Keyana Corliss: [00:00:04] Welcome to Just Checking In.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:00:06] I'm Becky Buckman.
Keyana Corliss: [00:00:07] And I'm Keyana Corliss. Each week we'll use humor, a little irony, and definitely some self-deprecation to dive into the world of high-tech corporate comms.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:00:16] We'll use our expertise and less-than-serious take on the tech news cycle to bring you the best in the business, across comms and media, for one-of-a-kind insights and perspectives you won't hear anywhere else.
Keyana Corliss: [00:00:27] Get ready to laugh.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:00:28] This is...
Keyana Corliss: [00:00:29] ... Just checking in.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:00:34] All right. Today we are really excited to welcome someone that many of you probably know. She is Mixing Board member Eleanor Hawkins. Eleanor has a really unique role right now, might we even call it a unicorn since we deal a lot with unicorns?
Keyana Corliss: [00:00:48] I like calling things unicorns.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:00:50] Exactly, exactly. Or decacorns. She's maybe a decacorn, in that she is a unicorn because she's both a communication strategist and a writer at Axios. Eleanor authors the weekly Axios communications newsletter, and she covers topics and trends that impact how leaders, brands and employers communicate. Prior to Axios, Eleanor worked as the senior director of corporate communications for PBS in Washington, where she still lives, and before that she worked in politics as a press secretary in the US Senate and for a presidential campaign. And we were discussing earlier that she does not say on her LinkedIn who those people were. And I'm assuming that's by design, right?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:01:26] That's right. Yes. Thank you for having me. I'm really excited to be here.
Keyana Corliss: [00:01:28] Okay. So we call you a unicorn or a decacorn or whatever corn you want to be, so we see a lot of journalists that go into comms and I won't say they sell out, but, you know.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:01:41] Yeah. Don't say that. Okay.
Keyana Corliss: [00:01:44] Just kidding, Becky. Love you. But what you don't normally see is the other way around, right? You don't normally see comms folks going into journalism. So I'm curious, just like, how did that happen? Were you sort of always going that route or where did that come from?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:02:02] No, I was not always going this route. I never planned on it. I will say a lot of the skills are quite transferable, which is why you see people jumping back and forth between journalism and the dark side, as my colleagues in the newsroom would call it. But this is really part of a bigger strategy that Axios has, which is they want to really invest in what they call subject matter experts or practitioners and teach them to be journalists as opposed to the other way around. So I am an example of that experiment. And like I said, I think communications is a pretty easy jump into journalism because it's all about asking the right questions and coming up with a story and following leads. And so, you know, it's been a transition, to say the least, but it's also been incredibly rewarding. And I would say one of the most rewarding things about the job has been really explaining to my colleagues in the newsroom what communications is, because while they do work really closely with PR professionals, they see the worst of it. Right? And so I had to explain to them, you know, when you get a pitch or when you get a leak when you get a story, that is either a perfectly executed comms campaign or one that totally imploded. And my job is to kind of peel back the curtain and explain which one it is. It's also been really exciting because now I will get, you know, Slacks or pings from my colleagues who are like covering breaking news. And they're saying, Eleanor, this is a comms story, there's a comms angle here. And I'm like, yes, there's a comms angle to everything. And so there has been no shortage of things to cover. And the newsletter will be two in July. So we're still young, but it's been really fun to see people inside and outside of our newsroom really embrace it.
Keyana Corliss: [00:03:48] Do you hear this, comms, people? Eleanor is in the newsroom fighting the good fight on behalf of all of us. So don't screw this up for her.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:03:58] Thank you.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:03:57] Well, that's another thing. Somebody once asked me, do you consider yourself a flack or a hack? And I was like, that's a really great question. And I mean, I would love to know how you would answer this, Becky. I guess I'm now a hack that I think sympathizes with flack.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:04:17] Yeah, yeah. You're like a sympathetic hack. It's so funny. I mean, I'm so dating myself, but during the Microsoft antitrust trial, like two decades ago, I think every Thursday after activities would, like, end in court, they had a happy hour called hacks and flacks and all the reporters and all the PR people that were fighting with each other during the week would get together and have beers.
Keyana Corliss: [00:04:37] Do you know what story I thought you were going to tell? About how your editor used to be like, who's got the free sushi tonight?
Rebecca Buckman: [00:04:43] Yeah, there's that story, too. We did take advantage of the flacks a little bit, but, okay, so all kidding aside, yes, the flacks always pay because they usually are working for big companies that hopefully make money. But what's been the hardest thing? I mean, this is, your career trajectory is so fascinating. What's been the hardest thing to learn about journalism or like the hardest habit to break as you function more as a hack and are writing columns and writing newsletters for this respected publication?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:05:11] It's a great question. Well, the most surprising thing about this role has been it's difficult to get communication professionals to tell you all their secrets and give you their strategy. They're very on message even when they're on the record. And so that's something that's been a little tricky, you know.
Keyana Corliss: [00:05:30] You can call me, Eleanor, I'm a loose cannon.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:05:33] Well, okay. That's good to know. That's good to know. But it is. I mean, so kind of breaking through has been tricky, especially because a lot of what I try to do is write in real time. I try to do like real-time case studies of what's going on and how it impacts the business and kind of how they're responding to it. And sometimes it can be really tricky to get people to peel back the curtain and talk to you about it. I think I'm slowly breaking down the walls there, but that's been surprising because I thought for sure comms people would love to be on stage and love to see their name. But then I immediately think back to my own experience and it was like if my name was ever in a news story, something went wrong, right? Like, you should not be quoted, there should be no fingerprints. So I'm navigating that on the other side of things, which has been really interesting. But I also have been really happy to see just how many folks tell me that they're sharing it with their team. Like, that's also been the big goal is I want this to appeal to like, very seasoned, tenured professionals, but also the greenest people on the team. And so just finding that range of content has been really challenging but exciting.
Keyana Corliss: [00:06:40] I actually have shared it with, not just my team, which I always share with my team, but although I think at this point they all subscribe, I think it's actually really helpful to share it with our executive team and folks, largely because I feel very fortunate, although this is by design, to have worked for companies where the value of comms was sort of understood, and I will never take a job at a company where the comms person doesn't have a seat at the table. With that said, I think it's, you know when you're covering things where something is blowing up because of a comms strategy or, you know, or something was done well with a good comms strategy or whatever the case may be, it's always nice to sort of remind folks of why this job is so important and kind of that there's a huge business impact. You know, whether that's a stock price or a brand reputation or whatever the case may be. So I actually think, you know, those stories have value outside of even comms folks.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:07:38] I love to hear that. And yeah, you're right. I mean, usually, it does take a big crisis for a company to realize the role of comms, and hopefully, we're kind of breaking that down. But I would also say, I mean, the other thing that's been a little different, and this is actually kind of on the same lines as I'm used to in comms, I was used to wearing black, standing in the back, no name, no mention. And so you are not the story. Your name should not be in the story. And so I've had to adjust a little bit there and kind of embrace social media and LinkedIn. And obviously, I have to have a byline. So that was a little bit of a challenge. But, you know, I'm getting used to that as well.
Keyana Corliss: [00:08:22] Do you ever get like mean comments? We asked Mosh this the other day about if he ever gets mean comments and how he kind of deals with it? Or are people pretty nice?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:08:31] Well. So I usually only really engage on LinkedIn, which is, I think, the nicest social media platform to be a part of. So no, I don't.
Keyana Corliss: [00:08:39] Don't go to X.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:08:40] Yeah, yeah.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:08:41] I, yeah, I don't really play there that much. And I think it's, again, I'm targeting like very much a professional audience. So LinkedIn makes sense for me. I will say there was a news story that came out yesterday in the New York Times, and it was about our media strategy at Axios, just given the state of AI and how it might disrupt everything. And I showed it to my husband and he didn't read the story and just immediately scrolled down to the comments and I was like, what are you doing? Why are you trying to ruin my day? And he read a few of those comments and I was like, yeah, this is why you don't read the comments.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:09:16] They should be disabled. I mean, there's some publications, right, that famously disabled comments because they're just not constructive.
Keyana Corliss: [00:09:22] I didn't know we still had comments on publications. I thought if you wanted to be, you know, a troll, you went to the social media platforms. But okay.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:09:29] I love the fact that you're offering your kind of real-time take on some of these, you know, because we love a good PR comms disaster here on Just Checking In, I saw you wrote recently about the whole Ronna McDaniel flap at NBC. Talk to us a little bit about that. I mean, I was fascinated just because I knew some of the NBC people involved. So I was like quickly looking through those stories to see what happened. But what's your take on that and the comms aspect of that?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:09:55] That one was interesting to me, just because it seemed very obvious from the outside that comms had little involvement because I think as a communications professional, your job is to see across the organization and it's also to game out every possible scenario and then align the messaging and then align all your key stakeholders, message test. It was quite clear to me that, like, ducks were not in a row before this went public. And, you know, in the past, media companies are known for strategically leaking things just to gauge how it might play before they even make anything public. And it just seemed to me that there was little of that happening. It also seemed that, you know, there might not have been a communicator at the table in that decision-making process. And so, again, it was it was a little tricky getting the folks at NBC to give me all the details, especially while they were in the midst of this crisis. But it just looked to me like a really great example of the value that comms can bring if they are brought into the decision-making process. And one of the things that I like to point to, and I think it's a great sign, is that there was, it was an Edelman study from this past year, and they surveyed Fortune 500 CCOs, and 90% of them reported that they are either brought in at the beginning or middle of a decision-making process. Only 10% are brought in just to execute the strategy. And I think that's a really positive thing. And I think it just shows that comms can help you with the decisions and help you game against them, and then help you execute them in a more seamless way so that you can bring all those stakeholders along.
Keyana Corliss: [00:11:34] You can also tell where the ten percenters are, by the way, like you could 100% tell when that happens. Usually.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:11:42] That's right.
Keyana Corliss: [00:11:42] It's usually, Becky and I are covering it on Just Checking In.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:11:46] I know, just, right, look at our past two seasons and see that. What I wanted to pick up on something you said earlier, Eleanor, about kind of Axios' overall strategy of taking practitioners in certain areas and then kind of turning them into journalists. What are some of the other, I don't know how much you can share, maybe just stuff that's already public, but what are some of the other areas they're focusing on?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:12:09] Well, I think the expert in our newsroom that we all look to is Sara Fischer, she's a really great example of this. Somebody who got her journalism career when she joined Axios, previously worked in ad and sales roles, and now kind of covers that for her Media Trends newsletter. I think that's also where Axios sees their niche. And I think, again, if you talk about the entrance of AI and how it's just going to be more content, maybe a lot more bad content, we see our value in being able to tell people things that they don't already know, and expertise in practitioners are part of that. And so, you know, we're building out these new models. Obviously, our newsletters are very closely associated with the journalists themselves. And then we're also building out pro and membership verticals. We launched Axios Communicators Pro a couple of weeks ago, which again is like a membership offering, more content, more events, gathering the community of readers and communicators. And that's one thing that we think AI can't do, is, like convene people around content, and that's where we think we really stand out. We also have a really awesome events platform, and we show up at all of the big tentpole events but host our own, too. Because again, it's not just about getting people on stage, it's about getting people in a room together. And that's where we really learn and grow, and we're really prioritizing that. And then it goes beyond our newsroom. We don't want just our journalists to be subject matter experts. We want everybody in the organization to be an expert at what they do, whether that's sales, whether that's tech.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:13:46] We want the best of the best, and we think that that's how you stay above the bots and AI and that's just how they're thinking through it. And again, when I first learned about this opportunity, I was a little confused. Like, I'm not a reporter, but there are so many nuances to the role of communications. And so I think that it's been really helpful for me. It's allowed for me to report from a place of authority, but it's also allowed for me to just ask the right questions. And I also think that the readers can tell like, oh, she actually knows what she's talking about. She's not just covering, you know, the basics. And the other thing I'll say is to write in smart brevity, you have to know what you're talking about because it is so hard to write succinctly about a topic that you're unsure of, because you have to get to the point. You have to drill it down. There's that quote, like, I think it's Mark Twain or something, it's like, I didn't have time to write you a short note, so I wrote you a long one, and I feel like it's so easy to just add in fillers and AI will generate a lot of fillers, a lot of nonsense. And so you really have to understand the subject if you want to write in smart brevity. And so that's a lot of why practitioners and expertise is required for this sort of reporting.
Keyana Corliss: [00:15:008] Besides sharing this podcast, Becky and I have a bunch of things in common. For example, we both love a good train wreck of a PR story, and I'm assuming we both like a good glass of wine. Actually, this podcast was created over a drink, you know, we both share that. And we're both members of a comms and brand marketing expert community called Mixing Board.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:15:27]] Yes. And thank you very much to Mixing Board for working to raise the value of our industry and for producing this podcast.
Keyana Corliss: [00:15:34] So Mixing Board has a very cool, savvy way of tapping the collective networks of their super connected community so that organizations can find right senior comms and marketing talent fast. If you are hiring for a full-time role, or trying to find the exact right consultant and want the expert guidance for an extremely reasonable price, I could not recommend Mixing Board's Talent Network more. The way it works is that Mixing Board shares the opportunity with the community, and this community is incredible, you guys, it is a who's who, and ask their members to submit candidates that they think would be perfect for the position. Most of the time, these folks are folks they've worked with or they've directly known for years, and they will quickly share back a super-qualified list of candidates and make connections where there's interest. Go to the Talent Network page at MixingBoard.com for more info, and mention Just Checking In for a special rate. The talent that comes out of Mixing Board is incredible. It is a really great way to find top-notch talent. So I encourage you guys all to go.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:16:37] Totally. Well, just to pick up on part of that, you talked about online events, we're talking about AI obviously. Related to that, what's your view in kind of the future role of online communities in the future of communications? You know, think Discord channels, Reddit, Slack groups, you know, at my company, we have Slack channels set up for our executives, and obviously we use them internally for communications. The rise of those online communities, when done right, does that make you think differently about the efficacy of traditional PR tactics? In some ways, like these online communities have really changed the game when it comes to thinking about how you execute communications programs.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:17:15] I think it just depends. I think it depends on what you're trying to achieve. I love Slack channels. I love being able to quickly get in touch with people. I think if you're able to find a community that wants to engage in like a very niche topic, there's always going to be somewhere on the internet where you can do that. And then, of course, there's always going to be some sort of virtual component, which I think is also really great because it allows for you to get more reach, right? It also kind of democratizes it in a bit because there might not, people might not have budget to travel, they might not be able to get a sitter, they might not be able to make it in person for whatever reason. But giving that virtual option, I think, is always going to be helpful. What I've heard increasingly, and I wrote a little bit about just the generational demands and how it changed when it comes to news consumption and the way that people want to be communicated to. I mean, there's a lot that's said about Gen Z and them not showing up to work and wanting to be fully remote.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:18:14] From what I've gathered in my reporting, is that there really is this desire to connect. They like in-person gatherings, they do want to network. They even welcome the idea of mentorship, believe it or not. So I do think that will always be a big draw. Like it's wonderful what we're doing now, connecting via video and across the internet. But it really does make such a huge difference when you're able to connect in person. And so we're going to go all in on that. And the other thing that I think is really exciting about the communication audience, and my vertical itself, is that communication professionals are often stuck staffing their principles and going to these events anyways. So if I can just get all of them in a room off to the side where they can connect with each other, that's great. And you can kind of find that camaraderie, which is hopefully something that we'll be able to do more and more of.
Keyana Corliss: [00:19:06] Becky, we have to take our show on the road. That's what I heard.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:19:09] We are, we are. We're going to have an event strategy. You're motivating us. Yeah. Okay.
Keyana Corliss: [00:19:13] Yes. We're gonna take it on the road. It's gonna be great.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:19:16] Well, what are you looking for? I mean, I feel like everyone who's listening to this podcast probably reads your newsletter. What are some of the topics you're interested in? What's on your mind right now as you think about stories that you want to cover in the newsletter?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:19:29] It's a good question. I'm always just trying to plug into the news cycle. One thing I think a lot about is the way that brands try to reach audiences and like, does the P in public relations matter? Like, do you want to reach the public? Does that really matter anymore? Or do you want to just find these very engaged audiences and get them to act and move? I think a lot about that. The other thing that I sent out, I sent out kind of a call out in one of my newsletters asking about press releases and, you know, are the days of press releases are over.
Keyana Corliss: [00:20:04] Oh my God, please do not get my Ted Talk started on this.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:20:07] What's your view, Eleanor? Because we, this is debated in every organization all the time.
Keyana Corliss: [00:20:11] And I keep losing this argument.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:20:15] Well, I'd love to know your thoughts, because I can't tell you the amount of reader feedback that I got on this question.
Keyana Corliss: [00:20:20] So I hate press releases with a passion that burns deep in my soul for a number of reasons. One, I don't think that that's how coverage, like good, meaningful strategic coverage that does anything is generated. I think it's like you could have just sent a fact sheet or something that if the journalist needs to pull, you know, logistical facts, you could do that. The other problem is that the calories burned on the stress of creating one internally is, like, and I'm about to trigger every one of our audience members, but, I mean, it's a stressful process. And deep down, I know that it doesn't actually matter because I'm just going to send a text to my buddy at CNBC, and that's actually how we're going to workshop the story, and it's not actually going to matter. The problem is, I feel like it is a necessary evil from a political standpoint of keeping your job in-house, but it is the devil. So thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:21:18] Well, okay, I want to hear Eleanor's view because I agree with much of what you said, but--.
Keyana Corliss: [00:21:24] What, not all? What do you not agree with?
Rebecca Buckman: [00:21:25] Not, we can't agree because that would be boring. But what I have found is in some cases where we have tried to replace a press release, let's say with a blog post or with some bullets, I find sometimes the journalists don't take it as seriously. And maybe that's only when I'm dealing with like, early-stage companies that were funding, you know, that, and with a big company like some of the ones that you've worked with and some of the ones in our portfolio, it might be different. But I also feel like, like doesn't, didn't Jeff Bezos at Amazon force all his executives to write a press release to summarize a new product launch or whatever, and that that was just a forcing function for them? So I do think it serves a good forcing function, but I do agree with you that the calories burned are excessive compared to the value that you get.
Keyana Corliss: [00:22:13] But those were for like, the engineers, though. To be like, does whatever you're working on like have a point? If it doesn't, don't do it.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:22:19] Yes.
Keyana Corliss: [00:22:20] The PR FAQ never actually got anywhere. I never even saw it. Like never even came to me. But. Okay. Eleanor, what do you think?
Rebecca Buckman: [00:22:25] Yeah. What do you think? And what was the consensus after you went through this?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:22:29] So I think just the name, press release, is wrong because it's not for the press. It doesn't generate media. I think there is definitely a need to gather all of your thoughts in one place. I think there are always going to be like regulatory reasons to put out certain information. I think it's super helpful on the local level, specifically with local governments, local police force, task force. I do think that there is a need for a press release. I feel like it's been abused. Like the vehicle of press releases have just been abused and we don't all need to see some fluffy 'this CEO is thrilled about this partnership' like we just don't need any more.
Keyana Corliss: [00:23:11] And he's excited for what's to come.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:23:13] And yes, the journey. It's always the next phase of the journey.
Keyana Corliss: [00:23:16] It's always about the journey.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:23:17] Yeah.
Keyana Corliss: [00:23:18] We're excited to be on this journey.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:23:20] Yeah. So I think there are reasons for it. But I think more often than not it doesn't generate press and it's not for the press. It could be for internal audiences, it could be for regulators, it could be for investors. I think it's also just important to understand, like what audience you're trying to reach and shape the narrative around that, not just dump it in a press release. The other thing I'll say is inevitably in a press release, legal will get involved in some way, shape, or form and, you know, take any of the news out of it. Right? So if it's just an exercise in gathering your thoughts and getting everybody aligned, there's a way to do that internally without also sending it to the media.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:22:29] Super good point. Yeah, I tell a lot of our companies that the press release is for SEO. I mean, that's essentially what we should call it, an SEO release.
Keyana Corliss: [00:24:01] It's so that when someone searches your, you know, your company, they see what you're doing. So, Eleanor, I know we've asked you a lot. I think we've covered some really great topics. What, okay, so you said the newsletter turns two this July, which is very exciting. What sort of got you excited, looking forward, is there anything you're working on that you're either really excited about or want to plug or...?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:24:30] We're excited about this Communicators Pro vertical. It's the first time we've ever done any sort of membership offering at Axios. And again, what that entails is just more opportunities to gather and get together. We're doing like occasional workshops and AMAs. I'm doing my first AMA on Monday with our CEO, Jim VandeHei, and I get to grill him, which will be very fun. I haven't gotten to do that, but it's all about, you know, the future of media and how it's going to impact communicators. And so what I very much understand is that it is important for the communicator audience to hear from me. It's probably even more beneficial for them to hear from some of my colleagues in the newsroom. So quarterly, I'm going to pull one of them onto a webinar and do some sort of AMA. I think we'll provide more content, more thought bubbles, more events. It's just really exciting to me that, given the state of the media and the media landscape, Axios is investing more in this communicators beat because again, I think it just shows that there is still an interest in more niche verticals. And so that to me is exciting. And I'm also just excited, again, to get out on the road a little bit and meet more people. We were at South by Southwest and had about 300 people come to our event, which was so exciting. We're doing an event around the White House Correspondents Dinner, all focused on like how companies are navigating corporate reputation in an election year. We're going to Cannes to talk about just brand safety.
Keyana Corliss: [00:26:03] I want to come to that. How do I get there?
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:26:05] Come to that one.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:26:06] I see the need for many gowns. White House Correspondents Dinner? Cannes? I think you need some new dresses.
Keyana Corliss: [00:26:08] I was, White House Correspondent, I grew up in D.C., so White House Correspondents Dinner, I'm good with. Cannes I can get behind.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:26:15] Well, we're doing no gowns. We're doing, like, a breakfast. So that's fine.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:26:19] You would be overdressed if you wore the gown.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:26:22] Come in your sensible heel. Yeah.
Keyana Corliss: [00:26:24] Your sensible heel.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:26:25] That's so Washington. The sensible heel. Yeah.
Keyana Corliss: [00:26:28] I threw all my sensible stuff out when I left. That's awesome. Okay, you guys, everyone with a professional development budget go spend it on Axios Pro. That's, this totally counts.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:26:38] Yeah, but, like--
Keyana Corliss: [00:26:39] -- and send your boss this podcast
Rebecca Buckman: [00:26:40] But super exciting to hear about Axios' growth. We love good stories in the worlds of communications and media. And what you guys are doing is clearly working. So, and congrats again on your personal success and on the newsletter turning two.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:26:53] Thank you.
Keyana Corliss: [00:26:53] And if you want to cover, like, you know, the best podcasts in comms, I can send you at least one that I know of.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:27:01] Okay. Yeah. Send it my way.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:27:02] All right. Thank you so much.
Keyana Corliss: [00:27:04] All right. Thanks so much for being here.
Eleanor Hawkins: [00:27:06] Thank you so much for having me.
Rebecca Buckman: [00:27:12] So if SBS Comms sounds familiar, it's because you might have seen them recently listed as a Top Five Most Innovative Company in Fast Company's first-ever PR and Brand Strategies category. They're one of the tech industry's hottest agencies that's attracted the attention of companies like American Express, Cloudflare, GitHub, Flexport, and more. SBS Comms embraces a modern ethos in technology comms, shedding outdated strategies for progress and results. SBS works across industries and with companies at all stages of growth, from industry leaders to those building tomorrow's consequential breakthroughs such as Air Company, Runway, Astro Forge, Vercel, Light Matter and more. You can learn more about SBS at www.SBSComms.com. That's a lot of comms, or by checking out their very active Instagram account, where they post weekly roundups of media hits at @SBSComms. Just Checking In is produced by Astronomic Audio and underwritten by Mixing Board, a curated community of the most sought-after communications and brand marketing leaders.
Keyana Corliss: [00:28:06] Thanks for listening to Just Checking In. Follow us at @KeyanaCorliss and @RebeccaBuckman.