Part 2: Distinct and Diverse. A Discussion on the Artists Journey. - podcast episode cover

Part 2: Distinct and Diverse. A Discussion on the Artists Journey.

Apr 25, 202454 minSeason 2Ep. 4
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Episode description

Have you ever watched an artist wrestle with their inner demons as they try to capture something ethereal on the canvas? It's this very struggle between ego and insecurity that we unravel in our latest episode, where we uncover how artists balance confidence with vulnerability. We discuss the critical role of ego—not as a symbol of arrogance but as a beacon of assurance—and how this impacts an artist's interaction with the art world. Join us and a panel of artists as we share candid experiences of wrestling with self-doubt, all while boldly owning the title of 'artist' with pride and authenticity.

This episode also peels back the layers of complex emotions tied to visibility and recognition in the art world. Imagine the double-edged sword of yearning for acclaim, while simultaneously standing naked to public critique—it's a vulnerability we all know too well, but one that can lead to growth. We navigate the art of celebrating personal achievements, leaning on the strength of a supportive community, and managing the green-eyed monster of jealousy with grace. Our guests open up about the transformative power of encouragement and how fostering connectivity elevates not just individual artists, but the entire creative ecosystem.

Finally, we take you on a journey to the seclusion and inspiration of artist residencies like Pooch Cove, where the environment shapes spirit and practice. Through personal stories, we reflect on how spaces like these can catalyze profound shifts in artistic perspectives, illustrated by our own encounters with the vastness of nature and a community that feels like an instant family. We wrap up with heartfelt gratitude to the residencies that have rekindled our creative flames and tease the promise of upcoming museum visits and interviews. If you're an artist or just fascinated by the creative process, this episode is a palette of emotions and revelations not to be missed.

Artists in the episode:
@tynathanclark
@Moksananda
@francis.beaty
@audreycha.art
@jaclyn_gordyan
@giannatesone
@allisonhudsonart
@bonny_thomassen_art (present but not in the episode)

Send us a message - we would love to hear from you!

Make sure to follow us on Instagram here:

@justmakeartpodcast @tynathanclark @nathanterborg

Transcript

Artist Ego and Creative Process

Speaker 1

Okay , so here we are , part two of this incredible conversation from uh , from Pooch Cove and um Ty . You want to tee up the second part of the conversation ? Yeah ?

Speaker 2

You know , if you listen to to the last episode , where we really kind of went through quotes and things that inspired us as artists artist quotes and just wisdom from those around us as well , that really inspire our making on a regular basis we kind of move into .

Well , we kind of go back to a question that was asked earlier in part one about the artist ego . I think it was Gianna asked the question to everybody your light side and your dark side and embracing the artist ego and then Moksa said I think you got to kind of embrace both .

And then we ended up in part two going pretty deep into that and talking about that .

And then we also go into my two quotes that I introduced from Laurie Anderson and Madeline L'Engle and we kind of go in and discuss those and then we jump around and talk about the residency and what we're doing and what an artist residency looks like and how our time has been there .

And then I think it creates even more great conversation that we are having every night at the dinner table or for coffee in the afternoon and things . So again , you're here in spirit . We have a cup of coffee just sitting there for you , empty at the table . Come on down . I got a bed for you in my room so you can come stay for the weekend .

Speaker 1

Well , listen , it'd be at a spot like that , I'd be , I'd have my arrow press . I mean , I am a coffee dork , so I'd have my arrow press for my little little espresso shots .

Speaker 2

All right . Well , hey , listen , let's dive in and listen to it and then we'll we'll share our two cents at the end . Yeah , let's go . Yeah , I want to jump into the ego part real quick and I'm going to take this away from the art and put it on the artist he or she .

And I think you have to have an ego in the art world as an artist and I'm not saying like a cocky machismo that you know struts around like Andy with his crew and in 19 , you know seventies , new York , with the whole factory behind them on the street type of bravado but you need to have a little something .

Even if you have to put the Superman suit , like we've talked about before , you have to put the costume on when you go to the opening and sometimes , for some of us that are very introverted , we kind of have to escape ourself into that ego in the room .

And I'm not saying perform , I'm not saying be braggadocious , but you've got to have that chest out and be confident in your work . For the curators and for the museum directors and for the gallery directors to say I really want to work with this artist , and there's a lot of things that kind of come into that fold . It's not just that .

That also means take really good care of your work , stretch your work really well , make sure it doesn't fall off the wall when you put it together , be confident in your work but also be really organized .

Keep spreadsheets of your work , have your statements prepared before all the other artists there's a bit of ego on that and being more prepared than everybody else on the gallery .

I cannot tell you how many times I have seen a gallery director , curator , go Ty , thank you for being so organized , because they're still waiting weeks later for other artists , information scale , sizing materials , descriptions of work , uh , artist statements .

And I know you all I don't have to worry about any of you because you went through my class and so I pound that in . But that is a bit of ego .

Though it's , I am confident enough in myself to take care of the things that need to be taken care of , so that I'm always prepared and , like today , not everybody up here wanted to be up here talking today .

That's normal for an artist , but we have to practice talking about our work so that we're confident in a situation where people are watching and we can actually spend an hour and a hundred plus slides Alison . At her recent university museum show in New Mexico she gave an hour presentation , 100 plus slides . Right , I mean , what was that like for you ?

Because I know that's not your favorite thing to do .

Speaker 3

No , it's not . It took a lot of preparation . Yeah , so in order to do that and but I think also just to be an artist , to say you're going to be an artist and make art , you have to have kind of an enormous ego , you know , and I feel like we have that , but we're also I mean , for me at least , I have that but I'm also battling this insecurity .

You know , it's like these two things Some days I feel great and really confident , and other days I'm like you know , what the hell am I doing , why am I doing this ? Confident , and other days I'm like you know what , what the hell am I doing and why am I doing this ?

But I feel like that's , you know , for most artists that I know it seems to be the case yeah , I mean , I reckon you've got to put yourself out , haven't you ?

Speaker 4

and you've got to have confidence in yourself as an artist and what you're doing in the process .

It's a funny thing because I think , in a way , because of the nature of art and being an artist in a certain way , the more authentic and even vulnerable you show yourself to be , but willing to be out there with that vulnerability and authenticity , the better it goes . You know , it's not like for me .

You need to have an ego that's kind of armoured up and you know , and getting out there and stuff . It's quite a different sort of world that we're talking about and that's probably why we're all artists , because that's actually the way we want to operate , that's the way we want to be .

It kind of ties into my quote , but I'll maybe let it run for a bit more .

Speaker 5

Well , I'll say one thing I think , with the healthy ego and that confidence , there's discipline involved , there's a commitment to the bigger goal ahead and understanding this is not just a futile practice .

This is something that's going to pay off way down the road , and I firmly believe this is another I can't remember who I heard this from , but it's another like mantra and like nugget of wisdom that has , like , really kept me grounded is how you do .

One thing is how you do everything , and I find that that bleeds into so many different areas of life , both in the artist practice and just . You know discipline in general and my background as an athlete .

You know , having having competed at high levels and having to put my body through a lot to be able to perform well , like you need to practice , you need to , you need to be disciplined in certain areas that you , that you're very attuned to and aware to .

And I find that I've been able to apply a lot of those habits and mental frameworks of discipline into my artist practice and like , okay , I'm in the studio right now or I'm practicing , or like I'm at practice practicing , or like I'm at practice , what am I doing right now to to prepare , so then I can be ready for for the big day , for whatever it is ,

you know , my next goal , and then to keep working from that . But I definitely firmly believe , like how you do one thing is how you do everything , and I think as artists we don't . You know , sometimes I see this with like a lot of emerging artists and already you know , like people just kind of getting started out .

It's like they're doing it for fun or like a hobby or not really sure of the reason or the why and like what really truly drives them . And I think we all start to understand and tap into that and develop . You know , we go through life and we start to see more and more of why we do what we do and that drives a lot of our purpose .

But I think you have to do a lot of work and be really aware of of your motivations and that will drive each of your habits . How you do one thing is how you do everything .

Speaker 2

Absolutely , and I'm going to bring Audrey into this with a question for her because I think this feeds into that great the conversation we're having around this .

Because you had a really big shift in work and the first piece you had a really big shift in you entered into a group show , got into the group show and then they used it for the actual poster for the show .

And not long after that you also had a studio tour and we talked through those nerves and that anxiousness and those things of new work and people coming to see new work .

Speaker 6

Talk to us a little bit about that and then just kind of share what happened as well . Well , I think the shift that happened with my work was while I was going through your mentorship and you really really taught me how to make work .

That resonates with me and because at first , like Gianna was saying , like when we start we just want to make beautiful things , and like I mean I was like you know , as a hobby , and then I got more serious about it but still what was , I think , too much concern about the result .

And then with you , I really got into making work that was more meaningful , letting my unconscious make the work at some point and really trying new things all the time and new materials and just kept , keep , keep , trying , trying and then finding what was moving me the most . And then I think that spoke to people .

Navigating Artist Relationships and Jealousy

And then when I did my my studio tour , my open studio , it was really interesting because , like you said , some people like that doesn't , that doesn't speak to me , they're like that's fine . And because we talked about it , I was like and I think Jerry Saltz also says it and like a bad critique it's like or in the press field says it I don't know .

When you get a bad comment , it means you did something .

Speaker 2

Like .

Speaker 6

I mean it did something to her to be able to say I don't like it . I'm like that's great . And then , of course , other people came and I was able to talk about my work and I sold a bunch of things .

So that was like chariot on the top of the thing , but it was a very incredible experience and I think it gave me some confidence and to keep moving and keep working and for the ego thing , like we can talk about it .

Furthermore , because so much to say about that I think being an artist is for me , is the courage to be really seen and really deeply seen . And when you lean into that , I think it's really speaking to people . But it's not that easy . Sometimes it's insecurity , it's like vulnerability , and then you're happy to be seen and then you don't want to be seen .

I don't know , it's hard , it's hard , it's hard . I think there's like an inner conflict . Sometimes you want to be seen and then feel like you don't want to .

Speaker 2

It's so interesting and yeah when I think and all that the key to maintaining that confidence is having a network of artists around you .

I mean , honestly , we all know we've had moments where we've done it alone and some of us may kind of be doing it more alone than others up here and that when we have that other little just foundation of artists behind us , whether they're in Spain or in Montreal or whether in the Netherlands , and you can hop on Zoom with them or visit them at the pub or

the cafe or wherever in the Netherlands , and you can hop on zoom with them or visit them at the pub or the cafe or wherever in your town and just sit and talk about we usually talk about our losses more than our wins most times , cause in art you're going to have a whole lot more nos and losses than you do wins .

But the ability to sit and talk about the wins I just sold a painting , I just got commissioned for an installation , I just got into a residency Like those are massive . What they do for your confidence , but what they also do for the other artists around use confidence too , because they know where you're at , and that's I mean .

I think that helps our ego , that helps our confidence . Having the ability to talk to other artists about our stuff too is just so massive of encouraging maybe it's something that everyone here experiences , I'm not sure .

Speaker 7

But when one of your artists that you talk with a lot , or one that you admire maybe not admire when you talk with a lot you feel peers with has a massive win , my instincts , and I'll just say it is like at first I'm a little jealous . I'm like , oh man , I wish I would have gotten that right .

But I found and I was literally just talking to another artist about this today that I get more energy by giving them excitement back , by saying I am excited for you . You worked your butt off to get that . And while I'm saying those words , my mind like out loud , my mind shift , does shift to that because they get excited . So there's like I don't know .

I'm saying this out loud because I feel like there's a lot of you can sit in that anger , you can sit in that resentment , you can sit in all that , but it's not going to do you any good . But the better thing to do is to connect further and say I'm so excited for you , right , like , put your own ego down in that moment and just watch what happens .

It's incredible .

Speaker 4

No , no , I agree with that . It's really interesting and it's kind of like there's a moment when you can decide you can go one way or the other and it's like just making it a habit of going with appreciation , you know , congratulations , being generous in response , and it's much better for oneself , isn't it Much , much better .

And it just keeps connection , opens things up . But it's an interesting experience because , you know , as artists we're kind of all on our own and at the same time we're really connected and things do touch upon us . You know what happens to other artists and stuff . It's a really , really really quite intense practice in some ways being an artist , isn't it ?

In that sense ? You know the kind of ethical level and sort of .

Speaker 5

I relate to that , jacqueline , because and I think we can all say it too like I , I mean , I experienced a little moment of jealousy today with one of my artist friends who , you know , had this big win , and I was like , oh , that'd be cool . But then I , I had to take a step back .

Moxa , just like you said , it's a choice , I , I , I was like , okay , I , but I'm right here right now . I'm actually . I made a choice in my mind . Um , I had to stop myself and remind myself where I am at right now . At this residency . I'm living out a dream that I had for years . That's a huge win .

And just to realize and like , like , take inventory of , like , what's actually going on in your own life and to celebrate yourself for a second , that's something that we don't don't do , just like the small things . But , like you just said , it's a , it's a choice .

But it's really important for us to have that really solid again , like the sense of self , to know ourselves , and to look back on on things and say , oh me three years ago , or me 10 years ago , or you know , me as a child , wouldn't she or he be so proud of of me . Like , the competition isn't between each other .

As an artist , like we said , this is our network and our community and our family . Competition is ourselves .

Speaker 2

I want to jump into jealousy real quick and then we're going to go to Moksa for his quote that jealousy is the artist's worst friend it is . The destruction of the artist is jealousy . You look through history and jealous artists end up in very bad places or take their own lives or end up in severe depression or addiction .

And gosh , just thinking of how much is the pressure greater today than it was in the twenties in Paris or in New York . I don't know , maybe , maybe not . It's probably the same .

But the ability to be jealous quicker sure is here right now , because you used to have to hike to the salon or hop in a horse and carriage and head down to the salon with your pals and then you walk in and go oh , what he got in the show and I didn't Right . And then they have to take the carriage all the way back .

So maybe they had more time to sit with their jealousy after their friend gets this show . I don't know , but today it's so easy to sit there for an hour in the studio on Instagram and go F them Seriously , oh what . And then what do you do ? You don't make work .

Then all of a sudden you're curled up in a ball , watching Netflix on the couch , drinking a glass of wine , you know and that's . And listen , we've all been there in one way or the other . Somebody gets the show over you . Somebody's work gets placed in the better location , even though you don't feel like it's stronger than yours .

You get put by the bathroom or the bar where everybody stands and nobody looks at . We've all been there . And then we walk around the room . Instead of enjoying our accomplishment and that new line on our CV , we walk around the room given the finger to every other piece that's in a better location than us . So , but then what do we do ?

Instead of celebrating , we go home and we're down and we can't stop thinking about it and then we have to find a way to crawl out of our hole .

So , just for everybody listening , you know , take time , not scrolling and comparing and being jealous like celebrate your accomplishments and even if you haven't had a show yet or anything , don't forecast your jealousy .

Just get in the studio and work harder in the little amounts of times or the greater amount of time you have to make work and , like everybody set up that's up here , be bold , get your work out there , ask questions , find people to help you . I mean , I can't tell you how many people I have sent emails to Julian Schnabel .

You get them from me every three or four months for the last five or six years . You know like asking please mentor me . How do you balance film and art ? How do you do it ? Can I just get 15 minutes every month of your time ? 10 minutes , be bold , get your . Apply for shows . Find ways . Hey , I don't have $45 to apply to your show .

Would you still let me apply anyways they might . To apply to your show , would you still let me apply anyways ? They might say yes , because who asks that question ? Nobody . We all pay the 45 . Just a hint . Um , no , well , at least 340 people or something like that . Anyways , um , allison , did you want to add something ?

Speaker 3

oh yeah yeah , I was just gonna add to that that . Um , you know , when you're supportive of other artists , you I'm in a group of like four artists in my studio building and we've all been .

You know we're all applying to things , people are getting into different things , but you know we're all really supportive of each other and I think it just creates more and more positive energy and it just feels like then we're just like on a roll , then we're just like on a roll .

Speaker 4

But no , I was just going to say and maybe it ties into Quo and this is maybe a bit idealistic , but to do with the jealousy thing and stuff I sometimes reflect on , well , you know , supposedly I'm an artist , so I'm kind of I've given myself to art , so kind of like the spirit of art , to put it like that .

So when I can contact that , it doesn't matter if it's me or somebody else that is getting the art out and into a show , it's , it's the fact that art is getting out . Do you know what I mean ?

So it's , yeah , I mean I'm , you know , I'm completely insignificant as an artist in the overall thing , but I doing my bit to keep , keep the flame alive or something like that , you know , without getting overly romantic , but it's that kind of thing . So , yeah , my quote is from agnes martin who , as you know , is definitely a , you know , hero of mine .

Um , her dedication to her way of understanding art and her artistic process , creative process Lots I could say about that , but the quote is actually to do with her commitment to a way of life that supported her artistic endeavours . So the quote is the artist tries to live in a way that will make greater awareness of the sublimity of reality possible .

Her artistic process , she says elsewhere . My interest is , she says elsewhere , sorry , sorry . She says elsewhere that her interest is in experience that is wordless and silent and the fact that that experience can be expressed in art that is wordless and silent .

So she is definitely you know she's a great admirer of Rothko as well and definitely trying to express through her art a transcendental reality , if you like , or a deeper reality , but not only , you know , trying to express it through her artwork .

But to do that , you know , being very honest about the need to actually dwell in that kind of awareness to be able to then express it through art . So , again , it's the artist tries to live in a way that will make greater awareness of the sublimity of reality possible .

So I guess what you know it's to do with how being an artist is more than just , maybe , in the studio , making art . It's about , it's actually a whole way of life , a way of being and a way of living . And yeah , I mean that , to be honest , is what really , really interests me about it . Well , and what we're trying to do .

Artist Residencies and Creative Freedom

Speaker 2

Being an Agnes Martin fan as well a Martinite , you know she and haven't seen a lot of her work , from her early work to her later work , and seeing that development and also knowing her story . If you haven't read Ninth Street Women , I encourage everybody out there to read it .

It's one of the greatest pieces of chronological history ever written about female artists .

And you look at the artists that she came up with in the same little area , with Grace Hartigan and Elaine de Kooning and Helen Frankenthaler , joan Mitchell , lee Krasner in New York at the time right , busy , loud , a complete opposite of who Agnes evolved into Loud , busy , crazy . They're always at Club Car and all these places over beer .

And you have Pollock and you have Rothko and you have all these other artists around Clifford Still , everybody from the New York Art School that was there learning together and developing this entire new spectrum of thought which is expressionism through abstract work . And some are quiet and listening , some are loud and boxing .

You know Pollock throwing over tables and guys getting in arguments , and you know Joan with her bravada and Lee owning the whole table in her own . You know and so .

But then you have Agnes , who's I can only imagine , having seen interviews and watched her just taking it all in and going back and thinking and going back and then eventually retreats to New Mexico and really lives out the rest of her life in solitude in her studio , working these things out through herself and her work in silence .

Speaker 7

yeah , do you think that her I'm asking because I don't know enough about her her retreat had a lot to do with , sort of like , having a lot of conflict with the way that things were moving ? You think which is always in her to be that way , or do we know why she decided to take that retreat outward ?

Speaker 4

well , I know , I know that I don't really , you know , know who knows . And when she did first go to New Mexico , she actually spent five or six years without doing any artwork , you know . So there was a lot more going on . You know she felt that need to retreat and to withdraw , and I know that she's . You know what she's written in the document .

What she's talked about is that incredible . Know that she's . You know what she's written and the document . What she's talked about is that incredible process that she went through , where she had to just be in a space where she could go deeper into her own awareness and a sense that that it was her own awareness , mind , consciousness .

That was , that was what she wanted to get to a place of purity in that from which she , she could create . So I imagine a very meditative kind of lifestyle , yeah , and and just the need to be in that kind of space and maybe it was being in new york and surrounded by all that she began to kind of get a sense of who she was as an artist .

You know , with all those stuff going on , and just the courage , you know , to recognise who she was an artist and to do what she needed to do in order to be true to herself as an artist , and it's pretty extreme in her case .

You know , and I , I just , yeah , definitely have myself as as an exemplar of of what's needed in some way , you know , whether it's redrawing or whether it's being in New York right in the midst of it , but doing what we need to do .

Speaker 8

Just to add to that , I totally agree with that . They say oh , make the work , make the work . I think we all need to not be afraid to have a dry spell and recognize if you're not being productive that doesn't mean you're not doing what you need to be doing . You can't always be producing , Just like these residencies , it's process .

But even a dry spell where you can't always be producing , just like these residencies , it's not necessary , it's process . But even a dry spell where you don't want to do the work , then something else is necessary for your being and hear what your body's telling you in your mind . Don't feel that you're some kind of production machine .

You know , and that's what she took the time and proved that for her that was her salvation . So everybody needs those dry spells . Get away from it all and and and . Don't feel guilty . You don't have to explain it to anybody . It goes back to nothing's logical . You don't have to explain it . But if you're not feeling it , you're not feeling .

Feeling it , and don't let it do you in . You know it's just part of the . It's for me sometimes it feels like a game sometimes , but you're going to win and you keep saying I'm going to win , I'll get to the end , but I'm just not in a good place right now .

Speaker 5

Okay , move on , anybody want to add to that . I resonate with that . Just coming from New York and now being here , the complete opposite . It's only been not even a week yet being here in a completely juxtaposing environment from Manhattan , and I feel like my spirit is finally settling . I can and I only know what the next three weeks are going to .

I don't , I don't even know what the next three weeks are going to be like and what what I'm going to see and feel and experience . As you were speaking that quote , it's just like that . It hit me so deeply . I'm like , oh my gosh , that's that's what I feel like I'm I'm going through right now . So that's going to be really interesting .

Thank you for sharing that .

Speaker 2

Hold your thoughts because we're jumping into residency next . All right , I'm going to jump into us being here doing an artist in residence together , because I'm sure there's a lot of listeners who are curious about residencies . I know I was when I was a young artist and just starting out . What the heck is this residency thing ? What's it about ?

And , like I said before , we're all here for a month at the Pooch Cove Foundation that is a part of the James Baird Gallery that we're sitting in right now in one of the gallery rooms , and for a month we'll all be here researching , making , creating , hiking , spending time in nature , et cetera .

So my quote leads into this conversation and so I'm going to read my quote and then I want we'll take some time for each of us . Just kind of I'll open up questions just about how you feel so far in our first week away from life and here in the residency . How are your thoughts different ? How are you know your process is changing ?

What has the scenery done for you ? I'll kind of prompt a little bit . Here's my quote that I think really kind of encompasses probably what we've been feeling .

I tried to find one that really fit , and this is by probably my favorite author of all time , madeline L'Engle , and she says when we are writing or painting or composing , we are , during the time of creativity , freed from the normal restrictions and open to a wider world where colors are brighter , sounds are clearer and people more wondrously complex than we

normally realize . Let's say it one more time when we are writing or painting or sculpting or composing , we are , during that time of creativity , freed from normal restrictions and open to a wider world where colors are brighter , sounds are clearer and people are more wondrously complex than we normally realize .

That is Madeline L'Engle , and so I really thought that quote fit well , because when you think about really being freed from normal restrictions in your studio , we are even more freed , being away from the other everyday life restrictions that could creep into the studio at home , restrictions that could

Connection and Inspiration at Pooch Cove

creep into the studio at home . How has your time been mentally , physically , thinking through where you might go with your work since you have gotten here to pooch cove ? How has nature , the landscape , the new space , the people already been speaking or influencing you ?

Speaker 4

I don't really know , because I'm sort of still in it in a way . I think there's different aspects . You know , there's just a studio space , so I've got a much bigger studio space than I'm used to . And you know , as you know , I'm trying to do what for me is a massive painting .

But being in this environment , so being somewhere that's just more isolated , wilder , the ocean , the walks we've had , just feeds my soul , feeds into my soul , but a big part is being with all you guys and what we've got going between us .

I think I've fallen in love with all you guys you know , and what we've got going between us , you know , I think I've fallen in love with all of you , even Ty . No , you know what I mean . I was thinking it's like , wow , this is just amazing , you know .

I mean we hardly know each other in a way , and some of us you know , and yet , anyway , so that's all going on feeding in some way , you know , and at the same time , for me there's a kind of growing perspective on my life back home , because I'm away for a month and that's really valuable , really , really valuable , and to feel afresh or not afresh , but to

feel the connection with my loved ones and my friends . I feel like I've been here already a month .

Speaker 8

I'll second that it's kind of like we became an instant family and it sounds kind of corny , but that's how I feel it . I've done other residencies and I come away with the same feeling and I think it's because everything is so pure here .

We don't have the other distractions we can share about our personal lives , but the connections happen very genuinely , I think here Because we're all setting ourselves up for who knows what we went into this with .

Well , we'll see , it's a grand adventure we're all in together and it's just that whole family feeling , if you believe in family , and I think family is the main connection that we all need to see globally . And if more people were like this , let me not get like , oh kumbaya , and all that .

But I truly believe these are the things that keep me going , the connections I make with the people . As far as the work I just already I can just say something really magical is happening with me , because for a while I was all about straight lines . So now I'm doing all these curvy lines .

So I know something's bubbling and I'm so excited already and it's probably that water bubbling and I'm so excited already and it's probably that water . Um , but it's also the , the feeling I have and the vibe . I hate that , but that you're all giving me .

Speaker 5

So I just want to thank you all I don't know about you guys , but I cried when I saw the ocean and went and like kind of just felt it and you know if that makes sense Like sat there and really took it in , like water is a huge component for me . To experience Something outside myself makes me feel so small .

And it inspires me and humbles me and there's something so incredible about it and it's interesting . I'm like feeling emotional talking about it right now and , as I alluded to a little bit earlier , coming from New York , you know you don't get that same feeling , especially with these these crazy powerful waves crashing up onto these rocks .

It's like you don't go in that water , you can't , like there's a respect and a reverence there , and I think that's something .

It is now just kind of hit me and I think that's going to continue to really sink a lot deeper , like throughout these next few months , just like this , this humbling , because I , in a way , I feel like I've accumulated some extra layers of armor and protection , not just not just in my move to New York , which was very recent , but just over the last few

years , like all these layers that I've told myself I've needed , or I thought I've needed , whatever out of fear really , and now I feel like I'm starting to let a lot of that go and it's I can already . I can already experience it and feel it .

And I had this moment in the studio earlier where something had , like earlier today , where something had finally kind of clicked , like they're like a little puzzle piece , just kind of like fit , and and I it was like an answer , like multiple answers , to questions that I've had over the last like two months , especially um that I that I could not access ,

especially being in the city . I moved to the city thinking like , oh , I'm gonna , you know , really expand and there's gonna be all this , you know learning , growing .

Speaker 4

Don't get me wrong it is .

Speaker 5

it has been really moving and really needed , and I've grown a lot , but something I thought would give me the answers has not .

It has not done that for me and being here unexpectedly welcoming things that are just so natural and beautiful and pure have started to wow me in ways that I couldn't do or cultivate myself and that , I think , is going to be extremely pivotal and , again , humbling .

Like I know , this is just the process of purging some things that I didn't , that I don't need anymore , so stay tuned .

Speaker 3

Yeah , I mean , for me it's a lot of different things . I mean the nature . You know , I've been in Philadelphia for a couple of years now and I haven't really seen nature like this big wild nature . So I mean especially the ocean . And I've started to paint with blue , you know , really use color .

And then all of a sudden I woke up yesterday and I started that with these big blue things on paper . I'm like what , what's that ? But also I live in solitude and you know , having this community , you know , is just amazing , just amazing .

It's like camp , you know , it's like I don't know if everyone ever went to overnight camp but it's like you have these , form , these like connections really quickly , cause you're like living with people and you're eating with them and you know you're spending a lot of time with them .

So it's like it's magical and as far as like where the work goes , I mean I feel like years from now , you know , I'll probably start making something and be like wow , I think that probably came from that time and pooch code , you know . So I think it's just going to keep , keep coming .

Speaker 6

Like , like everyone said , the community we immediately created all together . We kind of knew each other almost like by zoom , but it's not the same through your class , but being together for me is a very important aspect , because I don't have that community of artists at home at all , um , I only have it through Instagram and like digital world .

So that has been , for me , like incredible and we immediately like formed something really like a family , like you said , and I think that's going to last like after this .

So that's really really precious and all you said like I think the scenery , the nature , the landscape , the mountains , combined with the ocean , for me it's just like over , like overwhelming , like I can't even describe what it does to me yet , but it's just in a state of awe , like all the time we go hiking and just want to do it more and more , and I

feel that these feelings I get when we go on the mountains . I think they're feeding me with inspiration that will go on in my work here , but that will go , like you said , alison , beyond being here , and for me it's a privilege to be here , not to have to work on my other job and no kids and no other people to take care of or no responsibilities .

For me , it's really new to experience that . So yeah , I just already don't want to leave this place .

Speaker 8

It's only day four , right ? I'm like it's only day four .

Speaker 6

I know it's only day day five five .

Speaker 7

It's four for me , but I do it at the same time , so it's fine .

Speaker 6

So I'm like , oh my god , I don't want this to end ever . When are we coming back ?

Speaker 7

yes , james , when are we coming back , yeah , so yeah , I'm .

Speaker 6

I have so much gratitude of being here I want to add another .

Speaker 5

Another thing , and and on terms of the the community and the family feel , there's this , there's like a really lovely sense of safety that I feel like I'm able to like experience these emotions and express that I , what I am , because there is no judgment , there is no , there are like no walls between any of us .

It's like it's a really beautifully unique thing and I'm really grateful for each of you like it's very much like family , like I knew a few of you prior and connected in special ways , but it's um , it's really really unique and I this is setting a really high standard , I get .

It is like this is my first , this is my first residency , and it's it's really really unique and I this is setting a really high standard . It is like this is my first , this is my first residency , and it's it's setting a really setting the bar pretty high , so , which I think is a really good thing . So I love all of you .

Speaker 7

Well , journaling is a big part of my art practice and what I know so far about what it's doing for me . Well , I came in , so previously I was journaling a lot about what do I want to get out of my time , and generally it was very . What I was able to come up with before I got here was very functional .

I wanted to focus on 2D work and see how to connect my 2D and 3D work together , and then life has a way of just really turning stuff up for you , and literally a couple of days before I got here , some terminal illness really rocked my family and I had to pivot my flights and do a lot of different things , and so , as I was arriving here , my brain was

just not here yet . But what this place has done and people have done is sort of given me space to express those things . Right , I think a lot of you had shared some things that were going on for you before you got here , which gave me permission , in a lot of ways , to say , okay , we can go deep , which is like my favorite place to be .

Um , and I was able to share some of these hard things , and it's been . I guess I said it was day four . It was tech the day five . It probably took me about maybe until like this morning to finally be able to put down a lot of what that was .

So I could sort of , you know unconsciously process it while I'm making work and it's a very strange place to be in , I guess I should say to feel like I want to be open to everything but to have to I don't know compartmentalize things at the same time in some ways . You all have been so wonderful about all of that and I appreciate it .

Speaker 2

you even let me cry at coffee the other day , so thank you this is the awesome thing also about a self-directed residency , and , and what a self-directed residency is exactly what those words are is you direct yourself in whatever way , shape or form you want to while you're at the residency , and , and so there are plenty of residencies that are very focused .

They could be research focused , they could be sculpture focused , they could be a certain form of painting focus , but this is self-directed for this month . We get to kind of do what we want to do . If you just want to research , you do research . If you just want to work on sketching , you can work on

Artistic Reflections and Residency Recommendations

sketching . One of the previous artists from Argentina who works in light was going back to some old forms of paintings he had done years ago just to see how those two could reflect when he returned home . And so , coming here , I had stuff packed , I ordered things I didn't know . I ordered , left things at home .

I knew I had left at home and sure would have loved to have now to keep my bag weight down , but I also knew that I was going to really take time to listen and pay attention .

As one of my quotes down there my favorite , laurie Anderson , says art is about paying attention , and so I knew I wanted to spend an enormous amount of time up front paying attention . I don't know what I'm paying attention to . Is it the nature ? Is it our hikes ? Is it the ocean ? Is it the company ? Is it what somebody may say while we're having coffee ?

Is it my work ? Most of you know out there , my work's based on memory and the topography here has all the places I grew up wrapped into one .

So in California , from my grandparents in Santa Barbara and Monterey and big Sur area to my backyard and forest Hill , california and Tahoe , like all these things , it just seems like each trail I go down I'm on a nut , I'm eight , and then I'm 12 , and I'm 15 and I'm back to four and it's so .

It's just been really cool to experience those , the smells , even just the smells , the sites . You know my dad and I were texting about it earlier . He's like , oh , that looks just like I was , like you wouldn't believe it . It's incredible . It's almost like there are moments where I can come around the corner and hear my grandfather yelling from the beach .

You know , those things come back and rush in and that's paying attention , right , and how will it reflect in my work ? I don't know . I set everything up in my room and I just sit and just allow all those thoughts and then I write and write poems and just write those things again . That's what .

That's what the beauty of art is If we are paying attention , we will speak to ourselves and something will come out , and that's the beautiful thing about it . So , as we wrap up , I just want to let you guys know out there and gals , look at residencies . They're great for you to break out of the monotony of where you are .

Go to a new culture or a new city , even if it's in your same country or state . It takes you to a new location that provides new ideas , a new life in your soul for a moment . They range from a week to three months to six months . Some are funded , some you pay for . The ones that are funded are a lot more competitive than the ones you pay for .

But there are plenty of websites . We'll list them later but Artenda , resarts , transartistscom there's plenty . Just look up artist residencies online . You'll get a list of multiple residency sites that just list by country and they're all very detailed . They tell you what they're looking for , how long it is , if there's costs involved .

They're really , really self-explanatory . So I would encourage you , if you're a young artist or you're an artist that's looking to break out of where you are , look at a residency , research them , find one and start applying . Thanks for joining us today . I had a blast . I hope you all , listening or watching , had a great time .

And , just to remind you , we do have a YouTube page , and on the YouTube page I will put up B-roll and video of Pooch Cove , where we are as we're talking about it .

I'll also put up work from the artists that you see up here so you can see what their work looks like , and pictures from while we've been here at the residency , of our studios and things like that , and I can't wait to share Bonnie's work as well , who's watching us from the grandstands . We love you , bonnie , and we're glad you're here with us .

So , anyways , thanks for joining us . Nathan and I will be back I don't know next week , a week after , I'm not sure . So we've got some other really special interviews with other artists that are joining us , and I think we're going to end up popping into some other museums and recording from a few museums down the road too , like the Clifford Still episode .

So have fun and don't forget , just make art .

Speaker 1

Bye , yeah , so I I love Mox's perspective around leaning into both and I think that's a very Jungian sort of embracing the shadow self , you know , approach of not resisting or trying to pretend as though those dark thoughts aren't there . It's acknowledging their existence and then figuring out , you know , what to do with them in a healthy way .

So , in the context of your discussion , it's not , you know , feeling that pang of jealousy or that pang of that , that , that that sense of oh , that could have been me , even that maybe that should have been me . It doesn't make you a bad person . It doesn't make us bad people . I've experienced it , we , we , we all do .

It does make you a person , you know . So , yeah , check that you're a human being . I think what is really important and what you guys did such a great , just a magnificent job of really breaking down and I just want to honor everyone's vulnerability and authenticity .

I'm not surprised , again , just knowing everybody there a little bit and some of some of you a lot , but in that context I wasn't shocked by it , but it was just really cool to hear everyone just admit like , yep , me too I've definitely had feelings like that , I've had thoughts like that , which , again is just yet another , I guess check in the box of surround

yourself with other artists so that you can sort of check your thinking and realize like , oh , it's not , it's not just me that has thoughts . I'm not a bad person , I'm just a person who has very natural reactions to things .

But when people , and pretty much everyone , shared a version of that sort of like self checklist or auditing their own , like all right , I'm feeling this , what do I do with it ? Like that's , that's really the important part . You know , thoughts are just thoughts , feelings are just feelings . What do I , what do I do with those ?

How do I process that and channel it into something else ? And I think that feeling of Jacqueline put this perfectly , channeling it from it from jealousy to excitement .

Speaker 2

For I'm happy for that person .

Speaker 1

And depending upon your belief system as far as how that all works . But I believe that when I push something away , oh , it must be nice , oh good for them , right , when I go into that sort of negative place .

Speaker 2

Do we ?

Speaker 1

do that ? Do I ? What ? No , no , no . Do we ever do that ?

Speaker 2

Oh sarcasm . I speak it so well , but sometimes I still don't hear it ?

Speaker 1

Yeah , of course . But channeling that into like , okay , yep , I'm going to channel that jealousy and I'm going to convert it into excitement , which then whatever ener'm going to , which then whatever energetically , I believe , pulls that in versus pushes that away , right when we say oh , must be nice , oh , good for it .

I mean again , just my personal belief system , you know , kind of pushes that away and makes us more resistant to creating those opportunities going forward .

So just I think that that acknowledgement of hey , I am feeling this way and then doing something productive with it , genuinely feeling good and wishing good things for everybody , you know something to the effect of I feel like it's , it's still a win for art , Um , I'm paraphrasing here , but just no , that was a powerful statement .

Speaker 2

It really was . It was that feeding the lake statement , right , that we've talked about before . This is good for the betterment of art . Why am I upset ? I shouldn't be . This is good for art sake . Let's , let's celebrate it , let's embrace it . Yeah , it was beautiful , beautiful moment .

Speaker 1

And I think I'll , I'll , I'll , I'll land my plan on this , and that might be all I have to share .

But I had a thought too , and this is around you know what we do with it , and I've just observed for myself and this is kind of back to Gianna from the first part of this conversation around the competitiveness and framing things within sort of the athletic , you know context .

Again , we're going to receive , we're going to process things , how we're going to process them .

But if the mentality is , oh , I missed on something or hey , I'm frustrated by the fact that I don't have an opportunity that maybe I'd like to have or think I should have , you mentioned one response is to curl up and watch Netflix on the couch with a glass of wine . That's an option .

Speaker 2

Yesterday oh wait , hold on .

Speaker 1

I have found a lot of success and I've had a couple of like , distinctly memorable breakthroughs when I have taken that In one case it was a very specific criticism that and you'll know what I'm talking about and I just said F it and I mean had a couple of I don't even know 15 hour sessions back to back to back to back and had a massive breakthrough with

the work because I was like you know what Screw this , like that I'm going to put my foot down and I'm going to do never again will I dot dot dot , which led to something you know really meaningful and impactful in the work itself .

So the point is we get to choose what we do with those thoughts , with those feelings , and I believe that , while I would personally prefer to be motivated by love-based , you know emotions to be working , you know , towards something , it's also okay to be pushed by things as well .

Speaker 2

Right , I mean we're going to be pushed towards or pushed by , and it's okay for me anyway , I'm just can only speak for myself , but to get some juice out of you know running , you know from something you know as as well well , and there there's a quote that I didn't share in the panel , that I wanted to , but I didn't want to take another 20 minutes

because I think it would have led to a big discussion , but it goes into everything that you're saying and it's by renowned I believe she's a child psychologist Mary Natalie Tabak , writer , child psychology , and she says life is discovery or it is nothing . Life is adventure or it's jail . What do you choose ? Yeah , which one are you going to choose ?

You're either living a life of discovery , you're living a life of nothing , just sitting there , stagnant and stale .

Life is adventure or it's jail , because if you're not going for it , you're not running for the adventure and the new things and learning and fighting through the moments where you want to sit on the couch and drink wine and watch Netflix , like you're just going to be in jail .

All those thoughts , all those emotions , all those things inside they're just going to be behind bars and you're just going to be peeking out and peeking through the bars and I just exploded . Celebration . That'll be great for all the YouTube viewers . Please laugh at that . It just happened .

Speaker 1

Listen , there's no way to , there's no better way to respond to being behind bars than with fireworks .

Speaker 2

I mean , I got to figure out how to turn those things off of my phone . So maybe my nephew Tyler send me a text message and tell me how to turn that off my phone , because I'm old now .

Speaker 1

Well , listen , we've broken this down more than needed . The conversation stood fine on its own . We just wanted to throw kind of our little bit of commentary and two cents on it Amazing conversation . We're going to do more of this for the rest of season two and beyond .

In fact , I'm going to be recording an episode I won't spoil it now , but a good artist friend of ours when I'm back down in Dallas on a shoot . Down there we're going to catch up and actually do a conversation . We're going to call it not a guest , but a guest . Co-host is what we're calling it . There you go , I love it .

Speaker 2

From a gallery down there as well . So stay tuned for more . Just Make Art . See you on the air or on YouTube . Find us .

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