“DEATH! To All of Them!”

is not the goal. I just want to say that mine was very chaste. It was a very chaste pride weekend. UM. Did have some lovely little dance floor moments with some some individuals, but otherwise kept it really responsible. Not no, I take that back, That's not the word I'm looking for. I kept it s east irresponsible. What get to clothes? I did not get to clothes? I did not. I didn't even. All I did was open up my you know, my button down for a couple of moments, and that

was that. Anyway. What was yours? Like mine was you know, sort of um. To be honest with you, I've realized now more than ever, I really can't stay out past like one, and so a lot of it was finding a friend and leaving um and whether that meant just going to have a nice meal or go fall asleep somewhere. It was sort of, um, a lot of that. But I would not consider my my Pride weekend sex filled.

I certainly wouldn't. I don't. Yeah, I mean, but I kind of want to d I want I want to sort of debunk this whole notion that like sex is what's driving pride. I don't think that's what's happening. I don't think that's ever been what's happened for most people. And that's it's okay for us to all admit that

as um a collect to. Yeah, I think that honestly, what I wanted out of it was to sort of be back in New York, go to all these events that I've been seeing, Like I really wanted to go to Thai Tee finally, and we made it to Tie te Um and by way, I mean me and I sort of like did get to experience all of it. But I have to tell you, ultimately, I'm I'm only exhausted at the end of pride Um, and I sometimes feel as as if at the end of it, like

I don't know if I had fun. Now, remember like, uh, this this comes after the end of a few days of go go go, go, go go go, and it's a lot, a lot, a lot, and so sometimes your serotonin is sapped. But I really didn't take substances this time that really sapped my serotonine. I mean, you and I did half a Molly and we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll say it, but you, I think it took more substances than I. I whether whether or not that's true, I

definitely snaps. I definitely hit a breaking point and I'm still kind of in that space where I'm like, oh, I had a moment where it was dark and I I'm just gonna say it, like I was like fun. And I talked to our good friend, good good good friend friend Toronto about this because um, he was dealing with the kind of a similar thing where it was like we're both like fucking the marshals of fun and had to like concierge people's asses into like doing fun things.

And I was like, you know, uh, it's it's it's a drain. And I don't mean to like make it sound like, I hate that I'm like framing this in terms of something transactional, but like it did feel like um,

I was like things were being procured from me. And by the end, by Sunday, like circa eight thirty pm, I was like, you, guys, figure out what you want to do because I have facilitated everything up to this point, and one of you figure out which fucking car to go into because I'm not about to make that decision for you, can I? And I'm I'm just being open about that with you and you and you and you.

You came in like a very good sister and like really talked me down, and I'm very appreciative of that. But I the fact still stands at like I finally fucking like, I don't know, I I bottomed out chemically, emotionally legit like you know, um um on a producer lee level. I feel like I was producing the weekend for people and I was like, no, no, I don't. I don't want to do this anyway. I think that the what what what it's popularly how it's popularly phrased

is she snapped, And I think that I am. I was happy to be there for my sister when I saw the sort of limb limb breaking and I was there to hold my sister's hand because you are right. You were sort of like kind enough to like be like, this is what we're gonna do. And I think it was exciting in the beginning, but I could see even on I think Thursday, I was like, oh, this is going to be a lot. And I want to say I've been saying for years, and I think I have

to sort of correct myself. Be a bit to your closest friends, this pride. But sometimes you don't even have to be that close of our friend to be a bit to people. You can just be riding their back and be a goddamn acquaintance. And to your acquaintances this pride and I we love we we I would say this every single person I saw this weekend I love. And I even saw people that I didn't love before this weekend, I looked them in their eyes and I said, I love you, actually and how I really believe it.

But this is a weekend to get on the very last nerve of the people around you, and by the end we all need a break. And I think now we have a boundary for next year. This is of course,

we'll we'll see, we'll see. I hope, I hope we all sort of take away one lesson this year, which is um like just like just just just pull it back a little bit, because it was be a bit to your ease, as the kids say on Twitter, like like like every like you know, it was a lovely experience to hear people be like, oh my god, like you know, I know that gay from Twitter it is and it's so nice to see them out in the wild.

I love that. I love that we're able to finally externalize all of these relationships that have only played out on the Internet in the past year and a half. God bless But also I mean, oh, careful now, careful now, because there are some things and those relationships that are not fully earned yet. And you maybe and I'm not

I'm not speaking from experience. I did not deal with this, but I've heard I've heard some people recount add interactions where it's like, oh, this person that I've known from the Internet, that I've that I'm convinced I'm in love with has rebuffed my advances and I feel like garbage And I'm like, damn, that sucks. And I'm very sorry. I have a couple of those where it's just like you experienced that I I'm I have experienced a sort

of so. And especially it's like when you're coming to a new city, um, and when you're coming in it's like there's a lot of expectation around seeing people that you've talked to online. And the thing about the pandemic is I've talked to thousands of people online and like I feel like, I mean, like, what do you know that's a little but I think that I've got a lot of those like, um, like truly online relationship time.

So many readers can can identify with this where it's just like some someone out there, it's like you really have like a firm relationship with them in terms of the d m s. And then you get to the city and it's just like there's an expectation to sort of meet up. Meanwhile, there's so much to do, So it's it's the expectation to like match the tone of the d m s when you're in person, it's like it's like whatever, this is like we're not even saying anything new, but it's like there is like and it's

like some like diluted version of like online dating. What's that You've been talking with the person for like months and you're like, oh, finally we're meeting it. Isn't this so nice? But wait, we have to like triangular I'm saying this word too much. I'm sorry, triangulate, but we're we have to triangulate based off of it's a rule of culture. It's really good number seventeen. We have to try and have to triangulate imperative. Conte said, it's a

category categorical imperative that we triangulate. Um. It doesn't adendum to the rule, to the rule as rule number seventeen, as one said, we doesn't have to try to triangulate um anyway. I overall like it was a lovely time, but you know the writer, it wasn't. There's this writer Andrew. When they write for um Ne York magazine. They also perform under the drag alias Dynasty. We saw them. Oh no, you weren't there yet, Oh no, you did? You saw

that They did it? They did um guido, they did that numb from not unbelievable And we have to say we had the best time at Knockdown Center, like Fan Pride, Wonder Fan prim Yes, it was so fun. I mean it was incredible, and I saw I think the first time I really had seen something I didn't know I

always wanted, which was drag performance. Well, yes, obviously no I've seen We've seen it before, but a drag performance of a call from the Vatican from nine, the Penelope Cruise version, Help Christs version, So dynasty, we love you. But um so Andrew Wynn also is the one who has maybe not the one. I don't want to give it. I don't want to put this all on them, um, but they've certainly helped start the conversation, the the discourse

around the Christopher. Christopher Maloney is like, um, a gay sex object or not even gay, just just an object of desire. And who's someone who is like leaning into And I think Chris is finally leading into like you know, like ass like, well if you love the first for the first one, yeah, I mean, but it was always there, like you know, like you know, Oz has been there all along. But now I think Mr Maloney is really

understanding what he what he's providing to the community. And I think Andrew Wynn was writing about us for the Cut for a long time and now you know now they're they're bemoaning the fact that a lot of people are reaching out to them and DMS being like, have you seen this bit of Christopher Maloney news? And they're like, God, this is like the beat that I've chosen, and so this is like the bed that I've made. And I'm like, no, Andrew, it's okay, Like you have started this conversation in a

very good way. But also they said I saw them post something on Monday. They were like I most years, and this year especially, I feel even more sad and cynical after Pride than I do, like happy and hopeful, And I'm like, you know, I think deep down we all will relate to this. I don't know, is that is that too bleak? I'm sorry we're starting. No, I mean this is a redux of our serotonin deficit, episode

of our serotonin bottoming out. And I will say this, I actually I was looking forward to this episode because I was looking forward to checking in with you, because I actually think there might be a difference in in our legit serotonin level right now because I, for you, actually avoided Molly. I think I might have like because it was so because Memorial Day weekend was so much.

I was like, I'm actually going to take a step back and sort of like, you know, not that this is better, but like it was a very much an alcohol forward Pride weekend for me. Like the amount of tequila sodaes I I'm really impressed with myself actually or not impressed, but like she can drink still, really really

really in a in a major way. Um, but I avoided like drugs and I think as of maybe it's because I knew I had to work, I'm working this week, but I was just like, I I really I'm happy I didn't go as hard as I have in the past, because I know what you're saying, and I don't really want to feel that way about Pride weekend, but I find that I often do like my maybe my expectations

are so high. And also, you know, a couple of years ago, because of World Pride, I think we had like an uncommonly good time because we had so many people there that um we're from, you know, everyone came up and it was not such an asset to get

tickets to things like you know what I mean. I also think maybe you shouldered a lot of that because it was so hard to get into stuff, and you know, you know you were able to like provide that experience from people, and so you did did shoulder a lot of that and like, I know, like people are very grateful to you. I'm so grateful to you. And I also don't want you to feel some type of way about me because I came in from l A like I guess I'll just go with Bowen because I just

want to go with you. And there I was sort of like seeing what it was, what it was doing well not to not to sound not to sound whatever, but like it was like I'm happy to provide that service. It's not a service. I'm happy to provide that for you because I I have reason to want you to be in the same places that I am. But it's when, but it's literally when it's like, oh, be be exploited by your furthest acquaintances, this pride. I'm like, no, no, no, I'm like, who is this? Who the funk am I

letting in? I don't know this person anyway, I'm sorry, it's just I just um, it was just like things

being like I don't know, I don't know. And I talked to our good friend recent guest of the pod Celestium about this um and and they were like, you know, because they had witnessed me like being sort of like just they had witnessed me attending to a lot of wonderful, wonderful people coming up to me and being like, wow, you have Well, first of all, it's the thing that we talked about with a D right when like when it's like someone like Kyle Mooney is a Disney World.

It's like a bunch of people been like come on guy, and then with like eighty it's like you have changed the way that I look at myself. And then I'm like, yeah, oh ship, that is a different kind of approach. And then like I was getting I'm sorry to say, and I know, like, first of all, funk off. I don't think so many of the people who are like Bone's complaining about celebrity rights, No, they're not. They're literally not

this matter. This isn't no, they're they're here. They're fucking snitches, Like who listened to that there are They're not readers, they're fucking snitches is And I will literally fucking pop your jaw off if I see you. I'm I'm sorry. I'm like getting I'm like honestly getting to the point where it's like I'm okay with threatening violence. I'm like listening to a lot of we know you've always been okay.

We we know that Boon Yang is bon Yang is violent whatever I anyway, Oh my god, this is so dark. This is purely okay. You can can you can everyone tell that my dope imine receptors are like no, you're not on the list, You're not allowed, like they're not

taking any chemicals, and I, um, but fucking whatever. I'm I'm talking about a specific kind of thing where it's just a frequency and a volume of like interactions that I feel like as a human being, I have to honorwar when people are telling me like wow, like my my my self perception um as it relates to like my my queer Asian nous is like is this different? Is hitting a different level? And like I'm so happy

to have that conversation. I saw multiple people this weekend where we've had conversations where it's like, let's talk about like what this experiences as like Asian people, which is no matter what's going to be heavy, but it's it's not like what you want to do when there's a drink in your hand watching a drag show, right exactly. It's not it's not it's not that it's not a matter of what I want to be doing. It's just that like I kind of feel like or that I

am o blind to do. It's something that you were like kind of like conversationally, like you got to engage in for a little bit, and over time that like accumulates to a level where it like I feel like on top of like everyone everyone fucking hitting me up for like getting me, getting themselves into things or like picking up things from me, I'm just like wait, wait, wait, wait wait, I'm mentally I don't have the fortitude for this, and like this is the first time and I think

like two years where I've I've been like fuck off, stop, go away, go away, get away from me. I can't be here. I can't I have to, Like I where I broke. I broke for the first time in years, and anyway, I'm sorry. Is this no, I mean, there's nothing to apologize. I honestly, this is why I kind of was like Okay, on that last night of Sunday, I was like, let me stick right here next to bone because I can kind of sense because I was I was like, I'm about to leave, like let me

just say goodbye to the girls and leave. And I also like, I think I experience some version of what you're talking about, maybe about fifteen percent of it. And even I think it's a little overwhelming. I have to had people come up and say, you know, and it's it's so lovely, but but it's the nicest thing in the world. But but it is like you also want to I get that you also want to be able to like provide, like and I think that you do

a great job. But I do I do understand what you're saying where it's like when you are meaningful to someone and they tell you that like it's um, when it's not happening just once, it's happening sort of again

and again and again. And I also think it probably was just a different pride experience for you, because honestly, you that I saw someone someone sent me like um and not to literally do this to you in the in this on this episode, but someone sent me like tweet that was like bow and Yang just gave me propers So I guess that's pride, like and I thought

that was funny. I laughed, but I was like, but you were sort of like an attraction at Pride at a certain point, and I like it felt like that people were coming up and I was just like, I think, I totally no, it's not dark because you make people proud and and you like and I know it's like, but I'm not saying I'm not saying I don't understand what you're saying. I fully understand what you're saying, and it's gotta be a little exhausting. It was different experience.

I was happy to provide the poppers, but in that in that experience for that person, um, it was I I was like, like, Bowen gave me something which I'm not which is does not illustrate anything. It's just that like and whatever. I'm like, this fucking dude is hitting me up. I haven't heard from him in two months, and all of a sudden he's like, Hey, I'm gonna be in New York and maybe I can come a fire Island. I'm like, no, stop taking things from me,

Stop asking me for things, stop stop procurement. I am not here for access to like this thing for you, Okay, And so I'm not saying that, like that is not my attitude about, you know, opening poppers on the dance form, like passing them around to people, but like for this person to be like that's pride Bow and Yange gave me popper something like I don't want I don't want that.

Like you saying that I'm an attraction is weird to me because it's like like where are you, Like are you like what is what are you extracting from me? And I know again this sounds like I kind of I kind of remember when eight. Okay, not to bring it back to eighty literally sister life hashtab, but remember when eight was like I've never related to anything more as it relates to like whatever being known. Then when Brittany was shaving her head, I'm like, I'm about to snap.

Not at that level, obviously, I'm nowhere near dealing with what Brittany was has has dealt with anything before or but I'm like, I'm like, I'm like I need to

reclaim something. I need to reclaim something. And literally I was walking home from from this thing on Sunday that I saw you at and I was telling myself, I was like, the only way I can give back to myself is by like this sounds so fucking soft and cloying, but the only way I can give back to myself is to like create and is to like make something for me. And that is what I'm going to do the rest of the summer, and I will probably pump the brakes and like going to these these social things

being social at all. I have like been pretty bad about getting back to people's texts in the last few days, just being like not like someone being like, let's go to the beach. I'm like, no, we're not. I'm not. I don't want to be perceived. I don't want to be I don't want to be seen. I'm sounding I mean, I guess like for the reader, it's like you guys are kind of extemporaneously listening to me sort of think through this in you know, in real time, Like I am,

I have to re estab. I need to like triangulate. There we go, you have to I'm triangulating where I land and based on like what that with that extremity, with that extreme version of of what I kind of what stresses me out is and um, what my ideal is literally, Matt, I was, you know, I was I took. I took my half a pill on Sunday, twenty minutes later, as my role was starting, I was like, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna be here. I can't be here.

And I said by to you. I was rolling by myself in my apartment, listening to fucking like you know, Tyler the Creator and Dojic. I was and like sucking the time and Taylor. I was like, this is gonna be my musical buffet. I'm gonna like fucking have a great time by myself in my apartment. And I had

a blast. I'm sorry, I'm no. And I actually I said to you when when you said you were going to leave, I litterally, I think I literally said to you, I was like, well, that's gonna be a blasting your apartment. I was like, you're going to have such a better time in your apartment listening. I was like, you're probably gonna be up to like six I wasn't, well, well, yeah, I think I thought you were ted taking a full molly.

So that's that's happened to me so many times where I'll like be like, yeah, sure, I'm gonna do this, And then I realized I look around where I am and I'm like, oh, I don't like this and I shouldn't have done it, and I was like, why did I do it? And then I go home and I am up fully late, like listening to musically truly raging raw rang as I've been saying in my apartment by myself, and it's fine and it's great and I love it, and I just don't I think again, it's like an

expectation thing, you know what I mean. It's like, I don't want you to worry about how it sounds to people, because it sounds like you had a Pride weekend that was very up and down. And I think that that is sort of speaking to something that everyone can understand, which is that there's a lot of expectation and a lot of a lot going on mentally, emotionally, socially during Pride weekend for everyone. And I think that, like like and so I think it's completely understandable what you're saying.

I also had it on a little bit of a pedestal because I was coming back and I realized, like, there's really not a moment unless I'm like literally at something surrounded by three or four people. I really want to be with at that moment that I don't have an element of like stress, anxiety, fomo um or whatever it is. It's like intangible. It's like an intangible thing I can't really put my finger on where I stop at, Like at like it's like a maximum of joy for

me at like eight percent. It's like in the moments, I'm really enjoying myself. And then I think it's because, like I think social media plays into it. I think the fact that we've been through the pandemic plays into it. And I think the fact that you know, like things have changed with the way you're right, you are perceived and the way you are looked at and approached, And I think that that's all really understandable. And I also think drugs drugs and like I don't know, like don't

do them everybody. There's no like, there's no like blanket application, there's no like, I don't know, this is my really I normally don't really do them this and I kind of this The occasion for doing the drugs was pride, and that kind of is its own darkness for me, where I'm like, why did I feel that it was compulsory to do that you know anyway, But honestly, I don't know if this is what you were saying, But like the most fun moments on hand were this is

so this is so cheesy, but I'm looking, I'm talking to my sister. We're with you. I was like laughing the most when I was with you. We were doing stupid fucking bits and like this is this is the difference this. Do you relate to this? Yes, that is

what I wanted pride to be, yea. But in terms of the approach, my it's my favorite thing when people, when you and I are together and someone is able to to say, oh my god, I love the pod so much, And I'm like, that is different for me because that is like are like kind of like that is the quintestants of like us and like how we like to like talk to pe and like that is and that is like us like with no like I

don't know, no weird. People relate to it in a in a way that feels like pure and people like that and people and people know how to approach us, you know, as a as a duo of sorry I roll, but it's like people know how to approach because we make it very clear on this show, like how we feel generally about things, and they know like, okay, like you know, Matt's sensitive to this, but insensitive to that.

Let's you're the most respectful. For sure. There are one thousand percent the readers that we meet are the most respectful people. One and I will say to it's um, It's interesting because there there was the very the first night of Pride me being here anyway, was on Thursday night and we went to the Boom Boom Room. We went to that Madonna thing and it was it was so I was so disheartened the second we got there

because it was so crowded. You guys, it was so crowded, it was so seen, and it was so much and I was just like, oh my god, I'm here and already I'm like I'm confronting like what this is in terms of reality and what this was in terms of expectation, and I'm already like so tired and overwhelmed. And then literally I won't say who, but someone provided the best weed I have ever smoked in my It's a previous

guest of the show. It's a previous guest of the show who is a damn legend he's a legend, legend, oh my god, and I have I'm like, whatever, we can't get into this, but I was like swept off my fucking feet. Anyways, Uh provided the best godsamn read I've ever had. And I'm telling you, I could have stood there and bopped my head and not talked to

anyone for hours. Was like, I am totally fine. I'm looking around and it's like, literally, it's so funny because and I'll just say this, it's like you turn to your left and it's like land Spass and you're like, yeah, you are the blueprint of this party, like you are exactly who's here. And I'm just like, but I didn't feel stressed because this weed just like dropped me all

the way in. And it's like you look across the room and there's Andy and Anderson by themselves talking and I'm like, I'm so happy, that's real, Like there they are. And then you look over and it's like Adam Lambert's there, and I'm like, what the hell? Then Madonna comes out and her fucking blue wig looking like Sydney Bristow from Alias Crawling on the Bar. I'm like, this is so funny,

and it just was all. It all got to a point where maybe it was because this we really came through, but I was able to just chill for a sound. I was like chill because of the weed. Despite the I've never experienced the chaos of that room. It was not a good venue for it. And and we love, we love, we love ever playing and we love everybody

who made that happen, and thank you. And it was it was an experience, but it was like so there, it was just every kind of stimulus you could possibly think of was there to like was there to like fucking press down on you? And it felt like being like twenty feet underwater, like like the pressure of it was just like what could have crushed you, well literally physically we were being crushed. And so we finally found

like a little place to go. But I will say this, the aesthetic of it, Like I'm telling you, it felt like being in hell, in like a in like a cool way. You know those parties that are like it's hell, Like the aesthetic is the pit of hell, but in a cool way. And it's like there's nothing to make you more afraid than the words no fear in red

letters honking at you at the wall. It's like the words courage and no fear in all red letters, just like blare ring at you while this music played, and it's like truly red lights and I'm like, this is just so it was so aggressive that I thought once I once I smoked, I was like, oh, I might have just made the biggest mistake of my life. But

luckily it was such good weed. And I just had sat there and I was like, Okay, now I'm good, and I felt like I hope no one like looks over at me, and it's like, oh, that guy's not talking to anyone. I don't want to speak to anyone. And then I foundly found you and like sat down and we we were able to talk like my sister, but like I was like, I'm totally good now that I'm like completely like zoned in, like I'm okay. And I needed that so bad because I was I was panicking.

It was I know, this is how you know that was the best weed was because cent the problem, that's the probability that it would have any other strain of weed would have throttled you the other direction. And this is the word You've even more anxious and even more like on edge and wow for the weed to like fucking relax, you actual change, your change, your mental gravitational pull is like incredible, and God bless, God bless the supplier that night, God bless and I and I mean,

this nut is so good. One struck no no way O me. Oh look, I just I was enchanted by you. Whatever we kiss him, it is the man is hot. But okay, so here let's just say the people that want to know what did Madonna do, here's the answer. Mostly in auction. Most it was most she did. She started with Vogue, which is such a crazy move right now. She did Vogue, and then she did Hung Hung Up, and then she did the auction with Zachary Quinto, who dressed in a pussy bow blouse, and God bless the

two of them raised a lot of money. I imagine, we're really, we're really proud. I kind of like couldn't get a spot, so I went to the back, and um, I was just like I'm good with this, and I think I did see Madonna sort of passed through through the crowd and it was just it was I mean, her kids were out. We just have to say, like she gave you everything that you want from Madonna, she was serving you and in all the ways you can imagine. It was just I was happy to be there once.

I was happy to be there, but before that, it was like, oh boy, this is I mean, it was packed. Yeah. And so this is another thing. I realized that you're hearing,

you're listening to the two of us. It's sort of like already like wax analytical and nostalgic about this, like you know, pride experience that was just specific to one city, and we hope that like you listening at home, in the car, wherever you are, whatever your relationship with Pride is, if you've never even participated in it, if you don't have access to like it's like you know, programming beyond like a parade on Sunday, Like it's it's okay, it's okay.

You know, it's like you're not really missing anything. We're reporting back to you, like the fun, cute little details, but overall, what we're reflecting back to you, we hope you understand. It's like an emotion which is, oh god, this is this is a lot, this is a lot. Well, it's okay to be a human being, you know, Like I think that That's when I never realized I'm more human than one of these weekends where I'm like, okay, and then I feel crazy because I'm like, should I should?

I want to stay out until six right right? And I don't. I don't. That's maybe there was like and maybe I missed when I had the energy to be able to do that, but like I wasn't really doing this type of thing when I was and now I'm thirty one and I'm just like, by the way, this is the first weekend of my life where I ever was asked how old are you? I said thirty one and someone goes, that's okay, I was, and I laughed. I was like, I want you to know I still

consider myself to be very young. And they were like, no, no, no, you are you are? And I was like, and I don't need you to reassure me. No, no, it was like it was yeah, and can we just say something. The twenty four year olds walking around these events, UM are are not in the are not in the sort of UM are not in the power dynamic they believe they are. I just want to say that, I just

want to make that loud and clear. It's like you don't you of being twenty four, though I know it's part of being twenty four, but it's like it would just help if you had. And I think this is why we did not stay. I don't know whatever it's I had some awareness went back when I was that young that like I wasn't fucking I wasn't ship like I was I was. I was a fucking idiot, I was a clown. I think we didn't have good self esteem then. So I I think here's what I think.

If you're twenty four and you're ready to stay outntil six and you fucking are feeling yourself, I wish that for you. I just wouldn't say to someone who says their thirty one that's okay. But also I do think the person that did it, because it did make me laugh very much a lot, and I I love it. What is your thirty one? And that's okay. Let's just let's just talk. Let's just put this out there. Lately, you Matt Rodgers have experienced weird age fuckory with thirty

one and that's okay. And oh, Matt, are you didn't think I was left in? So? How do how do you feel about that? Well? I'll tell you what I did. Have readers finally get in my d M s and we're like the episode, we listened to the episode, and we're on it. We're making your Wiia page. Then one person said, I tried, but they say you don't have enough sourced articles, babe, And I'm like, okay, well I can't do anything about that. And again, this is not

like bloating my ego. This isn't like helping me. But it's also it also is like very humbling in a way that I think is great. I was just like, yes, thank you guys so much. And apparently there is one in process now, but it's like it's true, I don't have that much that much like media. Hopefully it'll change soon.

And I will say, okay, so while you sort of while you sort of like talked about your product experience, I think that honestly, something happened to me last week that's sort of like numbed me out in a way for a pride where it was like I really didn't So the Q Force trailer came out and um, it was like so crazy the response it got on Twitter, because like it was so it's so funny because it's like a forty second trailer, and people were so like

people who are on Twitter only, and I'm convinced don't live off of it, um and if they, if they do,

it's probably very dark and sad. But came for this trailer so hard and it's just like I couldn't even I was like, Wow, this is how stupid people are, Like they're gonna watch this forty second trailer that like Netflix put together for Pride Weekend, which you know it's gonna be a little bit like you know, just my nature of what that is, like it's gonna be a little yas queenish and I'm like, you know what I mean, Like it's it's just it's never gonna hit in a

trailer like for these people online, like these zoomers that needed it to be what they needed it to be. But it's just so funny the type of complaints I was getting. It was like, well, the type of complaint is all parritage ship, Like they said the same thing I was telling you this Like it was it was almost word for word, the same fucking quote tweeted stuff that was like when um Our Little Pride song came

out for the finale in Vessel. We wrote, we wrote, we were like, okay, this is like so clearly um modeled after Girls Night Out by Charlie and like Holiday Bay Madonna, and like it's just it's not like it's it's not like a fucking like masterpiece. It's just a cute little song about like a little like about what lived in Pride experiences are, which is like everyone spins out and whatever and so, and then the quote tweets on it were this feels homophobics. Somehow this feels homophobics.

Somehow this feels homophobics. Somehow this it was all the same stuff. I was like, okay, like we're not even like coming up with like original takes on this anymore. After the third or fourth quote tweet, it's just regurgitated

fucking bollus mush. Okay, that's what this is. And it's just because it's just because we're in this like consumption mode now maybe um where it's like, okay, this isn't exactly what's being what I want reflected back to me, then let me immediately write it off as garbage and drivel.

That's fine, They're allowed to do that. Um, it just seems like it now, but now it just seems just like it seems like this thing where it's like oh no, no, no, but like there is not any nuance beyond I don't know why, but I hate this right and it's just what they're trying to say is that it feels like something that is that that creates like a shame in them, I guess, and I honestly think it's like, well, let me just say this, and this is almost I hesitated

if I even wanted to bring this up, but you were being vulnerable, so I was just like, this is something that happens, so I wanted to talk about it because even though even as the audience of this podcast, girls, I do consider, like you know, the readers of the pod like family, and like I do always want to be honest with myself on this show, and um, I'm also very aware that, like you know, we're you and I are getting more opportunities and we're lucky, and I'm

so fucking excited for you and excited for myself. When the Q Force trailer came out and it got like this like bizarre reaction on Twitter from a few people that made it seem like it was a lot of people like like hating on it. Let me just make it very clear to anyone that that that might like have like commented on this or whatever in a negative way. You took nothing from me. I am so fucking psyched about Q Force. I know how funny it is, I

know how good it is. I know exactly what it is, I know who it represents, I know who's involved in it. I'm so freaking excited to be a part of the cast and to have written on it, because yes, I was a big part of creating it as well as being on screen in it. So you're never going to take away how excited I am and how proud I am to be a part of it. Ever, I think it's hilarious. It is, if you give it a chance,

exactly what you wanted to be. It's an incredibly diverse, dynamic show that represents all different facets of the queer community. The core four of it is Sean, Wanda, Psychs, Patti Harrison, and me, and then it's like other people in the cast play different roles and there's got an incredible supporting cast and guest cast that hasn't been announced yet. It's incredibly fucking gay as shit. I don't care at all.

If you are someone who watches it and and like has a problem with my character saying something happened to his butt hole when he's turned on, you're really not gonna like it. When my character jokes about getting bred, I don't give a funk what you think about it. I love it. If you have a problem with the fact that there are gay men out here and queer people out here talking about getting fucked like I have, I have to break it to you. I know a lot of goddamn horse and like, this is just gonna

be what this character is. And I hope that you like it. It's not the whole fucking show, but I just hope that you give it a chance because it's so funny. And if you had any idea, if any of you had any idea, how difficult it is to get something queer made, how difficult it is to get any thing made, it all in general, but then how difficult it is to get anything queer made, you would have shut the funk up. And let me say something else. When you make something queer, it has to check so

many more boxes. And when you make something from a marginalized perspective, it has to check so many more boxes because I'll tell you what, if Entourage gets rebooted, no one's going to talk about the lack of diversity. But Sex in the City does, and everyone has something to say about it, because when women make something, when pocs makes something, when queer people make something, everyone has something to say. And it comes from I think, when it

comes from our community. It comes from a real it's always no, but it's top down and then it's bottom up to were we're in a fucking like bear trap. It's crazy, you know what, I understand, like watching that trailer and think I'm not representative in that, and so I fucking hate it. And it's like worse for my

community that it exists. And it didn't give it a fucking chance to be smarter than to judge something based on a forty second trailer made by Sorry but Netflix, give it a fucking chance to be the thing you wanted to be, because it is and it was truly made for you. And I just I'm sorry to get like upset about this. And I put at the top of my list and from the beginning and the start

of my career when I was making no money. For years, all I ever wanted to do was make content and make comedy for people like me and in my community. And I've been so lucky to be able to be one of those people that when I log onto something that I'm proud of and I see, fuck this, this is homophobics somehow coming from what I know our UM queer Twitter accounts and being like this is the reason why people like UM, why why we have hate crimes

against our community. Guess what, even if my voice is a little raised right now and it sounds like you're getting to me, I'm only fired up to keep going because I know what I make, and I know what you make, Boon Yang, and I know what people that came up with us make, and we're coming from a place of wanting to entertain and provide and represent the queer community. And if you don't like it, then keep sitting on the fucking couch. I don't give a fuck.

I don't need you. There is just something so unsophisticated and like unformed and like pure, like college freshman or aspiring college freshman to say this is setting the movement back when it comes to anything, when it comes to I hear this from Asian people, I hear this from queer people. I hear this from just just people, like not not even queer people, who are like, what Bowen

Yang's doing is really setting gay people back. I'm like, excuse me, your your your your version of um, you know, your pseudo activism is that such a low frequency that no one's gonna fucking hear it. It doesn't register, babe,

So don't even bother. Don't even fucking bother. I mean, you know, it's it's it's like and I checked in with people that also worked on the show about it, and and like, you know, I was just like, you know, I think I've been like in a little bit of denial about the fact that it bothered me because flat out and like, I'm not gonna get upset. But all I ever wanted to do was make the queer community

proud and all. And that's all I ever wanted to do, was like like and and like so much of what I do was like I feel like explicitly comes from my queerness, and it's been from the beginning, like it

makes me who I am. I genuinely feel like I only ever really found myself as a comedian when we started this podcast, and I was able to really key into who I was and came into who we were because it was us together and it was by accident, and I felt like it's it's been like it's been such a long road and so like, I'm going to be proud of my success actually, and I'm gonna be really proud of Bowing success and no one's gonna fucking

do anything to take that away. So it's and it's like you and you can keep watching because it's gonna you're gonna see more of us. So how about that there is no developmental process. There's still no developmental process for queer people. Two land in a space where they are able to make comedy and and and try to like try to have every consideration and hold every consideration and take those into account while making something that makes

it inevitable. Remember when b D said that, I've been I've been quoting that and like every single thing, I've been quoting this to myself. Where it's when when Bed was like, you know, it's like when people say, like, oh, like, why hasn't there been an Asian person on SNL and forty five seasons? It's not because like there aren't eight

funny Asian people out there. It's because there is no process of like making sure that this will happen no matter what, that that it will be inevitable for whatever, an Asian person to land on a show like SNL or for a queer person to make an animated show about spies like perfect you know, um or something that like won't elicit like fucking weird, unmoored outrage. Clearly it is un founded outrage because these people don't know why they're mad. They I mean, they don't know. What they're

talking about is their complaints are factually inaccurate. And so it's this it's this thing where it's like it's the worst kind of emotion, whether it's guilt, fear, anger, love, the worst the worst versions of those things are the versions where you form them out of thin air, out of nothing. And that's what's and that's what is kind

of happening a lot more now. UM. And I just want I just want people to like really like kind of like try to like scope out and take a holistic view of things and be like, oh wait, we're figuring this out as we go. We're making sure that this happens that there are better versions of this that we like, that this is a recursive thing where like

people like come out with better things moving forward. We're just making this easier for the next person and the next group of people to make something even better for queer people as we go along, because that structure has not been built yet. Okay, That's that's what we're dealing with. I mean, you know what's interesting is it's like, I think in our own ways, we are sort of a part of like or maybe like a direct like half like quarter generation away from the first like queer mainstream

version of a lot of these things. And I genuinely think that, like it's like it's almost like we don't know how to celebrate ourselves or it's like a rocky road we've got We've gotten much better, We've gotten so much better, much better. Remember when Guy Brandon we used to say, like the only gay men who were celebrated are porn stars and dract queens. That is no longer true.

That is no longer true. And I think Guy would even cop to that, right, right, And I think that I think that, Um, it's just it's interesting, and this is what I hope I hope that a lot of these accounts that are saying these things that would say something like that about your Pride sketch or any of the characters that you do on us and Now, or that would be commenting on Q for uce or something that I do out there based on like something like

a hot dog or whatever. Um. It's just like I just hope that that's not reflective of like a young a queer generation who are like posts, who are like post celebrating clearness. I just it's it's like it's a rational fear that I have. We're not going to like broadly apply that to everybody. No, that's that, that's not what's happening. Like I'm I don't think someone. I hope not.

You know, it just it just got weird for a second there, and it's you know, I was thinking about this actually right before I got on, because I was like, I was watching All Stars six and we were all talking about it earlier, and we were all talking about it in the chat and I hadn't seen it yet, but you guys were like not loving and I watched it and I was like, wait, I think I love this.

I was like, I'm having fun watching it, like I loved Jara Sophia, I think a curious looking good at I think so many of the queens are looking so great, um, you know, and I'm just like I was happy to watch it, and I was happy to do it, and I was like, damn, it sucks for these queens that they're being premiered on the serotonin dump weekend. You know

what I mean. Everyone's unhappy. Everyone. Everyone's gonna be so unhappy for the next week as they finally catch up with like a download fucking paramount plass and like get to consume this. I'm like, I think that maybe my sisters in the chat earlier, like and I don't I don't deny your opinions, but I will say, like, continue to give it a shot because you know it's good. Although I do say I have some qualms about All

Star Stix. If you want to sort of transition out of this moment, and we thank the readers for going on this right with us. Thank you, Thank you readers. Um, it's just like little things where I'm like some of the cast I'm like, okay, like, maybe we didn't need thirteen cast members if we're going to consider this person like an All Star, and that's not shade to them,

it just is facts. Not everyone is an All Star. Like, if you appear on three episodes of your season like or one, you know you're probably not an All Star and so the steaks of watching you on the show are just not gonna be there. Um so and with thirteen queens, you know, on an all star season, you have to think that way, I think. And also it's a it's sort of getting to the point where like

with the challenges, I feel like we're repeating ourselves. Like seeing another Denim runway, it's just like or like another Like yeah, I watched both and I was just like, okay, Like this is stuff we've literally done before. And so if we're just gonna if we're gonna be so drag and drop, not to make a pun, but I guess I did with the show, then let's like find new things to do on the runway and new challenges to do, you know. Yeah, yeah, I feel like it's it's tough.

It's tough to talk about drag race because we don't know on a decision level, like how much of this is like a icon CBS thing where they're like, okay, let's let's put All Star six on, you know, on Paramount Plus it is and uh, you know, and these poor queens like probably can't even vocalize how they feel

about it in an honest way. And I just think, I just think like drag Race itself is going through a period where it is like adjusting, and I think, like it doesn't the show itself doesn't get too much credit.

It doesn't get enough credit for like evolving, like you know, like remember like you know, three or four seasons ago when a lot of the discussion was around like Rube being very exclusionary towards trans queens, and it's like now it's like you got Giggli, you got, you got, you got, like and even before that was like Gia and all this, and it was it was just like, oh no, Like it has not declared itself like we are Chap. It's not being it's not been terribly declarative about the ways

it's changed. And yet it has, Yes, it is it is responsive to like the collective critique of it, which I think is very valid um. And so I don't know, I think like I was just kind of like ribbing on drag Race on All Star six to like the thread being like oh God, like what is this like

what is this talent? What what does happen? And then but then like also obviously finding the moments of like true like true like ah and greatness with like you know, Josphiel like shaking like her big, her big latex tits around and like this is actually this is the best of this is the best of what the show has to offer always, you know, and so like if there's value in launching it, of course, And I will say like in that second episode you haven't seen yet, incredible

lip sync at the end, like true, And I mean like the show. Before I got on, I was actually really happy because I was beaming. I found myself beaming up at my television like like truly happy, and I was just like, oh great, And yeah, do I have a note for the whole thing that it's on Paramount Plus because do I think it really is a big

fuck you to the bars? Yeah? I think it's a I think it's a major funk you to the bars who really could use this now of course, not for nothing, for nothing, and I know that like they're doing like you know, like when it actually lead debuts like the bars will do whatever, but to have it on streaming, Like, I understand the movement towards streaming, and nothing that we say or do was going to like stop that. And I also totally understand, you know, they want people to

watch Paramount Plus and subscribe to Paramount Plus. I get it.

But I do think it's a shame that the communal experience that drag Race was built based on is not an inherent part of it anymore, because it still was even as people sort of like you know now now sort of um, you know, they accept drag Race as part of the real, true mainstream like Emmy winning repeated again and again and again culture, Like it's so like on straight people do consume it so much now and it doesn't feel like this thing that like was on

logo and there was commercials for Luban during it, you know what I mean, It's not that anymore. But I still think, like you have to acknowledge that like that experience of going out and watching it like are it's it's not not even just so important for the show. It's so important for the communities, and it's important for

these like businesses. So it's the optimal experience of watching the show because towards the end of season thirteen, you know, uh, stuff was stuff was opening back up in New York as far as like an outdoor experience went um and uh you know you and I went to went to went to a viewing outdoors and the first time I

went back, it was so funny. It was so the first time I went to a bar to watch season thirteen, it was so funny too, Like turn at the table next to me during a runway and be like, Oh, they're cheering for that queen that I don't care for. This is what This is why that communal experience is so important and funny because you're like, oh, I disagree with them and that's and that's great. And I'm like, oh,

they don't know. I'm like, they do not have that, Like they don't have like the same standards that I do.

And I'm like, this is why it's fun because you're you're able to like disagree in real time to be like and then everyone we day and like I just I mean it was that was like my first genuine moment of like euphoria in the pandemic of like, oh I'm with people again in this space that like is mostly queer people enjoying this, like whatever, like show that was kind of originally made for us, no matter how

mainstreamed it's gotten. I'm like, this is fun and so like even they try to do that with uk Um when uh, like they would just play it the next day at night, and I was like, this is it kind of was nice, but like I agree with you, like it's it's truly a shame that like it didn't it did not that that that that conversion for Paramount Plus in terms of like getting users to like sign up for it is like prioritized over but of course

it is. It's it's it's it's capitalism baby. Well, and I think going forward, like and I would I would suggest to all the readers, are like hope that all the readers would like create their own experience with it, you know what I mean? And I know I do know that the bars are doing this, like they will show the episode at a certain time, and I think, you know, just like check in with your friends and um and you know the places around you that are doing that because it is fun. And like I have

to disagree with my sisters. I think that it's gonna be a fun goofy season. I think it's gonna be a fun season. I'm just like, I just don't know what's going on. I'm like, oh God, I'm like what. I keep asking myself why which is which I guess is a compelling thing, and like why thirteen queens instead of ten? Why these queens from these seasons? Why that queen again from that from those seasons. I'm like, there's so many question marks, and that's what's throwing me off.

I'm not I'm distracted from like the pure quintestants of the show because there are so many random ass fucking things. That's all. Yes, And I would say here's here's what who's that? Here's what I would say in the second episode one if I would say the more random queens involved in the season, like turns it and and and so. I won't give spoilers, but it's it's like some of

the queens. When I saw the list, I was like, oh, so it is that thing of like, you know, maybe Asia O'Hara keeps saying no, or Ligne just can't handle coming back, or kim ch is just you know, you know, feels above it maybe or like whatever where I'm like this is the girls were ending up with. But I will say, you're reminded that just because of how you do want a drag race season has really no reflection

or bearing on how you are as a queen. And I think it's cool to see them understand what the show is and then come back with like less of a insecurity or less of a notion of what they have to do, or less of uh, you know, block up and come in and have fun with it. Because another thing is it feels like because these girls all know what All Stars is and they kind of know, it's like fucked and like it's like you get voted out for like stupid reasons and there's so much fuckory.

They all care a little bit less and so it's a little bit lighter in a way. That's fun to watch. I think, you know, that's a that's a really that's a good observation. I like that. I like, like I want to feel stressed during a regular season. During an All Star season, I kind of wanted to be like they get voted out and it's like got me out, you know, like sort of that energy like oh I didn't I didn't win this silly game. You know just by the fact that there's real money and real stakes.

No that is I think maybe the producers are very conscious of that fact that an All Star season is just going to be like a different species of animal, because it's like you're you're you know who these queens are, you know what you're getting. You're just seeing what the mixes and seeing how things play out. But again, the stakes aren't as crazy, whereas like, I mean with thirteen, I was like so with it. I was I was glued to the fucking screen the entire time because I was, yes,

this is all new. And by the way, I mean a lot of the thirteen girls were at Booming Room on Thursday, and I think I turned to you at one point I was like, wait, thirteen was like one of the more incredible seasons, like because I was like, yeah, I was like over there, I was like, oh my god, got make I was like, it's got mcenny news and Simone over there and then and then we love and from twelve was I was like, I was like, oh, Like I was like, I don't think like I think

we've like filled that. We keep like like the show does a good job of filling the well again with like great reality characters and great drag queens where I'm like, I would love to see them on. It's not it's because because what's happening now with All Star six is maybe a lot of people are like, oh, they've run out of great queens, and I don't think that's true. That's not think that's true. That's not true in the casting of All Stars six, because there's some great great

queens on six. Uh. And I'm also like there's plenty of like you know, there's plenty from the Reserve. Oh yeah, I mean from in the future, like even from season thirteen, like and and and Jen is the only queen from season twelve on. So it's like there's great queens from twelve who, by the way, remember that was a pandemic season and they did not really get their shine afterwards in terms of performing live. So there's great girls from

twelve and thirteen that are going to come on. By the way, I had a moment with Candy Muse, so

I'm a mom I had. I had a moment with G and G and I really connected and like I like was like it was like my one moment of like being star struck all week I was like, I was like, wait, yeah, literally was there and I was like, you know, I was like, I was like Smane and it was like literally like g I have to tell you like you're so you're so wonderful and like I can tell your good energy and like, you know whatever, and anyway, superstar and I'm thinking about g G being

on All Stars. I mean, come the total that's in our future. Um. Candy Muse is sitting in the v I P section and by the way, she was sort of like sour Plus in the V I P section, like doing doing that and I love I live for it. So she turns to me, looks me in the eyes and goes like this beckons me over and I'm like, oh, this isn't I'm in I'm in trouble. I think I might be in trouble here because I did the Grinder recaps.

Oh yeah. And I'm literally thinking in my head as she as she's as she's calling me over, She's like, was I like a bit too? Can the mus I don't think? So? I love Candy Muse. I think I was always like a Candy Muse fan, even though it was like an up and down Season four candy muse, like we can say objectively, I think I was always like pro candy and good to her. But I guess I'm gonna find out. So she whispers in my ear, were you the one that did the Grinder recaps? I

was like, yes, yes, that was me. She goes, I thought I'd recognized you, and I was like, I was like, I want to tell you that I love you, and she lends down and gives me a kiss and goes, I love you too, baby, and I was like, oh thank god. I was like that could have been a candy muse a moment. Like I was like, I hope she doesn't like it was all sent something that like I said, like maybe shady one time during her more off weeks, but like love, they know what it is.

Um Kenny was also there are poppy juice and I I, oh, yeah and yes, and I was like I was like, you know, like I am too. I was like I respect Candy too much to like go up and like kind of like like kind of like harsh the vibe a little do the thing, and like we were technically co hosts the event of the function, but like I

got a little follow I was like okay. So she like she like kind of saw me across the way and was like, we're doing the same job right now, this this one and I and I'm like respect respect we I I was always pro Candy, you know, even even even in the fucking like the Creature Challenge, the Animal Challenge with the fucking alien around her neck, but like the don I was living for. I was on the group chap like, no, I don't care what you guys say. I fucking love the look. I was loving

every Candy look that came out every single week. I have been pro candy this whole time. And also here's the thing about Candy. Candy has it, but this is what Candy has it behind her eyes. Candy believes it, and so I believe it. Even when she came out and something that wasn't like perfect, and I said during my Reek have a bunch, I was like, she is wearing what she's wearing, but like, look at how she's selling it, Like you can tell her nothing. You can

tell her nothing, and that's what I love. Like And even in that alien get up, everyone was like this is bad. This is one of the worst things ever. I'm like says I was like, and I will say again and again and again, sometimes things that are bad are the best things. That's camp, that's called that's reveling in bad taste. To come on. Also the fact that just Candy was very much the show a lot of this season music the producer muse it is her name.

I we understand that simone want the soft drink challenge, yea sweet tooth. But Candy, I mean, what's the case specials? These special glanced to the side, glanced back at camera. I con without Jim one of the honestly one of

the smarter commercials. And also like something that like people like people that are the inherent audience at home are going to be laughing at you know what I mean, like like truly like watch that Oh my god, were watching an episode together and cackling at home, being like, oh my god, this is so stupid and funny, like

Candyusa Cacalusa, Um, oh my god, you know what. Sorry not to fully swerve the other direction, but um, speaking of stupid like whatever, I just I have not really reckoned with the idea that I have been like a conan fucking freak since day one and Conan ending like on the perfect note. On the perfect note, did you watch Did you watch His Little Fair? Well? I did not, just because I've been swept up but you lately, But yeah,

you should. You specifically should watch it because he's just like all it is is him thinking people and thinking that people have stood by him all these years, and at one point he's like thinking like Lisa Kudrou And then there's a whole segment where he and like Lisa like go to like this fucking like sidebar at Largo where they met for the first time in an improv class, and that was really they both recognized they both like they were so young, they were like in their twenties,

like both twenty two, like recognizing each other as like that person is funny. I don't know, it's not to be cheese, but like I remember exactly where I was. I'm not even with you when like he did like the whole like synesism is my least favorite quality and all you have to do is work hard to be kind to people and amazing things. What happened? Oh my god, I'm crying. It's I love Conan so much. I'm sorry. Oh my god. This is this is like the pure surge this is this is the drugs by the way,

Oh my god. Well, I mean he I know, I know that, I know that's a legend. He's a legend, like and it means something to you, And I was I was really happy that on that episode with Nikki you were able to externalize that, because I feel like you haven't really talked about on the podcast. No and like no, but like Roger, I'm calling you rog l

o L like Josh Stripe does. But like every night watch every guy in middle school in high school, like I would stay up to watch and like, oh my god, I'm sorry, and so I know, like work hard and be kind of people, is like on every fucking like basic like withered, like the distressed wood poster in the world. But like, I don't know, like that's been like that's like that's like such a perfect distillation of like who

he is, how he conducts himself. But then the way he ended this one, um, this TBS run was the last thing he says, is my whole life, my whole career has been about finding that sweet intersection of spart and stupid. He's like, that's what I spent my whole life chasing. Is that like that little that little like tangential point of smart and stupid, and like that is exactly what Conan is, right, like every cone and bit is perfectly stupid, perfectly smart. I immediately me, boonyng, I

immediately thought of you. I thought of you, and study. I thought of you and students like those are the people that I know in my life who do that the best. And then and then he's says, as I say, I thought of you two. He says, um um, so if you can, if you can do what you love with the people you love, that's the closest thing to heaven on earth. And I was just that I thought of you guys, and I was like, oh my god,

this man is my hero. He's been my hero all along, and he like is the reason why I've like stuck with the people that I love is because I knew, like that was like the sauce, Like that's like what like that's like what everyone wants and like I'm so lucky to have that. And I'm sorry, oh my god, I'm like literally sobbing over Conan. O'Brien l o L who I love you, and you know I feel the same way, and I just uh and honestly that is emotional because it's like he has been such a constant

for so many people. And I do think, you know, I think in the Late Night conversation he does get a little bit lost because I think in terms of whenever when everyone talks about like Late Night legends, it feels like only only like comedians will talk about Conan. I think maybe because you know, it got a little weird there with like his his representation in Late Night with the Tonight Show of it all. But that man is and he is a singular icon, and I mean,

like talk about one of the best interviewers. I mean also you'll hear like many many celebrities coming out now are notable people that have been out, they will They're all coming out of the woodwork right now saying that my favorite interview was the one I did with Conan O'Brien, or I never felt taken care of communically like I did with Conan O'Brien. I never felt like I could actually go out there and be do a real bit like or or Honestly, Conan O'Brien, like some interviews that

he did like made people's careers in ways. I mean Aubredy Plaza like on tonor O'Brien is like it's like it's like a comedic touchstone for some people, you know what I mean, Like he made people feel like they're funniest self and that is a skill and that is a talent, that is a that is a gift and to to in order to those interviews, I was like, Oh that guy bow like wow, and like it was like pure like Conan like setting him up for like to shine. I'm sorry, no, I mean I think I

guess very real. You did not comeing off at all. I mean I think that this this is someone who means something just so many and means some something to you and so like that's a part of this podcast, babe. I mean it's like you like like letting letting everyone know that Conan Conan is one of my culture is like moments that made me say cultures for me one thousand percent down like Conan like fucking shaped like the way I related to comedy because I was like, oh

my god, who is that writer. That's Miriam Toland. That's fine. I was like I was like getting granular about this about comedy and about how comedy is made like that is huge, Like I was never curious about it until Conan.

I'm sorry, I'm crying. Oh my god, I'm crying. Um you know what's funny too, Like the person that makes me cry obviously Kelly and one of one of I one of my favorite cod ever did earlier in her career was when she was on Conan and she sat down on the chair and she turned to the audience and she goes, this is my favorite show, you guys, And I was like, I love her because I believe it.

And then they had an interview that was so fun and good and I could just tell she felt comfortable and like this one, I was watching everything she ever did, like downloading it truly like a little fact, Like I was like, I need to download everything on my computer. But I remember her interview with him like made me so happy. I think I watched it thousands of times, but I get it because he made people feel good.

He made you feel good, and I honestly like to see him really really get his flowers in this last week, like um, as people like say goodbye to the show, or as it is now anyway, or him as he's been on television pretty much our entire developmental life, you know what I mean, Like it was really special, was really special. It was very cool and um oh my god, of course I'm but intersection of Martin stupid like that is like, oh that's like that, that is like perfect.

That is like every anytime I laugh and something you say, it's because you know how you're being so smart about how stupid you're being that. I know how to sick her. I always know. And that's why I said, my sister needs me in a vulnerable moments. I'll just stay right here, sisters, my sister. We could sit here and we could actually like do a follow up on our Brittany episode and fucking say like say something about that, or we could start I don't think so honey, because mine has to

do with that. Let's just I think the I don't think so honey will sort of jump start the conversation. So I am actually very happy with that. Okay, Okay, that means that we um on this episode everyone readers.

We are moving into I don't Think some one right now, which is our one minute segment where we take something in the pop culture and we just, you know, we let it know the way we feel about it currently and sort of there's been a lot of I don't think so, honey energy in this episode, and you know you can count on that when the sister and I get together after a harsh, long, hard weekend. Um, but I have something to say about about this, yeah, I, and I would really trust I. I want your take

on this more than anybody's. I really do. So this is Mount Rodgers is. I don't think so, honey, And as time starts now, I don't think so honey, Jamie Lynn spears, you need to shut the funk up. I don't care what you have to say, because where where the funk have you been? If you are in her life just as her sister, which you say you are now, like I'm not part of her team, I just part of her life as her sister, and I want what's best for Brittany, Then what where the funk have you been?

Because if she's now saying that she's basically lived as like what she describes as like a slave, basically in a situation she compares to sex trafficking, and you're in it just for your sister, then where a fuck have you been? I don't trust you at all at all? And I don't trust the entire family, and noticed that Brittany said my entire family did nothing. She didn't leave you out of it. And last I checked, she doesn't have another sister, and you publicly are someone that we

associate with her and you're lucky for that. So I don't trust you at all. I don't think so, honey, And you need to shut up unless you have something real to say. That's what I have to say about that, because hearing what Britney Spears had to say for herself

broke my heart in half and in half again. And it's just so fucked up that this person has been so afraid and has felt so like closeted and restricted and tamped down that she had to publicly get on on her Instagram with what I assume had to be like at least a metaphorical gun to her fucking head to say that she's the happiest she's ever been. And now the second she gets some freedom, she says that she cries every day, that she feels like she's so angry.

It's insane that she is an I U d that she won't she won't take out of her body because she's not allowed to because of her conservatorship. Where the funk have you been as her sister, as someone who you claim is only involved in her life and a sisterly capacity. That's not how sisterhood works. That that that that that only when someone steps up and says how much pain therein? Can you also speak to that pain. It's your job. It's your job to be there for her.

If that's what you said you're there for, where the funk have you been? I don't trust to screw at all. So clear about it being her entire family, she like that that that that whole statement was so thorough that she it is it is no mistake that she said, my entire family has has should should take full responsibility for or they have they have inflicted this upon her.

You know, It's like, I don't know if this is the way that you sort of consumed the story, but like I read the text of the statement the day that it came out, and I was just like, holy sh it, and then did not know that the audio was available, And so then I looked at the next day and I was like a true like my blood went cold. I was like, oh my god, oh my god. I mean it's obviously one who has been abused for years.

The lithium thing is the most but I mean, besides the I d besides, like Jamie spears, overall, I'm like the lithium thing because she refused to like do a dance move is fucking crazy. Uh. And first of all, it's like, it's so funny to assume that anyone in that room is going to know better about like what dance moved to do than her. That her punishment for a disagreement or a difference opinion is that she gets put on lithium, which could have and I don't know,

maybe did fuck her up forever. Like, this is so fucked up. You've got someone begging for their life and there's still a conversation about whether or not something's gonna happen. We need to seriously, this is one of those moments where as a society we need to fucking zoom out, because if you zoom out for a second, this is crazy.

It is a human rights issue. It's it's it's and and if there's conservatorships out there that are this abusive, what she says that there are, and I believe that the people involved in them and that are victims of them do not have a platform like this. Then I feel really fucking embarrassed and ashamed that we have a legal system that can't do anything about this. Like it's just this is just crazy because I care a lot, this is I care a lot. It's like this whole

system of conservators ships is is only designed to exploit people. Yeah, and look, I'm doing my I don't think so, honey, based on Jamie Lynn spears, because I don't know something just like about her using her sisterhood with her or as like and you could never understand, so back off. It's like, no, girl, where have you been? Where have you been? We can't understand it on some level, on a deep ish level, because we've heard firsthand from Brittany.

It's like, what are you talking about? We don't understand Brittany has Brittany has related none of that to you, except for say, except by saying my family has fucking destroyed me. That is the latest possible expression of her relationship to you as a sister. Right, And she was also pretty and this it was a pretty long statement and she was pretty specific. I'm pretty sure if she really wanted to exonerate you, she may have and also

not for nothing. But when the most when the most compassionate statement of the weakest from Christina Aguilera, It's like, what the funk is going on? Like I don't trust this family at all? Obviously. Anyone that listens to that statement or read the statement, or is invested in this story at all knows it's messed up. It's just crazy to me that I'm watching the news cover and there's still like a discussion about what's going to happen because

of this legal system. You have someone begging for their life, and it's just like, well I don't understand them, Yeah, I mean I don't. I don't fully have the best legal understanding of this obviously, but like the statement is so explosive that like the judge has to at least like push for some investigative, like close investigative effort here to make sure that like to see to see it to verify these claims. And then from there it's like, no fucking way do you like side with the family?

There's no I mean also, like just the fact of the matter being that he makes money off of her works, she works, and then makes money that they that goes in their bank account based on her efforts and her image and her brands, and then they were able to make decisions for her. It doesn't make sense. Jamie's a

fucking deadbe who like couldn't fucking hack. It is like some like I don't know what even he did, Like I don't from the documentary like what he's she was just trying to like do some grift somewhere and then he came back as soon as Brittey's career was popping off and the night it's like that is it's so pathetic. Oh my god, wait did you watch Wendy and I say that clipp with Wendy Williams, right, I just heard

her talking about this, the whole situation. And then she goes, shame on you, Jamie, Jamie, and Lynn spears shame on you. She goes death to them all and only death to all of them. She was the only death and no, no, and then the audience is like oh and then and then wait do you make she like Wendy realizes and that splits like and then she's gone too far and then she makes a face like oh, like she's like yeah, I said that, and there's like yeah, that's at to

them all. Title of that well, it's very someone someone on Twitter pointing this out and then had lost cultures. They're like, it's very Aaron Jackson energy on last culture dark dark killed them all. I did see them. I did see this tag and I didn't watch. You have to you have to watch it now. Hold on, I'm sending you the link you have. I want to get your real time reaction. Okay, okay, okay, I'm watching rehab that her father forced her into. Was a rehab where

they knew the paparazzi was there every day. How dare you? Mr Spears? You had me fooled? And you too, Mrs Spears? Death to all of them? What? What? To all of them? That? Thank you? Honestly, thank you that's the title of the death exclamation point all of the period. Honestly. That the only levity we need in the whole situation. Call for Jamie and lind Spears to be killed. That is why Wendy will always be number one. She can't do that. And then just look at the audience like y'all know

I'm playing, but also like not really, how dare you? Mr? Spears? And you too, Mrs spears death. So that really is Aaron My god, I killed them all. One is crying again, but this time for Joy, this time for Joy. But I just I would feel remiss if we didn't revisit our our Brittney episode with this, because because honestly, when she came out and said the documentary really made me sad and I wish I every almost stopped talking about me.

I almost felt badly about doing that episode because I was like, maybe we are talking about someone that, like, you know, we don't really know what the situation is. Maybe she didn't speak to it. But no, you know what, sometimes Spade is a full fucking spade. The woman is like like like indentured. It's crazy. I just yeah, I I I can only like follow the story as it keeps developing because it's just like if I spend too much time thinking about like what her like life has been,

I just I can't. It would just destroy me. I can't do it. It's just which is which is which is not? Which is not my way of like ignoring the story obviously, it's just like this is so um. This is one of the great tragedies of show business.

I think one of the and as far as like an individual story goes, like this is this is among the most tragic stories of like of like a performer, someone who like all they wanted to do is entertained being brought down so low that like we as a society have to like think about how we have thought about them over the years, how um, what we can do to help, Like it's it's it's truly I were works. I mean, I think everyone understands that we are living

that we were. We're watching something play out that is like fucking that is like really really like a huge story. I'm not saying anything new to me. It feels it feels like the same kind of cultural conversation we should be having when we were talking about about like you know, like fucking I don't know anything having to do with

Michael Jackson. You know, It's like this is like this is something like that has like such a such a sadness to it that we are that we have to confront um what that means in or like you know, celebrity media diets. Anyway, Absolutely, I mean it was it was surreal to here and obviously hashtag free Brittany as always, and I will say in game show last week. Um, which, by the way, if everyone, if anyone, if anyone came out to game show last week and is coming this Friday.

It's been so exciting to perform again. But the boy's lips sank too stronger by Brittany, and I was just like, this woman hasn't given us so fucking much, like I mean, she's just that song is just so rousing, and like I was just there's just so many millions of people across the world that support her and want her to live a free life. Like it's just anyway, Um, do you have something for I don't think so, honey. This

week I do. I do. Well, that's good to hear. Um, So everyone this on the episode death to them, all all of them, to all of them. That's what it is, death all of them. This is this, we laughly cried, this is bone Yanks never nothing. I don't think so, honey. And as time starts now, I don't think so honey. Ice at parties? Why are you always running out? Why is it always bring ice? Oh my god, we're out of ice, bring ice, and yet and yet we all

it's it is a truth. University Universally acknowledged that if you buy ice, no matter how much I see buy for a party, no matter what size, you're gonna run out of it. What is going on there? What is the witchcraft that is happening? Was it Agatha all along? Probably because the ice keeps disappearing? And I swear to god, I bought five bags of ice from the grocery store to make sure that all of my guests drinks this weekend at my house party were cooled and chilled to

their satisfaction. And no, and still to no avail, even with an hour left for the party to go. My guests had to mix drinks with no ice in them, and I and I wept for their experience because I'm a better host than that, and ice, you will not make me a fool of a host. That's one minute. Why does ice always parties? It's because, well, I first of all, there's many elements famously melts, and so many you know, it's not even that, it's not even that

it melts. It's that no matter how many it goes away, it goes away. I know, I know, I know, I know. So so listen, when when so many people want to drink, they're gonna want ice for that, and so you'd say, you know, you've got a bunch of people at this party, and everyone wants a drink, even if it's not alcoholic. You're needing, gonna know what drink even more even more everyone all around, especially especially on a hot day like that day. And I will say this, I've never I

love the city of New York. I love the city of New York. I have never been more sure than I made the right decision. And this is boring, but I'm telling you, I came back to l A because I have to do a job this week. I'm like, yeah, this is where I live, and fucking thank god. The heat is bad, humidity is bad, it is dark, it is dark sided. And right now that's true. We pray Forrest right now, which is going through an insane heat wave. My hands and more walked to remember, pray to be only.

I will say this to be on the as I know now you're my only. I would say that one of the best songs of all time, one of the most beautiful women of all time, one of the great films. You talking about how stress you are, like sort of getting people on list for parties and getting tickets for parties full on hosted, like a big party at your apartment. Didn't too much. You did too much. And so you

know what bowen boundaries boundaries for next time. I said, next year, maybe you don't even do pride, take yourself on a vacation. I'll go with you. I'm not I'm doing that. I'm like, I'm talking to like people who like have just got on trips, like queer people who are like, oh no, I just I went I went away.

I'm like, yeah, yeah, you did the right thing. Yeah, because there's no there's no Folmo, if you're on vacation, if you're like on a fucking beaches really culture number one hundred and three, there's no if you're on a vacation and you're like beach, it's true. Absolutely, So yeah, that's what we're doing next year. And anyway, I just thank you readers for listening to this whole episode. We Matt and I were working through things in real time.

Our emotions are are little postmortem, as they call it. About pride, I cried about you know, a straight white man who has happened to be very influential to to my life. And some of them are good. Some of them are good. Conan is one of the best ones. I gotta say Conan is one of the best ones. UM. We talked about Brittany, we talked about drag Race, we talked about what we what you said we would talk about actually was the new Jojo Cat album and we

did not talk about that. But quick thoughts. Quick thoughts is okay, just in my thoughts in a nutshell. Doja, I think with this album is officially like she's going for Rihanna status. And what I mean by that is she's going to be like occupying that niche that Rihanna occupied, which is I will come out with hits an album wall to wall of pop hits like every year. Like I do think that Doja like is feeling herself right now where it's like that last album had all bangers.

This album has album as all bangers, and we will be seeing her live performances on every UM Music show because you know she can deliver that. I think Doja is there for ubiquity and I think that, like wal to Wall, this is great. I think she is the maybe like in the in one of the premier pop

girls right now, and I love her problematic. She is she's kind of like creating the new a new pop persona of like we know her to be chaotic, but someone who is like and this is maybe similar to be on it, like, I don't fucking I don't give a fuck, I don't care, uncancellable. You say I'm canceled, I say I'm not. And so um there's I don't know.

I just think this is a very I mean, this is an album where she where I think the statement is I can do it all because I think hot Pink, her last like full like Studio album released was like this is Me, like giving you Dr Luke like bops, and and this time she I think he's only on three. He's only on the three the first three singles, Um, he's only on kiss Me More and need to Know and that one with the Weekend If I don't know what,

I don't know what it's called. You're right, You're right. Yeah. Um. But the rest of the album, which I think and I think there's some great fucking songs on it into it. Yeah, I don't do drugs. Love to Dream is so beautiful, Love to Dreaming, gorgeous song, sound good, No, like She's here to stay and like you know, like we can all I think, but I think this is what we need to come to as like as a community and

as a culture. Like it's okay to say she is fucking nuts and that like her past is like very checkered and questionable. That is not like that is not that is not like a contentious point. That is not that is a moot point in fact, as they call it, like it is it is part of her like persona now that she is like all over the damn place, and like that is maybe like the value, that's the appeal, that's whatever, but like the work stands for itself in

a way, like the work is good. Um. Anyway, I also think this is an interesting conversation that we might need to unpack later on. But like the new, the New Tyler the Creator album excellent. Um. It's also Josh and I were talking about this. Josh Rip and I were talking about this where it's like Tyler is such an interesting person to talk about in terms of like

who owns homophobia? Right, It's like he was on Goblin like saying faggot, faget, faggot like got eminem like like like kind of like tease it out of Eminem again to call him the faggot and like then like kind of brush it off, like Tyler is someone who would and then and then like and then like the ultimate gag was surprised, I'm gay too, Like what absolves what doesn't absolve anything? Who gets to like be homophobic? Now?

It's like really interesting, I think, I think, I think Tyler is like a really interesting study and like what what like a popular artist can do, not can do? But like how they how they like occupy their queerness can they like because like part of the reason why I think Tyler is successful because he's been able to navigate the industry as someone who has not announced that he was queer, but then kind of like come out

like once he was established. It's so interesting. I was I see him as such an such a such a great artist, but someone who is like kind of like in in the way that like we think about doja like but way like did you like bypass a lot of stuff? Not bypass a lot of stuff, but like are you like letting things slide off like in a way that is like confusing to people, like are we confused? And is that helpful? Is that hurtful? I don't know.

There's just a lot there but you but you, you know, Matt and anyone our readers, if you partake um just like smokabolet or honestly drinking tea, listen to it. It's got jazzy lounge. It's like igor but unless of a through line, it's so good you would love it. And I think I mean that. And also before we go, I just wanted to briefly touch on Lil Noex's performance

at the Awards. I mean talk about breaking new fucking ground, and also the trailer for his album being a marvel I loved, I loved, And I'm also like, you know what, like in such a short time, he's amassed all these like images and clips that could come together and this like thing that the entire m c U can like

do as well. And it's like he's he's saying like I'm this big and I'm doing this on this stage, and that was like I would be nervous to do to do what he did on that stage in private sometimes you know what I mean, like talk about like

announcing yourself. And then I've loved the way he's responded to like ha ha l O l by the way fuck you criticism, like by him being like, yeah, you know what, I'm living myself out on stage and finding myself out on stage because you actually, like as a society never allowed me to do this and like I'm finding it and because y'all are too afraid because you don't have an m amazing tweet about this one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I mean just like I just I'm loving it.

I'm loving it, and it's like anyway, it's sort of calls back to what we're talking about before. It's like, no, actually, fuck you, I'm gonna enjoy myself and do this the way that I know how from the heart first out and like from the loins forward. It's so it's so like wait, can I okay, I'm gonna share I'm gonna

share with the readers my my little encounter story. Okay, and I told you this right, I'll recognize it immediately once you started talking about that season finale after party, like he like, he like, I like, he comes, We go up to each other and then he's like he's like, hey, like I can tell you have good energy because we like because we like because we'd like worked with it, because we've done like the Pride so long thing, and like I like, I was like when I was like

in the booth with him, like when he was recording his first um, He's like, I can tell you have

good energy. And I was like, you do too, and then I and then I said to him, I was like and and by the way, I was like, I've never said something like this, but I'm really glad the kids have you, and he was and he like looked at me and he smiled and nodded, and then he was like whatever, and then and then he was like, let me give you my number, and then and then he and then he texted me happy Pride out of nowhere one day, like three weeks ago, and I was like,

happy Pride, Montero. I was such a little like fucking fan. I was like happy Pride. I was. I was just like this. I was like, this person is really fucking smashing ship down in a way that is perfect. And he knows what it's about. He knows where it's coming from, he knows what he's doing, why people are reacting the way they're reacting, and why it's okay that there, and

why it has nothing to do with him. He's like it has everything to do with why with you guys hating each other, like hating yourselves all just because I kissed a dude, you know, and you're still talking about me giving state in the lap chance because you're like fucking you have no like mooring on your own lives, in your own spirituality and your own belief system to like understand why you're mad. Like that's it's beautiful. I love it. And ultimately, maybe everything we've said should we

should just take back. And Pride was excellent after all because that got to take place. I agree that that was worth I mean, Leno Tex doing that made my pride bottom mounts all worth it, all worth it. And here's what I'll say. I love you, And ultimately, like I'm coming back on the first, and I know you'll be you'll be leaving shortly after that, but I'm excited to see you for a few days and I'm happy I got to see you and be there with you

for Pride, and I'm proud of you. It was the great joy of my ear to see you and spend that time with you. Have more time soon, and you better stay tuned readers, because there is some good stuff. There's some coming and some gay stuff coming. Okay, if you can believe that. Whatever. Now, at the top of my I'm giving, so I would name man, and then I lift my mind prayer to be, prayer to be, pray to be. You're my my, oh oh. Well, the

fact that we ended it with that song huge. That's very queer, very clear, happy ride.