Shirley Manson

Hello everybody.

This is Craig Ferguson letting you know that my Fancy Rascal Tour continues throughout the fall of twenty twenty three. For a full list of dates and tickets, please go to my website, the Craig Ferguson Show dot com slash tour. My name is Craig Ferguson. The name of this podcast is Joy. I talk to interest in people about what brings them happiness.

Here's one of my old friends. Her name is Shirley Mans.

She's the lead singer with a band called Garbage. I first met her she was the lead singer of Oh Well You'll find out enjoy.

I'll just say nice things about you. But if I say nice things about you now, no, because I don't want to say nice things about you, know, because you're Scottish, so you'll get angry at me.

You saying nice things about I've been living here for a long time now, though, I like do.

They try and take your Scottishness away from you when you go to be ridiculous?

So they do it to me? What do you mean?

Sometimes I think it's because you're from Edinburgh. Edinburgh people, No.

That's not true. That's not it.

No, no, that is not true. You are super famous, you are.

This is great.

Well, good night everybody, good night, We're done here.

I think in the Edinburgh side of things, I think people are nicer about it.

I think in Glasgow they.

Try and say are your accents you're not even Scottish anymore.

But I think in Edinburgh there like, no, it's okay, you can, you can. You're allowed to be successful elsewhere and then come back to Edinburgh. Lots of people do it, but in Glasgow to get fucking mad at you.

Yeah, that's the thing. That's probably fair. They're a little bit easier on you.

And yeah they are.

They've got me ship over the years.

Well, you can't get tenured. You're now tenured. You're now a rock star that's tenured as rock star.

But you can't get to that point without getting going through the I like to call it the Zar Doors period. Like even Sean Connery had to go through the Mangini before he became finally tenured. True, you know what I wanted to talk to you about today. I was just thinking when I was coming here to day, I want to talk to silly about there's a couple of things.

One is the Columbia Hotel God, which was we'll get to And the other thing is you being one hundred percent Viking.

Yeah, that's the weirdest thing.

I Like, you did a twenty three and meion, you're one hundred percent one thing Viking.

Which is really unusual in this d Dane.

I suppose Viking is a verb, isn't it.

It's like, I don't know what that meant. I don't think I'm Dane per se right, I'm not sure one hundred percent what they meant by that.

Yeah, you do have kind of a warrior spirit, you know what I mean. It's like, even like as a performer, even when I.

Saw you when you were like a kid, when I was a kid and you were a kid, I was less of.

A kid than you were, but not that much, not by much.

But I remember, like even seeing you back then when you were with the cool kids, you still had that kind of.

Like like you were tough girl. I guess you had to be back I think, well.

I am tough, Yeah you are, for sure, and I am redheaded, and I am aware that I am in tune with my Viking for sure.

Did you think because rock music is very fucking His horror was like a rugby thing, almost the way guys are. Actually, I was reading that the thing recently that Courtney Love wrote about the.

Rock and Rock Hall of Fame. Yeah, it'st fucking ballocks, that is. Do you know that I went to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and I was looking around. I was in Cleveland, and you know, there's limited things to do. I was walking around the Rock and Hall of Fame and I saw an exhibit and it was like Buddy Holly exhibit. And I was like, oh, yeah, Buddy Holly is a seminal artist.

And I was looking at it and they had his glasses and I was looking at his glasses and I thought, wait, in a fucking minute, wasn't he wearing his glasses in the plane? These aren't a fucking because they were intact. If they were his glasses, they surely would have been broken.

I'm going to just throw this out there, and this is more than I don't know.

I'm not sure. I think they went to a fucking eye doctors. They went to like a specsaver. Give us a pair of the Buddy Holly, we'll put it in the museum.

When we when I was at school, we did a museum of space and we did man's first foodprint on the minut We had bought a shoe box full of sand and somebody stood on it with their wellies and then that was it.

It was amazing Man's first step.

On the moon. It wasn't really that's quite. No, I'm sorry, I think that's quite.

Are you in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame? I am Are you really one of the few women that are in it? Or is the bad?

Lots of women's articles and sort of testament to women, to be fair, and I actually loved my visit to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. I couldn't get over it. I thought like the public enemy, except it was amazing, you know.

I just was angry at the Buddy Holy Glass.

Yeah, no fair, I mean I get it. I mean I'm just into music, so I was to related, you know. But I think there is a real issue with the whole patriarchal view of history. I mean that we were face we face a problem.

Yeah, I sure, I mean there's definitely work being done on that, a little bit spread out enough. But I love Chrissy Heines take on.

Yeah, I mean, who doesn't love stop, she said, anyone who thinks the rock roll of Ames getting to do with rock and roll was funck all about rock and roll?

Oh god, she's still fucking fantastic.

Tremendous were they were these because.

We were talking about Susie Sue as well. Who these are artists who were like a wee bit ahead of you chronologically, but they're the women that you kind of were looking up to when you were in Goodbye Ms. McKenzie and stuff.

Yeah. I mean, I'm really lucky because I sort of fell in love with the sort of second generation of women artists, right, and they were all, for the most part, kind of rock and rollers, you know, like Debbie Harry, Christy Heine, Patti Smith, even Stevie Nicks.

You know, Steven was awesome.

Yeah, she's real.

Rock and roll.

Yeah, I've burned at heart, you know, So that's true. Actually, I mean that band, I mean, their music was very kind of accessible, but their lifestyle, yeah.

It was wild.

I know.

So Yeah, I had an amazing I had amazing women to look up to. And they were the first generation of women who have been allowed to age, which is again something that hasn't happened really historically, is that women have been allowed to work.

I think still these women still, I think the women still get it worse than men about aging.

Like you still see that, like articles that look at her now.

It's awful. I mean, they do it. They've done it to me, and it's so gut wrenching when it happens.

Do you ever meet Carrie Fisher?

No, I've never met Carry Fisher, although she was friendly with a lot of people I knew.

Oh, Carrie was a friend of mine.

I was very friendly with Carrie and I loved her, and she talked to me about that. She said, I didn't think when I was twenty four years old and I put on that metal bikini in Star Wars, that I was making a fucking contract to look like that for the rest of my life.

And I would be shamed and putting the pillory for not looking like that when I was fifty years old.

Yeah, and I get it.

It's shocking. It's of open prejudice, I think as well.

I wish it was the last bastion, but I think there's quite a few other.

I think important people try and kind of hide it a little bit. And oh yeah, I'm very inclusive, but I don't. What they say now is they say it's woke if they.

Want to kind of say that they don't like you, or they're angry at what you think.

They call you woke, Well, they call you woke when they feel a little guilty that you're aware that they're being an absolute asshole towards someone else.

Yeah, I see, I'm very capable of being an absolute ass.

Well, look who you're talking to me, And I'm really good at it too. But I mean the stepping on people's necks currently, I really find it frightening. Actually, I think I think it's worse than it used to be. I do, Yeah, I mean I think the world has always been awful, right That's just how the world is.

You're only happy when it rains.

I think it's pretty bad right now, I really do. I think there's a very sort of just a right swing around the world, all over the globe, and it's allowed people to voice really horrible ideas about other people.

The awful thing I think about it is that if you believe in free speech, which I kind of do, then I suppose you have to believe in the right of people to voice awful shit, which is a shame.

Yeah, I don't know. See, I don't know if if you if freedom of speech is to allow people to spew hate, I think it's really dangerous. But I understand that it's a very thin line. Unfortunate.

Who was it was?

It was a russo or I think it was Rousseau who said, I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death you're right to say.

It sounds like Russou sounds French, it does. Yeah.

And then and then the French, or God bless them, they're mad again. They're setting their garbage guys around strike, they're setting fire to the town halls because they're raised, you know, raised the retirementge from sixty two to sixty four.

Yeah. Like I love that by the French. I love whether they take it sitting down, but.

The idea of to write, so who's right? And then the sixty two year.

Olds like, we're so aggurate. I'm so tired, but I've got one more riot in me. I'm going out and the blessomar I love it.

That's I'm very envious of you in the fact that in your world you get to play Paris and Madrid and South America and all that, because music is universal and what I do is just you know, like, no, I have to talk to people that understand.

What the fuck I'm saying. Yeah, that's true, that's horrible. Just go and learn a few languages. I thought about Eddie doesn't wanderin. I'd like you to learn a little Mandarin.

You know, my son speaks Mandarin.

See it's great, Yeah, it's he's really good at well, I don't know if he's really good at don't speaking of it, but other people seem to amazing.

Yeah, Chinese people kind of talk to him and he talks about that's the coolest ever, I think, because it's very hard. No, I wish I did.

What do you speak? Then? You speak?

I speak a little bit of French. That's because you're from all the lions in the French.

Scott's in the French against the English. Do you go back to Scotland a lot? Because the last time I saw you was actually he through airport. Were both getting off a plane.

During COVID and there was nobody else on the train but you and me and my husband. You were on the train and my husband got on the train and for some reason, I was trolling behind nearly I was like the doors and I suddenly pushed my way in and I felt the annoyance of another the only other passenger on the train, and to my horror, it was.

Me Worse than that, it was a Scottish person's unbelieva people.

Hey, Scottish people.

Unless they're prepared, you know what I mean? You have to be prepared for it. You just like running Scottish I think scott Yeah, it's so weird, isn't it.

It's quite weird that Megan says that to me, is like, what the fuck is that with you guys? I'm like, I don't know, It's just weird.

We are very strange people.

I love that though, Yeah, we're I love the Scots. I can't help myself.

They are the odd Would you ever go back there and live? Do you think I would?

I've talked about it. After COVID, I went kind of mad here being living in La right, and I just woke up one day and there was literally twenty four helicopters buzzing around our house and had been for hours and hours on end. There were people protesting in the streets, and it was quite intense and heartbreaking, and then there was an earthquake and I sat up, ball upright and shouted, well I did, and yes you did.

I did. I went home and it's raining.

Yes, it's raining. All I could have told you that, though love.

Is always raining.

And on that amazing house, No, I moved to.

Another amazing house. Do you want to buy the amazing house I've trying.

To sell that? Do you realize what happens? Musicians don't make enough money anymore?

No? I don't know if that's true. You guys level.

Musicians, trust me, don't make enough. People think we're really rich because they think we're like Beyonce or The Weekend.

It's not like that, yeah, but you know what those guys, But I don't know. I mean that's not mid level though. I mean, like you're playing big, You're going to tour with No Gallagher this year. I wouldn't describe either you or No Gallaghers like that's top tier.

Well, it is top tier, but it's still, like, I don't know, there's just a huge gulf between us obviously and baby bands who are really struggling, and then us and those heavyweights that I've just mentioned, like they make handle our fist, you know, and that's not the case for us. Like, if we're not touring, we're not making money. Yeah, because records don't sell anymore. They don't kind of you can't make money. You can't make money through radio play

And it's it's hard work, it is, but it's it's also kind of interesting because the musicians that I tend.

To like, I love music and I we're musicians, and I think like that.

I even think like that when I'm right stand up has the show has to run, like and I tour with Tamas who if he's not touring with me, he's touring with Dinas or Junior or or somebody.

I don't know if people.

Like most of the people he deals with are like quiet and introspective and and I'm like, hey, yeah, but you're a rock star. I was just a I'm just a vulgar lounge entertainer.

But but the but the idea of I'm I think that the people that I tend to like you are one of them. As an artist, you would do it if there was no money in it. Yeah, you know, it's what you do.

Yep.

And because I remember I did I tell you this? I toured with the Rolling Stones for a while.

No, you haven't told me that.

Yeah, I was writing a script with Mick Jagger.

How do I not know this story?

Well we never made the movie, but I got fired. But I was.

But I toured with him for a couple of months and it was on the Bridges to Babylon tours.

So it was a while ago.

But I remember watching Keith Richards, who became the focus of my fascination, not Meg. Mike's a I'm not saying I'm not comparing myself to Meg, but he's an entertainer.

He's a like a razzle, dazzle show off man. But I became fascinated by Keith Richards, who if he was playing a pub in South London, he'd be just as happy. Yeah he's not. I don't think he really even sees that world.

Yeah, I agree, I mean he's that's what makes him so extraordinary. But that's what I think makes the bands.

I mean, when you talk about Beyonce or The Weekend or I don't know anything really about them. Artists I know they're huge and people love them, but it doesn't seem to me to be the same kind of thing. That's show business and rock and roll, and show business to me are a little different.

Rock and roller is kind of like circus folk. Really, you know, it's kind of I think that's fair disreputable, but it's very out of vogue to be a sort of rock and roller. Of course it will. Yeah, it's funny. I once met Karen a Party from the lead singer of the Ya Yes, and we were talking about rock music and I said to her something along the lines of, you know, oh god, yeah, I know, but I really embarrassed to be a you know, a rock and roller.

It fucking is.

I mean, it's like being like the women that you mentioned, Debbie Harry and Susie so Edible, Chrissy Haying. I mean, these are fucking seminal artists, and I think that it transcends so much rock and roll whan has done right, Like it's that feeling of you know, I think it was the guy in Son what was what's the name of that guy that a head that runs you know that band's Son that do the really loud drone metal stuff.

A fucking size of it.

It's crazy, and I don't think you get that with you know, the stadium shows.

I don't think I agree, but I think it's definitely out vogue to voice you know, fury and lust and you know, even like Unbridled Joy. It's just uncool for some reason. And it's all this very contained pop music currently that people are really into. But everybody that you're ever going to meet has got streaks of you know, darkness in them, and that's what I love music.

I love what Robert Fripp said about rock and rolling pop.

Do you ever hear that he's incredible?

The main fucking invented the guitar solo style. I mean, but Robert Fripp said about rodd. He said, the difference between pop music and rock and raw is that in pop music people fall in love and kiss each other.

In rock and rall, someone's getting fucked.

Amazing, amazing.

I love it.

It's just when you say, you know, voice and lust and fury and and that to me is that's the difference, I guess. And so let me take you on a journey, if I may, you may back to the we were talking.

Briefly about the Columbia.

Hotel in London.

London.

Yeah, when I stayed there when I was drumming in bands like I guess the early to mid nineteen eighties, which.

You would have been. I was there.

You were kicking off with Goodbye mister McKenzie at that time, right, we were like they were a sizable band in the UK at that time.

Yeah, they were doing well.

And that hotel that's where everyone used to go in was the rock and roll hotel.

It was.

It was like London's I guess, right High or right High wherever it was. I got into a fight there once.

You're very unruly when you were young. I mean, you're unruly enough now.

No, But I got into a fight with Mark Allman's manager, How did you manage that? I don't know, I can't remember. It wasn't really a proper fight. I think it was a lot of pushing and shoving and stuff, but I think we were both out of shape and a bit scared.

So it was like a lot of move fu you fuck you anyway.

But that and I remember people in the bar.

Of that hotel getting really twisted. Oh a lot did you do A lot of that? Did a lot of that? I mean, my first band, good Bye Miss McKenzie, was wild, like proper wild ye rock and roll, lifestyle, rock and everything has been very tame ever since, to be honest, even our wildest days in Garbage had nothing on good Bye Mister McKenzie. But yeah, being in that bar. I can still really remember that bar in the Columbia Hotel. The curtains, the weird curtains, and oh the carpet, and the.

Carpet was it was like it wasn't really a carpet. It was just like old beer and seamen.

I was just actually going to go somewhere like that. But you're right, very crusty.

It was awful. But I think that the anecdotal part of that, I I mean I suppose things move on, but does that still exist for young musicians and young of course we're still doing that.

Yeah, although it's apparently the new generation are a lot are risk averse. You know, they're just not as wild as we all used to be. They're a bit more, they know a lot more. But there's still, of course, there are still wild sides to the rock and roll business.

I feel I feel sorry for the younger generation because everything is documented.

So every mistake they make there's it's there they it's there forever, you know.

That's why I think they do temper themselves a little more than we. I mean, I would take my top off in the bar, you know, at the Columbia Hotel, just to be a brat. Well I'm so glad everybody else you would say, a great girl, a great gal, but you know, a big show offie yea like shocking. First, I don't know why I did that, but I did it. And now I don't think there's that many.

You can't do that anymore.

I think also kids, I don't know, I mean because I'm kind of at the get off my lawn age, but I kind of see the younger generation.

I think they're great. I actually think they're great.

They're great, they're they're they're the challenge, and they're fucking they're difficult and they're annoying. So that's good. Everything is good in that respect. But I feel sorry for them because they are risk of it a little bit. That they are a little they place themselves a little too.

Yeah, and they're all worried. Apparently there's a lot of anxiety and question and I don't know, God, we're getting very dark today. No, I don't know, but I feel bad for them. And they're not having as much sex as we used to have. That's another weird twist to the tea.

Probably avoid antibiotics, but they might not need the answer, right, That's what I was thinking.

But it was an odd environment. I suppose it was very kind of back an alien them. And I wonder, now, here's an interesting thing because I thought if I was looking at that now and if I had a daughter in that environment that I was in, so when you were a.

Young girl, i'd be like, oh, I don't know, I feel about that. I mean, you would you are tough, and I think that's okay.

But I think there were girls there who weren't tough who were like, that'd be fucking scary. There were some bad guys around.

Yeah, I mean there's still bad guys around.

Yes, there are, No, that's true.

I don't think that's changed any Unfortunately, the percentage of you know, dudes that when it hurt girls is perplexing to me. I don't understand it. It's really beyond my understanding.

I mean those people are that's a different thing. I mean, yes, they exist. But what I'm thinking more is just the general kind of blockerry.

I mean there is still that unfortunately in the music industry. It's really bad actually, but it's not quite as bad as it was in the eighties.

Yeah, I think it's funny. I get out of it very quickly.

I mean I was out of it by the time I was twenty one. I wasn't drumming anymore.

Wow wild Yeah, I wish I could say the same. I never got out of it really well.

I think I regret getting it.

Yeah, sometimes, and then I see how much of drummer makes now and I'm like, yeah, you.

Know, you made a good choice.

Everybody.

Yeah, let's look at your bank. Why monkeys. But it's very free still if you want it. To be being a musician can really live pretty freely, and that's the greatest gift.

Does anyone live free? Though? If we're all taking video of each other all the time.

Though, that's getting very profound.

Well I know, but it's just like we fucking volunteered to be in this fucking big brother society.

We don't even need big Brother. We do it to her fucking selves.

Yeah, it's like you volunteer to We live in this giant fucking neighborhood watch scheme.

We do. And yet there there's so much content now, and there's so much testimony. I don't know if you're anymore. You know, I feel like you're as anonymous as you always wear. I mean, who fucking cares? Yeah, I don't care. It's like fucking I don't care if you're watching me or filming me. I really don't give a toss.

Right, Well, that's because you're a rock and roll star. But if you were applying for a job and Denny's, they're going to fucking google you when you turn up.

Oh, I see what you're saying. See you with your top.

Off in the bar and the you know, I think she should be actually the hostess so bad, but it's it's kind of no.

I see what you're saying.

I think it's it's a shame. But I don't know what you do.

But I don't put your tits. So youre are So you're on the internet, Well that's really pretty simple. But once it's done, it's done.

I don't know that. So are you too?

Are you going back to South America and all that kind of stuff? Do you live inside the bubble of the tour or do you make do you force yourself out?

And I always insist on going out, and I literally send our security guard into like mad anxiety. He can hardly handle it. I'm like, I want to go and do this, and I want to do that, and I want to see this, and yeah, I'm a huge culture whore, so I'll go anywhere and do anything. And he just has to keep up with me.

And do you think that helps in the in the business of writing and creativity to do that, because I always think that if you start writing songs about how great you are and how much money you have, you lose me a little bit, as I know, audience member.

But I think it's really inspiring. I mean, I just think about our last record, which is arguably the most political I've ever gotten. It's not even that political, but it was inspired by going to South America and seeing what was going on in Chile and basically the people's uprising because they just couldn't take the disparity between the

This is an official invitation to the Fancy Rascal stand up Show I Craig Ferguson will be performing this fall in your region. You can buy tickets and check out the full list of dates at the Craig Ferguson Show dot com slash dour see you.

There or not.

That's interesting that you would say that capitalism is insane because.

It kind of the type of capitalism that we have, right. I'm not anti capitalist, but it's.

An interesting thing though, because I remember when I was very young, because I'm from Glasgow and you're from Edinburgh, and I always thought people from Edinburgh had more money than people from Glasgow.

And I think it's a kind of broad stroke rule of thing. It was a richer city, that's true.

Yeah, it was a capital and then also just that time in the eighties that that kind of was true. And then so I had been always raised in a very like my grandfather was a red clydesider and all that kind of stuff. So I was a very socialist ethos and everywhere I looked. And the first time did you ever go to Russia when the Soviets were in charge, because it goes I never did. My sister did, but

If there's a crisis not government police, if there's a crisis in police, then you've got a crisis in society because if people don't trust the police, or if they or if the police aren't trustworthy or both, then that's when you get real fucking problems in capitalists or any society. I suppose when you think about it.

And then when you mix that with police and government, yeah, you know you're in a lot of trouble.

Are you an American citizen?

I am.

It's funny because I think when you become a citizen, you're allowed to participate in that.

When before I was a citizen, I.

Would never talk about any politics here.

I don't really talk about it now actually because I'll talk to you about it because we're talking, but I would never in the act talk about politics.

Won't do it.

But you're also you were in real mainstream like entertainment, and I don't know if you're certainly in this country. Are you in adverted commas tolerate? It's not tolerated, you.

Know, that is actually I think if you look at what I was doing then, like I was in late.

Night, but you were there to make people feel good. Yeah, if you tossed on about politics.

That you are all political now they all they're all political and like the whole thing is is and to even if I was still doing it, to not be political would be seen as being political. They would assume you were right wing unless.

You were like being very different climate it is, well, I think it started.

We watched the tv R in about twenty sixteen, because I think it kicked off around then.

Yeah, I think you might be right. I mean, things have just got so polarized, polarized and crazy and unreasonable. Yeah. You know, when you talk about reasonable police we don't currently have a reasonable police force. We don't even have reasonable political parties. They're both unreasonable as far as I unconcerned right and the left.

I think it goes all the way across. I mean, I think if you if you think about I had friends in my life, I still do have friends in my life.

I find that very hard to be Yea, I have friends.

Of my people who I think are fucking idiots and their views are shit and either're just you know, what they think how the world, to be honest is awful. But they're my friend.

What are you going to do?

So you know, you just I just don't bring that up when I'm talking to them. And I wonder, I wonder.

If that is dying out with the sense of the if you have the algorithm that only in your if your friendships or your interactions socially are fueled by your phone.

Or it's just your phone. Let's not talk about computers. It's your fucking phone.

So all your interactions are informed by the algorithm. Will show you this because this is what it wants you to say. You're being led away from discourse and led into you know, furious yeah, yeah, yeah, and the inability to debate. Computers can't debate. That's ones are zeros, so they don't have they talk about AI. But yeah, it's fucking billshit, it's a lie. I don't think it's it's not a lie.

It's a bias, right.

Right, Okay, yeah, you're right, it's it's it does exist, but it doesn't have that thing. It's pop music versus rock and roll. It's sure you listen through your ears, but but not really. I mean, you talk to a deaf person will go to a rock and roll show and and love it because you feel it, you know, you feel the whole.

Yeah, but I don't think computers do I think computers just hear it?

Do you know what I mean?

It's like you it's it's like it's one it's only using some of the of the equipment, but not all of them.

Well, indeed, and I think get in there, trust me. Yeah, really getting scary, I do.

I think. I also think the Internet is a phase that will go the way of CB radio. Yeah.

Well, let's hope.

So it's never coming back.

Although I mean it's really handy for so many things.

Totally agree.

I love it too. Oh, I love it for some things.

Yeah, and I love it for like I love a good, you know, dog that can balance a plate on its head and stuff.

And I'm obsessed with the animal videos. It's actually really worrying. I might need to go and see somebody about it.

Do you know what that is?

Anxiety?

Sadness, It's it's part of the aging process.

Oh yeah, fair enough. I just love animal videos. Yea. I even have animals that I don't like in my house. I have a really old dog and I'm obsessed by her and I don't know what I'm going to do when she decides she is already halfway out the door, yeah, and I want to follow her. It's literally that insane.

I understand that.

But here's the thing because do you remember Cabbage the French bulldog that of course Cabbage sadly shuffled off this morll coil about two years ago. It was bad, like she lost an eye. First she was I mean she was a rescue dog because French bulldogs shouldn't really exist.

I don't think.

It was a weird something very odd there.

And then she had like an extra nipple and a weird ass and she was run toy and Milo mouldest boy used to say nine nipples, zero fox.

But when she died, I thought, well that's that's it. Yeah, and now we have Seamus Fabulous, who was a Jack Russell tener.

They're my favorite breed of dogs.

Oh my god, they're fucking crazy.

They're full on.

Do you know the difference between a Jack Russell and a French bulldog? French bulldog people kiss and fall in love Russell, somebody's getting fucked. I mean, they are fucking crazy.

They're not crazy, they're just they don't go along. Yeah, they don't give a fuck. And they're wild. I mean they're hunters. That's why they were bread.

They'll go down together, they will.

And they'll kill it and bring it back to you blood.

Yeah, good face good Now what kind of dog as you doing?

Jack Russell next?

See, that's what I'm thinking.

But she's got a wee bit Chihuaha in her so she's quite docile. But she was wild when she was young, were you? Yeah, well exactly how are you wilder? Are you wild?

Now? Do you still about wild?

I am not wild, but I do notice that I'm I really really don't give a fuck, and that is a wildness in itself. Worse. Yeah, of course, of course I love that.

It's one of the good things about it.

Well, I don't know, It's been really great for my career. I wouldn't have had this longer career if I was docile.

No, but but you were beast. But you had to be. You had to be, I mean, and you were you were when I first saw you perform.

You're a young woman in this particularly aggressive period of music, you know, I mean, it's like that.

All the energy was big and loud and noisy and tough, big fucking open ee chords and fucking tom tom drums and wait, you're time very tough, and you were.

Part of that. So of course you are.

Of course you you become like that I think it's great that you're still there.

I don't know there. Sometimes when I come home from dinner parties and things like that, I'm always having the conversation with my husband and it's like, did I did I embarrass myself tonight? You know?

No? You no.

I'll always say did I embarrass you tonight? And he'll always say, no, you just embarrass yourself.

See that's pretty good. That's really why I know, because I don't know Billy very well. But what I know about Billy is this, Yeah, he's slightly embarrassed all the time.

No, it's quite the open, yeah, which is why I married him.

He's quiet, He's so quiet, he's got a calm air.

I want to be like more like Billy do. And I have learned to like chill a wee bit because of him. Like he is never gives himself away socially. Now I know you well enough to know that you give yourself away like I do over and over and over again.

The rooms start crying.

Same thing, And he's just like always like he just listens to people. And I find that astounding because I'm a broadcaster.

Yeah, I think I think it's dignity.

It's dignity and it's powerful and I'm just like like a big messy labrador licking everybody's faces, you know. But at the same time it takes all sorts. Of course it does. And clearly Billy is fond of you. Yeah, he loves me. Today it should be a very very pitiful lead singer. He'd be crasy. It wouldn't be this you want to watch that.

I got, you know, I have struggle with that sometimes when bands watch a band and the singers like shy and they're airs in front of the face, I'm like, hey, hey, people at the fucking back have paid two pal come on, let's fucking see your eyes and teeth.

Let's go.

But we grew up with Bruce Forsyth show.

I mean.

That's our style. But I'd love to be a floppy, shy singer at the front. I mean, I'd love to be like that mysterious and everyone going, oh, she's so cool, so.

Cool and mysterious. Do you think you're cooling? Don't think nobody thinks. I think that would be a reach.

But cool, I'm fucking quite hot, you know what I mean.

Okay, okay, but I think look, if I had to, if I had no you, Luke, no you you look at this if I had if I had a daughter, I don't. But if I had a daughter, I'd want her to be like you. I'd want her to be confident and like fuck you.

Let's get my dad on the phone show.

Yeah. See, your dad's an interesting dude, Yes he is. You know your dad was the correct me.

If I'm wrong, I will, which you never fucking shy about doing that ever before. But your dad was the moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland.

Is that right?

No, I don't know if that's true. He certainly was a member of.

That the group of elders, the correct that he was an elder there, Yeah, which that which is?

He did a pretty cool thing though, didn't he wasn't he involved in the recognition of gay marriage within that church.

Well, he certainly voted for that, right.

Yeah.

He's a good man, my dad, and he's a bit punk rock onto himself. Let me just put it this way. He just recently told me he was planning his funeral. I am not involved. I'm not allowed to be involved. My other two sisters are involved. Do you get to Go's what I said? Am I invited to this event? And he's also written his own obituary. Who does that? Who does that?

That's a pretty cool thing.

It's not cool, it's silly. As I said to him, Dad, if you've written your own obituary, that's really all good, you know. But I will survive you, and I will. I can write you, I can write over your a bit.

That's true. It's kind of a waste.

It's control, very very cross. When I said that, yeah, it's a bit of a control, and I was roaring with laughter.

But he's clearly a very religious man.

He kind of his faith got shaken during COVID. Oh, it was really wild to watch. This is a man I grew up with. He was my Sunday school teacher, and during COVID his faith kind of deserted him a little. It was wild. It's coming back now. I notice.

Why would COVID have all things?

He felt like, well, it's interesting should say that, because he felt really disillusioned by organized religion. He felt like the church just left people to it, like, left them alone, didn't support them, didn't find money to bring to the poor. Literally, I mean right, I don't know, it sent them off into this weird, like we were really shaken by it. Like, what's happened to Dad? Is he going to the devil?

Did you become religious?

Oh? God?

No? Well where are you in the whole God thing?

I don't believe in anything? Really, I think it's very religious, is it? Yes?

Yes, I think that's a very religious thing.

What on earth do you mean by that?

Well, here's what I mean by that. If you are, would you describe yourself as an atheist?

Maybe I feel like I'm getting tricked. No, no, no, say yes, I would say yeah, I would say I'm an atheist. See.

I think atheism is the most fundamental religious stance that human being contained.

And what do you mean by that? What I mean is this what you're saying is I know.

Socrates wrong, Einstein wrong, Saint Francis of ASSISI wrong, all you people in human history that believed in God.

You're all wrong.

I'm right, that's an atheist position.

But I don't disagree with Einstein or Socrates.

They both believed in God.

Right, I see what you're saying. Well, we have a difference of opinion. Right, they were wrong. Well, here's my feeling about religion. I get what you're saying, So it's an interesting point, and you've sent me spinning, and I'm

You know, Yes, I agree with that, and I think you're right. But what I also think is religion is not God. Religion is religion.

Yes, and God. But you asked me if I was religious.

I did, and so you've tricked me and you run the day I did. But I also asked, do you believe in God? Or if I didn't, I meant to, do you believe in God?

I believe in dogs? Yeah, I do, somewhere somewhere in my face. I mean, I believe in nature right, That to me is the only thing really I can believe in with any certainty. And of dogs, dogs and nature.

Dogs are part of nature, of course they are.

And also I think that is to me, that's more to do with God than you know, the idea of angry Santa on a cloud.

Do you go to church? I don't.

But I built one. What well, we moved You're getting right weird on me, now, yeah, no, no, I'm a little weird. Get it.

It's not that I built one, it's that we moved house in Scotland. We moved to a place that had a bit more land because we wanted to keep some horses right.

And the place that we bought had.

An old, broken down chapel type building on it. And during COVID, I had nothing to fucking do, so I kind of.

Looked at YouTube videos of carpentry and thing and stuff, and I thought, that little chapel thing, I'm going to put it back, and and I so.

And I'm not a religious person at all. I'm not in part of any organized religion at all. But I thought, well, what harm I'm going to do put the little building back. Then I found a little bell, so I put the bell in the church. Tell me in a local joiner.

We got up there and put the bell and it's a beautiful little church.

And the guy who works on the place where that works on the estate, he's he's very Scottish and he said what church is that? Because he's he's from a slightly different like I was raised in a Protestant like you, yeah, and he was raised as Catholic, which in Scotland is you know, it's a big or was a big deal.

I hope it's not so much, still is for some people.

But he said to me, so what is it? Then I said what do you mean?

What is it? I said, well, is it Church of Scotland or the proper one? And I said it's a non denominational Church of Scotland. They said, that's no a church. I said, it fucking is.

Now, it's right there. That's brilliant. So it's just a it's a but I got some pews. I bought some pews and I.

Put them in, and like, there's no imagery from anybody's religion, but there's some places to set in.

Some books and stuff, place to be.

Yeah, I like that. The first book I put in it was Young's Read.

Book, How Fantastic?

Yeah, So which is all different religious imagery and stuff like that.

Do you when you travel do you go to local churches? Because I do all the time. I don't.

Actually I should do that. I used to kind of do that a little bit in Europe, but I haven't done it in America so much.

Well, yeah, they're not quite as grand as they are in Europe.

Yeah, well yeah, when you do that, So like when you go to South so you've seen a lot of Catholic churches then for a Protestant, yeah, a.

Lot of cathedrals. And I love it. I have to say, like, I don't know why I'm drawn to it. So there must be some weird like pool from me with religion, of course, of course, because the impulse.

Look, capitalism in and of itself is not evil, but people could use it for evil.

Religion in and of itself I don't believe is even of.

Course used, although it was constructed to control the people, the poor. That's that's where religion basically began as a way of control, at least in I don't like relatively modern history.

I think. I think in modern times, I think that's true.

But I think the impulse to try and figure it out or to recognize the larger thing, I don't know about that.

I don't think so. I think when the when the Roman Empire co opted Christianity, I think that was a power move for sure, that was perc and certainly a lot of a lot of different religions have done that, But I'm not so sure about it anymore. I used to be a lot sure about it, and I'm not. Like as I built my wee church and I thought, well, who am I a pressing here? Well, nobody, I am a local joiner to help me put the.

Bail up pressing.

I don't want to oppress anybody. I don't think. I don't want to even people I don't agree with.

What then, what is your relationship to Like, why are you a comedian? Because that is a that is something you're honest truth, I don't I fell into it.

I think that.

But you've been doing it long enough.

I have been doing it for a long time. I think that.

I just it was very forgiving of a lifestyle that I had when I started that. You know, you could be fucking hammered and late and still kind of get by, certainly in the early days.

You can't now, like you've just finished a tour here in North America. I like doing it. I know, I love doing Why do you like doing it?

It's my instrument, it's my band, it's my it's my guitar, it's my Keith Richards.

It's like I play the guitar. I go there and I play it. It's what I do.

What is it doing?

It's fulfilling an emotional and financial need.

I think, well, aside from the finances, I mean, you have to make a living.

Right.

As you've gotten older, surely you must have a different idea of why you do what you do than you did when you were younger.

No, I do I feel alive when I do it. Do you remember the movie Chariots of Fire? Of course, it's great, beautiful Edinburgh feeling in that movie. And when Ian Charleston, who plays I can't remember the ad.

Ian, Oh god, damn it. The Runner, Yeah, the.

Runner, beautiful Scottich runner who wouldn't run on a Sunday.

I yes, I think I think it was something like that. He wouldn't run on a Sunday.

That was the story that he was a Scottish athlete the Olympics in the nineteen and he wouldn't run on a Sunday because of his faith.

And somebody asked him about it. His sister is what it was, says in the movie. It's a great line in the movie.

Because he wanted to be a missionary in China, and in fact he did become a missionary in China and died there. But he says this line about running and about China. His sister says, you should be a missionary, and he said, I know. He said, I believe God made me for a purpose, and that purpose is China. But when I run, I feel his pleasure, and I feel like I feel a little bit like I'm connected to something when I do stand up.

But you must enjoy. But yeah, of course, like as I've gotten older, I'm like, oh, I'm actually in service. I'm basically, you know, I'm here to make people feel better than when they walked in. Yeah, and then when it's gotten clearer and clearer for me, that, oh, that's my service and this is such a great thing to do. Is a purpose for me, right, And I just imagine that if you you literally are going on stage to make people laugh, it's the same thing. That connection with

I think it's a good I think It's an interesting way to look at it because there are parallels. There are little rituals, you know, there are little things that make people feel comfortable. You go to the merch table, you get a warm beer in a plastic glass. There's your communion. You go into the room. It smells of weed and sweat, you know, yeah, and bum yeah.

You hear that.

Of the ams before the music starts going through them. There there are rituals.

There's the whole thing of we were talking about this earlier actually that the idea of the on war for rock acts is like, will they do an extra song? I think they will?

They do so annoying. I keep saying to my band, let's not do an OnCore tonight, please, Can we just do this set right? And they're like, no, no, no, we have to do the OnCore. And I can't stand an encore unless it's really warranted. I mean there's occasionally, and I can count the warranted times, maybe five times in my whole career, but we really warranted an encore. Yeah, I know, so dumb.

But you know, when I was going to see bands when I was a kid, and I assume you were doing the same when the band did an encore. It was like when they came on and said good evening, Glasgow or Edinburgh, this is our.

Favorite time to playing, and you'd be like it is their favorite town to playing.

Yeah, that's true, true.

You feel like it feels special. It's part of being live with the band. It's not TV, it's not a record.

No, it's very special live. But it's when I was younger, I guess I thought it was all about me and what I'm trying to get at. It's just that ideas. As I've gotten older and older, it's so not about me anymore. It's like you're making if your challenge, Shirley Anne Manson is to make people feel good tonight and let's see if you can do it. And it feels like a challenge to me. And when when I step out into a hostile audience, I'm liking my brain, I'll

I know, I fucking know that it's the weirdest thing.

And I think only twisted Scottish people.

I think people who are true performers respond to that.

Like I noticed that with like in my business it's comedians, but I've seen it with rock stars too, or rock musicians even, or any musician that you go out in front of an audience and you fail badly, and then you go and do it again, and you go and do it again, and I think, I.

Do I like this. I don't like it like a little bit. There's something in it.

I fucking like it's failure.

It's weird. It's weird.

You know.

It's like that now when I look at young performers and they go on YouTube and they don't fail because they make it a little bit and they put it out and it's good.

They're not standing in.

Front of you know, three hundred drunk Lasswegians who are it's not even a comedy club. It's like, all right, it's a disco stop for a minute, and now here's some asshole thinks he's funny, and then you like, they're not cheering when you walk on.

I think what you do is really scary. It's really really scary. So I would imagine the adrenaline rush must be so intense.

Do you know it's funny? Now? No? I wonder do you get an adrenaline rush when you're on stage?

Not really, not anymore.

No, I see I don't either. I go to it different.

I get Yeah, it's a different thing.

It's like I remember once, when it was years and years and years and years ago, I read an interview with Michael Jackson, and it was how weird he was. It was not about how weird he was, and there was one or two of those and.

Certainly things going on, but in the interview he said he felt so comfortable performing that he could sleep on stage. And I remember at the time thinking that is the strangest fucking thing I've ever heard. What a twisted, crazy mind. And now when I get on stage, now I'm.

Ready for a snoozl quite but I relax.

Yeah, it's like now I can It's like getting into the bath or something.

Maybe I'm like being good at something. Yeah, when you're young, you don't know that you can do something really until you've done ten thousand hours of it, and then you're like, I can gut it.

Just what Tony Hawk was saying the other day when yeah he was talking about the ten thousand hours.

I love Tony Hawk.

Oh he's fantastic. Yeah, he's fantastic.

He really is.

He's very, very interesting dude, and that the same thing, there's another guy. In order to do what he did, you gotta fail over and over after fail fail fail, fail fail. What I think is is a little bit of a I worry for the younger generation is they don't get to fail. And you got to because at some point you're going to fail, But you don't get to fail in private. You don't get to fail in the dark little comedy club. You don't get to fail without someone filming it, you know what I mean.

Your humiliation is online, it's there for your failure is permanent. But they also have this strange attitude I've noticed and I've seen it with some of the young ones in my life, is that they think they should be the CEO of any company that you know. They get a job as a tea and coffee runner and they're literally like, well when am I going to get promotion? After like two weeks? It's like, you know, you really have to just stick in their kid, Oh, you're going to be there for a while.

It's like you're going to be fighting Mark Allman's manager in the Columbia Hotel.

Yeah.

But they've got this weird, twisted idea of what of doing well is and they all think they should be famous and I know, have tons of followers and be influential. It's really strange. It's not good.

It's been around for a while.

I'm I ember seen a trailer for Justin Bieber, the Justin Bieber movie, when he was about eighteen, and there was this tree.

I didn't watch the movie because I watched it. I'm not in the demographic, but either it's actually really well, it was.

Good movie, but I was watching the trailer, and then the trailer, which is of course not the movie, this voiceover says.

They said he'd never make it, and.

I'm like, well, how long did they say that? Well, he's fucking sixteen, Like who said it? Yeah, who said it?

That's fucking ridiculous that everything has to be an epic and everything has to be, you know, Madison Square Garden.

By the time you're.

Eighteen, you know that you don't understand it should be Keith Richards Madison Square Garden or the fucking Dog and Duck and eel Pie Island, doesn't matter.

You've got the guitar in your hand.

I noticed a weird thing though, at the Oscars this year, where Lady Gaga performed, and I actually thought it was really clever over like she just I think she's great too. But she took off foll her makeup and was just in sort of like how we dress, you know, like how we dressed when we were young, like just jeans and a T shirt, no makeup, you know. But then she tells this we story before she starts singing, which is, you know, I wrote this song in my basement and

I wonder if I'm making any sense, I make a total I'm just gonna yes, and in you, I wonder if that the ones that really are.

Involved in the poetry, you and I don't know about them. They're hiding from us.

I know that for a fact.

Yeah, they're They're in basements in Akron, Ohi or Detroit, Michigan or fucking you know, in New York or New Jersey or Glasgow or Edinburgh, and we don't know about it.

I'm not saying they don't exist. I'm just saying how interesting it was to have this huge star pretend that they were smaller than they were. It was just I can't explain. I really can't articulate this because it's just come to me as we were speaking. No, I thought it was fascinating.

I think you, I think you are articulating it very well, and I think it is fascinating. I think what it is is that at a certain point I got to this in my own life, and I wonder if it happened to you when garbage was at the absolute, fucking, the supersonic part of your career. And we all know, any of us who have survived more than six months in this business know that that comes and it goes. It comes and it goes, and it's quite a fucking ride,

You know what, I don't think this is for me. I don't think this is right.

I don't think this is I don't think this is as cool as I thought it was going to be. I think that I think sixteen year old me would be impressed. But I'm fucking fifty two and this is not cool.

See. This is why I love you, because you're the only person I've ever heard say that kind of stuff to me. Because I feel a wee bit like that, And in fact, I was just talking about this yesterday, when we were at the peak of our height of success. I was embarrassed because I thought my teenage self would think I was a fucking RS piece. It's cheesy, Like I felt like all these the whole sort of hysteria that surrounded success, like all of a sudden, tabloid photographers.

No, I totally get it.

I think that there was Once I got a phone call from Steve Jones, the guitarist, Yes Pistols, right, So Jones calls me you. I've known jonesy for years, and the Pistols were getting back together to do this. They were doing this shown at the Roxy.

I think it was. This is a few years ago, like maybe fifteen years ago or something to ten or fifteen.

I remember this actually, and Minus said, obviously.

Right, Minus said, but Matt Locke was doing it. So they were getting back together and Jonesy called up said would you you come and introduce it? And now sixteen year old May, that's like getting a call.

From God, Yeah, that's incredible.

But I couldn't do it because I was doing a corporate gig for T Mobile and lesbigas.

Oh god.

I remember when I was going out to talk to the the night of the show.

I'm doing the corporate kick for T Mobile in Las Vegas and I'm walking out. There's all these guys in this and I can smell the fucking shitty lobster in the room and I have a It's fucking horrendous, and I felt awful about it, and I was like, just what the fuck happened to me?

Man?

I spoke to Jon about it a couple of weeks later, and he went, it's.

Just what we was doing. We're doing it for the fucking money.

I went, oh, yeah, I suppose so and he let me off the hook.

It's a good story. He still got the good story out. Yeah, I got that.

Highlights it right, Yeah, a little bit.

That to me, it completely explains the discomfort of realizing, like this is just not who I want to be.

But none of that ship matters. What matters is is the feeling you get when you hear the fucking amschoo and you fucking walk out and the audience is there and you know what you can do and I've seen you fucking do it, and you walk out and you fucking get a my in your hand and here we go, here we go, and here we fucking go, and that's the ride and everything else it's fucking gravy. It's it's sugar sprinkles.

Strangely, the thing I love the most is being in my dressing room and you can hear the crowd. Yeah, that's my favorite moment. Like yeah, like it doesn't get better than that. Like for me, that's it. It's like the anticipation and that excitement you hear them all speaking and laughing and shouting. I don't know, I just love that. I totally understand that.

I have a memory of doing a gig in la, which I love you for and I will always love you for. Because I was going out, I was playing the Ace Hotel.

I remember it well.

I was doing I remember because I was in that you have a laugh, that's this thing you were going to. No, no, it's not even about the laugh. It's not even about the laugh. It's before it. What I did was I remember the intro music I had at the Ace Theater was the Cramps playing Let's Get Fucked Up. And it starts off with the drums going like that, just fucking rolls out like that. And I heard you going, yeah.

The audience, I heard your voice that would fucking right, fucking.

Right, here we go, here we go. And it is that.

It's that there's like everything falls away in those moments of performance. I think everything falls away, and the planes and the money and the fucking and the paparazzi photographers and the resentments and the fear and everything fucking disappears.

And that's that's why I do it, and I think that's why you do it. Yeah, I think so. Although I've never had a personal plane, I would quite like one. I must have been.

Yeah, you'd be surprised. I would quite like you'd be surprised. You'd be surprised.

I totally understand what you're saying, and I love you for that. I think I can I can find that talk to you. I understand it must be weird, so weird, but I mean, you've had such a insane career and you've seen things that's a few people have, you know, and like you talk about these massive you know, like you say, you're on late night TV. That's huge. I don't really get much bigger than that in America. Yeah, I mean it's weird.

I remember talking to somebody.

I was talking to somebody about this the other day because they were talking about how I left, and I said, yeah, but because I didn't, you know, it wasn't a thing to me. And this if you look at the people who have left, like after shortagh period of the time I left, James Corden left, Trevor Noah left. We're not from here. John Oliver left, We're not from here. So we didn't grow up with that. Johnny Carson is the way you have to be. It's like it's a gig and you do a tough gig. Yeah, it's a lot

And you're being self depreciating. But to be fair, that is a tough gig, you know, is it?

Though?

It's tough, Like you're cleaning floors for a living. That's a tough that's a tough job. Or you know, you're a nurse. That's a tough job. But but that's not to say that what you do in these positions is not I don't know, it's exhausting.

I would imagine it is exhausting. It's emotionally exhausting and I and that is true.

But being an intellectually you have to be intellectually awake, you know, every night.

Yeah, that's a lot, it is. It's a lot, but it's I didn't do it for I did it for ten years. That's that.

Well, that's a long time.

It's long enough for me.

Yeah, yeah, And do you I mean, surely when maybe.

My podcast early I meant to ask you.

I know, but I haven't seen you in so long. I'm dying to ask questions when you decided to leave? And you know, because I can remember thinking Wow, he's going to go back to Scotland. That's intense because it's like coming off an escalator. Yeah yeah, so for a while you're moving at the same speed as it's challenging. So what was like what happened? Like I'm assuming you

I do.

That's why I built a fucking church, you know. I mean, it's it's like you you have to put it somewhere. But also, I don't know if you've experienced this, there was a point where I became discouraged, of course, just with everything. Yeah, I was burnt out and it was after late night and I've just discouraged. I didn't know why I made some TV shows I probably shouldn't have made it. You know, I wrote a book, which I'm proud of, but there was Yeah, it was a change of pace.

It was difficult.

Did you never experience that? Absolutely experienced experience it just around about our fourth record and we couldn't put food right, you know, And and that happens to musicians all the time, but when it happens to you, you're just like, I literally thought, this is the end of the world. And I am forty years old. I was forty and I will never get back up on that pony because they

And that's when you become Keith Rechards.

Well, that's when you're Yeah, you're freed and you've never been before.

You're free because they don't know you. Ye, And that's what I think the truth is.

Look, I'm sixty fucking years old, but you look good.

But here's the thing. I'm sixty years old. It's not whatever fucking way you cut it. It's not the first day. And this is I've said this to audiences and I mean it like I'll go out and say to an audience, Look, I've done a lot of shows, and I've fucking won of wars, and I've made a lot of money and I'll be very successful. So if this show sucks tonight, it's fucking you. It's like that, Yeah, and it's true.

That's brilliant. You know, the evidence is good at what I do. You want to have a good time. That's great, fucking relaxed that he's got it. Yeah, you know, I mean it's.

It's I can do this.

I love that, and I love that and I'm cool.

I mean it.

Do you feel that when you work out? But I've never vocalized it as well as you just have sing it. Yeah, it's so good. It's a really nice feeling. And I guess that's why when I do do shows now and I walk out and people you can and you see them immediately, right. You can look into a massive audience and go, well, there's the cunt that hates me, and it's only here because his girlfriend wants to be and blah blah blah. Yeah, and for some reason, you can

Oh yeah, you see them.

They don't think you're looking at them. And you see all kinds of things going on. People picking their nose, you know, looking at their phones, you know whatever. Oh he's off to the bar to get a drink. I mean, you catch it all. It's really wild. But now it used to bother me when people won't pay attention and not appreciate what we were doing. And now it's just I said earlier, it's just sort of like everything's good. We've got this'rye.

You are the joy.

You are a joy, Craig Ferguson, is so great to see you.

Thank thank you for on your podcast.

You're welcome.

Problem.

Have I see me in it again next time?

Yeah? Not all befo