Kate Micucci

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Will find out.

On this podcast. My only real is that I only talk to people I want to talk to.

So apparently that's you.

Oh yeah, because thanks for having me.

You were doing that very funny thing, the garfunkeln Yeach thing.

Which are you guys still doing that?

We haven't been for a little bit. We're right now working on other projects, like our separate projects. But I am sure we'll get back to it. I feel like it'll be really interesting because now we're both moms, and I feel like that'll be a whole other turn in a cool way. Probably sure.

I mean, look, you.

Grew up, you know, you grew into something else. I mean, I think we were just talking about this. If I have two boys, you have.

One one boy. Yees four, he's four. That's lovely. That's actually a good time.

Yeah, it's lovely because they're kind of a little bit better and pre school yet.

Yeah, he's in preschool. He just had his first school play. Oh my gosh, it was so he was a bird. I was it was he? Yeah, I love I've really been having like I did not do great with the baby phase. I didn't realize this is there's just nothing to do other than try to like feed it is just a lot.

It's a lot of work and nothing coming back in, no gargles.

And once they start talking though, oh my gosh, I've been having like really like I love two, I love three. I've been having such a great time. Four is getting a little tricky because he's he's getting smarter, like, you know, not everything. He doesn't believe everything, so uh.

Yeah, but also they they but they still watched the same movie over and over again and stuff like you put him down on Ratty walk Away.

Yeah, my kid is he he doesn't sit long because then he wants to play whatever he's seeing, which is kind of cool, but it's like a lot of pretend of whatever we just watched.

But do you know a lot of people, because you do a lot of animated movies, do you do you know a lot of you?

Is he watching anything that you're in?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've showed him some Scooby Doo. I feel like maybe I should try that again now that he's a little bit older. But yeah, he'll know like, oh, I'll say, hey, that's me or that's my friend or you know, uh, but yeah, my friend. Claudia is a voice on Bluey and so that's been a very big deal.

But no, I haven't been in the world of young kid yeah for a while.

So blue is.

That that's like the one, right, Like that's like everybody is talking about it, right, but it's for a good reason. It's actually a really really amazing showy Yeah.

See, I don't know. I mean, here's the thing. Did you ever get into music for your kid?

You mean like playing music or.

Well, obviously you play music, but do you play kids music to your kid or growing up music?

I play growing up music mostly choice, Yeah, and I even't I put out a kid's album which wasn't like, you know, the songs that I write that like come from me, like are just maybe very kid centered, even though I wouldn't like I'd say half the songs that on the album we're not written for children, but they just were, yes, yeah, and then the other half were written specifically. But but yeah, so I I you know, I play him. I have played him those songs and he played. I do a show at the Bob Baker

But here's the thing, though, what were you into when you were a kid?

Broadway? Like big time and you know the Disney musicals of course, which I guess also kind of aligned with Broadway and Billy.

Have you ever done Broadway?

No? But I want to someday. That's my dream do Broadway? Yeah? Have you done it Broadway? No?

I've been to Broadway, yeah, a couple of shows, but I haven't done anything.

I did the West End in London, the Rocky Horror Show.

Oh you did? Oh that's fun. How was it?

You know, eight shows a week for a year, dancing in high heels. It's a it's a it's a job, Harvard, Yeah it is. What kind of Broadway shows do you like? Do you like the kind of the Wickeds and all that kind of stuff?

Is that your thing?

I mean all of it. I love the big spectacles. I love the smaller you know, like small like you know, a play with three people. I love all of it. I'm such a nerd for all of it.

Was that your thing when you were in school? Was you a theater nerd? Was that the thing?

I've always been a theater nerd. I wasn't in a lot of shows. I didn't. I was really shy in school. The fact that I've become an actress is I think surprising to anybody that knew me before.

I was.

You were in Jersey, right, I am from New Jersey and then grew up mostly in Pennsylvania, and then I went to a tiny school, like a little art school in Pennsylvania that was only a two year school. I thought I was going to be a toy designer, and so I was going to school.

Was it a tiny school, as know, a little people are just a tightest school because you were quite small.

And both things. No, it was like probably a thousand kids. It was really a small school in a very small town. But it had a great art program.

What did you do then? Did you do performance art?

No? I was doing fine art at the time.

Ah yeah, So what were you painting?

Mostly painting and getting into sculpture, and then through sculpture started making puppets. And I was really into Julie Taymore. You know, she did The Lion Can and I'd seen a show she started. Yeah, she said, she's done a bunch of movies, and I really got into the way she makes puppets. And I was trying to like do that on my own, kind of like learning from books and things, and uh. And then I thought, oh, maybe I do want to perform. That's like my secret wish,

No, I understand that I felt the same way because I wasn't your Your family background was nothing like that.

No. I mean, my my parents were exposed my brother and I to the arts a lot, and we were you know, we were in the school plays and things like that. And both my brother and I competed with classical piano, so that was. Yeah.

So here's what I'm thinking, Like classical piano, you still play piano.

I do, but I lost I've lost the chops, but I still play it and I enjoy it.

Classical piano and sculpting. Mm hmm that's both.

They're both very specific people I've met in my life classical pianists and sculptors, and they're quite similar.

Really, how so I feel like.

I want to say this without being judgmental, but they can be quite difficult personalities.

Interesting kind of emotionally it's tortured too much. Yeah, it maybe a little too much, but certainly shut down is the vibe that I've.

Got over again. Interesting, you don't seem that way at all.

Well, I wouldn't say i'm either. I mean, I love, like I dabble and like now, I mean, the only thing I sculpt is like when I go to the beach, but I am kind of I was able to like take a block and make something out of it, and that was to me really fun. Yeah, and I love that.

Was that is it Henry Muir who said to make a sculpture of a cop you got a big lump of marble.

And just cut away all the bits that aren't cot. He was pretty good at that. Sculptures were kind of weird look at it.

That's cool though.

Did you study different artists in the sense that, like where were you drawn?

Were you drawing it? Stuff? Like Andy Murror? You drawn abstract stuff.

When you drawing, I was very much into just doing like realistic at that time, like you know, and and oil painting and like you know, just trying to make I was more in the real like trying to make it look as real as possible, and which is the opposite of what I make now. But it's just and But sometimes I think, oh, I should kind of go back to that, it would be fun, But I always

Have a young child. So you're going to be working mostly in macaronio, yes for a while.

Yeah, I feel like I my time is limited, so I I go go go when I draw or paint and uh, and so the things I make are quicker, but I feel like it's really fun to just kind of So.

How did it go from? Like what did your parents did? For eleven?

My mom is a piano teacher, although I did not take lessons from my mom. I went to a very strict woman who she was from Germany. She was a wonderful lady, Missus Smith. I was very scared of Missus Smith's growing up, and she was just the most wonderful lady. But I and I owe so much to her. But I would get stomach aches before every lesson because I was like, I hope I did it right. I hope

But you know, is that what you finished when you were doing our school? Did you finishing toy design?

Kind of railed I was gonna go to f I T in New York, which at the time was the only toy design program in the country.

I don't know what that is.

Oh, the fashion, the Fashion Institute. Yeah, sorry, and uh, and then but I was very shy, and I went and looked at the school and I just was like, I don't know if I'm ready to go to New York City, even though I grew up ninety minutes from there. I was just like, I don't know. And then I was putting myself through college, which is, you know, very expensive.

Did you have a job.

I was small jobs here and there, and then a lot of financial aid and figuring it out. I never did that. I'm not that coordinated. I felt like, I mean, I don't know that I'd be the guy. I guess I could wait tables. I was always I always taught. I taught piano myself to make money, or baby sat aton and I taught art also to a little.

Kids, babysat and you still went ahead and had a baby.

Anything like the amount of time from babysitting to actually it was a good gap. But yeah, I just kind of I put myself through school. I wasn't sure if f I t going to New York was the right move. So I went to Hawaii and I lived with my aunt and uncle for three months. And what did you do? I I didn't. I'm very I was very good. I don't know what good means. I mean now like whatever, I don't, I don't do I don't smoke only because I'm crazy on MARYL I don't do well.

No, it's not that old the drugs, but marijuana was the one that actually had the worst effect on me.

I'm not good on it. Yeah, I ate it. I don't like it either. I like I like mushrooms, but I've only done a few. I was micro dosing mushrooms. Here I'm getting sidetracked.

But no, no, that's quite interesting because I want you to tell me what micro dosing is because I don't understand.

I don't really understand it either. I had really bad postpartum depression after having it said really that and it was it was also during lockdown during the pandemic, so it was kind of extra looking back, I don't know what, you know, where there was probably both the depression from you know, having.

What does it feel like postpartum depression? Because I mean, I know that it's it's a real problem for a lot of women, and it's not really talked about much.

Yeah, I mean it is.

A little more now, but it is more and more. But I think I have this theory that it's such a terrible thing to go through that when you're out of it, it's almost like I don't even think.

I don't want to talk about it. Yeah.

I was talking to a friend of mine who's a playwright, and she she had it as well, and I was like, when I was in it, I was like, Oh, I want to make art about this, or I want to make a book about this, or maybe a book of cartoons about this or something. But then the minute I felt good again, I was like, I don't want to think about it. And I think that has that happens to people like where it's like, I mean, there are some amazing books about it, thankful, but.

What form does it take though, because like I've heard stories like women like have thoughts about.

Heart and their baby.

Yeah, weird and shameful thought to cope with and stuff.

Is that right?

I mean yeah? And I think a lot of times I understand I feel like those horrible news stories we read about, you know, bad things happening. I can go I now see like, oh that woman was dealing with postpart Like sure, I was very fortunate that I was not in you know I didn't want to. Well, this was the thing I went to. I knew something was wrong because I just couldn't stop crying, like just deep sadness. And I said to my doctor, I need I need help.

So what I did you get out of it?

I did brain spotting, which is that, and that was over zoom because of the pandemic, and it took me a year, over a year to get myself to get help. But then it's where you look. It's it's similar to E. M. D R, which which is more but it's something it has something to do with rewiring the brain. But it's all visual. And so I'd be like looking at the wall and listening to these this music and headphones, and then the therapist over zoom would say, Okay, now I

Can't quite what is a microds of mushrooms because for me, the only thing I took mushrooms was like.

In a pub.

Yeah, and I bought them from a guy that looked like Charles Manson, and that's probably not.

My Yeah, No, I mean it's it's such a small amount, and I feel like it's the thing that everybody's doing these days, but that you don't get high, you don't even really feel, you don't feel it. It's just a it's just each day. I would do it. I do a tiny dose every three days, and for some reason

Had you ever done therapy before that?

Had you ever experienced like because I look the reason I bring up, I've done all of that, and I know a lot.

Of performers and fight most people I know are performers.

Yeah, and it feels like that it's quite common for folks like us to get kind of trapped and dark alleyways a little bit in your head.

Did you get it before the baby?

I mean, I think even as far as depression goes, or I've been very lucky. I've gone to therapy, you know, throughout the years here and there with different people. It's almost like dating, like trying to find the right person that understand yeahship and definitely, So I think I was getting better at going like I don't know that this person's for me, and then finding the right person for a while, or you know, when I made the switch once I met the woman who was going to help

The Craig Ferguson Fancy Rascal Stand Up to Her continues throughout the United States in twenty twenty four. For a full list of dates and tickets, go to the Craig fergusonshow dot Com slash tour.

Say you out there, you know what, People take drugs because they makes them feel better. Yeah, and I sometimes wonder if we don't and the way to and the desire to save people from the terrible dangers that you forget to go. Well, they take them because they're not feeling good.

Yeah, you know, like I I have.

A friend of mine right now who I'm trying to talk to her about his alcohol intake. And he said, I realized I was self medicating with alcohol. I said, well, if alcohol is the medicine, what do you think the illness says, because there's an illness called alcoholism, that alcohol is kind of the medicine for alcoholism.

But it kills you yep.

You know, so there's another there's other medicines for it. I just wonder if it's kind of like it's a funny thing, the old the old brain, especially if you go through a huge physical.

Trauma like having a baby.

And you said, like the baby was it wasn't an easy time either, Yeah.

It was.

It was. It was an emergency sea section, and the minute he was born, his lung got torn. I think it was a mistake on the and looking back, it's

Yeah, I totally agree. I never really understood why people feel threatened by it.

Yeah, like you should talk to your priest and you go, well therapy. Do you have a religious faith? Is there something that you or anything like that?

You know. I feel like I'm a spiritual person. I'm very open to anything, and I love like I I grew up like Catholic light, you know, like.

Any turns into Jesus, but.

It's just like Christmas and Easter Catholic Like, okay, we'll go.

You know.

I did. I did my like I did my communion and then I came around for the confirmation and I was like I'm not into this and my parents. That's cool. But but there's parts of it, like I like the music. I love the music in church, you know.

Yeah, yeah, ceremony is great. Yeah, that's another way of bringing people in. That's what you want, right.

I feel like there's there's little bits of things that I think I can take from different religions and be like, oh that's cool, Like I yeah, I've dabbled in Nietzsure and Buddhism as well, and I feel like that's been really you know, whenever I actually go and stick with it for a while, it's pretty amazing talk to.

Me about that, because I haven't been much about that.

To be honest. It's like I feel like I've sort of done my own thing for a while. Like I used to babysit for this family who was very into it, and they would have meetings at their house and I would just go and then I just Buddhist.

I don't even know what Buddhist meeting would do. I mean just like meditate, Yeah.

Well kind of you go around and talk about what you're chanting for or how your week's going. And it was a small little group and then everyone would chant for like an hour. And at first I was like, oh, I don't know that that, like I just moved here. I was like, that feels very like California in LA or something. And then I started to do it and I loved it, and it was great and very helpful at a time when I was like, you know, twenty four and trying to figure out my life.

Is that when you age, you came here.

I moved out here when I was twenty one, and then I graduated two years later. If you had met me at twenty one, you would have thought I was fourteen. I looked so little. I hadn't I was like I had never dated. I was like, didn't know how to drive on a freeway. I was and were you safe?

But who was looking after you?

I was living in a hotel near the airport, but it was with all the transfer students. They then they took all that. I went to Loyal and Marymount University. Oh yeah, so didn't go to learn how to be a toy designer. I decided to go to Loyal and marry Mount instead. And that's when I was living in the hotel, which was super fun, and I didn't have a car, at a skateboard. It was like just if you met me, I would have thought it was very little.

To chat.

I always got a little embarrassed with that kind of thing as well, when like if you're in a yoga class or something, when they start doing things, I'm like, all right, knock it off, i gotta go.

Yeah, I know that feeling. Yeah, I kind of stopped going to the meetings for that. Say. I was like, you know, I'll just do my own thing.

Yeah, yeah, I don't mind being quiet. Yeah, you know, like if everybody's quiet. Have you ever do you know much about the Quakers?

No, tell me you know. The Quakers I'm quite interested in.

I don't know an awful lot about it, but I'm beginning to kind of sniff around it a little bit, just because I'm fascinated by all these things.

I don't have a religious affiliation.

But I but the Quaker thing kind of interests me because they have meetings like AA meetings and stuff like that, but they you can just go to a Quaker meeting and not say anything, and it's for an hour or something, and if nobody says it and that's it, you'll just sit quietly in the circle. Then I feel like there might be a lot of information in that. Somehow it feels cool to me somehow, And I don't know why. I mean, I don't know if you have to have words for it. So right now, if you ask me

Right then we became great friends with John Oates. In fact, I love him, Yeah, pretty crazy after fifty years or a long time. Yeah, which it's kind of hard to imagine because.

What's even the point.

I don't know. I don't really I have no idea, but I do know John. I love John. He's such a wonderful guy. He is a great, great guy, and he's been always so supportive of us. You know, we started Garfunkler Notes, and very soon after this is my

So he is when he's Oats? Does he just go out as Oats?

Yeah? He played a couple of hollow songs, but he also did a lot of his solo I.

Think it must be this is a thing because you've been in a double aight. I've never been in a double act. It's a weird kind of relationship to be in.

I think it's like a marriage. Yeah.

I've talked to a lot of different people who have been in them, and sometimes it's not so much fun and it goes through I mean, are you guys friends?

Yeah? Oh you we're definitely friends. And I feel like, yeah, I feel like that that those touring years that we had like bonded us for friends. And we also made a TV show. It was only one season, but I've had so.

Many TV shows.

Something that you know that would maybe like tear you apart in some way. No, it made us so together, like we we you know, we have so much life experience together.

I feel like you come together. What did you mean we met.

Just through mutual friends? We were both going to acting class at Leslie Khan at the time. This is like early maybe like two thousand and four, two thousand and five, and I knew you know when you meet someone and you like have this feeling almost like dating, where you're like, I'm going to know this person. When I first met Ricky, I had that feeling. I was like almost like a dizzy, like this person's going to be important in my life.

Out of your hands is a good way.

But it's there's that Youngian thing of like the collective unconscious is feeding wherever you're doing.

Yeah, you kind of can't deny the universe when all of a sudden things are happening.

It's like you get to hold the phone for a minute. It's yeah, it's kind of interesting. I love that idea in that environment when you were when you guys met, because I feel like your generation of performers is I've said this on the show before to people of your generation of performers, but you seem to be a little more collegiate than than.

When I was coming through There was it was a little more kind of.

Rivalry and back bite and kind of right, kind of a little more swimming with sharksy uh huh, Am I wrong about that To have an idealized version of four you guys think.

I think like there was there was a really like it's almost not you can't really know about it till the moment has passed. But in that moment of like those early days of UCB and and all of these warmers, when I think about like you know who we were with and who and also who was so supportive of us. I mean, I think and that group is still still exists, but like the early days before, he's one of the people that brought everyone together. And yeah, Sarah Silverman was like,

I remember it was.

It was it a party environment as well, were you guys like I mean, I guess you said, Oh my god.

That's like the craziest. Like as far as uh, Ricky and I on the road, we'd always joke with people. People would always be like, hey, you want to come out afterward, and we'd like, we're going to place Solitaire on our iPads. Oh thank you. But there was something about conserving energy and you know, being good for the next day. But we're neither of us are are you know, like party years at all?

Oh, I think that's quite interesting. I remember talking to Kristin.

Channon with I love her, She's great, right, and she had and there's a Broadway Oh my god, loyalty for you, And I remember talking to her about it. She's I mean, she's very open and very lovely person, and she was talking about I was talking to her about her life off of the stage. Yeah, and she said something that's always kind of stuck with me, which was.

What I do requires rest.

Yeah.

I was like, oh, okay, So when I'm hanging around a hotel room like a slob all day before I go on stage, I'm like, what I do requires rest. I got to feel like I got some energy for this. I got to focus on it when I go and do it. Is that that's the kind of the way you felt on.

Tour, definitely. I Mean there was so much just like like just chilling before the show because and in the early days when we were just kind of building our audience and we were doing two shows and I two shows Friday, two show Saturday, meet and greets in between, and then one show Sunday, and that's like by Monday.

I still do that.

You do. It's a lot. It kind of does require you to just stay in your hotel during the day and watch bad movies on TV.

And what's bad about it? As well as you?

I mean, I just came from San Francisco and it was a beautiful weekend and I love San Francisco.

It was sunny all day, but I.

Was doing two shows at nighttime, and I was like, if I go out and do it, these shows are going to suck because I'm going to tie. Totally understand that I really want to go out, but I really better know. But of course I'm almost sixty two years old, so I really have to hold it down a little bit.

But it's about protecting protecting yourself and your energy and also being there for your audience, you know. So yeah, never should you should never feel guilt about staying in your hotel.

I won't, And coming from a Catholic, I think is you shouldn't feel good with guilt. Of course you are.

It was programmed down airly. It's like you're a original Sino. Right away, before you even go here, you were in trouble. So what happened when did you spend a lot of that time? Was that when you met your husband or did you guys get together later on or.

I met my husband well, I mean we were Ricky and I were touring for gosh, I don't know how many years. I don't even I couldn't even tell you, probably two thousand and nine to you know, eighteen. But I met my husband in twenty and seventeen. We just met on an app.

It's a very like blind no tell me about it, because that all like I've been with my wife for you know, way before apps and even smartphones. I think almost the the but we that whole thing passed me by. Yeah, I'm very glad to say. Actually, I think I worry about that as I look at like my own son's growing up, and I think that's how people meet.

It is how people.

Yeah, and did you have a little profile.

And oh yeah, well I had never done the app thing. But then Rya came along, which is like the hot.

That Riya's the like you've got to be good looking, a rich is that I don't know what it is.

It's I think it's I don't know how it works. Even it's changed a bit, but at the time it was like, oh, it's kind of this exclusive thing or if you're an actor, or you know, like.

Oh, you're famous, you can go on and then it won't be nobody's going to like take your thing and embarrass you on Twitter.

But yeah, I think that was the idea. I don't know, yeah, and so I felt like, okay, I could try this. That sounds exciting and I loved it. I had a great time on that up and then you know, and I would kind of like go on a bunch of dates and then kind of like take a break from

It's only biology.

Yeah it is.

I mean, it's it's not it's not I mean, was it that think Sarah silver And says it's rather lovely. We're all just chemical, sweetie. Yeah, I mean, and you know, if your clock is taking it really is. It's a real thing. I mean it's like it sounds kind of sexist, but is it, you know, I mean what it's were you when your your baby was born.

I was just a few months shy of forty, so so yeah.

It's fine, but it's it's I guess in terms of human history.

Yeah, totally. I would have had a grand kid. Yeah.

Well I look at that now.

I mean like here in la I was sixty two, I could still be having care yeah no, But in Scotland I'm grandpa.

Yeah.

I mean, it's it's a different thing.

It is, and it's you know, I think our town is definitely you know, everybody delays there there having a family for their dreams, you know, I think, you know, so I among my friends, I was one of the first to have a kid of my friends, like my age, which you know was probably way late for the compared to the friends in my hometown.

Right, yeah, no, I get it.

The thing is though about because the the real lesson I think of.

I mean, I was thirty nine, so the same as as you when my first kid was born.

When he came along, it didn't happen right away, but within six months I realized that the movie that I had been in up until that point was all about me. Yep, And suddenly there had been a change, and now I was an extra in the movie that I used to be starring at.

It's really hard, isn't it. It's a change, especially if you have the look I don't. I think I'm cursed with too much of an ego.

But it's bad. I mean, it's as bad as anybody has.

Everyone is an ego, everyone, and I guess I was like I resisted it a little bit.

Yeah, how was it for you?

I think, well that and then the world stopped at the same time, so it was a weird. It was like, okay, well, nobody else was really doing anything right now except for Zoom shows. Like it was like I didn't feel like I was missing out. Oh god, doing comedy on Zoom. Oh you can't. It was the worst I was like, are they laughing? But then, but I think it's harder to have kids when you're older for a lot of reasons.

No, it comes another way because like my wife is twenty years younger than me.

So she was much younger when.

She had right, she was much younger.

And so what happened was that like now our youngest is thirteen, okay, and he's kind of like doing what teenage is doing, kind of pulling away a little bit. I mean he's still you know, but he's pulling away a little bit. And now she's in this position of having been dealing with young because when she met, I had a When we met, I had a three year old okay, right, and so she I was like, you know, here's your minivan.

You know you're in her your eye, I don't have time for this.

She jumped in.

Yeah, she was like I'm in, let's go, and we're still together. And then ten years later we had another baby, and or nine years later we had another baby, and actually six years later we had another baby.

But so she's been dealing with that for a long time.

But now she's, you know, in her forties, and now she has some time.

How is is it exciting?

I think it is.

But I think it's it's like change, even if you want it, it's tricky, you know, I mean, it's tricky.

It's a weird adjustment.

Yeah. Yeah, And I feel like I'm still trying to figure out. I don't know if I ever will like how how to like schedule my day and then still be able to pick up my kid at school, Like it's just there. The time is so limited.

It is. But and also just when you get used to it changes again.

Yeah yeah right.

But was it changes?

The law of God's mind and resistance to it is the source of all pain?

Yeah, that is true.

How do you do with professional ambition and the torment of that given if desire is suffering, do you do you feel fulfilled as an artist? Or is that because at least a very strange place for that kind of thing.

It is, and I feel like, I mean, we're at a point right now where I think everyone's kind of in this uh like question mark. Yeah. And but I I love making. I feel like my fulfillment comes from even making something small. And then I get excited like if I if I write a song or if I paint a picture, Like I it doesn't take much to get me excited about creating. Like I just naturally create a lot of things right when I'm like, you know, like I said, in that dark time, I wasn't making

Ideas about what.

Yeah.

I remember going back home and running into a kid from high school and he was like, Hey, you must live in Malibu in a mansion, and I was like, no, but I live in an apartment in Hollywood and I have a roommate who lives.

In Malibu and imagine people who work in the executive position exactly.

But I but I will say, like, it's, uh, it's really for me. I you know, I just like creating things. And if it's you know, creating things with friends, making little cartoons, like that's where I'm not great at putting it out there in the world to figure out, Okay, how do I turn this little book I made into some you know, like I'm trying to be better at that, right, But the joy of making something is like, I don't know,

Yeah, me too. I mean, it's fine.

I was just talking to skol Akerman about this because I asked him if he did any act. He said maybe once a year, yeah, And I said, I'm the same, And we both admit it's because it's about as much as we can.

It's like it's a stranger time.

It's weird though as well, because I can't acting in particular an odd one for me.

I have a trouble. It's taking it serious.

I feel like, and you were on a show like in the in the in my mind, what was such a great time for sitcoms and Drew Carey shows so great?

And it was it was It was such fun to do it. Yeah, but it also.

Was really boring, was it? Yeah?

And it was really fun.

And if I remember it the way that you know, sometimes I remember it's being really fun, but remember how it actually was. It was really boring a lot of the time. And because it's acting, there's a lot of waiting around.

Yeah, there is that.

I wrote three four movies. Wow, I was doing that time.

Because there's so much downtime.

Yeah, it's just in my trailer and there wasn't Instagram, so I couldn't film my day.

With great But you actually wrote movies instead.

That's another thing I was talking to Scott about that that I wonder how much art is not getting past the starting point because of social media.

I think about that for myself all the time. Wow, what what I have made with the time I have scrolled? I don't like it's it's kind of messed up to even think about, like, you know, but I think everybody it's you know, it's that it is another drug. It's like, oh, it's time to fight the power.

Though, I think I think that we have to stop saying that it's cool, and we have to stop saying that. We have to stop participating in our own demise.

It's garbage. It's a fucking toilet wall, and we got to stop.

We gotta fight the fucking is tiny a little more punk rock with that ship, Yeah, put it down and pick up a fucking analog something, a paint brush.

I literally just bought three new paint brushes today, just like.

Yeah, I'm excited that I need you fighting the power fight back.

I think, uh yeah, I try to do a thing where it's like the posting Ghost, where it's like I put it up, but then I don't look at it anything else. But of course I'm not.

I'm not creatd I think that's kind of like saying, if you're an alcoholic, I'll just one, or I'll just have a shandy, or you know, I don't think that.

I don't think it's possible, not for me. Anyway.

I've tried it and I can. And the thing is, I feel like the addictive nature of social media. I don't know if it's late for you, but I think it might be the most addictive thing I've come across.

Yeah, I mean, we're fucking Instagram, man, I mean Jesus, Yeah, with that thing.

It will just suck ours out of your day.

And and it's, uh, you know, you see people on the streets, it's like, uh, you know, we're all kind of just looking at this thing in our hand, and it's you know, it's it's and you know what else trips me out is then the ads that pop up. We're like, I was just talking about that. Does that happen? I don't know, are you?

Are you a conspiracy theorist? A little bit?

I mean I think they're fun. I don't. I don't know that. I like, yeah, I love to hear about I don't know, I don't know who's listening but to this No, no, I mean to our phones. But uh yeah. The weirdest one for me was that I was I juggling oranges by a pool and then a friend of mine, can I just tull you?

Why were you juggingling oranges by a pool? Was it something to do with entertaining children.

No, it was just that there was an orange tree by a pool. And then I was like, let me juggle as one would. And then and then maybe five minutes later, our friend goes, oh, my gosh, and he shows us an ad and it's a it was a bowl of oranges sitting by a pool, and we were like, what what is that? Like, maybe it's coincidence, but it's not coincidence. It's weird.

It's not coincidence. I can't believe. That's just not Paul.

Yeah, I think that. But you know in nineteen eighty four, in the book nineteen eighty four when they talk about the Tailey screens and they're everywhere.

And I think, no, we just volunteered for it.

Yeah, we don't.

They don't even have to put up screens to observe us. We we observe ourselves. We walk around tailing on each other all the time. I wonder about you. You escaped this just I think. But young performers coming up now, when they make mistakes, ever, it's forever.

It is, and it's I don't I don't know. I feel for that, Like I feel like, yeah, it's a scary thing and putting, you know, putting thoughts out there, putting jokes out there, like the freedom of that feels it feels very scary, you know too much.

It's like whenever there were good TV shows, I think they always had good producers and a good producer.

Like I had a really good producer in late night.

His name was Peter Lasally and he had like produced Johnny Carson for thirty four Wow, and he did David Letterman's transition over to CBS from NBC and all that, and so he was he was a great producer.

And not for what. He didn't tell me what to do, You tell me what not to do.

Like I would say, a joke has a great joke, and it's a great joke, but you want to do it? Yeah, that's going to be he said. He had this phrase which I loved. I think people on social media, me and b I don't post anything on generic bullshit, but.

He would always say there's always another joke. There's always another joke.

And I get angry at him because I didn't want that to be true.

I wanted like to find that, you know, to be more kind.

Of like I'm an artist. This is pure and you go, well, if you're an nurist then it's pure, then you probably wouldn't be working at CVS. Yeah, life, you know, you're it's like you're working on a TV show and it's kind of it's kind of strange. Do you do you censor yourself?

You know, I don't know that. I I don't need to. I mean, I guess the thing I feel like what we're my my place of making things, especially like you know, the things I'll post these days is like I'll I'll do a painting and I'll like speed it up, you know, right, it's you know, there's nothing that I don't think any one's gonna get mad about. Who knows, I mean people get mad about everything.

Well, here's the thing, it's all a matter of time. And say you post the picture like you do a painting of a boat. Yeah right, So here's a boat on the water and you speed up. It's a nice picture of a boat on the warrants, it's oil on cabins, it's beautiful. But unbeknownst to you, a news story has just broke about a boat that sank.

Yeah, people were drowned, and now.

Your boat picture goes up has nothing to do with you, but now you're an insensitive monster.

Yeah that I mean I've seen versions of that yeah.

Times all the time. Yeah, and it's like, but that's not what I was doing. But because the zeitgeist has it's a headless monster.

It just yeah, it goes everywhere. So I'm trying to bring back your depression.

Oh gosh, oh no, I feel like I get Yeah, I'm gonna knock on my head and say, like, currently that stuff that you're talking about, like it's I don't think about it too much when posting, only because it feels like what I'm you know, like it's mostly my paintings or a song or something, you know, like a song about my dogs, you know, but it's I feel like, yeah, it's it's scary. I don't know what kind of dog do you have. I don't know she we we adopted her.

I think that's a good answer.

Yeah, if you.

I mean, I know what the dogs I have, but it's only because we always have these dogs.

Yeah, what is it?

The German?

Oh, those are very smart dogs.

They're very smart, really smart.

Yeah, like you you can leave the house and say I'll be back about six.

They'll understand.

It's just something light. No carbs.

You have more than one, I have two and a jack Russell. And do they how do they hang? Are they okay?

The Germans march up and down and the jack Russell drinks too much. Stereotypes for where they're from.

No, gentlemen.

Shepherds are very kind of like it's time to go to bad. The kids are letting a little like nudge of them.

Oh that's so sweet, they know.

Yeah, it's kind of like, no, go over here. Yeah, it's time for sleeping. And the jack Russell's are like, let's all go fucking and they're kind of the pogues of the dog. Well, but I do love it is that you have a little dog. It's a little and a little kid.

And a little kid, and the little kid could care less about the little dog. But the little dog wants to protect our kids, so like she's she's like his guardian. And even to your point of like really knowing what's up. Like when he was little, she she would come up and put her paw in my head and just wake me up in the middle of the night. And she would know that Mikey was hungry before I knew. Yeah, very in tune. A sweet sweet dog.

It is your dog.

We think maybe nine or ten at this point. Yeah, but yeah, she's she's a Yeah. I could tell she she always wants to go with me wherever, but she just right in my bed. No, she has a type of dog that sits in a back like we fly with her and no one ever knows. I mean, obviously I still for her to fly, but like nobody would ever know. Yeah. Well, actually I just got that perk through jet Blue. So if I fly Jet Blue, no, I don't have to be that's a fun thing.

I didn't.

I don't know because when I see people carrying their dogs on the plane, I'm like, I assume that the dog flies for free.

It's usually like seventy five dollars or it doesn't get a seat. But I but I fly Jet Blue mostly, and so I got the dog perk. That's really exciting.

The mint jet Blue where you get a single seat on your own.

I used to, but now with with a kid, we just we do the three to three across in it.

Yeah, but that's the great thing about once you're a family, that you don't have to go first class or try.

And you just have a ro you're in first But yes, mint Is I always loved Have you done the flight?

Yeah?

Every parent does that pass through this thing where your baby is the baby that's ruining the flight for everybody else.

I'm gonna knock on. No, we know it happened.

Really yeah, well maybe not.

He's four, but he's always been a great wire, like we've been so lucky. Do you want to hear about a crazy flight that I just had though? Sure, this is a crazy story. We were visiting my aunt and uncle. They live in Hawaii, that's where I was back in the day, and they had never met Mikey, and so

So of course, no way it was the fruit.

Turns out it was a fruit called a durian. Did you know somebody so these I looked it up. I felt less crazy once I looked it up. It's caused other flights to be delayed in things because it can smell like propane. It can smell like a lot of bad things. But it's illegal in some countries because it smells so bad. And somebody got their fruit through two fruit screenings and decided it was time to eat a durian while on our flight.

And are the people that wear short but bringing on that that's a rage.

It was so wild. I mean, I did feel a little crazy because I went through so many emotions within those you know, eight minutes, but it was it was really scary, And it turns out it was a fruit. Yeah, well all's well, that ends well yeah, I guess so.

It's been lovely talking to.

You, so much fun to talk to you. I feel like we just kind of wandered around, but it was really fun.

Thanks for having me lovely, Thanks for being here.