Danielle Brooks: Mourning Pre-Mom Self, Embracing the NEW

a million other things. She just welcomed her daughter Freya into the world, and so it's a very interesting episode to talk all about her emergency c section which she didn't plan, her struggles with postpartum depression which she also didn't plan, and all of the body image stuff that comes up around pregnancy, having a baby, and postpartum. She just exudes joy and hope. I love her so much. Let's give it up for the one and only Dan

Yelle Brooks. You have had like a lot of changes in the past year issue to say goodbye to your Orange is the New Black families six years, you know it a life's like, Oh my god, we're so lucky. That's such a lightning in a bottle like situation. To get first of all, to get an acting job period right, To get an acting job that you love that lasts for a while is insane and then to also like go through all these life changes, you know, and you had a female boss who's like incredible and mine too.

I feel like Genji Cohen, who created Orange the New Black, and Shawna Rhymes are just like the best of the best in terms of like powerful women who are also moms and who are encouraging of you making a family while on your show, did you get pregnant and shoot at the same time. I literally got pregnant, almost not to the day, but almost the day after we wrapped. I was like, oh wow, I'm pregnant. Perfect but like what a great setup, and like, no big deal, But

you got engaged to death. I got a ring on it. I want to talk to you about a million things, but like just about you getting engaged. You got engaged after you had the baby. Yes, I think there's a lot of society tradition ship that we have to face as moms, and I think I just think you're already fucking throwing that out with the bathwater. But you were like, oh no, no no, no, Like I got pregnant, he's loved

my life. We got engaged. Like you're just not doing anything in the order that people are supposed to subscribe to. Have you always been like that? I think I have, but I didn't grow up like that. My family is very rooted in tradition in the church. Is your dad a no? No? My father is a dea, and my mother's and minister. So this was definitely not the order

that they would have liked it to go. UM. But I think I kind of always been the type to ben the rules and do it best for me um, which has always been important because I don't want to live for someone else's happiness if I'm not going to be happy. So did you find a lot of judgment, like with your family or friends at all when you were like, I'm pregnant and people were like what, No? And I think it's because I was thirty. I think it's because I'm like at that age with people like

are you gonna have a baby? You need to have baby? You know what I mean. So I think it was kind of like oh yeay, friendly versus and your family was just so excited about the baby versus the order in which you didn't. Well, that's good to hear, because I don't know. I'm sure other people in your situation probably would have had it and I'm a Southern girl, so you know, if you're from the South and listening

to this, I'm sure you get it right. Um. Do you play being raised religiously with your parents and the church. Do you feel like that will be a big part of how you raise Frea or is that a conversation you have with Dennis a lot that's sort of more fluid or Uh, that's definitely a conversation that we have with my fiance. Uh. You know, I think it's important that we're on the same page religiously, and luckily we are.

You know, I'm sure it can work in other households where you can be fluid and believe what you want, but it really works for us to be on the same page. So we're both Christians, and um, we plan to raise her that way. Um, but I also just want her to be raised, you know, like her name, her name is Freya. Yeah, tell me about that, Tell me about that. Where does the name come from? It's beautiful?

Thank you? Well, Okay, so me and him are both d's and we wanted d names that that didn't really land because we kept looking at stuff and we're like, okay, d Well, it's hard to SAYD because can you call each other D? Yeah? I got but it's like, okay, Dunn this, you know, you say your name and I'll say mine at the same time. If we land on the same d names, and that's going to be it. We never landed on the same name, and so he was like, what's open up the pool? Two different letters?

I was like okay. So I had told him the story about a young guy I met name Chosen, and I was like, I like that. It just had presents to his name the way he said it, and so I was like, I want something powerful and um he was like what about free? And I was like, oh, that's so good. Good Man is so well with me.

So he started looking up different ways free could be, you know, said or you know a name for it and eat saw Freda and it's actually this Nordic goddess who was like the goddess of love and beauty and war and all that kind of good. Come on. So we're like done. We were like this is it? And did you have a easy pregnancy? Was it hard? Was it like everything you thought and more? Did you feel okay? I did feel good. I mean I had morning sickness the first uh, you know, try master and then um,

things got easier. You know, you do start feeling like you're getting your strength back and stuff like you can do more, but they're always kind of was this like tiredness that lingered over me, but I just kind of leaned into it and I was like, I'm not going to but for you, I know, but now I'm feeling it. It's kind of a double edged sword because at first I really enjoyed the pregnancy, like I ate what you didn't do it? Yeah? Lord? I was like, I can't

tell my shoe can you do that? Then my pregnancy did not go as planned, which is fine. My plan was to go with whatever guy's plan was and okay with that. So I wanted to go natural, um you know, no epidural, no nothing, um and just see where it takes me. And I had people say, oh, would you do that? That's crazy, Like if you don't have to deal with the pain, when I deal with the plane, I was like, I want to experience all that. Motherhood

is like my thing. I want to I want to be that Amazonian woman that's like, yeah, I did that. Yeah you wanted to get into the Yeah. The Lord was like no, so one that ended up happening. Girl I ended up having to have an emergency C section because Freya and maconium in her system, which mcconium is basically when the baby poops inside their amniotic sect. So she was in distress and therefore we both could be in distress and we just had to make it happen.

It's interesting, I'm so glad to be talking to you because we've we've done an episode on C sections in the first season, but I actually can't remember if we've really gone into detail on an emergency C section, which sounds in my head it's like on Grey's Anatomy or something like all of a sudden, things are beeping and like people are running into the room, and all of a sudden, a sort of peaceful labor vibe goes into like def con for and it's really fucking scary and

you don't know what's happening. And that's when you know that doctors are like such miracle workers. I once asked my o B. I was like, how fast can you get a baby out if there's trouble. She's like, oh, I can get a baby out, and like twenty seconds or a minute and twenty seconds. I'm probably this is now through telephone and in my dramatic actress brain, but I think she said within like a minute and twenty seconds she could have you cut open the baby out

and like everyone, okay, um was it? It was exactly that horrifying scary It was of E R m H. It started out really smooth and she was like, oh, you haven't dilated with too cinames. I'm like, I've been like and labor for like nine hours. What are you talking about? And she was like, yeah, you haven't dilated. Just go get something to eat or come back, go home whatever. And like two minutes later she looks at

a monitor and the doctor doesn't really say much. She just starts calling other nurses and doctors in and they throw a oxygen mask on my face. They start throwing ivy in my arm, and now I'm not joking. It was almost about ten people in a room, a very tiny room now watching a monitor and telling me to stay calm when you just threw oxygen masks and ivy and my arm and you're telling me that my child isn't like her working like like they literally called it flatlining,

oh flat lining. When the heart rate goes like there's no activity happening, right, So when you hear that, you so I immediately started just praying and singing the gospel song and I know you really did. I was taking out the Oxen's like put it back. Oh, I was singing Precious Lord. Where was Dennis? Is Dennis when Dennis losing his mind? Like? Is he staying very calm for me? My Dula was there who also worked in pediatric for children who are in distress, so she knew what to do.

She was kind of a little more equipped than some of the other nurses, so um, having someone to advocate for me there was important too. But yeah, I just was like, I gotta stay comfort. I've heard when I have heard like friends who had emergency c sections, a lot of them have said they were just afraid, Like they felt very uninformed in the moment because I don't know if you would even understand the medical terms anyway, and so everything is just sort of happening around you. Yeah,

everything's happening around you. And I just ended up telling the doctor when things calm down, because they ended up getting the heart rate back up, and she's like, we're just gonna monitor you for a little bit before we go into the C section, and I said okay, and I told her, I said, please let me know step by step what is going to happen, because what happened in there was unnecessary. Y'all. Just talk to me, communicate with me what's going on, and I will stay calm.

Like for some women maybe that's not the case. You hear too much information, you freak out, But for me, I was like, I'm about to go onto a sixth section that I had no intention of having right now, so which is a major fucking surgery. And you're just like, I just found eight nine layers in your body, like I have apps right now. Okay, now tell me when they finally so they get the heart rate back up two stable, and then they say, does the doctor sort of drop the bomb like we're going to do a

C section? We'll see. I'm gonna tell you the T. I don't know. I can't wait. I think it's important to know the T. So the thing was I didn't have the doctor that I was supposed to have, because it's you know, if you don't know and you want to be in my most likely you might not get the doctor that you think, because it's just how it works, right. So I didn't have the doctor, but thank god I

didn't and I love her. But the reason I'm say I think god I didn't is because when the prior before getting pregnant, my doctor kept hinting to me that I might have pre aclampsia. She kept saying, pretty clampsy, is pretty clamsy that, blah blah blah blah blah. And I kept saying, I don't have it though there's no signs of it. I don't have high blood pressure. I don't have anything that's pre Clampsia is a it's basically when you have high blood pressure that can be dangerous

to the mommy and the baby. Yes, and it's this is very scared, like you don't want it, like they don't want it. But people like, there are a lot of cases and you can be three hundred pounds. You could be perfect, doesn't thirty, It don't matter. You could be so healthy, you could be not healthy. But it kept bringing in my ears. She kept saying that it might need to get um what was it called induced?

I didn't want to get induced, right, And then like she just kept kind of like saying the good reasons why it's okay to get a C section and all the stuff, and I was like, I don't want it. I don't wow. So all the doctor's appointment's fleeting up. She some some of these phrases and catchphrases and words

had been floating around. They were floating around. But if I would have had that doctor, I probably would not have gotten that C section because I would have felt like, oh, this whole time, she's been putting that on me, and now she wants me to do this and saying this an emergency. I ain't doing it. And thank god you know this. This new doctor said, look, I want to honor what you want to do. You want to do

this naturally. I want to help you do that, but right now it's not looking like that's the best thing for you. So I'm gonna let you hold out for an hour. I think we can do that, and after that, girlfriend, we need to come up with Plan B. And that's what we did. And I'm so glad it worked out that way because I just don't know if I would have followed through that C section and how that would have went down. Oh and how great. So you have

this hour where you kind of got less. You came around to the idea and like felt more like you were in control, in the know. Yeah, And I talked to my dol about it, you know, and I love her. My Da was really trying to say what did she say? She kept being like, oh see, I think I'm seeing some more activity on the monitor. Wouldn't happening on end? Now tell me about that this C section was it? Could you feel anything? You had already had an epidural

in or so they they did the spinal tap. Um. But but again I told the doctor, I said, man, tell me every step, and she coached me like the best, like what's the best football team that what's oh my god, you're asking Tom Brady, I don't know, yeah, one of those. So you're getting fucking coached through like you're a goddamn quarterback.

That's like the Patriots in this we like the Patriots, right, And she taught me through every step and they did the spinal tap and I couldn't even feel it going my back, and um, you know, but then all of a sudden, you can't feel nothing, like everything is. You just feel like a sixteen will truck is laying on you because everything is so heavy. Yeah, you can't feel anything. I had that feeling too. I had it, but I had it. Yeah, I had it epidural like my bottom

half were just Remember my legs were like bricks. Like. I was like, you can't lift them. They feel like a billion pounds like and um. Then I you know, I put on my playlist and the nurse held my hand and I told her I'm just gonna keep my eyes on you until didn't gets in the room because I felt like I was gonna pass out, you know, because I've never had any major surgery. And then the

important thing to remember is the aftercare. I think we forget to take care of usself after because I literally bounced up like I got this because you're so drugged up and you're like I can move that second acirl? Fight are you so sore? And just like and they're making you walk around the hospital and you can't even sit up. You can't get on the toilet. It's a disaster. Know, You're like, what is happening? What? Oh my gosh, it was crazy? Did they let you hold the baby? What's

the deal? Like? How would they better give me my baby? And how is your here? So did it take like six weeks? How long until you I mean you said you're still struggling. Oh, yeah, the app thing is fucked for a while. So I was on a commit having an emergency C section for eight weeks. So that's two months of not really doing much and it was hard.

To be honest, I gained sixty pounds being pregnant, and um, it's been the challenge because I had kind of branded myself and came into this world as like miss body Positivity and like you were on the cover of Shape, right, was on the cover of Coming. I mean I literally had a sixteen seventeen ft billboard in Times Square in two seventeen and me and underwear. I remember this so

well and I loved it. Like I was like yes, because I maybe I was doing wait or some on Broadway then, and so I think I was maybe walking through Times Square, but like I just remember seeing your fucking hot body in brawny panties. I mean I was like, this is like, this is the best shout ever. Tell me about how your body awareness and your body confidence has changed, shifted or every day it can feel different, you know at first because your stomach doesn't go down

right way. For me, I was in this like glorious stage of wow, I just had a baby. This is kind of cool, you know, like, look what my body did is changed because of this miracle, magical moment that I've had. And then after a while, when that big belly goes down and it ain't really going down as much as you wanted to go down side now I was. I didn't get down to add anything until two years.

After years, and I think anyone else is complete fucking bullshit, Like when you hear like how Hollywood gets their body back, give me a fun sorry about it. First of all, why it's so important what you're doing this podcast is so important because you we do not get saturated with that. We don't hear it takes two years. We don't hear you. Okay, I'm still you don't hear that. And I had absolutely no ambition to work out or move my body for at least a year or a year and a half,

and then it wasn't until I quit breastfeeding. I didn't feel like myself until my son was a year and a half. And I didn't get some sort of resemblance of what my body once was until two years after that's my story. Um, that's insane. I mean, oh wait, I think Hi, free guys, we're very lucky on this episode of Katie's Crib that the beautiful, one and only Freya has graced us with her presence. Oh my gosh, she's smiling and I my heart just stopped. How are

you breastfeeding? Did you breastfeed? How is that journey? I'm breace feeding, um, and I don't get that much, to be honest, one of these women out here, it's like such a such milk. I guess so angry at women who like just inst a story their refrigerators and freezers that are chock full. I'm like, dude, may not be sensitive, like that's not every woman is a milkmaid. Like, no, it's hard. Yesterday she looked at me bumping. She said,

that's all he got, little mama. Yeah, And you can't say ship like that because we're it's like you're in the hormonal spot where if you get an ounce, you're like I made that, Like that's that's it, and that's that's enough right now. Like just it's a miracle that any of it's happening at all. Did you, um always want to breastfeed with it something you really fought for. That was the first thing I asked the I was

just like, yeah, I presonator now. And to be honest, Katie, that was the one class at all the classes I did not take and I should have. And and I put that girl in my breast and the first time I was like, oh cool. But we struggled to latch her because she had such a hard bite. How these nurses would come by and put their finger in her mouth to feel how hard she was biting and how she was latching, and they're like, this is not normal, how hard she was. I hurt so bad. I felt

it like a vein in my back. It was like like sharp pains in my back. And I had to stop at one point, which I think stopped how much milk that was producing because my nipple fell off. Oh yeah, my nipple fell up to I lost nipple. And I'll tell you this stuff. I don't think we are given

an education at all in terms of breast meeting. I feel like everyone it should be included an insurance that a lactation specialist comes to your house, like three visits or whatever, because you even if you had taken that class. I have news for you. Read kid and Mouth latches different. It's such a personal thing of how it works for you. I had the worst time breastfeeding and I had postpartum depression and I felt like such a failure because breastfeeding

was so hard for me. So you had postpartum depression too, Yeah, I have. Um. You know, it's crazy because I've always been mis positive and I'm still that. It's very important what you speak over your life. And so I kept saying I don't have it. I'm good I have And then I had to just admit to myself, no, you have this girl, You're going through it. And it wasn't just necessarily crying out all the time and things like that.

It just was my like mood. I just feel so down sometimes, you know, and one minute it could just be so exhausted and trying to like keep up with the house, find a babysitter, you know, cook dinner for your partner, you know, make dinner for yourself, walk to stay in shape. But whether ain't helping you with nothing. It's raiding. So I've cried inside too, just everything, you know. But then I did counseling therapy and that has been so helpful. And my therapist said something that was so

valuable to me. She said, what's happening is you were mourning your old self. You were never gonna be that person again, that girl that was on that billboard that was miss thaying sexy hot. Not that you will never be sexy the way you want to be again, but you'll never be that girl again. And and it's okay. And the person you are becoming and the person that you are, has so much more value and it's such

a rock star. So embrace her right now, and then you'll be able to layer those things that you miss about the old person back into your life. But you ain't never gonna be that twenty eight year old girl. But you're not. And that's okay. Your body will be different, but it'll be fucking awesome. Like there are things I used to hate about my figure that I don't even think about anymore, and then there are new things about

like it's just different. But I think the thing that messed me up, Katie, is that you hear all these stories about oh breastbane, I lost so much way. Oh my god, it's like breastbane that gay so so did I Okay, I have a few of these asshole lovely friends who I love with all my heart, who are thinner than they've ever been for having a baby. That is not most women. Okay, that is a handful. That was not my story. I had never had bigger boobs like that, Like, I just had never even to my

point now said what is this? Seems like isn't that a good thing? I'm like, I don't know, no, And also like it took me years before I could like think of my boobs as like a sexual thing again, Like I'm like, oh God, like, don't even go near them like a that's like absolutely not until they were my own again. I think it was like a year after I had stopped breastfeeding. Oh my gosh, you guys, I'm sorry. Free I just gave me face again and

I'm just lost. She is so incredibly cute. Um. Did you end up having to go on stuff for postpartum depression or was it just therapy? Now I've chosen not to because I don't think it's that necessary. Um, But the therapy I'm very consistent with. I do about once a week going and that really is just helping me

a lot. How are you feeling about everything now, oh girl, I mean really trying to take this time, you know, being that you kind of in a way, you have to get me back in shape, you know, work out, work out every day and eat right. But I feel like this is gonna be over and I'm still not going to be happy like physically, and I have to just and grace that. I guess you said it's gonna

take time. It does. And then I just had a whole human being, which is a privilege because there's so many women that struggle to do that daily and it's hard, you know, and to be what I'm sure you've heard a hundred times, um, but it's to be kind to myself and that is a daily practice. Are there things that you do that are like saving you right now? For me, it was like if I could just take a fucking shower, that was like such a wind, girl. Yeah, taking a shower, Um, really that's been a big one

impression my teeth huge, it's a huge wind. That's huge, huge, I'm telling you there. That's that's like all of a sudden, life gets very very simple when you have a baby and you're dealing with postpartum depression, you're dealing with hormones, you're dealing with body image stuff. You're dealing with breastfeeding. The simple things of like eat a meal, brush your teeth, take a shower. It's like they're just like huge, nice for to get that gas out, that's what you want. Um,

Are you a meditator or like a yoga person? I wasn't, I like always trying to be, but now I wish when you've been pregnant. Girl couldn't tie my shoe, I couldn't bend over, I could barely get in the car. I mean, and I loved it for many of it, but now I'm like, I need my flaceability back. I mean stretching, but not Yoga is not really my thing.

It's too slow for me. It's too like I like pilates, though polates was fun when I did that, but no, I just get outside, walk two miles a day, three if I'm filling it with Frea or by yourself with Freya. And again like my therapist, she's wonderful, she told me when I go on my walks, to affirm my daughter. So that's what I've been doing. I put on some good music, you know, my walks I just look at her and say, you're great, good girl, You're smart, and

you fine girl. You're gonna be so kind to people, like just tell her, you know what I want to put into who she is. Um. So that's been good to like it to spend time with her. Did you feel connected to her right away when you were dealing with your postpartum depression? Did? I sept from the minute she came out. But I mean there are moments that I just want to take a break. A break is yeah.

I finally admitted to Adam the other day. I said to Adam, you know, I'm so lucky that I have this job where, like you on Orange and Black, like I'm in the ensemble. So there are weeks where I work really really hard, and there are weeks where I don't. And it's sort of the best thing because there are days where I'm so full on mom and there are days where I have to leave before he's out and I come home from shoe yes when when he's already asleep, and I told him, I say, I fucking miss that.

I really miss working and I really miss like not seeing him for one or two days a week because it just really makes me miss him. Now. Look, my kids a toddler right now. So ship is so real, but um in a different way than what you're dealing with being a stay at home mom. This is the longest I've experienced it, and it's UM. I like such such respect and like props to every women woman that either makes this choice because they want to or they

have to either one. But how did you and guaranting it at the States after oh my god, husband was doing it? You can, yes we did. My husband and I did waitress together. For you guys listening, I think allot of you know, but if you didn't, we did

Broadway together. And I had a seven month old and I was still really really struggling with UM identity stuff, and I was still very much overweight from how I feel good about myself UM, and I was really worried on being on stage because I um still hadn't really gotten control of my bladdery yet and I was like fucking horrified that someone was going to throw me around the stage and I was just going to like pee everywhere.

My first two weeks of my Broadway debut, I was literally in depends, like I was I was, I was in depends because I was just I was scared. I was so scared. It's come back around, thank god. Um, but you know it was awful, Like I every single night, I um handed my kid off to our nanny and I only put him to bed one night a week, and it was really, really um a struggle because I felt for the first time, like I really really wanted to be in two places at once and that that

was not possible. Do you feel like your child felt no good? Okay, I say this only because I was a nanny for like ten years, but it's definitely hard, and we say it on this podcast all the time, Like I don't really believe you can have it all. Like I think any day where you're succeeding as a mom is a day where you're not succeeding at work. And the day where you're on set till late at night is the day you're not putting your kid to sleep.

And that's just like you sort of hope at the end of the year that it's sort of equals out. I just think like if you are finding caregivers or if it's your parents or your partner or an auntie or whatever the funk it is, and that person loves on your kid. The more people that love your kid, the better. And when are you in, Dennis, Like, how are you guys doing? Are you even talking about wedding talk or you like, we need to get through this situation. Like,

I mean, we were talking about wedding talk until this happened. Um, you know, and we're all at home, so you know, I've had girlfriends have to cancel their wedding ione their weddings.

So luckily for us, we were we're never in a rutch, and so we've actually been doing merrit or counseling to make sure that we just set the foundation and that's good to go because I know this is my husband, don't give me wrong, and I know i'm his wife, but I think it's important to lay down the foundation so that when we're in this relationship and things get hard, will have the tools to communicate well with each other, especially they don't want a child into the meets. Yeah,

so that's what we've been doing. I'm just so impressed by you and your like ability to go for outside help. I think we've found a lot on this podcast that's so hard for women to do. To make it seem like they've got everything together or that's the thing. We're supposed to be fed. And if you look like you might not, or you ask for someone for help, you might feel shamed about it. But I'm just so impressed by you that you've got therapy when you need it.

I'm a huge I've been therapy for ten years, and that you and your husband have like an outside person to talk through all the stress of a kid, because it does, I mean, it takes a toll, especially like with what we do. You know, in this industry, it really is not set up to rust to win as couples. I think they're so looking for that story of like see another divorce or you know, such a such a such steped out of their marriage or something. And I don't want that. It's not worth it to me, you know,

to be a part of Hollywood. I don't want to that. I want my family to be tight, great, great mood. I just think you're amazing. I think you're inspiring as all. How um, any last bits of advice to women who are maybe pregnant or they just had a baby. Oh man, I just say, be kind to yourself and go with the flow. And that's in every stage. Whether you're trying to come up with your birth plan, you really got to go with the flow, you know, Or if you're trying to have a baby, go with the flow. Well

she had a baby. Go with the flow. When did you get any weight? Go? What'ss all like? You don't get too caught up in what you think things are supposed to look like, because what they will be is exactly what it's supposed to happen. And so just enjoy the journey, um and be patient. Patients, patients, patients. You are doing an amazing job, Danielle. You are. She's sitting here talking to me giving motherly advice as she rocks her beautiful baby on her chest with your headphones, and

you're doing it. You really are, and and it's really insane circumstances that you are doing this in with quarantine and coronavirus and it's scary. Thank you for taking time out of your day. I'm so happy to see your face and I'm so happy to me for you. Okay, thank you, Danielle bro Us. Bye, Thank you guys so much for listening to Katie's Crib. I just love that episode and I will always remember the image of Danielle singing gospel music in the room when she found out

she had to have an emergency C section. I love her so much. I hope you got a toe out of the episode. Remember to subscribe and follow Katie's Crib on all the socials. You guys are awesome. Katie's Crib is a production of Shonda land Audio in partnership with I heart Radio. For more podcasts from Shonda land Audio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Want to watch