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And now, ladies and gentlemen, the body count continues. Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, Saw's giving time is here. That's right. We're talking about Spiral from the Book of Saw on Kill by Kill. Well, greetings and salutations, Internet. It's your old pal Patrick Hamilton, and it's the most trapular time of the year. That's right. It's our annual tradition of talking about a Saw movie.
with no connection to the rest of the Sawsverse. It is Sawsgiving, and this year we're celebrating by opening the Book of Saw, which implies... that this is a very literature-based franchise. But I promise you, it is not. Of course, we're coming to you once again from Sonsville, USA, Canada. And it's lawless streets patrolled by the Metro police. And there's only one person I trust.
to tell me what the fuck that broken glass projector was used for before it became a death trap. The one, the only... Gina Radcliffe. How are you doing today, Gina? Sorry, hang on a second. I'm just finishing just skinning this rando to make a point. Do we ever learn who that is? Is that another person that...
We're supposed to know who they are. I think he explains who it is, but because so much of this is explained by that point, I was actively not listening to anything. Sure. No, it makes sense, which. probably the only thing that makes sense about this motion picture now
I don't want to alarm you, Gina. That's right. We have a special guest. And you know her, of course, as a returning champion here to Kill by Kill. But what you may not know, she's just one third of the new horror podcast, Pillow Fright, the one, the only. Alyssa Wagner. How are you doing today, Alyssa? I am doing wonderful despite this film that we're about to get into. Or I should say with the film we're about to get into. Alyssa, for as long as I've known you, right?
You have had like saw was a thing that like had meaning in your life. This was something you attended when they would come out. You were like. into this when it was a genuine phenomenon, correct? Correct. I've actually only seen two of them in the theaters, I think. But I love me a good franchise or a bad one. I should say maybe more a bad one. But you know that I love me a hot mess. I love me the worst of the best.
of the worst of the sequels in a franchise. So thank you for inviting me on the episode where we're not talking about the franchise. No, no. All jokes aside, though, I had been wanting to do a Saw's Giving because I genuinely enjoy watching sequels such as Saw 5. I'm not saying they're good. I'm actually saying the opposite, but... I enjoy me a hot mess. And this one is not a hot mess. It's just there. It's just kind of there. It is very weird because the concoction that this is coming from.
I don't think are inherently the worst ideas necessarily. Right. Lionsgate senses and Twisted Pictures sense that with Jigsaw, whatever the fuck that was, I haven't seen it. We haven't covered it on the show yet. And please don't spoil it for me. I can't wait to find out after this. John Kramer. No, I'm just kidding. A man named John Kramer. It would be great if instead of John Kramer, who came after him to take over his mantle was Jan Kramer. And it was just some guy from Norway.
Who became Jigsaw. Well, great. Now you just spoiled Jigsaw. Oh, damn it. You figured it out already. Are all the traps things you have to put together, including like inserting wood dowels? Because that would be great. They are all from Ikea. all of them listen after this i like if it's all just just john kramer just talking For an hour and a half, people would be like, yes, thank you, God. Oh, finally. Like, for the longest time, we lamented how weird the franchise was about...
being constantly underground to the point in which one of them, I think it was six, six sat at a quote unquote underground zoo. Yep. That was six. Definitely a thing that is. Totally happened somewhere in the world. That a zoo has been placed underground. to house moles i don't i don't honestly know gophers who's to say we never find out why is it a zoo necessarily we're never told it's just Yet another one of Sausville, USA, Canada's many underground layers. And now...
With the emergence of last year when we covered Saw X, a film that, Gina, you and I were as surprised as anyone to find ourselves liking? Yeah, I found it fairly engaging. Like the secret sauce to it is that John Kramer isn't just some dude who is grabbing randos off the street and putting them into metal contraptions, but he's in fact...
on a righteous mission in Saw X to right a wrong, to personally take care of a problem that has affected him personally. And as a result, we, the audience, suddenly care? What happens? It's just not some group of weirdos like that. I remember which one it is, but it's that love triangle where they're like killed for the fact that they're.
that two guys are having sex with the same woman. And they're like, we got to put this on display in front of everybody for no fucking reason. It's like they have completely lost the plot. Yeah. That was good old Saw 3D. When you say good old, that's an anachronism. It's just being kind to it, right? Because up until this point, I thought this is as bad as this is ever going to get. And then I got to spiral. Yeah.
I think it reached a point where you just don't care about Detective Hamhawk. What are we calling him, Gina? Have we? definitively call him one slice of meat. He's had various names. Detective Hamhock, Detective Pork Roast, Detective Porchetta. He's a salty processed meat. I'll give him that. He's just oozing juices. Oozing juices. And perhaps like Saw X's worst moment shows up for a macro second.
Oh, that's what you're talking about. Yes. For a fraction of a second. Costas Mandalore. That's right. For a fraction of a second, I thought you were talking about spirals. Like, wait. No, I was like, so help me God, Hoffman better not fucking show up in this. And that is the only good choice this movie made It is It is the sole good choice That this movie makes And then at one point Though
Before we get into the plot details or anything like that. But Chris Rock's character, Jacko, I don't even fucking remember what his name is. I'm sure I have it in the notes. But it is proposed to him that... Could this in fact be a jigsaw or a disciple of jigsaw? And he's like, well, Kramer never targeted cops. And I'm like, I've only seen.
A quarter of these things and cops are constantly being targeted. He kept one in an underground lair to the point in which Marky Mark's brother made friends with a rat. Yeah, I think if I recall, part two is kind of all about targeting some cops. Yeah, right. But part three ends with like, I think every single person, almost every single person that is killed in that is a cop.
is a cop. Four is all about don't be a cop who just kicks down a door. Like it is very concerned with cops. He kills one for being a workaholic. You're spending too much time solving crimes. You know, you have a supposed workaholic who goes on an extended rant about how being a cop is the worst job in the world, leading to terrible mental health and personal decisions. And you're like.
Why am I listening to this guy? Yammer on and on and on about shit that doesn't fucking matter to giant metal traps. And this movie is utterly unconcerned with. really be in a saw movie which i guess i'm okay with so long as what you replace it with is interesting new and fresh and i have to say a lot of the decisions here aren't bad It's their executions that are fucking terrible. I just don't.
understand the the point of it i mean i understand that they chris rock it's kind of because he produced it right he he's the one who brought this off this whole thing is birthed from him being at the same fucking wedding or whatever With the head of Lionsgate. And he's desperate to get back on a movie set. And he's like, get me one of those Saw movies.
Because I would like to do that Saw movie. And Lionsgate's like, oh, the last one we did did not do so well. He's like, well, maybe we do like a sidequel. Like it's in the Saw universe. It does a lot of Saw things, but it's not Saw. And that's not the worst idea in the world, but I can't imagine a worse execution than what I had to sit through for an hour and 33 minutes. Yeah, it didn't.
try to do anything different i think it tried to connect it just enough but in the same way i don't think it relates to the general crowd who maybe isn't a fan of saw it's a little kind of bland but also chris rock trying to be a hero Serious cop just doesn't work very well. Yeah, it's been a long time since I've seen a movie this badly cast. Yeah.
And it's the person who's the brains behind. He's definitely trying to do seven. Definitely trying to do seven. And his idea of doing seven is what if I just have a chin beard? No other part of the beard, just the chin beard. Does that make it seven? What if people wear hats? What if I yell at everybody?
Yes. There's a lot of. What I really loved about seven was how much Morgan Freeman yelled at everybody. That's an inherent part of what makes seven successful, right? Is that Morgan Freeman is always. pissed off and yelling and complaining about his ex-wife who who shows up in this movie for no reason oh yeah like it does that go anywhere
Is it a false flag? Does it lead him down the wrong trail? Is there any point to it? Absolutely not. This movie is more Chris Rock's bits that... did not make his HBO hour that year.
suddenly becoming the main thrust of the motion picture yeah there's because it's in a soft film you'd look at every character introduced and think okay are they a part of it or are they going to end up in a trap like where's the connection in this one this is definitely not a saw film it's right which yeah it's good and bad i guess because in a in a certain way it is like the weakest version of a saw movie but
Like all the elements here could have been fantastic. So you have like, all right, we know this isn't.
jigsaw but it's someone who's taken up the mantle which is not new lots of people have done it as we've said many times we even have a t-shirt right jigsaw has a posse there's a whole cadre of people who love to pick up the fucking mantle and do the due diligence and get out there and trap some people that's fine i'm okay with that and he's going after corrupt cops again you're not going to hear from me
But what about the sacred lives of corrupt cops? That is not forthcoming, if you were wondering. But that also leaves us with the problem is that if these people are caught in traps and we don't want to see any of them escape. That's the problem we came up with before in this small franchise. Like, some of these people you've got to kind of want to root for in some way, shape, or form. Yeah, no. They all suck.
Yeah. Like, like, I don't know that I was supposed to be, you know, being happy that this guy gets away at the end of the movie, but instead I'm like, yay! You can continue avenging your father's senseless death at the hands of crooked cops. I'm with you all the way. Oh, no. Oh, that's... I'm shrugging my shoulders as high as my earlobes.
I feel like this is the only movie in the entire franchise, series, whatever, that I genuinely just felt numb to any character. I didn't care either way about anybody. Yeah, I mean, like, Jigsaw killed. pedophiles he's killed rapists he's killed evil health insurance providers this guy He's killed a smoker. That's true. And a workaholic. But generally speaking, he does choose people who get what they deserve. Yeah. Whereas this guy, you kill some cops that.
killed a man in front of his child. Like an innocent man who was going to testify against another crooked cop who killed an innocent man. Yes. And we're supposed to be like rooting for Chris Rock who constantly presents himself as while not the worst cop in a bevy of terrible cops. also is not a person I care for on any level. Like he just from the word go.
Feels and sounds repugnant. He's just talking. He is yapping. He's giving hot takes about Forrest fucking Gump. That's how it opens. That's how it establishes his character. He is just trying so hard to be the cop that doesn't play by the rules. Yes. Good for him being able to do that for himself. Good for him being able to be in this movie. I guess this is something he's always wanted to do. Yes. I think this is somehow this dream come true.
So this suddenly becomes one of those things that you kind of look forward to when it comes to bad movies in that when you get an ego trip, when you get a... Something that's massaging one person's personal peccadilloes, or they're getting that one thing they've always wanted to do, and they fumble the bag this hard, that usually...
equals in bad movie math, this is going to be a good time. Because now you're into kind of like that Neil Brain territory of someone who has too much control over the narrative of anything. And if... I were to learn that Chris Rock also provided all of the crafty on this movie. I would not be surprised. Yeah, exactly. It's just like, everything seems to be coming from his source.
It all revolves around his character. He is the focal point. We get so much of him endlessly yipping and sniping at people and yelling, fuck you, indifferent. And exciting ways. You've never heard before from Chris Rock. Not in the decades that he's had in the public consciousness. So I don't know why he thought that he was bringing something new and exciting to this. I can promise him as someone who has little to no chance of slapping him in the near future. Team Will Smith. Sure. You don't...
have to agree. Yeah, I mean, that's the, you know, that's the secret, is that, you know, he wasn't upset about him talking about Jada. It's, you know, he was looking, he's just bored and watching a, watching Saul. spiral from the book of saw on his phone at the Oscars. And like, yeah, that's really why he was. So let's set the record straight. It's like this movie sucks. He just finished watching it. And that's when he walked up. Exactly. Watching it.
On his phone in the audience. And he's like, God damn it. I'm so looking forward to this. This had so much promise. You got Samuel L. Jackson in a fucking Saw movie. And what he's left to do is show up for a couple scenes. hide a gun behind his gut and walk straight into a tramp. This sounds like a real winner, everybody. yeah this is this is very much a a you know i just you know all i did is make sure the check cleared and right and that and then show up did a favor yeah movie now alissa yes
When it comes to previous editions of the Saw franchise, Darren Bousman kind of holds a special place. Because for a little while, although I have little recollection of his editions of it, because we really only covered four on the show. He had a little runner, right? From two to four where he's kind of like the person put in charge. He's the saw master general for a little while. And so I think.
When someone has that little bit of authority, when something's in a bit of a golden era, regardless of what I think about it, it obviously grew as a phenomenon over the course of his... directorial efforts in the franchise. And so when you get him back involved, it feels like, hey. They're bringing in someone who knows what they're doing. And then I watched this movie and I'm like, has he ever known what he's doing? Wait, was he involved in this one? He?
No, he did not. He absolutely did. How did I not know that? Oh my gosh. I'm so embarrassed. I should have done my research. I could have come prepared. No one should be forced to research this. Like my experience with Darren Balsman is that he did those Saw movies. He did Repo, The Genetic Opera, which I think is fun. Like that's a fun gonzo going for it type of movie. Ridiculous in a great way, in my opinion. And then he did one movie that I saw on Netflix in which someone from like a CW show.
exists in a world where everyone dresses like it's the 1940s, even though it's obviously the 2010s Los Angeles. And you're like, oh, I've met too many of these people. I can't wait for them to all die. I don't even know what the name of that movie is. But I was like, hey, everyone can have an off day. I mean, this guy's... proven assault. He has like a phenomenon underneath his belt. And then this movie has all the visual panache of like a Hallmark original. Yeah. I'm sorry. Sorry. Go ahead.
Oh, no, I was just going to say I have a very strong feeling that this was all a singular vision that. the director had to just kind of try to bring to life that didn't have as much say as previous films. Let's just put it that way. I don't know. Allegedly, I don't know. But yeah, I have a feeling there was a lot of not creative freedom with this one. There's so much of the like staggered.
I don't even know how to describe the camera effect they keep using where it's constantly moving and it has like a nu metal video vibe to it. And it's like they use that so much. that it actually starts to come off like, okay, is this actually, is this a parody of Saw movies? Right. Because that's what it starts to feel like. Is this a scary movie entry that I did not know about? Yeah.
Because they play it up so hard. I'm all for playing with the Saw structure. I'm not some originalist. I don't believe that there's one right way to make a fucking Saw movie. I enjoyed the one or two Saw movies I've liked and not enjoyed so much the other ones, which is fine. If you love these things, continue to do so. I enjoy lots of crap and you might not like it at all. It's all fine.
It's all ice cream, but I don't need spiral to be anything other than what it supposedly wants to be. And sadly, I don't think it actually knows what it wants to be. Like if it's a mystery. Perhaps it should be somewhat mysterious. That's the thing. I think with the other sequels, like four and five, I think are the melodrama ones that people are just kind of like, those are probably the worst, subjectively. But at least.
fun to watch there's something silly because it's silly Hoffman is fucking ridiculous they're silly to watch this one is just there's nothing silly about it whether intentionally or unintentionally I just think the silliness doesn't land like if he's trying to crack his joke the forrest gump stuff the it just doesn't quite land so i just don't think there's much fun in this one as there is to enjoy and even the worst of the sequels yeah i i want those ridiculous moments i want
when Wahlberg makes friends with a rat because he's kept underground for a full year. I want... When John Kramer shows up with a backwards hat looking like he's getting tickets for a Lincoln Park concert. I made a note about that. And the last remaining Ticketmaster. In this one. The best. It's. You have to be somewhat ridiculous. Or at least in Saw X, I think the secret sauce there is that they make the decision that what he's doing is personal.
It means something to him. And so he's going out of his way not to just set them up and watch it from across town. but be there and deliver instructions directly to people. And it's quite ridiculous, but it's also engaging. You suddenly wonder what the stakes are and it engages you with the movie. Whereas here, there are no twists. It is semi-personal, but then...
You don't know what the personal stakes are until the very end. And then at the end, you're like, okay, you go girl. It was a very underwhelming reveal because it just, I feel like there's that turning point in the last 20, 30 minutes where. I mean, I'm assuming this whole episode is a spoiler episode. Yeah. Anything you want. Yeah. So you get he gets they get the package. They see the skin carved and they're like, oh, my partner died. And, you know.
I think right then and there you're like, okay, something's up because they didn't really show it as much. They killed the second lead. Right. Just unceremoniously, you know, whatever. And then he comes back and it's not this big like dun-dun-dun, dun-dun-dun. Like they don't do this dramatic flair of the music. It's just he's like, yeah, I'm here. Oh, there he is. The thing that you guessed probably.
The guy who's constantly on your phone and computer and used it to con your friends and family into deadly traps. He's the killer. He's just watching you the entire time saying every time he's with him. I've been wanting to do this since I was. Oh, your father inspired me. I am the one who is doing all this. I've been waiting for this.
When are you going to catch me, wink? Yes. And then because Chris Rock's character turns out to be a terrible fucking detective, it's not very fun to watch him go and detect. yeah this this when this uh uh
police captain who has probably has some of the worst dialogue in this entire movie. I don't know if it was personal against this actress, but like- Or the audience. When this, when you've got this- of the introducing the two of them together at the beginning of the movie and she's just doing the whole yeah You're going too far. You're taking this personally. Just because your father, everything, everything she says is exposition. Oh yeah. They give everything. And it is not good exposition.
It is literally just filling in information that the audience needs to know that his father is the former chief of police or whatever and or precinct captain. And, you know, but 12 years ago, you got. shot and turned in another cop now everybody hates you and for whatever reason you you didn't get stationed to another precinct for reasons Even though it would be dangerous for you to work around these cops when they know that you turned someone in.
When she is kidnapped and set up in a trap in the basement of the police station. Oh my gosh. And I'm just like, okay, so she's been there the whole time screaming and yelling and nobody noticed this in the police station. Well, they have a safe door. So no one can hear someone screaming for their life as they're being burned alive by wet, hot wax. Oh, man. And meanwhile.
Chris Rock is outside the door yelling at this person to open the door, open the door, open the door. She's obviously putting in the fucking... dialing in the code to get into this with this old fashioned ass, you know, spinning dial. Is this supposed to be tension? Am I supposed to be scared? Should I be laughing? What is the emotion I'm supposed to feel right now? Yeah, there was no tension. It was just, I don't.
I just kept thinking, how did he alone do, I mean, I guess you could say this about any of the movies, but how did he do these traps? How did he set them up? Well, that's the thing is that in a lot of them, after a while, they... you know, they did have helpers. Exactly. And these are pretty elaborate. Yeah, because that was one of the things I always, you know, found very amusing about the Saw franchise in general is that as insane as, you know...
these plans are that they somehow managed to find people that, yeah, you know what? I like the cut of your jib. I'm going to help you achieve this vision.
Yeah, as the franchise goes on, you see more and more of, you know, the help behind the scenes. Yeah, the apprentices. And some of the apprentices have apprentices. Right, so it makes sense in some ways, but this is just... did you do this sir like this in particular there's a there's a bunch of things that just simply do not pass the smell test and we do not come to saw movies for realism but
I do not believe that you can just yank off your tongue by jumping off a small step ladder. A. B. There's nowhere for him to fucking go. If that train comes by, where's he supposed to run? There are no doors when they go to see the crime scene. They have to walk along a long hallway. So that person was either going to die.
just from bleeding out of his mouth or getting, he was going to get hit by a train. It was just going to happen. If he was told immediately, jump off that thing, rip off your tongue, and you'll avoid getting hit by a train. he still would have been hit by a train. The guy who has to have his fingers ripped off was still going to get electrocuted. There is no escape.
from them so why are these traps so long it's basically it's basically the idea is you know just you choose whichever death you think is going to be the fastest for you right Which kind of goes against the point of what John Kramer is ostensibly trying to teach people, which is how much do you value your own life? Have you covered part five yet?
No, no. Okay, never mind. I won't go. We don't want to hear any spoilers. Then I won't say anything. We have to remain free of any information going into a Saw movie. Which is why I asked. Every single Saw movie has to prove their weight in gold by their own merits. I love that. But yes, I won't go any further then. Just wanted to double check then before I go any further. Again, you could tell us anything happens in Saw 5.
We will believe you and we will probably forget before we see that movie. We won't be doing this again for another year for now. We do it once a year. If no one else. All we can fucking handle. And next year, supposedly, is Saw 11. So we'll probably be seeing that. Oh, wow. So who knows when we'll see Saw 5? Well, when you do, I will come back. The show will live long enough to cross that hurdle.
I'll make sure I'll keep it alive just so I could be our guest on Saw 5. But like, I think that that takes away some of the quote unquote. fun of it there has to be a way for people to get out of it and that way is not easy it takes effort they take damage but The threat is they can get to the other side of it. And at no point in any of these traps, do any of these people have any ability.
to get out of what was their fate from the word go. Once they got hit with the sleep juice, which apparently Spiral also has access to vats of sleep juice. Those cop connections. Right. But no one in the fucking police department at this point says.
Put an APB out on anyone who sells or buys microcassettes. Right. My favorite part of the train death is how they immediately... assume it's a homeless guy which is which is hilarious to me because like i mean i live in a city where occasionally people do unfortunately fall in front of trains and and you know either they
they jump themselves in front of trains or they are pushed. And they're not, you know, by default, homeless people. And the realization that this was not a homeless person is, oh, he's wearing a Fitbit. A homeless guy can't have a Fitbit? Come on. Maybe he got one for Christmas. They said it so prominently, too. Like, it's supposed to be involved in the whole plot. He had Fitbit.
Do you ever see a homeless man wearing a Fitbit? It's like, well, no, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. Right. It doesn't mean that he couldn't have picked one up. Or he had one the whole time. He fell on hard times and could not sell a Fitbit because how much could you possibly get for a Fitbit? I don't wear a Fitbit. Does that by default mean I am a homeless person?
Yeah. What, what, what is the line here in Sausville, USA, Canada? What determines whether or not you are, are unhoused or not unhoused and how does it coincide with Fitbit ownership? That's an interesting Rubicon that they've doled out for themselves. That's an interesting police station. They have interesting logic in there.
tactics i think there's a lot of interesting logic going on here when we were talking about the you know the she's downstairs captains downstairs we're coming to get you there's this whole sequence which they're descending stairs there's another sequence in which chris rock's character is trying to get information from a drug dealer who takes up money in an old paint bucket and then they somehow
bamboozled him into getting a paint explosion in the face. And then they're like, we have 10 seconds and it is at least a minute of them running upstairs. including like that dog scare is not. It's one thing to have a dog bark at you. You're like, whoa, and you move out of the way. But that ends up being like 30 seconds of the dog just barking and Chris Rock going, control your dog, control your dog. Okay.
Am I supposed to be scared about this? Is this dangerous? Why would I care? You had 10 seconds and you spent 30 of those seconds? 10 plus 20 on this dog situation? Dog wasn't even coming up to him. I mean, he was barking, but it wasn't like... The dog's barking because you're running up the stairs. pushing people out of the way like you're fucking OJ Simpson going through an airport with the same side. And he was leashed. He could have just dodged.
dog right you just walk to the fucking right of that dog the leash is obviously taught like you have a pair of eyes fucking use them and that entire sequence in which Chris Rock is doing a stand-up routine slash torture session over a guy's compound fracture. Is another one of those, why should I care for this person? Why do I want to see him untrapped to death? This is a PSA or public sock announcement. Experts have declared Bomba socks as the best way to warm up chilly feet.
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pushed into a Saw movie because they had to shoot something that day. that's probably he probably did say you know i'm gonna i'm gonna improvise a little bit during these uh interrogation scenes during these guy got you scenes that's when he's like the instagram filter do you want me to tag you I've never thought I would hear that in a Saw film. I never thought I would hear Jamaican nanny riffs go on.
And then, you know, me no want no potna. Oh, yeah. What the fuck is happening here? Like, are you telling me everyone saw this in the edit and they're like. There's no way to cut around this. We got to keep it in the movie. He was the editor. Yes. He did crafty. He was the editor. He rented everybody, their trailers on set. He really was Neil Breen.
He was a teamster. He drove the van to and from set every day. That would be amazing if he did, though. Thank you, sir. That's very kind of you. Yes. He's really going out of his way. In the lead up to this, because Gina, you watched it yesterday. I watched it today. And what I came to a conclusion about this is that this is like.
A very tedious combination of two things that usually I would find compelling. Badly filmed cheapy. I'm not against it. And we are not into people's looks on this show. But I have to say. This is the ugliest cast of any song. It's not meant to be the model cast. I still disagree because, again, Detective Pork Roast is not present. I love me some Hoffman in some ways, okay? In some ways. But I agree. Yes, that is a thing, Alyssa.
You are not alone in this world. There are plenty of people who look at Costas Mandalore and go, that's my type. I just don't believe any of the other cops in Chris Rock's precinct are... someone's like oh my god break me off a piece of this asshole maybe his partner a little bit but even he's just kind of But I almost feel like he is vaguely, you know, he's like, I can see he's symmetrical. His face is symmetrical. Good for him. I don't possess a symmetrical face, but he does. So.
That's fine. He can be in movies. He can be in TV. I have nothing against him personally, but it also instantly nails him as a suspect because he's the only other person on screen. Besides Samuel L. Jackson, who you're like, that person deserves to be in a movie somehow. He must be involved in the end of this. Yes. And the captain. Again, I forget character names, but. She's a looker too, so she's a suspect automatically.
You know, when I just looked up the case on Google, her picture comes up as second, and they did not give her a name. It's Marisol Nichols, and she plays Captain Angie Garza, the legendary Captain. Angie Garza. One of my favorite things about Captain Angie Garza is that she is the subject of one of the many flashbacks that Chris Rock's character has to events. he could not have witnessed
Because he's not in the fucking room. Classic Mrs. Brody. Yes. Literally thinks back to events he was not a party to. Was he told after the fact and he just has that kind of mind that can picture it as thus? One of those flashbacks involves him starting in the room and being told to leave it. And then the flash... back continues and then he's back driving the car like that happened when i wasn't around that is definitely a jaws revenge uh hills have eyes to syndrome there
Oh, my gosh. And, you know. I'm looking at the actor who played the partner. Shank or something like that? Nobody's memorable. He's had a pretty decent career. He was in, well, he was in Babylon. Lots of movie stars were in Babylon. But he's also on, he was also in the social network. He was in, he's on.
Handmaid's Tale. So he's done all right for himself. I think he could probably walk away from this with his head held high. Yeah. I mean, listen, it's hard to make a movie. It's even harder to make a good one. Bad movies happen to anyone. Right. And it doesn't land in his land. It doesn't land in Samuel Jackson's. lap. It doesn't land in the guy who played Detective Fitch's lap as much as I might like it to. And what a fantastic lap to land in. But it really comes down to fucking Chris Rock.
It just all feels like this is an ego trip by Chris Rock. And the one thing you can level at him is that he can be funny. And the one thing I do not believe you can is he does not have drama juice. He just doesn't. He tried. He tried and bless his soul for doing so. But, you know, sometimes you got to try to realize it. And hopefully he realized it.
In the flashback to him when his partner kills the guy who spirals dad, he runs in going, and it is without a doubt one of the worst performances I've ever seen. ever seen from any actor in a major motion picture he seems like he's in a completely different movie half the time like this is scary movie oh yeah When the last great drama performance you had was New Jack City. And even then, he's not that great. I love New Jack City. But also, he's only on screen for about five minutes. Right.
Pookie lives because Pookie is only on screen for 20 minutes total of a two-hour movie. It doesn't infect the entire movie. Yeah, I think the only movie I've ever really seen him in is that like Heaven, just like I forget what it's called, but it was a remake of an older movie where Heaven something. Heaven Can Wait. Yes, that one. And I just. you know he's a comedian and not and that's great but sometimes
You know, you can't do the Book of Saw. You can't sometimes. I'm just a comedian. I guess the only way he was willing to put up the money for this is if he starred in it. and and unfortunately you know no one evidently no one was able to sit down and said like this you may not be the right person for this role as an actor i i uh I would not do this actually, because I know what I can and can't, I'm not capable of, but it must be nice to be able to do that.
Just kind of throw your weight around. Yeah, you're like, I want to do this. And have yourself cast a role you are woefully. Not appropriate for. Listen, I want to skin Catherine Han and do every single thing she does. But I know that I'm not even capable of that. So not everyone can get their way. Sorry, Chris Rock.
But at least Catherine Han has the understanding of, like, her strengths and everything. So she puts herself into roles where she can thrive. Whereas Chris Rock, like... wants to do a horror movie, wants to basically do seven but different, and goes to the guy who owns the rights to Saw and says, let's do something like that.
Then the screenwriters who have been working on five different scripts up until this point for a follow-up to Jigsaw get told, now this is a Chris Rock cop movie. And they just start... picking pieces out of those five other scripts to make their own weird career trap for Chris Rock. And he's like, I can't wait to shackle my tongue to this.
Do you know if this was filmed during the pandemic or if it was a pre-pandemic? Okay. I was going to say. It was supposed to come out 2020. So obviously it gets held for 2021. So I was going to say, it feels rushed. I feel like there's so many. missed opportunities and it could have been better, but it almost feels like it was something that was just, no, I'm going to do it this way. And there's no time to, you know, try something different, do different takes, do different this.
I don't know. It just feels a little rushed to me. And I think Lionsgate was into the idea of... zagging on what people expected from a saw movie it's not the worst idea it's kind of what leads to saw x strangely enough being a movie that i think crosses over more than most saw movies do because it becomes weirdly personal and you're connected to what happens because it's not some random shit it's this guy was wronged by these a-holes and
He's giving them terrible choices to make and they either do it or they don't. And then all of a sudden it's like, well, I know he doesn't die here, but. It looks like he's going to keel over any fucking second. Like it just weirdly magically works. And the absolute opposite is true here. This becomes a vanity project. And you're shackled to one guy's weird comedy beats that he's worked out. at the cellar in New York and seemed to work there and fall very, very flat on screen. I'm not even sure.
I mean, do you think that this would have improved any if they had been a different actor in the lead? Like Will Smith? I still think. Well, I don't. In terms of plot. This is kind of inert because you have a detective who can't detect and you, it's a mystery in which only one of two people can possibly be the killer.
And it's either Samuel L. Jackson or a guy you've maybe seen in one or two other things. So it's more than likely not Samuel L. Jackson. There's not much of a mystery here to who it is. It might have been better in the sense that someone could have pulled off the dramatics of the lead character, but... I don't know that it dramatically improves in that way because it would have been maybe 50 minutes without all the unnecessary tangents.
that we get from Chris Rock along the way. And you can kind of, if I mind swap this with the cast of seven, let's say it was Brad Pitt, Morgan Freeman. I still don't think that it would be, I think the level would stay the same because I just think it comes down to. The writing, unfortunately. And the directing. Exactly. There's no tension. If it's an action movie, there should be some action that is compelling.
And that means not all the action sequences should be people running up or downstairs. That's the only time this thing gets into action mode. And it sucks. It is one thing to go, all right, we're going to make a Saw movie. that has all the beats of a cop movie then you actually have to make that cop movie and this
This film just stops short. It doesn't want to do that. It doesn't want to commit to being something different outside of Chris Rock's character. And everyone else just slots themselves into roles that they would have fit into a normal Saw movie. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I, is there supposed to be a sequel to this or I don't know if they're working on it or they planned on setting it up, but it almost seems like it was set up that way.
They definitely thought they had a winner. If this, if let's say the pandemic didn't happen and this came out in 2020 to a normal box office. It is quite possible that this might have done a little. I don't think it would have gotten better reviews. Maybe they would have had the chance to do reshoots to make it better. But they can't. It's locked and no one wants to spend more money. And this ends up just like they take a bath on it.
It's just unfortunate because I mean, the title from the book of saw, it feels really fucking weird to me first off, but. You'd think that it would be kind of cool to see other takes on it, other variations to see if there was more time and not as much of a singular focus in mind with Chris. I don't doubt that someone can't pitch this to Lionsgate, who let's say Miracle of Miracles is still a company in a couple of years. If they were able to figure out how to.
do saw acolytes in a way that is compelling that dips into different genres i don't think it's the worst idea yeah The issue that they have here is they shackled the film to someone whose sensibilities do not lie in the genre he wants to exploit. And as such... You have a bunch of stuff that just doesn't make a whole hell of a lot of sense. And whenever the movie just becomes a Samuel L. Jackson vehicle and he's like head butting dudes outside of his apartment, you're like.
wow, this movie has juice all of a sudden. Like, all right, we got a movie, y'all. All of a sudden, I feel like I can lean back into the comfort and easy boy-like charm and put my feet up. and a performance of Samuel L. Jackson. But he's in 10 minutes of this movie. Yeah, he's in 10 minutes. He's phoning it in. Yeah, this is you. Alyssa said earlier, you know, it's doing it's doing someone probably Chris Rock a favor. Yeah. And like you see indifference is just.
Coming off, like according to the Wikipedia page for this, he agreed to do this because he'd wanted to do something, try something he had never done before. As in being shrunk up like a puppet while he's slowly bleeding out. Samuel L. Jackson said that? Apparently, yes. Because if this is different from his vast career, then I don't know what excuse he was making because that makes no sense. I mean, he's getting probably real money to show up to...
Canada. Oh, he definitely, I mean, looking at this, looking at this cast, he definitely had one additional zero in his check than everybody else did. His intro feels like he might as well actually be Nick Fury connecting this to the MCU. The way that he's introduced. He's definitely in Fury mode. He's very Fury mode. He has not changed it up. Yes. No, not at all.
And so, you know, Spiral makes this bold choice. Just give people nonsensical, elongated deaths that don't make a lot of sense. And that's not... unusual for the saw movies we've watched but at least those feel grounded in some sort of point whereas how the fuck does shrek get those weird wire nets
around a person's fingers so they can be pulled off. It's not around the bone. These little weird nets are sewn into his flesh somehow. How the fuck did... he do that where did he find the broken glass machine that spits broken glass towards a wall machine this is where i wouldn't mind actually seeing a sequel and seeing this very convoluted uh
between saw and the book of saw because that would be kind of awesome because at least kramer has the flimsy excuse of being an engineer and architect yeah whereas max mingela's character is just some dude who was wronged. And not that that's a bad motivation, but it has to explain where he came up with the idea to be able to trap someone's tongue between two pieces of metal. To the point where the natural juices of one's tongue wouldn't help you slip out of it.
Did you see the after credits? Because, you know, Hoffman does show up and I'm just kidding. No, but I'm sorry. Hulu did not have after credits. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. News flash. Hoffman? actually enters this fucking thing? No, no. I am kidding, but I do. That's the thing. Alyssa, you have to be worried. I'm very sorry. You can say anything about a song movie. We will believe you. I would have believed you.
prefaced it by saying I was going to make a bad joke but uh you I mean you could expect it because I know these don't follow any sort of real you know timeline or anything if he did show up I would not have been surprised at all i i mean there's all a bunch of there's a whole bunch of like how this production sort of happens sort of you know and the screenwriters have said we had to combine a bunch of scripts and
There's a whole bunch of rigmarole to line all of this up. And all of it seems confused and just trying to... get it done and everyone kind of wants to keep their jobs but everyone secretly knows deep down this isn't gonna work but no one just says hey let's take an extra year Let's put this, you know, on the back burner for three months and really figure this out for a different Halloween release, you know.
let's figure it out ahead of time. And they don't, they don't have the fucking time and they don't have the inclination. And then they start the movie with a guy walking around in Hannibal Lecter's last outfit from the silence. of the lambs like that's just normal shit it really what are they celebrating why are fireworks going up i don't need like a long explanation i assume
It is 4th of July, but no one says that. They say it's hot, but they don't say it's summer. It's Predator 2, but it's a Saw movie. It's just a lot of different things that don't make a lot of sense. And for half of it, I'm just happy we're outdoors. Yeah. Yeah, I was thinking that's that's one of the few scenes that are outdoors in this movie. When the purse grabber goes down a manhole cover and then this person wearing.
where Hannibal Lecter's last outfit goes. You did not just go down there. I'm like, yes. Yes, he did. This town is full of underground zoos. Of course, he went down there. That's all these movies do is go down there. Are we supposed to assume that that's Schenk? Luring him down into the subway tunnel. Right, yes. So he snatched this woman's purse. Mm-hmm. Under the... Expecting... This was Boz. They talk about Boz a lot. This was Boz, who was apparently also Chris Ross' character's good buddy.
That, you know, they never really established until he just kind of mentions it casually. You know, just knowing that he was going to give chase. And that, like, that's, he, like, he was that sure that that's how that was going to work. Yeah, this movie has a lot of different little threads that it picks up and puts down. People about halfway through the movie start talking about Article 8 and you're like...
What the fuck is that? And apparently it was some sort of local law that allowed cops to just do whatever the fuck they wanted. So. Get ready. This is talking about the future, everybody. We're all going to be living under Article 8 sooner. Oh, no, Article 8, no. Spiral warned us. Spiral predicted the future. It was all from the book of saw. If only you had read. Um, but so he gets hit by a train, even though he yanks his own tongue off and.
He was going to die one way or the other. And meanwhile. spiral who does not show up as billy the puppet he has a different puppet and he has a he has a different pig mask not the same he looks like it looks like it looks like like set design from a primus concert listen And also sounds like drunk Siri. I have words about this. Please. This was the only note that I really prominently wrote down because it's.
the thought I've had about this whole movie is that, okay, this is a real thought. I feel like the jigsaw voice that they used in this, don't know why they did it, but it sounds like if a company were putting, like if corporate was putting on like a...
training video and they were trying to be edgy and like cool and hip, but they had never seen one Saw movie in their life and didn't know anything about it. And they're like, Hey, Kathy from HR, do you want to do voiceover? And she says, yes, that's what this sounds like. Kathy from HR is just like, hello, detective, blah, blah, blah. Just with anonymous, like the anonymous filter, like voice filter. Oh my gosh. It's just, it is.
It's just so weirdly uniconic. Yes. It's anti-iconic. It just makes no sense. And then you read, like, we never quite figured it out. That's evident. It is evident that whatever you tried did not work. No. And the movie had to be released. So contractually, it had to show up in empty theaters in the middle of 2021. Yeah. And so.
They did it. And this is the permanent record. Like, this was their best effort, everybody. Oh, my gosh. This voice is like the equivalent of Amanda's wig in X. Like, it's just that bad. It is that bad. It really is. I don't think the Saw franchise as a whole does wigs well. No. But they really do her dirty in that. Like, she doesn't have to have the same hair. I honestly... Don't care what kind of hair Amanda has, but that suddenly makes me.
want to care about the hair Amanda hands because it's so fucking terrible. It looks like Stuart from Mad TV. Well, she does. want jigsaw to look what she can do yeah it's true i mean that it's true it's not off brand for her oh so Zeke gets partnered with, he can't have any partners because he testified against the crooked cop once upon a time. And it just turns out that the partner he's given will be spiral.
Spiral sits across from him in the desk and looks at this framed photo of Zeke's dad, Samuel L. Jackson. And he's like, he's what made me want to do this in the first place. And my question was like. Did he invent the idea of police? Like, how do... Did they not have police at a certain point in Sonsville, USA, Canada? Maybe.
I mean, even he expresses like shock that, you know, or puzzlement that, you know, do you know how hard it was to be placed as your partner? And it's like, yeah, I have a pretty good idea. how hard it was to be played with your partner. This is like one of those, like, you know, it had to have taken at least some 15 years.
to get this plan in motion and and you know and you somehow you know a lot of things that were going to happen you couldn't possibly know and and it's just like like Even if the movie was good, like this sort of pseudo-sauce plan, the minute you give it any more than a fraction of a second's thought... That doesn't make any sense. Yeah. I mean, I don't know that even the original saw.
makes a ton of sense i think it all just kind of falls apart it just works on vibes and the problem here is that the vibes ain't vibing the math ain't mathing i think What really typifies how badly this is assembled is you're constantly being told how hot it is in the city in this particular summer. People are going crazy and they're having rolling blackouts, blah, blah, blah.
And then during one of the many driving scenes from North Sawzville to South Sawzville, Zeke passes by two children playing at a fire plug. that normally in any other movie you see cracked open and kids playing in it and they can't afford to do that so it's this tiny little eking spray out of the hidden part of the fire plug and they're kind of like huddled right next to one another to be close enough for any water to hit their tiny little child chests
What the fuck is going on? Could you not afford water? What is going on? Didn't have enough for the water budget. They didn't have it in the water budget, but they have to portray something other than Chris Rock's spare thoughts that were. Too good for Twitter. Oh, gosh. And because for some reason, it's very important that you establish that this takes place in the summer. But they can't achieve that.
And what you get is so cheap, wrong, and stupid that it sticks out amongst an entire movie that should stick out and grab you and be entertaining on some level. And this is as close as it gets. to Saw 4 when you saw Kramer's Taint. Remember, Patrick, glad everybody got that version. Well, they should have because... This is a PSA or public sock announcement. Experts have declared Bomba socks as the best way to warm up chili feet.
These pairs are super cushy, soft, and designed for maximum coziness. Plus, for every pair purchased, another pair will be donated, so someone in need of essential clothing can stay warm this winter. Go to Bombas.com slash listen and use code listen for... 20% off your first purchase. That's B-O-M-B-A-S dot com slash listen and use code listen at checkout. That and Wahlberg becoming friends with the rat. And then at one point.
You know, Chris Rock is supposed to go to his dad's for dinner and he meets a guy who's delivering food outside of it. And the restaurant's name is Taroni, which is kind of the... The combination of Terror and Rice-A-Roni, the Sonsville Cisco Tree. Like, I wish it was more this. Then I would have a lot more fun with it. There's another restaurant called Big Wong.
I don't know if you noticed that. Big Wong just has good dim sum is what it comes down to. I want Big Wong's dim sum. You know, Big Wong, you want Big Wong. We all want Big Wong. If anything, this movie has big Wong energy and that's the best thing. Hashtag big Wong energy. We did it, everybody. It's time to close up shop. It's not getting better than big wall energy. The other thing that drove me absolutely nuts throughout this.
is that there are moments in which people take time to put on gloves before handling Navidix. And then an equal amount of times in which someone's like... Give me that evidence with my bare fucking paws. I'm going to Crystal Lake CSI this bitch. They just put their fingerprints all over vital evidence. And you're like. Why did you put on gloves before? Why can't you put on gloves now? I don't need to see you put on gloves.
I'll assume that that happened in a millisecond, and this can just Kuleshov affect it into me believing that you put on fucking gloves. But the movie can't do that. It just has to be inconsistent. They're terrible cops. They're terrible at copping. The Saw universe, man. Saw and cops. They're just, they don't know what they're doing. Those cops, man. I don't, I don't know.
If it's that cops are really this fucking bad in Sonsville. Or the point is that all cops are bad and it doesn't matter that they're in Sonsville. But... none of the movies have an opinion one way or the other. And this film seems to be under a delusion that cops have almost not been involved in the Saw franchise at all. This is...
unspoiled virgin territory for cops to be involved in. Yeah, this is like, it's like his angle was, you know, what if we show the side of the police investigation into Saw's crimes? It's like... Oh, so you mean every other movie in this franchise? There's so many movies that the cops are so fucking involved to the point where one of them is a goddamn jigsaw. Is this supposed to take place in the same...
Because you'd think that they would know that. Do you think that maybe Saw is North Metro and South Metro is not as familiar with the Saw areas? Because they don't have... That level of underground zoo in the south part of the city? I do like that when they're looking through their little pile of jinx saw case evidence. They do have... cover of his Architectural Weekly Digest image.
Like, why is this evidence? This is the only picture we've ever had of John Kramer. And they just keep reproducing it over and over and over again. But at least that makes sense. It's not as crazy as the newspaper articles that show Jason in the hockey mask that show up in later Friday the 13th. captured him like Bigfoot walking through the fucking woods or whatever. Like, I don't believe a photojournalist was part of any movie I saw. Not to say one couldn't encounter him, but like.
Did one of them like take a picture of him underwater? Like the start of Jaws 2? What is going on with that? They were waiting. I mean, we just, we tend not to. fine movies that are just endless rants. And every once in a while we encounter one. And I think famously the rantiest episode of all time was the nightmare on Elm street. remake which we yelled at for an hour and a half and i think it is absolutely justified and i think this is the first movie that has that has angered me on that level
And I think it's the same reason. It's not that they couldn't, that Spiral from the Book of Saw couldn't be a good movie. It's that they... Absolutely took elements that could have become something interesting and went out of their way to make it suck. Yeah. It's not the kind of podcast I want to have where we're ranting and insulting people.
Um, it's not how it's occasionally funny, but, um, it's, it's not what I want to do on the regular because I want to find the best, even in movies that aren't, you know, commercially. or creatively successful i still want to have fun with them and this movie really works hard for it not to be fun which i think is a cardinal sin yeah you know the the listen to you to you earlier
You know, the two words that I would use to describe it, and most of the Saw movies in general, honestly, are dreary and nihilist. And, you know, and I realize that for people, sometimes that's a big pull. in in horror movies and and you know i don't mind dreary and nihilist but but for some reason i i think that what they're doing here is they think they're also you know
It's they're trying to say something sort of, you know, edgy and controversial. Right. They're supposed to they're trying to have a message with it. It's just I don't know if it works in this particular format. And I think a movie with a message has to clearly know what that message is. And occasionally cops are bad is not something. that I think needs a message. Certainly not this message. That is a subject worthy of examination.
And I don't think this movie cares about that examination. I just think it wanted to exploit a feeling and they couldn't figure out how to do it. And so they just did something. That's ultimately what is the most irritating part of this is that. Then choosing to do this something, it turns out to be a waste of 93 minutes. When, you know, he announces to Chris Rock's character his big plan.
is that Chris Rock will, you know, sort of sniff out bad cops and, you know, and then Saul will torture and kill them. I'm like, hey, maybe you should get involved in that business. It's better than what you've been doing before because you suck at it. Yeah. That does not sound like a bad idea to me. It certainly will save on taxpayer dollars. Like, he hasn't hit a bad target yet. All these people...
I mean, listen, I live in New York City. Do you know how much money we have to pay out every year to cops who get in trouble for beating up on civilians?
tens of millions of dollars get a saw get a partner in the police force yes just just somebody willing to to to to you know torture throw it and throw them in that toxic waste that gets released at midnight well that that's friday i know i know you gotta you could probably you could probably you could probably get people you can rotate ships um yeah i agree with you i mean listen lapd the sheriff's office the sheriff's office has a gang problem in los angeles
The sheriff's office has a gang problem. So like, would I mind a couple spirals come in? From out of town. Maybe clean up the joint. I wouldn't mind it in the least. I don't think it would be a good idea. Oh, but the robot dogs. They're going to be great. Gosh, don't. Don't even. Taking an entire box truck of fireworks and lighting it off in a populated neighborhood, which the LAPD did not in the 1930s, not in the 1970s, but literally.
In 20 fucking 20. Okay. That's a great fucking idea. But you know what? I propose spirals. I think we need a spiral squad. Spiral squad. We are not going to be popular with cops. No. You're going to be on a list after this. Unfortunately, my apologies, cops. But you need to look within the cop house. It's not a kill by kill problem. No. Anything else that we've left out of this just shittacular edition of Saw's Game? I just love that you just kind of gave up on going through the plot.
No, no, no, exactly, exactly. Yeah, it's just, you know, it is a half-assed procedural.
mushed together with it's really hard to even try to describe the plot if you were going literally like i thought about it and i can't because i don't i've seen this this was the second time i watched this movie for this and i still looking back and i just it like an hour before we started i don't remember anything that happens like five points i think i remember but that's it slips through the brain they're just and it doesn't have
as many crazy moments as I want out of a Saw movie in order to make a bunch of hay out of them. They're very select things. They're very hat based. Just. They, you know, they, they, you know, they, they, they really, you know, the big, you know, gross out kills right at the beginning, you know, everything else was just sort of, you know, whatever. I just.
There's not as much imagination on display. It's not that much of a quote unquote mystery. There are no, none of the plot twists genuinely twist. So you're just left with all these weird half measures. And I knew we were going to have a hard landing after Saw X because we were so surprised by...
the plot twist of, oh my God, they made us care about something, that anything that came after it was bound to sort of flop. I just didn't really imagine that a movie that was trying to do something different would... Different their way into the difference being it sucks harder. Oh, sorry, Chris Rock. Chris Rock is very rich. Yes.
He's got good money. He's fine. What if he was personally affected by this, though? Like he cries every night because this was supposed to be his maximum. Good. He should have done a better job. I don't listen. I don't, again, I don't necessarily, I might be team Will Smith on this one. I think maybe he should have been slapped fucking harder. And specifically for this.
With that being said, it's time to choose our own slap. I'm sorry. It's time to choose our own death venture. And it's where we decide. Of the death in this film, if we were forced to die in one of those ways, which one would it be and why? Up for bid, you have pull your own tongue off just using your own body weight. or you get run over by a train, guess what? It's both. Or you can have your fingers pulled off.
Or be electrocuted. I'm sorry. It's both. You can sever your own spinal cord or get smothered by hot wine. Oh, wait a second. There's no way even if you did sever your own spinal cord that the trap would stop. That's just... It's nonsensical that it's a choice. There's no choice to be had. There's no mechanism that detects when you sever your spinal cord, you're going to die by hot wax.
What's the fucking point, Patrick? I don't fucking know. I didn't make this movie. Get a shit ton of broken glass spit at you by a machine. I don't understand why it exists. That is not something someone assembled. Like were there pipes that were supposed to exist out of those two holes and he depiped them? How does that fucking work? Or you just get shot to death by the goddamn police because they see you are strung up on wires and go.
he could probably shoot that shotgun. That that's definitely a. Also, or you could be like, you know, some anonymous person who, who is, who is skinned and, and, you know, your body is, is, you know, used in place of someone else. That they apparently did not bother confirming. via dental records or anything like that, that it was, in fact, Shank or whatever his nickname was. They just recognize a tattoo and they're like, we'll find out who this is. That's him, all right. Fuck.
Because in advance of this plan, he got a tattoo of a child that does not exist. Well, his name is Dad. So I guess he can live on. And when someone asks, there's that.
Well, okay, that's fair. But it's also going to be hard to explain at police picnics or whatever the fuck he's going to do from this moment on. So, Alyssa, you're our guest, so you get to go first. Man. I think... my heart wants to say the tongue beginning death would be the quickest even though it would suck but also now that I've seen the whole movie and knowing it on a whole I feel like a part of me
you know intuitively would want to be the skinned rando because you never know he probably got shot in the head to you know it was over quickly and he doesn't know what the hell happened to him he could get smothered with sleep exactly as we all know is sawsville usa canada's number one producer exactly so based on my creative liberty to write the backstory to that i would choose that
Okay. Jaina, what say you? Yeah. I, you know, I think I'm going to take you because yeah, probably just some like, you know, he, he did say who it was and I completely forgotten, even though I watched it 24 hours ago. um so i'm just gonna like i'm gonna uh um uh retcon it that's just again just some random person that you know they picked up you know knocked out and skinned them and then you know they woke up in heaven
Surrounded by their loved ones. So, so I'm going to, that's what I'm going to choose. I want to get strung up like a puppet and get shot by cops because they have the green laser things on the end of their guns and I just find them cool. It is a cool visual. I just want to be different. I want to be different, like Spiral from the Book of Song. God damn it. The extra gritty. Go to our Patreon, where we have lots of episodes where we talk about things we love.
We answer your questions. We do movie commentaries. It's a goddamn good time. You should join us over there. Alyssa, what do you got going on? Uh, you can find me on, I'm usually just on Instagram, Alyssa Wag, E-L-I-S-S-A. And the Pillow Fright podcast is a thing. We are a podcast. We talk about all things horror through the lens of kind of the nostalgic slumber party of our youths, the millennial youth.
we filmed a Halloween special in October which you sure did and oh you saw it oh of course I saw it Patrick had a little cameo And that took, it was a labor of love and a labor it was. So we took November to just kind of recoup. So we are on a bit of a little recalibration break. But we will be back and we're at Pillow Fright Pod on Instagram. I love what you guys do. And I think the difference between you and anyone else who's doing it is that you all are creators within the space.
This is podcasting is not your end goal. It's just that you. are engaged in creation of horror content on so many different levels that it just made sense for you to talk about it in podcast form. Right. And I think that's a difference not... any other podcast can really claim when it comes to horror. I didn't even think about that. So it's very special and I love the three of you. You're fantastic. Gina, where can people find you on these here internets?
I write about movies and television and pop culture at my newsletter. Gino watches things at subspec.com. I am mostly on Blue Sky now, also under Gino Does Things. Yeah, so are we. Do it today, people. Check it out. Don't worry. The body count will continue. For myself, for Gina, and Alyssa, happy Sawsgiving. Bye-bye, everybody. God bless. Hey everybody, I'm Trevor Sikama, host of the PFF NFL show here to tell you what you can find on all of our shows.
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