Land Of The Creeps Episode 407 : DD 52 Bava's Black Sunday & Sabbath

ROTC presents Black Glove Mysteries with Ian Urza and Greg Amortis. Welcome to Black Glove Mysteries on Land of the Creeps Horror Podcast. Happy New Year, everybody. Oh, yeah. I'm your host, Greg Amortis, along with Ian Erza. What's up, Ian? At last you're here. I've been waiting for you. I need you again. Just a few drops of your blood brought me to life. All of it will give me the strength to accomplish my vengeance. Look into my eyes.

I'm scared. Don't want to look in your eyes, Ian. I love that. That's such a good scene, too. Powerful. What Ian's quoting from tonight is one of the movies that we're going to be reviewing. We're looking at two. We'll call them gothic horror films because that's kind of what they are. And we're looking at 1960, Mario Bava's Black Sunday.

along with 1963's Mario Bava's Black Sabbath. So that's the movies talked about tonight, and I cannot wait to get into these. And Ian, that was such a good quote to start the show off with, brother. I love it. Yeah, I was wondering which Barbara Steele one I was going to do. That was one of the ones I thought of. The other one is the one where they're on the coach and he had said something. I think one of the professors says something about.

the gin he's drinking or something like that, giving him visions. That was the other one I thought of. Well, we got to say, since we're doing this tonight, that Barbara Steele just turned 87 on December 29th. Happy birthday, Barbara. So December 29th, baby. We're recording actually on the last day of 2024. That's right. New Year's Eve. Ian and I are here.

We're getting ready to ring in the new year, but we're going to do this in style with Black Sabbath and Black Sunday. And once again, Barbara Steele, happy birthday, girl. He's still 87 years young, I'm telling you, boy. She literally did the mask and came back. I'm telling you, she did. She's awesome. I love it. So anyways, we're super excited. Once again, happy new year to all of you. Hope that 2025 is going to be such an amazing year for you.

Lots of things that we hope that happens for you happens in great details. And I hope you get everything that you're wishing for and looking for. I hope that happens. I hope LOTC, man, I'm hoping we do great things. I'm looking at. Stuff that we'll do in the future that should be awesome. I can't wait. More jallows and stuff to get into. Ian, for sure. A lot more Italian cinema that is out there for us to tap into. And I know I'm excited about that.

Yeah, for sure. I know I sent you a Christmas gift. I'd love to delve into some of those films eventually too. Yes, I love it. logged it in my my account today so i got it in there put it on the shelf to be ready to watch man can't wait we'll definitely get into that this year uh so so much good stuff to happen man i cannot wait with that said i know we got our top

10 horror movies of 2024 is going to be coming up soon in probably January, early February for LOTC and it's such an amazing year of horror. Did you get a chance to see Nosferatu by any chance? Yeah, I enjoyed it a lot. I think it was a little long, if I'm being honest. I think that there were certain things I didn't love about it. Like, I think there were a lot of scenes where...

There was like this big musical buildup that just kind of led up to nothing, if that makes sense. I think you maybe know what I'm talking about. But there are some flaws with the film, but I... really enjoyed almost everything else about it like I love the way it looked I loved how it was filmed I liked a majority of the performances you know the period aspect was awesome the way

eggers shoots it and makes it i talked about it in my letterbox review how it's almost like a gray film it's not even a black and white film you know like the whole The whole color palette is just gray, except in the scenes where there's natural lighting, like a fire or a lantern or something. And I like how he inverted your typical Dracula story a little bit with the fates of some of the main characters, let's say. Like most...

Dracula films will have certain characters die. This one for the most part actually kept some of them alive until the very end and I liked that. that aspect of it, how it changed things up a little bit from what you typically see in these films. Lily Rose Depp's performance is amazing. She's really captivating, really, really beautiful on screen. And I like how it's a film that.

took place in you know the 1800s or whatever and she's fighting back against you know nosferatu slash dracula which is what he really is wrong with her sexuality which is not something you would think of at the time the you know the setting in which the film takes place that's not something women were allowed to expressed as much back then. And I thought that that was an interesting aspect to it.

Bill Skarsgård looks a lot like George Eastman in Anthropophagus, so I enjoyed that aspect to the design, even if he looked a little bit more mutant to me than vampire, but I was willing to go with it. Yeah, I'm spot on with you on that too. And I think that's the biggest gripe that I've heard is the length of the movie. That seems to be the census for most people.

that are having a little bit of trouble with it is they say it's too long. And man, here's my biggest gripe, Ian, with movies in general. What happened to the 90 minute movies? Like that used to be the norm. Now it's a norm is a two hour movie. And I'm like, it doesn't have to be two hours. Why has it all of a sudden become. Every movie's got to be two hours, especially theatrical. I don't get it. I don't understand it. Do it in an hour and 20 hour and 30 minutes. Be done with it, right?

Yeah, and it can't have anything to do with the amount of money a film makes because the longer the film is... technically speaking, the less money they're going to make because they're going to get less showtimes, especially if the movie's over two and a half hours. You're going to lose showtimes as soon as that happens. A lot of the...

superhero movies unfortunately have set that precedent um i mean i don't know what it is if people are just incapable of telling a story anymore in a certain amount of time I mean, I don't necessarily want my films to be an hour long, but I would like them to be like the sweet spot for me is

somewhere between an hour and 25 minutes and an hour and 35 minutes. An hour and 40 can work as well. But anything beyond that, I think there's probably stuff you could cut out of the film. Now, of course, there are... your occasional epics, your, you know, your saving private Ryan's, your war movies, your period piece dramas that can be three hours long. And you can, that, that is, that is necessary to tell a story. Right. But most movies.

You know, popcorn films, so to speak, horror movies, action films. I don't necessarily understand why they need to be over two hours for sure, but even over an hour and 45 minutes, truthfully. Yeah, I totally agree. And I think that's become a problematic thing in cinema right now. I really do. I think attention spans for most people. A lot of people are on the run. A lot of people are busy.

You start throwing two-hour movies at them, and it does start, I honestly believe it does start hurting the aspect of filmmakers.

getting their movies seen i think people want to see a quick hour and 20 hour 40 minute be done get out go do what they got to do but when you're leaving two two and a half two you know almost three hour movies i mean it does get long it really does uh so maybe something will happen here in 2025 that'll make people start realizing go back to an hour and 35 minutes dude please

But anyways, with that said, I really enjoyed Nosferatu. And if you've already listened to Jay the Dead's new horror movie show podcast that just released, you heard our take on Nosferatu. our ratings and everything so go listen to that over at jay the dad's new horror movie podcast man we had real fun over there man we had nine hosts at one time man it was crazy

Wow. You know, I haven't listened to it yet. I didn't even know it was out. Was it today? Yeah, it just dropped today. Okay, that makes sense because I haven't been on Twitter as much today. I'll have to go and check it out. I'm curious to hear. pretty much everybody involved with the show's thoughts on that. I've been going through some of the recent episodes.

I really enjoyed some of the Nightmare on Elm Street retrospectives so far. I'm up to the Dream Warriors part of it. It was nice to see, or nice to hear, I should say, Ron Martin taking charge on that. I think it's been fun to hear him sort of lead the way on some of those. Agreed. He was definitely molded for that series for sure. Yeah.

go check all that out man there's really good content over there to listen to for sure and uh go check out uh considering the cinema as well dvd infatuation uh new episode just dropped of something from ian let's say from ian from mac myself and uh ian might have one coming up on there but i know i we recorded dave and i recorded uh the french connection months and months ago but uh jay got it released recently so you can go listen to that and uh some good stuff but

I actually still haven't listened to that part of it yet. I did listen to the one that he did, the part he did with Miles on Once Upon a Diamond America, but I still haven't listened to your segment on there yet. I'm curious to see what you think of the French Connection. I mean, with some of the... probably around the time you recorded it you had seen some of the euro crime films as well which were obviously heavily influenced by the french connection if you didn't notice for sure uh

Yeah, so that film, it's got that amazing car chase and some amazing action sequences and an amazing Gene Hackman and Roy Scheider performance, as well as Fernando Rey. I mean, the part with Fernando Rey waves to him. on the train is one of those images that he'll never forget.

That's right. So go head over to Considering the Cinema to check that out, man. So tonight we're going to be talking Black Sunday once again from 1960 and 1963's Black Sabbath, both from Mario Bava, one of them being his director.

editorial debut that we'll be talking and we'll look at that one first which is uh black sunday uh so i think without further ado we'll just jump right into this hopefully your new year's like i said went without a hitch and everybody had a great time and it's 2025 you're already a couple days into the new year and hopefully uh things are looking good for you so heads up And let's get into this episode here. So we're going to go to 1960 Black Sunday. Horror. Anguish.

and terror are powerful words. But more than words, the chill language of living images shows that the mask of Satan is a picture of unparalleled emotion. It turns a tale of a strange, dark fascination set in a spine-chilling atmosphere of fear. It's death I've just seen death She's breathing we're in the presence of some unnatural mystery It is no longer your blood. Spirits of evil have rendered that tie between us forever, and an accursed poison flows in your veins.

the unexpected combined to create an impression beyond any imagination of an indescribable fantasy coupled with an unmentionable reality But it's impossible, Father. He moved. He even spoke to me. Then he ran away. Sometimes Satan, with his capacity for doing evil, even plays tricks with the dead. All right, Ian, take it away with a plot synopsis, my friend. Okay, I actually found this on a Vampix VHS. I thought it was a pretty good, accurate summation, the synopsis of the film.

So Black Sunday, the one day in every century when Satan is allowed to walk freely on Earth as a spike mass of the demon is hammered onto the face of the evil princess Aza. She curses the house of Vida. Vida. Yeah.

Two centuries later, her rotting corpse is still craving the one drop of blood that will revive her demented hatred. Hellraiser, anybody? That I just added, by the way. That's not part of the synopsis. Then two doctors... stumble on her tomb and it isn't long before the night once again echoes with her chilling invitation come to me kiss me you will die but you will know bliss beyond the reach of mortals dot dot dot

Quote, unquote. Based on Nikolai Gogol's short story, The V.I.Y., Black Sunday is one of the most universally acclaimed horror films of all time. With Black Sunday, Italian director Mario Bava claimed the title of Master of Terror and Barbara Steele became... The First Lady of Horror. Boom, boom, boom. And she certainly did. Such a beauty and such a force.

Shortly after this, like an alluring presence on camera. Absolutely. Yeah. Her eyes alone just draws you to just something about them. And, uh, He chose well when he chose Barbara Steele for this character. But first off, man, the movie, I've seen this a few times. And I meant to do this, and I should have already had this pulled up. I know. My wife said, you should do that because I looked up back in the day. Yeah, you and Dave covered this. I remember that. Yes, we covered it on episode 60.

Oh, wow. That was a while back. It was a while back. I've got it somewhere. Oh, here it is. Okay, so episode 67, March 4th, 2014. Dave and I actually sat down and reviewed Black Sunday and Black Sabbath. And I'll let you know if my ratings stay the same as they did back then. But I haven't listened to that episode in... forever so i don't even know what the heck i said back then uh but this is a new take on it uh new viewing and i enjoyed it these were on

Cluedo and Tubi and YouTube. They're everywhere in those avenues, so you can find them readily. I wish I'd have had the Blu-ray. Do you have the Blu-rays on these, Ian? Yeah, I do. We can talk about that more with Black Sabbath. in terms of I probably own one of the worst possible Blu-ray releases of it but

Yeah, I do own both of the Kino. I own Kino releases of these that are both just the English language versions, the AIP versions of it. Okay. Yeah, that was one thing I was going to ask you was about the... Italian, if you had the Italian version or the AIP? Unfortunately, no. With Black Sunday, though, I don't think I've ever seen the Italian version. I assume one does exist and you can find it, but I've only ever seen the American version of Black Sunday. Same. And I don't think now...

Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't think there's much difference, if any, in the actual... No, maybe the music. I don't know. That could be different. That might be the only thing that I can think of, though, that could be different. I can't tell if it sounds too much like an American score or an Italian score. They may have kept the original. store who knows exactly uh but we do know and we'll talk about that i'm sure on black sabbath we'll get to the difference on the italian and

uh, American version. Uh, but once again, back here to this one, I will say cast on this one was phenomenal. I really enjoyed the atmosphere of this movie. It's black and white, uh, set piece, especially the beginning when we're back in the, uh, It's supposed to be set back way in the, what was the exact year? 1630s, it said, in Moldavia. And that's where it starts. And we see...

Barbara Steele's character being persecuted for witchcraft, basically, for worshiping Satan and all these different things, man. She even does that great quote where she's... cursing them and you know towards satan and i love that love that scene but this movie has so much atmosphere and it's insane it's

thick it's really thick with atmospheric uh greatness and that's what i love about this movie not so much it doesn't really to me on the acting and the set and blah blah it's the atmosphere that really makes this one for me but how many times you've seen this and what's your initial thoughts? You know, I'm not entirely sure. Cause I watched this. This is one of the first Italian like horror films that I ever watched. It would have been.

Right around the time I got shut out for the first time, and I think I was 21. I'm now 28, so time flies, I guess. My guess is maybe like my sixth or seventh time watching it, because I know I've watched it quite a bit throughout the years. If I had to make a bold statement on this, I think it's the greatest black and white film ever. It might not be necessarily my favorite film that happens to be black and white, but I think it's the best film to use.

that color compositing uh apparently they had enough of a budget to film in color but bava did not want to and there are certain aspects of this film that probably would not be the same If it were shot in color, like, for example, some of the scenes when you see Yevudich, like when you just when you see him just appear in a doorway or behind a portrait, those are much more impactful and much more scary.

uh in the black and white format i think he's he's pure nightmare fuel in the black and white uh format and without that If it had been in color, I don't think his impact would be quite the same. The way Barbara Steele looks, how luminous she looks throughout this film. And she's not the only actress, by the way, that I think just looks a little bit better in black and white. You know, there are other examples, Marilyn Monroe and Asphalt Jungle.

And in some like it hot is another example where I feel like they, you know, she just looks a little bit better, more luminous and black and white. Like they don't almost don't look human. They look almost too amazing to be human. And Barbara Steele and this film is a. is another example of that. Agree. Man, here it is. They put the mask, and this is historical. This is something that they did do back in the day, right? They take these masks that had the spikes.

and they would press their face in, and oh my gosh, dude, that scene always gets me when I see that in this movie, specifically, because it's the way they do it. They place it, and then they hit it, and you hear the screams, and I'm just screaming in my head going,

God, that would be so painful. I don't know how long it would take you to die. Maybe instantly. Who knows? I don't know. Do you? I don't know. But I know they did this historically in the day. And man, see it in this film. It just really. Oh my gosh, dude. I was like, oh, I always cringe when I see it, but I love it.

Great scene. But then we flash forward and we go from the time period in which the movie takes place, basically, right? Because we've got that intro. But then we move in to... What year is it? It's like... I don't even remember what year it was supposed to be. I should have wrote that down, but I didn't even write it down. But anyways, it goes into current times.

If the original is supposed to be 1630s, you'd say 1830s because I think it says two centuries later. Yeah. So say 1830s or whatever it is. So basically have the carriage. thing going on we got a something happens there where the carriage breaks down and uh the two casts the members there they walk off set and they go do something and that's when we're introduced to the movie and I love it I love it I love it from there oh the young Barbara Steele so beautiful

So, atmospheric-wise, what else did you like on this movie? Characters, too. I know John Richardson we have as Dr. Andres Gorbeck. And he was a good looking man. Yeah, for sure. Apparently him and Barbara Steele did like theater work together before they were acting. And Joe Bob Briggs in his episode on this talked about this, how.

You know, you had to pair Barbara Steele, who was like an impossibly beautiful woman with an impossibly handsome man, which turned out to be John Richardson for a lot of those theater things that they were in together. And, you know, it was coincidental that they just ended up in this movie.

together as far as atmosphere goes all the gothic elements to this i love you know you got your your fireplaces your statues the trap doors all the mausoleums and tombs and stuff and uh you know the the cobwebs and the shadows just everything possible to be um as amazingly gothic as possible is in this yeah and that's one thing that does make this movie is

The castle itself, the different avenues that they go through, like you said, the caves and different things were perfect. The mausoleum, everything looked creepy. It's got that... gothic look which uh mario baba totally crushed it on this one with and it's got to be one of the greatest movies of of especially like you said the black and white era it's got to be one of those greatest movies even into the gothic

horror which is huge it's just hard to beat this one man it just they nailed the atmosphere of it and i keep saying atmosphere like take a shot every time I say that tonight, and you're going to be drunk really quick, but I've got to say it because this is so well done.

I would agree. And Joe Bob had talked about how this film sort of merged the classic horror with the modern horror. And when you think about it, Psycho comes out the same year as this, but Psycho still had to conform a lot to the American Hays Code of the time.

whereas this film obviously did not. I mean, even the AIP release, I know there's some stuff they cut out that's... more intact on the blu-ray they cut out that shot of the mask piercing the guy's face at the beginning and some of the other stuff i can't remember specifically what but if you watch the uncut version of this

basically it was allowed to do more than any horror film at the time. I mean, there's nothing in Psycho that's quite as violent as like the branding of the mark at the beginning of the film and the mask going into the guy's face. Like Psycho shot around a lot of the violence. because Hitchcock still had to do that. You have all those, I'll say, cleavage shots of Barbara Steele throughout the film, which really wasn't present in many films of the time. I mean, it does have a hammer.

or horror influence to it for sure and somewhat a Universal Monsters influence but it still feels more modern than both of those because it was of what it was allowed to do I mean you think about Pretty much every horror movie that comes after this feels... a little bit more unleashed than any film had uh before it even american horror movies like you think about the haunting came out in what 1963 or 1964 so that was just an example of one of the first films

really come after this in america even if that movie could have been influenced by psycho i think this also had its own influence uh whether consciously or subconsciously on films that came afterwards agree i could totally see that Right here, how did you feel like basically Asa, Princess Asa, which is Barbara Steele, right? She dies at the beginning. She puts the curse. And then the two centuries later...

We got this scene where the couple goes in to the crypt where Barbara Steele's body is, and something happens to cause... barbara steel basically to come alive right so did you like was that a good I liked that. I thought it was a perfect way to do it, even though it is in that Barney Fife kind of clumsy way. Like, why did you, you know, of course you had to trip and, you know, cause an accident with a bat fly. Why?

You jackasses. Well, in these viewings, because I watched this movie twice, I watched it on Joe Bob's episode and then independently from it just a few hours ago. And I actually really liked Andrea Chechi. I think it's. his name as Dr. Cruvion. I think he's an interesting character because...

He kind of reminds me a bit of Dr. Chouinard in Hellraiser 2 crossed with, I mean, I'm going to make a more contemporary reference here, Willem Dafoe in the new Nosferatu, where he's this doctor who is... somewhat a mentor and somewhat older to someone but he also seems to have these occult interests in a way like he's he's not quite menacing enough to be Dr. Chouinard in Hellraiser 2 but he's not quite as heroic enough to be Willem Dafoe in the new Nosferatu if that makes sense

And I like that he has this interest in his curse right away as soon as they go into this mausoleum and know what it is. And he pays the price for being too curious. Like he even says to John Richardson as Andre, hey, I want to stick around and look around for a minute. You can go help the coach driver or whatever for a minute, and he ends up paying the price for it by bringing Aza back to life. Exactly.

And then we know where it goes from there. And I love that, dude. I do really like, because you have to bring her back. And she did promise the curse. And then it does come back. And it comes back with a vengeance. I love the story in this one. I think it's a good story. It's a strong one. I think the acting helps it. The atmosphere and the set pieces totally help this movie. The musical score in this is really strong.

I really enjoy that by Roberto Nicolasi. I thought it has a foreboding sound to it that really works. And I think Mario Bava is able to use that in this movie. to a to a good degree and it helps push it and i love that man i love everything about this movie yeah and bava is just so much the master of optical effects and you know, little sets in the foreground. I mean, Joe Bob talked about this. His episode made me understand this even more.

um like for example those those uh coach driving scenes at the beginning they were filming at titanus studio so they couldn't go very far in either direction and basically joe bob was saying how They would film it from above so you couldn't see anything on the ground. And, you know, crew members would come in and just rotate, you know, certain branches around the sides of the coach to make you think it was going way faster than it really was when, in fact, it was barely moving.

So he was just a master at doing these little things to make the film look more authentic than it really was. And we'll get to it in Black Sabbath, but even... Even some of his backgrounds, they look realistic enough. It's so strange how he could film these things with certain colors. And he was professional enough at making these sort of mirrored.

matte paintings look real enough to where they didn't even look like miniatures they actually looked like real sets it does and there is moments where i catch myself thinking wow that is a real tree that it but it's not and i mean a lot of it is fake but no yeah yeah it's crazy how bob and this being his directorial debut i mean he did have that cinematography background so he definitely you know had an eye Man, just to see the beginning of his career right here at filmmaking, right?

at being a director and then where he went from here even just shortly thereafter with his first yellow man it's just wow dude what a career and this is the start dude this is this is it right here and uh it's almost like how do you how do you improve off of this first movie you come out the bank man is crushing a home run

But he done it. He does it throughout his career. Such a talented, talented individual. Well, and Joe Bava talked about the retrospective praise of Bava didn't come until later. A lot of his films would say. well, this movie's good or whatever, but it's no Black Sunday. For a lot of critics and scholars of the time or whatever, he couldn't live up to this film, which I think is pretty ridiculous looking back at that. I mean, this film's amazing, don't get me wrong.

A lot of his films have the same mark of quality that this one does. Agreed. And I don't think – do you feel like with Mario that maybe the time that he come in and then we started seeing the – you know the other individuals popping up in the 70s and uh whether it be uh oh god throw a couple names out i mean he was getting thrown into a bunch

Because 70s hit so hard with the shallow. And then you were getting Argento popping up and all these different ones. I mean, do you think he got kind of maybe pushed back a little bit? Maybe a little bit. I mean, I just think I think people I think around, you know, I don't think his films ever had the popularity that someone like Dario Argento's did in the 70s. I think his influence was felt afterwards.

but it was never given the credit until later on, if that makes sense. It does. And that's why I'm just wondering why, though, because, you know, we look at them now, you know, X amount of years later, and we're looking at them and going, wow, man, these were phenomenal. They were much, I guess, much like John Carpenter's films, flops, you know, so to speak, during the time. So it's just odd to me. I don't know what would cause that.

maybe the period of people that's watching it at that time or whatever i don't know i don't know what would cause it but you know i'm just thankful we're able to watch them now and see it and be like wow uh Maybe it's just at the time. Maybe we just needed it here and maybe not so much there. I don't know. They may have been more successful in Italy, some of them, but some of the ones that AIP kept buying definitely became flops as they went on.

Like Lisa and the Devil for sure did not do particularly well when it was bought by American distributors. This one I think probably did.

maybe the best of all of them i don't exactly know what happened with blood and black lace i don't even know if that i mean i i think that did get an american release but this one i think was the one to set it all up and to influence, you know, what came later with Italian horror becoming a little bit more, you know, more popular in America now, but even some of them back then definitely caught the attention of some people.

specifically the ones who definitely went to go see it. Yeah, for sure. Now, I'm sure the Blu-ray itself, you said it was just the AIP, American, no Italian dub, anything. Okay, cool. I'm curious to know what it would sound like in Italian. I'd struggle. I'd totally struggle. Well, not like you're getting Barbara Steele or John Richardson's voice in this anyway. Exactly. I hate that too. God, I want to. Why? Why?

just let us hear these people talk Barbara Steele is dubbed by Joyce Gordon in this movie who also dubbed Claudia Cardinale in Once Upon a Time in the West oh wow Yep. Who else you got? Uh, that's the only one that I know. Okay. Fair enough. Um,

What else about this movie do you like? I mean, we've talked atmosphere for sure. Acting, I think, was strong in that. Was there anything else that really stood out to you on this one? I like the relationship between the two doctors. It stood out to me more this time.

You know, I like the beginning when, you know, he's all the younger one. Andre's all anxious about trying to get to this conference, this conference that they're trying to go to, this medical conference. And he's like, oh, what if we missed, you know. He's like, you know, and the older one, Crubion, is basically saying like –

Well, when you've been around this business as long as I have or whatever, or in this practice as long as I have, you learn to take some of these conferences with a grain of salt. There's almost like a blasé nature to how Cruvion feels about his profession. compared to Andre, who's this young upstart and seems a bit uptight about everything.

I think that manifests itself well within the film and the paths they end up going on. Not necessarily intentionally, of course, on Crubion's part. I think he's influenced by evil and unfortunately falls victim to it. Right. And even that part.

when they're in the tavern and, you know, Andre's getting drunk and Cruvion's like, oh, you keep drinking, you'll wake up Princess Asa or something like that. There's a lot of funny moments between the two of them. And even towards the end of the film, when Cruvion does fall...

victim to evil you know they're in the same room together and he tells you know i think he has a moment of clarity and he's like he tells andre just get out of here please get out of here um so he even has a he still has a moment where he's able to revert back to being good to tell him to get out of there exactly um the ending of this movie too where

We have, I don't want to call it the switcheroo, I guess that's a spoiler, but anyways, that ending, how did you feel that, did it hit the climax that you was expecting, and did you like the ending of it? Yeah, I mean, I liked it. I liked the, I liked it.

that Andre figures something out at the end involving our cross. And there's like a little twist involving that. Because, you know, there definitely was part of me that genuinely thought that this movie wouldn't end happily. It definitely was leading.

towards that and i think it does end a little bit more happily than than you might expect for part of it it does and i did like because we know in a in a and in a vampiric movie and i'm not necessarily calling this a vampiric movie but you know they they use the cross it's like you know the

the fear, you know, and all these things, the way they pull it off in this movie is really fun. Cause it, it gives you clues cause you're looking and you're like, Oh, and then they pull the cross out and you see them not look at it or they're trying to, okay. Yeah. You're evil. I like that. Uh, the makeup. effects in this movie was really good too some of the aging processes they did uh the holes in the face with barbara steel was awesome loved that and uh

The eyes, there's a scene where her eyes kind of mold into the face, you know, after, because of the curse being lifted and that. So it's just really cool stuff, man. I'm like, damn, Mario, you go boy. I love it. You have the eyelids with the holes in it, and I think this is...

This is before the birds, right? Yes. I think did that. Yeah. So it's, it's kind of cool to see that as well. Yeah, totally. I wonder how many people took inspiration from this movie. I know we know several definitely did. of mario's career in general but i just wonder if this movie really inspired other films

During the time, I'm sure it did, man. Well, Joe Bob was talking about how there are certain sequences filmed in, like, Bram Stoker's Dracula, the Coppola version, that were influenced by scenes in this. The same with The Omen. graveyard scene in the omen is the one he was talking about specifically so it is felt throughout film history the influence of this

uh, for sure. I also, uh, I didn't point it out yet. I really liked the priest that comes in like a little over halfway through this movie. Antonio pure Federici is the priest that comes in with the beard and the hair and everything. I thought it was really cool. Yeah. You almost look like Moses or something. I like that. A fairly large cast, too, honestly, man, for this movie. And it works, man. Prince Vahoply by Ivo Garini.

Man, what a good cast. God dang, I can't say it enough. What a good cast. What a good atmosphere. I love this freaking movie, dude. It's like I want to put it back on, and I've got to own this. I do not own this, and I'm kicking myself for not owning this movie. But I totally need to own it. And maybe I'll make that happen.

i know uh seven or somebody needs to do something to a good i wish someone would come out with revamped blu-rays for both of these unfortunately the one the really good print uh or the really good version of Black Sabbath from Arrow Video is now out of print. I think the initial version of it, which is more a collector's edition from Kino, is now out of print also. Now they just had the AIP version. Same goes for their version of Black Sunday.

this Blu-ray is pretty bare bones. I think it has a trailer on it and the movie and nothing else. Yeah, it's pretty generic. I know it's when you're talking about the Kino. And trust me, listeners, if you go to try to buy this movie, forget it. You go on eBay and they're 60, 70 bucks. Yeah. Yeah. There's no movie for me worth 60, 70 bucks. I don't care what it is. Uh, if you can afford it, Hey, go for it. But, uh, hopefully we can get somebody. I feel like this is a Severn movie.

I feel like that's who would take this. But then maybe not. They haven't done a whole lot of Mario Bava stuff. I... I wonder if Arrow will eventually sort of republish these. They almost seem more like the ones to try to do it if they... if they had such an interest or heck even criterion truth be told i think i think black sunday is on the criterion channel now so who knows maybe they're the one to take an interest in it now that would be awesome because i know it would be handled with care

It would be expensive as hell, but it would be good. But you could get it on the 50% off day. Yeah. Pay regular price once it's 50%. Oh, that's crazy. It's weird that you say, you know, that I say that, but it's the truth. Like all. 50% off and it'll still be $25. Exactly. It's like, dude, you have to wait for the sale just to get it to the price of where typical Severn releases are or whatever.

But hey, they do it a couple of three, four times a year. So there you go. You can bang on it then. But I definitely want somebody to release this in a proper 4K release would be even great. But I'll settle for... blu-ray for sure but i don't know i mean hopefully arrow do that i mean arrow i don't know i don't buy a lot of arrow anymore because it is the the titles they just don't really put out a lot that i'm interested in right now but we'll see maybe something will happen and

near future but uh what else you got on uh black sunday that we haven't talked about or that you want to talk about we'll tackle it apparently barbara steel uh felt these films were a bit beneath her at the time um i think she's still feels that way a little bit now even if she hides it a little bit better apparently she would show up late to set every day um she wanted like a body double for some of the cleavage shots and then she hated the body double so she just ended up doing

She apparently thought Mario Bava, because he was so, you know, he was so technologically advanced, she thought he had some x-ray camera that could take nude pictures of her, which is really funny. And he said to her, you know, if I was able to do that, I wouldn't be making movies. I would be so rich, is what he said to her. Yeah, true.

uh darcy the male girl on joe bob briggs had talked about how she met her once and she seems to be more fond of talking about eight and a half the fellini film that she was in than the horror movies that she was in but then again if she goes to con she must understand that people want to talk to these films and talk to her about these films or this is what she's more well known for so she must have some degree of understanding of it absolutely I know back in

in 2011-ish, 10, 11, something around in there. I know I went to New Jersey up to Monster Mania. And I went with Kenny Caperton from Myers House NC. And that was during the first time John Carpenter. I'm pretty sure that was the convention. Yeah, it was the John Carpenter convention. And anyways, but Barbara Steele was there. julian sands were there her and julian were side by side and she's very

At that time, and this has been X amount of years later, she has such an aura about her, right? Very regal, very royal. So I almost, and I didn't go up to get her autograph because I couldn't afford at the time. So I was very limited, but I almost felt nervous to even walk up to her because she had a presence about her that made me feel like.

she was almost like a queen or something and I know it's odd to say but she just had that presence about her I listened to her talk a little bit she was very regal when she talked and a little bit standoffish not gonna lie but I mean at the time

You know, whatever. But I would think that she should be appreciative because Black Sunday definitely put her on the map. I mean, what did she have done before that? Black Sunday definitely helped her along the way with pitting a pendulum and different things. So, yeah. I'm sure she hears it all the time, Ian. Definitely.

I don't know if she does conventions much anymore, but I know back in the day she is. There were two different ones she was supposed to be at, Monster Mania one specifically, in the same place she went to that she had to cancel, unfortunately, and I assume at this point they're probably not.

going to try to bring her back again right i'm fingers crossed maybe i'll be able to meet her at chiller theater who knows if she manages to make it across the pond yeah again i'm really hoping it would be awesome but Yeah, unfortunately, I may have got, I mean, you know, I'm only 28, but I do wish I had gotten into these things just a bit sooner. Who knows?

I wasn't raised on horror movies. I had to discover that kind of stuff for myself. So I wish I had gotten into it a little sooner. There may have been a few people that I would have gotten to meet. Otherwise, George Romero specifically, I know I probably would have gotten a chance to meet.

meet if i had gotten into it a little sooner for sure so uh unfortunately uh it's just the way it goes but i've met so many people that others haven't so yeah uh it's it's been awesome discovering conventions and my love for horror movies throughout the years

Absolutely. So if you get to see Barbara still anytime soon at a convention, man, definitely give her her praise, man. She's such a talented actress, and I'm not trying to smack shade her way at all. She deserves all the... respect that she gets and uh such a talent and beauty she was so freaking gorgeous and she was

probably 70 plus and looked amazing man like she she definitely her and julian sands and god rest his soul man both of them sitting beside i kept looking over at them because the room that they were in felissa rose was in there I remember the guy that played Dr. Satan.

uh with a house of a thousand corpse i was over talking to him and herschel lewis and i'm looking over at her i could not quit looking at her and julian sands and just thinking wow there's royalty over there was that the same one where they put John Carpenter next to Aaron Gray or something. Yes, that was the one. It was odd, dude. I felt so bad for Aaron Gray. Yeah, it's...

You just, that's not good balance. No. Let's just put it that way. No. I mean, I was at one back in September. Not that I want to go off on a massive tangent about this, so I'll make this quick. But they put James Jude Courtney.

Next to why am I blanking on it? Shawnee Smith. Yeah. And Shawnee had just a way longer line. But James, James seemed pretty OK with it because I remember being in line and I looked at James at one point and he just smiled at me and winked at me. So. seem to have a problem with the fact that there was really no one going up to see him and he was right next to johnny smith but yeah it was just one of those weird balancing where sometimes cons don't always get that right

Yeah, they don't. George Romero was sitting in one line and where they had him right beside him was Flyboy and a couple other people. Popular characters from Dawn of the Dead and different. mood don't get me wrong but they're not george romero right everybody was going to see george romero and it's like okay let's make a v-line but uh yeah that's that's horrors of convention i guess but

Black Sunday, man. I'll say if you ain't got nothing else, it's 87 minutes long. Once again, music by Roberto Nicolasi. We got the, let's see. who did the cinematography for that one i should know this and i don't know who did the cinematography i don't even see it on wikipedia wow Well, we'll make it up. It was me. Ah! And you'll believe it. I would be too surprised if Mario Bava is just a credited cinematographer, but yeah, I don't see it either.

I wonder if it's on my Blu-ray. I'll check that real quick. No, it's not. Yeah. Well, whoever did the Cinematography done great. It probably was Mario. I mean, let's just be real. It was probably just Mario Bava, even if someone else has a credit. That's right. One thing I had to add before we get to ratings. So John Richardson, we have seen him before. Do you remember which movies? I should. I don't. I honestly don't. Not without.

cheating and clicking on them uh it's been a little while but we saw him in murder obsession i think he played like the butler or the groundskeeper in that movie right but more importantly we saw him in torso and uh if anyone doesn't want to hear spoilers for torso you can skip ahead five seconds i'm giving you five four three two one but he played the killer in torso yeah Duh. I'm sitting here like, I should have known that and remembered that.

Oh, John Richardson, you beastly man. One million years BC. There you go. Well, and that was the thing is they always put him, you know, they always, you know, had him be the co-star. Right. these really beautiful women, whether it was Raquel Welch in that movie or Ursula Andress in She.

That's right. At one point, he was rumored to be James Bond, which that would have been interesting. Yeah. He was also in that Carl Shine's Frankenstein 80. I think Cauldron was the one that released that, I believe, that I got. Oh, interesting. Yeah, I mean, he was always around these genre films because I think that that was a big part of the work he could get. Yeah, totally. All righty. Well, what kind of rating are you giving on Black Sunday? It's a 10.

and ian said 10 and easily yeah did i give that i'm pretty sure i gave that a 10 as well because that's what i'm giving it right now but let me let me go back on that show note again and i'll see what i rated that with dave back in the day and i'll do that for uh both these movies so everybody will know exactly so yep dave and both of i gave it a 10 back in the day and that's what it still stayed so 10 for me

Bam, 10 for Ian. Cool. All right, so now let's go ahead and move into three years later, and we're going to go to 1963's movie, Black Sabbath. Do you believe in ghosts? This is the night when fear and horror walk hand in hand. This is Black Sabbath. starring the incomparable Boris Karloff, the personable Mark Damon, and lush and lovely women, even though one is from the Netherworld, a vampire, a burdelac.

Black Sabbath, as ancient as superstition, as modern as the telephone. How nice you look with that towel around you. You always did have a beautiful body. Who are you? Who? Black Sabbath. The bare truth about the unbelievable, such as... The brilliant beauty of a priceless jewel that holds within the body of a buzzing fly a vengeful woman's murderous spirit. Only on the seventh night of the seventh full moon can the living see the lifeless undead. I am hungry. Is he man? Thank you.

an adventure into black magic that goes beyond the boundaries of the supernatural. And a man's devoted love is welcomed by a woman's deadly lust for his blood. And Ian will let you go ahead and take it away with the plot synopsis. Okay, so I'm just taking this from the Kino Blu-ray. One of the great horror anthology films of all time and Mario Bava's personal favorite of his works, Black Sabbath solidified the director's reputation as Europe's maestro of the macabre.

In The Telephone, a woman is haunted by menacing phone calls from a former lover. Vertilox stars Boris Karloff, the Crimson Called, as a vampire hunter whose family is stalked. By the wandering spirit of an undead ghoul, a drop of water involves a nurse who steals a ring from a corpse, not realizing that the curse is carried with it. This is the AIP language version of the Mario Bava horror classic.

Featuring an international cast that includes Michelle Mercier and Mark Damon. There you go. So Black Sabbath. First thing we need to mention on this one is Black Sabbath is... This is where freaking Black Sabbath got their name, the band. Ozzy Osbourne, the band. And I read the story on that. Did you read the story on how they came about their name on this? It was something like they were doing a show and everyone was in line to see this movie across the street or something instead.

Yes, they were originally called Earth, of all things. What a name. It's not a bad name. It's not a bad name. For their type of music, even, too, it kind of makes sense. Yeah. It's like hearing...

Instead, let's just put it in there. Instead of it being Black Sabbath, we're going to hear him say Earth. Earth with Ozzy Osbourne as the lead singer. No, no. black sabbath is totally where it was at and i love that so it's crazy so we can get we can give 1963 mario baba's black sabbath credit for giving us black sabbath the band name yeah just let me let me do this for a sec uh what is it uh Figure in black, which point said me. Oh, no.

That's the Black Sabbath by Black Sabbath from the album Black Sabbath. There you go. All right. So let's get into Black Sabbath. This is an anthology. Well, I guess you wouldn't call it anthology. It's only three. So what would you call that? I'm going to still call it anthology. I don't care what you call it. It's three short stories in a movie. And we open up with the great Boris Karloff giving the introductions. And I love that he's in.

The segments. Which version did you watch out of curiosity? I watched the... Clearly the American version, which was on Pluto. We're going to talk about this. There are some differences. And the American version opens on a drop of water. The Italian version actually closes on that. And that is something that.

I really want the listeners to know that there are two different versions, and I do need to see the Italian version. And his segments introducing each one are different. Right. I've never actually seen the Italian version.

just know of the differences because of reading about them and because of tim lucas's commentary um thank god for his commentary actually because he did a very very good job pointing out even the subtle differences between the two when we get to the telephone there's gonna to be a lot that i have to talk about yeah that one in particular uh is the one i think has the most difference clearly the american version was going for a different style

for whatever reason i enjoy it it's it's an okay it's the weakest of the three stories we got but it's still a really good maybe even quote this ian maybe one of the first jallows we've ever seen The telephone is, yes. Yeah, so there you go. So, bam. But we have these three short stories, and I'm going to talk the AIP version.

I'm going to talk the American version because that's the one I watched. We had the Boris Karloff introductions and we had it throughout each story. And then we have him starring in the third story in this one as well. So the three short stories, the first one opens up.

uh which is so creepy man i just really enjoy this first one and it's the story of the woman who has passed right this uh woman has passed and this girl called or the maid calls in a woman to come in and help fix her up and she ends up stealing an item off of her which causes a lot of crap to take place a flying fly of all things this is one of the creepiest segments ever dude like The face of this individual laying in the bed is haunting.

It's so freaking creepy, man. And there's this eyes, the grin on the face or whatever you want to call it. The terror of the face is so horrifying. And then there's a scene where. Woman closes the eyes and turns around his back again. Holy crap, Ian. Does that not freak you out? It's so uncanny. It's like such a weird...

It looks so real, even though you know it's not, that it's just really freaky. I can't think of a better way to describe it. When I saw it, because this was actually my first time watching this, even though I knew what this looked like already from... Some... Other things like Shudder's 101 Scariest Horror Movie Moments. Shout out to that program. You know, Eugenio Baba designed it. So Mario Baba's father, and he sculpted it, but it just...

it looks more real than any fake face with eyes that you've ever seen. Like it looks way better than any CGI creation I could think of. Like anytime CGI has tried to make someone look real. like whether it was Peter Cushing's likeness in Rogue One or more recently Ian Holm's likeness in Alien Romulus, which...

truth be told, look kind of bad. It looks way better than that. This is what those films should have done, although unfortunately Eugenio Bava is not around to grace us with such a realistic looking human face. Exactly. Now, the first segment is called La Gossier d'Aqua, which is equivalent to Drop of Water, correct? I think it's called the Drop of Water.

yeah and uh so that's what the segment is called and what happens is is like i said the woman is called in to uh basically dress this this corpse up to uh because she's passed so uh she does this and by doing that she notices a ring and that ring uh draws her attention so she grabs the ring off her finger and instantly a fly shows up and then we start hearing this echoing of water everywhere

she goes and it's a very creepy I don't want to say scary but it is to an extent it's just a very eerie creepy segment that you just constantly are haunted by these uh, sounds by these noises, by the fly, by just everything. And it's all because of this freaking ring. And she, why did she take the freaking ring? You dummy. Well, I mean, it is a powerful story about greed, like, you know, karma and that kind of thing comes back to bite you.

You know, I can't think of a better way of putting it. But I thought that that was interesting because it doesn't really have any religious or mythological significance. It's just purely. uh greed and and an artifact right uh we got the character of jacqueline perot who plays helen chester and then we have millie playing the maid

You do have the neighbor come in, Harriet Median playing the neighbor. And that's pretty much it with Inspector Gustafio DiNardo. I like this segment, man, the water drip. I just think it's... To me, it's the creepiest and the scariest of the three segments, for sure. And I think a lot of it deals with that person, that body, just laying there. And then what happens after that, just the ambience of...

the noises and the different things going on in this woman's head, man, it's just frightening to me. Yeah. I mean the way, the way it kind of starts out and then she goes, you know, to the house and then. You know, she sees the body, but then when she comes home, it becomes much more of basically a really atmospheric, supernatural horror event.

As it goes on, it just gets weirder and weirder and scary and scarier and more nightmarish. This whole thing feels like such a weird quick nightmare, and I think that's what I enjoy about it the most. And like there's part of there's even like a supernatural thing where is the fly like the reincarnated, you know, the reincarnation of the dead body? That's one thing I was thinking about while watching it.

Right. That's kind of what I was thinking too, man, because it didn't happen until the ring came off. And as soon as the ring came off, fly shows up, right? And that fly flies to right where the ring finger was. And I'm thinking like, okay, no way is this. I don't know. I don't know if it was a curse laid upon this ring for somebody taking it. It could be very well.

reincarnation that could definitely played into it it's just odd man it's just the way it shows up and then the moments of her trying to swat this fly away is hilarious

You see her trying to swat it, and you're like, what are you doing? Why are you trying to swat this? Laughing my ass off, man, but good stuff. And I do want to mention, in the Italian version, supposedly the telephone's the first segment, and then we get the word lock, which... is the vampiric one and then this one would have been the last one

The telephone is a better one to start with because that starts so quickly and just has a consistent pacing throughout. This one would have been a better one to close on. I mean, AIP, we'll talk about more in the telephone, how they kind of screwed.

this up but it's it's bad economical storytelling to start with the shortest one and instead of ending with the shortest one first of all but i think they were thinking well we know this is obviously the best one because let's be let's be real it is the best one it is um by starting with that one i think that that's what they were thinking true true uh then we have from here the way the story takes place is the ending of this one really good it is like you said really short

I don't remember how long this segment took. It didn't take long. It was, what, 10, 15 minutes it felt like. It didn't feel very long. But it was powerful. It was enough that it was creepy. and scary, and eerie, and just all those bundled into one. So I was excited. I was like, all right, cool. I remembered this one. I'd seen it a few times before, and I really was excited to go back and see it again. See in the face.

is just worth gold listeners i'm telling you once you see it you can't unsee it it's just there and it will haunt you in your nightmares you're gonna see this smiling creature face looking at you man so good well and there's something involving let's say a moving doll um and that obviously influenced things

for years to come. I mean, it probably influenced Dario Argento for a certain scene in Deep Red. Probably influenced James Wan when he made the Saw films, or at least, well, the first one. That's the only one James Wan made. But I think you know.

exactly what i'm talking about agree yeah i do i know exactly so even even billy the puppet billy the puppet how real that thing looks kind of reminds me of the way this human body looks and because it's it's human it's even more scarier because you know you know billy the puppet is just a puppet it's not a living thing but it still looks really weird and creepy whereas this is an actual human being looking that good.

Sure. Yeah, that's right. I didn't even think about that. Looking at real. Yeah, exactly. Not good. Looking dead. Not by any measure does it look good. Not what I describe anyway is good. There you go. That's right. Yeah, and also... Bava does such a great job with the green and purple strobe lights. It's just beautiful to see every time. Oh, this screamed 60s. This screamed that era of hippiness and everything. I just like that. It just really. The room that they're in is very 60-ish.

and it just nailed it i'm just like oh man it's just felt like going into a time machine and going back to 1963 and just getting inside the goodness of of what it was like to be in that era i'm sure and this one definitely hit that with that It's got a great ominous ending. I mean, I won't spoil anything directly, but I'll just say you have a feeling that this cycle could go on and on involving this ring because of the way it ends. Right. Exactly.

So we got that segment and it was great. Enjoyed it. So super awesome. And then we move into the second segment, which I think is where a lot of time will be spent on the differences for sure. And I'm curious to hear Ian. And how much I hated this ending. Right. Yeah. Especially in the American version. Exactly. Gosh, did this ending let me down? I got to say, I really like the story for the most part. Then in the American version specifically, a reveal happens.

kind of toward the end not not at the very end i'm talking something that happened sort of in the last part of it that i didn't necessarily enjoy in the american version and then the very ending in the american version I just didn't like it. I got to be honest with you about that. We're going to do a spoiler section. I think we have to on this part. We won't do it right now, but I think we'll let the audience know when we're going to do it toward the end.

There you go. So the telephone, you got Rosie. And this one right here starred, the character Rosie was played by Michelle Mercier. Very attractive. Very, very attractive young lady. And her character is basically a, she's a call girl. She's, she's.

we'll call it for better term a prostitute this one the american version doesn't really lay into that that well and i think the italian version supposedly shows a little bit more into that with the well i think they still had to go they had to conform to the Hays Code. We talked about the Hays Code a little bit earlier when I was mentioning Psycho and how that had to conform to it at least a little bit. The Hays Code is really stupid to me. I've always found it really stupid. I understand

that it went along with the morals of the times and the censorship of the times. Some filmmakers were very good at still putting their... subtext in around the Hays Code Alfred Hitchcock was especially good at it especially when he made a film like Shadow of the Doubt where he makes it very obvious that there's

a weird relationship between joseph cotton and theresa wright's characters as uh uncle and niece when he can't show it but it's obviously there with the way those two characters are talking to each other And he did a good job with it. Most people could do a good job with it. But some, I think AIP in this was like, you can't do anything with a lesbian relationship.

And you can't do anything with showing that this woman's a prostitute. You just can't do it. Now, there are vague parts of this where it still comes across like the way. I think it's Mary, right? Who's the friend? Yes. It comes in and there's a part where she's like twirling and, you know, stroking Rosie's hair. So there's there's hints at it, but it's never said. And I think it's a problem to me.

you know cut out the prostitution fine i don't really care what rosie is supposed to be her occupation that doesn't really bother me right you can still do the story with cutting that out but their relationship I think is a little bit more integral to what the story is trying to be and getting rid of that I think

is not good it doesn't it it makes it's a cop-out it does to me it does it becomes problematic for sure uh i did like the setup though where she's coming in and you can and here's the thing It was 1963, right? And I kept telling Pearl through the whole thing, unhook the phone. That's all you got to do. Take the phone off the hook. Whatever. This phone keeps ringing. She answers it a few times and nobody's there. And then all of a sudden.

we get the voice right and explains what she's wearing you know and all these different things so cliche to an extent not cliche still it worked for for a little bit she was very attractive we get to see her do these scenes even a moment where she goes in and gets undressed and you think you're going to get some scenes of nudity and everything you don't get it in this one this is not what this film's about and we see these moments where she's

getting creeped out because this caller keeps becoming more obsessive right becomes a little bit more forceful and everything and she's starting to really aggressive yeah aggressive exactly it's that gradual at first it's like ha i know what you're wearing ha don't do that ha see you and then it becomes a little bit more like you know i'm gonna basically kill you and these different things

So it does become, and you watch her unraveling. And I liked that aspect. I thought that was good, but I felt like they just really didn't catch the atmosphere that this movie segment really deserved. And I really want to see the Italian version because I really want to know what they gave us because I really feel like they would have nailed.

uh the italians were able to capture a little more stuff that would give us a little bit more umph in this segment this one just lacked that it just really didn't have the the the punch that I was looking for. It was still good. It was manageable. It just wasn't equal enough to what we had just saw in the first segment. And then we get this one, which is a totally different story.

totally off cuff and you're like wow what are we watching okay let's go here and then we get that ending that i'm with you dude it was just like really

Early on, even if I didn't like the way it ended up going, the phone calls were good. They were creepy. There was some good suspense there. And watching this segment... showed me once and for all that Wes Craven had to have seen, liked, and been influenced by some of Mario Baba's films because this is... the opening of scream yes for sure you know 35 years before yes

What's your favorite movie? Oh, this is totally that dude. Yes. Well, and I talked about how in blood and black lace, and again, just a quick. spoiler alert for both blood and black lace, which is more important because I'm sure there are some people who haven't seen that. uh a spoiler for scream to uh scream scream no i shouldn't say scream 2 i mean scream 1996

If you haven't seen Scream, I don't know why in the hell you're listening to this. I mean, all the more power to you. Listen to us no matter what, but if you haven't seen Scream, I'd be a little surprised. But spoiler alert for both of those films, Blood and Black Lace had the thing where there's two killers at the end, right? And it had the whole thing with the police holding everybody at the police station.

And someone gets killed while everyone's at the police station. All the suspects are there. I think Wes Craven was influenced by that. And I think he was influenced. There's a scene in Bay of Blood where the killer chases someone down with a knife. And it's very similar to how Drew Barrymore gets chased down in the opening of screams. So I really. think Wes Craven.

liked Mario Bava's films. I've never really heard him talk about it, interestingly enough. Maybe he did at one point that I don't know of, but I do think he was influenced by some of the sequences in his films. I totally agree. And I think anybody watching this will back you on that, dude, no doubt. So the ending of it, a little bit wonky.

i like the set i like the we're in one room right we're in a enclosed area and we're just following this woman around with the phone call and then we had the friend come over and then we're introduced to the character frank and uh frank well whatever so we got frank and he is uh what was uh milo quesada quesada played frank there you go so

Yeah, and Lydia Alfonsi, her performance as Mary, some of the look she's giving and her mannerisms make a lot more sense in the Italian version than they do in the American version. I will say that much. Yeah, because you're going to be off on this if you're watching what most of us will watch, which is the AIP version, because they just really didn't go into the full effect of this movie the way that...

I feel like the Italian would have with the lesbianism and the different things going on with the pimp and different stuff. So you just get kind of a... watered-down version, in my opinion, on the telephone. Yeah, I wish the American version had ended just completely differently. In the Italian version, I'm actually fairly okay with how it ended.

But in the American version, I wish they had done something different altogether. Yeah. So let's do a spoiler right here. Spoiler now. Okay, so you've been warned. Skip ahead a couple minutes here. So with that said, like...

How would you have rather the ending have took place if you were doing this movie? In the American version, I actually would have liked it more because they don't ever tell you... that mary is the the person behind the voice right right so i wish they would have just gotten rid of the whole frank thing entirely because to me it comes out of nowhere And it's really stupid in the American version. I wish they would have had it.

Whereas with Mary just like poisoning her at the end or something, I think Mary being the killer would have been even better in the American version if they had done it that way. I totally agree. And I think that's where I feel like they missed it too. I think they should have went to the subtleties in her.

performance would have been rewarded even more in that version if that were how they would have done it there are a lot of you know small differences like for example there's a part where she's writing on the notepad and the note is actually her revealing that she's been the one on the phone calls all along um and then there's a part um i think

There's a part when Rosie looks at something, looks at like a note, and it's actually the newspaper in the Italian version saying that Frank has escaped, which Tim Lucas, in his commentary... The Italian version, the only thing that didn't really make sense to me in the Italian version... was where was why frank was taking so long to do what he was doing if it was going along with the phone calls him having just escape actually made more sense with those newspaper clippings

And Rosie says something about Mary, I should say, knows something about it in the Italian version saying, oh, I know he escaped because I saw the newspaper. So that was one thing Tim Lucas addressed. which was my only issue with the way the Italian version went. Also, there's a scene where you actually, it cuts back to Mary on the phone.

in the italian version which is something they cut out entirely um at one point showing that she's guilty um similar to something like vertigo where at a certain point you know um kim novak's character is is guilty replaying the events through her perspective. So... I kind of like that in the Italian version that you do get that one scene. The scene with the neighbor, which is in the American version, is cut out entirely in the Italian version.

I think AIP for whatever reason was afraid to show the relationship between the two. And as a result, you just get too much of a compromise with her. with um mary not being guilty of anything at all and i don't particularly like that i think it makes her character kind of useless truth be told and in the american version If it's supposed to be Frank the whole time, because it kind of implies it is on the cell phone calls.

Why the hell doesn't he just attack her right away? Right. It doesn't make any sense. Why torment her and mess around with her? It doesn't make any sense at all. Yeah. It totally didn't. Yeah. So there you go. We'll end those spoiler section right there. But overall, the telephone, weak. It was good but weak. Yeah. I think had I watched the Italian version, my rating for it would probably be closer to like...

an eight, maybe a nine. I haven't actually seen it. I want to see how it actually gels together. But just knowing the differences, I think my rating would have been higher with the American version. My rating would probably be like a six. Yes. kind of in there about a six five uh or so on the telephone for sure and the first one being like a

I would go with as far as to say a 10 for the water drop, man. And that was just perfect early on. The intensity was good and it held my attention enough until some of the reveals happen and the ending. Yeah. So then we'd go to the third and final act of this movie and it's called the Word-A-Lock. And the Word-A-Lock is the longest segment.

And this one is starring Boris Karloff himself, and he's playing a very vampiric play. That's fuller, but who cares? When he shows up at one point, I... did a double take because I knew he did some of the intros for this and the transitions, but I didn't know he was actually in a segment.

so when i saw him i was like what like i didn't even i didn't even know he was actually in it until i saw him right that's crazy that's awesome though because i keep forgetting this is your first time watching yeah yeah that's awesome so 19th century We got Serbia. We got the Vladimir character. We're introduced to Boris Karloff's character showing up and their lack of term, you know, something's happened to them.

and well first of all we got the dagger we should say the sword or whatever we got the individual coming up with the sword in the back right and the guy gets the sword and brings it back to the uh individual and he's like that's that was my family's

sword wherever you can see where it was supposed to be on the wall it had been took off and everything so we already got hint that somebody who was stabbed was part of that you know that knife belonged to somebody or that sword i keep saying knife it's a sword And then we fast forward and we got the people outside and then Mr. Vladimir, the main guy shows up, which is Boris Karloff. Loved it. Loved it. Loved it. This, this episode is very.

or this segment is very uh it's a vampire story so we basically have somebody who is able to turn individuals. We got some turning going on. And then we got plight between individuals who are torn, like this is my family, you know, let me let them in because they're... they're clearly here but no don't let them in because they're not who they are you know and and it's that fight between reality and and

and just being in love with somebody and saying i need them back you know so it's a really good story it's it's just a really strong story i still prefer the drop of the water more than the Wardleac, but still the Wardleac is really good, Ian. Yeah. And to what you were saying, the Verti-Loc is vampiric in nature, but it's its own folklore. It's almost like the difference between Santa Claus and Krampus or Santa Claus and Sinterklaas or something.

right right that's that's what it's that's what it's like I like the period aspect of it because it takes place a little further back in time than either of our other two segments. So I really like the costuming. The color was different. It still had... some of those strobe lights and shadows that Baba loves, especially towards the end. Um, you get the, you know, the blue and the purple and the green a lot more at the end when they go to this sort of, um,

this sort of crypt or mausoleum. But it also had a very brown color palette. And you get that, you know, the whole tavern or inn that Mark Damon shows up at. Karloff is so good in his performance. I mean, this is the segment you should watch in English because you get his voice in it. Yes. More so than the other two especially. I think the other two you could...

The Drop of Water, you could be fine watching it either way. Telephone, you definitely want to watch the Italian version. This one, you want to watch the English version, mainly for Karloff's voice. And Karloff was always so good at... You know, he was so good at seeming sympathetic even when he was evil. Like in this, he shows up and you know something's not right with him immediately. But yet you still believe him just long enough. Like especially the part when he goes.

up to the grandson is being all friendly with them like you think he's being genuine about not being a vampire but you just know something's up and of course as soon as everyone goes to sleep yeah um later in the night uh you know the the jig is up at that point yes you figure it out right away And I even so there's something about in this movie where people get beheaded. Right. Right. Something about that. I almost had wondered if he was actually beheaded.

and his head was put back on or something because his face looks so gone and pale and everything. I almost wondered if his head was severed and put back on. That was a theory I had while watching it. Well, there was a scene early in the segment. where they did hang a head on a stake that looked like his head. I'm assuming it was his head.

It could have been. It really looked like it. Even his own family, for whatever reason, believes him, even though they know this legend and know the time has passed because it's supposed to be, what, 10 o'clock at night that he's supposed to show up and he doesn't.

Even they're convinced just enough. And I think it's all down to his performance where he's so good at... being you know so good at turning evil when he has to even though you believe him early on just for a second there even though you know something's wrong exactly We have Susie Anderson playing Sinka. Sinka? I think how they said it's Sinka.

is how they were saying it. Zvenka, maybe, something like that. I think it was pronounced like Zvenka, but it's S-D-E-N-K-A. Susie Anderson, very attractive. Very, like, Slavic. spelling and pronunciation yes uh maria who is the mother of the little boy the young boy now what an attractive and pearl and i kept saying her name's rica dialana And we kept saying, like, she looked so familiar. And I don't know what it was, but it was nothing we had seen her in. I went through her filmography.

She had not been anything that I knew of. So it wasn't that, but she just had a face of somebody I felt like we had seen in a, maybe in an Italian giallo or something. Regardless, we were like, wow, you know, she looks very familiar and it kind of helped the movie. you in a way i'll be honest i love that scene where she gets all um emotional about

you know, her son having to be beheaded or, you know, his body having to be defied. I thought that that was really good acting. Absolutely. Absolutely. And there is some strong performances in this one. Vladimir character played with Mark Damon. great character. So this really... well told it's very well acted the set pieces i did agree with was really cool man it looked going back in time like that was fun it's just it's a fun piece now i did read somewhere on

not to throw anything, but on the word light, the character of Maria, once again, Rika, that she was a, did you read about her any, her history as far as in real life history? I know I did not. Well, she was a beauty. uh, pageant winner. Yeah. But she was not able. They had basically, what had happened was that she was not able to come to the U S or whatever, but she was. Something had happened where she was doing some illustrations for a communist book or whatever. So she was not allowed.

to come because of those things but she eventually i think she married or came over here had a child or something but eventually came over to us but but anyways there was something with the communist party and different things that made her not be able to come during that time but regardless. I mean, she was very talented and I did really enjoy this character. Yeah. And it's unfortunate, you know, political leanings and all that are still impacting things today. And I don't care.

I don't really care which side people are on like, James Woods is a known Trump supporter and he's obviously he's not in as much stuff anymore. And I like James Woods as an actor. I don't really care what he does as a person. I want to see him in more movies. And, you know, on the other side of things, Melissa Barrera was. from Scream 7 for voicing her support of Palestine and Palestinians. And I think that that kind of stuff is still really disappointing that we still have that.

nowadays right right just let people be who they are yeah and This segment right here is just really good, man. It's got some good sequences in it, and I really enjoy it. I think this is a strong one. I was okay with the ending with this one with the longer segment, but I would have certainly had flipped it. I would have totally had done. you know, the drop of water lasts specifically for me because it would have left a much more impactful with seeing that, that.

face and that body and leaving that as your ending holy crap dude nightmare fuel i'm telling you well so if you wanted to go Time period by time period, you would have started with this one, then gone the drop of water and then done the telephone last. But for pacing purposes and for economical storytelling purposes.

That wouldn't have made sense. I would have started with the telephone because of the pacing of it. I would have gone this in the middle because it's the longest one. And then I would have gone the drop of water last, like you said, for the purpose of saving. what is probably going to be the last, you know, the best one for last. Sure. Absolutely. Uh, what else you got on this one? And, uh, we'll start wrapping this one up. I know musically wise we have the same.

uh direction as far as the music that we had in black Sunday. So we got Roberto Nicolasi who took care of that. And we know Obaldo Terzano did the cinematography. So we got a cinematographer named on this one. Oh, boy. Who did it? Yeah, I mean, so as far as dubbing corner goes, Joyce Gordon. who we heard dub Barbara Steele in Black Sunday. She's the one dubbing Susie Anderson as Svenka.

So same voice there. Our guy, Glocko Honorato, who played Giorgio, who's sort of the oldest son in the family. We saw him play mozzarella in the big racket recently. Nice. He looks a lot younger in this. It took me a second to recognize him. I was like, where have I seen him? And I'm like, oh, it's Glocko Honorato. So it was nice to see him again. Boris Karloff. So apparently...

He had to shoot, and I'm not talking necessarily about this particular segment. I'm talking about all his introductions. He had to reshoot those with AIP, and Mario Bava came back to shoot those. He apparently got pneumonia on the last day of filming. But he had nothing but good things to say about Mario Bava later on. Apparently he was neighbors with Christopher Lee at one point.

And they both talked about, which, by the way, wouldn't have been awesome to be their neighbor. Yeah. But he had talked about Christopher Lee had talked about how. Karloff had said to him at one point, you know, they talked about their mutual involvement with Bava because, of course, Christopher Lee was in The Whip in the Body. And even before that, he was in Hercules in the Haunted World, a peplum film that Mario Bava had made.

But anyway, Christopher Lee had said that Karloff had said something like, oh, I love Mario Bava. I would do anything for him. So despite... you know how that last day of shooting went down where he got sick he still really enjoyed working with baba uh contrast that with how he felt about roger corman where karloff had a contract with aip which is one of the reasons why he's in this film

And he had shot a film with Roger Corman. Then Roger Corman had shot another film with him because he said, oh, we still have two days of shooting left. We still have the set left. Let's do it. And Karloff had a really hard time physically with that. His knee was not in good shape. And he had told people to never speak about Roger Corman again in his presence, working on something else.

So did not have a good experience working with Roger Corman. Apparently his contract still wasn't up by 1968. And that's why he ended up working with Peter Bogdanovich and targets, which is an amazing film and has. an amazing Boris Karloff performance in it as well. Check it out for sure. Yeah, it's great. And Mark Damon, I wanted to talk about him a bit. He was an American actor. Again, another AIP player had worked with Roger Corman.

a few times and went to Italy to become a star. And he did become a star in some spaghetti westerns. Naked You Die probably being the biggest one of them. And I remember him mostly for his performance in a film called Requiescon. where he plays a main fill, and he plays a really... despicable um racist and misogynistic sexist character in that who's like a basically a slave owner of sorts he's he's very memorable in it but he's also extremely abhorrent in it i i remember enjoying his

He eventually stopped acting and became a producer and was a producer up until the early 2020s. He died at the age of 91 in 2000. this year in may but he produced films such as i'm just looking at a long list of films here uh does boots that would have been in the early 80s um I'm just trying to see here. Two Guns, the Denzel Washington film, Hurricane Heist. So he was producing films all the way up until recently. Wow. Yeah.

I saw a picture of him on his Wikipedia. There's a picture of him in 2015, and he would have been about 80 years old at that time, maybe a little older than that, and he could pass for 60. So clearly he aged well. took care of himself pretty well. Yeah, I see the image you're talking about. Yeah, totally. Let's see, we go back into anything else on here I was going to mention. I can't think of anything else that... other than I did see some trivia that I'd throw out just real quick.

The only time that Boris Karloff played a vampire, which I found unique, I thought he had already played a vampire in something else, but I was totally wrong. Yeah, it's one of those things where you would think with all the things he has played. That's right, but this was the one time he had only played a vampire. so that's that's exciting this is telephone was the first Italian thriller to be shot in color so there you go

Does that make sense? Yep. And it was being shot around the same time. If you remember in the movie, oh, shoot the eyes, the first Italian, quote unquote, giallo. So this was being filmed around that same time. So there you go. Bam. Not this one, but Black Sunday. Black Sunday or Black Sabbath. Anyways, regardless, there you go. Some information for you to go suck your brains in. Do a word lock on it. You got anything else on Black Sabbath?

Not that I can think of, really, no. I enjoyed watching this for the first time. Seeing the Italian version might help me like the telephone a little more. I'm hoping one of these companies sort of republishes it with both. versions. The Arrow video version that is now out of print had some more special features on it as well. So hopefully someone republishes some of those features at some point and a high definition version.

of both films as well that would be awesome so you can get this for like 15 bucks on blu-ray listeners but i do warn you that there is no features i was noticing that on the keynote so yeah it has the tim lucas commentary which is okay that is the only feature that is on there um and it is a good commentary but

like I said, it is the AIP version. You can't switch languages or anything like that. And there, there are no other features besides that Lucas commentary, which is very good. There you go. Get your hands. Somebody please arrow. Somebody release this thing in a proper.

where we can actually have a bunch of pictures. Aero, Cauldron, whoever wants to get there. Cauldron, yeah, absolutely. That would be awesome if they did it, or Radiance or Rero, one of those companies. Maybe we're speaking it into existence now. Well, I mean, like I said with the other one, I actually think criteria. might be the most likely one to try. Just because I do think these are the type of films they seem to be more interested in nowadays.

Agree. All right. So wrapping up with Black Sabbath, what do you got for a rating for your first time viewing? I'm going to give it an eight. I would give the drop of water a 10. But the VertiLoc, I'd probably give an eight. And the American version of the Telephone, I'd probably give a six. So I think having it sort of right in the middle there evens it out. Okay, cool. Well, I will go back to once again, the screenshot back in episode 67.

I gave this movie a 10. Doc Shock gave it a 9.5. I am not a 10 no more. This has definitely went down with this viewing. I really enjoy it. And maybe the Italian version will bring it back up. But I'm going to move it down to a 9 for me. and definitely drop down a whole point but who knows what italian version will do for me i'll track it down one day

So that said, that is the movies for the reviews tonight. I do want to go ahead and head to you in and have you let the listeners know what our next segments or our next episode is going to be about and what we're going to be doing in January. So for the two-year anniversary of the show, which part of it was actually this, we were going back to Mario Bava, who was some of our first episodes of the show. But we were going back to American Giallo Month, just like we did last January.

for the one year anniversary of the show. And my pick will be Striking Distance, the movie starring Bruce Willis. And Greg's pick is Body Double, the Brian De Palma movie. Yes, so you have got to check these movies out. I have never seen Strike and Distance. This will be my first time viewing, and I'm looking forward to it. That is 1993. And starring Bruce Willis. So, got to check it out. Search it out. And then...

I will be doing Body Double, which is a movie I have not seen in a little bit. It's been a year or two since I've seen it, but I absolutely love this movie, and I cannot wait to revisit it, and we'll be doing that, so go check out. uh body double as well so you can come back and know what all we're going to be talking about so american shallow month man i cannot wait and this is exciting uh two-year anniversary and this is super awesome so there you go

So with that said, what do you got in closing for this episode as we're closing out the first episode of 2025 officially, Ian? What do you got for closing? Happy New Year, first of all. Hopefully it's just as good of a year. if not better for everybody. You can find me on X, formerly known as Twitter and Instagram. and blue sky social at erzonomics you can add me on facebook just type in my name you can add me on letterbox same thing my blog site is the good the bad and the macabre.blogspot.com

Awesome. Definitely check it out. All right. And there will be no mortise vision on this episode. We had... plans of doing one but something happened and so we won't be doing it this episode but the next episode we'll be back with something special cool and fun that you the listeners are going to have a blast with i really believe so get your nostalgia in well that said we're going to

close this thing out you can follow me at facebook instagram x all them spots just look up greg and mortis or land the creeks check out the youtube channel starting to post a little bit more uh being a little bit more active over there and plan on doing some more i just did my recent

I guess my most recent is the... black friday sale from vinegar syndrome releases i picked up so that video is over there you can see what i picked up for black friday and my severin and i believe yours as well ian have shipped so we should be getting those really soon And cannot wait. I'll do an unboxing of that and let the listeners see that.

and break that down so with that said i have vixen vixen uh all three of the vixen movies that severin just released i'll be doing some reviews of those and maybe have something special in the future for that so stay tuned for that so with that said Oh, thank you for tuning in. Ian, it's been a blast. Can't wait for 2025. Can't wait to record many episodes with you and what movies we'll be tackling and stuff that we'll be doing. It's going to be awesome. So with that said, listeners.

Thank you for making 2024 an awesome year, and let's make 2025 even better. And we're going to see on the flip side. Get your jally on, we always like to say, and help keep horror alive. We do that one movie at a time, one review at a time. Until next time, peace. Mwahahaha!