Oncet we cant worth actually than seven. But in the twenty tens we would have this argument. And this alone actually has converted a lot of people, and it's part of Ephesus. Yeah. Well, we want to see the entire letter of Cyril to Nestorius, and we want to see the line of argumentation that he has. All right, I can't read that script. It's funny. See if we can find a good copy. Okay, here we go. Maybe this
will work. So the anathemas are attached at the end, and let me see if this has the full quote that I'm looking for here, because people don't realize that one of Cyril's biggest arguments is the Eucharist against Nestorias.
H h m hm, h.
M hm.
He's going to argue that deification in the Eucharist refutes in the stories. I hate these screens. H. I don't think this is the full letter. This seems truncated. Let's see, is it. Well, maybe it's the wrong numbered letter. Let's see. Yah. H It's always a challenge, dude, to try to to find the freaking shaft version and list with what people have on their websites. This is this is a nightmare. It always happens. I think this is the first epistle.
Let's see, by the way Cyril argues at the beginning that the faith comes before human interpersonal relations. So I hope we can find this. Let's see it is when he says, when our Savior says, let's see if this is it? Oh, I think this is it? Okay, so this should be. I keep having to switch glasses because I hate this freaking glare of the screen in my face. All right, following the declaration of the Holy Fathers, this
is yeah, this is it okay. So notice here he says the Holy Synod in Rome and Great Rome with Pope Celestine, and he argues that the faith is more important than interpersonal relations. The right faith rejected and the flocks torn into pieces by thee, we ought to preserve them. If thou wert a lover of right doctrine, tracking the piety of the Holy Fathers, and all who have been by thy piety severed for the faith's sake, both late and cleric. So he's saying that together with Pope Celestine,
they reject and anathematized Astorias. And he's going to talk about the line of argumentation to prove that. And he's going to say that we feed on the flesh of the god Man. And how could we feed on the flesh of the god Man if Nestorius is dual subject ristology was true and he was just some dude. He says, this is the faith of the Catholic Apostolic Church, and it anathematizes anyone who would say otherwise. I think it's right here. He assumed flesh and blood from the womb
of the Virgin Mary, God by nature. And in truth, neither do we say the flesh was turned into the nature of the Godhead, nor that the inefftable nature of God the Word was born. Aside from the nature of flesh. It is unchangeable in invarying. So the divine essences in past. And he says, and thus as a babe in swaddling clothes, yet in the lap of the Virgin, the virgin bear him, he was filling creation as God while he was in
the lap of the virgin, he says. And then he goes on to say, here it's hard to tell where this argument actually starts. We will necessarily add this also, this is it right here? Here's the main point. He says, declaring the death in the flesh of the only gotten Son of God, that is Christ confession, that confession that he lives again from the dead. We celebrate the unbloody service of some translations say sacrifice. This is the Eucharist.
And thus we approach the mystical blessings. They're sanctified, and we are render partakers of His holy flesh and blood. Not as though receiving the flesh God forbid of some man connected with the Word by a unity of dignity that's in the Storian position, or as a divine in dwelling, but as truly quickening deification the flesh of the Word himself. For by being by nature God, since he became one with his own flesh, he rendered the flesh to be
life giving. That's the uncreated energies, that's the real presence. And by the way, elsewhere he argues in it for the energies explicitly barely, I say unto you, except you eat the flesh of the Son of Man, to drink his blood, you will not have life. Thus, truly he has become our flesh, and is called son of Man. In other words, he's saying, if Jesus was not the The flesh of Christ is another deified flesh of the
Son of God. Then you're eating the flesh of some man, which would be cannibalism and which could not save you. So deification proves, according to Saint Cyril, that Christ is a divine hypostasis of the sole subject of all the incarnate actions. And then he makes these same arguments in the Anathemas from the Eucharist, where he says that consuming some man wouldn't save us, but consuming the flesh of
the God Man would save us. And thus he says, the Eucharist refutes Nestorius Anathema twelve says, if anyone does not confess that God the word suffered in the flesh has been crucified into the flesh, taste of death, of flesh has been made first born of the dead. Inasmuch as he is life and life giving, let him be anathema. That's in the context of the Eucharist what he calls the sacrifice. So his flesh is life giving flesh. So here you can read the letters for yourself, and there's
more in there, it's just hard to find it. From the Chaft version to the online version. But there's the letter with the anathemas, and you'll see that, Oh that's not Protestant at all. Cyril's actually making liturgical arguments against mystorias. You ever heard of Protestant making a liturgical argument against anybody? How does that not write there show you that Protestants do not have the faith. I'm not saying they're not sincere it's not a question of it. You can be
sincerely wrong. The question is do they have the faith. The faith is not I believe in jus, that's not the faith. You have that belief in your head. But the faith is the faith. Once we're all delivered to the Saints, the faith confessed that. And I see a conspicus calcedon trollo and I see two and so G what's up dude? Yo?
J you know that Israel fell into error? Right, I'm just I'm totally joke.
No genuine question here for for for someone who has landed at the position that prostism is not the faith kind of like you just said, our soul scripture that just has no grounds but is not uh clear on like east or west, for for example, would to say getting clear on the filial quick and the papacy should be like primary as next steps.
Or like what would you say to that? Yeah, I think the easiest route, if you wanted a quick route, would be to go to my website and read the Ecumenical Canons refute the papacy. That's a collection that I think a guy's a deacon now might become an a priest. That Seraphim and our discord created that back in twenty eighteen, and he basically just listed all the canons from the Seven Councils as an example that disproves the Vatican One
arguments for the Roman Catholic version of the papacy. So that's the quickest route that I could say to see that in all of these centuries and all these councils, they don't have the attitude of Vatican One, and so therefore the Vatican one arguments for the papacy are obviously out of accord with the Seven Ecumenical Council's idea of the papacy. Beyond that, I would say, I've got several videos on kill shot contradictions that prove that the papacy
changes its dogma. There is the temple supremacy, a temporal supremacy argument that's changed. There's the death penalty argument that's changed. There's a religious liberty that's changed, Acumenism doctrine has changed. These are all easy kill shots to that the papacy has contradicted itself openly, dogmatically, many many times. So go check those out. And also, if you want a book, you can start with something like, UH, two Paths by
Michael Welton. That's a good readable introduction to the topic.
UH.
And then if you want more advanced, get Sashinsky's book Orthodoxy in the Papacy. Ethan, I can't believe we still haven't gotten one single Protestant Evangelical to call in. Ethan. What's up, dude, you owe me a Gucci suit? Ethan.
Yeah, I appreciate it, and the mean situation. I was just gonna call in and ask for a second.
So I'm an inquirer.
I'm gonna go into an Orthodox parish and now about four months. I have no trouble with icons. I think icons are fine.
I think the cool thing that.
Icons have that and the orthodox that they have is there's some ones that it sounds like we're miracles.
Like I think there's a parish in northeast Pennsylvania as a very icon.
I can't remember the name of.
The parish, but.
That is something that evangelicals to have. And then the other thing I was gonna say was the last thing was when I look at.
The Creed, it's this one holy Catholic episodic church and baptismal forgiveness.
Like forgiveness of sins.
And so.
When I talk good prostant friends, I don't think they agree with that.
No, of course I don't. The only the only Protestants of believe in Bagelan regeneration are some of the Lutherans, which again I don't know how that makes any sense, but you can see here clearly when the Creed says one holy caloic apsol like church, they mean Bagilism and regeneration. And everybody knows that. And it doesn't matter how many times redeemed zoom Erny these people try to re formulate it, restate it. Everybody knows. The cappet oceans are teaching about
bismal regeneration are que requiem. What's up, dude? Okay, well, hey, j.
My issue with Orthodoxy is the priests. They have the beads.
I think they need to have the Doug Wilson go te I think that would.
Be like more manly.
Oh my gosh, Oh my gosh. So dudes literally out here trying to argue for the gen X church. If you don't have a gen X goatee, then you aren't authentically apostolic, right, because we all know. And by the way, you notice in my fat dude who I gave I said, this is Saint Dunning Krueger, the patron saint of evangelical apologists.
Notice he's got the Bloomer goatee. I mean, the gen X goate The only thing I would change on this I should have giving him a like a professional sports jersey cap or I should have made the Godly Ambition T shirt, the Rouslan T shirt. It should have been a jersey. That's the thing I should have added, right, it should be a jersey, and he should have a I don't know it's a star at David in the background or something drizzy. What's up? Hey, what's going on?
Jay?
What's on your mind?
I'm sorry, I say again.
I said, what's on your mind? Man?
Oh?
What's going on?
I really like your content bank acquirer for maybe two months now, I was just wondering, is there a book set for the for like e communical councils that you would recommend.
I would say read instead of trying to read through the ecumenical councils. I mean, you could get this volume. This volume is well, you can find the Philip Schaff. You can sometimes buy just the volume sale on the ecumenical councils. But I would rather, I would say read volume one and two of Pelicon set over that. That's that would be more relevant to getting a full picture of the first thousand years of Christianity. And those are really good one and two. I mean they're using seminaries,
so they're good. I don't know about one single book just on ecumenical councils, but there could be one that. I mean, I just heard about this Saint Nactorio's book on the Schism. I don't even know that existed until Pano told me to get it the other day. So there are probably there could be one that I'm just not even aware of. Mitch, what's up again, Evangelicals? You need to ask for the intercession of Saint Dunning Krueger. What's up, hey, Jay?
So formal former evangelical pasture here. So do you finally have an evangelical calling.
Former former to what? Former to what? Non former and former and now what now an inquiry? Okay?
Yeah?
Yeah, So.
So we had our former or I guess now former pastor of this non teenon church.
Are you there? By the way, I'm shake even dire now. Lewis exposed me a long time ago that I made my hojj to Mecca and I am now called Uh it been dire, shake it been ire. We lost you dude, come back in, Anthony, what's up? David Wood has exposed me as a Muslim sympathizer because I said his critique one guy's critique was correct. So that obviously that means I work with Islam. Now that's how stupid this is.
But it's also it's telling too how what low view, what lack of respect David Wood has for his own own audience. Right that his response is to say that if I dared to say Jay dawat right, I'm not Jay Dire, I'm Jay Dawa bro du ja one one one go to one. What's up? Anthony? Okay? I thought you were going to talk dog. Are you there? Can't hear me? Yeah, what's up.
So I was curious. It's off topics, so you just give me if you want to. When you were talking about Tajo as a great discussion, I know you didn't elaborate at the time because it wouldn't really be appropriate. But when you said, because I'm debating with one of my Roman Catholic friends, when you were saying it's better to not attend the Roman Catholic Church than attended, can you elaborate on that? Do you remember that part?
I think it was at the end of the conversation and he had a more liberal attitude about that question. I think that, as you saw from the canons earlier, Orthodox are not allowed to participate in the liturgical worship
of heretics and schismatics. So we saw that if you go back to the first hour, we went through the Canons of Leo Deicilla, we went through the Canons of Gangra, we went through the Canons of Nicea one, we went through the Canons of Constantinople one, and you can immediately in the canon Apostolic canons, you can see right away there's strict limitations on what it means to be heretic and schismatic and it's determined canonically, and this is what
Protestants don't understand. And in fact, we made the argument that we can disprove Protestantism just by the canons, because the canons show us that the Church is viewing itself as able to lay down Church law, which is what delineates the boundaries of heretic and schismatic. So unfortunately, Rome departed from the faith a long time ago, and they have all kinds of crazy innovations now post Vatican Two.
I mean, it would be one thing if we were talking about, you know, the Tridentine Latin Mass, because even though I don't agree with any of that, at that time it was what purgatory created, grace works of super irrigation Philly oakuayh right. I mean at the time of Trent, it would be like maybe ten things that were like major issues. Well, post Vatican two, we're in a totally different world, dude. We're in like Novasorto gay uh clown mass where the priests baptized people into the land to
see in the air. I'm not joking. There's actually Novasorto priests that do that, and they use cookies for the Eucharist I'm not kidding clown masses, cookie yu. I mean, so we're we're way That's why we can't say anymore. You know, this is not a Pope Pious, the Fifth Tridenteene Church anymore. That's gone, that's long gone. I mean that is kind of there amongst the SSP actually the set of a concert. But even that was way off
off kilter. Well, how are we gonna say, oh, well, yeah, you can just go to the you know, gay guitar mass with the clown the clown mass and the dorrito Eucharist. I mean, it's so far and by the way, you're just picking extremes. Well, it's actually not that extreme, because this is pretty widespread in Rome, especially in certain areas, right like Dutch areas, German areas, Cardinal Marxist areas, a lot of the American Catholic Church, a lot of those areas,
they're the worst. Women alter servers, letting women give sermons, basically, let women run everything. That's the norm in a lot of Roman Catholic American Western parishes. And what do we just see in the canons. Women are not allowed on the altar, women are not to be Presbyteria or preachers in the church. Did you remember those canons? We just read Gangra Leodicea an hour ago so now, and I'm not trying to be mean to that guy, but he
might not have seen the first hour. In the first hour, all we did was look at canons and how the canons disproved Protestantism because it shows us the mindset of the church in synod and that Trump's individuals. This is what they cannot fathom. Just like the Papists. They say, I'll just cite Jerome, I'll just site Augustine, I'll just cite this dude. Well, wouldn't canon law trump one dude, since it's the mindset of all of the church generally speaking.
Well, look, Kita Loved not infallible.
It's not a question of infallible or not. Your bishop's not infallible. That doesn't mean he's not an authority. Remember we had a guy calling last night. He said the same thing, Why would I submit to the bishop but the bishop is infallible. Well, infallibility is not a criteria of authority. And that's when we met the same argument about the Old Testament, the priests and the Levites and the Synagogue teachers. They were not infallible, but they still
had authority. Even in the Old Testament, they were the normative authorities. So infallibility is not the essential criteria for authority. And this is why the Protestants always lose their mind about this. They cannot conceive of an authority that isn't quote infallible, even though they they'll turn around a lot of the classical reformer people will say, well, we believe
our Presbyterian Synod has authority. Yeah, okay, so you admit the point then that having authority is not essentially bound up with infallibility. And it turns out this is breaking news as well. Let's see what Lord Boldemort is saying. The roommant is that Daily Wires about to close. Whoa another small victory. See what he says.
A year ago they laid off thirty percent of employees. Last week they laid off the other thifty percent. Somebody, they have twenty five percent of employees they had a year ago. And it's all because Ben Shapiro is a known front for the Israeli government. Massive funding. That's all they push, and people are sick and tired of it. But here's the bigger story. But nobody's covering the collapse the Daily Wire and all other neocon ratings like Mark Levin on Fox almost no viewers.
Lowest ratings on Fox.
Is emblematic of the collapse in major polling for President Trump.
Now, I'm mainly interested in the Daily Wire point of this. Why because Daily Wire is an outlet for evangelical Zionism. Because the funders, those Texas billionaire funders are aryan Messianic cult leaders. They're in the area. I forget the name of those billionaire whatever brothers. That's the money behind Daily Wire, and I'm happy to see that that heresy outlet is
going under good. Their shit sucked anyway. I mean, if you ever watched Bench one day for fun, I watched like forty minutes of Ben Shapiro just to see what he even does. Dude, the show is so boring. All he does is play a clip and then tell you what he just saw on the clip. It's not even as like Arnold Schwarzenegger is entertaining on the DVD commentaries because he will tell you what happened in the clip. But he's funny as hell because he's retarded and he's
drunk when he's doing the DVD commentaries. You don't even get that with Ben Shapiro. It's just yeah, we just watched a clip and the transgenders and why are the transgender transgender's going against fax lodging.
So we just watched a clip where two transgenders are saying that thumb.
It's like, yeah, I saw the clip, dude, I don't need a Wikipedia summary an AI summary of the clip.
We just watched it.
So, I mean, Arnold Schwarzenegger is more entertaining than Ben Shapiro.
Luc Yeah that I was talking to the guy and this is the bad guy, and we decided to stop the guy to do lack pew of Paco with the good guys.
But then we tried to fight the bad guy. Yeah, we know that you're the good guy, Arnold. Everybody has seen your movies. Thank you for giving us a play by place, like, remember we were watching this clib they're not We're all die laughing at because people didn't believe me. They were like, no, there's no hilarious retarded Schwarzenegger commentaries. Yes, there are. There's a bunch. They're actually really funny. You should watch them. That's the same thing that Ben Shapiro does.
He just watches a clip and tells you what was in the clip. It's like, dude, what this is? What they poured like hundreds of millions of dollars into White mountains? What's up?
Hello, jay?
Yo?
Yeah?
Question?
Uh So it's more of a I guess I want your opinion on something. So I called in a while ago about the parish that we're attending.
We just go watch so.
They actually turns out teach ecumenicalism. So I've been looking at the other church in our area, but I was like looking at their Facebook, and they do events a Masonic lodge, So I'm kind of just like what the hell like.
Like what do you think?
Like?
But sometimes sometimes Masonic lodges are like the only venue that you can rent in a small place or somewhere, so that might not mean that they're necessarily Masonic. On the down low, I would just go like go talk to them and be like, are y'all pro masonry? Are you pro skittles? Are you?
Like?
Just be upfront.
Okay, I got another question too, if it's okay.
Sure.
So I grew up, like I guess, non denominational, and so you know, obviously all the stupidity.
About like the rapture and whatever.
So I guess my question.
I was doing like some research, but I don't know.
I'm super new, so sometimes it's kind of hard for me to understand.
So when in the Orthodox Church, when we say.
That Christ is coming back, what does that like look like?
You know what I mean?
Because obviously in the Church we don't believe in like prea tribulation or whatever. So like I guess in a nutshell, or if you could point me to you know, there's a great I can.
Well, there's a great little uh booklet from Jordanville Monastery. It's called Apostasy and Antichrist. But I don't know if it's in print because it kind of goes in and out of print. I cannot see in these glasses. And since it's out of print, somebody there's a couple channels that have done audio versions of the whole little book. It's I got sixty page booklet. By the way, it has partial preterism in it, so you could go to
I don't know what this is. I'm not advocating for this website because I don't know who it is or what they're doing.
But God living in Holy Trinity being.
So this little booklet is right here online and you can listen to the audio right there, and it gives basically just a bunch of quotations from church fathers and saints and elders and what un orthodox church and bishops giving the overall outline. So it begins with preterism and saying that seventy a d is the immediate context of Matthew twenty four, twenty one, et cetera. And that's a
microcosm of the last days. So some of the signs of the end of the world from the Orthodox perspective would be mass apostasy in the church, attempting to ban the Divine liturgy obviously antichrist figure conversion of the Jews is another one that's listed very clearly. All of those are some of the key elements, as well as the attempt to rebuild a third temple. When you see those things, that's pretty much the universal indicators amongst the fathers that Okay,
this is looking like it really is the end. I'm not dissing the prophecy Bros. I mean, I just don't study all the elder Saint prophecies. I'm not against them. It's just not it's not my domain. I try to stick with more of the patristic and biblical approach. But that doesn't mean I'm dissing Conrad or Cotel or any of those people. It's just not a domain of so much time. And so that's that's a great thing about what we do in Orthodoxy. Like there's different gifts. Not
everybody has to be an aggressive debater. Not everybody has to be pago icon carver, symbology person. Right, there's places for everybody with their unique skills and gifts.
Not everybody has to be a debater, Mando, ask philosophy bro.
Not everybody has to be professor deacon logic. I'm trying to think of other uh. I mean, how does Paul describe the gifts?
Right?
They're they're all apportioned for different functions, right, And the eye can't say I don't need you hand. Right, the hand can't say I don't need you eyes because they all work together. So, you know, we need people debating politics. You know, Andrew's really good at that. We need people debating feminism. Rachel's great at that. We need people debating logic. Father, I wish father Deacon would do more debates. You're you're, you would be the best cool calm debater if we
could get you to do more debates. Well, if I get paid, somebody pay me. Okay, that's actually all right. Well I saw there was a comedian, Eric Spears was bitching that he hates doing podcasts because they won't pay him. And then it was like he was asking for like five thousand dollars for every appearance. It's like, dude, you're not that popular anymore. It's like five thousand dollars or I'm so crazy about this. So, yeah, you have a
you should have every syllogism. I get five. Yeah, I have a minimum of, Like I get paid persillogism in a debate, so I expect, you know, at least one bitcoin persilogism in a debate.
You know, I'm kind of joking, but I'm serious, Like I'm just grading right now while I'm doing this.
Two and forty.
Essays have eight classes. I serve two parishes. Oh, I have a wife.
I actually have a life, but do you know what I mean? Like that stuff other than my wife I get paid for. So it's like I have to take time for like everybody just wants you to do free stuff. It's like, I like debates, but it's got to be worth your wife.
I've never even thought about targeting.
Debates of somebody because it's not worth your while. And I don't necessarily mean even moluntarily, but no.
This is something that a lot of like Internet gebers and randos don't understand that not every person is worth a debate, And then everybody on the Internet thinks, no, you have to debate and respond to every single person. Well, dude, I'm the only one out here in this sphere of apologetics who literally does the open calls where anyone can debate. So I'm like, nobody else will do that as far as I'm aware. Now, please kind of does it. Alex
will do it. But I'm saying, like none of these other people, Trent Horne won't do open forums to talk to all y'all, Gavin Orland, as far as I'm ware, he done do open forums where he lets anybody call in and challenge what We're not scared like, we don't go. I'm not worried about anybody calling in and bringing their challenges. Oh but you block everybody, You block everybody. No, I block the pe people that talk smack and won't debate.
That's very different from just blocking everybody. I block the people that talk smack, and then when I say come on the stream, here's the link, call in next time, they always like for no reason. Yeahs blocked for no reason. Cop just pulled me over for no reason. I didn't do nothing. I didn't do nothing, man, Yeah, I just yeah, oh, no, one got blocked. I just went into the discord and made death threats. I don't know what it blogged me. That's a joke with the guy that was saying that
about me. Aquan note, can I join the call? Uh? That was yesterday? Yes, Cyril says for five dollars, Ortho Bros. Converted me out of the fake Orthodox Presbyterian Church. Hey man, there we go, Corbin, twenty dollars. What do you think Andrew would and David Wood debating. I think it's funny and it just shows that David Wood will debate about
me but won't debate me. So he'll debate. Isn't that weird? Yeah, he'll debate Andrew on whether or not it's bad to say to that random Muslim dude that, yeah, you were correct. In your criticism of God logic, Oh, he's.
A Muslim collaborator.
Now, dude, that's the leftist logic, right, that's like Russian collusion, collusion logic. Two dollars gas, Papa, Well, two dollars ain't going to get me foreign gas. But thank you, Burning Bush. Ten dollars do I want to apologize. I used to critique your demeanor. I let that obfuscate the bigger picture, which is that these prop liberal channels are actually not acting a good faith crisis. Thank you. Yeah, I think again, And FDA knows this. I'm sure everybody in the debate
spirit Rachel Andrew, we've all experienced this. A lot of people that you interact with put on a good face and they are very nice on their streams or publicly or whatever. In the background, so many people in media are just absolutely backstabbing snakes. Man. They're just no morals, no qualm. They will they will stab you in the back in an arty.
Luckily, thank god, I rightly know how to interpret faces.
So yes, father Deacon has a degree from FBI University in facial physiognomy recognition. Well, it's crazy.
So we just finished up on office hours.
We were doing. You were on Tim Hideaker's show What I'm Jordan.
We did it to the last two office hours with the seminary with Jordanville.
We were doing the David and adject debate and we're going through Calconon and Ephesus and these things.
And I didn't even think about this. I first got the idea when I was doing Logic Classic Carol.
We're doing a debate with Alex O'Connor and that Richard Swinburne, and.
I was like, well, Alex Connor has the fallacy of like gay man leg crossing.
I'm like, I don't know why, it's like honed into those details, but I'm like, I don't think any man should you know what I'm talking about, do the kind of like crossover leg.
Yeah, we all know what that is.
You can do a right angle where you.
Can do your your feet behind kind of tucked in, and I'm like, it looks gay and effeminine.
I don't know. I like your new approach, right, So we're not even gonna just do we won't, we won't. We won't even do debates anymore. We'll just do a physiognomy check. And that's that's what I've.
Been doing, and so I was like, let's do the agents.
And I'm like, because you can, and.
You can always do that, but you can tell a lot by it, how squirrely and the weird kind of mannerisms, and I'm.
Like, shifty eyes swallowing a lot candled still, and I'm like, anyways, I think that's kind of a new thing that we should do in And now it'sis of debate.
What do you think? I like it? By the way, notice this was pretty funny. I forgot this. I forgot to mention that yesterday David Wood was playing the race card. This is so pathetic, uh so, because I called out Avery pushing people to a synagogue to judaize them, and David Wood's response was, oh, Jay Dyer calls out the black apologist, so he's I mean, this is so low tier trying to pull the race card because I called out I didn't call out Avery for anything racial. And
then I just said, well, I'm BYPOC. Which was a massive ratio for David Wood because David David and I did this because David would loves bragging about ratios when he got ratio not once but twice. When I asked him, if you want to set up a formal debate, and uh, of course no, he won't do it. So now, if you support Zionism like Red Vaughn and his weird fetish, you're all good. And if you send people to the synagogues for church, you're all good. Actually, it wasn't even
synagogue for church. It was online zoom call discipling with a fake Mexican rabbi. You can't make this up, dude. That's the real church though.
What balls?
What's the Mexican term for balls for testicles? Abrolh, my name is, My name is Rabbis.
Abril.
Bring her Tomali's to Rabbi Wabos church.
It's also a synagogue. To Bro, it operates as uh, it's a it's a food truck. It's a food truck church that operates as a bank and ATM.
And Bro check it out like you go totally.
You can totally exchange your goal for paesils or whatever. Bro.
You need to go under some money to.
Homie.
You need to line her a little bit of cash or whatever.
Away.
Come to Saint Tomali's food truck on the corner of Wilson Avenue.
That makes a good skin We should we should make these sketch sketches.
You know what.
Yeah, that'd be well, it'd be a perfect skit to get your canceled from Adult swim. So that's the that's the skit they got Sam canceled from Adult skin Swima. By the way, I forgot shout out to dire Wire, one of the one of those newer Eclipse channels. They made this. Uh an awesome little hipster stump clap crench core. There's a new hipster stomp clap crench core. Let's play real quick. Gaye space brother, gay space brother. Won't you come down from my bone high? Gaze pace brother, gaze
bace brother. Won't you come down from my bone high and touch my cheese, touch my gluteswone high, touch my glues thone.
High in the sky Eesebee's brother.
Won't you come down? Slap in cheese?
Can I get up slap on the cheek?
Yeah, I can't kind of get up slap from the butt check chez face brother. He's gonna come down and find you cuz he's face brother.
Down the said space brother, You're gonna reading you're into your gage space brother.
You want to clap them cheeks like.
Anthony was up gay space brother going to clap them cheeks from up on high waves. Right, I got, but they use waves, eggs, Rabbi, eggs. Okay, Anthony, what's up, dude?
Yes, no, I just got two points since you have father deacon here, two questions.
One of them, uh, the.
Would you say that the Roman Catholics with when they have masks, are they participating in the eternal heavenly liturgy? No?
No, absolutely not.
If we talk about lyric.
Yes, sorry, well we speak about liturgy is patterned off the worship in heaven.
So if you have a different pattern, how could it be partation in the liturgy and heaven? Gotcha?
And I'm sorry, I'm ignorant, and you know the Roman Catholic however they worship, but.
It is.
Can you give me like a point or two about like the main difference besides obviously you know, I know there's no essence energy distinction.
And dude, I got to keep in mind, Anthony, I'm not trying to be mean, but like the modern Romeancaolic Church, most of them quote masses, they're worst or equal to Anglican services. They're they're basically just Protestant Services. PJ. What's up, man, I wasn't laughing at you, by the way, I was laughing at the waivos calling them Rabbi X instead of rabbis. It's way better. It's actually, yeah, Rabbi X is funny. What's up man, PJ. Pajamas, what's up?
Hey?
Can you hear me? Hey? Bro? I can hear you, dude? You think I can't spot a toller within like two seconds? Bro? Totally?
I know you guys like like you guys are my people.
Bro, even though I'm by polk, I can tell you guys can spout you guys from a mile away. Bro, Yeah, you're funny.
Get I'm sorry, Let get to Let me get to the question about the ecumunism in in the evangelical spaces. Have you noticed that these people you are using mean girls tactics too?
Yes? Yeah, absolutely. In fact, I noticed that, I said today right here. Look now, listen, I said, the e e apologists are just like the e thoughts on the internet. I said it right here, dude, No, but you're right being seen that a lot.
They don't mention you by name. They're afraid to mention you by name. They make this passive aggressive remarks.
Yeah, totally clearly talking about you. But they don't want to see it. It's like it's literally high school drama all over again. Yes, the people, they're giant vaginas. They look right here, I said today, right here. Look, the ecumenical evangelical anti Islamiti Grift Crowd are the exact mirror of the e thought egir ol Grift Crowd. It's exact same, man.
Because I'm noticing that.
I'm sorry, I'm sorry to come back here. I thought you were I thought you were done. Go ahead, PJ, come back, Peter Adam mean, I thought you were finished and I hit the button too quick. Come back if you want to, PJ. Sorry about that. Chase huh, Oh my gosh. Now what.
Yo?
What's up girl?
What's up? A little Tristan?
That's not funny. Yeah, it's this whole thing is fascinating in it.
What I think is going on, and I've been been able to watch the most of your stream today, what I think's happening is these people, they are doing these insane tactics, like David Wood saying, somehow you are allying with Muslims when you just agreed with them, with one Muslim saying yeah, they're not interested in about what's true.
Their entire brand is just anti Islam.
Yeah.
I think the reason that they're doing it is because they know they can't actually defend Protestantism. And if they character assassinate you, and they character assassinating Orthodox doing apologetics that aren't a humanists, you know, doing actual apologetics to say, hey, whatever system you believe in, whatever world do you have, come in and join the church. This is an easy
way to just discredit you and discredit Orthodoxy. And they play this game of oh, you're the poll, the pole diar, you know, all this like silly stuff.
I was.
I was baptized and received by a cradle Romanian serving under the Greeks who agreed with everything theologically that he would ask me to help with, you know, obviously Sunday School.
And stuff like that.
But this is this is the point, is that they are using this just to try to stop Orthodox apologetics in general.
That's what they want. That's why they ally with people like schismatics.
And I try to talk to John Claypool and I wanted to ask him what bishop he's in communion with, to show these dummies like the JPN cut Dude, this.
Is a schismatic but they're not interested in it.
And just stopping the conversation.
Correct, not John Claypool, Nick, you're right, father, And.
Well I got a little question for you, Chase, because I noticed the name Haggard is suspecially suspiciously similar to Hagar. Are you in collusion with Muslims? Yes?
And I actually I was at the grocery store the other day and I saw I saw a Muslim and they also picked up picked up milk. I enjoy drinking milk with my.
Co dog whistle. Muslim dog whistle. You're drinking milk just like the Muslims is lomic dog whistles right there. Yep.
But what do you think about that?
Like I it seems to me that this and on the whole like Ortho broth, in which they can't ever define ever, or it's so loosely defined.
It's anybody that's Orthodox that's hold.
Now you know what? You know what Cleave actually figured that out. He made a great point of mego. He said, the re that they're attacking orthobros is because they don't have the k to attack Orthodoxy, so they act like oh, we still want to be friends with all the Orthodox people. It's just the evil Ortho bros. When Ortho Bros are basically, whether you like them or not, they're just stating Orthodox theology.
Exactly, and then they'll try to use these nebulous things, like when I tried to ask John Claypole and JP and that that weird moler dude who was just screaming at me the entire time when I called into their show.
It's very strange. When I tried to ask them, John.
Said, He's like, oh, they're racist, and I was about to say, I'm not racist, so I'm not an orthobro, and then they they they just they want to stop.
The conversations about actual dogma.
That's what they want us. That's what David Wood did. David would try and imply that I called out god logic because I'm racist. It's like, where do you like that's so retarded?
Yeah, yeah, thousands, like does that even work?
It doesn't ey work. They're so behind that they're using the tactics of like twenty ten Democrats. Dude, what's up a PJ bro? What else did you want to say? Dude?
Yeah, it is.
About what they're thinking of it.
As was talking about, I noticed that these guys are also favorite prof feminists.
Yep. They rarely cut it out, and because of that, they.
Use the exact same tactics of the feminists to use to detect to discredit somebody against other people because they're like so passive, aggressive, and they can they're so incapable of actually like confrontation. Yes, it's kind of yeah, that's why I.
Have to say. No, that's exactly what it is. You hit the nail on the head, everybody. It's all. It's not the theology, it's none of that. It's first and foremost, it's a bunch of feminized whissies, dude, That's all it is. And then the rest of it's all smoking mirrors. Sam, what's up, Sam? Shamou? What's up?
You?
Son of the devil? Are you doing Muto with the Shia tonight? Is your mother doing Muto with the shia tonight? You, son of the devil?
Oh?
No, Muto, No homes that's bade, that's bad for you.
No.
I am over here at Papa Pios Taco truck over here at Papa Pios oneas not Chez from the West coast.
Homes, uh for two for one.
I served the Yukaristia on flatbread to you, homes.
Okay, you know that the real.
Yucaristia because it's flat, the tortilla Yukaristia.
That's how you know it's real. Homes in the full spirit of acumenism.
And go over to my cousins, you know uhes you go over.
The Rabbi Colonez, He'll serve you with the flatbred himself. It's Yukaristia and it's a human isma. I got the blessing from the Pope himself, Homes.
Actually, I appreciate it if the Pope would bless that. Actually, that would be fully in line with the humanism.
Is that?
What's up? Dude? Gay space brother harsh word says for forty weird currencies. I used to think that Jay and David would were the same person. Shit, dude, let me prove you false. Could David would look like this, watch this, I'm gonna blow your minds or her talking about effeminacy and divas. Could David would look like that? Nope? Could God logic look like that? Nope? So no, I'm not the same as any of those people.
Is that?
What's up you can hear me.
Uh yeah, So a big fan.
Just called because I was wondering if I could take the freemason position real quick.
You're not serious, is no?
I'm serious?
You're are you debating to debate? Are you really amazing?
No, I'm not amazing.
I'm just have one point one of your arguments that you used in the debate with Yeah, So it seems like one of the main things you pointed out was like the fact that they would not allow someone like a Satanist to join their their group, or you know, you had to believe in one God or you have to have you have to believe in a religion that believes in one God to join, right, And so you were using that to say that it entails you that you're pointing out a generic theism or generic theism or whatever.
And I don't see why that necessarily entails that. Why couldn't it just be we'd rather believe in a religion that believes in one God because chances are, you know, you're going to be a Christian, art you or a Muslim, and generally these people are okay, But like a Satanist, Dad, that's kind of like queer first.
Of all the culturally hold on. The argument was intended to show first that they don't just have one dogma of believing in monotheism. You also have to qualify that by all of these things that are excluded. That was the first point, to show that it's not actually one dogma, it's mini dogmas. The second point is they actually dogmatize that the God can't be specific. So that's the problem. They have a dogma of generic theism. Really okay, yeah, if.
It can't be specific, that makes sense.
And then also too, do you remember when I did that article and I was working with Garby, so with.
This common core, this generic saying one of the things.
That it's about God is he's worthy of worship. But worship requires allegiance.
Yes, great point, you can't.
You can't have a generic God. That's like saying there's two warring armies and I'm allegiant to them both I am with army.
So worship requires exclusion to the exclusion of others.
Right, So it doesn't make sense that you can even say like, oh, I can have this generic kind of or we.
Accept this other worship.
So worship just like allegiance to an army excludes all the others too.
And another way to show that this is false, and I should have brought this up in the debate and I forgot, is that when you go to Masonic lodges, they will put on their quote alter the Torah, the Bible, and the Qur'an and even the bahgabad Ghita. No, and I've got it up on screen. So when you are yeah, well yeah, when you join the Masonic lodge, any of
those can be placed on the altar. Here's an example where they put the Bible, the Shinto text, the Baga bay Gie to the Jefferson Bible, the Torah, and the Qur'an. So this this proves my point, all right, cool.
I was under the perception that they just wanted you to believe something, but like you would never talk anybody about what you believe in and they would never teach you anything.
But if they actually you know.
There's a bunch of there's a bunch of a bunch of Masonic altars right there. And then throughout the debate, Chase kept saying, yeah, but I can personally have it be my God. That doesn't that doesn't work. That's like father Deacon saying It's like, you can't be well, I am, I'm fighting on the side of army, but personally it's the good guys. I'm against the bad guys, but I'm
also on the side of all army. Like okay, well, if there's a Muslim army and a Christian army and you say I'm on the side of army, but I'm also personally on the side of the Christians. I think this is retarded. It's like, obviously this doesn't work, dous on what's up?
Hey?
I was just wanting to build up off the huavos at humanism.
Next time, if any of these evangelicals ever debate you, have you tried.
Running the DN argumentation? What? Running these nuts across her forehead?
All right? Got them? Thank you? It's Ben Watson's I heard of good D's nuts argument. I like it. Chase what's up? Although it might be verging into gay territory, so we don't want to if we do something like that, we might attract the galiens. Chase what's up?
Hey, Jay?
I just wanted to say, dude, your Freemason debate could not have came at a better time for me.
Spiritually speaking.
I had just moved away from an Orthodox church that I was attending around two hours away due to financial reasons. I'm a salesman.
Head moved back home and in with family.
To get back on my feet, and one of my food managers is actually a Mason.
He started telling me about how great it was.
You know, we got a lot of Baptist pastors here in the South that are Freemasons, and so I was looking into it and I thought it might be a cool thing to join.
He gave me a bunch of Grinders magazines.
I was like, oh, look, they're helping kids. You know, it look really cool, and so I hate to say it, but I did. I did end up petitioning, but you know, I'm not going to join obviously. But before I had petitioned, I had a I had like Masons coming to my job asking for me by name that had Masonic tags on the back of their vehicles. That it came for about two weeks straight, and I felt completely gang stalked.
This is before I did ever even sign a petition. So I just wanted to ask, do you have any like actual record of Masons that have done gangsonging?
I mean, I don't know your situation. But I don't really think they would gang stock typically nowadays because they're a little more they're they're less popular amongst people younger, you go, people are less interested. I mean in history, if you look at the William Morgan affair, there was a Masonic assassination and we just had that case. In France, there was a Masonic kid squad. I think those are
in those are more rare than the norm. And I don't mean to be rude, but I'm just saying, like I doubt that how can I. I mean, they might be to be zealous because they just want you to join the lodge.
But like.
I and I don't mean to hurt people's feelings. But I unfortunately I think that most people, not you do because I don't know you, but in general, people that think they're being gang stock, they're not being gangstock. It's a it's almost always people who are having uh, you know, paranoia episodes, schizophrenic episodes. If you watch the document I
watched a bunch of stuff on this. Yes, I know that during the Cold War, the East German Stazzi had perfected a technique of harassing, you know, dissidence to the to the sazy. I know all about that, but I don't think that that's happening to most people, mainly because and I don't want to hurt your feelings, but like, most people are not a threats to the establishment. And if you you know, if you had like a compromising info on a politician, yeah, I might believe you're you
were harassed and stalked or something. If you had dirt on uh, you know. I mean, if you're Michael Hutchinson, you're sleeping with Bob Geldoff's wife, then you might end up asphyxiated. I mean, I don't either just say like that, that's the kind of a situation where I could believe it. But if you're like, you know, random factory worker, dude, not dissing random factory worker, Like if you I'm not
hating on working class folks. I'm just saying I don't think they're worried about you know, random people, whether they're joined the lodge or not. But Andrew, what's up? I mean, who, like, who have we seen oft in recent times? Charlie Kirk, whatever you think about it, whoever did it? Jeff Stein, McCaffrey, they attempted Trump, whatever you think of that, the Masonic hit squads going after organized crime or being involved in
organized crime stuff. Uh, guys in the chat, remind me who are the more recent you know, people on a lot Benzer Bhutto was unalived because the Muslim stuff Breitbart unalived, it seems probably. I'm sure I'm forgetting some obvious ones people around the Clintons. Who else is? Oh? Yeah, who is the famous Uh my godfather wrote a book about the the guy that was in the circles of Hillary that was unlive. What was his name? I'm going blank
on the Hillary dude. Oh, the the insurance ceo Virginia Jeffrey perhaps Sinzo, right, yeah, you had the Japanese guy I take unlived. Perhaps Kurt Cobain, perhaps David Carrodine, Yeah, Seth rich Apps McAfee. I don't mean people that we speculate about. I'm saying like known on a Livings shinzo abe definitely. I mean that's kind of stuff's kind of rare, you know what I mean? Sorambe Cecil cecil and Harambe. There we go, Oh, Justice Scaliah, that's the one I
forgot about him? Perhaps, Yeah, those are the perhaps though Andrew what's up.
Hey, sorry, I'm about a power behind in the life. So I don't know if this was brought up or not.
But you were looking at the cannings those first contentional bull and saw that the third one was different. I looked in the way back machine and it was changed all the way back seven.
Oh you're saying that the New Advent deleted that canon. Yeah, wow, in November of.
Six it's there.
Wow.
Yeah.
The next snap shot is a hill seven. It's gone.
Interesting. I wonder who and why they thought to do that, because, yeah, that's interesting. And by the way, when I was pulling up the I don't I still don't understand why there would be two versions of John Paul the Seconds uh Homilies and Jordan or speech to the Jordanians, because there's one that says still has the made John the Baptist protect Islam, and then there's another version where it's not there. And people found that the Vatican website still has both there,
but I think it's the same talk. So the these are interesting questions. Why would New Advent remove that canon in two thousand and seven, and why would there'd be two versions of John Paul saying that one saying John the Batist protect Islam, and another one saying where he doesn't say it, Luca, what's up? But I mean, come on, now, the Vatican is like they're classics when it comes to forgeries. They're like the ancient masters of forgeries. Dude.
Sorry, hey, j I'm relatively new to your channel. I've been watching you for about three months. I'm sorry.
I know this is.
It's sorry, my first.
Time doing this kind of thing.
Okay, So I know the topic is cons are bad idols and stuff like that, but I have broader questions just in general, and I'm not trying to be like antagonistic or anything towards you. My family is an Orthodox Christian. I'm from Macedonia. I've just recently come into the faith almost a year ago, give or take.
Through logic, I guess I was looking.
Through Islam and just reading up on a bunch of things, and my conclusion was that Jesus Christ is our Lord and Savior, and the Orthodox do what Dollarsthodox Church is the one true church.
And I've watched your videos on that.
My question being, or one of the questions that I want your opinion on, is I think my mom is falling into the modern liberal feminist kind of ideology. And it's like, I don't really see it as an orthodox or.
Even near Christianity.
And it's just whenever I tried to show her any kind of debate it's involving Rachel Wilson, She's.
Shut it down.
Cool, this is demonic. This is that they don't watch debate like that. And she's pro abortion. But I don't know how you can hold the same claim as I'm orthodox Christian, I believe in Jesus Christ and stuff, and also be pro abortion.
Well, yeah, you can't, right. I appreciate that, Luco. But here's the thing. You can't debate your parents. Never debate your parents. It's not gonna work. They're never gonna listen to you logically refuting them. I've never even heard of that. Ever. The only way you're gonna convert your parents is that if you become a responsible adult with a job and you know, wife and kids and all of that, then they will perhaps listen to things that you have to say.
But they changed your poopy diapers. They're not interested in your logical augmentation. So don't even try it. It will get you nowhere. In fact, you'll just have a less worst relationship by trying to argue with your parents. So never ever argue with your parents. The only time I would say that it's good to do that, in my estimation, is that if they specifically ask you, like, hey, why
do orthodox do this? Or what what's your view on this? Yeah, then you can give an answer, but don't don't argue with them. We're looking for people who disagree. By the way, Fugan, what's up. I'm not fussing at that guy. I don't mind people who have questions calling in fugen what's up, yo jie?
What's what's going on? Father Deacon? I saw one of the Wilson's in the call.
I just wanted to show up at my real quick. Love you guys, God bless But I'm gonna get right to the point. I'm still learning about Acumanism. I just picked up Orthodoxy and the Religion of the Future. I'm gonna be honest. The ship from Rose talks about Legit scares the absolute shit out of me.
What exactly? What exactly is scary? What do you mean? So that's what it is?
What I'm That's what I'm talking about. So someone is still learning and coming into the church.
Right.
It talks a lot about that. It uses the word antichrist a lot.
Right, And how do you share something like this with people that you know that are in these churches, right, that are still your friends, it's still your family, and not sound like an absolute insane person.
Right.
This is something that I think is worth talking about or at least to explain that these theological views are just far from true Christianity.
Well, like we mentioned a minute ago with the previous guy, with family, you're never going to get anywhere debating your family. And the same goes for your brothers and sisters too. My younger brother and I we used to have arguments all the time, and I would try to debate him. I try to debate with my mom and my dad. It doesn't go anywhere because they've been around you their whole life. They've seen every mistake and flaw and sin that you've done publicly. They know all that and it
just doesn't work. So they have to see a change in you over time. So keep in mind too, because a lot of us are theology nerds, we're spergs where philosophy weirdos. We think that everybody's going to be thinking logically and argumentation wise about how to have solve these problems. No, ninety nine percent of people don't think that way. They think that what's true is what I want to be true. So there's got to be a change in the person. And a lot of times this comes when a difficulty
happens in their life. It doesn't come through logical augmentation very rarely. Usually it's a death in the family, car wreck, illness. Those are the things that get people thinking, maybe my paradigm isn't what I want to be true, but maybe I have to actually submit to something true. So until those things happen in a person's life, arguing and debating is limited in its effectiveness. So the best approach with
friends and family is feel them out. If they're open to it, then take a hey, check out this documentary, check out this book, tell me what you think of it. Take that kind of judo approach. Let them come to you, let them ask the questions. Don't be aggressive with your friends and family. You can be aggressive with your bros, right because bros can appreciate and take aggression. Your mom,
your grandma, don't prece have grandma. That's what I'm trying to say, applied by the rule of don't pres grandma, fway, what's up?
Yep, you could hear me. I could barely hear you.
I can hear you.
Well, oh, I you know, I was gonna ask a question.
So basically I had started o Cia within the Catholic Church. But then like after really inquiring a line and doing some like research, I wanted to pursue like basically inquiring of Orthodoxy. So I went to a church and I spoke to a priest and I was telling him how basically.
The church that I was in o Cia, and they were saying that.
Dating and recognized my Baptist and so I was trying I was trying to tell him he might end up you know, he was saying that he might end up going through the same thing, like he might end up feeling the same way.
But what he told me was, since I was.
Already in Ocia, what he told me was that it would probably make more sense for me to finish that out and go through with the whole process and then come to him, and then he would receive me that way because he would have like less baggage. I just wanted to know, like since you have father on like, is that an appropriate No?
Not typically, I mean unless there's some extenuating circumstance that we don't know about. Not, that's not. Does the stream still going? Look like? Did it cut off? Looks like it's still going? Maybe just shut shut down on YouTube, FDA. Would you say anything about that? All right? He can't hear me. No, unfortunately, that's not.
Sorry, could you say again it's probably but without even knowing probably not.
What's the question now?
He says that Orthodox Pre he's told him to finish his Roman calcol r c I A absolutely not all right? Uh, well, Pre said, you know what I know you are going to.
The scientology. Uh what do they call that when you do auditing?
Auditing?
I think you just finish up that program, finish up whatever it deals that you have with the cartel.
Yeah, get go ahead and get catechized in the Vatican to religion, and then we'll then then come in.
After after you've done all the satanic stuff.
We just.
Yeah, Jake, what's something Hey look here, ja, Yes, sir.
Hey, it was something either last night or the previous live you said something about many or some of the you know, stories of the saints are similar to myth or legend, And I was curious because what got me into Orthodoxy was kind of a lot of the biographies and whatnot lives of the saints.
And I was but also very skeptical.
As well of some of the stories that I heard. Do you know any literature that goes deeper into what you were insinuating the other night?
I don't know, no, all right, I mean I think it's just it's obvious that there are legends. Ah, what the delineator is? I mean, I don't know. There's no easy answer to that test this what's up? Oh you guys remind me? Yeah, there's a bunch of super chests. I got to catch up here, non fake Blake ten dollars. People in this evangelical online e space is care more about dollars in truth, for us, it is about eternal life. It's not easy. Their business appeal is a bare minimum salvation.
Thus their only hope is to have acumunism. Yeah, we talked about that last night. That's the model that Peter Drucker, who's the big, big daddy of evangelical megachurch stuff, who was not even a Christian. He created this business model, and he said, for the business model to be successful, it has to be a cumunist. It has to have no dogmas, because then you're just excluding people tests this what's up.
Secially weird using can you hear me?
Yeah?
All right, there's something I want to mention.
And I'm a catech caman from like a strong IFP backgrounds. You know that Liberty University back when our grandparents were emission you know, seminary. And it's specifically kind of with that Jim Bob debate you had with the scriptural preservation. He mentioned that verse that would they always bring up with the not one jot or tittle would pass away? And I often like to refer to it like that. Even the Hebrew text, you know, the Old Testament is
perfectly preserved from when it was written. But you know, I know you say you're not a textual staller, but it seems like a very easy kill shot.
For that view.
Specifically, what's the kill shot exactly.
The whole idea that not one jot or tittle, so specifically every single letter, you know, down to the letter preservation for the Old Testament is held up until today. But with the actual wave it was preserved. It's kind of hard to make that kind of claim.
Yeah, there's just so many things that we're mentioned in the debate, and you'll if you end up doing a lot of debates, you'll realize that you can't address everything that a person brings up, especially when it's like, uh, not formal and just constant back and forth, and you have to choose in the heat of the moment which things you want to respond to and which things are more important so that you don't let the opponent take
you down a rabbit trail. And you'll notice when I do debates, almost always I stick to two or three key issues that I never let go. And that's because there's a lot of different tactics and techniques that people can do in debates to get around issues and challenges, and one of those is to deflect over into other topics and then go down a rabbit trail. And so I always bring it back to the thing maybe three
things that are not answered. And that's because that really, I think emphasizes the main faults in the person's position, and it doesn't allow them. Because I've done debates for a long time, I know all the tricks and the snaky tactics that people are going to do. And one of the easiest is obvious that that's easy to spot is when people try to go off into some other tangent to get you to reflected away from the thing where they don't have much to say, or they're weak
or they can't answer it. That's why you have to call out two quoquay is because most of the time people are doing it too quotuay. It's because they don't want to answer the question you just ask them. And a two quot way is not an internal critique. It's two different things. Beef salt, rabbi waivos frantiros is more correct than you exactly, sterling five dollars? What's a black aaroney ten dollars? Have you seen Hispanic pentis? I don't know what that is. I was raised as a Dominican
penty is this a group of people? I don't know what that is. They found that a Hispanic church in the US, and one of the pastors showed a picture whoa of a young, unalived person that was sacrificed too to Satan. To pepple for people or is pepple something Hispanic Tentius. I can't are you saying that's a cult. I don't understand what you're saying. Let's see, by the way, this is a shout out to Gooster. I did bring
up a bunch of the links that Gooster sent. I told you guys were gonna we're going to cover his links because he old school ortho bro for whatever reason, knows all of Maybe he was in the mega churches, I don't know, but he knows all about the history of the megachurches. And this is a thing he sent from a guy called Todd Wilson. I don't know anything about this. The Leadership podcast, and this is about personal growth and basically like the business model of the church.
So we're not going to go into this whole podcast, but you guys can watch this if you want. This is what these evangelical types are being taught. Right, So the Ruslan types, the Gavin Ortland types, they watch these dudes too, and Redeem Zoom or these like, they watch these people to figure out marketing strategies to create their business churches. But you said there's a cult called Hispanic penthees, no Dominican Pentees, you know, like Dominican Republic about the
Dominican order Dominican pepsis. All that gives me is bad bitches behaving, misbehaving, bad Dominican bitches misbehaving. I don't know what Dominican penties, panties, I don't know what that is dog Dominican penty. And there's a Hispanic church I don't know, lucas five dollars. Thank you, Jay, I forgot that YouTube doesn't allow the that word. Uh, it's hard to know what they're doing doing. I'm not sure I'm interested in getting into debate. Thank you for sharing your knowledge. Appreciate
that man. Oh Pentecostal black Aruni says Dominican Pentecostal the pastor showed a charred on a lived person to hype up people. Oh against spiritual warfare. Interesting, so you wasn't talking about these bad bitches. How the modern churches shaped business church. Okay, here's another one that Gooster said we need to check out. This one is called this is
about the implosion of the megachurches. There's nothing you can do to make God stop loving you, because God's love is not based on who you are, based on who he is.
You have to know who God made you to be.
That's your identity.
This book sold fifty million copies. It became the best selling hardcover nonfiction book in American history. Rick Warren's face was on Time, magazine, Newsweek, and every major Christian publication. Presidents called him for advice, and nobody talks about the
churches it destroyed. Between twenty three and twenty ten, thousands of American congregations adopted his program, Some of them grew, many of them split, and across the country, people who had worshiped in the same queues for decades found themselves pushed out the door. This is the story, they didn't it on the bookjacket. In two thousand and two, Rick Warren was already a superstar pastor. His church in Orange County, California had grown from a Bible study in his living
room to a megachurch with fifteen thousand weekly attendees. But the Purpose Driven Life changed everything. The book was simple, forty chapters, forty days, one promise you would discover God's purpose for your life. It sold a million copies in four months, then five million, then ten million by two thousand and seven, and had sold over thirty million copies in fifty six Languages. Publishers Weekly called it the best selling hard damn.
I remember too, back in the two thousands or whatever, like you would go and in thrift stores, you know, book hunting, and you would see like twenty copies of the cell Esteine Prophecy and twenty copies of Purpose Driven Life. I remember every evangelical had this, freaking because I was already out of evangelicalism when this came out. I was a tradcat. And I remember, like, you see this stupid book everywhere, dude.
Cover nonfiction book in American publishing history. OPRAH featured it. Corporations bought it for their employees. The military distributed it to troops. Even secular bookstores couldn't kee on the shelves. Warren became America's pastor.
The military distributed this book to troops. That's crazy, damn, dude. This really is the official American civic religion is mega Churchianity.
And Hurricane Katrina business church devastated New Orleans. He mobilized thousands of churches for relief efforts. When world leaders gathered at Dabos, he was there. When Barack Obama needed someone to give the invocation.
He went to Davos.
What when Barack Obama needed someone to give the invocation at his inauguration in two thousand and nine for relief efforts.
Well, actually, that makes sense because he's in the CFR. People forget that Rick Warren was in the council.
Warren relations world leaders gathered at Tabas.
He was there.
When Barack Obama needed someone to give the invocation at his inauguration in two thousand and nine, he called Rick Warren. Saddleback Church became the model everyone wanted to copy, while pastors flew in from around the world to study Warren's methods, Seminary professors required his books, denominations restructured their training programs around his principles seminary.
Could you imagine reading Rick Warren's book and seminary. Don't read that, Saint John Christostom, we got purpose driven life, dude.
What The purpose driven movement wasn't just about individual spiritual growth anymore. It had become a blueprint for church transformation. Warren's previous book, The Purpose Driven Church.
And I've even blown away at how business Church was actually ten times more business church than I thought it was. Wow.
Ready sold over a million copies to pastors. Now, with the Purpose Driven Life reaching ordinary believers, he had both the leaders and the congregations ready for change. By two thousand and five, Warren was training four hundred thousand pastors through his website his conferences.
Every time I hear saddleback, what's that game movie with Jake Jillenhall broke Back Mountain Church? I think it broke back, broke.
Back chirts just a saddle back pulled out months in advance. His Peace Plan promised to mobilize a billion Christians to solve the world's biggest problems. This wasn't just a successful book. This was a revolution horror. But the book came with something else, something most readers didn't know about when they picked it up at Barnes and Noble. It came with a program, and that program would split churches from California to Carolina. The program was called forty Days of Purpose.
It was a turnkey church campaign that came in a box for thirty nine dollars ninety five cents. Churches got everything, sermon.
It was a marketing scheme. So the Purpose Driven Life had a forty dollars thing. For forty days, you get the This is don La Prie on a massive scale. Everybody's ripping off Don La Prie man and poor Donala Prix. Thank Don La Prig got unalive? Do speaking of unlived, your boy donal La Prie was unlived. We got a lot of young young pups that don't know old Don Laprix. Who was Don Laprie. Well, if you were in the nineties, just like with all the other horrible infomercials, right, remember
Susan Powder, what was her thing? Stop the insanity with Susan Powder, that crazy flat flat top woman wine mom with a flat top that was fat and helped you get skinny, get a flat top. I'm not joking, by the way, only on my live streams do you go from Rick Warren to Saint John Christos to Susan Powder and Donald Prix. Stop the insanity. So you would be you would be partying. You've been drinking zemas all night. You're half drunk at your buddies after the party, hanging
out on a Friday night. You fall asleep on the couch in the nineties, it's nineteen ninety five. You wake up groggy, it's two in the morning, and after the TV, this TV is still playing and this is what's on right now.
It's up to ten.
Diets don't work now.
I lost one hundred and thirty three pounds, But I didn't go from a fat person to a thin person.
That's not whoa dude, look at that.
What happened.
I went from an unfit person to a fit person.
And there's she would actually be attractive. She didn't have that stupid Sinad O'Connor haircut. She would have been all right. You know what I'm saying, Look at these women are like.
I won't that.
I won't that for me. And then you you're saying, I don't want to watch that, so you change the channel. Oh guess what happens when you changed the channel? Don la prix.
Video is the most powerful form of.
Media on the face of the planet.
In fact, television has proven this year after year, decade after decade. If you're not using video to promote your product or your servi, you're missing out on the internet the way they this is not.
The original though, I want their original Don la prie, here we go. No, this is two thousand and two. I want nineties, bro, I want nineties Don la prix. I don't want this recent crap. Here we go. Hello, I'm don La Prie.
I'm so excited that you decided to become a sales representative for the Reminder Service. I'm going to walk you through fifteen ways to make all the sales you ever wanted to make if you want to make ten sales a day.
All of the online e grifter bros, especially in the red pill sphere, do they all want to be Donala Prize? Dude? I want the original ads though, I don't want all this stuff. Here we go infomercials.
To realize how.
So you don't want to see the Susan powder infommercial, so you switch over to the other channel on cable and boom, there's don La Price.
Once you realize how much money you can make doing this, you can't stop thinking about it. And when I get to meet people who got my making Money package and then did what I said and now they're making incredible amounts of money because of what I showed them, it's the most incredible feeling, especially when you see how much their lives have changed.
Right now, as we said, we're going to do fifty thousand in our first month of the year.
So now, what was don La Prize's model for those that don't know placing tiny ads and classified magazines About how to place tiny ads and classify magazines to get paid? WHOA and what is Rick Warren's model? Forty dollars to get the full course on how to teach people. The forty dollars.
Course outlines small group guides, marketing materials, pennerstant inserts, even the graphics for their websites. Pastors didn't need to write a single sermon, They didn't need to create a single Bible study. They just needed to follow the script. Warren's organization, now called Purpose Driven Ministries, provided training videos, They offered coaching calls. They created an online community where pastors could share success stories and troubleshoot problems. More than thirty thousand
churches signed up in the first three years. Think about that number. Thirty thousand congregations in cities and small towns, Baptist churches, Methodist churches, Presbyterian churches, non denominational churches, even some Catholic parishes, all following the same program, all preaching the same messages, all moving toward the same model. And that model had a name, Seeker Sensitive. The idea wasn't new Warren had learned it from men like Robert Schuler and Bill Hibbles.
By the way, this is how all of these people became so effeminate, because their churches are modeled on what's called a seeker sensitive model of church membership, meaning don't do anything, say anything related to repentance, changing your life, dogma, anything like that, because we don't want to scare them off. Now, after a few decades of this nonsense, all of these effeminate evangelicals are now reflecting this in their seeker sensitive orthobo mad bad people line of argumentation.
Jueler and Bill Hibbs pastors who had built megachurches by rethinking everything about Sunday morning. They asked a simple question, why don't unchurched people come to church? The answer seemed obvious. Traditional churches felt foreign to outsiders. The hymns were old, the language was religious, the buildings looked like museums. If you wanted to reach modern people, you needed a modern approach. Warren took this philosophy and packaged it. He taught pastors to think like marketers identify.
And this was from Peter Drucker. As we saw in the Last Stream your target audience. He even gave his target a name.
Saddleback Sam, a professional man in his thirties or forties, married kids, too busy for church, but searching for meeting design. Everything for Sam, the music, the messages, the parking lot, the coffee bar, yes, the coffee bar. Remove anything that might make Sam uncomfortable. Anciently, I remember the first time I went to a it's a Presbyterian church in Nashville.
And I was there with my ex girlfriend back in the it's like two thousand and four or five, somewhere in there, and my buddies and I we drove out to Nashville. We were hanging out with my ex girlfriend from high school and she went to this is the church that the Jars of Clay dude went to.
Before he went faking gay or whatever he is now. So we went to this church and uh, this is right when I'd become a tradcat. This was like two thousand and three or four. And we went to this Protestant PCA church in Nashville actually, and we walked in and there was a giant like Starbucks Barista coffee bar, and I'm like, a coffee bar in the narthex of the church is the first time I'd ever seen that, but that actually comes out of Rick Warren's thing.
It was gone religous syms, hidden long prayers.
Who is the Jars of Clay? Dude? By the way, I forget that guy's name. Didn't he go.
Full U?
And I knew it was a bad sign because I went. I remember seeing I saw Jars of Clay in concert around the same time because I still like some of the evangelical goober music at the time, and I remember it was a bad sign because I'm the During the concert, they played a special message from Bono asking for money, and I was like, oh, dude, this is the worst. Who's the jars of Clay? Dude? The jar yard Jar Jars of Clay? Chart music?
Can swim for forty d's.
Jarge Yards of Clay, Dude, that's funny. Uh, there's a lot of angles you could take with jar jars of clay.
If I can swim up to forty date Dan.
Hazelt that's him. Yeah, So he went. So he used to go to the PCA church in Nashville, which was my ex girlfriend's church. This is before or anything to do with or I didn't anything about orthodoxy in two thousand and three or four, and this was the church where they had the coffee bar. And then a few years later Dan becomes an LGBTQ ally shocker.
Right.
But even in the nineties when I was hanging out with people, because I when I became evangelical in nineteen ninety seven and eight, I had a bunch of friends that were in the music scene and they were friends with all of the Nashville Christian rock and roll Christian artists people, so I got to meet and hang out with some of these people. I never met this Dan dude. I did meet and I went to a Bible study with Mac from Third Day, So I've actually hung out
with a Third Day dude one time. What's his name, Mac Powell, I think. And I've met not a lot. I've met like a handful of these Christian evangelical rockers over the years. But it always, even in the nineties, there was all these whispers that like, well, you know, all these evangelical rockers they're all gay, right, And I don't know that Dan Haselsteen himself is gay, but I'm saying there was all these rumors in the nineties that, like all the a lot not all. A lot of
the people were Skittles. And remember Jennifer Napp, she was like the biggest Christian thing for like two thousand and one, two three. Then she gets invited to uh Lila Fair and then she comes out as Skittles and it's like, what the heck is? Well, how are all of these remember? And the same thing with the Caveman's called Remember the Caveman's call Dude, the biggest Calvinists band, And remember Dan
Halseleton was going to Calvinist Church. They're Calvinists for like ten years, and then they turned Skittles.
And then the guy that signed them left and so then all their budget money the day their record dropped, his gut, their guy was gone. So then all their budget radio money went to Jarza Clay, Jarza Clays, Jarza Clay. Now yeah, and then all of a sudden it got dropped because all of a sudden he goes Doe. We try to call and no one to pick up, like no one knew they were resigned to her. So I know what you mean, from that start, that's crazy, jars Clay.
I haven't heard that name is forever. I mean, but like you know, boom you know they they get all the radio money.
They became an act. I met Butch Walker through Jeremy pop Off. I thought that was gonna be an actually interesting video. Didn't say anything at all. So let me think of what what is that PC eight?
I think it's PCA.
I think it's the big PCA Churchimber. Let's see if it still has a coffee shop. That's not it. This, by the way, is like the mega rich area of Nashville. Christ Presbyterian. It might be that one. That's it. I think that's it. Christ Presbyterian, Cool Springs. I want to see if they still have a big coffee bar.
I don't know if the so or not.
Anyway, it doesn't matter. Who cares what am I doing. Let's get back to rig.
One offering plates replaced with boxes in the back, make church field like the rest of Sam's week, professional, practical, positive, non threatening. It worked at saddleback, why wouldn't it work everywhere? But there was something Warren's training materials mentioned only briefly, something pastors wouldn't fully understand until they were months into the transformation. Not everyone in their churches was saddleback Sam. The changes started small.
First, I'm sorry for keep forgetting the super chats groovy banana fifty dollars. I was raised Baptist, but I've been listening to you and the others and have been in questioning what's true. I'm reading orthodoxy and religion in future. I'm taking it seriously. Thank you for all these videos. You have book recommendations, Well yeah, I mean we just recommended early on Uh Life in Christ by Saint Nicholas Cabasilos. That's a classic. It's a good one. Neo Palomite James
Vallant was critiquing you on tag. Do you want to do a response? No, don't care, Floyd five dollars. I'm stuggling Charlotte to just understand the distinction between Christ's body as the church and the Eucharist. Well that's why it's called the mysteries. So again, actually you would like this book too, because this whole book is actually about that. So that's providential. Eighteen Disabled says for five dollars, you the ayah Toola of Wexantium. Now go and slay queen.
I like that he sent a slay commission to me. Slay Queen. Rock Bush says, I saw a UFO in northwest Florida as a kid. It was a glowing saucer with a dome and rings of light. That's a light bright boy. It flew over our car probably ninety miles an hour. Weird thing is we remember it being different colors? Was it demonic? Perhaps?
Z K.
Get the book Bad Post by E. R. Chamberlain. It looks interesting. I think I've heard of that book. There was another book that came in the two thousands, very soon. More to that that would be interesting. Timothy ten Dollars I was the caller. But you can go further to those that are separated from the Orthodox Church and those that are confusing people anathema. They actually become persecutors of the church, who are the killing the priests, that destroy
the temples and torture brothers. Well, they may not be as extreme as you know the Ottomans killing people or whatever, or isis or what, but I mean, it's it's it's yeah, it's spiritually subverting and confusing people. And again a lot of these people they don't know any better, but they're also tempted with the grift. So we have to be patient, trying to remember that these people are. They're in a they're their own worst enemies. Timothy five dollars anathema anathema,
Christ is king, Muslims do not or same God. We don't define ourselves by what we're not correct these people do. Yeah, their whole thing is like we are defined by online anti Islamianity. Jay is our new black Ayahtola agreed. Thank you again, most wanted five dollars. I've been attending Orthodox liturgy, my wife and three almost about to have four kids. Congratulations, thank you for bringing me to the truth. Hey, that's awesome,
man epistemic Anthony. Appreciate that. Guys. I'm not going to be reading one dollar super TETs anymore, but I appreciate it. Journey of Abundant five dollars. Adam Livingston on the swine Bitcoin channel is a big fan.
Awesome.
Yeah, I like Adam as well, and I need to swine Bitcoin needs to renew my referral link because it seems to not be working. I have to reach out to them. Rise five dollars. Channel five made a new documentary about the Sweetish Sisters from Madden. Oh interesting. I definitely want to watch that because that was a classic
mysterious mk Ultra situation that the BBC caught on camera. Well, they eventually did a documentary Madison the fast Lane, which appears to be something related to in cultural assassins with those two weird twin sisters who were actually sent to assassinate somebody. And you're saying that there's a new documentary, I've definitely got to watch that. We need to go back and do some of those conspiracy classics like Madison the fast Lane, Madness and Manslaughter.
Mm hm yah.
Yah.
Channel five? What's Channel five anyway? Is that something British in the UK or something?
Yeah?
Oh, this is this British? Or is this like Australian? What is Channel five?
H m.
M hm yah.
Where is it?
Dude?
I don't I don't see it. Sure.
Well, later the women were spotted on Moltorway CCTV by transit police.
This is the original. Maybe I gotta go somewhere other than YouTube to get it. Ah, Oh, it's a show. I can only access that in the UK. That's gay, dude, watch it on YouTube.
Let's see it was in the Woodeny day of filming.
That's a trailer. I want to watch. The actual thing is it on Apple TV.
Okay, it was an ordinary day of filming until it wasn't.
We need ambulance to possible facials.
A shocking turn of events. I've never filmed anything like this before, with an unbelievable ending, twisted sisters, madness and manslaughter.
Okay, it looks like I could find that via Apple. So it's a two part part two. Appreciate that. I'll definitely watch that, and we need to go back and read. I wonder if you get away with doing part one, or if the BBC will or it's maybe it's not BBC, it's like Channel one or whatever. Will they copyright strike it? I don't know. This looks like some random channel that put it up, so maybe you get away with it. Dire Wires says Jay. What oh, I just went away?
Where to go? What do you think about? To be Mac? What about Grits I used to love? I don't really, I mean Toby Mack was kind of corny to me, but I did like Grits songs ooh my life be like ooh. But uh, I don't know anything about I mean, I know that the DC talk the black Dude got in trouble for trying to hump everybody, But I don't know anything about Toby mac do Cevsky two dollars, thank
you for everything, You're special. Toby Mack's the original Christian wiger. Dude, that's a unique little subgenre of the wigger.
Bro.
You got the dang mainstream wigger, and then you got like a Christian wiger, uh sort of ethos, kind of its own little nishe you know what I'm saying, And that's Toby Matt right there, y'all listen to the o C super Tones right now, do Cvski, Thank you everything, You're special, Thank you, uh special special ed fire Walt with me ten dollars. Crisis Risen Jay, thank you indeed he is. Thank you, world des five dollars. It's a funny thing to ask Baptists, especially Baptist pastors, if John
the Baptist is actually the denomination. Most of them will say yes, yeah, that's the trail of blood theology, which is it's funny in the film five dollars. Did you see Russell Brand's new book and Griff It's promoted on Tucker. He would fit right in with online Protestant business church group. I saw you had a book with a cross that was house flies, and I'm like, what in the heck is that dude? Pashanami, what's up? Became a member Sterling
five dollars, Thank you, Redbrook ten dollars. Some of my family are evangelical, I'm Orthodox. How do I speak and have the conversations with those that are not? Like we said earlier in the dream, I would say, just give them a book, tell me watch this documentary. Don't aggressively try to argue with him. Take a passive sort of approach, not passive aggressive passive. Adam Bingo is thus an Islamic dog whistle. Yes, apparently my life youlike is a great song.
Good fortune to you on next conquest against the Islamianity. Heretics Scorpio ten dollars, Thank you so much. Read Schnoby five dollars. Daily Wires trash. But the movie that What Is a Woman? Is gold? Yeah, I mean, I'm sure that they have some good content. It dropped at the right time. Read Schnobi one year on two month subscription day Jire eight dollars. Watching Lutherans dance around the concord
but not being equal to scripture but totally authoritative. Yeah, I mean it pretty much is the same with all all the Protestant confessions. It ends up being the same circle crash meta religion ten dollars. David Wood treated Jay very harshly, even though Jay says he likes God, logic, IP and et cetera. Disagree with somebody doesn't mean that you dislike them. They make it personal. Well, I mean, that's all they had to rely on as a character assassination.
So they're just David Wood that holds through. They're dislike the Muslims. And David Wood's going to debate Andrew about me, but won't debate me about his fake church. I'll p n a five dollars me at Smoothie King, I'll take one shake, even dire, please exactly easy on the muta with the Shia tonight. And he says the same thing. Beef Salt says a lot of wiggery going on at Ruslan's Rhythm charge Kyle Bircher, Kyler Birch, fifty dollars, thank you. Unfortunately,
all of this is pride. If truth isn't a person, but it's a bunch of propositions that you pick and choose, then Christianity stops being relational, even though evangelicals always speak of it. In this ye, this relational way becomes a spiritual analytical philosophy where every man is just his own Guru and those humility dies exactly and no better example than Calvinism most wanted. I've been attending Orthodox letter, know we read that. Excuse me, TINGU fifty dollars, Thank you
so much, gotta go, thank you for the call. Much love Jay Jamie in the chat, thank you tingou much, appreciate it. Alf Sceneric five dollars. Cooin a is the best language flash five dollars. Dude, you gotta watch part two of Ruslan's conversation with the Oriental Orthodox that he uploaded. It's actually a bloodbath. He is a fallacy machine gun. I don't doubt it because when I debated Ruslan in the second half of that interview that he put it
behind a paywall, it was a bloodbath. And I mean I'm like, literally, like four times in a row, I'm rouselon, that's a fallacy. And it doesn't even register with him. He's like, so Alpina is Orthodoxy the least subverted sect. Well, I believe the promise of the of Christ of the church. So yeah, but that doesn't mean that there's no subversion Orthodoxy. Absolutely there is. That you have giant the entire Jesuit universities like fordom dedicated to subverting Orthodoxy. And by the way,
David Wood is a graduate of Ford. Him luise five dollars. Do you have a video explaining the prose of you on music and movies thinking they're bad or clothing with skulls is bad? You mean like death to the world.
Uh.
I think a lot of Protestants are just superstitious when it comes to symbology, and they act like ritual magic goobers, and they think that like a skull is necessarily automatically satanic. I mean, it's retarded. So they're just doing a version of word concept fallacy. But with symbols, it's like when you know, Baptist Grandma says, I saint the icon and it had a halo. That's a the Hindu Sun God imagery. It's like it's signifying the uncreated energies, deifying the saint.
It's the uncreated light. It's not the Sun God, but I saint the Hindu thing that was the Sun God. The same thing. Yeah, but They're not the same thing. They're different, Big boy ten dollars. The strategy of calling all the author bros evil Islamists is so hilariously short sighted. Yeah, I don't think it's going to work the long run. People will just see all the Muslim debates and immediately know that all the Zyobros are US pathetic liars. Absolutely.
Why would I have debated all the top Muslims and gone on podcasts with Ridwan and would debunking Islam as a Muslim collaborator. It's just so stupid. But but again, they are actually relying on their eighty IQ Muslim convert audience, right, That's that's who they're talking They're not talking to Orthobros. They're shoring up their cult against us. In their cult, just like Christian Prince's army of ad Iq Muslim converts. They don't think in terms of fallacies and argumentation. They
think in emotion. They're emo, So they respond to what wh do the Dieter share that Muslim correct? That mean hi Muslim? Jay Diner said, Muslim correct Muslim. It's so stupid. It's like you're but you're talking to people that are like Noah says Schrodinger's a humanism. Protestants only view Orthodox as Christians if the Orthodox isn't attacking Protestant doctrine. Exactly right, that's why there's That's, as Cleve pointed out, that's why
they're not attacking Orthodoxy. They're attacking Orthobros. But in reality they just disagree with Orthodoxy. Zombie twenty dollars. I listened to the dude named Alton Johnson of the Black Dude. Yeah, I try to get him the debate. You wouldn't come do it. He is the black dude on X that has the laser eyes PfP yep. He and gay p spent an hour tone policing and crying about the words that were used. JP said the same thing that Rouselin said. Jay has to repent. Yeah, exactly, like I'm going to
repent to these dudes. This is so gay. Notice like they don't believe in confession to a priest, even though they bring a schismatic priest on their dumb show. And then rouselm demands that I publicly repent to him. I thought, you don't believe in confession to people. MKG thirty dollars. You have many in your corner. Our prayers are with you. Thank you, John. Five dollars. You are killing it. They won't debate you make a chat GPD version of Hess
to debate you just for shits and googles. Who's Hess? Rudolph hes mkg forty dollars. What is true piety? It is how well you can signal it on Twitter. That's true piety. Spit on the West two dollars. In eighteen hundred, Jonathan Edwards John Edwards, John Edwards became their bishop. Who's they? Who's John Edwards? You mean Jonathan Edwards the Puritan nowadays of ten dollars? Don't think agreeing with a Muslim? Do you not think agreeing with a Muslim will give them enemy power?
No?
I think it shows intellectual honesty. If Jake, the Muslim metaphysician says that the Theophanes and Orthodox theology are uncreated, that's correct. I'm not gonna say, no, Jake, you're wrong, they're created because he's Muslim. This is so stupid. Anthony fi dollars. What are your thoughts on Orthodox Christian academia.
You're not going to be welcome. I mean there's only some certain sectors where you could probably get Like, if you find some somewhat traditionalists Roman Catholic school, maybe you could get through. I don't know, but I mean, I mean, it was made clear to me in the two thousands by the academic strata where I was trying to become an academic. You're not going to be welcome here as a straight white male. So you can do with that what you want. Tingos as we're twenty dollars? Have you
covered Mike Winger? Idm Mike Winger. In fact, I tried to get him a couple times to debate and he ended up just blocking me so and he took huge offense for me daring to offer to debate. You understand, these people, they're so fragile and passive, aggressive, soy that they lose their shit if you offer to debate them. I used to watch Mike Winger and thought he was intelligent, but I don't watch him anymore well, because he's not needs world five dollars. In Genesis four eight, the Orthodox
Study Bible cites the Masoretic text. This makes it hard to read the whne the notes of this of the Study Bible citing the Masoretic So what Graham five dollars Deep Doctor Cooper, five dollars, the pro Germanic Orthobro, Constantine hated pop Christianity. What Who's are you talking about? Somebody today? Are you talking about Constantine the Emperor? I don't know what you're talking about.
Son of Salads?
Are five dollars? Keep pressure on these clowns. Okay, tweet bomb ten dollars. No more of this charitable acumenism, No more calling everybody Christians. It's only orthodox Yeat Fernando Wigxantium Rising co Lob Wiggas. Ain't got nothing forgive your moms exactly, Flavis twenty dollars. Hello, listeners, cringe core rap song slaps, of course it does. It's great. They impressed me with
the song they came up with. And just just out of putting pressure on these boys, let's play it just in honor of Rouselin and Wigsantheum, We're gonna play our prized rap discs once again. Y'all ready for it? Right here?
I need seven figures. I need seven figures, bro, I got the following. I got twenty eight thousand, I got to hundred thousand, exactly. How I'm monetizing speech, you know, what I mean? How do I monetize?
I like the money and I like shoes.
How do I feel business?
I don't really care about how many from an Oriental to a born rental wigger.
I'm I'm a Blusy's proud of stricts for every done by my merchy is my ministry, my church.
I'm blessing God.
JD.
Please don't save me. I've been safer for a yard. Heavy yady bitty wop. He got me fascinated. Do I think my pride? It's my dude like MUFOSSI baby my testimony. Get me money bat or watch walla. I'll be back for my all super chance. Like I'm sure Senative, I need to monetize you so fight Christians. I need some money from them. That's my mission. And if I'm coming up against real Christians, I run like hell not to take in. Hey, Jay, don't make me play myself. I'm
here a ticket for the dinner. Bell this my meal ticket. Please don't make me feel please, please please, bro.
I got the follow it, I got twenty eight I got two eleven thousand on taketac.
How do I monetize this speech?
You know what I mean?
How do I monetize?
I like money and I like shoes.
How do I feel a business? I don't really care about how many followers I have to I need seven figures.
By the way, those are all real rouselin quotes. Now that's hello, listener, that's not me. Uh whosoever. Ten dollars? What do you think about Little Season Revelation twenty? I don't think about it because there's nothing to do with Orthodox Christianity. Tip eight five dollars. Tyrants create the conditions and impetus for revolution. The error papal supremacy of one man holding absolute power was always going to produce the aggrieved clergyman like Luther. Absolutely, this is what Saint Justin
Paplovitch says. The pope was the first Protestant, He made himself a pope and then led to the personality cult church which we see today. Absolutely vonder three dollars day. I recently watched Mahon drive again, and maybe wonder the elites have plans to make humans into pets. I think they're already view it that way, but perhaps element to
de Vista, three dollars crisis risen. Why do the GOC channels call rokor surgeon because their excuse me not it, because they are tools of the CIA, even though they're two done the knowe day. Jire No, we did that. I got it. I'm starting to get a crick in my neck. Dude, we get a We got to call it a night soon. Let me make sure I get all these up. JT says for five dollars, I'm currently forcing my wife to watch your quasi Moto freestyle song whilech she nurses our son. We are back good. That's
how we do it. This is how we do it. I need seven figures. I need seven figures. Prairie Brother, Prairie Ortho Bro. Three dollars. I went to my friend's Roman Catholic service the other day. I thought I walked into a Pentecostal church. I don't understand why Roman Catholics don't get that liturgy is also theology. Well they've lost the liturgy. That's what I'm trying to say is like reverent masses are unfortunately not the norm anymore. Anonymous five dollars.
Jay are going to watch the Twisted Yoga? I think yes, Jamie is gonna and I are gonna watch this documentary. So yes, I've heard of this. I recommended it to Jamie when she did her et phone ome stream. There's a super demon Hindu pantry yoga cult. Yes, I've heard this. Clap my cheeks from up on hot Well, that's what that's all about, dude, Benson five dollars. Did you see that Bob from Speaker's Corner is gonna talk to ap
about ecumenism. It's all piety signaling. Yep. Well, I had a huge argument with Bob the Builder on Discord in like twenty twenty because this whole thing is like church doesn't matter, just debate the Muslims with apologetics. And I'm like, sorry, dude, I like your you know, I like your idea of doing apologetics, but you can't do apologetics without the church and all these people want to do that, And I mean,
I don't even think Reridbond's orthodox. Kezy two dollars is David Bentley hart Spook cooock Er Crook, I don't know, but he's heterodox j ar quit wave ten dollars. Aw shit, here we go again, yep. Every time what's up became memember pro fo or ten dollars Mesi Ronaldo or Eric Cantona. Well, I don't follow soccer, but because Eric Cantona used to email me and DM me. We used to have some theology because he used to be in a theology. Don't know if he is now, but he used to be
in a theology. And when I had my old blog, he started commenting and I was like, is that really Eric Cantona? And then we started dming I think on Facebook back in like two thousand and eight, and at the time, if I recall, he was a Calvinist, but he he found some of the arguments about sol scriptura and all that kind of stuff somewhat interesting, maybe halfway interested in it. And I mean we didn't talk a lot.
We probably had maybe I don't know, five or six lengthy dms back and forth about the and he used to comment on the blog. So I guess, out of all those people, Eric Cantona, even though I don't know anything about soccer players, so I don't know, I think he was the first famous person on the Internet that I ever interacted with. Groovey been in a twenty dollars thank you for all the book revenation. Do you have any recommendation regarding baptism or the gifts, Holy Spirit and tongues.
I mean, we've done several videos de blinking charismaticism, orthodoxy in the Religion the Future debunks it. I'm being hurt since Serious, absolutely one or percent Serious used to I mean we were weren't talking on the phone. It's not like I've had like hours of conversation with their cantona, but like it was just like uh dms and website comments.
He was a pretty every he was an occasional commenter on my old blog, and it was really him and we had some I can't remember his Facebook or emails back and forth back in the day, but let me see if there's h He also might have found the the movie stuff interesting too, because he was in uh, the Elizabeth movie. Doesn't he play a jesuit assassin in the movie Eric Kenton Erica.
H h.
H maybe he uh, maybe he kept that private. Let's see what this is about. What the hell is that about? Yeah, there doesn't It doesn't look like there's a lot of public stuff about any of his religious beliefs. Maybe he just kept it private. But I mean I do remember him specifically saying that he found Calvinism convincing, but maybe maybe it was a passing intellectual interest or I don't know, but uh, we did have that conversation. I'm not lying.
Why would I lie about that? I don't know anything about soccer, Like I'm gonna just make up some random Oh yes, I talked to a random of soccer player, like, I don't need to make up wisely, that's just a retarded, nonsense lie. So I don't appreciate being called liar either. Would you don't have You don't have any basis to think or say that I'm lying. You missed my super chat? Uh the palma gravy banana twenty dollars? Tank you for
the book recommendation? Do you have any recommendation reguardy baptism? What we did that one basil? Five dollars?
Jay?
Would you or Andrew or any other people? Wait? Group? Make a media group? Yeah, just make a media group. I mean, Bro, that takes like Daily Wire was hundreds of millions of dollars. Bro Charles says for ten dollars. They twerk in at Rhythm Church. Absolutely about the palma ten dollars? Jay, I hope you're well. Could you give me thoughts on the bulgate? I mean it was the normative Bible for the Latin Church for a good while, but I don't. It's not the normative Church or Bible
for the Orthodox Church. So I don't. I don't really have much to say, and.
No, I'm not.
I don't have any videos on it. By the way, people say, why didn't you reach out to God Logic. I mean, so we had several of our friends already friends with God Logic who've been trying to kind of sway him in the direction of Orthodoxy for a long time. And when I asked God Logic a few weeks ago if he wanted to do a debate, uh, he said no, he's not interested in that, which is fine. But it's like, okay, then why are you're sending people to synagogues. It doesn't
make any sense. So, Hank Williams sindar j What do you think about Americanism? They took over MAGA the Boomers. They believe in dispensationism. They have no idea what it is or I mean, you know what I think. Why do you think I've been I'm the godfather of boomer jokes. I was making boomer jokes in twenty eleven before anybody made boomer jokes. I wrote an essay that went viral. I am the father of boomer jokes. So that's how
that's what I think, Coco bro fight dollars. Do you have any book recommendations for an orthodox type of mere Christianity like C. S. Lewis.
No.
In fact, although I love C. S. Lewis, this is unfortunately one of the terrible things that C. S. Lewis did was contributed to the idea of a lowest common denominator Christianity, which is the mindset of all these goofball so called apologists. They all have the mindset that there is there is no mere Christianity, there is no Oh, you just have these five things and that's the no that that's a Protestant idea. I'm trying to find a
clean way to explain the totality to an agnostic cultural Hindu. No, you don't want to give them CS list. I mean for a Hindu. I mean it's something more like maybe something like Jason Lyles's book on tag I mean, that's the only thing I could even think of that might work. I don't know, Like again, all of you people don't underst and like there is no Christianity that is churchless, it doesn't exist. God Logic has already said he doesn't
want to do a debate like. He said that personally to me, Will you make a debate course like your philosophy course. Probably not, because it's so forever to make that debate course. That's why it's expensive. Which, by the way, you can still get the debate course. It's in the show description. It's at the autonomy Agora marketplace link. You
can get the philosophy course there. You can also head order to chalk dot com choq dot com, the best and supplementation on the Internet, to get access to the best supplements out there using the promo code JYCX zero l A f E J sixty life. I don't know they're gonna get that male vitality sack. Do not be a passive aggressive evangelic fish become a toxic masculinity evil orthobro Right there, Groovy says for twenty dollars, when I say baptism, I'm asking about patal baptism. What makes physical
baptism special? Well, the creed says, there's only one baptism. What do you mean what makes it special? It's only one, one Lord, one faith. One baptism that's water baptism, and Titus three the washing of the labor, regeneration. That's what makes it special. This is hard for me to understand as a Baptist. What's hard for you to understand? There's not two baptisms. There's not a meaningless symbolic water one and then a super spiritual, gnostic personal one. That's they're
the same. That's the easy answer. And by the way, the Church always baptized infants. So your whole sacked is created around a dumb rationalist George Fox, Roger Williams retard set who thought that you have to be an adult to be baptized. It was just dumb. The whole thing's dumb. And the reason it's all collapsing is because, well, guess what, we have this machine that puts all the world's information right at your fingertips, which didn't exist before. So all these dumb cults are falling away.
The hymnals disappeared, not thrown away, just moved to storage. The projection screens were more flexible, pastors explained, easier to teach new songs, easier to change things up. Then came the crosses. Warren's training explicitly addressed this religious symbols could be barriers. One prominent church in Michigan removed a fifty year old stained glass window depicting Christ's crucifixion. The pastor said it was too graphic for visitors children. The language changed.
Two sermons became messages or talks. The altar became the stage, the sanctuary became the auditorium.
Yeah, but the Protestant world was already business church. Basically even before this, it just got worse.
Stopped calling themselves pastors aunt they were led communicators or vision casters. Sunday School became life development classes. Prayer meetings became connection gatherings. Even communion got rebranded. One church in Texas started calling it the Jesus Meal. Warren had written in The Purpose Driven Church.
Groovy says, Basically, you're saying that the physical act of baptism and spiritual baptism are the same. Yes, just like the incarnation is the Divinity with the humanity. There's a synergy there. The Holy Spirit is present at the waters, just like he's over the waters in Genesis One. Guess what in your new creation, the Holy spirits were really present over the waters and your baptism. You're saying that
Baptists confuse and separate. That the confusion is baptisms baptists separating. Yes, correct.
That Saddleback was unashamedly a market driven church. He used demographic studies. He surveyed the community. He discovered that unchurched people's number one complaint was organ music, so Saddleback didn't use organs. Churches following his model conducted their own surveys. They hired consultants. It's the worship leader now called the creative arts director, explained that him didn't fit their target demographic. But I'm not the target demographic. She realized after forty
four years US America, the stories were eerily similar. A church would launch forty Days of Purpose. The pastor would attend the conference at Saddleback or Willow Creek. He'd return excited, energized, talking about vision and reaching the next level. Changes would accelerate traditional service at eight a m canceled due to low attendance. Wednesday Night Prayer meeting replaced with seeker focused
small groups, annual hymn sing not strategic anymore. Those who questioned the changes were labeled resistant, divisive stuck in the past Pharisees. One pastor in Georgia sent a letter.
To Longue all the same stuff that these Geobers say about the Orthoeros.
Time members who had expressed concerns. He wrote, if you cannot support the vision God has given this church, it might be time to ask him where he wants you to worship. Translation.
Leave.
Warren had a term for this. He called it with blessed subtraction. The phrase appeared in purpose driven church materials. Warren taught that every church had people who resisted growth. They preferred the church stay small. They valued tradition over reaching the lost. When these people left, Warren explained it was actually a blessing the church could move forward one hindered hunt. One training video showed Warren explaining, well.
All these DIDs are always chunky too. I think the new physiognomy criteria we should put that in place because they make a lot of this stuff easier. Ef you got double chins. If you're a chunkster, opinion immediately discarded.
Get to a room full of pastors. You've got to be willing to let people leave, he said, even people who have been there forever, even big givers. The audience applauded, but on the ground, in actual churches, blessed subtraction looked different. In Illinois, a church of six hundred shrank to two hundred in eighteen months. The older members didn't leave because they were resistant. They left because they literally couldn't hear.
The new sound system was designed for contemporary music and sermon volumes that appealed to younger ears left elderly members unable to follow along. In Florida, a couple who had donated the land for their church building their family farm, watched as the church board voted to sell the property and relocate to a strip mall, more visible, better parking, all closer to their striking demographic. The couple left, so did forty percent of the congregation. One woman in Arkansas wrote,
I taught Sunday school for thirty one years. Then they told me my style wasn't aligned with their new strategy. They offered to retrain me using purpose driven materials. Like everything I'd learned, everything I'd done, was worthless. But defenders of the movement pointed to numbers. Some purpose driven churches were exploding with growth. The question was what kind of growth, and at what cost story one. Purpose driven churches were
succeeding attendants, up, baptisms, up, small groups, multiplying. Saddleback itself had grown to twenty thousand weekly attendees by two thousand and five.
Willo Creek was good grief, dude, twenty thousand and one giant megachurch. That's crazy.
Members, multiple campuses. What they found challenged everything they'd been teaching.
Multiple campuses they called their church campuses.
The people who showed up for the contemporary services, the seekers they'd redesigned everything to reach. They weren't growing spiritually. They attended, they enjoyed the experience, but they weren't reading their Bibles. They weren't praying. They weren't becoming disciples. Worse, the most spiritually mature members, the ones who should have been thriving, were the least satisfied with the church built again.
As we said earlier, here's my challenge to any of these people in the eepologetics sphere. Find show me one parachurch, church less apologist in the first thousand years. Show me one church father, saint apologist, theologian who argues that you can have apologetics without the church. Where's a churchless apologists just name one. By the way, there was a baptisty that was supposed to come to debate this and he didn't show up.
Shocker Bibles. Willow Creek's founding pastor called it the wake up call of my adult life. He actually said this on stage, bought to thousands of pastors some of the stuff that we have put millions of dollars into, thinking it would really help our people grow and develop spiritually. When the data actually came back, it wasn't helping people
that much. He went further, we made a mistake. The study called Reveal found that church activities, the programs, the events, the services designed to attract seekers had almost no correlation with spiritual growth. People might come for the show, but they weren't encountering God. Other research confirmed the pattern. A study by the Hartford Institute found that seeker sensitive churches
had lower member retention rates than traditional liturgical churches. People would attend for six months, maybe a year, then drift away. The Southern Baptist Convention studied their purpose driven churches in two thousand and eight. They found that while attendance initially spiked, giving peer member dropped eighteen percent Follen.
Yeah, these megachurches, they found the style. Even in the two thousands, they have a huge turnover.
Tiroism declined twenty three percent. Most telling, these churches were conducting fewer baptisms per one hundred attendees than traditional Southern Baptist congregations. One researcher called it spiritual consumerism. Churches had become so focused on removing barriers that they'd removed the very things that created commitment. No demands, no expectations, no cost, just come enjoy the show and leave when something better comes along. Even Warren's home state of California was seeing
the cracks. By twenty ten, several prominent purpose driven churches had closed or merged due to financial problems.
But nothing compared they're closing copared to what would happen at Settleback franchise.
Franchaws were out of business.
Itself for twenty years. Rick Warren taught pastors how to build churches weren't dependent on personality. Don't build around the preacher, he warned, build around the purpose. Then came twenty twenty two, Warren announced his retirement after forty three years leading Saddleback. He had handpicked his successor, a younger pastor named Andy Wood from Echo Church in San Jose. The transition was meticulously planned. Warren had been preparing for this moment for years.
It should have been seamless. It wasn't. Within months, Saddleback was bleeding. Staff key leader who had served under Warren for decades, quietly resigned. Attendants, which had already struggled to recover from COVID, began dropping faster. Then came the earthquake nobody saw coming. The Southern Baptist Convention voted to remove Saddleback from fellowship. The issue Saddleback had ordained women as pastors, including Warren's own wife, ky It violated.
Did they started ordaining as wyw I gush.
The spc's doctrinal statement. Warren appealed, He flew to the convention. He gave an impassioned speech about the Great Commission being more important than gender debates.
He lost.
The church that had taught four hundred thousand pastors how to grow congregations was kicked out of America's largest Protestant denomination.
But that was yeah, and they're all about to die. Uh, a slow death to the Orthodox Church.
Just the public drama behind the scenes. The reports were worse. Staff members described a church in identity crisis without Warren's personality, his vision, his.
Who are these e chicks that are in the stock footage here? Like this stock footage is cracking me out. Do you see that the uh Malaysian Asian girls earlier?
Like?
What did that have to do?
Think? The stock footage doesn't even match the AI.
Voice connections his presence. Saddleback didn't know what it was anymore. The irony was brutal. Warren had spent decades warning against personality driven ministry.
Uh, look at him at the Davos Dude, what a phony dude this is. This should have been an immediate disqualifier. The Council for Relations, fake ass pastor at Davos was brutal.
Warren had spent decades what is this.
Klaus Church, Saint Klaus Schwab. Sorry, Warren's a perfect minister of the Corsper.
Of Davos against personality driven ministry. He'd written books about it, created systems to prevent it, trained to build churches that could outlast their founders. Yet Saddleback itself turned out to be the ultimate personality driven church. Remove Rick Warren and what remained a very expensive campus and a shrinking congregation trying to remember why they were different from the dozen
other megachurches within driving distance. By twenty twenty four, reports suggested Saddleback's attendants had dropped by nearly thirty percent since danger Bleeding Warren's retirement. The church stopped publicly reporting numbers, something Warren had always advocated for transparency and accountability. One former staff member put it bluntly, we taught everyone else how to build purpose driven churches, but when our purpose walked out the door, we realized we'd been person driven
all along. Critics who had warned about the purpose driven model for years felt no satisfaction. These weren't just numbers or theories anymore. These were real congregations, real people, real pain, which raised an uncomfortable question titit. This isn't a story about whether Rick Warren was sincere. By all accounts he was. When Purpose Driven Life became a best seller, Warren did something unprecedented. He paid back his church twenty five years
of salary. He stopped taking any income from Saddleback. He reversed tithed living on ten percent, and gave having away ninety percent he and his wife Kay threw themselves into causes that mattered AIDS.
Really yeah, right, who believes that? That's this old trick where the church owns everything and the pastor doesn't own it, but he's able to use and do whatever he wants. Right, So like in it isn't Kenneth Copeland's giant mansion owned by the church, right, This is a trick.
In Africa orphan care mental health advocacy, especially after their son Matthew took his own life in the twenty thirteen. Warren could have built a religious empire. Instead, he gave away fortunes. This isn't about one man's motives. This is about what happens when churches adopt corporate methods. The purpose driven model treated church growth like market expansion. It segmented audiences like consumer demographics. Funny, It removed barriers to entry
the way business is streamline purchasing. It measured success in attendance.
It's titled growth without compromise, and he eventually didn't. He eventually capitulate to Skittle's marriage because Obama buddied up buddies with us, and then his wife becomes a pastors.
In square footage the way corporations measure profit margins. But churches aren't corporations, their communities. The hymns weren't just old songs, they were the words mourners had sung it.
Yeah, I mean, there's no telling what he made from that dumb book. So oh, he's not going to draw a salary from the church after his dumb book probably made him fifty million dollars.
Save sides, the liturgy wasn't empty ritual. It was the rhythm that had carried believers through decades. The crosses weren't decorations, they were reminders of why people gathered in the first place. When you remove these things to appeal to seekers, you tell the sort that they don't matter anymore.
What all right, that's enough of that. I can't take this AI video anymore. There's a couple more that we did get about the collapse of this. We'll get to that next time. Shadow Man. Could you say baptism is a manifestation of spiritual baptism. I don't know about manifestation. That's they're united in synergy. The water and the uncreated energies are what spiritually baptized you. It's in it's in the baptismal liturgy all right,