Shark Encounters and Rescue Missions: Chris Cameron’s Uncharted Adventures

Get ready for some great adventures , not only in the water , but in the air , with Chris Cameron . Welcome to Journey with Jake . This is a podcast about adventure and how , through our adventures , we can overcome the challenges of life that come our way . While I expect you will learn some things about different adventures , this show will entertain you .

Each episode will feature different guests or guests as they share experiences and stories from the different adventures they have been on . Not only will you be entertained , but you will also hear the failures and trials each guest faces and what they have done or are doing to overcome the hardships that come their way .

My goal is to take each of us on a journey through the experiences of my guests , with the hope that you'll be entertained and inspired to overcome your day-to-day challenges . After all , it's not all about the destination as it is about the journey . Welcome back to the show . My name is Jake Bushman and I am the host of Journey with Jake .

We are on episode 123 today and I was thrilled to be able to speak with Chris Cameron . Before we get to my conversation with Chris , I want to mention a few ways to get to know me and my guests just a little bit better . First and foremost , give me a follow on Instagram at journeywithjakepodcast .

This is the best way to see some clips from the show , see what my guests look like , and a way to get to know me personally as well . Journey with Jake is also available on YouTube . If you get an inkling to watch the episode , you can do that on YouTube . My YouTube channel can be found by searching for Journey with Jake podcast .

If you venture onto YouTube , I would love it if you could subscribe to my channel . Another avenue I don't talk much about is my website , which is found at journeywithjakenet . You will find all 123 episodes on my website and this is a good way to go back through and see what we have done on the show by browsing the episodes on the website .

As you all know , journey with Jake is an adventure podcast and my guest today is all about adventure , from flying planes and helicopters to swimming with sharks . Chris Cameron is up for it .

One thing I loved about Chris was his honesty about the challenges of being a first responder , and he also talked about being present and how swimming with sharks is one of the best ways to be present . This is a fantastic episode . If you like this , you will also enjoy episode 76 with Alison Burkhardt about her year of discovery and ocean free diving .

Be sure and check out my episode with Alison . All right , let's get to my conversation with Chris Cameron . I'm excited . Today I have Chris Cameron on Journey with Jake with Allison . All right , let's get to my conversation with Chris .

So before we dive into all that , we're going to jump into some of that . Maybe not all of it , but we'll dive into little bits and pieces of some of your story . That's what I want to know . I want to know a little bit about who you are . So , if you don't mind , can you give us a little background , kind of where you're from , where you grew up ?

I'm a third generation Floridian , which is hard to find Usually somebody has a transplant from New York or wherever . But I'm born and raised three generations here in the Peninsula State .

So my family that settled here generations ago were cattle farmers in the middle of the state and then we kind of trickled down further and further south to this final landing spot . But growing up I always had a bunch of family that still had land and was still in the calving industry up in the middle and north Florida .

So I'd spend my summers at ranches working with cattle , working with horses , just getting into trouble around farms .

But then the beauty and just kind of what raised me is I could spend my summers up there out in the middle of the state , kind of in the countryside , and then I'd come back home and I've got the Atlantic Ocean right here and if I run a boat out 15 , 20 minutes out , that way I'm in world-class fishing .

So it's always been the best of both worlds for me . It was like a huge shaper of my childhood and just being outdoors and that's what got the adventure bug going right . So it started at a young age . Yeah , born and raised here , and then I've lived everywhere else . I went to college . I was fortunate enough to play at Mississippi State University .

I played football there for four years and then came back home , got into . I guess what are my professional careers now ? Just , sometimes it's even kind of I can't even wrap my head around it .

But being that , it's an adventure podcast , so I , years ago I founded a dive charter and specifically the dive charter was centered around shark interactions or just apex interactions in general , so anything big , whether that was whales , whether that was dolphins , whether that was sharks .

Me and a group of friends of mine kind of perfected the art of without cages , without scuba gear , just going out and repetitively being able to safely kind of do these dives again and again and again with the public . At first it was just our friends , people that were crazy enough to come along , and that's how it started .

And then I was , very fortunate enough , at a young age . There was a man who was a big influence on me . His name's Manny Puig .

You might recognize the name Some of your followers might but he was the stunt coordinator for the Jackass films and the Wild Boy films , as well as a huge , legendary spear fisherman commercial spear fisherman down here in South Florida .

But he was one of the first ones to ever start doing alligator diving in the Everglades in really , really murky conditions and he took me out for my first dive when I was 11 years old .

Then that was the first time I ever saw , you know , alligators in the wild , face to face , no cages , so that all kind of started young and then from there I got into spearfishing and and it just kind of just rolled on from there . It was just growing up in Florida . If you're a Florida boy , it's just , that's just normal .

I , you know it's kind of weird to say , but that's like that's a skillset , like any other part of the country . You just that's growing up . You , you interact with these animals , whether you're fishing or diving or just you know , in the back country , and it just becomes pretty commonplace and just something that you deal with as a part of life .

So doing it professionally and guiding people was really just kind of polishing up a skill set that I'd already developed when I was a kid and just making sure that I could replicate it time after time and putting in safety protocols and that type of thing . That's one of the jobs . And then , second to that , which I guess usually when people ask I'm like .

Well , the professional job is I'm a professional pilot , so I fly for the sheriff's office here in Palm Beach County , so I fly their helicopters , and we have some fixed wing aircraft as well . So I'm dual rated , can fly helicopters and airplanes , but the day to day is usually just catching bad guys from a helicopter .

So , which has an adventure side of it too .

We can drop down baskets , we can drop down people , whatever it is to get people out of harm's way and get them back to that next level of care . So that's kind of the nine to five , I guess .

So all the CPR training , all of the I mean all the firearms training , we do that every single year on top of our piloting skillset and just staying on top of that .

But you mix stainless steel cable with rotor blades and tail rotors and weather , yeah , and weather changing conditions and there's small margins for error there . So they're very intense flights that I'll say weather changing conditions and there's small margins for error there .

So it's , it's a very , they're very intense flights that I'll say you're , you're really locked in and zoned into your job for the entirety of the time that you're in the air .

You know , especially , I think you ask any person that's in law enforcement or military you , you go into these things wanting to help , wanting to make some type of difference right , and there's days that you get to achieve that .

And then there's days where you don't and you fall short , whether you were too late or whatever the case may be , whatever the circumstances were . I mean , I recently had that on a rescue swim a couple of weeks ago , where an aircraft went into the water .

We got there on scene and I was the first rescuer on scene , got into the water , was hoping , praying in the back of my mind , that there was an air bubble or a pocket in the aircraft , but it wasn't the case . You know , at that point you're just , you're recovering , you're recovering bodies , and those , those moments will just , they just .

You know we have great tools to deal with them . I think mental health has come a long way in the first responder profession . But you still have trouble sleeping that night thinking if I could have done this , if we would have been faster , if this call would have come out

at this time . You're always going to try and run it back and see what you could have done better . But I think that's important to the profession too , because you're always kind of self-criticizing so that you can put out a better product . But it's definitely up and down it takes .

You have to have a strong support system and you have to have a system in place to process that stuff . And I've tried to put something together that works for me , but it's , you know , it's definitely can be an uphill battle some days .

And it wasn't until probably I might've been just six months , maybe a year ago that I came to the realization just a light bulb moment and some reflection that there's no going back . I was always trying to like , do this process of like , how do I reset ? But there is no reset .

It's life continues now from this point forward , and then you've just got to process what actually took place .

And I find that if I can glean something from it , if I can , you know , make myself better as a first responder , if I can make my unit better , or the crew that I was with that day , or if I can find some type of positive to pull forward into the future , that I'll say , okay , this is who I am now , with these new set of experiences , this is what I

have and have gained from it . Now let's move forward with life , and that way I'm in that sense . For me , I'm able to continue to perpetually move forward and not be stuck , and that's what's kind of worked for me .

Because it's hard to find even with a supporting girlfriend , wife , family , whatever it is it's different when it's somebody that really knows what you're going through . And we've got a fantastic culture in our unit , that kind of because you know .

You know what everybody's baseline is , so when they're having an off day you're able to just say , hey , let's have a conversation . You know , come chat with me real quick and then check in . So that's number one .

I've got a fantastic girlfriend whose father was in NYPD for a 25-year career she gets it in that respect and a family that's very supportive of my career as well and always checking in . So the immediate family is fantastic . And then I'm very blessed to have a unit that I work with . That's kind of forward thinking in that regard .

I don't know if that's the case across the country , but certainly lucky to have a unit that I work with . That's that's kind of forward thinking in that regard . I don't know if that's the case , you know , across the country , but certainly lucky to have it here .

, girl .

That you said being close to this wildlife doing that sort of thing in Florida , that's just you being a kid , that's just growing up in Florida , that's what it's like . And you did your first alligator dive when you were 11 years old . Can you tell me about that , what that experience was like ?

Once I started seeing sharks I was like , oh man , this is the coolest thing ever . So I kept trying to to replicate that and I'd , I'd shoot fish that you know were kind of junk fish that you would cut up for bait and I would just break them up in the water to just see what would show up .

And then , as far as the alligator dive thing , close , family friend took me out into the Everglades , to some areas in South Florida where , through the Everglades and the filtration system of that kind of preservation wildlife sanctuary , you get pretty clean freshwater flow . So as far as freshwater diving goes , it's amazing visibility and that's like 12 , 15 feet .

So if you can see 12 , 15 feet in the Everglades , you're like in the Holy lands , that's like the best scenario ever .

Yeah , you're really onto something , and so we would just , we would just swim on the surface , just snorkel on the surface , to kind of little pockets of different topography where we knew they would usually be during that time of year , and you'd either see them , typically on the bottom and I'd have a light with me , and you just kind of flash the light through

the water and you'd catch two glowing eyes and that was it .

I mean , it was purely observational , we weren't going and putting our hands on anything , but that was enough and it was a huge , huge learning curve to keep your heart rate under control and I learned some skills at a very young age that have helped me through a lot of different areas and components of my life .

But yeah , it was such a thrill to be able to share the water with something like an apex predator , without barriers , and you have to know your limitations and you have to have some expertise and some knowledge about body posture and body language and that type of thing .

But when you're with somebody that you trust and that knows that environment it was , it was incredible , it just like it would just light a fire , that it was like that was living , you know , like moments of just raw nature and these very , very impressive animals that could just explode in just this display of raw power in a second if they wanted to or if

they felt threatened or needed to . It was just very different to see than going to a zoo or whatever the case may be , which definitely has its upside , but when you are there in their world , it's special and it puts you in your place in the world too . I think that is like a huge , huge component of wildlife and being out in nature .

That I take away is that you want to feel small and you want to feel like and you want to humble yourself . Go , jump off the boat , you know , four miles offshore , and then have the boat drive away and and you will immediately , you know , have an understanding of just just how tiny we are on this , on this big rock . So , yeah , special moments .

So four days of 12 hour shifts and then , just , you know , kind of balls to the wall with the , the , the helicopter thing , and then four days of time to myself and I'm just . I'm just the type of person where after I get the first day of recharging my batteries , I can't sit around for three more days .

So , you know , it's just right on , right onto the next . And and now , uh , I , I used to have the businesses that were open to the public , but now , after I , I sold those . I just cater to private clients at at this time . So it's just , uh I .

I've got a handful of clients that I've been leading their guide , leading their dives for wherever they want to go in the world , whatever they want to see whether it's I've taken clients to go see great whites in Guadalupe , mexico , the Bahamas , for tiger , sharks and hammerheads , dolphins , you name it so or if they just want to come here in our backyard , we

can do it here , but so that's . I'm a lot more selective now and not as strapped for time as I used to be , that's good , you worked your way into that . Yeah , yeah , it's . You know cause . You got to build relationships , especially when , I mean , my job is to get you in the water and get you as close to the animal

as you feel comfortable , to be able to get that really , really just special observation moments and then get you back on the boat safely and then , hopefully , you know , the reason I like doing it with with private clients is that I get to really personally work on their skillset in the water , like we .

We will take you from here to here to here over the course of you know a couple of trips and you know , at that point maybe they've got the skillset to go hands-on with the animal and do some redirects and that type of thing . So , yeah , it's , it's cool to see people grow . That that I really enjoy .

It's kind of kind of just feels like diving with a buddy and just watching them grow .

But you go to more distant places and once those first couple hours are spent in the water and the sharks start to acclimate to what's going on and they get a little bit more curious and a little bit more pushy , they just start closing the gap and , whether you're ready or you're not , they , it's their territory .

They start moving in , you know , with a little bit more speed and a little bit closer to you .

So being able to be comfortable and actually place your hands on the animal and and just gently guide them it's not like a grab it , shake it you know , Hollywood movie , but just to have just the presence and the calmness and stillness , to just place your hands on the animal and just just give it a .

give it a a gentle deflection and like , hey , we would . We would prefer if you went this way and that's like all you're doing , we'd prefer if you went that way . I don't want you coming right towards my face , yeah exactly , yeah , I prefer you to go that way , and that's really all it is .

Is you just putting your putting your hands on the animal and just guiding it along ?

You know , usually there's some areas that sharks , just their natural curiosity , will get them to show up , but in most cases you're going to have to put some type of bait source in the water . Whether it was for photography or videography or trying to get a shot . I'd have bait in my hands and be trying to drag it across a camera or set something up .

And there was a couple of times where the current was pushing this way . I was dragging bait that way . I let go of the bait . Bait came right back to me . Shark went right for the bait and I did this at the last second , just right on the elbow , but real quick , just the presence and calmness to , as it kind of clamped down , just another redirect .

Hey , I'd prefer you not do that and off she went . So it happens right Comes with the territory , yeah .

sharks are , I guess , I guess , the best way to , uh , they're ambush predators and they're , you know , they're very opportunistic . So your eyesight and making eye contact is your number one deterrent .

If you can make eye contact with a shark , it makes eye contact with you and then you play this kind of little game of chicken and all of a sudden , boom , they make their turn . So you're constantly scanning , your eyes are going to the closest one and it's just a very yeah .

It's an interesting process because you can't be anywhere , but where you are , your mind can't be anywhere else . You are just completely in the moment , 100% .

I think it's just , you know , the unknown is just a natural fear barrier that you've got to break down . But , like I said , I've never been attacked . I've never seen one beeline for me , hell bent on rolling back to those doll black eyes and the whole Quint Jaws monologue where it was like it wanted to swallow my soul and all that kind of stuff .

It's never been that . That . It's just a wild animal that really tells you the truth Every time you look at it . You know I've , I've never had . I like to tell people this . They're like well , isn't it dangerous ? And this , that , and they're like I've never had a wild animal lie to me .

They tell me exactly what they're going to do before they're going to do it with their body posture . They're more honest than humans . So if you can just learn those things and kind of pick up on what those processes are , you'll find yourself very , very comfortable with a very , very honest creature . That's the way I think of it .

That's a good way to look at it .

This is fascinating to me , something that I find interesting too , because I've seen those videos where , like , here's the Florida coastline and you got all these people on the beach , and literally just right off the beach there's like a hundred sharks , and I don't even think the people on the beach know it .

Okay , what do you say to someone who's like me , who's oh , let me go visit Florida . Do I have to have a fear , like , what's the ?

You know , the left side of the helicopters were headed North and I'll just kind of chuckle to myself Like that person has no clue and it's the best thing that could happen to them that they don't know .

It's like the ignorance is bliss thing , nature's doing nature's thing , you're doing your thing and we just , you know , every time they intersect it doesn't happen often , but when it does , it does , and for the most part , you know , sharks don't have hands , so if they're going to you know poke and guess at what something is , it usually comes with what we refer

to as a test bite and that's usually what most of those interactions are because you're in their territory , you're in murky water , you're in the surf , crashing waves , it's their ocean , we just get to enjoy our summer break in it . But yeah , I mean to that . I don't think it's anything that anybody should have a fear for

. It's just you know , you'd be better served to know the reality of it . It is , and the reality is that they're there .

It's all regulated in the cages , pure observation . But you steam out there . You leave the day before you start steaming out there all night and then you wake up the next morning . The day before you you start steaming out there all night .

And then you wake up the next morning , the day that you're going to get to the island and it's like straight out of king kong , I mean you're talking like a mountain that just jets out of the water . There's dramatic fog draped around the entire thing , like in your mind you're thinking the jurassic park theme song should be playing .

And then you pull up into this cove , anchor the boat and they start , you know , putting some chum out in the water and then you start to see very in this instance , I'm not afraid to say it some very Jaws-like imagery , where you get this fin , you know , cutting through the water and it's like , oh my gosh , this is straight out of Hollywood .

And then you get in the cages and you get . You know , the visibility in Guadalupe is amazing . It's the best place in the world to see white sharks because you can see for three 400 yards out into just crystal clear blue . So the first shark you see as it approaches the boat , I mean you're like , oh , what's that little fish ?

And then a couple of seconds later it just keeps getting bigger and bigger and bigger . And then it's right up at the cage and it's literally blocking out the sun and a school bus is just calmly just swimming by you . And I remember just first time I ever went out there , I remember just seeing , thinking to myself this is cool .

Like you grow up as a little kid thinking about dinosaurs and this , but you don't ever get to see most of us don't get to see nature that big and that powerful , like face to face and just the pure size . And like you're just you know that you're looking at something just perfected by evolution .

And uh , and then the first time that thing powers up and goes and chases one of the , they throw out these large tuna carcasses to get the sharks to come up and it's just like you'd see on like a shark week , the great whites will breach and they'll come , you know , tail out of the water and you see that 20 foot animal power up and just go full

prehistoric . You're just like , wow , there's still mystery in the world . There's , you know it . Just , it just kind of like stirs up this , like this magic that you kind of think about when you're a kid , and then you get to see it , you know , at real world , and it's , it's a game changer .

But you're also have your mouth kind of open and you're just trying to make it work .

The stripe pattern , the intelligence they're very , very smart . They know visibility . They'll stay just on the edge of where you think or where they think you can see them , and all you can see is kind of the hazy stripe pattern .

And then you know , if you lose sight of them all of a sudden , you'll get bumped on the back of the head and they'll swim right over top of you . So they're very , very intelligent . Yeah , it kind of just feels like you're playing a game when you're diving with them . It's a lot , a lot of fun and they're just , they're gorgeous animals .

I love everything about them . So tiger sharks for sure .

But yeah , I think there's a lot of people that are just like I could never do that , you know , that's like that's insane .

And I've taken those same people into the water , whether it's in the Everglades or in the ocean , and once , once the heart , heart starts settling down and they realize that I dare say it can be a little bit therapeutic because again , like I was saying , just you are , it's , you're purely present and people really get , get captivated by it .

You know part of my skillset and what my job is to do is just to bring the show to you . So if you can breathe through a snorkel and not freak out , you can do it . You know I'll do the rest and then and then people wind up , just it's . It's a life-changing experience for them , which is really gratifying for me to see .

Do you have , and is there a difference Like which , which one gets you more animated , like , is it flying these planes or is it going underwater , or is it kind of the same or is it different but the same , if that makes sense .

But there's like two dynamics in both the diving that I do and aviation , that are very , very similar and and what make it very satisfying to me ? So in aviation and in in the dive guide there's there's kind of like a very linear system to it at first .

So it's checklist , it's preparation , it's planning , it's all of these kind of like black and white rules , and that's very satisfying to me , like my male brain , it's just very linear . Check my boxes , checklist . It feels good to have those dialed in Because you know like after that systems are a go , let's go get after it .

And then you get to this second portion of it in the air or in the water , where you're kind of in the water you're using your body and the animals to where you're low and we're trying to get certain angles through the camera and getting eyes on people and we're going around buildings like you're molding man and machine and it's just like this flow state .

So it's kind of like a little . It's got like this kind of like feminine , artsy vibe to it and then it switches back to all right , the job is done or the dive is done , let's check all our safety boxes , let's get back to the boat , let's land the aircraft , and it's back to that like linear thinking .

So there's like this polarity that I experienced in both of those separate endeavors that are very satisfying . It's like a very complete process .

It's this linear and then this nonlinear , where you get to really just be like expressive , and then it ends with linear again and then , like , by the time I'm done , I'm like like what a day , like nobody's got it better , just feeling like a hundred percent .

So I constantly feel both a mental pressure to stay physically ready . I swim every single day , hit my laps in the pool , I run my miles , I'm still lifting weights . I mean that's just , that's . That's the only way that

I can feel prepared . If I miss a day , I feel like I carry like a big weight on my shoulder that I could be potentially letting someone down . So that mental side of things , you know , like I I kind of have to . I've just got my process and I got to stick to my process to make me feel like I'm ready . So the physical side of it is definitely there .

The mental side of it , yeah , just just feeling that pressure and really the only way to stave that off for me is to just know that I'm physically ready . There's a whole other side of it . You stave that off for me is to just know that I'm physically ready . There's a whole other side of it .

You know , aviation is a you got to know a lot about a lot . Like in life , you can get by with knowing a little about a lot , but aviation is you got to . I didn't . Nobody told me when I was a kid and I was like I want to be a pilot . You know , I saw a top gun . I want to be a pilot . Nobody told me .

Well , you , you're gonna have to know how to interpret law as far as the rules and everything . You're gonna have to know how systems work . You have to know how jet engines work . You're gonna have to be semi-engineered . Like if I'd have known that I would have picked something else .

So , like I start my day every day I crack open the book , like the basic books , like literally like your student pilot . I just I . I always say I've got a 32 gig brain and I got 64 gigs of stuff to remember . So if I'm not constantly , that's part of my process .

I wake up and I study my craft every single day , because it's the only way that I feel confident when I power up the machine , that I just that I know what I'm doing . I don't ever want to be as a professional in a oh uh . What do we do in this scenario moment ? I just I . I just don't ever . I want to .

You know , I don't ever want to feel like I'm an imposter . I want to be what I am and what I am as a professional . So it's important to me to just keep that process , keep that skillset sharp and and never let it falter .

Do , Cause there's a lot of people in any profession right that once they get the letters next to their name , once they get the title , they've arrived . I don't want to be that way .

You know , and you've seen the movies and you got the helicopter drop in a basket . I even see people jumping . Are you jumping off to into the water to help people ?

And then just whatever the situation dictates if it's black water situation , where we can't see the bottom or we're unsure of what's on the bottom , then we'll just hook up to the cable and we'll slowly get lowered in . So it's , you know , obviously we're not worth anything . If we're hurt , you know we can't rescue , then it turns into a two person rescue .

So whatever the situation dictates to get us on scene safely and get us into the water , obviously expediency being , you know , part of the equation . But all of that is in constant flux , based on what information we have and what the what the scenario is . So I guess the short answer is we do it all , whatever , whatever we need to do .

It could be that , you know , and it could be somebody off into the Everglades . It could be a four-wheeler accident . Now they've got a broken leg , you know , and the fire rescue and the actual land vehicles just can't get through the marsh , so it becomes an aviation unit issue .

At that point In most cases the first thing we do is get on scene and just find out what we got and then after that we're making the decision on because of the risk and the skill of that rescue hoisting . We try and go through the scenarios of how can we get this person out without having to do this without doing it .

Yeah , it's a last resort , just because of uh , you know the risk that it takes for for all the crew members to to , to you know , operate it effectively . So , but it yeah . The answer is it , if you can dream it , here in Florida it happens Wow .

We get a lot of kids , you know , that wander off into pools , that wander off into canals and and find themselves , you know , falling down the bank of the canal and unable to get out and and showing up and and finding those scenes is tough . I don't have kids yet , but I've got two , you know .

I've got nieces and nephews that I adore and they're of that very vulnerable age where , if you don't have eyes on them , something could happen . So those are , those are tough ones . Those are definitely come home , hug the dog days and and then go make sure I , you know I go hang out with , with the kids that weekend and just love on them .

But yeah , the hard ones , the bad days stick with you , more than the good , unfortunately . But you just do the best that you can Try and get there as fast as you can and make a difference which we've been fortunate enough to do that and have that happen .

It was seconds away from going bad , and now they're back with their family is great gotta love those ones for sure , yeah , for sure .

So I think for me , in order to just stay functional and stay with it , I just have to purge a lot . And it's not that it's all bad stuff that I've got to repress memories or anything . I just it can be so emotionally draining that you've just got to let it go and then on to the next , just so you can stay fresh and be of service the next day .

There is a , one of the mountains in Argentina I'm going to butcher it because I don't speak Spanish despite living here in South Florida Aconcagua , or something like that , I don't know , but we're summiting it in January . So we've got some got some fun adventure stuff on the horizon and just just things that I wanted to tackle . I think .

Uh , no , but in the next next couple of years , you know I'd I'd love to , uh , to be in a place where , um , I've got more time to , to step away and take a break , and I'll probably fill those with an adventure too , but I I think I definitely am and trying to , um , enhance the , the quality of the time that I've got with my loved ones , and not be

you know , and and be able to , to turn my mind off and just take a break from it all . So that's that's actually my focus coming up is just yeah , just just a little . Me time is . Uh is what's on my agenda ? Yeah .

I've learned more about myself out in the ocean alone than I ever could in a self-help course or in a book . You really learn on an adventure what you're made of , what your metal is , and you really get comfortable with knowing yourself . There's a lot of quiet time during an adventure . You got to sit with your thoughts .

If you've got any inefficiencies , they usually start to poke out during an adventure . You got to sit with your thoughts If you've got any inefficiencies . They usually start to poke out during an adventure and you know what you've got to work on , to kind of answer the call the next time it comes around .

So for me , adventure is just about chasing the horizon , but also chasing that yourself internally and getting better and growing . It's always been a great opportunity for me to grow every time I've been out on an adventure , on an expedition .

Also , thank you for sharing your adventure side of you , including your time as a guide , and why that means so much to you . I would invite all of you to give Chris a follow on Instagram at Chris Cameron dot CC . This is a great way to follow along on not only his adventures in the water , but also his adventures in the air as a pilot .

Thanks to each one of you for tuning in and listening to the show . I would really appreciate it if you could leave me a rating and review on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to your podcasts . That would mean a lot to me . I would also love to hear from you .

Please reach out and say hi , either through Instagram at journeywithjakepodcast , or send me an email , jake , at journeywithjakenet . Next week I have an endurance athlete , Josh Vernon , on the show . Josh has a great story about overcoming addiction and finding himself on the bottom and having to work his way up .

It is a great conversation that I hope you can all join me next week . Just remember , it's not always about the destination , as it is about the journey . Take care everybody .