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Institutional trust

May 30, 202536 min
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Speaker 1

This is a podcast from wor is the Jesse Kelly Show.

Speaker 2

Another hour of The Jesse Kelly Show on a wonderful, fantastic Thursday. Remember we got Brandon wik At about a half hour from now talking Rutchia, Ukraine, Iran and net Yahoo stuff.

Speaker 1

We have Carol Roth next hour, but we have other things we have to discuss, and there are lots of them. Communist lies is on the list. I have a fear about how bad the Democrats are. Right now, I'll explain what I mean, but first I want to talk again in a different way, about trust, institutional trust, why it really matters in what's happening out there. So I'm gonna use this example because people, it can be confusing. What actually is power? What is short term power? What is

lasting long term power? So let me explain the difference. Let's say I am. I am in charge of the police department. I'm the police chief. Small town, pretty small town. We're in West Virginia. We're in rural West Virginia, and it's a twenty person police department. I take over. I'm the police chief. I am an evil, corrupt human being.

Now I use my position as police chief to fill up my twenty person police department with other evil, corrupt people, and we will deal drugs, we'll commit murders, we'll do whatever with the authority of the police department. In fact, if you because you're a part of my town, if you make me angry, if I decide I want you out of the way, maybe you witnessed me commit a crime, I have the power to gather my men, my guns, and myself and come out to your home and kill you,

arrest you, shoot. You say, that's short term power. I have that, but that's not long lasting, tangible power. And here's what I mean. If I do that once twice, ten times, how many times do me and my officers, how many times do we have to commit a crime or do some kind of horribly corrupt thing until the people of my community decide they no longer trust me,

they have declared me to be the enemy. And at some point in time, I hop in a car with five of my other cops and we drive out to a home to commit a crime, and we get ambushed and murdered by the people of the town. At some point it will happen. These things don't happen without end. Now, why why did I end up dying in losing my power because I lost the trust of the people, and that that is long term, lasting institutional power. And that's

the most important kind of power. I realized. For the individual you when I showed up to murder you, none of the long term stuff matters because you're going to die in the short term. But on a long term scale, on a thirty thousand foot view scale, what matters for the institution. For my police department, the most important thing is that the people trust it and rely on it. If I have that, the police department will have power forever.

If I violate that, if I lose that, the people will take their trust away and my least department in the end will be completely powerless at some point in time, no matter how long that takes. Maybe it's twenty years, thirty years, but it will happen. I saw this woman. She is affectionately known on this show as doctor Witch, but her name is actually doctor Wynn. She used to be in charge of Planned Parenthood. She now is obviously a contributor to CNN. She goes on there to talk

about medical things. She goes on there to lie because it's CNN. She was ranting and raving about RFK Junior in some of the things he's doing. Here's what she said.

Speaker 3

This is the reason why we look to guidelines. There are medical organizations that synthesize these data. And by the way, we look up to the CDC, or at least throughout history, we have looked up to the CDC, to the FDA to compile these studies for us and to make recommendations. And this we have always throughout history depended on our federal agencies as the gold standard for expertise.

Speaker 1

Really, these federal agencies, we have looked up to them as the gold standard for expertise. Okay, she's actually not wrong about that. It we hop at a time machine, you and me, we go back to the year true not even ancient history. Twenty fifteen, And you ask Jesse if he believes the things the CDC says. Jesse says, yep, I would tell you absolutely, Maybe not everything at face value. But if the CDC put out a warning, hey, don't travel to Mexico, don't eat this, don't it. I'm listening,

it's the CDC. So twenty fifteen, Jesse did very much trust organizations like the CDC. Now twenty twenty five. Jesse when the CDC is brought up, scoff and rolls his eyes. In fact, I'm looking at a headline here, I'll tell you immediately the fellows put it in front of me, Chris, Jewish producer Chris and producer Core. They put it in front of me. I read it and I physically rolled my eyes immediately. You want to know the headline new

Chinese COVID strain spreads to the US. Immediately, I went from here we go again, Well, why it's only been ten years. I don't know. Maybe we should go back to this little flashback from that same doctor doctor which during COVID.

Speaker 4

Of course, I strongly believe that indoor masking should be the case, including it in really in all schools in this country at this point. But even in schools that don't have masking, parents can still do their part and take matters into their own hands. For example, talk to other parents in your child's class see if.

Speaker 3

The majority of parents would agree with you.

Speaker 4

To also put masks on their kids. Also, make sure that your child is wearing at least a three ply surgical mask, not a cloth face covering, but as that helps to protect your health and better them. Try to get the school to also disclose all positive cases and increased testing. That's something that there's sale fund.

Speaker 1

Why doesn't anybody trust these gold standard expertise organizations anymore? Because you took down the outdoor basketball hoops, because you told an entire country of three hundred million people to stand six feet away from everybody, because you closed schools, because you cost people their jobs, because people had to say goodbye to their parents by zoom in the hospital. You arrested a paddle boarder in the ocean on camera

outside paddle boarding by himself. And you did all this, all this using medical expertise as your shield, and you did it as if that trust would be endless, and now you're finding out it's not. It's finite. We were talking about Harvard earlier in the show, Harvard this and Harvard that and Harvard this.

Speaker 5

Oh.

Speaker 1

I know Harvard has had a blast pushing communism into American society. But whether or not Trump stomps him into the ground in the end, it won't matter why because you're already leaving.

Speaker 6

I think going into this, I think a lot of Americans thought that hier Ed needed a nice kick in the rear end. What am I talking about here? Well, why don't we take a look at high confidence and higher education. You go back a decade ago, fifty seven percent of Americans had high confidence in higher education.

Speaker 1

Look at where we are now.

Speaker 6

That number has plummeted, plummeted as of last year, down to thirty six percent. We're talking about a thirty six point drop among Republicans. Specifically, get this, sixty eight percent of Americans said that higher education was on.

Speaker 1

The wrong track.

Speaker 6

So it's a question of whether or not people agree with Trump's tactics, but they definitely agree with him on the idea.

Speaker 1

Two thirds of the country just a little while ago, yesterday, two thirds of the country, when they heard names like Harvard, Stanford, they thought to themselves, Wow, that's pretty cool man. You would tell you got into Harvard. WHOA, Now you just heard the numbers. Two thirds of the country. When you tell them Harvard, you bring it up, they go, oh yeah, here we go. And in the end, Harvard is finding out what we've talked about over and over and over, Agune.

Harvard is finding out what the FBI found out, what the medical establishment has found out, what the media has found out. They're all finding out what Jesse tried to warn everybody about years ago. Trust is necessary, and trust is not an infinite supply. You violated enough times, people will move on, and from there you'll discover that the only true power you had, long lasting power, was the

trust they gave you, the legitimacy they gave you. Once they remove it, it's gone and almost impossible to get back. I'm going to expand on that just a little bit more in a second hand a Jesse Kelly show on a Fantastic Thursday. We have Brandon Wiker coming up about ten minutes from now to do all kinds of foreign policy nerd out things. But right now we're having another talk about trust, and I want to be totally upfront

and honest and crystal clear about this. It's really important that we have institutions we can trust and do trust. I don't celebrate where we are, and you shouldn't either. It's a picture a home with bad parents in it, and there's a child in the home. Mom says, hey, I'm gonna make you dinner tonight so you don't go hungry, and then mom just gets drunk and passes out on

the on the couch and doesn't make dinner. And the next night she tells that little boy, she tells that little girl, I'm gonna make you dinner tonight so you don't go hungry, And she gets drunk and passes out on the couch and doesn't make dinner. And this happens over and over and over and over and over again. Well, at some point in time, that child is not going to trust her anymore, not going to believe her anymore. When Mom says anything dinner, what else doesn't matter, the trust will be gone.

Speaker 7

Now.

Speaker 1

That child, out of its own self interest, out of his own self interest, should remove that trust because when mom says she'll make dinner, assume she's lying. You gotta go fend for yourself, get your own dinner. The child should remove the trust for his own survival. But on a bigger level, this is a terrible situation, because a child should have a mother. When she says she'll make dinner, the child knows he'll get dinner. Exact same thing happens

with citizens in their institutions. I want you to know that none of this is normal, and none of this is okay. You should have a medical establishment. You can trust, you don't, and so you shouldn't trust them, but you don't. And that Look, we'll focus on medical because that's what we were talking about, doctor Witch. Here, let me be honest with you about something in my own life, totally honest with you. Why do I talk so much about

natural things now, natural solutions, naturalness. You've heard me rant about big pharma. You've heard me rant about the medical establishment. Why, well, they have violated my trust and now I have to look elsewhere. Now do you want to know why? Do you want to know the real reason why? I mean, I've told you real reasons before, But why is it? What chalk is a great example. Why do I love chalk so much? Well, the way I look at Chok Chok's natural herbal supplements. Obviously, the way I look at

chalk is chalk keeps me away from the doctor. That is my goal. And you know what I hate that. I actually wish I had a medical establishment that I trusted for everything, a doctor I trusted so much. Every month, every two months, I go check in with the doc. Doc, this is what's going on, this and that. But now don't don't have any of that at all. I Well, you know what I take. I take a male vitality

stack from chalk every day. I take that not only because it makes me feel better, because I feel like I'm preventing myself from ever having to go to the doctor. I check in with the doctor's office when I want blood work done, and then not at all because I have taken my trust away and I don't celebrate that. I do celebrate chalk, and I thank them for it, but that's not what I want. I would like to have chalk and a doctor. Now I just have chalk.

Speaker 5

Sucks.

Speaker 1

By the way, do try a stack from chalk. You will be amazed at how you feel. Choq dot com remember promo, Go Jesse, go try it for a few months and see how you feel. But that's not the point of our conversation here. The point is I want you to have that. I want me to have that. The FBI another great example. Look, you've got guys Cash, Betel, Dan Bong. You know people, you know people we've talked about,

people we've celebrated. They're out there talking on the news and talking about this, and they want to do this and they want to accomplish that. And we're gonna well for instance, Dan Bongino went on Fox News this morning said this.

Speaker 8

There was a room and we found stuff, a lot of stuff hidden room. I wouldn't call it hidden, but hidden from us at least and not mentioned to us. And a lot of it's from the Komi era. And we are working our damn this right now to declassifying. Just so you know, because I get the public, I totally understand people saying we'll do it now. The process is not. All the information is ours to classify some as other intelligence agencies, it's not. We literally can't do it.

Once that gets done and that gets out there and you read some of the stuff we found that, by the way, was not processed through the normal procedure digitizing it, putting in FBI records. We found it in bags hiding under Jim call. Yeah, you're going to be stuff.

Speaker 1

How can you trust an organization that does things like that? The Federal Bureau of Investigation troves of information that they socked the way in a room to hide it from the new director and deputy director. How do you you can't trust an organization like that. It doesn't matter who's in charge of it, who the new director is, who the new deputy director is to me, Frank, I think they both have an impossible task. I've told Dan in case you're wondering, I've told Dan that myself. But I

don't think I'm just saying it to you. I've told him I don't think he can do what he wants to do, reform the FBI, fixed the FBI. I don't believe it can be done, and not only just because of the poison inside of the building. By the way, why haven't the whistleblower has been brought back. That's a whole other story entirely, not just because of the poison inside of the building. I don't think you could do it because the public has already left. Remember was the

last time we brought up a public poll. I don't remember the last time it was about the public's view of the FBI. You lost him. Now it wasn't obviously Cash and Dan. It lost them, but the FBI as an organization gone completely gone. Elections are another great example. It's really really important for you and me to live in a country where you can trust elections, that they're honest, that they're on the up and up, that every vote

will be counted. Twenty twenty that went away, And it doesn't matter how many Democrats you send to the news to say it was the freest and fairest election ever. All that does now is cement in people's minds that you did something dirty. That's all that does now. Now that you've lost that trust, where are we puts us in a terrible place as a country, just like the kid whose mom didn't make dinner. All right, we're moving

off for that. I won't talk about it anymore. I'm going to talk to Brandon Wikert.

Speaker 5

I want to know.

Speaker 1

Why Donald Trump is upset with Vladimir Putin now vocally he nor really doesn't do that blast away vocally. I want to know why Trump is upset with Benjamin Nett and Yahoo vocally said something today about it. We played it for you earlier. What's going on to Brandon next? It is the Jesse Kelly Show, and I want to know what's going on with this whole Putin Ukraine Roughshia

stuff and why Trump is scolding Benjamin Nett and Yahoo. Basically, I want to know why we're hearing things like this every day.

Speaker 7

I can't tell you that, but I'll let you know in about two weeks, within two weeks, we're going to find out very soon, we're going to find out whether or not he's tapping us along or not, and if he is, we'll respond a little bit differently, but it'll take about a week and a half. Two weeks.

Speaker 1

He's talking about Putin and Ukraine and whatnot. So let's ask Brandon about that. Joining me now, Brandon Weikert, author of so many books national security expert, including his book Shadow War about Iran, which I really love. Brandon, Okay, let's start in Russia Ukraine. Obviously we all know Trump wants to end the whole thing. He's now vocally scolded Putin a couple of times. What's happening over there?

Speaker 5

Well, I think everybody needs to remember, as fun as it would be to say Putin is a mustache twirling villain, he is responding Putin is to an assassination attempt. Somebody tried to whack him. The Ukrainians are saying that, note it wasn't us, But I suspect what happened was somebody in our intel services thought they had a beat on

Putin's helicopter. We know that our intel people have been helping since at least twenty twenty three serving as targeting analysts for the Ukrainians when they were firing these long range missiles into Russia. We were helping them target so that they'd be more precise. We also know that the intel community has for the last two years claimed they know where Putin is at all times and they can take him out whenever they want, if it ever came

to that. Well, I think that this was not actually Ukraine they pulled the trigger, But I think this was as an assassination attempt against Putin by a rogue element within our intelligence community. And I say that because Trump he came out on Monday, I think it was Monday or Tuesday, and he was scolding Putin as you as you noted. But then yesterday he came out and gave a brief statement in which he said, I was just told about an assassination attempt, and maybe that's why Putin

is behaving the way he has been. Well, in my opinion, why wasn't Trump, or my question is, why wasn't Trump briefed immediately about this potential assassination attempt? And I think that's to tell that there was a rogue element going you know, trying to manipulate things by getting rid of Putin in the middle of this a very important negotiation. They don't want negotiations, Jesse, they want war.

Speaker 1

Okay, So a couple big fat questions I have from that one. You said we were helping the Ukrainians with their long term targeting, including targets inside of Russian territory. Are we still doing that, that's the first question.

Speaker 5

Yeah, I would assume so, given the relationship that's been built up between our intelligence services and the Ukrainians, I know that the Ukrainians are not able to effectively. They have the weapons we gave them, the long range weapons, but they're not very good at these long range targeting, and the NATO intelligence services, including our intelligence services, have been acting as targeting analysts for them. So I would assume that's still going on. But I believe it's still

going on. Yes, I know it was going on during the Biden regime though.

Speaker 1

Okay, Now that actually leads me to this question, how do you long range target these things in whatever way you're allowed to tell us? Why are they bad at it and we're good at it? What is this space satellites? People don't know how this stuff works. How's it working?

Speaker 5

It's mostly Our space surveillance capability is really I wrote a whole book on this, it's called Winning Space. Our space surveillance capability is light years if you're part in the pond, the dad joke is light years beyond what a country like Ukraine has. It's actually probably light years beyond what any other country except maybe China's catching up to us. Even Russia, which has an impressive space capability as well, it doesn't come close to our surveillance capacity.

And so I believe that that's why we were being used for targeting assistance.

Speaker 1

Why is our surveillance capacity so much better than every other country? Does this just come down to money in volume? We have enough money to put more satellites up there than anyone else does. Is that what it is?

Speaker 5

That's part of it. In the middle there was a gap after the Cold War. The Russians were kind of cut off at their knees for a period of time, and we were kind of the only show in town when it came to space, and so that gave us a lot of ability to kind of get a lead on the rest of the world. Of course, as an aside,

those surveillance systems. While they're essential for US, they're also very easy to take out with anti satellite weapons, which is what China and Russia have been developing for the last fifteen years, very effective capabilities to render US deaf, dumb, and blind in space. But until that happens, we still have the lead with these surveillance and communication capabilities.

Speaker 1

Okay, so when it comes to Russia Ukraine, why don't we just leave? Can we just leave? If that's what Donald Trump wants to do. I realize he's trying to brokerr a deal and be a peacemaker, and I actually applaud all that that's great. But if at some point in time he gets frustrated, Putin doesn't want to end it, Zelenski doesn't want to end it. Donald Trump is the president. Can he not say, hey, Cia, military, everybody pack up your things. We're going home.

Speaker 5

Well, so this is basically my inaugural piece at the American Conservative was published two days ago, and it was exactly about this. Donald Trump's going to walk away from Ukraine. And there's no doubt in my mind that whatever, whatever you know, he's angry at Putin, he's not angry at Putin. You know, it's different every day, and it's part of the kind of the Trump show. You know, he's got to put on the show, like, yeah, he's holding Putin

to the fire. But ultimately, Trump bottom line, wants to get a better working relationship with Russia. He rightly recognizes that Russia is a much more integral player deal politically than Ukraine will ever be, and so he is going to go do the negotiation show for a little bit. He knows he's gotten a losing hand. He's going to eventually drop Ukraine like a hot potato. Tell the Europeans

tag you're it, don't include us anymore. That he's going to pivot and try to do direct deals with the Russians on a coterie of other more important issues, ranging from rare earth mineral development in Russia to Putin. A few weeks ago, positive that Elon Muskin him are talking about doing a joint American Russian manned program to Mars in the next year or two. That's something they're wanting to try, maybe doing together Russia in SpaceX. So you know,

we're moving beyond Ukraine. I think you're right. I think that Trump will ultimately just drop Ukraine and tag you're at Europe.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I'm right a lot. Chris is used to that around here. What Chris, what? It's just Brandon and I talking. Don't get involved, Okay, So not to get too sidetracked. I swell, I'm going to get to Iran and net and Yaku in a moment. But where does China come into play there? Because I know Russia and China have been getting I know, their competitors in a lot of ways, but they've been getting closer in recent years, almost out of necessity for both those countries as other parts of

the world are cutting them off. If we start getting more friendly with Russia, where does that leave China.

Speaker 5

Well, that would technically, you would think you would leave them in the odd man out position. And I think that's what Trump and his people around him, the ones that know what's going on, I think that that's the hope, that's the ambition, is to overtime divorce Russia and China from each other by favoring Russia over China. This is what Nixon did in reverse during the Cold War, and it ended up actually setting the table that allowed for

Reagan to ultimately defeat the Communists. The Soviet Union without fire or shop. Whether that's possible, it's a little bit different now, I don't know, but I do think at the very least, we can nudge Russia away from its total commitment to China. Ultimately, Russia is aware, they're keenly

aware that China views them as a junior partner. And I can assure you that Vladimir Putin does not view himself as a junior partner to anybody, and at some point he's not going to want to be treated that way, either certainly publicly or even behind closed doors. Eventually, the limits to that supposedly limitless friendship he has with g will be tested, especially as Trump offers a lot of you know, tasty carrots, you know, come work with us instead.

We're still a much better market than his China, and I think that Putin is looking for a better deal. We just got to be willing to offer.

Speaker 1

Him at Yeah, limitless friends are hard to come by. Okay, Brandon, can you stay and just answer a couple more questions about Trump and net and Yahoo? Just sure, real quick? Okay, we will be right back with more Brandon Weikert. Before we come back with more Brandon wikert. I want to remind you that tonight might be the night you lose all your family pictures, all those home videos. Think about that drawer you have with all the home videos, the

family vacation, the wedding. Tonight might be the night that goes bye bye, one flood, one fire, little wire that's wrong, it's going hey wire in your attic right now, and that wedding album is gone. Doesn't have to be that way. It doesn't have to be that way. You can digitize all those things with Legacy Box. They'll send them all back to you. They'll send you a box. You put them in a box, You send it to Legacy Box, an American company, You send it to Tennessee. It's not

some big machine. They will hand digitize your stuff, send it all back and then fireflood time, nothing will destroy those memories. Sound like a plan. You want a nice deal on it, Go to legacybox dot com slash Jesse for an exclusive offer. Legacy box dot com slash Jesse, We'll be back. Is the Jesse Kelly Show a fantastic Thursday, reminding you that tomorrow's ask doctor Jesse Friday. You need to get your question estions emailed in now to Jesse

at Jesse kellyshow dot com. We are back with Brandon Wikert, national security expert. You need to go buy his books and you'll learn a lot more than you will in school. Okay, Brandon. Donald Trump is famously close with Israel. As you and I've talked about this before. We've talked about it on the air before. This is as vocal as I've ever heard him separate from them when it comes to Iran. He's talking about net and Yaku. He told him to

back off. He told what's going on here? What does Trump want out of this deal?

Speaker 5

Well, what Trump is trying to do is he's trying to get to see this is not even He's just trying to see if it's possible to get a real reliable deal with Iran that secures not only the peace, but our security by extension, by the way, the security of our allies in the region, not just Israel, but it includes Israel as but also the Arab States as well, who are also threatened by a nuclearizing Iran. But he

can't do that. If Iran is blowing up the place or threatening to blow up the place, I'm sorry Israel. If Israel is threatening to blow up the place, which Israel threatening to do. And so you know, Trump has asked politely net Yahu, you know, just keep your powder dry. Let's just see where the negotiations going after that will reassess. But net Nyahu cannot do that. And I think this is partly because Netanyahu is politically his survival is on

the line. Let's face it, he missed key indicators and warnings as Prime minister of the impending Hamas attack on ten to seven. He knows that at some point the Israeli Parliament, thaness and Israeli security is going to do an after action, a thorough after action report, and eventually he will be blamed on some level, because the buck ultimately stops with him. He will be blamed for those failures on that day, and he likely will lose his

next his political future. Furthermore, he was under all these criminal investigations before ten seven, and all that sort of evaporated into the ether when he became a wartime prime minister.

And this is why I think on some levels, cynically he's opened up multiple fronts against these different countries, saying it's part of the ten to seven response, but really I think it was because he was just trying to double down to prevent the ultimate reckoning that he was going to have to face four mistakes he made as Prime minister. So some of this is self interest on his part, but ultimately he is not interested in seeing the Trump administration even try to negotiate. We don't know

if this is going to work out. I'm skeptical because of how the Iranian regime is, but at the same time, Trump is probably the greatest dealmaker in history. So why don't we let the man work and see what happens, you know, before we just write it off. There's absolutely no reason to rush into what will be another regional war that could trigger a third World War in the Middle East.

Speaker 1

Brandon, you mentioned October seventh, and I have many friends in Israel and outside of it who, when you know, when we have discussions about it, they have a lot of questions about that day, not necessarily accusations, but there are people who want to understand how it's possible, maybe the most capable intelligence network on the planet, given its size, Israel's, how you could miss a thousand person raid with paragliders

into your country. So without being King Sinek Jesse. How's that possible.

Speaker 5

Well, you know, the sort of non conspiratorial answer is they got complacent, and we know that the Israelis when it came to Hamas not necessarily has blow, which Israel's always taken more seriously and they should because it's a

more comprehensive threat. But when it came to Hamas, particularly under Netanyahu, there was the policy they nicknamed it mowing the grass, which is basically, every so often the Israelis would come in and sort of knock out a handful of targets in the Gaza strip and sort of keep

the As threat under wraps. What people didn't realize is under the table the Israeli government, Netanyahu's government, was quietly paying off Hamas to basically not attack, to keep things quiet as best as possible, so that Netanyahu could have a kind of clear playing field at home in Israel. But what nobody seemed to realize is that they thought they were buying loyalty from these Maas leaders, or at

least buying their cooperation. In fact, those Hamas leaders who are committed to the destruction of Israel were taking that money and using it to rebuild their war machine that we saw come on display on ten to seven. On some level, the Israeli military, the Israeli intelligence services were both complacent about the threat from Hamas, and they were very arrogant. They didn't actually think Hamas was the real threat. They thought Hesbla, they thought Youron. They didn't think Hamas

was significant of a threat. They were proven wrong. And I think you saw that. There's obviously more conspiratorial things stand down orders for instance, And why wasn't net Yahoo more on this given the size of the attack, et cetera, et cetera. I will leave that to you know, a different day to talk about, but I certainly have theories on that. But basically, I do think a key component of this was complacency plus arrogance about the Hamas threat

on the part of the Israeli security services. There's also a chance, given what we know about what was going on with Netanya, who's legal issues. You know, the same kind of lawfare used against Donald Trump last year was used against Netan Yahoo by the Israeli version of the FBI,

the shin Bet. There is a chance that they didn't brief Netan Yahoo fully on the threat and he didn't take action because he wasn't brief fully, and it might have been part of a kind of a deep state conspiracy to make met Yahoo complacent so that they could then tend this on him down the line and get him out, because we know the Israeli deep state does not like nets in Yahoo.

Speaker 1

Wow. I glad to see we're not the only ones with these problems.

Speaker 5

He is.

Speaker 1

Brandon Wiker, Thank you, my friend, as always for giving us a bit of your time and wisdom again today, come back soon. Appreciate you very much. Foreign policy is a complicated affair, isn't it. Well, that's why we always talk about that. It's so complicated, different motivations, different divisions inside of the country. You're trying to strike a deal, but there's divisions inside of that country, but you're not also working with a different country. It's just foreign policy

is complicated. As I've always said, with the exception of chicken hawks, I have open ears for all of it. I'll listen to any of it.

Speaker 4

This has been a podcast from wor

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