Chris Cuomo (Part 2)

So who do you forgive? And how do you move forward? You're moving forward? Are you're forgiving? Who do you have to forgive? Do you forgive CNN? Do you watch it? Do you forgive Jeff Jeff Zucker? Do you still hold anger?

Like?

What's what's the arc?

I think it's always about degree, right, I mean CNN, that's easy. I love CNN. I miss the people there. I think it's an amazing organization. People are full of shit when they say that CNN is no good and all that nobody covers news internationally the way that place does a foreign correspondence I've ever seen in my life. So I love CNN. Do I watch CNN? Absolutely? And I wish all those people's success, and I'm jealous of their success, and they're going to have success. I don't

You're in the Hamptons. You ever run into them?

Yeah, a little bit. I mean, you know, I'm careful about it, and I don't want anybody to the way I'm not here to hurt anybody, eat anybody up. It's it's hurt full. Now where does forgiveness come in. Where it comes in is I get why they did what they did. I get what the pressure points were, I get what they were afraid of because I know they're not telling the truth. But again, I know why this story was what it was.

Cover your ass. You have to cover your ass. You think they're a great place, and they didn't get there by like, you know, playing fast and loose. You think they're just covering their ass.

I mean, in my situation, that's absolutely what it was. Why I'm litigating. But it's not this guy's good. You know, this guy's bad, this woman's bad. I don't play that game. What happened happened. I don't want to see anything bad happen anybody. I don't believe in that shit. It takes a lot of energy from me. I don't believe in it. And if I want something bad to happen to you, I'm gonna do it, and then I'll pay. I'll take

But you're not saying, don't hate the player, hate the game. You understand the whole game, the mask, machines, the chest, the whole deal.

It's just like they look, hate whoever or whatever you want, as long as it gets you to a better place. And it just worked for me. Forgiveness is very hard. I suck at it personal level. I believe I deserve no forgiveness. Everything I do is intentional. It's not like I was too stupid said this thing to my son, or that I should have done this to my buddy, or you know, it's I know and I do stupid shit anyway. So likewise, and then it's next, and that's the part that I focus all my time on. Now.

So what is now? Let's hear what's what? Well, what's next?

Well, I mean it's totally about context. It's like, what's what's next? I never do podcasts. I never do.

I didn't know that. Thank you? What made you do this podcast?

I'll tell you why. One you've always been good to me. Uh And two it was who am I not to do her podcast? Like, you know, she's given me an opportunity. It's nice of her to do it. Why wouldn't I do it? Who fuck am I? You know I can't.

Yeah. I really wanted to talk to you, and then I guess, Oh, two things. One, don lemon, do you speak to him? Do you see him out there? You guys friends?

No, the situation screwed us up because, uh, he decided to believe things, you know, on his own basis. I get it. I wish him no ill. He's a beautiful guy and I want good things, and he's a talent. But you know, the situation fucked up a lot of relationships for me.

Yeah, it's like the rip tide.

But again, you know, you gotta go forward.

Yeah. I saw him in the Hampton's and I think I talked to him about coming on, and he looked like it was a little deflated. He looked handsome, and he's lovely, and he was nice, and he just looked like he was like overall confused, like what you know? What am I doing?

What am I? Am?

I going here? Am I going there? It's just it's it's an interesting thing to talk to you and have seen him on the street, and I was like, you should come on and talk.

He will have opportunities. He is very talented and I do not you know, I missed the relationship. I wish him well. He has it wrong.

But you know, listen, you never know cooler minds prevailed. You don't know where he is right now. He's been through his own experience.

I don't. I don't, uh, you know, listen. I reached out to him as soon as he was in trouble to say I'm here, okay, and anything I can do.

He hired my lawyer, by the way, Oh he did well. By the way, everyone's going to think that. So Brian Freeman is Chris's lawyer and I guess Don's lawyer. I have referred people to him in this reality reckoning, but Brian is not my lawyer. But I didn't call. I've been asking for Christopher a long time. I have a list of people that I just would like to talk to you since the beginning. So it's coincidental, but yeah, so oh I didn't know don so great you guys all are working with Brian if I.

Had bad intentions you know, for him, which I certainly don't. But it sucks. Yeah, sucks. Yeah, people that matter to you in your life for bad reasons sucks. But forward, yep, you know, and you you know, forgive yourself or whatever you did in the situation. Kind of kind of scotch taped to a task of promise to try to learn and do better. If there is something in that.

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Now.

So what's your rose and your thorn? Of your career? Not your life, not your wife, not your kids. The rose and the thorn may not be something we expect.

It's funny when you say rose Rose is my producer.

Oh, your current producer.

She does all.

So forget you have you have another rose. You have two roses in your career.

What you tell you, But in my life you know, it's a it's a it's a good question, and that's a hard question. The thorn is my emotional baggage, my emotional uh, the the the experiences and the personality formation as a response, and I'm not talking about Listen, this is the truth. Okay. What happened with my brother, what happened with me and CNN is very low on the list of bad things I've gotten through in my life.

That's why I asked it.

And you know, and I'm very careful to say. Look, look, I'm not feeling sorry for myself. It sucks to lose your job, and it was a little bit more than a job because it was kind of a platform. But I'm okay with that. I don't like how it happened. It's created challenges for me. I'll probably have to work longer now that I was going to before, and there's

What you know, Well, I didn't ask you about the money because before you get to your rose, I didn't ask you about the money at concept because when I left house was I thought about how am I going to piece this all together for the because you have a nut bigger nuts? So are you noisy with the money?

Now?

It's it's hard and this is expensive, by the way, and I'm the only one playing with my own money in this litigation. And you know, ah, the money has been an issue, but I'm working on it. It's part to fix but I am not. And maybe this makes me, and I've been told this before, maybe it makes me

You're being very humble. You're not positioning this, you're not sugarcoating it, you're not frosting it. You said like, I can't like you. You've leaned into that, which I respect. I think that's so secure. I think it's very secure to just say what happened.

Weren't I wish it weren't this way. I wish that I could be like people that I learned from and that I live with. Who are I'm awesome? I'm awesome. I'm not perfect, but I'm awesome. I love who I love who I love how this is. I love that I got this table, I love this.

House right, this is all.

I want to be that way. I want that way. I would tell you to be that way. Be hyper positive on yourself, be super optimistic about yourself. Sell yourself up. Life will bring you down and create the market for you. You never sell your.

Good not good line, but I don't do it. Yeah, Okay, that's a thorn, you.

Know, So that's I am my own thorn. What is my my rose? Is this this? I have a feeling that is you know, so, it's just a feeling. You know, it's not tangible, it's not it's even ineffable. You know, it's a nebulous thing. It's not like even defining. I have a feeling that conveys a couple of very absolute

And they're not. They're not. They're not, they're not. I mean maybe some things. I can't control everything, but they're like, I.

Know what I'm saying, and I know what but I'm just saying, that's just what it is. Yeah, but I think for this, and my feeling tells me you signed up for it. You can help here, okay, it matters, okay, And you got to have a purpose driven life. And I can't just make money. I worked at a great law firm. I've had so many friends throw opportunities at me to either be in the cell side of hedge funds,

Got that too.

It doesn't work for me. I'm saying that I like to take care of my family. I like that they don't have to worry about things. I like that I don't have to. I mean, I do now because I'm in a fucking barrel. But the I'm a grinder and I'm a warrior. I'm not brave enough to go serve my country. But you know, I love to watch them when they're serving our country. And you know, I mean, I'm not a hero. I'm not. I don't have that kind of bravery. But by disposition, I'm okay with a fight.

That is a rose because most people don't even know what they want and usually if you put it out there, the universe will hear you. And that sounds too spiritual, but I'm saying or whatever, power positive thinking, the secret, whatever it is. I know that if I want something, the craziest thing, it doesn't matter if it's superficial or not. It'll come if I really am intentional about wanting it. So you know what you want. You just don't know exactly what shape it takes.

Yeah, and it doesn't matter to me as much, you know. And you know something I get heat from my friends. You know that. It's it's always so funny to me how I'm seen versus how I am when there's absolutely no artifice to me. I'm no different on TV than when I'm off TV. I just don't curse as much. But you know, I I take on a lot of positions and test positions that I actually agree with, and I'm okay with whatever makes somebody happy.

Well, my rose is this interview of the day. You know, I want to I want I did this to have real conversations, like I wanted to do this not only with you, but overall because it's like therapy, it's learning. I wanted to hear your about your journey. I wanted to let you tell your story like whatever you know now then tomorrow, Like I just wanted to kind of massage it and hear it. And I'm really grateful that I went with my gut and like only a couple

What do you?

What'd you fuck up? Sorry? Last question? But what what'd you fuck up?

Everything? Everything? I fucked up my platform, my brand, my goals.

No, but how what what? What mistake did you make? You had to make a mistake?

I mean I was so so many.

For someone else's takeaway at their job, like what you know, pigs get fought, fat hogs get slaughtered. You overplayed your hand. You thought you thought your bosses were your best friends. Like what's the takeaway?

Ah, the takeaway is that I gave in to external judgment. Ultimately that because I wouldn't do anything differently. I wasn't gonna not help my brother. I offered to resign more than once, and I was told, you don't have to, it's okay, and they'll say things came out. What the fuck came out? I never contacted any media to help my brother by doing him a favor. And the reason you know that is you don't think they'd raised their hand and say he called first thing. Would I never

Didn't go with your gut. You should have resigned. You kept offering it it but but the money had to be really good. The ratings were really good. Like what you know what I mean?

If I had taken a leave to help my brother, how do I know they would have let me back in? And they would all, he can't come back in now, not after he helped his brothers. Oh, I don't know.

So you really don't know. You don't know what you could have done differently.

This is the this is the transferable wisdom, the you know, the old Shakespeare of to thine own self be true? You can judge yourself very harshly. I'm not telling you not to. I certainly do. Every external judgment is a mistake for you. Your own reasoned choice of what is right and wrong and good and bad, as long as you're not delusional, is the only thing.

Totally no regrets.

I made a mistake there. I didn't. I didn't think about the external judgment. I didn't. I didn't weigh it. I didn't. I didn't calculate it, and then I gave it too much importance and I allowed it to change me for a time, and I learned. But I mean, you know, it's not like I make shoes, you know. Being in the media, you sign up to have people judge your worth, that is, and some people will say you're amazing and you're not, and some people will stuck

I see that, I see that. I see that. I like the age too, same same thing, like you really just want to do what you want to do and what you know is right, and you really don't suffer fools. It's very different, you know.

It's like, Yeah, I was talking with this guy who were like going back and forth. He was being the media lies, look at your audience in the eye and tell him that I do them all the time. I was bullshit historyonics and at one point he was like, yeah, and you know this is what you did. You crossed the line, covered for your brother. And I said, of course I was there for my brother. Of course I did. And all this media comes out with headlines Fomo admits

Well, you saw the rose and the thorn of that game. That's for fucking sure.

And it was a good reminder. It will ever change for me. Nobody's going to take news Nations up over one hundred percent since I joined. They're not gonna tell you why, because they don't give a shit about helping me. Because a lot of them don't think I should be in it. A lot of them don't like that I'm I'm doing well, you know, whatever it is, but you just build it in. The lesson for people is external judgment is to be mitigated. It is to be minimized.

Ellen told me that don't believe the love, don't believe the hey, stay right in them. Yeah, so yeah.

And just look, you know, you know, whether what you did for them was so extraordinary, Oh, whether or not your performance in this thing is something that you're proud of now and that don't be me category on my podcast. So much of what I'm saying is one I'm no guru. I'm just telling you what I know and what I usually fuck up on. So don't be like me. Is be nice to yourself, forgive yourself your mistakes. Life is

Thank you, Chris, so good talking to you. I can't wait to see you in the Hamptons.

Whenever you want. I'm thankful for the opportunity and I need to we'll get with it this season because if you think about it, when's the last time that anybody has been talking about being thankful for anything? All we do is shit about what's happened was worse, and this is that. Yeah, this is a good opportunity to remember. You know, we don't always have to nobody's gonna get together on Thursday and say goods. Do the airing of grievances like it was Festivus.

Yeah, well, I'm thankful for this conversation and i'd like opened my mind and it was a good it was great. Thank you so much. So I'm thankful for this.

Whatever I can do for you, I'm always a call away and thank you for the opportunity.

Likewise, love to your family, I'll talk to you later.

Thank you, thank you,