they when they moved to the top seven or um what was it when it was literally just the only people of color in the bottom? Yeah, that was what I was saying. I was like, see, there's there's it's not it's at a certain point. It's like come on, yeah, And if it's and if you know, I've always had questions about American Idol and how real the results are, that's interesting. Yeah. Completely, Um, it's television show,

not everything. They need those eliminations that shock people to happen. They need that to survive and stay interesting. Um, so just think about that. And also, we've had a friend go through the American Idol experience in detail how crazy it is. On this very podcast. You can listen to a vocal eased episode with a man of check when

you can her all about it. She was on season nine. Um. But anyway, when when you're a producer and you see that all the people of color are in the bottom, you would think like, okay, optics on this are like kind of iffy, but let's just give it the benefit of the doubt and say that is the actual bottom four or whatever. Then there's something to that. There is

something to that. And also on the voice, the only real artist on the show, her name was Christianna Danielle and she's this um sort of black RMB singer, not sort of black black black, sort of R and B soul singer. And like, um, she's on Alicia Keys's team, and she had the lowest vote votes and has been

getting the lowest votes. But she's the only person doing anything relevant musically on the show literally, And then there's of course the sea of country singers and it has to be up and what are the demographics of these voting blocks? Well that's also like I just think like American Idol is no longer how we listen to music. I just think like there are so many new musicians and so many different voices. But I worshiped American Idol as a kid. Yeah, yeah, I get that. I mean

I think we all did. I mean I always whenever anyone, whenever we go on other podcasts and they ask what was the culture that shaped you? I always mentioned American Idol is the thing. Here's the thing with this Christianity girl and with all these people and with Ada and you know, with these people who deserve to sort of make it through. And I said this before. Entertainment is presenting things that we already know in the ways that we know how to see them. Art is expanding our

understanding of things that we did not know. Yes, and therefore maybe American Idol is not necessarily the place for arts, something for entertainment. And you know what, like if if the majority of people that are watching American Idol are live are white people that like country music, then they will get the winner that they want that. I just think, like Verry under, what is the biggest winner of all right, the most the most lucratively, the most yeah, right right,

the biggest earning yea or yeah? But you know that it's just you call it American Idol. You think it's going to represent all of America. It does not do that. It is a fabrication of that, you know what I mean. So it just it depends on how much you accept I need to watch that movie. I never saw that movie,

American Dreams. It wasn't as good as it should. I wonder if it's like it was if it was before It's time, you know, it's like, yeah, an American Idol satire, Like while American Idols was in the like fifth season or something, you know, or if it was. I feel like there's some way you sort of modernize that now where it's like you get to talk about and now I think it's a black Mirror episode. It's right. I mean that that that is probably what should be done.

There probably should be a Black Mirror episode about it. And there's the there's the Daniel Oh my god, I'm blank clue clue, yeah, yeah, Daniel kluea um, black mirror episode. I have a question, and I'm going to say this. It might be popular, might not. He looks much bigger. I think he's get a part. I thinks. I don't know, but he's amazing, very attractive, very attractive. I just know. I couldn't help but notice from get Out to what

he looked like on SNL. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and the met gal I was like, oh, he looks much much thick. Did you see the announcement for Jordan Peel's movie, Oh my god, yeah, I can't wait. Lupeta, I mean Lulu Pepita, and I heard um Elizabeth Moss, Elizabeth Moss. So those are the two leads. And then but there's another Blackmail lead that there. Yes, yes, yes, um, I thought they were set. It's the guy who played in Baku and

Um Black Panther, it's that guy. He's so good. It's so good, it's him, Lupeta Do Black Panther stars um in this new Jordan Peel movie. And then the Perority tweeted, I can't wait to see what this guy has up his sleeve or something in a way that's like, I can't wait to see more of this guy. I'm excited to see another horror movie from him. I was wondering if we'd see something different. I'm excited to I'm excited that he's sticking with that. Okay, I thought for a second,

I was like, wait, is like, do I want something else? No, this is actually this is what he does. Well No, yeah, I'm very excited. So we've gotten so much from him, you know, like Ky and Peel that I'm like, yes, continue. The thing about get Out is and that's why I'm excited to see his follow up. And they always say, especially with someone like that has a big hit like get Out, that second picture or that second album or that second the sophomore thing is a big deciding factor.

They'd say it about Real Housewives to Pat Regan famously said Real Housewives first Real first season is her second season. Um, well, not to give him any credit whatsoever because he's on the frist. Sully's the name of this pot absolutely makes us worse. Yes, um No, I love you so much. I love you passionate. Um I just said, wow, An

you better, Patty, you are passionate. For What I'm saying though, is get Out feels so the child of Jordan Peel that I think it's going to be a tall order and people are the bar is going to be extremely high. He's absolutely smart enough and talented enough. But I'm just saying, like, with somebody like that, it's like, you know, the eyes are going to be on the project and people are going to be looking for the littlest thing, and I

just hope that. Um, it's so intimidating, truly. Um it already looks I mean, whatever possible success, you know what I mean, like is fucking wild. I can't wait. Oh, I can't wait either. I'm very interested to see how I'll consume this one, because I am literally so terrified movies like that. But you watched get Out at the last possible second, Yeah, I watched. Well, it wasn't that I didn't want to see it. It It was that I was. I'm just as scared, and so I watched it once

like from across the room my SAG screener. And then once I had seen it once, then I watched it very closely, like a numerous times after I shot to my family and my dad really liked it. But it's the first time I'm watching it. But then I gotta tell you, I'm a free for horror movies. See, I don't get it. That's why you're not. My husband hates horror movie. You're Oh my god, stop. Dylan just tried to really hurt me. Dyone just tried to kill me

with poison, tried to no bullet. I just took a knife out of his But I said, I know, I prolapsed, my asshole, and there was a knife and God and I and I brandished it in front of you, brandish. No, I love it. You know who feels attacked HPJ with the word pro laps. I'm sorry I didn't like and I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Baby. Um it's time for our segment. We have a new segment done this segment before has done it. It was lovely. I bet you've never had a guest who has done this segment Who's in the chair.

This is true, this is our first Patty whatever passionate. Um. But what I'm saying is I am a guest, a returning guest who has already done a voicemail. Yeah, and so what we're saying is Patty's already done. Guest is already done the voice. You know what. The distinction that Dylan has is that he literally had the conversations with dumbass. No conversation with dumbass who's stupid? Maybe that's maybe that's we're talking about projects conversations with MS Who's stupid? I

think that's the title of that. Conversations with mask Who's stupid? Multiple conversation with one dumbass? I guess, can I can? I actually requested that not be the title because I was aware that when people then search for conversations and if it comes with Allen Maren, then we'll be like, oh, is he just bad mouthing his guests, when really what they won't know from the title is a dumbass who stupid? Is me? That? How about the title? This is debates

with this Hoe? Well we'll kick it around fully. I fully trust you guys with a with a podcast debate title with this debates with this Hoe title of h you scrolling it and look at that tiny black Okay, we'll look at that stupid little tiny black book. HBJ has this whole Well, we'll run debates with this Hope by Dylan again as we get closer to I listen, Okay, Um,

this is well no, no, I was gonna say. Dylan has the distinction of being um a guest who submitted the voice memo just the prior week and then being in the chair. We're really it's like, you know what's rich people like or royalty specifically, it's like, please make a record for me. You know, I feel like I'm like please. We're like an award that means like nothing, but it's like you, sir, Philip Hiller holds the distinction for biggest boat, the biggest boat that is not in

the currently currently. Yeah, that's it. That's the distinction to So, no distinction, no special distinction, whatever. I'm here with this whole with conversations with dumbass who's debates with this whole play the voice memo. This is a voice memo from a dear friend of all of us. Joe fires My god, I believe she has UM. I think we didn't prompt or anything. She just has um a nighttime routine suggestion. So I'll say that and we'll discisten. Hi Bowen, I

mad Hi Gillen. I don't know if anyone else is there. Usually you guys have four people, so I imagine there's someone else. I'm so sorry, Hi. Maybe you guys could fill it in later. UM. So is Joe Firestone. I was just calling in to say hi, UM, and I wanted to share with you guys a little nighttime routine that I've been really getting into and I think you guys would really like it. I think people would really watch onto it if they knew that there's like a

new trendy night time routine. So basically, UM, here's what I would recommend if you're thinking, if you get home at night and you think, like, man, this sucks, is a great Um here's I'll just tell you what I do. Okay, So first off, uh, you put frozen chicken nuggets on a plate. This doesn't matter what time it is. Minute you get home, you put them on there, and you put them in the microwave and uh, you know, put it in for a minute. And then here's the deal.

You flip them and then then you put them back in the microwave and from for longer. And while that's cooking, Um, you gotta take off all your clothes and you put on a nightgown. Now this is it's hideous. It's a hideous nackgown. It's um. I think I bought it as a prop, but now I use it as a piece of clothing. It's really it's really ugly, but it's so airy. I really recommend getting a nightgown. I know they're not fashionable. It's don't you can't have said nobody's gonna want to

have sex with you. But it's really nice piece a piece. So it's a nice piece. It's so you put on your nightgown, you put on your slippers. This could be any time of night. I'm talking six pm, I'm talking midnight. Whatever, okay with me? Okay, ding ding ding. Chicken nuggets are ready. You take out the chicken nuggets. Now you stack up the chicken nuggets, however many you have, maybe you have four, maybe you have ten. Stack them up. Now you gotta squeeze as much catch up as you have. The height

of chicken nuggets, because otherwise it's just not gonna work. Okay, this is a very healing, very spiritual understand Okay. So then what you're gonna do is you're gonna take a take a vape that you bought online, and you're gonna take a few tokes of that. Now that's gonna really unattractive thing to do around people, but it's very important you make this exclusive and by that I mean alone.

So you take a little puff of that. You make sure you're just a little too high to understand things, but not so high that you start to understand things. So we're a little high, you start eating your chicken nuggets. You're gonna use all that catch up, don't don't worry about it, Okay, So you use to catch up. You're in your nightgown and at that point you're gonna turn on an episode of Gilmore Girls. It doesn't matter what episode, as long as it's before season six. Please God, do

not go into season six or beyond. It's not worth it. Watch something else. So you watch Gilmore Girls and you wonder, why did it make this show? Why is it? Why am I watching? Um? There's not a lot of answers, so don't think too hard after that. I think it's kind of um, I don't know. I think it's kind of nice to like pretend you're going to stay up.

This could again anytime, any time after six um, but you kind of fall asleep, face down on the couch with all the lights on Gilmore Girls still blasting up three to four hours later, confused, beyond understanding. You think, where am I? Why do I taste chicken nuggets? And why am I wearing this sad dress? And then what you're gonna want to do is you're gonna turn off the lights. You gotta stagger into your bed, and then you've got to star fish starfish legs, arms in all directions.

And at that point you're not gonna be able to fall asleep for a while. So at that point I would recommend watercolor. Personally, I don't do this stuff, but it's like a nightmare. I think that'd be better than what I usually do. That's kind of where I'm still working on it. Anyway. I just thought this could be. You know a lot of people work on face masks, and you know, meditation, and this this has been this

is very successful. Another option if you're not so into the watercolors just well, I'll be honest about what I like to do. Turn on to fill fill the fill a bathtub with hot water, and lay face down. Again, it's not for everybody, and I think a lot of people would probably like the bath if it was faced up,

but it's important to be face down. And you're not gonna have enough room for both your legs and your top to stay warm, so you have to choose, and I choose a top, so the peaks of my ass on top of the water and untouched and fry, and the legs play up like a dolphin. Well, anyway, thinking of you guys, um I really love your podcast. I really love you guys as human beings. And I hope, I hope just helps you have a nice night. Sometimes

nights can be hard. Okay, I love you. Okay, I was that was a voice memory, but from Joe with the lifestyle alert, you don't know, should we reach out like it sounds like she's going through a hard time. Listen, I feel like we all can have troubles falling asleep and Joe was just looking up for us. Um Yo, I was on board for the whole thing up until like the water colors. That was when she lost me. I was like, I don't really do water colors, but I I will, you know, pop a plate of chicken

nuggets or whatever the vegetarian option is. Dylan say, tan nugget, State, Tan nuggets, Hail state, Tana. Stop. But you know what, I don't think you should judge. I don't think you should judge people disagree with you. What you might not know about my history with Joe Firestone is that we live for a year on my childhood bunk bed. You guys hooked up. Yeah, you brought the furniture down from

your childhood apartment. No what, because we lived together. I took a semester off senior year of college to travel around the country with a play that Joe and I wrote together. You couldn't afford to live on our own, so we lived with my mom on the bunk beds that I grew up them. That's beautiful. And look at the glow up and look at the glow up, honey, Oh my own apartment now with a mantle with a mandel. I've seen. I've seen the pictures. I haven't been hearing

your place. I would love for you guys to come. It's about the size of this room. That's beautiful summer hang less less. I think my new studio apartment is the size of this room. I'll ask you off Mike point. I've said it before. Invite all my friends and fans to come see me, hang out. We can hang out. Um does don't come to me if you are going to say something main Yeah, if you want to come say something nice to you can visit. Please hand Giles

with me if you want something. What is this accident? No, I don't know. Okay, we're putting an end to it. Okay, okay, listen, I think it might be time for I don't think so. I think so. I think so might be time every time. And there's gonna be many opportunities for you to see. I don't think so. Honey performed live coming up very soon like a Comedy Central Cluster Fast on Saturday twond and the Echo p X on June twelve, which is a Tuesday, and the Bellhouse it's a venue in Echo Park,

Los Angeles, Honey, which will having many heads performing. It'll be very fun. Um, okay, I think it's time. Meant you have something, Okay, I'll start lately I've been starting. I just got his point out the trend here. I've been prepared, all right, this is bone. I don't think so, honey. And as time starts now, I don't think so, honey. Subway adds that specifically catered to rich millennial children, Honey, I don't like that fucking subway ad. That's like, well,

don't do your parents pay for your rent? Fuck? You look God blessed. If you are blessed and charmed enough to live in this horrendously rich, expensive city to live in and your parents are paying a rent, that's wonderful. I don't I don't begrudge you of that, whatever it takes for you to survive in this town. But I don't think you should be catered to by advertisers. You get me. Look, there are plenty of other populations that should be catered to in this city with through subway ads.

I don't need every John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmit in this town to look at these this garbage, this driblets on our subways and think that they're supposed to They're not supposed to. Look, honey, you've got plenty of access to other things that you can opt into. Other forms of media that you can opt into. You have choices. Some of us do not. Some of us are four seconds. I would rather read a poem Honey by Mary Oliver on the subway than this trash from he doesn't think so, honey.

I don't think so, honey. Those subways. I don't like those subway adds. It's they're dumb to come up with something better. Okay, that's me. Matt has someone. This is Matt Rodgers. I don't think so many as time starts now, I don't think so, honey. The story of the Tortoise and the hair. Let me tell you something, honey. If I've been working for years for the race, and I happened to be very good at racing, I better not

lose to some dust the ass lazy asked tortoise. If I'm the hair and this is my moment, I've better win the race. I have been running around the fields. If I'm gonna get up to the finish line and see a tortoise has beat me, I'm gonna ask what the fuck happened? Who does the tortoise know? Because there's nothing about the tortoise that should beat me in the race. The tortoise has his own moments to thrive. When the tortoises in the water, I can't be in the water.

I'm the hair. When the tortoises protecting itself from predators, it has a shell. Yes, it should thrive, that's how it lives. But when it comes to the race and I'm the hair, I'm gonna win. I don't think so, honey. Otherwise, one minute for you as the hair, to blame your loss on nepotism or there is no feasible reason why the tortoise should win. I have a problem with this, A sop look hair. The hair hubristically took a nap while the tortoise carried on and was you know what

the funk? How long was this nap? That's what? Is that? A coma? I don't believe that a that a tortoise would ever be. The hair was too long, and the tortoise beat the hair at the end. No, I disagree. I think there was some fucory and nonsense going on. I think Russia colluded. There was collusion the tortoise and the hair. Another goose paid someone cash. No, No, that's not how that works. I think it was Oligarch paid

money to a stop top wrote the fab. Okay, so what you're saying is you think that there's some people out there, the powers that be you. Dylan Marrin is rocking back forth right now. I can tell he's getting sold ready for as that. I truly like got into what you say. Are you do you stand with me? Because I love that story? But I love your conviction, the passion and affirm your convictions. I feel that the story of the Tortoise and the hair attacks people who

worked hard for their whole life. That's who's to say thertoise start all his life. He shouldn't even been doing that race. That's not fair. Didn't put him up for it. But I think that I think that. All I'm saying is I think there was some shady backdoor nonsen. You're putting people in boxes like how people put boxes. We're not allowed to do stand up the same thing. I I'm just saying you're wrong and that I stick with myself. I PopEd a giant hoole. This is Dylan. Dylan, are

you ready? Maybe this is going to be good? And you know, no pressure. We're gonna get an edu. We have we have a master here. This is Dylan Marin's I don't think so, honey. As time starts now, I don't think so honey. The idea voice for radio, what the fuck does that mean? If I can make sounds with my body that then come out of my vocal cords and into a microphone, guess the fuck what? I

have a voice for radio. I am sick of people saying that the voice for radio is the low authoritative man's voice, because you that is adhering to the problematic notions of guess what the patriarchs, and then is saying that authority can only come from an assured male figure. Well, guess the fuck what, bitch, I take that back, babe, I said a problematic word. Guess the funk what, babe. I have been mistaken for my mom ever since I started sring the phone, and some people think my voice

is grating and therefore doesn't belong on radio. But guess the funk what? I have a voice or radio. I don't think so, honey. And that's one minute, beautifully done. I relate to that. So the phone answering things so hard, ma'am, And I'm like, do not miss gender me queen? Yes, yeah, when I when I when I was studding, I have a story for you, guys. I know we're rapping, but but I want to tell you. When I was booking Todd's surprise trip to Disney World, I was I was blooming.

I was like, just so I surprised my husband Todd with a trip to Disney World for his birthday. I just bloomed so hard that I had prolom Yeah, you got a prolapse, then fell out. I booked the trip and as I was on the phone with the woman who was, um, you know the Disney Amanda, Disney woman, that Disney imagineer is what they called them, m or the cast member. I don't think she was. She was a cast member beautifully, and she called me ma'am every time.

And I was like, you know what, this will be uncomfortable if I tell her um, Like how do I subtly tell her? I'm um, I don't identify as a woman, and I wanted to. So I was like, okay, I have a great plan. Because also whenever I booked trips, I always want to make sure that like wherever I'm booking as queer friendly, right, And so I was like, okay, this is great, and I said, okay, so, um, you know, would you mind just telling me? I have a question?

I always asked this, but I will be traveling with my husband, so is um, you know, is this like a gay friendly place? Kind of knowing the answer, knowing that Disney, you know, purports to accept all. And there were five seconds of silence on the on the other end of the line, and I was like, did I say something wrong? She was doing the math in her yeah, and she was like, oh, ma'am, what you do in the privacy of your own room is your own business. And I said, okay, she didn't get the hint. Also,

what does she think I was asking? And I was like, I wasn't, like, where can we of bare backs? I don't think that was the answer she should have given. Well, she well, then I said this thing, and I was like, well, Disney does gay days, right, so it's like, so you're dropping intelligence and she was like, oh no, ma'am, like only those are outside groups who do events inside the premises. And I was like what. And then for a moment I was reconsidering it. When you wish upon a star,

you're talking to a homophobe on the phone. Well, I don't know she was a homophobe or just like misunderstood. Some people have heard this story and been like, maybe she thought she like continued to think I was a woman, and I was like, oh, are you asking? Like, are you uncomfortable with gay people on Disney World? But like, that's not what I said, because she wouldn't have said, what you do in the privacy of your own room is your own business. Girl, You are too proper. I

would have been like, Hi, excuse me. What I'm saying is I'm a man, and you have made this conversation very much more difficult than it had to be. I'm asking you if I'm going to get hunched in the face and answer yes, yes. But even like, I don't know, no, I think it's what I think. It's that thing where it's like the riddle of like I can't operate on this child, he's my son. It's like you can't fathom in your head that a surgeon would be a woman.

It's like, I think, yeah, caught up in that mental turn, I say something. H p J reached over and turned down my mic. When I started to talk about I mean, when I started to talk about gay rights and you're blaring into the microphone. And this happens every single episode. It happened during year. I don't think so, honey. I was looking at your audio waves and I was like, every single time, nothing, it's nothing, this is not It

happens all the time. I was all right, lady got oh my god, um well, I think that is a beautiful story. That sort of upsets me. But you know what, why not she really upset me. Most cast members are great at Disney Parks, and it's doing an amazing shop. She was very helpful. I just wanted to that's that's a funny story. It's a funny story. What you're doing the privacy of your own room. I knew, but but like it's it's a thing of like I really am not asking, like is it quiverly like fuck each other

like in the Magic Kingdom. It's like, it's all right if I in my own hotel room, and if I sent in my husband's face, shut up, and you know what you would have said, you know what you should have said to her, which is what we're going to end this episode on. Dylan, thank you so much for being here. The Ted Talk. Everyone check it out. I love you very much. I love you. I can't speak for I love you so. I love you so much. You know what I love most about you? That you

are beautiful no where God's no, the stays. I'm on the right chat, baby, I was born this way, no matter gay, straight, you don't buy, let's be untranspennp. I'm on the right check baby. I was born this for hey, same DNA, oh my god, fantasy you know. Just kidding and love you forever. This has been a Forever Dog production executive produced by Brett Bahum, Joe Cilio, and Alex Ramsey.

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