This podcast is intended for mature audiences only and may contain content that could be triggering. Please listen with discretion. We learned in episode one that Stephanie had a normal childhood up until the age of about six and a half. Then the family dynamic shifted into a stressful environment when her dad became a pastor. Based on the content in this episode, I wanted to explore non denominational church structures. to see if there are any child abuse statistics available.
There are studies noted that abusive behaviors can sometimes be justified or hidden under the interpretation of the Bible. However, I dug a little deeper and I was able to find an article titled, Spanking Away Sin, Christian Child Abuse. It examines how certain Christian parenting guides interpret scriptures like Proverbs 13 24 that states, Whoever spares the rod hates their child, but the one who loves their children is careful to discipline them.
This verse is linked to cases of excessive corporal punishment in some pastoral families. Another sad truth is abuse may also occur when pastors prioritize their public persona or ministry over the well being of their children. And this can also lead to neglect and emotional abuse. I don't know what was going on on their end, but whatever that stress was, they started taking that out on me specifically. Um, and that's when, you know, picking your own switch started turning into actual abuse.
Like spankings became beatings. I think it had everything to do with, you know, being a good pastor. And then the larger your congregation is, the better, you know, that looks on your church. I mean, there's just, there's other things even outside of money that still make you look powerful. You know what I mean? Even if that's what you don't think you're seeking, that is truly what I think starts happening. We always had a, you know, spare the rod, spoil the child paddle hanging on the wall.
Um, yes, it did. And there was a scripture that they used to quote it. They would literally say we were going to beat the devil out of you in a literal sense. They thought if they beat me enough, that would do it. It's just like beating a horse. You know what I mean? To get them broken. That's what I think the approach they took to me as a child. Just because I, I think I just had a little too much spark and curiosity for them.
I remember being in my parents bedroom and I was, um, laying on the floor while my mom sat on me. And my dad beat me with a belt so hard. That it drew blood, welts, and bruises, and I literally passed out. I was told that I could not tell anybody because if I did, they would take me somewhere that would, you know, do bad things to me, like in foster care, so, and so I didn't tell anybody. I was scared and I remember going to school and this must have been fourth grade.
I was in the Christian school at this point and it was, it was hard to sit down in my, in my desk. Like my body. And I know they would always convince me that it was because I was out of control. They were convincing me they were doing this for my, the good of my well being as a Christian child. Um, my sister was born in 83, brother was born in 84. My sister said they were so afraid to make mistakes. Um, because every mistake I made, they saw what would happen.
I mean, when my sister and brother were around, they weren't getting beat, but I was, and they knew that they could hear me screaming. They could hear those things. Like there's no way that they weren't completely sheltered from that. But eventually when you were raised in that, you start just becoming a part of it. I remember when things were going well. And we were all like in line. I have spent time with Stephanie's closest friends during the process of recording her story.
I've loved hearing about the life experiences they have shared with Stephanie. Krista is one of those lifelong friends of 19 years. It's only now, like just now, just in conversations about this very podcast and her kind of rehashing her story in very recent conversations. A couple weeks ago, I had my hair done. Like that literally was just like the last time I can think of that she actually was thinking about herself as, you know, seeing that she actually was victimized in this way, right?
I just, I don't understand how a parent could ever look at that and say, it wasn't abuse. Because it, I mean, it literally caused physical harm to my body. It went beyond a spanking. If you've never attended a Pentecostal church service, it's an experience marked by passionate worship, a deep connection to the Holy Spirit, and a strong sense of community. where many feel the presence and power of God in a tangible way.
You're praising worship, you're, you know, speaking in tongues, they're filling you with the Holy Spirit. So you were speaking in tongues as a three, four, five year old. Absolutely. But you had no idea what you were doing. No, no. You just start saying the same thing that somebody else was saying beside you.
In some congregations, you could kind of hear the similarities and then you would go to another church and they might sound different, you know, you pick up on this, um, speaking in tongues lingo, depending on, you know, who you've been around and being filled with the Holy Spirit and speaking in tongues is supposed to be a gift within the church. It was wild. I mean, there were, there were times that I remember they would take somebody's legs.
Sit them down and realize their one leg was longer than the other and they would hold their feet and start speaking in tongues. And remember, nobody knows what you're saying unless there's an interpretation by somebody because God's given that gift as well. And then all of a sudden, they start praying and one leg would lengthen out to match the other, which It's, it's not real and, uh, you know, the body shifts or you can, you know, they could be pulling on one leg for all we know.
It's and nobody ever says anything or, you know, no, they just like think it's miracles of God. That's when everybody goes crazy and people start running around the church and I mean people, you know, will dance. I mean, dance their skirts off almost. I mean, they're just. It gets wild.
As a child, there were times, you know, there was giggling because you had that one wild woman in the church that would just, you know, go crazy and just flop all over the place and then fall out on the ground and start rolling. And I would just be like, Oh dear Lord. But I do remember. You know, giggling and if you're on the front row and you're the pastor's kid and you giggle, you're going to get the fire pinched out of you. So my mom pinched me a lot.
No, no, my brother, I mean, must've been maybe three. I was five and a half. I'm a six years older than my brother. He was the youngest. He was with my dad at a gym and like tiny gym. They had those iron ballerina bars. So the big heavy ones and, um, my brother climbed up on this ballerina bar and it fell over on top of him and split his head open.
They created this story that my brother was out of his body, obviously dying, that he hovered above and he could see the gym and he could see where he was laying on the floor. And he saw my dad slam down the weights and run over and start praying for him and he came back into his body. And at the time we were all praising God, this is a miracle, you know, we, I mean the whole church, you know, I mean, you're, you're, you're collectively praising God for this miracle. And all of a sudden my.
child brother, you know, has this story and we're like, yes, you know, we believe it. And, um, it brings the church together when things like that happen, which I'm sure was really good for my mom and dad in their first church. My brother was so young, he could not have articulated that story, even like verbally. Which, by the way, he was so cute when he had his bandage on his head. He looked like a little pug puppy. It was adorable.
Stephanie shares examples of her mom's gaslighting, and it's important to share what happens when a parent inflicts this type of communication on their child.
A 2020 study in the Journal of Child and Family Studies found that children who experience gaslighting are at a higher risk of developing anxiety disorders, depression, health issues, Let's say that, you know, when I wasn't quotation marks, you know, being rebellious, um, um, she would like have fun and laugh and, um, we could all have a good time together. And during this time, my mom started telling me stories of my, like, early childhood when I don't remember.
She also said she worked in the maternity ward and babies would come out holding IUDs in their hands. That is absurd. Um, that literally does not happen. And she would tell me, um, she was a psych nurse at one point, um, on a psych ward at least, and she was pregnant with me. I was born in 78. So it could have been the end of 77, but she was a psych nurse and this patient she had would like target her stomach when she would come in and throw things and curse it.
And so obviously that led her to believe that I was demon possessed, that when I came out, the umbilical cord was tied around my neck twice and I was black and blue. Then later on, she leads up to tell the story about. when I was a child and I was in a crib. Um, so I was small that she came in and I had bite marks up and down the backs of my arm and top of my back.
And I had handfuls of hair in my palms holding them and just standing up screaming, you know, she also said when my sister came home from the hospital that I put a pillow over her head and tried to suffocate her. And I don't remember being that kind of Sibling even to my sister when she came home later to find out in the evangelical world. There were stories of demon possession going around that literally fit that same bill.
So she always made me feel like there was something wrong with me from the very beginning. Um, I don't know why, but the stories were always extravagant and It goes back to the just never being good enough. Mm-hmm . For her specifically. My mom, she would tell me how many boyfriends I had in kindergarten and just, she said I would just name off all these names in kindergarten and I don't remember that at all. But I do remember getting in trouble for having a little girl that I liked
. And, um, I, I just think that's also very interesting that, you know, I think my mom probably early on, picked up. And the fact that maybe I wasn't, you know, a completely, um, straight child, just planting all those seeds, like even at a young age, I mean, we're talking about this was like fourth and fifth grade. Unfortunately, curiosity was labeled as rebellion for Stephanie. And when a child hears this repeatedly, it can have devastating effects for Stephanie.
It caused her to shut down, and she learned to stay silent. This was the beginning of her health struggles. These are stories just get worse as time goes by, and You don't realize this until you're an adult that everything you've been told about yourself growing up, um, isn't true. I mean, there's like an identity crisis. I was curious and, um, curiosity was not a good thing in our family. It was considered rebellion. Um, asking questions was not okay. I was that kid.
I had questions, I had curiosities. Everything was fascinating to me. I think I was a child that had a wild imagination, even like, that's why I could go out to my grandparents' house and spend so much time by myself, even as a young child, without having to be entertained because I didn't need that. I could make mud pies and ride the propane tank like it was a bull. You know? That's honestly like how I was. And so I think honestly too.
that my mom might have had a little jealousy because I was so loved by my grandparents. My parents are stressed. My mom's telling me crazy stuff about me that's not even true and. I had extreme stomach problems at an early age from stress and that continued to get worse. I was constantly always getting spanked or slapped, you know, something like that. But the significant beatings didn't happen, you know, like. every month.
Okay. It was more of regular hard spankings and slapping in between grounding, you know, things like that. And then a significant beating the hell out of your child every now and then. It's just like the whole family dynamic just became just, it was just not fun and it was, um, uneasy. And You could feel that hostility there, even as a child. So I think they were just trying to keep everything afloat. I think once I have time to myself to like, sit with this.
I have a therapy session Tuesday morning. Yeah, like all of that stuff. I think it's going to help tremendously to kind of know how to put these things into words. Because right now I don't even feel like I've taken the time to gather everything. I'm still just kind of like, like I said, I feel like a little floaty. I guess you could say. I think that's just a coping skill that I've always had. Unfortunately, it's like disassociate. Um, and that's not what I'm trying to do right now.
I just think I'm just, there's just a lot to process. And so I think my body is probably kind of protecting itself a little bit from getting overwhelmed. Who doesn't want to love their parents, you know, and want their parents to love them, you know, and I know she'll never know or realize that I have compassion for her and she went through things that were awful and who knows what happened to her mom. I'm sure the generational issues go on and on.
Um, it's conflicting because there's a compassion in me for her pain. And that pain she bestowed on me from childhood instead of getting help for herself. And so part of me resents her for that. And then part of me understands that she just. never found her way. My mom turned to God, put all of her energy into their pastoral ministry and just dealt with everything by giving it to God. I needed a haircut, walked in. She seemed super cool and just had really good energy. And so.
I just, she became my hairstylist as long as I've known her. Like, she has just been this, like, incredibly brilliant source of light in my life. And, um, in all these different ways, what's been amazing to me is the more I've learned about all the trauma that she's been through, that she's been that way despite that. I happened to be in Texas that summer with my grandparents, my Mimi and Pop Pop, of course, because I loved to get there as many times as I could.
And so I was staying with them and we got the phone call. That my parents, um, sister and brother and my cousin actually who was with them at the time had been in a car accident and they were hit head on, uh, by a drunk driver and this drunk driver owned a fruit stand on the side of the road and had no insurance. So that obviously wasn't good. And they were, there were five of them packed in a little Dodge Omni. Which is, you know, it was a little ice blue tin can.
A little hatchback, tiny little thing. Um, and it was a severe car accident. Feeling this urgency, like we need to get there. I remember my grandparents, they're like, no, we're gonna eat breakfast, we gotta do this. And I felt like we were lollygagging. I was like, we gotta get on the road now. And I do remember my Mimi getting a little upset with me, um, because I needed to calm down.
I was getting aggravated with them, and in all honesty nobody I don't think had told them the severity of the situation because it was pretty severe. I mean, I saw my dad first, and his, his scalp had been pulled back, and so. As a child, it's a panic attack. They had sewn him together, his whole scalp, and then it had iodine all over it, so it looked like he was just bleeding from his forehead. Oops, because it was stitched up. He looked insane.
I, you know, I just, I remember walking in and just falling apart. My brother and my cousin were fine. My sister, part of her intestine was messed up, my mom had gotten it the worst. I remember seeing her for the first time, they were wheeling her back into the room, and if anybody even bumped the bed, I remember her lips were kind of like a, you know, purplish color, um, and they would just start quivering, uh.
You could just tell the even with sedatives and morphine, whatever she was on, that there was still just a lot of pain in her body and she was, um, I mean, it took off some of her ear part of her face. They were doing some reconstruction with that, um, crushed her hip. You could just tell the even with sedatives and morphine. Morphine, whatever she was on, that there was still just a lot of pain in her body. I mean, she had been through the ringer in that car accident. It was really bad.
And so that was a lot as a child to take in. Um, then we're like away from our family cause we're still in Louisiana. My dad's pastoring this church that's falling apart. And we go back home to like our actual home in Louisiana from the hospital. And here they are now with three children. pastures. My mom's in a hospital bed in our house and cannot walk. And my grandmother, my mom's mother came for a little while to help out. She made me a cookbook.
And that way when she left, I could help feed my family. We may, I was a meatloaf connoisseur. I made some good meatloaves. That was the easiest thing. And, and I don't remember. like a ton of outpouring from the church. That's what I was going to say. You should have had like a whole entourage of people bringing meals, like everything.
And I'm sure there were a few that showed up here and there, but I remember like a pastor friend of my dad's coming, you know, our family coming in and out, but I don't really remember the church, you know, being there. So we did not have the support of the church. My dad had to give up his pastor position at that point. I mean, he couldn't. feed his family, you know, and couldn't, I mean, he was, it was, it was just a lot.
I was the oldest of the siblings and helping care for, you know, them as much as I knew how at that age and making many, many meatloaves. So, you know, like the church that my dad sold out to. Wasn't ever there to help. And I, it was, I just do remember that time being very confused. I had no one to express that to. And, and I think from holding that in and not knowing what to do with it, it just was. overwhelming at the age of 10 and a half.
And I was already overwhelmed because I had a mom in a hospital bed that couldn't walk and a dead scalp that made him look like a zombie. I mean, we're all alone here. Of course, that's another thing we had to praise God about the miracle that they lived because the car, the way it was smashed. So they also used that, you know, as a miracle testimony eventually. I don't remember if people were ever taking the time out.
for us as children to sit down and say, we want to, what, how are you feeling, what's going through your head, you know, nothing like that. It was more like we got to power through because your mom and dad need you. It was intense and it's kind of a blur. I can't remember how long it was until we moved after that, but it wasn't that long. Literally, I would assume it was like a few months. And so back to whole Texas again, like the five of us.
We ended up back in Texas and living with my grandmother. And you, you really don't have the emotion of you're excited because you get to be back by Mimi and Pop Pop or any of that. No, I don't remember any of it because I think that had started my downhill spiral because with the beatings I was getting, there was some trauma and now there's this accident and people are praising God because they're alive. And I just feel like the whole world turned upside down even more than it felt already.
So I became very angry at God. I mean, I was like probably 10 and a half and I started having suicidal thoughts already. this whole idea of my parents selling out to God to the point that our lives had already felt so different in the most negative of ways. And then all of a sudden they're almost dead, and they still were praising him like it was the only reason to, to live on this earth. And I just remember becoming very angry with that.
And the more angry I became, the more trouble I got in because I wasn't allowed to have that emotion. I wasn't allowed to feel that way. I wasn't allowed to talk about that feeling. And so instead, I just remember I would just lay down and I just write letters to God and tell him how angry I was. And I do remember. I do remember writing a letter one time and saying, God, I'm going to be a Satanist. Like, you know, I don't even know what that meant. But I, that's the only thing I had.
I knew there was a God and there was a Satan. So I had to serve one of them. But, not. Thank God they didn't find that. Oh my God, I would have been dead. You would have been dead. How did you know about suicide at fifth grade? Like. I didn't know that's what it was then. Okay. I just know that I remember writing those thoughts about wanting to die.
The suicidal feelings I think came with how angry I was and not being able to express it, but also having parents that were so disconnected from that feeling I was having. And they loved this guy that I felt like almost killed them. Oh, I can't even imagine the tremendous amount of stress that my dad was under at that point. Because my mom was not, I mean, I don't even feel like she was conscious half the time. I mean, she was on pain meds, you know, she was in such bad shape.
I would imagine that he was under a tremendous amount of stress and it's any security we had, I felt like just dissipated overnight in that car accident and this was all in the span of just four years. To me, my salvation was at risk. I just know that I remember writing those thoughts about wanting to die. Feeling that death would be better than what I'm feeling now, no one to talk to. And I was wanting to embrace it because life felt so upside down. Here we are back in Texas, you guys. Yeehaw.
Living, um, at my mom's mom's house in Hull, Texas. Where my uncles lived on the same block as well. My Mimi and Pop pop, they built a, a little room on the back of the house and that's where I stayed. It was off like the kitchen and dining room and then the back door, you know, just went, there's like a little, I guess you could call it a small hallway that was on the side of the bedroom. They built me that went out the back door.
Mm-hmm . So it was my own room, which was lovely because I was in sixth grade and you know, needed a little space. There was a brass daybed. I remember everything about my Mimi and Pop Pop's room, including the sachets of potpourri and all the pillows that made you have a headache when you slept. So, and so at this point, my mom is on a walker. Um, And, you know, up and moving around a little bit, I don't know what my dad's doing at this point. I have no idea.
I was turning into a teenager around this time about, you know, going into sixth grade and I, um, had all this pent up anger already because God tried to kill my parents and it's the same God that was also beating me. I remember yelling at my mom one day that I was going to run away because she was just badgering me about something and, um, she was like, fine. And she threw a garbage bag at me and I thought, cool, she agrees. I need to leave.
And I started bagging this and she's like, yeah, where are you going? And I was like, well. You know, I've got some uncles that live around here, like, I've got places to go, I know what I'm doing. And, um, I did not get that garbage bag packed before I was backed in the corner of a bathroom with her on her walker in between me and the wall. And she was raising a belt wildly, beating me at every angle she could figure out how to.
I realized at that point I had made a mistake, and I was definitely not running away. Like, she gave me the garbage bag, I really thought I was set. And it was a trap, Lisa, it was a trap. Sometimes I wondered if anybody noticed, you know? I mean, you just talk about feeling alone. I mean, you know, there's a loneliness in not being able to talk to anybody and then also being abused at the same time. Did your Masha know you were getting beaten? I have no idea.
But she's also the one that supposedly walked out of a room when my mom was being molested. I think I was, uh, disassociating to just keep myself safe. The pressure of everything around me and holding it in was, um, too hard to, I mean, physically feel. You know, so it was easier to just dismiss and almost be just out of my own body in a way. I was already drowning inside my own self at fucking 12 years old, you know. It had been 10 years since Stephanie had been back to Texas and Louisiana.
I wasn't sure how this trip would go, concerning the emotional triggers and her physical well being. We just loved her, and listened, and called it a day when she needed to wrap up. Um, and I think that's, right now I cannot process all that. Not on, like, not right here on the road and stuff. I gotta disconnect for a second. Well, it takes more than a night, I'm sure. Yeah, yeah. It'll take a little time. Of course. I can't even feel my ear yet. Yesterday, you know what I mean?
Just like my body is like, okay, your acid reflux is literally coming up through your nose. Um, your ear is feeling puffy and red. Like my body was just trying to tell me like, you just need to stop trying to figure it out tonight. Because I think there were just a lot of questions. Next time on Just One Person. I remember also, uh, just feeling so badly for that child back then. then now that I'm an adult. And I didn't know that.
And I gave up on me because no one had ever even given me anything like that to work with. Um, people pleasing. That's the only thing, you know, I had learned was people pleasing in the name of Jesus. It's a hard story to share. Consent and rape over the years. I didn't know anything about that when I was younger and just, you know, educating myself with things as I've gotten older.
If you or someone you know is affected by abuse or is in need of support, resources are available and we have them listed in the episode notes. Or you can call the Child Help National Child Abuse Hotline. It's 1 800 4 A CHILD. Available 24 7. You can also Also text 4HOPE to 741 741. We also have resources listed on our website at www. justonepersonpodcast.
com. Just One Person is produced by J1P Productions, executive produced by me, Lisa Bloom, lead producer and story editor, Carrie Caulfield, and our sound designers, Amita Ganatra and Alejandro. A special thanks to voice actor, Scott McKinley, portraying Stephanie's dad. Our heartfelt thank you to Stephanie's partner, Melissa Weaver, and my wife, Julie Koleski, for being a part of the podcast team. Also, to Stephanie's dad.
Stephanie's three close friends, Krista, Annalisa, and Bex, for participating in this series. Music for this podcast is from Epidemic Sound and Soundstripe, original music recorded and performed by our first season's guest, Stephanie Michelle and the Michelle Michelle Band. Creature's daughter, hollowed out to be filled up.