Topher Grace

And that is what we're talking about today. Let's get into it. Hi, yay, I'm excited you too. I am. I'm really excited because I don't know you, and I don't know a lot about you until today, but I like you, like we know you. We're big fans in the Grays household. We know from the way. We don't even know you from Housewives, we know you from Maybe we're big Shark Tank fans. And then got on the podcast and what you're a truth teller. I am that. I am a truth teller. If you like Shark Tank.

There's a new show coming out that I'm doing Kevin O'Leary called Money court and you'll love it. It's very effectively like binding mediation for businesses that are in conflict so they don't have to go through the legal process. We just go and we actually, like, we actually deliberate for a while, and it's intense, like real businesses up to like a hundred and something million dollars. But it's pressure and it's cool, you'll like because we love the profit.

We love anything that makes is my wife and I because we have an hour when the kids go to bed. It's like anything that makes us feel she's an actress too, and it's like makes us feel like we know business in any capacity or we did anything like we were never a part of any of that stuff. So it makes us feel like we're Oh, I like it. Like this, it's deeper, it's deeper and shark tank like no fluff, it's all it's all meat. No, no, like you know, no fluff. Um, So your wife and you haven't married

for how long? Oh? What are you doing to me here? Hang on, I'm looking at my wedding ring. It says, uh, okay, And did you meet in the business through acting? No, we met at a charity event and uh, that sounds better than it. She was actually involved with charity and I was. I was involved in more of a bullshit way, and she was really involved with charity and then uh, and that's how. But she was dating someone at the time, so they kind of waited out. Oh you waited it out?

And what what is it like two actors in a relationship, Like how does everybody shine? And are you both tortured actors? Like well, as we know all the actors that get together always goes great. Um, so yeah, no problems. No, she actually she wasn't. Uh she's a very good actor, but she wasn't as uh passionate about it as I am. And it was like a job for her. And she actually but fully quit once we got together and is now getting her masters and social work and he is

literally working internship as a social worker. She's a much better person than I. And uh that's good because with kids together, they should have at least one good role model. You need one, You need one. Okay, I got it, because there's all yeah, there's one peacock in the house, and who is the peacock? It's you know, you know, it's funny. I've heard that someone. I think it was Mike Nichols said he was like eating with one of these famous couples that we all know that is like,

you know, there's two stars and it doesn't work. And he said he looked up at him and he said, I forget what the couple was. It was, you know, some couple in the eighties or something. But he said, all Rose, no Gardner, which is the Great's that's so true. So who's in your house? But I actually think you'd think it would be me because I'm on television and stuff,

but it's actually my wife. She's doing such uh incredible world and it's actually interesting in my age to watch some one have a transition and do something that's, you know, probably better for the world than what I'm doing. Oh yeah, it's well I'm fifty one and it's became a TikToker, So what kind of that's a real amazing No. No, look, look here's what I do believe. I thought about it a lot because sometimes I feel bad she's like really

working with uh underprivileged children and I'm not. There's like a gap in between we do. But I do think, after thinking about it for a long time, that you should do what you're calling is like she feels passion about what she's doing because that's her calling. And I don't think it's right to go against what you're calling it. And I'll tell you, I mean, we love this show that I'm on right now, because actually I like it less when there's celebrity interviews because you're just like, you know,

un just truth telling. Yeah, it's great. Well, that's funny that you say that, because when you're around someone who's doing so much, it does make you look at yourself. And um, I've been at all levels of philant to be like me deep in it, trying back and forth from Parto Rico or the Bahamas, and then I've been in like just sort of delegating and telling everybody what

to do, which makes me feel not great. And my fiance will say, like, it's okay that President Coca Cole is not putting the syrup in the bottle, but because and he's donated a lot of money to my charity, and he's a very generous person, and he's worked with Emily's List and done different causes. But I think that seeing me when I'm me deep in something makes him feel slightly uncomfortable because it becomes so I'm so obsessed with it and I'm so immersed in it, and it

makes other people feel a certain kind of way. Well, you know, even my wife has uh Okay, sometimes she'll be doing it on a real um micro level, and sometimes she's doing it you know, she's on a lot of boards and stuff too, which is more of a macro level. And even she, you know, he has questions about when what's helping more. Actually, when I'm involved in a you know, in a national sense, or when I'm involved like when I'm literally boots on the ground doing

it myself, it's confusing. I think the only wrong answer is only doing things for yourself. Off. I think as long as you're trying to help others in some way, there's no wrong answer. You're so right, and you're right because it's more about our own insecurity that makes us want to be boots on the ground when I'm way more valuable when I'm telling twenty everyone what to do in organizing and I'm raising money, but you don't feel

the same. It's that's a great Really, people who hate charity are the people who are like get bugged by it, or it's like alcoholics when you're not having a drink, you know what I mean, like when they're not doing anything. Like never realized kind of like, oh, you have to be such a you know, an angel all the time. But I think, um, yeah, as long as you're helping in something, there's a lot of different ways it's gonna get exactly. So why why did you not like your

name Chris Christopher? Why did you not like there is? There are a lot of Christ's in my class. My mom was a Patricia trapped in a pat People kept calling her Patch you want to be Patricia and I I don't think she thought that people would abbreviate to Chris, which is ridiculous because it's such a long name. But when I went to boarding school, I was toying around

with because you kind of reinvent yourself. I went to boarding school in eighth grade and uh it was in Massachusetts, school called Faith School, and the cutest girl in our class I kind of was in a group with her and we're talking during orientation. I said I'm thinking of going to toefor and she said, well that's cute, and I was like, you got it, yeah, and you so you went with tofur and I also feel like it's a better name for an actor, Like it's the only

people think I did it for Hollywood reason. I actually probably should have changed it back because it's such a stupid affectation. But but it was the nineties and like you remember Zenes and Za, everyone's going with the second half of these names, you know, And so whatever, what does your wife call you? She is the only person in my life that calls me Christopher. Really, yeah, my parents call me CJ because my little name is John and uh, and most people don't even call me toefor

they like the cast calls me tofe. The seventy show called me toe for some reason, that became my nickname. But it's rare that I'm even called tofur. But even my my my daughter when she says it, you know, because she calls me daddy. But once in a while should hear an adult call me that? Tofur? What a

lame name? So that seventies show popped you off you were you left college, which I think is interesting because I think the college conversation is a conversation, but it wasn't a big conversation in my family, and I even to this day have regrets even though it was such a success. Yeah, just because you know, I was having such a great time getting a liberal arts education. Like, you know, I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I was really enjoying. And it is a trade off.

It's basically like going into like instead of like liberal artists a wide. I hadn't even picked where I was going, and then then you go into like you know, if you want to be a blacksmith, like you're just studying with trade. Yeah. The funny thing about liberal arts did you feel like you were learning in college or youre just having a great time? No, I was. Actually I was such a nerd that I was actually learning. Uh where I was at USC, I should have been having

more fun. But I was really in the film and I didn't know how I wanted to enter. And I got rejected from the film school there a couple of times, and I did get to go back. The first thing I did was traffic and I got to go back and speak with Steven Soderberg. And it was the kids in my class. It was that there were girls who remember there was a girl that I walked up to a college who I said, um, actually two different stories.

There's one girl I walked up to right when I got to I've been such a loser in high school, and I thought I'll be like, I'll be like a winner here, like I don't know why I thought that, and like that people would just you know, treat me differently. But I went up to a girl who was probably like the hottest girl in this campus of you know, twenty thousand or forty thousand kids, and I said, like, hey, we should go out sometime, and she said like, oh

my god, honey, sit down. And she sat me down in this cafeteria and she goes, you're a freshman right, like kind of like like I can, and I said yeah, and she said, um, I'm a senior girl, so like, um, freshman girls are dating senior guys. I'm dating a dentist. So wherever you are too, that girl it wants a

big shout out to you. Uh. And then the second thing was there was a girl in that when I went back to speak with Stephen, there was a girl who I literally I just asked out and she like laughed and said no, like like she thought I was kidding at first. And then she was in the audience like waving to me. It was just great. Why would this new fame not have gotten you girls? That doesn't

seems like I was rejected before before that happened. Oh okay, I was gonna say wow, But she was in the like she was in the class and I would have been a senior and she was a senior. And now she's waving like we get five minutes. I was like, sorry, I got a bounce, by the way, that's yeah, you can't. You're not too mature for that, for sure. You no, no, no, no, And if there was anyone would be me, and no,

it's the I remember. I had a really weird experience, which is I had been in a high school play and then at this boarding school I was at. And then when I went to USC since I was in l A, the parents of this girl who had seen me on like a parent's weekend during this play, they called me and said, do you want to mean My first audition was for a seventy show. That's so crazy. I was an under I got cast as an understudy ninth grade and as Maria and west Side story. I

don't know why. It's not that interesting a story. That's why I've never told it. But and I didn't take it because when I auditioned, I was better singing than the girl who's a senior. But they were giving the role to the senior because it was a senior, and I it's one of my regrets in life that I, who the hell did I think I was? That I should be a freshman getting the role, and then to not what a store loser to not take the understudy role? What an as well? At least it's not still an

issue for you. I can tell you. Yeah, I'm not holding on to would my life have been if I got the if I got to play Maria and West Side Story, it all could have been very different tof tofe Um. So, so are you pro college because you were really going to use it for an education or do you not like that you don't have a college degree? And what about the money for college? Like what about college versus non college? Because I am really mixed on it. I hear you will tell me your point of view.

My point of view is I wanted to work. I didn't. I didn't. I did all my classes Wednesdays at Boston University so I could leave and get back to New York City, and I just was a person who wanted to work. I paid no attention. I wanted to get by. I wanted to get the grades and get out like I was there to get through. It was I was

very similar. That's why I didn't have My dad had more misgivings about me leaving college than I did, although I did understand his point of view that it's kind of only open to you at that point in time in your life. And now that I'm older, I go, oh, I I would enjoy, uh, just the education part of it, not even the grades part of it, just sitting back taking these classes that are so wildly different because I

was undecided. I was taking like Zen Buddhism, and uh, you know, I guess American writing, and like astrology not astronomy. Not astrology, so astronomy. I don't know if they had a class astrology, but I was just trying, like lots of different things, and I, uh, you become so focused on what you're doing once you leave, and it's, you know, the last time your parents, if you're in my position, it was the last time my parents were gonna you know, someone else was gonna take care of me and allow

me to kind of experiment and try different things. And it's harder later in life to say I want to. But youth has wasted on the young. And I was the kid who didn't even think about what the syllabus, that just wanted to get out. And I think I wish that I could go back. I could. I think there are places in Europe where they they you like go into the workforce at twenty and then at twenty six or something you go back, And that's how you to do it. Because I wasn't at the time. I

didn't really want to sit in there. Now. I'd go back now if I had the time, and I would, like, you know, I would like not even care about the grades. I just pay the money and sit back and listen to the lectures and actually ingested instead of like taking notes trying to pass the thing. And you know, that's exactly right. That's how that's the way you just said that if we could sort of teach our kids that

way and convey that message. And I'm going to start messaging that with my daughter about take things you're interested in and just utilize it as a time to absorb different information. And I think if you went back to school, you might be financially successful the Grindstone and you really you know what I mean, Well, I would like to take a Meditate TM class. I have to transcendental meditation. I actually would do stuff that isn't even related to

the industry. Yeah, yeah, okay, So seventies show is obviously embedded in your history. Is that for sure? What you're do? You have street credit in a different way for Traffic or for Spider Minute, Like, you have a very unique, interesting trajectory that I don't know how much of that is just like luck and and grabbing something good or you turning a lot of things down, like explain your road of the first of all, Yes, when most people seem to know me from seven show. Uh, syndication is

such a even around that show. We were on it for four years, it was doing fine, and then once it syndicates, it's on, you know, thirty times a week. It just, yeah, it embeds itself from the culture. But but because of that, I was really conscious to do actually you know what, It wasn't like a career thing. I just personally didn't want to keep doing the same thing. And remember when I got this role in Traffic, my mom being like, why are you like, why are you

doing this to me? Like she was so happy to see me on seven show and then I was playing like a like a junkie, and just for me, it has kept it alive over the years. Do it like Black Landsman, which I did right before we started Home Economics. This is you know, two very very different and it keeps it really exciting. Uh for me, I mean, I've been out in a career for oh my god, I don't know how many years, I mean over twenty. But

you curate this. This is not happen since you're saying I want that, because that's different than that, and I don't know, I can't really say I want that. I mean, the truth is sure. I mean everyone wants the Leading and Academy award, right, But it's more like you, you know you you say I'm not. I think it's more what you say you're not gonna do, like I was

not going to play. I would say the role I play on Home Economics is very similar to the one I've done seventy show, but I didn't play that for like fifteen years. And for me that was really great. I'm sure for my agents they were like, hey man, let's start playing that role where you know they like because the people who make money in Hollywood are the ones that do the same thing over and over again. Well that's funny because Matthew McConaughey talks about his story.

He was, by the way, I was an interstellar with him, uh And I mean he was the lead and I had a small part. But we had a couple of days where at that house together, And that is the perfect example I'm you're talking about where he turned down Magnan p I. He turned out every Oh no, that's funny that you're saying that too. No. His book green Lights,

which is a great read. Everyone says that's great. Yeah, yeah, it's very easy read and it's just fun and he's great, but he talks about he was sick of being the shirtless romcom guy and he kept getting offered and offered and offered. He said to his wife, we're gonna do this, but like, we have to hang tight, and she was super supportive, and it got up to like eight, ten, thirteen million, and then scripts started sounding good to him,

but he held it down. And then I heard it was because this is the Magnan p I was the big one. Right before Dallas Buyer's Club, I think, And he was telling me this whole stuff is before I mean, when he was telling this story, True Detective was coming out and Dallas Buyers Public just and you're like, oh my god, this guy's career is just taking this total shift that I would not have guessed. And when he was telling it to me, he was like, I hope,

I'm sure there's all stuff. It's in the book. I mean, I think it was a ridiculous number because you kind of go like, who better to play Magna p I. Yeah, the film didn't get made, you know what I mean. It was like, really Matthew McConaughey with him Stash does that or not? And it was not even that it was going to be a flop. It's that it wasn't like probably look on a much smaller level, It's what

I was talking about, where you go. I'm sure people want me to play this role all the time, but I only want to do it when I want to do it. The only way to not burn out is to do so many different things that he turned. I mean, I think it would probably be like a payday of thirty million, including like the twenty million, you get paid,

and then he just participation or whatever. So like, and I heard these people at his agency were like, yeah, no, no, for sure, Matthew, like this is the last one, but we we gotta do this one because yeah, but I but your point. I mean the takeaway is it's it's not that easy in the moment to turn things down. But you have to be playing chess and trying and you may not make the right decision. But I'm not

that smart. It's really not that's it's just like you you would just get sick of I'm sure in business it's the same thing. You just get sick of doing the same thing over and over in and you want to be challenged. And it's not even really that much about perception. For me, it's just about like when you go to work, are you doing the same thing. I mean when I was when I got on Home Economics, I made sure it was and I spent a lot

of time with the writers before I signed on. I really wanted to make sure it was the thing that I wanted to do for eight ten years, because that's what it turns out to be. Wow, well, you know, so I I do think that. So for example, walking away from Housewives. When I did the second time, I was making a lot of money for four months work like millions and also probably the relevance, right, like, that's not the way. Well, no, this is an example to

but you weren't talking about this. This is more to I guess Matthew McConaughey's example walking away from them. My business managers were like, Bethany, even just one more season, like it's millions. I was like, I want to do something greater, and I need to sort of take this off the board and start from scratch in a way, which is how this podcast came to be what it is. And then multiple podcasts and it's it's and it's a lucrative podcast. And I started for the first you didn't

make any money. I actually paid for it because the bed is mad. You know. Yeah, it's a real believe in yourself moment. That's what it is. It's like, it's not really the money, because you would have been fine, Matthew would have been fine, Yes, it's more. Is there more in there? And I mean, congrats to you because you've really done it, like you're I mean, I mean, I'm not I'm not into that Housewise franchise. Is there anyone else that has really made it out of that thing?

Not the same way? No, and I don't say that. No, I and I was, It's just the true. Yeah, No, No, I did everything first. I was the first really celebrity Becauide didn't ever markt a cocktail. Now you see it's everywhere. I was the first one to turn a brand and oh my god, everyone has a cocktail? Did that make

you mad? Like? Like literally everyone I know? And I'm going back in, but I feel like I'm the only person people can't say she has a cocktail because I was the one who started the whole trend, literally because Forbes cover. But anyway, back to you, just you going with your gut. It's been you just saying right after that seventy show, I just don't want to do that role again, not saying I don't want to be typecast and that. So you just made good choices based on

your gut, is what I'm here. Look, I've made bad choices too, But but I will tell you you can only learn if you're trying. You know, I I sounded old when I talked about this stuff. I sound like one of those motivational speakers or something. But the truth is like, um, you can't learn if you're doing the same thing over and over again. And you have to always be I mean it's whether it's college or not, like we're talking about, you do have to always be learning.

And ah, you know, I've played bad guys. I played good guys. I've been in like really small films. I've been big blockbusters. Like I feel like I know so much about the industry that, um, some people who may be more successfulan you've done the same thing over and over again. I don't know, because I've been able to, you know, go to all the different corners of it. Amazing. I mean, a good career and that's not easy to not have to really have had a fair, fairly steady career.

And what about money, So like, well, look, I prefaced the whole thing by saying, I'm so lucky that seveny show worked because that gave me the ability to try all this stuff there you can't uh, And I totally respect working actress. And I've thought about you know that when that money manager runs away with all my money, you go, okay, like you gotta do what you gotta do.

But I was very lucky that hit and for so long for me, something has to have an r O. I either it's philanthropic or it's hilarious, or it's like the Money Court Show, which is just gonna be me learning or it's money like meaning Someonemist say to me, you gotta go do this, you gotta do this panel and this person did it before you and Ryan Reynolds was on and I'm like, am I getting paid now? I'm like, I don't want to do it, Like if

I'm getting paid, I might go. Or is it interesting or is it like I have a reason for the things? So I wonder does anything really motivate you? I mean, is there something you really don't want to do that

you're doing because of money. No, it's probably something that you would do that you're like, only I don't not want to do it, but I don't want to do it if I'm not being like you know, there's some things that it's like speak on a panel and fly across the country and I don't necessarily want to do that. I could do this on here, I could give tips on a podcast, or I like talking to my own detriment. Not done that as much as I should. But uh, and I don't. I don't feel guilty about having money.

I think I would if I if I you know, it's a different life. You're talking. You're a business person, and you know what I mean, Like you're crushing it. I think I really wanted an artist life, and I've been able to have one in a really um business part of the town. Like I'm not doing church basement theater, you know, I'm really a lot of people to see. Yeah, And so I've spent a lot more time thinking about

what fills me up personally. And I'm just lucky that whatever my thing is goes with making enough money that I don't have to not do the things that I got. This show I'm on now, you know when I started just a pilot. We're entering season three. But um, I just like it spoke to me. I liked it. I really they want to be a part of it to help cast the other people, and I have a huge, huge respect for the four other people. It's kind of

there's no start of the show. It's kind of the five of us, and they're just amazing actors, and so I loved it. I mean, don't tell anyone, but I would do it for Fris. That's how I feel about this podcast. That's how I felt about Money Court and why I did it for different You'll do different things for different reasons, and I like that because I'm exactly the same. I'll do something for really nothing if I'm I got a question for you for what you're talking about.

Cuban was on our show last year, which was just great because I got to spend three days. We were like in a POCRA scene. I got done three days talking to him, and he's fascinating guy, you know, and it's legit. What he is is what he is, Like I was waiting to see if there was some other side of him, um, and I tried to ask. I think I got an answer. But you would be able to shed more light on this because I think it has to do with why you're doing this podcast too.

Is ultimately look and you're not like, you know, not going to take the money from it, but ultimately isn't like, isn't it ended because it's like your base to people. I don't know how to say this exactly, like like Mark Huban, just do I mean, I know he's never ready, yeah, but he does not need to do Shark Tanker. He's doing it as almost like a charity to America to show future entrepreneurs, kind of some of them who likes

a little of the action too. It's but it's a combo, like it's okay to like a little of the sizzle of the action, a little of the relevance, you know. I know other I'm friends with the owners of the Carolina Panthers. No one knows who they are, you know, the person, but you know he likes a little of the sizzle, and he's playing with the house's money, so it's fine. He's interested in the entrepreneurs. He never doesn't text me back immediately or called back. I emailed him

after the episode aired. He gave me. First of all, you gave me his email in front of everyone, and I was like, hey man, I mean there were like extras in the scene and stuff. I was like, you know, just you know, give me act you and he's like, I don't care. Anyone can email me. He's very yes, I mean like incredible, And then I emailed him like in the car somewhere, just saying hey man, I don't know if you had a chance to check out the episode but you're great in it. And I've never had

a faster It was like he's done it. Came back in and you go, what is this guy doing with his time? And he's he's up in the morning early and he reads everything, but only assholes like you know, don't respond only you know he's a teaching You respond very quickly too. I am a responder. You can tell you text me, you practice it. I'm a responder. I'm afraid because because the rationale is because why do it

in five minutes? Which you can do now? And all successful people are like this right, just get it off, get it off, get it out, forward it CC, somebody, BCC, somebody, get clean up, check the box. But he's doing that. He invested in some company that someone emailed and ten years ago that he'd never met. He just forward the email that was a lawyer and said, yeah, pay the quarter million dollars or whatever they're asking for. I never heard from again, and then just got sent to forty

million dollar check last week. That's insane because the company went public and he didn't. He's like, what, like he forgot he Oh my god, that's like anyone can email me any time. I was like, that's a crazy story. So yeah, you are asking, like what the reason is for doing things based on the fact that he's doing that, And it's the same as what you're saying. I have to be doing what I can. There's nothing I can

do for money. If I had gone back to house plugs, it would have been only for money, and I would have been miserable. You marry for money, you pay the rest of your life. I wish I was more like that. I value my time so much, I value my rest I value my peace of mind, I value my home body. Noess, I only can do well, that's funny. Actually, no, that's what just happened. In the last six months. I decided I'm only doing exactly what I love and want to do.

And it's harder than you think, even with plans, even with trips and the kids. I'm only doing what I want to do. Well, You've you've earned it. I mean, I don't know a good busincision or that's just for you. I'm just want to be happy and there's enough. I have enough good ideas and enough things that are lucrative that I could pour myself into them and they can

be successful. And I just I remember that Joan Rivers documentary about the calendar being full, and some people really do that's their identity, and that's not me at all. I want my calendar empty. You know, it's fine. I've been thinking lately because promoting the show, the launching of the show, while making it is it's a lot of stuff. You know, if you're in five different episodes, there's like

the writing of one. I'm not part of the writing, but I'm like looking at what they're doing, and there's the editing, and then you're the one you're filming, and then to be promoting the premiere, which we shot a while ago. Um, and I realized, I think, I don't know what happens when you fully burn out, because it's

never happened to me. But the closer you come to burning out, the better you are, in my opinion, because you find this like your mind is like so attuned to what the thing is, so a part of you is dying, but like you're actually the results are better, you know. Interesting, Well, I mind that all my good ideas come between sleep and wake. That's so I have

a little pad next my bed. Okay, you're waking up, but you're still so sort of you know, or like you're getting a massage and falling asleep and you have an idea and like that. And also when you really relax, like if I go out to the Hamptons and I'm Jello for a while, the good ideas come because your brain is resting. It's like your body digesting twenty foods for Thanksgiving is why it gets tired. If it's just calmly like digesting one thing, the machine can work better.

So if you're relaxed, you know, you can digest more information in my opinion, and get more massages. I will, okay, good, more massages. So um, what's your recognize? Like you can you have a normal life? You want a vacation of people not bother you, like on a one to tend like tend being Gaga or like j Lo where they cannot have a normal life. Like what level of normal life as a celebrity can you have? Oh, I have

the perfect level of fame. I love it, which is to say not a lot, Like I have enough that I work. I'm probably the least famous celebrity alive, if that makes sense. But like I think, I love what I do and we we get bothered a little bit. It's starting to bug me because my kids are they don't know yet that I'm that I what I do for a living. We've kind of not featured it, um, so that'll bug me when that happens. But I love it.

It's such a wonderful normal life and I get to do this thing at a really high level at work. And like you, yeah, because in your Google thing it said like one of the most recognizable faces and whatever, and I would think that you have you've been at your a less actor, there's no question, Like I was so excited when you were doing this, but I was thinking he has a good No, there are other less actors that like have some sort of a life where

it's not so crazy. And I was wondering, like, if you went to a mall, be honest, in Ohio, would it get gnarly or now? Oh, I mean yeah, if I strolled around them all singing the theme song the seventy show thing, But like you know, there's ways to look. I it's it's by design. Like there was a time when it was a little crazier and a big part of it was me and my wife and she happens to share a lot of the same values I do.

I was listening to that that episode you were talking about um j Lo and then and why would they go on a and I that I actually, I mean, I've met Ben Affleck. He's fantastic guy. And uh uh, I guess the thing between me and j Lo was just like a couple of months, like it was just a little romantic trist But I the truth is, I mean, no one wants to talk about how much they like fame, but everyone does. And man, it has an addictive drug

like quality. And that's the thing I think you were leaving out of that conversation, is like, because I always have that thing about other actors where I'm like, why are they like if they want to not be seen, Like, why are they having lunch at the front thing in the ivy? And That's what I'm saying. And I don't think but I don't think everybody likes it. I think you might not like it if no one recognized you, because it might be an indication that you aren't relevant

as an actor. But I don't think you give a ship if someone recognizes you in then the moment. That's a good point. I get. Yeah, I hear what you're saying. I think I think you just have The only person who can tell is you. Like my wife doesn't even know, Like what is your I mean, it's very personal, like being in a relationship with someone who has a problem with alcohol or or drugs or whatever. It's the same kind of addictive thing. And all I can say for

me is that I don't not like it. You know, like everyone should try fame and see you know what I mean? Who they are? Yeah, you know some people don't. I what do you think? No? No, No, nobody doesn't. First of all, no one's companm is who doesn't at least have a question or thought about Yes, um, you know I in Traffic, that movie which is all about drug use, and I wanted doing a search for it.

And the first film I did, there was a scene that was cut out where I'm talking to Michael Douglas about how remember I don't know if you remember that movie, but I get I get the girl like hooked On. Isn't Katherine Stones the mother in it? She's the She's Amy Irving is the mother of the girl that I get hooked pregnant. There's lots of different plots it's amazing. I get this girl hooked on it, and he kind of Michael Douglas takes me into the hood to kind

of help find her. And in doing that, there was a scene that cut out, but I really liked it where I talked about how I can do drugs and it's okay, like you know what I mean, like and this girl gets lost doing them. And I think fame is a little bit like that where some people, you know, I'm very lucky. I did a bunch of that drug when I was younger, and I you know, and I survived and it didn't really and I'm look, I met my wife and she's kind of pulled me in this direction,

and and uh, I like survived it. But I know many people who I mean, who are alive. But I love this. I've never talked about this or heard anyone talk about it that way, And no one wants to talk about it because they're more guilty, you know. The more guilty they are of the of the doing the drug, the less they want to kind of talk about it. I think what you're saying by the way this, I talked about this with food or money. That's why I asked you have money. You don't have a lot of

money noise. I can tell people have money noise, whether they have a lot or a little. You don't have a lot of money noise. And you're talking. I'm talking about a guy. I pay a guy to handle my money noise exactly, But you still would have it. If you buy something expensive, you get noisy, or if you you know what I mean. So you have a good relationship with fame, which is like people having a good relationship with exercise or food, like you. That's why I

asked the question to you. I don't ask questions to people like I asked you because I get the vibe that you probably have a good relationship with fame. And when you say exercise, your food or these are all things that like on first Bluss you could say, yeah, people exercise, people do, but people have big issues with food. You know, people have issues, big issues with cocaine. I mean.

And I think all you can do is kind of get real with yourself as to how much you like, what are your actual not what does it seem like to everyone else? Because that's what fame is. It's all like other people's perceptions of you. But what to sorry if I'm getting to know I like it just to you what is your real And the truth is I do like it a little bit, but not a lot.

That's funny, like I would like, you know, it's another world where I wish that I was sort of that poise person that just sat back and doesn't really say a lot all the time until I'm saying something. But you can't. You know, that's that's really crazy that you say that, because I because your gift is to it's so funny what you're saying. A lot of people are so um I found in this town are like sad

about the thing that is their gift, you know. They're like they're so good at playing like a like a you know, like a character or something, let's say, and they're like, man, why do I always have to play dumb? I was even victim. I don't want to play this kind of you know what I played on some and you go. But it's also it's your way of shining, you know what I mean, it's your thing. Like I said, the reason we like listening to you is because you're

so did that, you know, and it's scary. It's scary, but but I appreciate that yeah, it's and you don't always want to be the big mouth in the group. I'm the person. No, no, no, no no, it's what's good about you don't fight your thing and getting older as you go. Oh this is what I am. All right, Well, I don't know what agency are you at. Well I

was at I c M but I am now. It's okay because Kevin Huvane is the person I always give the Kevin Huvane is the person who said to me Bethany Frankel, but those listening thing he represented, he represents er and everybody in the world. Yeah, he's the biggest age in the world from from time and let's just say, a great guy, the best, the best. He's got to come on. So he said to me, I think you could be one of the greatest messengers in the world. Use your voice. And every time I tell him, I say,

it's to make shocking because he's like my conciliary. He never gets frustrated. So if Kevin Eubains that's why I'm on is because I wanted to have a honest conversation with you and we just did, like you know, I mean, do you know what many not honest conversation. That's the whole name of the doing. Well, We're not done because I still have I okay, I'm sorry, but yeah, let me wait until we're done. We're not done because I need a little more, just because I'm not because we

could be done at the time. I just want to hear a couple more things to me, I really do. So I want to know, Um, you just you got a role and you were the least experienced person getting on the seventies Show, and it seems like you haven't had have you had that real feel of like the lows and the highs of being an actor, Like you're not saying you're everything, You're you're you know, it seems like you've had a normal career, like meaning stability and

an acting career. Is that true or that's I'm just saying the highlight. I'm very lucky and I'm lucky that seventies show one that I got it and it was my first audition. I didn't have to deal with all

that rejection. And I almost that I feel guilty about more than the money, is like the fact that I, you know, I know all these actors were so hard and they're so talented, but there's so many great things about uh doing a you know, yeah, it's like we're talking about, it's like a boot camp or a graduate school or whatever you want. You know, you do it for so long. I did it for seven years, and you know, people won't remember this, but the show was not doing well and was not good when it started,

especially because it was starting. I mean, Ashton never acted, Laura had never acted, Wilma barely knew English. I mean it was you know, they had a little experience, like they had been modeling or something. But like, uh, we all learned it by being bad on a week, We'd all take turns as being the worst person in the episode, and then the next week, that Monday, you start back up again. Plus there's also like a live audience, so you have this like direct standing whether what you're doing

is funny. I remember at the beginning doing jokes and the audience wouldn't laugh. And there's nothing louder than four people sitting in silence when you just told a joke, and you learn how to make people laugh, and so and then and there's the repetition of it, and then you have the summers off and you can do movies in the summers and then you come back to a

home base. It is like whenever I hear an actor say I wish I could get off this sitcom, I go like, this is you're You're wrong, You've kind of mastered it. It It was like a wonderful and so I think that allowed us to kind of go a lot of people that cast have met with a lot of success afterwards. It's because we kind of were trying things in the summer and by the time we were finished, I finished at the age that Chandler like started friends,

you know what I mean. So we got finish early too. Wow, were you are you friends with a lot of people that you've worked with, or are you like friends with civilians? You and your wife like, what's your soul? What's your data? Civilians? Now that we have kids and all that stuff. But we did you know, they just did a that nineties show reboot. Um that's on Netflix. I don't know, want to like later this year or something. But I went to do just one episode because I can only do

one because of home economics. But uh, it was amazing. We went back and it was that I imagine having that great a experience on that show and then you come back and someone's recreated the sets exactly, and Ashton was there, and Meil was there, and Laura and the people pay my parents, and and then we went and did it in front of a live audience. They have a whole new group of kids who are fantastic, and it was like, I don't know, it was like going to a high school union and then you go back

to school and yeah, that's amazing. If this is narcissistic, but I'm okay with it. Uh. If ever I could have someone to play like a portion of my life in a movie, it would be Mila. I mean me too. I mean just because she's just I just because she's got dark hair and she I mean, she is so cool in real life, Like I know, everyone wants to like, what's that person really like? Uh. It was very weird because the word in no way romantic when we did the show, and then even now, I mean like she

was sitting on his lap. They were watching a scene I was doing, and I was like, it was too weird. Together married obviously, but to see them on that said, like laughing together and holding him, that's funny. It's amazing. Full circle, I think. Yeah, I know I saw them. It's so stupid. This is again, this is my craft as a content creator now who didn't know how to

do social media. A year ago, I was doing a stupid TikTok with Paul, my fiance, and Santa Barbara had a cafe there and it was like recreating a scene from from Bridesmaids where she's like, I don't think people evolved, and she's like, I think they do. And we were

in it. We were in our own scene and Ashton and Milow were there and they had just done stuff for Ukraine and I had just done stuff for Ukraine, and I imagine if I say hi, they're like, oh, yeah, you're that girlfriend the bat thing, and for some reason I didn't say hi, and I was annoyed after say Hi, there, I'm so annoyed because I still haven't go in. So that just shows how much I don't care. But now

I care. I'm like, wait, when you talk to them, just tell them Beth that he should us at high in. Santa bar definitely make a point of that I was in a scene just say I was simidly they're legitimately and the fact that imagine if like two year great friends from high school later met up and got together. But I was filming a scene, so I was also

they know not to interrupt people during this. Yeah, I was shooting a scene from from TikTok and I was, you know, I'm a I'm a mis interactor, and I wasn't gonna let that, you know, distract me, so I was in the focus. Um okay, So last question, well, now, what's your relationship to social media and short form content? I am blowing it. I'm so bad mother. I try

to post once or twice a week a picture. I'm just from that generation that didn't have to do it, and now I don't really feel like I have to do it, and I should do what you're talking about, which is have a The who plays my younger brother, Jimmy Tetro on Home Economics, he's um, he comes from that world. He was like a YouTube content creator and got so big that day cast him in Life Jump Street and that's how he got into the acting scene.

The point before about saying we were talking to do what you love, I need a vehicle, so when I would do this for free because I need a place like and that's what social media has become for me in the last year, which I didn't realize because Instagram is because it's a place to emode and just say what you here. I want to say what I think. I don't have a platform in this podcast. I could do it on these days, but I'm not just always like throwing it up and just talking into the camera,

so that becomes immediate. You're finding all these different places. It's almost like social media is is my reality show now in a way. Rosenthorne, what's your Rosenthorne of your career? Rose and thorn Um, Well, I mean I'm very centered on I'm very focused on my personal life, so like you mean, just in my career like you no, not

because I want to have my baby. Like this crazy ship happened on this day and it really made me feel like it doesn't have to be the right answer, like the ship, the worst and the best, my best or your best moment or your best thing you got on the I was on the cover of Forbes magazine maybe or I left the show like, well, I wasn't on the cover of Forbes, but whatever it is, let me see. Uh oh, that's such a good question. What

was the best day of my career. Wow, I think, um, it's probably not something people know, but there was a oh gosh, I don't know. I did a movie called war Machine with Brad Pitt, who had who had met a couple of we were I was in those Oceans

Leven movies briefly with him. But there's a movie that didn't turn a lot of heads even though with starring Brad Pitt on Netflix, called war Machine and the director, great director David Mashad he um and me and this other actor, uh, Scoot McNary to improvise and it wasn't like this isn't even like the best scene that came out of it. But he's uh, the director is not in that much improv and the fact that he was asking us to improvise the scene really meant a lot,

and I think I delivered. Improv is very hard because it's about you know, it's like write it and it's hard to do improv. That's good. Many people try things that ultimately you're gonna cut. And then after that, I did Um, I did Black Klansman in short succession after that, and there was a lot of that experience that I brought into it where I tried some like to try stuff was Spike Lee. It's just it better be right, you know what I mean, Like it's good, he loves it,

but if it's bad, he's gonna hate it. Like it's not It's not like he's like, hey, good effort, like he um. He's like the best coach you could get of a sports that, you know what I mean, You just got sports analogies, but you get the ball out of the park, and uh, to improvise at that level was so scary, and you can't be scared in order improvised, so you know, it was like I just learned how to do the homework and then let go of it.

That period of time for me was my most Like I was just like feeling it being in the in those movies. That's so nice that that was your rose. Okay, do you have a thorn? My thorn would be um. You know, it would be something I probably did to myself, which was earlier in my career kind of the opposite of what I'm talking about, where I had a real design on what the scene should be like and you're

trying to impose your will onto the scene. It would it's hard to imagine when you're watching just me on screen or me with one other person, that there's all you know, there's the writers and the whole crew is around you, and then the editors later in post, and when you're trying to make it, there's there's like in Black Planets, and there's where you can just discover new things that nobody knew what was going to happen, That you didn't even know what's gonna happen, and he's putting

these people together that hopefully not to find that stuff. Probably early in my career, I was so I want to make something happen. Happen the less happen, you know, so you just have to kind of learned to What I've learned is I did a play and uh and and that changed everything for me because you rehearse so much for play, you know, you don't rehearse at all from and I've now realized this is probably more boring

than your viewers want to. But you the more you rehearse beforehand and get to know the material and get it, then that then on the day you're kind of less nervous and you can do whatever I think. I didn't used to have a design on what it should be that's very miss because I did take acting classes, and you're supposed to like write everything down without punctuation and just memorize it, so in the moment, you're not thinking about how it's supposed to be said. You're just reacting

to the other person. And it's funny because I was talking to Elizabeth Moss about this and she said, there are three scenes. It's the one you plan to do, the one you actually do, and then the one you do in your head on the way home in the car. Well, that's true. I've worked with her on a film and she is unbelievable as an actress, and it's hard to believe that she goes home going, oh, that could have been better because he really comes to play. But I

do think you you uh. I think if you're doing it right, which is takes so many years to figure out how to do, then something should happen that you're not planning to do, and then the way home you go, well, that's great because we could never even recreate that. You know, we did a moved Look. She's probably one of the if not the best actress of my generation. But the

movie we did it was with Cate Blanchett. And Robert Redford and we were sitting there like like, I mean kids, I mean, we just couldn't be how good they were. But then are after the handmas tail came out and I was like, whoa, I know, she's the coolest she Where do you live? You live in l A, right, yeah? And do you come back to Connecticut because I know

you grew up there. You ever go there? My folks they lived there until I was like forty, and then they moved out because because I live, that's where I am. I mean, that's where I live. Awesome, Okay, Well I love meeting you. I now know as much fun as I thought it would be. And honestly, like, that's this is what you want. You know, you always do these little sound bites. You don't get talk to anyone for

a long period of time, and you're great. I appreciate likewise, so fun and thank you, and um text me, I'll see how fast I'll respond. And I get to meet you and your wife in l A. Absolutely, and come say hi. By the way when you see us, don't pretend you're doing a scene. Well, I might be in a very deep, deep emotional state, so I might not be able to talk, but tell Ashton I'm sorry that

I will immediately ill. Okay, good bye. First of all, I can't believe that people like Toe for Grace know who I am and want to do my podcast and have an opinion of me and listen to this podcast and like that I'm honest and speak my opinion. I mean, I just that always moves me because I hear, Wow, tofer Grace is doing the podcast, and that's he's major and that's exciting, and he seems like a great guy

and he's a good actor. Um, and then I have an amazing conversation with him and I feel like I know him and I like him and I want to meet his wife and I'm excited. Um, I'm just excited. I love talking to him. He's so real, a real actor with an amazing career down to earth. Uh what a thrill. So excited. Thank you for listening, and remember to rate with you and subscribe. We are doing so well. This podcast is crushing the game, so keep listening. I'm thrilled.

And I love that. Toper was like, I like when you talk to celebrities, but I like when you just ranted on about bullshit, which I know a lot of you like too, so we try to mix it up. Have a good day.