New Horror Movies Ep. 125: A Nightmare on Elm Street 40th Anniversary Retrospective - Parts 1 and 2

Hang listeners, Jay of the Dead here, just two quick post-production notes at the top of this episode. A Nightmare on Elm Street had its initial limited release on November 9th, 1984, and its nationwide US theatrical release exactly 40 years ago today, November 16th, 1984. Make sure you listen through to the end of this episode because there are two in-depth reviews of the first two Nightmare on Elm Street.

We review the first film and then there's a surprise specialty segment as your intermission entertainment and then we bring you an in-depth and spirited review of the second film, all in this episode. Enjoy! Hello everyone and welcome to Jay of the Dead's New Horror Movies, the podcast that haunts your nightmares. The purposes of this series, my name is Fred Head Ron Martin, and I am joined today by a couple of horror vendors with today the eponymous Jay of the Dead.

Thank you, brother. Thank you for having me for this very special series here. The man that probably has a dedicated registry of films greater than the US Film Registry, Dave Dr. Shock Becker. Thank you, sir. It's great to be here. I'm really looking forward to this. I got to watch this movie again today, and after a ride, I've seen it maybe now six or seven times, so I'm really thin. Looking forward to it, and thank you so much for letting me be part of this.

And the movie that we're speaking of is going to be part of a new retrospective series that we're presenting here in 2024 because one of our most iconic, one of our greatest horror franchises of all time turns 40 this year, but I'm not sure if you guys can believe that or not. Crazy, it's crazy. You know, the way time flies. It's amazing. First release on the Vembranise 1984 today, we're going to talk about the iconic film at Nightmare on Elm Street.

The first of an entire retrospective we're going to do of every film in the franchise, including Freddie versus Jason from the early 2000s. I'm so without any further delay. Let's move into the show. Thank you for listening to you, Jay, the Dead's new horror movies, the boiler room, asbestos of podcasting. The kids of Elm Street don't know it yet, but something is coming to get them. There's something out there isn't it? We just see cuts happening. What did that pretend? I don't know.

Peter is a car that got the same in the John Pugans since he saw it. We're going to kill me for sure. Did you do it? There was somebody else there. He was locked in a room with a girl who went in alive and came out in a rubber bag.

So in 1981, a guy I like to call Wes Craven, because that's his name, wrote this script that was a movie that we're going to talk about today, and created one of the most iconic, I think, in the, at least in the conversation for most iconic horror villain of all time, inspired by a series of articles from the Los Angeles Times about some refugees. Some refugees who were having nightmares and refused to fall asleep because they thought they were going to pass away during the night.

And then when they did fall asleep, they did die in the middle of the night in a situation the doctors called Asian death syndrome. Inspired by those articles, you throw in a little bit of a scientific American and a childhood bully and a homeless man and you get a nightmare in Umstreet written by Wes Craven with our iconic villain Freddie Krueger. And the reason that he's called you guys know why he's called Freddie Krueger.

Yes, he knew somebody named Fred Krueger, right? His bully, right? Yeah, it was a bully in high school that used to bully Wes Craven named Fred Krueger, which is also noticeable in the movie last house on the left. Krueger in that film. Oh, wow. Oh, wow. Yeah. So that's where he gets his name, the red and green sweater, which I never really understood why Freddie wore a Christmas sweater that seemed to be, you know, not in his ballpark of things that he did.

But apparently Wes Craven read a scientific American article that said red and green are opposite colors and very hard for the eyes to see together. So whenever you saw Freddie Krueger in his Christmas sweater, it would automatically like give you revulsion because your eyes did not want to see those two colors together. Although I think Christmas kind of kind of devise that article, like I would think, but yeah. And I feel that way about most Christmas sweaters to be honest.

I think you felt that way about Christmas in general, right? No, I love Christmas. It's just not Christmas sweaters. So a little more trivia here before we go into a round table discussion. I now have some trivia, like, for points at the end of the episode to make you guys compete with one another. Oh, great. Thanks.

The iconic glove with the knives came from Wes Craven's cat, retract his claws and a late night ampomercial for knives, but those two things together, you get one of the most iconic weapons in all of horror history. Is that weird to wear a wear inspiration jump from? That's very strong. I didn't know that. That's, that's awesome.

And I didn't know this until today. So I was doing research today, and I should have known this, but when I covered at night, my street series a long time ago on the resurrection of zombie seven podcasts. This was this hadn't taken place yet, but into 1021 night, my number street was selected for preservation in the US National Film Industry by the Library of Congress as being culturally, historically, and aesthetically significant.

Which is a rare treat for horror fans. Yes, it is. That's awesome. Absolutely. So getting into our 1984 made for like $1 million and about 30 days, a nightmare on Elm Street. I just want to know what your guys' relationship with this movie is and maybe your first impressions when you saw it for the first time.

Dock Shock, if you want to give us an explanation of maybe your first time watching this film, your first impressions of this film from I would assume that you've sought me eighties for the first time. It was it was the eight, but it was the late eighties. It was not in the early eighties. I think that I might have seen it. It was definitely on cable. I think I've seen it.

You never saw in the theater then. No, no, I did not see it in the theater. This this was this was still a time in my life when I would have had to have been taken to the theater. And my parents would not have taken me to a theater to see a nightmare on Elm Street. Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was the late eighties. It was not right around when it first came out.

So it was already in the zeit cut. It was already out there by the one I saw it for the first time. And I was fully aware of who you know of the character of Freddie Krueger. How do you see it in the sequel to that point? No, no, I had not. I did see this one first. Now please tell me you saw it like on a page channel or something you didn't see like a cut up version. Oh, no, no, it wasn't a cut. No, it wasn't a TV version. No, it was it was on. It was.

I don't know if it was. I'm going to say HBO. It could have been. Which was the local fill it out. I hope you're capable station. But I'm going to say HBO was the first time I saw it. And yeah, I it's. It's it held you know it worked for me part of what really works for me about this movie is the fact that you know as far as you get these iconic killers. Okay, Jason's Jason's out there. Okay, don't go to Crystal Lake.

Um, you know, well, there's Michael Myers. Okay, stay out of hadn't field. How are you going to avoid Freddie? Yeah, my former co host, the Resurrection's always having podcast hammer said that he thought Freddie was the scariest of all the horror icon icons because what is some of the what he did feel somebody and they're safe. You're not going to know. What if what if he was real? Exactly. I mean, he does something with the way he takes out the.

There's a character in here who's been accused of a murder and the way he takes him out. It seems like that's something that the character might do to himself. You know, so you can never you never really going to know and if somebody came up to you and said this a guy is going to kill me in my sleep. You're going to you're not going to believe. I forgot to mention we're going to we're going to use spoilers during this series. So it's okay to talk about characters and talk about endings.

All right, and things I should mention that in my opening monologue there, but I completely spaced it. No problem. So for anyone who hasn't seen a 40 year old movie. Yes, if you're given still on your watch list after 40 years, please go and watch it is probably available just about anywhere because we're going to spoil the hell out of it.

You know, that's the thing that that always sticks with me about this is you cannot avoid Freddie. You can't avoid him if he wants if he wants to take you out. You will he he doesn't have to come to you. You're going to go to him. Then there's nothing you can do about it. It's just the nature of you have to go to sleep. So he would so it adds really a supernatural element to this film.

And you know, it is a slasher, of course. I think it has all the tropes of the slasher, but it also a supernatural cause Freddie is technically dead. You know, he's he's you know, he's living in the dream world. He's not living in the real world and that adds a supernatural quality to it that I think definitely works to his advantage.

Yes, also it's it's one of a kind, right? So we're in the middle of this slasher craze of the early 80s that kind of first run of slasers. And I definitely think that you would categorize this as a slasher, but it's not your traditional Friday the 13th or Halloween and rip off where there's this guy to mask running around stabbing people with a knife, right?

There is that dreamscape element that we're introduced to that really I think before this movie has really only kind of been introduced and maybe one of their franchise, nothing of fantasm here, which is another weird franchise that has some sort of dreamscape qualities to it. So we really haven't as a horror fandom experienced this sort of killer before I agree.

And the weapon of choice is super unique like Jason and Michael Myers, those of every two prominent ones at this point, they just use kind of whatever's available, which is usually a knife and ax and a shetty whatever. But we see at the beginning, the very beginning of this film, the killer has crafted his own unique weapon, which is I would say become them, we would become the most iconic horror weapon of all time. That would be my opinion.

Interesting. Now, well, it definitely is. I mean, that's what when you think of Freddie Krueger, that's what you're thinking of are those, you know, and in this they're calling him, you know, it's funny how the characters are referring to him as fingernails. Well, they're not really fingernails. They're they're more like knives and they're where he's got these, you know, they're all refer to them a little bit differently. But clearly, you know, we get to see him make this thing.

That's the first film too, and they're trying to figure stuff out as well. Yes, yeah, no, but I mean, and you know, if you have a, you know, it's going to be a franchise either. So, you know, I don't, well, I was craving ever intended it to be a franchise. Right. Right. That's why I will get to this. I'll talk about this in a little bit, but that's what the ending is so whacked out because we're in line.

I wanted to be a franchise, which we should mention West Craven shop this for like three years until new minds and the picked it up. There's only the second movie new minds and I ever produced. And that's why this kind of made them. That's why new minds in them is usually referred to as the house that Freddie built. Yeah, and it makes sense. Without Freddie Krueger, it wouldn't exist. The house that Freddie built in Lord of the Rings eventually saved. So there you go.

That's less ad to that title. Right. How about you, Jay? What was your first experience with a nightmare in home street? Okay. Yeah, I was young. It would have been, it would have been the late 80s for me to probably round 86 or 87. And much of my 1980s horror education came at my cousin's house. And they had, they had a cousin, right? Yes, we do. And they had HBO and the cinematics. So it had to be, I imagine it was on one of those. I mean, it's possible.

They had a BCR as well as possible. They rented it. But anyway, that's where I saw it. And I was pretty freaked out to be honest. I even hate to admit that nowadays because Freddie isn't one of my favorite horror icon, you know, care. Dave, I don't know if you know this little behind the scenes. I had to actually Venmo Jason $50 in the end to... I don't know why I'm again to... No. I believe it to do this franchise. He hates it so much.

I know this was never, I know for a fact this was never one of Jay's. Do you know how much we had to pay him to do the, the, the puppet master and hell razors? Oh, you know, I had to go, I had to go, you had to pay him at least 100. No, the truth is actually I do appreciate the early films, which, you know, we'll see you about that as we go. I understand why you dislike the later films because you are an old funny daddy. But we'll get to that in a little bit.

That's right. But no, with this though, as a kid, you know, being around what, 10, 11, ish, this is 86 or 87, I'm guessing. I thought it was pretty freaky and a lot of my friends were freaked out by Freddie as well. And you know how kids can kind of stir each other up and influence each other. You know, that had an influence on me too. So there was that, but also even at that time, and this is why I think that the concept of this is master.

I always say this, but and you guys hit on it. The fact that here is a monster that if you, you see the movie of him and you're scared. And if you actually have nightmares about him, well, that's where he gets people is in their nightmares. So, so that has an extra power to it, which I think is absolutely genius. Let me ask you guys this. What's the longest period of time you've stayed up? If you were trying to avoid Freddie and go my past history, how long could you stay awake?

I don't know. I don't know straight, but I know when I was at senior week in 1987 for the, and I wasn't there the whole week. I think there was there for maybe five days of it. You know, six days. I think it was there for six days. I know I slept about seven hours total. Three of them on the beach when we all fell asleep without having applied.

I mean, I don't know if I had applied Sun Tam or saw, you know, something. Oh, no. Yeah. So, so we were all red for that would have been like maybe the second day. So for that for that six days, I slept maybe seven hours. Dave and his beach orgies. Yes. Oh, God. If he's this they wait for a week when you're having a beach orgie day. Yeah, really. Yeah. For me, Ron, 36 hours. And I was going to die.

I it was painful, painful. I think, Dr. Ock, I think that you could probably avoid Freddy for seven hours and a week's time period. I think you could do that. Longest for me, I had when I was younger as a teenager, I had a chronic and I had a chronic issue called the late sleeps in drum. So I had been able to stay up like over 50 hours. Wow. But again, I wasn't very, very bad. When I went to sleep, I probably would be easy pickings.

There was I remember watching and I might have been on 60 minutes. A condition that this guy had where he could not sleep. Like he could not fall asleep and he eventually died. I mean, they sort of chronic they chronicled this on video. And you just see him laying there. And this was a young man, maybe in his 30s or you know, in his 30s, I want to say just a lump in a wheelchair in the on the last day of his life just because he could not sleep.

And you and you pointed this out earlier, Dave, they always say the things you need for life or oxygen, you know, food and shelter and and new clip, but what they don't love also need rest, right? Yes. Body has to recharge. That's how your body heals itself. That's how your body recharges. And again, to the point that you made earlier, that's why Freddie Krueger, you can just like you said, you can just not go to crystal lake. You can just not go to haven't feel, but you have to sleep.

Right. That's what makes Freddie to me so scary. My first glance at Mr Krueger and this would have been the first one I saw on a theater was four. So this would have been before that.

And it definitely would have been a video store rental for me. And I would have known about the movie for sure. And I would have known about Freddie Krueger at that point. You could not have gotten to 1988 anywhere over the age of seven and not known who Freddie Krueger was. You just couldn't have done it because he was everywhere at that point. Exactly.

I'll try probably rented the film at some point. My mom was one of those moms that was like, you know, as long as you don't kill anybody else or you know, as a latchkey kid, as long as anybody else, as long as you don't. Well, I remember that was. If you're going to kill kill within the family, that's right. If I was on you don't kill someone, you know, or get arrested, do what do you want to do? I don't care. So I was free to rent whatever I wanted to rent at times we had HBO and or cinematics.

So I would have probably seen this on video. And I remember it was the one thing it's the first film, but it's the one I remember the most vividly, actually like frightening me as a young person. And the scene that really did it was Tina and the body bag. Yes. Yeah. And to this day, like that seems still I watched this today. Yeah. Like a couple hours ago. And that seems still is freaky to me. I have met Amanda Weiss on several occasions. She is a lovely lady.

We talk about Salem. She's awesome. But that scene of her in the body bag freaks me out. Oh, yeah. And especially with the with the bugs, I was listening to the commentary on the blue ray that I have. And they actually had to bring in an insect Wrangler because West Craven is like, I wanted to be all sort of, you know, with bugs and gooey. I wanted to be like really. I wanted to really pop. You know, I don't want to just standing there in the bag.

So they had they actually had what and the guy I think one of the producers was telling the stories that I didn't even know there was things like an insect Wrangler. And this guy came in and showed us all these examples of these insects that we could use. And we got to pick and choose, you know, what ones were we're going to actually have in the scene with West Craven was on the commentary. Which do you know which commentary it was Dave like that was not it was there were two of them.

It was the one that had a whole group of people they'd be introduced and then they'd say something. They weren't commenting on the movie. It's not the one there's also one with West Craven John Saxon, which is magic now because neither of them with us anymore. Yeah, I've that's the one that I have. Okay, I have that one, but this second one for a laser disk. That's how I recorded it.

Yeah, it had the producer. It had a several of the producers. It had Robert Che. I guess I guess I'm guessing Linché's husband or brother. Okay, I knew there was some relation obviously with Linché. That's what you said in this movie. Yeah, then you have the I want to say like a production or the guy who did suck decoration. And a lot it had maybe I'm going to say maybe 10 to 12 people in this commentary.

And it had Amanda Weiss and it had Heather Langing camp and they would just they just say Heather Langing camp who played, you know, nant. And then they go in that she start talking and they say Amanda Weiss played team and then she start talking. They introduced the name and the character each time. And then they would just start discussing the movie. And what's that?

This is what the movie was playing while the movie was playing. Yeah, it is a commentary track on the blue race. So yeah, because there's a documentary called Never Sleep Again that I also have that discusses me with the franchise. And it has. Yes, it has almost all everybody from the franchise and the documentary as well. I'm just seeing except Johnny Depp. I can't remember if he's in and they're not. I don't think he's in it. But no, this one did have.

It was a really surprised you though if Johnny Depp wasn't it? When it depends on when the DVD was made. Now I probably wouldn't be a surprise. But if this was done during the Pirates of the Caribbean days or something, yeah, I don't think this is the guy who shows up as Jack Sparrow and stands on the ride at Disneyland. Right. And he would he would tell they do it. He probably would. He probably would. And they did have Ronnie Blakely was also one of the ones that was part of this commentary.

And and would chime in how she got the role. You know, she she used to be married to director of inventors. And she was talking about how the inventors old assistant contacted her and said, hey, there's a movie they're making. And I think you might be good for one of the parts. And that's how she got the part. Very interesting. It's a very interesting commentary. We should mention to the listeners as well if they don't know this. They probably already do if it was in this podcast.

But if they don't know this, this is Johnny Depp's first film ever. Yes, it is. They have introducing Johnny Depp. And you can I'm going to be as you can tell it's his first film ever. Do you think I do. I don't think he's bad. It's just early Johnny Depp and he's not you know, he will give better performances. Yeah, he's been a regular type. Yeah.

Well, he's basically he's basically let's be honest. He's playing the and and I'm trying to figure the best way to say this without like offending anybody. He's playing the what would be normally the woman's role in the relationship. I mean, this is one of the things that I thought was really fascinating in this was West Craven when he made swamp thing.

He said his daughter gave him hell saying dad women do not fall down when they're running straight. Why are you having these women falling over when they're running straight because the swamp thing is coming after them. And he started to think about it. You know, that's right. I mean, I and he start to think of women's roles in all of these movies.

The final girl and all this stuff. He did not want to do that with Nancy and when you look at it Nancy is the strongest character in this movie and even stronger than John Saxon because she's going after Freddy. You know, she's she's not like saying I'm so afraid. I'm so afraid she's like no, I'm going to fall asleep and you stay you stay here.

And if you see me struggling you wake me up and that's seen I'm I saw it again and I've seen it so many times but it really hit me today where they're sitting there and she's like Glenn you bastard. I give you one job. Stay awake. Shit head. Why didn't you that was and then she smacked around a little bit. Yeah, right. It was it was a really.

And that's the role Johnny that was playing in this in this movie. You know, and you she said and even later she's like well, you know, I want you to take this guy out for me. He's like how she's like you're a job. Do you have a baseball bat or something like that.

She's she really is a very strong character and that was done by design by West Craven. He's like I did not want just another girl who's going to fall over when she's being chased by when she's way ahead and being chased by somebody just going to fall over for no reason. Yeah, that's what so great about this film. I think West Craven it's a really, really strong strongly written film well, it's one of the films that help create all those horror tropes that we all know and heart back.

Back to it this point like every horror movie that comes out now are either playing with or against those horror tropes and assuming that we know of those, but this is one of those movies that help create those tropes at the same time also fighting those tropes, just like you mentioned Dave and the thing about Nancy throughout this film is.

You can see her character getting stronger as the film goes along and as she learns more and more about Freddy Krueger and what he's done in the past, which I should mention in this version of the film I hear it's different in the remake, which I've never seen, but in this version of a nightmare in the industry he's not a child molester.

No, he wasn't the original script right no one had to like make him just a child murderer when she's doing her commentary she is referring to him as a child molester in the commentary so that's how she sort of reproached that character I guess yeah, but it may have been that might have been the case when she read the original script it might have something.

Yeah, and I'm sure maybe you're going to get this run sorry, but like yeah, because I guess in California at the time there was a infamous child molesting case or something and they didn't want the film people to think that this film was exploiting that, but but honestly I have always thought of Freddy as a child molester even though that's not what they're pushing here, but he's I'd never have I've always thought he's just a child murder. I don't I don't think he gets.

Sessure out of that his character even throughout the entire franchise which we'll see as we go through these movies is all about playing with them enough I mean he'll make some sexual when you windows here and there, but it's all about playing with them enough to make them afraid and it's all about the murder.

That's how I viewed it in the past so I wasn't surprised to read that there's the bathtub scene for example like it's like in and in the tongue I'm your boyfriend now Nancy at tongue out of the phone scene but looking at later films J that that really out of place I mean that's something he would say in part four or five or six.

No I know but just looking at this film you know I see I see it in there yeah he's more of a boogie man character in this film than anything else I true but I but I could read I think you can read him as a perv. I mean if you're mind wanted to go that way J I'm not speaking. Well he doesn't seem wholesome I'll just say that he does not.

I would surprise you right if you if it came out that he was a child monster well I've never I've never stuck my hand up in between the gals legs in the bathtub with a knife knife fingered claw on what do you do with that? I have not got you haven't lived as Jay absolutely I know I need to get some Mr. bubble and get the work on that. It's not a scene right like it's just obviously no monster jaws for some reason but right.

I guess just to put a little more I think I was driven had done a bathtub scene in deadly blessing to now it's not vaccine it's not the same as that scene but I know he had a bathtub scene in that movie as well. It was crazy like and for that same scene that happened in the movie today it would probably cost more for that scene than it cost for the entire movie in Niamar Namshri to be made.

Oh yeah probably which is which is kind of crazy while we're talking about scenes I have this question written up what are gentlemen what are your favorite scenes in this film well I'll just I'll just throw it out there. This is very impressive and I would like to cite Dave Z something he said in our text chat and that's. It was something to the effect of maybe you guys can remind me that within every 10 minutes there's an epic or iconic scene that's pretty memorable.

Yes can I build upon that J please please go ahead so I took that comment that he made he said just for just for the record for those of us out there this is a 10 for 10 of 10 film for him. Yes you can be here tonight but he wanted to let that be known I wrote down what I thought were the iconic moments of this film that every horror fan probably knew. And I got eight so that's pretty close to every 10 minutes yeah let me let me let me read them off and see if you agree with me here okay.

I iconic moments I chose from this film Freddie in the alleyway with along arms chasing Tina in her nightmare Tina in the body bag Freddie coming out of the wall above Nancy. Glenn's death Tina's death Nancy in the bathtub the fun the phone tongue situation and then the exploration of the boiler room I thought were iconic horror moments that every horror fan probably knows and that's eight in the 90 minute film so that's pretty accurate actually Dave Z was pretty on it. I was thinking of.

I like the dream sequence in school with Nancy when she falls asleep in the first time she sees that body bag and it gets dragged away yeah yeah I like that scene quite a bit but I would have to go with with Glenn's death when I think of this movie that is the first scene that when I'm one mentions this movie that's the first scene that pops into my head is is Glenn's death.

And they were talking why can't remember if it was the production manager who it was in the commentary was talking about it that there was obviously a guy standing on a platform underneath and I want to put his arms up and pull down the problem was the TV hit him in the head house.

So he ended up with a you know bump on his head or something and by the way that was a sweet ass TV for 1984 not bad yeah yeah I don't know why but I've forgotten his line that Miss new to America is coming on and he was listening to his music and just watching the TV and his mother's like well how are you going to hear what they what they can test and say is like who cares what they say.

I was hilarious yeah I'm of course and he was doing all that to try to stay awake as well the music and the TV but right but yeah that guy could never stay awake no matter what you did he could never stay awake right yeah he's me I mean I'm I'm not I'm almost have all narcolepsy like that too but you know why our podcast episodes run long k falsely halfway through the mind of the way we have to somehow what we just we sit here sit around waiting from the wake up that's right no the blood guys are seen is just incredible.

That is mind blowing and yeah Tina Tina's death scene up the wall and around the ceiling is just I mean the first time you see that that is just who and then it's not a knife in the gut like Jason or Michael Myers right right it's this drawn out Amanda weiss does an amazing job I think in that scene she does yeah she drawn out scene that really this makes you kind of cringe but it's really good.

And when you see those four just wounds appear in her chest like like his glove just absolutely ripping her open I mean like whoa I mean that that was it's pretty intense and of course the boyfriend he's pretty much done I mean if if what happened to him in the jail cell didn't happen that guy might have gone to the electric chair absolutely he never committed I be beat up because who else could have possibly done it in the eyes of anybody else.

Yes, how can you prove it differently you cannot there's no way right right and then the last one I was going to say for me is yeah when when he's stretching out of the wall above Nancy out of the bedroom. Yeah, that that is nightmare fuel I still think that looks scary. I agree I agree and this is all this is obviously all practical and it looks amazing.

Yeah, but they did in this movie they look amazing they really do. I don't love don't love the long arms though I'll say that you got well the long arms now look now they look you know you could see the effect. I bet you looked if he in 1984 to be probably on my day for film though in a dark alley yes yes because it's so unnatural I mean the arms don't look like that in the first place so of course they would look. I know but I'm just saying it looks it looks a little.

Another effect another effect that I never noticed I noticed for the first time this is the first time I watch the blue right because I've had it on DVD for years and years and I used to watch that all the time. First time I think I watched this blue right you can also the only other effect that I noticed is when the sheet is going around who was it was it ride.

Yeah, you see the metal in it you can see a little tip of the metal coming through the sheet as to what they used one and around and what's Craven said that was the most difficult effect they had to do he said he did that was the single most difficult effect in the movie was that particular one. There also was some insinuation in at least the cut that I watch which is again made for a later this I bought this box set back in like.

2006 I'm still watching I haven't ever rated that set I do have Freddie versus Jason and the different DVD set but the original seven are still in this box set some of the people on the commentary when I watch it a while back. Had an estimated that maybe in the original foam that little wire that you're talking about Dave yes wasn't visible but now with modern day technology and everything much more clear it's you.

It the same thing happened last time I watch Friday the 13th on 4k it was the first time I noticed you can tell that Kevin Bacon's neck is a different shade than his face. Yeah but still it's pretty good. It's a great scene and it's just these movies were never made to have that sort of clarity. No they were made for 1984 audiences my 19a for theaters right right.

And for the 4 that was probably a really good effect I mean there's a couple of things effects in this movie that maybe don't hold up to like 2024 standards but they're certainly not a gregus enough that it takes you completely out of the foam no none of it none of them do none of them do but at least not for me right now thinking of the mothers the mother's death later in the movie but that's fine.

But you know what I just that was like that was that was an oh shit moment for me when that happened just it just takes you like whoa you know and one of the interesting things is that West Craven said that what are the I wasn't once Craven it might have been I can't remember who it was in the commentary saying that what you can you can tell there in the dream world because there's like there's some fog going on.

And then you could tell when they're in the real world because it's clear there's no there's no Fox and when you see a little bit of fog that's your idea that they're in the in the in the dream world well obviously what is all around in that final scene. It's a fog yeah absolutely. Also the Freddy colored car the Freddy color is the hood goes on that yeah and you really because how could they all be alive again. The final scene in I want to discuss that in detail here in a minute.

I just want to mention that my favorite scene from the movie is what you mentioned before Dave it's the Tina in a body bag scene this is that one was so effective for me when I was younger but I also really enjoy Tina's death scene. And this record whenever Amanda was signs any of your any of your night and all three stuff she always signs her name and then and then Freddy's first. Wow nice.

I guess that's the place she wasn't because there was probably some off there was had to be some off screen stuff but Freddy's first on on all many way first going to yeah I thought you're going to say she signs it up in the corner of the picture upside down that would be cool. I will tell you this so I sent you guys earlier this today in the group chat picture I a ton of autographs from the night I'm not franchise all on one poster.

From all of the movies from from this this movie almost everyone in this movie all the way to Freddy versus Jason as I was getting the autographs Freddy rubber England was one of the last ones I could get because he's very very hard autographed to get.

He's expensive to when I understand he wasn't when I got him okay he is expensive now yeah I think $100 is what I hear I think it's more than that now wow now you're okay I mean he's going to have their an age right so yeah he's more in demand but one of the things that was really cool was when I went to actors of the various films two three four five six. New nightmare Freddy versus Jason they all ask me has has Robert signed this yet.

And they all have the big spot for him right near his head on the poster just a picture of Freddy Krueger with the nightmare on street logo yes wow that they are not a big spot him to sign they showed a total respect to him. Yeah I think it was how the Langley camp was saying that that you know what was funny they were saying he was always he would get there 4 a.m. to get in makeup obviously for the day out.

Yeah one time I think he wasn't do one set date like he wasn't suppose but he showed up and he was at the craft table and security came over and said was going to throw him out because they didn't know who he was. Yeah he had to tell him yes I'm in this movie because nobody had seen him without the makeup so when I finally got to Robert England and he saw my my poster was have been signed by many of the other actors doing his response was.

No he says to me he goes you got a lot of fucking things was on this thing. Yeah I'm having a work on this for a long time. Yeah nice nice but does he said did he sign it in any special sort of way. He wrote sleep kills Robert England. Right right near his head where everyone left him space to write cool before we get into reviews and things I want to mention that while there were different directors and writers for most of the series.

I believe that this film this this franchise as a whole does a really good job of like following the lead of the first film. Because in this film for example we get our first batch of Elm Street kids even though not really called Elm Street kids just yet. So we don't have that Elm Street storyline just I don't I don't think we get that until the second movie. But these are Elm Street kids right and there they have no siblings in a common thread is they usually have shitty parents.

Yes and in this movie like we see you know Ronnie Blakely Nancy's mom is an alcoholic we see teeness mom is basically white trash. A sort of a we'll break that streak in nightmare five but that's way down the road so we get these templates for these characters and thankfully I think throughout the remainder of the franchise the writers kind of respect that notion that Elm Street kids have no siblings.

Elm Street kids have shitty parents and Freddy Krueger is out to kill the Elm Street kids and revenge for what their parents did to him until we to a point where there are no more Elm Street kids and then we take a whole toy different direction in the franchise to the strand of some.

Well let's be honest this is a story for a different tree different podcasts so this this viewing of the movie I really noticed that more than previous viewing just because I was kind of looking for that because I see the movie I don't know a dozen times at least probably more than that. So you're looking for you know different things every time you watch the film where you're looking for your favorite scenes do we want to go into reviews and your ratings of a nightmare on Elm Street 1984.

Yes but can I ask you guys a question about this because this is something I wondered there are some really cool things happening with the rules in this film which I love like when she's able to come back. And grab his hat and bring it back into the real world that's really that was another thing I was going to mention and I totally forgot the intervention of dream powers.

Yes which are prominent throughout the rest of the franchise but we get them here she's the first one right so I'm sorry go ahead Jay yeah that's super cool but like for example when she burns her arm on that hot pipe in order to wake up.

So that tells us okay pain you know she caused herself pain in order to wake up so it's a little striking logically if you think about it okay wouldn't they wake up when they're being killed because presumably that's painful as well is it only self inflicted pain you can wake yourself up but if Freddy's taking you out then you're not going to wake up.

I was taking the same thing actually with the bathtub scene because she was coming out and screaming for her mother who did run to the door but still kept being pulled under. Yeah which we should mention is the only nude scene in this particular film I don't know what she had her like. Yeah the lady was nude she was the director of photography.

She's girlfriend or something yeah so like the underwater scenes yeah okay like if you paid a lot of attention the girl who's pulled underneath the water is much more upper level gifted than having like in campus. Okay. She's busty which I really only noticed when I watched it with commentary because have everyone can't point it out to be to be fair. Interesting. So Jake you want to go ahead and give a wrap up and review sure for this one.

Yeah absolutely thank you well I think in addition to the iconic character the iconic knife glove prop we also have one of the most iconic horror scores I mean that theme music to this. Yes thank you for mentioning that. Yeah it's incredible so so in terms of horror history I mean I can certainly respect and appreciate the importance of a nightmare on Elm Street. I think this is very well done and especially for a first entry in 1984 supernatural slash or film this is a scary movie.

And this has a lot of even as an adult like revisiting it last night as I did I was thinking you know this has got a lot of freaky stuff in it I really respect it because like you said I guess I love that you both hit on the body and I've seen today because I had never I don't know if I had never but I just don't remember it striking me the way it did this time.

And so that that actually kind of was creepy. The last thing I'll just say that's kind of cool that I don't think I've ever picked up on before about this movie is. It's interesting the boiler room. Hell slash Satan iconography and I bet there's some kind of if I were more well read like you guys you know maybe I could maybe this is Dante's inferno or something like that but.

I would have no proof that you can read I've never seen anything I'm like please do it I mean but it's funny because like she she has to go to send in to hell to try to get in and he's this red faced devil you know to defeat him I think that's all very cool now I know Dave Z said in his text that he appreciates the movie traps at the end I do feel like it has a little bit of a home alone vibe to it. Which is home alone with him around for 10 more years I know but but re watching it now.

You know what year did home alone come out what. I want to say 90 I want to say 90 yeah I think it's well. I was in college and I remember getting a video of it and I actually. Did a little edit of Kevin going after the the when the guys were trying to obey the house and what he was doing to them I cut some I just did some cutting of that on an editing in the in the online editing suite at the college.

So that would have been like 91 so I'm pretty sure the movie came out in 90 well then yes it's a sense this precedes home alone certainly this gets a pass and should not be docked at all for that so I will not dock it for that. But I will say there's a very cool stunt in here you guys it's a double stunt in that there's a person on fire and falling and rolling down the stairs it's like.

Yeah that that that had to be a good paycheck for that because that was something I really liked the fire footprints. Oh yeah very cool that was really cool as well. Anyways when you when you when you send the commentary Dave did you pick up anything about that fire scene the guy the stunt man who did it apparently does this is like a thing he catches on fire. I started the commentary late and I still haven't gotten to that part of the comment.

So I believe very well made but he put it on fire he went the stairs they put him out. Did they say on fire again and he rolled down the stairs I believe that that happened I can see that I can see that I can see that well yeah one thing that when you mentioned the score they did have a brief.

I guess conversation with the composer in this commentary he's only there for like a few like a minute or something just saying his involvement with the movie but then it goes into one of the producers I can't remember her name now. But while they were putting something together they were doing the cut they hadn't gotten the music yet they were doing the sound mixing is what it was.

She went into labor and went to the hospital well she gave birth and a couple hours later she gets a call saying that the composer the money for the for the score fell through the people they were who were going to provide the money for the score fell through. The composer is not going to turn it over he's only got half his money he's not going to turn it over to the rest of it.

And the guy's like can you call her and this one was like I gave birth two hours ago and he's like yeah but you can make a call can you so two hours after giving birth that she's laying in a hospital but she had to call the composer to negotiate getting the music for the first movie. Wow that's awesome. Alright well okay so yeah rating that that's where we are so yeah you said run today Dave Z told us it was a 10 Greg or more to says it's a 9. I say a night round on street is 8.5 out of 10.

Okay having revisited it and being very impressed with it yet again a new and I say this is yeah this is a buy and I only have this on DVD actually. I'm surprised I don't have this on Blu-ray and I I feel like I should so there you go. I also pick it up I would pick up at least a single if you're not going to get the whole set at least pick up the single Blu-ray.

Sure of it because of those commenters I'm looking forward to hearing the one with Westgraven and John Sachs and just because like I said that we they're no longer with us. That's one of the great things about when on physical media one of the great things you get with physical media are these audio commentaries. I have a little Mr. Roberts I had an audio commentary by Jack Lemmon and how many years has he has even passed on talking about the whole move.

And that's you know one of the great things about this is we have that forever now we can always go back and hear these these artists who are no longer with us talking about their art and what they you know what they put into it and stories and everything else. And so since you gave his really dof shock you want to go and to yours. Absolutely for me it's I'm going to probably I'm going to say nine I was leaning toward 9.5 I'm going to go 9 out of 10.

The one thing that buys me I'm not the only one who broke this up when the late scene where Nancy's on the phone with her father and she says in a half hour break down the door and arrest this guy. I'm going into the dream world to bring him back that should have probably come after she was booby trapping the house because there's no way she could have done that in 20 minutes. All the booby trap she was setting that probably would have taken a couple years.

I heard you that that should have come after that I would have thought so that's just a little bit that that it doesn't bother me it takes nothing away from the movie. But it's just I'm thinking that probably should have come after that it's they should have shown her. Maybe it takes a little bit of a movie that's how I think they aren't you the fastest booby trapper. East of the Mississippi. Yes, but I still it's not that we're doing grab her he didn't take all of that.

Yeah, so but but still yeah a nine out of 10 absolutely pick it up pick it up on on blue ray and again if you don't want the whole set which you probably.

I think it'll be where I don't have that blue ray set they came out I don't have that yet but I do have the first one on blue ray and it is absolutely we're picking up it has other special features on it that I haven't gotten to yet I was just making way through this comment I was so fascinated with what they were what they were talking about with that that I haven't.

I think it does I think it absolutely does and I'm with Jay I think there are definitely moments in this where it's it's still it still works as West Craven intended. He said in the commentary that the first audience to see this was at the lab there were like 20 people at the lab where it was processed who got together and watched it and he knew from their reactions which scenes he needed to tight not he said he was watching their heads.

When they all jumped at the same time he said okay that's seen works when just a few and a few and like it was sort of like he said okay I've got a tightness seen up a little so he watched that audience in the processing lab and that's how he knew how he had to like.

He said at one point I can't remember it was who told him this I can't remember it was Sean coming him but he said somebody told him nothing will ever look better than the dailies and nothing will ever look worse than your first cut. That's there wow and that's kind of how he was approaching it so even from just that initial viewing at the processing lab he knew what he had to tighten up a little bit.

So for my rating and this is the world exclusive right here previously I have scored this movie on previous podcasts a nine out of 10 just like most of you. Today after watching it I have decided to bump this up to nine and a half out of 10.

The reason that I had at nine out of 10 was to two fold one the ending I think kind of takes away from it you really have to stretch your imagination to fit it in with the rest of the franchise when we talk about that here in a second and I'm not the biggest fan of Heather Lagen camps acting. I've heard that from others too.

I'm still not the biggest fan of Heather Lagen camps acting but upon rewatch I think that could be over shadowed by just seeing how tight this script is every scene means something and means something important in the film. And I was just impressed by that on this viewing that I decided to bump it up another half a point to nine and a half out of 10 let's talk about the ending a little bit and then we'll do a little bit of trivia. Okay and then I have a question for you at some point as well.

Like I go ahead and work right now let's do not it's it's regarding West Craven so if it's if it's okay to do it now. I am the worldwide expert on West Craven obviously. I know I know friends of mine I have met his ex wife Mimi Craven who was in this film as the nurse at the sleep clinic. Oh okay that was that was what's Craven's wife okay at the time was his wife and then they divorced and I met her at a convention a week after he passed away.

Well I guess my question was back in the day on the resurrection of zombie seven podcast when you did your the horror. Dang it what is that called Mount Rushmore of horror okay okay was West Craven one of your heads on that because the reason I asked looking over his filmography because of course he's the writer director of this film I don't know why I it's not like I forgot but I just I haven't taken the time.

Lately maybe ever to really appreciate all the horror cinema that that dude put into the world and how most of it is very strong.

So I just wondered if he was one of your four heads absolutely because like we just mentioned in this film and you don't really realize this and how you've watched a bunch of horror it has some of the horror tropes because it helped create those tropes without you know without bowing down to tropes that came to it previously like kind of sitting in the face of those same

tropes so it's kind of twofold I do believe I have to look at the actual articles that I wrote about Mount Rushmore and for the listeners that are listening and for Doc Shach who I don't think knows about this when I was on the

resurrection of zombies having podcasts on our website zombies having that comment still there for you to go look I reached out to a bunch of people who had been on the show to submit what I would consider the Mount Rush what their versions of the Mount Rushmore of horror was right so that would be like your top four horror people whether it be fictional villains or like directors or producers or actors or what are you going to be I believe West Craven was online.

Yeah mine was good to I'm just saying everybody's was good it's not hard to take for people that was fascinating and I love doing that so thank you.

Yeah it was fun to do there was a Halloween where I was getting into the West Craven movies that I thought I hadn't seen before there was one that I thought I thought man I really got to watch this and it was the people under the stairs and as I'm watching I said oh wait I think I have seen this one before I just don't know that I've ever seen it all the way through but things like what was it the

serpent in the rainbow just some really really master of the screen series this cream yeah awesome the left from the 70s absolutely and the hills have eyes. Is a great one do you mean do you mean rad to because this is the hills I'm not about the hills have eyes part to which was rad to I'm just saying but yeah the first hills have eyes. That was the might have been the first movie where I don't have a flashback nice nice.

So before we sound the trivia I do want to talk about the ending of this one because it is really kind of a mysterious and weird ending so the the basis of the film plays out and then the very end scene after you know in part of my nine out 10 original rating of this was because I thought the ending was a little

weak like Nancy defeats Freddy despite turning her back on him which again is another staple the franchise that starts here of course later on we learn that you know Freddy gets his power from fear and the main reason he brings Jason into the fold later in the

franchise also uses that against him at some point that's a big theme throughout the entire franchise so wasn't this bothersome this time it is I think for a guy who's created so much havoc in the movie and for a guy and again we should mention this isn't the traditional like if you're thinking of Freddy Krueger in your head the makeup he has in this movie if you haven't seen it and why haven't you seen it you listen to this podcast is not the traditional makeup that you're

thinking about I'm guessing everyone who's listening right now has has seen this movie and they're like oh my god it's not the feta Krueger that I that I remember because the pop culture of feta Krueger looks looks pretty if he's a little thing that a little bit he's still pretty gnarly but like Jack Sparrow and the later Pirates of the NBA movies right he's Disney pretty right yeah Freddy Krueger's never Disney pretty but he's a little

cleaned up a little bit later in the films I think probably just for the sake of of a VEs and putting on his makeup apparently a dispute between what's cravin and Robert shea who was producing the film about how they wanted to end the film because what's cravin's ending was pretty dark I mean it survives but everyone else dies Robert shea one of the happier ending and probably also at this point you know we had a couple of Friday movies to couple Halloween movies he's probably looking at

franchising this because that's what the 80s were good for right franchises of slasher film. There was a compromise between them where after Nancy defeats Freddy. She goes out into the day and it's a it's a sunny day and she's wearing wide and her mom comes out even though her mom has passed have been killed by Freddy and she's wearing white and as Wes Craven says in one of the commentary tracks Dave it's like a tampon commercial right. This long you ever get that not so fresh feeling.

It's kind of what it looks like but as I think was shared I mentioned this or maybe was you Dave I'm not the mentioned earlier there is fog yes that kind of insinuates that maybe this is not on the up and up and it might be a dream thinking yeah that that's that's what I took it as because the mother you know

when Ronnie Blakely the mother even says it's going to burn off it's going to be a beautiful day when it burns off and they said that what did what the line of said was when there's fog it's the dream world when there's when it's clear it's not so I think was Craven maybe was given the happy

ending but did that did it for that reason is what I'm thinking is like that's not really happening I don't think you have to think I think it's cannon I think this was a dream from Nancy that was that was like a good dream it turned into having a bad dream but still was a dream because I'm so the cannon the rest of the film is those those characters are dead they don't come back I didn't even

know it was a question you guys I I think it's it's clearly a dream to me because he says at the very end to Freddie you know I want my friends back I want them back and then I'm turning my back on you so I could see where some people like oh she got her waste they're all back but no it you know it's definitely it's definitely a

dream yeah even the first time I've ever seen when I was a kid and I first thought when the the drop top goes up and it's the sweater colors oh yeah like that's that's your clue you're like the most hideous car with all time Christmas colors right you're like this is absolutely a dream and you know because he's not in you know it's I like how when they brought him into the real world in this movie he was vulnerable she's hitting him over the head with with with

like glass and and he's set them on fire and then she's tripping he's looking a little bit more like ghost face when he's in the real world and he was obviously I call yes he's a dude right exactly because now he's just a regular guy which which is one of the we'll get to it when we get to the second one why would he want to come into the real world why would I would draw him out I don't think that you know he wanted to you I think he was forced

to because her power she can draw things out of a dream oh no she did and this movie he was pulled out there's no doubt she pulled him out in this movie because she found that she could he was not looking to because you know he his with his world is the dream world that's where he is he's like a god I mean he can he could be chasing you

then you're running and then he appears in front of you again I mean you know he can do whatever he wants in the dream world well the second the second maybe is a little bit of homosexual anomaly we get to that later half of this particular podcast so it's a little different than the rest of the

films isn't quite fit in the I mean you can make it work in the canon but isn't quite fit in the canon the real quick though I want to just clarify something are there people out there because I was not aware of this are there people who are you that that ending is

literal and not a dream I'm not that I've heard I've not heard people saying that I've not heard anybody say well she got a wish and everybody's back alive I think the minute that that hood goes up and you realize it's the colors of Freddy's never end of cars

like locking them in and speeding off with nobody pressing it and then the mother getting pulled through the window I think I think there are people who are doing it but I don't think anyone truly believes it is why I never heard that or anything because yeah the car has dead people in it or people

who should be dead yeah like I it's just anyway sorry I'm just astounded by that if that's the case plus this this franchise has pretty good continuity from one from one movie to another so if those characters were still alive in some some way we would see them

right yeah and they're not always and anti mentions in the third film that her mother's dead right well in as with that ready I think she also mentioned Freddy killed her friends I believe she mentions that yeah oh yeah no there's no way it was you know I clearly was not meant to be a literal scene or or even you know that that that was West Craven's idea of giving them that happy ending absolutely and as with many many horror films that last you know that last moment of the film to show you

that there is still a threat there is still horror existing it just shows us that Freddy is still still at it so to speak and she is still facing him in dreams so right right so before I'm gonna I'm gonna throw some trivia you guys but before we get to that I did I did write in in capital letters on my notes and I took four pages of notes on this film if I'm I've seen like probably few thousand times before I'm sorry I'm just I just want to throw this in here real quick

do you think maybe in the dream if that that being in the dream world that Freddy gave her her friends back to bring her fear back to the forefront and her mother back because when she loses the fear she's lost everything you know Dave I have never considered that but that is a very very interesting and logical take on that she said she wanted them back he gave him back in the dream world is like okay now I can scare her again absolutely that's in them that is a really

good take on that that's really cool if West Craven were alive to confirm that I might even bump this up to a dead I don't even know I have a story with him on it he did not mention that but maybe you know with maybe maybe that's not what he maybe he just this is just his idea of okay I'll give a happy ending but I'm still gonna mess everything up but if you may hear it he may miss him exactly like what you just said yeah he was but now she's back with her friends she's gotten

everything she wanted back her mother standing there beautiful day hey I can scare her again now but but however it's not it's not like she lost everything because she still had her own life she had her own life but she was but she she had gotten so pissed off by that point that she's like I'm taking this guy down myself and she's like I but and but now she want she's back with her friends and everything now she's got something to lose again yeah and what Dave's

thinking to hear Jay and you could you could speak this because you're a father is you get to a point with your own life where you're like you know you know kill me or don't you don't frighten me anymore you're not you're not a concern of me if you're gonna kill me do it I don't even care anymore at this point but Jay as a father I'm not I'm not a father so I'm I'm leaning on you okay you I'll be either if you guys at that

point but somebody put one of your kids in danger that changed the situation am I am I wrong sure yeah the famous saying is when you have kids your heart runs around outside of your chest right so that's a really interesting theory because since Nancy was no longer scared of Freddy which she may quite clear in the last scene of the traditional part of the movie by being in her friends and her mother

back at least in their in her dream he now has people to threaten that will frighten her yeah well I respect it and Dave that's very creative read of it I just think if they're they're gone and in their back gone and back because because it's like why would you be afraid if she's in but she's she's she's in a back again she might be dreaming right you know she's she could be and she's having a conversation with her mother and

there's her friends picking her up in the car but she is everything that happened was a dream yeah she isn't Freddy's domain again he's like okay let's give her everything she just she said to me when she says I'm not I'm not afraid of any more I want my friends back he's let's give him back and then let's see she reacts when I when I when the cargo's driving off and nobody's actually controlling yeah that's a super

interesting theory and I'm a good body else post that I need to make agreed so you're saying Dave that maybe he just tried to restore her life as if none of this horror actually happened to her yes if he can scare her once again that's really that's one thing I have no idea of West Craven was even

thinking that that just came to me I don't even know that he he he might have been so far from that this might have just been him saying here's your happy ending screw you yeah it definitely was a compromise with Robert

Shay but I'm but man I really want that to be true day he would because that's so great that would be interesting really cool would be interesting great so I want to tell a little story real quick before we're getting some little bit of trivia here anyway so this story involves Joseph whip who plays

this sergeant in this film just first the answer to Lieutenant John Sachsen this movie he also went on to be the sheriff in scream so I got to meet him I've met him a couple of occasions and I took a group photo with the cast of scream at some point during the convention but he wasn't involved when I left the photo area he was sitting on a couch but I said on next to him I started talking to him first of all he said that he and West came up with a story where his character in Nightmare No.

Street got fed up with all of the Freddie nonsense and then moved to a small town and then all the stuff in Woodsboro happens oh wow that's cool even without the same character it's kind of a cool story that him and West came up with for his character that's really cool but also I ask him I said well what's the biggest difference with him working on the set of Nightmare No.

Street and and then then working on the set of screams I think you're the only person that did it though then West Crackin and he said catering he said I mean I was here with so low budget and West Craven wasn't as well known yet they were basically eating baloney sandwiches but time he got to scream West Craven was so well respected in the Hollywood they had like five star meals at the catering booth like every night.

Nice wow there's a little extra trivia there for you that could only be gained by talking to Joseph Whippen person that's great that's cool all right so I got six really quick trivia questions for you if you guys know the answer is just like yell the mall we won't keep score anything

okay good because Dave will crush me at everything so first first question just before Glenn dies he's watching television on his super sweet portable TV for 1984 and the station he's watching goes off of the air with TV stations did back in the 1980s yes and it gave the call letters of the station what were the call letters of the station it's called Kruger it's Kruger something KR it's KRG KRUG it's something close to Kruger sorry it's right it's KrGR KrGR it's without the vows very cool

and PS the way that that that ends this is a little Billy Joel tie in here you guys because yeah that's how I know state because this Billy Joel related oh there you go Billy Joel yes when when when TV yeah when the TV stations would end they would play that

you know the national I remember watching what you get you get that at the beginning of poltergeist but I remember that happening I remember being weak and then happening it's it's kind of creepy and it really is kind of creepy it's a good idea cut off from the world

and then it then it goes to snow but but what's cool is Billy Joel's song sleeping with the television one opens with that which is super cool so everybody look it up yeah well that like that I love no no with that the playing of it it sounds exactly like the the soundtrack but you know what you hear in the film it's exactly the same and then it starts into the song so I thought when I saw this again I'm like oh they're going to play Billy Joel's song but they don't so it's like

it's a trivia question okay at one point in the film Nancy goes to a sleep clinic to get tested while she sleeps her doctor in this scene is a doctor by the name of the doctor king the actor who plays the doctor is the voice of a famous cartoon character what cartoon character is this one doc you got this well you got this famous cartoon character is it underdog this not underdog no underdog group the 60s droopy really I'm just guessing no I was going to get a group he goes

back to the 50s and oh yeah I'm taking cartoon character it's not that old not a lot of it is not a camping cave man okay I was waving a hand the cartoon character debuts in the 80s so was maybe a smirk is it pop a smirk Lionel doctor king is played by a guy named Charles Fleischer he's the voice of Roger Rabbit oh interesting only when it was funny I love I love Roger yeah so we mentioned earlier in this podcast that West Craven shop this around

for about three years new lion cinema was not the first production company the show interests do you know the first production company that was willing to show interest in his script these are hard questions was it paramount it was not

paramount would he have been a universal monster no think more Roger Rabbit oh okay dream wonder brothers Disney Disney was the first company show interest one of the changes if obviously he said no I'm gonna do it my way so I think we're good here and thankfully for us that's yes that would that

would be that would be interesting I have confidence you guys get the next one though famously this is Johnny Depp's first movie famously Johnny Depp showed up at the auditions not willing to audition he was going to be a rock star at the time right he was just accompanying a friend of his who was going to audition for the role of Glenn and ended up getting the role getting asked the audition and then getting real because West Craven star if I thought he was cute was it

Charlie Lachin who was no it was Jackie Earl Hailey it was Jackie Earl Hailey yeah that one that one I remember very cool because why Ron why is that significant to this franchise Ron because Jackie Earl I play Freddie Kriger in the yes I think that's like Kelly and bad news bears and I

remember that's that's all I will always think of him as Kelly and even though he's been in in other I mean he was great was that was the movie little children I think he was that he was really great in love it yeah love it he's a he's a really strong actor but yeah the old Kelly it's so I only have six so this is the scene that we spoke of earlier where Glenn gets killed and a waterfall blood comes from his water bed straight up was inspired by another scene from a

famous horror movie you know the scene the blood guys are well what how is this not this was mentioned in the commentary by West Craven by the way that's why I was probably that's a commentary I did not see yeah I feel bad for not knowing that some sorry you could probably make a straight line to the if you guessed you you have a good try getting it I'll help you the movie came out 1980 a blood guys are 1980 1980 okay it's like a Friday a lot of blood came out of

a certain item in a movie okay oh the shining the elevator and the shining absolutely correct and the last one a pretty famous horror director who was mentioned on this podcast previously in this episode directed without credit some of the second unit shots because West Craven helped him on his

famous horror film with some second unit shots do you know who this director was Sean Cunningham is Sean Cunningham good job that's it to them are Sean Cunningham produced last house on the left also yeah that's there we go you got it there we go that is my horror trivia for

nightman umstreet and I believe we can comfortably say this is a very iconic horror movie a very inspirational horror movie I would guess there's a ton of horror movies that drew a ton of inspiration from this film and the first of our retrospective of nightman umstreet was turns 40

this year that is something that is that all the movies turning 40 this year or over the hill over the right right well you're now I guess legally middle age right yeah yeah and before we sign off I want to mention that one of my little tag lines for the podcast when I said we are the boiler room

asbestos of more podcasting so all of the scenes they shot in the boiler room were shot in a prison later condemned because all of those pipes that they shot around were full of bestos I believe it would I never heard school or school had as best of all I have a kind of an interesting

semi interesting trivia for you guys okay cool let's go it just so happens coincidentally I put on a nightman on elm street when DVD in the background sound off and I started it as soon as we started recording this is when you got married that's why you hate it what this is when you got married that's why you hate it no I got I got married in 2004 I'm not following you but anyways I put this on at the beginning of this recording this review and it just ended our mom was

just pulled through the door so well our review was the exact length of the film like the one you Blakely pulled through the door on you just this movie has two Oscar nominees in it I mean Johnny Depp eventually would be nominated for

an Oscar as Jack Sparrow and Ronnie Blakely was nominated for I want to say supporting actors for Nashville in 1970 let him out in 75 so I'm so I've met Ronnie Blakely and probably will never meet Johnny Depp probably not but yeah so two Oscar two Oscar nominees in this movie yeah pretty good for a

slasher horror film from the early 80s absolutely right up there with Texas Oscar four yeah well I guess that's correct yeah well though that one has two Oscar winners just for the record listeners so we're not telling you go check out Jane passes you know no no no as matter of fact I'm pretty sure neither is L. Wager nor McConaughey would tell you to go check out Texas James I think that you're correct yes yes so to wrap up at this particular movie in

this retrospective of the nightmare on Elm Street franchise this was the first movie the most iconic of the movies and probably will let's be honest will be the most well-reviewed of all of the movies I'm your host Ron Martin on behalf

of J. of the Dead Dave Dr. Shock Becker the Gilman Joel Robertson Mr. Watson Dr. Walking Dead Calabishup Greg Immortis Macula and Dave Z we all want to thank you for listening to the J of the Dead's new horror movies the animated bloody body bags of horror podcasting okay J the dead here don't shut off the podcast yet because it's not over we've still got a rip-roaring review of a nightmare on Elm Street two Freddy's revenge coming up in the same episode in just a few minutes but first a quick

little intermission here with something very important I promise it will be worth it then we can get back to all this Fred head stuff for all you Elm Street weirdos so this is J of the dead little under the weather it's my by voice sounds so sexy right now and I'm joined by my son spawn of the dead welcome so if people have been listening to my horror podcast for a long time this might be meaningful to you especially if you're a fan of horror movie podcast so

I have this thing about horror nicknames or the horror remaniker and it may seem silly to some people that we call each other things like macula or J of the dead or Greg Immortis but it's actually quite meaningful to me and I think to a lot of the guys even though we have fun with it and the thing is I have this weird belief it's especially important when a nickname has been given or bestowed by another horror podcaster one time I think when macula was first

talking about his name he mentioned how in the deaf community when you're learning American sign language I guess if I get this right mac sorry I hope I don't butcher this though actually give people their name like they make up the signs they represent their name that if I recall correctly so that's really cool and you actually there are a few places you can see this kind of thing so this isn't new or anything but it is something kind of cool that I think we

do anyways I just wanted people to know because this is kind of a special occasion that spawned at the dead here he received his horror moniker and a very legitimate way actually and it wasn't from me believe it or not it was bestowed upon him by another horror podcaster and while we haven't always seen eye to eye to say the least the horror podcaster that I'm referring to is one of the most talented people I've ever worked with and it was Wolfman from horror movie

podcast so it was it was Wolfman who deemed you I don't know if you recall this because you were quite you were much younger he deemed you spawned the dead and so you are the real deal with a legit nickname given to you from a legit horror podcaster I think that's awesome how old was I back then yeah you let's see your 16 now you were probably I think if I recall correctly this is so weird but I if I remember right we went to shark week at the theater there was a

shark week presentation we went with Wolfman and his kids and that's when he started referring to you as spawn of the dead which was super cool anyways this is a very special occasion as well because I've been calling spawn of the dead number 10 or horror vinger in training and all of that is true but I want to make it official this is the official inauguration so to speak of spawn of the dead as an official 10th horror vinger and to celebrate this and

commemorate this he actually has his very own specialty segment now here's the thing listeners most of us horror podcasters that you listed to on the show we're in our 30s 40s 50s right so you know and then we got 116 year old here and then Mac as well yeah yeah he's like 14 but see that's so funny you are now officially the youngest horror vinger but they're still gonna give Mac grief you know they will but oh yeah but anyways spawn of the dead he only

pops on once in a while he is still in training and I think he's doing a great job for sure but to quote Edward Walker in the village who do you think will continue the show this podcast do you plan to live forever it is in them that our future lies it is in spawn and macula that this way of life will continue so it is important to pass along what we do here to the younger generation for the days that I try up and blow away as a dusty shell of the last memories

yes mithereens anyways and by the way thanks to Ron Martin I want to give special thanks this is Ron's episode he's in charge of all this and he was kind enough to let us insert this here but we're not trying to crash the Freddie party there is a very cool coincidental reason while we're inserting

this segment into this episode on this date Saturday November 16th 2024 we'll get to that in a minute but I want people to listen in spawns intro music he and I wrote that together but I just want to point out the spawn of the dead is playing the electric guitar so without further delay let's move into it all right we're back spawn of the dead's PG 13 hormones it's for people that are too young for rated our movies okay and I chose this segment because if there's

movies that are notable or surprising to me that RPG 13 or if I think they should be or shouldn't be PG 13 yes so you'll be talking about some of the content if it's like surprising that it's an PG 13 movie yeah okay cool because yeah this serves as a little bit of a guide for people who are doing

some gateway horror or like we've done with you I've shown you certain horror movies along the way so this is an order yeah yes this will provide it okay and what else other PG 13 horror movies that are actually like scary mm-hmm actually good ones so you're in search of actually scary PG 13 horror

movies yeah yeah does such a thing exists you're gonna find out for us soon okay okay and and I'll be making a list of them and compiling it for y'all okay and then actually good horror movies they don't necessarily have to be scary but if I thought they were well-made yeah I'll be happy with those

two excellent I love this I honestly I'm very impressed that you're doing the segment and thank you for covering this because yeah we don't have a segment or we don't have any dedicated attention specifically to PG 13 horror movies in

fact infamously I often make some kind of like grumbling comment when it's a PG 13 horror movie and maybe I shouldn't do that because you're out to prove that you're under the impression that there are some effective PG 13 horror movies right yeah I feel that I have already seen multiple really good

actually scary PG 13 horror movies and recently too I'm with you I'm with I agree I agree actually yes so I'm being converted to that oh yeah okay so what is your very first horror movie that you're gonna review this PG 13 rated okay guys here it goes the movie is night of the comment okay so this is very interesting spawn is allowing me to chime in here and so I hope I hope people don't mind on that we actually did quite a bit of research on this yeah

and if you google it you will find incorrect answers if you use AI you will find incorrect answers so I just want to say with a great deal of confidence I think we're fairly I think we're 98% certain we have identified the very first ever yeah PG 13 rated horror movie that was released and that is the night of the comment now let me just back that up for a minute and I'll give a little history lesson if that's okay with spawn here yeah because I did prepare

some stuff people are familiar with this story so I won't go into it in depth but you know we had Indiana Jones in the Temple of Doom and Grimlands and those were initially rated PG but they were hugely controversial due to the content and those and that's when it was decided that okay there needs to be something in between our and PG okay and so the hence we come up with PG 13 and what's interesting is you know maybe the sticklers out there you could throw some

curveballs at us but trust me we've spent I bet at least two hours deep diving this and of course red dawn which is not a horror movie that was technically the first film released with an MPAA PG 13 rating and that was August 10th 1984 but the flamingo kid also not a horror movie that was the first

film to get a PG 13 rating however it sat on the shelves for five months before it actually ended up releasing so even though it was given a PG 13 rating before red dawn red dawn was actually out first now in terms of horror cinema I'm telling you folks go ahead and challenge us see if you can yeah set us straight because spawn and I are pretty confident on this spawn tell me if this is not what we found so of course night of the comet had a limited

release August 31st 1984 but it had its major wide theatrical release which by my standards on this show on my podcasts I judge by the first widespread release in the United States okay the first time that a film becomes widely available to be seen by American audiences and that was exactly 40 years

ago today November 16th 1984 which happens to be the 40 year anniversary not only of night of the comet but also of a nightmare on Elm Street these two films were released exactly on the same day because again nightmare as you heard at the top of the show it had a limited release November 9th but

November 16th was nightmare on Elm Street's wide release as well so that's why we are doing this today and we are celebrating both films they're 40 year anniversary I think that's the coolest coincidence don't you spawn and a lot of you guys really like nightmare on Elm Street yeah so and that's fine that's fine right yeah we we forgive you that's good that first one's definitely good yeah I mean if people want to throw we won't take a lot of time on this other

stuff but like somebody might say what about goalies what about goalies the Grimlands were above that was January 1985 just saying now it did show it's festivals like there was a loss Vegas screening on November 16th the same day but it wasn't wide so you see where I'm going with this so if you're ever in a horror trivia night spawn and listeners out there what is the very first PG-13 horror movie ever released what would you say spawn the Omen let's

wrong with you night of the comment that's right damn okay all right so go ahead I'll shut up now I'm sure people are sick of hearing me go for it we like you okay well thank you oh by the way my segment this time at least there'll be zero spoilers correct so there is a comment coming around like a milkman there's a comment coming around like a milkman so like your real dad like the milkman okay got you that's a joke that's a terrible joke Kyle Bishop please don't make

jokes like that yeah Kyle and it is a type of apocalypse end of the world scenario and when it happens something dangerous okay so what type of horror movie do we have here sort of a pocket-lipped zombie movie yes okay also

comedy horror right it's comedy horror because there's some jokes too so yeah the first PG-13 horror movie was a comedy horror film thanks Joel thanks a lot it usually is who was the writer director on this one again it was Tom Everhart that's right and in this movie there was a funny quote our main

actress Catherine Mary Stewart we like her yes lovely and she plays Regina yes there's something happens and she gets locked out of somewhere and she says I hate it when days suck like this yeah it's so awesome because it's kind of under her breath and she's walking kind of grumbling her delivery is just perfect also yeah think a lot of people might overlook that line but we yeah it's toward the beginning but we both just cracked up dying laughing that was

awesome okay and just to really dig deep into what horror genre this is I would say it's dystopian apocalyptic it can be seen narrative at times kind of it's a zombie movie but don't get offended other horror Avengers because it's a very specific kind of zombie and you might get offended I don't know yeah so let's talk about how these zombies work so so this there was something about this comment right yeah where it ended up pretty much wiping out much of the

population and turning them into kind of this red dust but our few survivors in order to survive they happen to be inside of some kind of yeah metal casing like one person slept in a shed so that person lived one person was inside of a film projection booth so that person survived but some of the survivors that are outside they're infected and they become these zombie freaks so they're kind of infected yeah of sorts right yeah I would say it's kind of like a cosmic

investigation okay not really not like aliens does it but kind of like a cosmic illness I'm with you and that that sounds right okay and I was thinking scientifically in a nerdy perspective this would have to be a certain kind of radiation okay wavelength to do that interesting because space things are usually radioactive to some degree oh well okay I haven't I haven't spent a lot of time with many space things so I wasn't aware of that but well not very many

people have the rear view and yet we are on a planet that is hurling through space at the very moment so we are space things in a sense in a sense yes not innocent what protects us from the radiation like the radiation of the sun yeah the atmospheric field yeah atmosphere and stuff so it's science and stuff that makes it do that so anyways you're funny no you so this is kind of a lower budget film yeah and by the way this is a Christmas horror movie oh yeah it's

great yeah a Christmas horror movie also put that on your list in case you forgot about that of course side note sorry yeah you're good there's actually a lot of freaky stuff they kind of surrounds comments believe it or not for example a real life horror story I remember in 1997 there was the hellbop comet which came around and there was this cult this religious group called heavens gate and those people believed that when the comet came by they were

gonna be picked up something to that effect I was actually a missionary I was trying to get people to join my religious group at the time well these people were getting people to join their religious group but I didn't promise anybody that they're gonna ride on any comments that day and very sadly they committed mass suicide in order to get access to the comet so I'm not making light of that horrible tragedy but I'm just saying the whole comet thing can really be

creepy yeah in the way that it affects humanity because we do get freaked out by that why it's just a rock or ice or ice or metals yes or metals that's right or some other alloy and then it's just going it's going it's and sometimes it's coming back again like do you know that I and probably most of

our listeners were around and aware of when Haley's comet last came by did you know that I don't know if you've even heard about Haley's comment all lots lots wow okay well I'm impressed yeah science dude it it okay science dude it appears every 72 to 80 years approximately and so the next time

it comes around because last time was 1986 that was when Mac was born in fact that's how Mac God here he was delivered by Haley's comment that explains a lot really that's what I was gonna say and then it will next appear in 2061 hey I might be alive for that you'll be alive for that but I'll be dead I think oh well let me just see real quick if I live to be 85 mm-hmm which I doubt you well maybe but if I do I'll be around for that and if you live to be 53 that's

not very hard isn't it okay anyways and then you'll get to see Haley's comment so anyways I don't know why we got on this comment thing I'm just saying comments are weird some point of the movie is about to comment so that's how and that's what made him in the zombies yeah oh we've come full circle let's go like Haley's comment and it didn't take us 86 years or whatever but the listeners are probably thinking it's taking us that long yeah all right just a few tips for

watching this movie if you decide to watch it which I recommend is I would say I didn't try this but Mountain Dew live wire might be fun for this kind of movie oh nice I feel like okay but also you got to have it on the rocks that's right or else it isn't worth it okay and then I would also watch it with a fun attitude not upbeat like you're going to a party but like be kind of open-minded for a movie like this yeah cuz comedy horror right yeah so but surprisingly do you

agree with you and I were really actually very entertained and having quite a bit of fun with this weren't we yeah I was having a blast yeah it's a really fun movie and I'm surprised at how much I appreciate this film yeah I feel the same way and me and Jay we love to think what would I do in this situation that's happening right now okay so if we talk about a certain movie that I'm thinking of yeah throw up okay the name is of the movie is good boy it's a horror movie

and not PG 13 it is not but awesome and that movie just oh my goodness that one flipped out spawn yeah his brain is still affected by the movie yeah kind of so I've seen a lot of things but that one that's a good one really got to me so that's a little bonus recommendation but it is rated are so anyway so maybe watch that at your own risk so bringing it back around then in terms of PG 13 I think there's only like one F word in this right yeah there's only one in that

F word is Fresno Frank Furtr it was falafel falafel and then some notes that I wrote down it's a fun watch entertaining I thought the atmosphere of the movie not only the feel of it but in the movie did you call it an app atmosphere oh I did you can make an app about space and call it

apnos apnos fear no apmosphere that's it I said I know wouldn't that be cool yeah because you know they did what's app yeah I know well you could do atmosphere what it be about well obviously all of your extensive comment knowledge especially

Haley's comment I know more than other space things since you're so well acquainted with Haley's comment even though I actually witnessed it all right so the atmosphere in the movie like the sky was neat and dystopian and red right shockingly unnerving it was just the sky mm-hmm yeah this is one of

those I'm reading in the trivia this film actually ended up coming together and it was kind of one of those little miracles where they didn't know how well it was gonna turn out overall and how much it was gonna be appreciated I'm kind of underselling all of that it's kind of a long story but I'm just saying it ended up being a serendipitous production overall and a lot of people are very pleased with this so yeah it's got a screen factory release and

it is a Blu-ray DVD combo pack collectors edition check that out I just wanted to know that there were some surprisingly dark parts in this mm-hmm for a comedy horror yeah it gets pretty dark I'll just say I mean I'm a guy who's usually kind of you know anti comedy horror I'm not really into it but this film was a lot of fun that's science so if you want a zombie type horror movie that's Christmas horror that's just an enjoyable good time and it's very very

characteristic of the 80s horror cinema if you want that mood and that feeling like I think for example macula speaking film I think he would really have a blast with this film oh yeah yes is a high recommendation should we get into the rating the movie night of the comment yeah yeah do you want me to go first and you bring it home okay yeah for me I'm coming in at a seven out of 10 and I I own this and the reason I purchased it for us for our family is because it

is the first PG-13 horror film and I think that's historically important and I want to don't it is worth owning but I think for most listeners out there I mean I'd call it a high priority rental now by the way the only place that it is currently streaming that I found is on Pluto at the moment so you can stream it on Pluto I think with commercials but yeah I ended up going ahead and buy in the blue right cuz I think it's worth it but what say you spawn to the dead I just

like to follow up to your latest comment as we're recording this it's November 2024 if you're listening to it a later date it might not be streaming on Pluto anymore like if you're listening to this in 2026 potentially or in 2061 and you're waiting for Haley's comment and you're like what the heck it's not streaming on Pluto right now yeah for me I would also say it's a whole octave higher and high priority by an octave so it's like night of the comments no you know because

high priority rental and then a whole octave up is high priority by I thought you move at music theory you you were hanging out with Kagan too much yeah maybe you guys in your octaves and your picker D thirds no no no no there's no octaves in ratings pretty soon you're gonna be like Mac and you're gonna be like this is a 4.29 Kelvin no so what do you rate it again no no it's not what I said are you saying nine out of 10 9 out of 10 great yeah that's what I've been saying so is

that a purchase for you yep high-bye a lot of high-bye okay all righty all right but this movie is called kind of comment that's right so yeah listeners if you've seen night of the comment recently when you get any comments on it let us know I didn't say any comments I said comments yeah spawn thank you this was your first I know a special segment do you have any teasers or do you know what sort of PG-13 horror film you're gonna be doing for your next segment no all right way to

prepare hey I prepared for this one I'll be just as ready next time that's awesome thank you and and welcome officially to the horror Avengers yes yes and by the way of people I don't even know if people know we have a website if you go to the website at new horror movies dot com and look in the show notes each horror Avenger has his own gravatar monster and spawn has his own gravatar now you guys should go see what it is that's right all you're gonna tease it like

that you're not gonna tell them it's gonna be a teaser but my only teaser but now but he chose it and it was his choice his monster and it was an excellent choice yeah thank you listeners for sticking around we got a night round on street two Freddy's revenge and we get pretty saucy we get we get some sparks and some fireworks talk to shock gets low wound up so we'll look for that someone is coming back to Elm Street he is not friendly he is not patient and he is not a welcome visitor

but he has something terribly special for the new kid on the block dad you've had some scary dreams okay hello everyone and welcome to Jay of the Dead's new horror movies the cannibalistic parakeet of horror podcasting my name is Fred head Ron Martin and for all of you Nymer and Elm Street deep divers you understand that is by the this retrospective series I'll explain it and with me tonight for our next entry and our Nymer and Elm Street 40th anniversary franchise retrospective is

the titular Jay of the dead hello I love being titular and Dave Dr. Shock Becker hello everyone and I just shuttered when Jay said that today we are continuing our retrospective look at the nightmare of street franchise celebrating its 40th anniversary here in the year of our Lord 2000 and 24 today will be looking at the second installment of that franchise and I'm going to treat to Freddy's revenge somewhat divisive in the horror community and we will be

spoiling this 39 year old film so if you have not seen it I don't know what you're waiting for it literally can be seen for free just about anywhere I believe you can see it for free on the YouTube's so without further delay let's move on to the show thank you for listening to Jay of the Dead's new

horror movies the podcast where we give our dogs human faces so of course after the success of Nymer and Elm Street new lion cinema this was by far their most successful film they wanted a quick follow up kind of cash in on the Freddy Kruger character absolutely wanted to push out a sequel very quickly and by this point we're in the mid 80s so horror sequels are kind of in right they're kind of the cool thing to do at this point so they get a script I think they

script out for a long time and if you ever go back and listen to my take on this movie back in the old resurrection of zombie seven podcast days I posit this theory that the Nymer and Elm Street 2 script was a script that they had purchased and was not originally a Nymer and Elm Street script and they just kind of shoved Freddy Kruger into this is a common thing my production companies do for horror sequels especially B horror sequels or like we when

you get really down the line like movies four or five so they don't lose rights the characters those sorts of things because this movie is a lot different than the other entries into the franchise a la hell razor right I hope you did that several times near the end of the run another one that's that's really famous for doing that is the howling franchise where was basically like oh it's the howling nine and here's a romantic love story but we're gonna throw some

werewolves in there yes other time they even got to number three it didn't have anything to do with that I think that was a strong one it was about marsupials though and that's yes that's great the wrong turn franchise also has has done this

but I've learned since I mean that was about 10 years ago that I covered this movie on that podcast my learn since then unfortunately you might see it doesn't even have that theory to fall back on this is actually a real idea that was written specifically for this movie and this movie isn't even the

first idea the first idea was like a Freddy's controlling the dreams of a baby but depending that because I'll come in to play a little bit later on in the later episode of this retrospective series so they end up with this script

written by a dude named David Chaskin and if you've ever wondered about Nimer on Street 2 I actually rewatched the 2010 Nimer on Street documentary never sleep again before this particular movie because there's a lot about this movie in that in that documentary and everybody who's

everyone is in that documentary so if you're an Nimer on Street fan that must see it's probably a must-own for you it's really well done and you learn a lot about Nimer on Street 2 in general and David Chaskin the writer of this secret film he's interviewed for that documentary so he explains some things that will probably get into a little bit later here so after the script is done they go looking for West Craven to direct because why not West Craven is a

horror genius he made the first film work he can make this film work West Craven takes one look at the script and says he had no way not doing this and I can't blame him he has some problems with this script so they move to a guy named Jack Scholder who had done a movie for them previous to this a horror movie at home man I can't remember it alone in the dark yes that's a good job so they offer this movie to him because he directed alone in the dark for them he doesn't

want to do the movie because he doesn't want to get Peg as a horror movie director but also you know he doesn't want to get Peg as a guy who turns stuff down so eventually he accepts the role of director for Nimer on Street 2 so now we have a script that's rushed a production that's rushed we have a

director who doesn't really want to direct the film and he was the second choice director so this movie is already off to a bad start and then when we get into the script we find out it doesn't really follow any of the rules that were set in the original Nimer on the street I will say this in its defense the rules of the franchise or at least the format of the movies as we know and love them hadn't really been created just yet I mean it was a little bit there

in Nightmare on Street but it would be solidified with the next film Nimer on Street 3 so this was kind of a free for all and we get like a Freddie possession so we're a film as opposed to Freddie killing Elm Street kids in their dreams this is even and these aren't even Elm Street kids at this point they're just kids that happen to move on to Elm Street had the bad luck to move on to Elm Street when Freddie needed more victims and on top of that they ask

Robert England to come back reprisals rule as Freddie Krueger seeing the popularity of an Iron Man Elm Street Robert England his agent decided they want more money to play Freddie Krueger rightfully so you might as well as says no we're good we can just throw a mask on some stunt guy a la Jason

Voorhees a la Michael Myers and we're gonna be good so when seen into that experiment they give Robert England all the way that he wants to come back because they understand that not as anybody can play Freddie Krueger and we've learned that over the years right well Jackie or Haley can play Freddie Krueger but anyways I mean he can get a credit for being Freddie Krueger yes can he play Freddie Krueger I have missing the movie so I can't really speak on it I

think so personally but and I will never see the movie sad Ron you make me sad I'll be there are extenuating circumstances that I would see the movie you know if Allison breaking to me it's a listen we can we can watch this movie naked but it has to be the remake of an Iron Man Elm Street look of course I'm going to say yes to that okay good if somebody says I'll pay you a thousand dollars to we have you in Iron Man Elm Street they remake I will obviously do

that yeah yeah I don't see either of those two scenarios happening anytime soon but you but you're still not willing to say never and I like that yeah there are there are some conditions under which we'll watch it absolutely if Allison brief you're listening contact the podcast we can get you my contact information at least he's reasonable so let me hit this you guys real real quick my my question would be you know what was what is your experience with the

film did you see it after an Iron Man Elm Street came out did you see these in order was something you came back to later did you see it on TV you see it in a movie you're like what's your relationship with this movie and what did you

think of it compared to the first movie a doc shock if you want to go ahead give your take on that real quick I saw this one this is my third time watching it but it was more recently I was not really as much a fan of Fred the earlier I did really like the first one but I never got into the series

until later I mean I'm talking maybe around late late two thousand early twenty-tens before I start to get into the rest of them so it was later and I did review it on the blog almost ten years ago now and this was my first time seeing it since then and I did have a better reaction to it this time

than I did then but I also still had you know some some issues with it the the key one being the change you had mentioned about instead of Freddie in the dream world him deciding to you know to to take it to another level with with the lead character but we can get into that in a little bit yeah and we we should mention that he not only is in the dream world but he uses that man character as a conduit into the real world as well yes which yeah which didn't

make any sense to me because he's a god in the dream world and here women can kick him in the face and he falls over I also fall over by getting kicked in the face by woman yes but not if you're a god in the dream world you want I am not a god in the dream world and for now no but for any was Freddie was ready to do anything in the dream world once you got into the real world we saw it at the end of the first movie once you got into the real world Nancy was able to get

the upper hand on him a few times and it happens in this one a lot more than it happened in and it's because of the situation and what you know where they're going with it I just never understood the need to change up the whole thing because that's what made the first one so effective for me was that you could never escape Freddie because when you would dream he would be there here he says I want to go out into the real world and I just didn't understand it where

he's just the burnt up old guy that has a glove that has razor blades on it yes yes which intimidating but not undefeatable exactly that's what I'm saying he then he then becomes third best when you're looking at Jason Michael and and Freddie because I didn't think and this is getting way ahead but I thought that that that party scene was was just dismal I didn't find anything frightening about that and I didn't see it was even a little bit effective there wasn't a single memorable uh...

chosen not not one you make me sad to date becker are you kidding me I like the bull party you like the poor party you thought and I always have you want to say that you thought that Freddie you thought that Freddie was effective in the pool scene that he was frightening he what is what he wouldn't

take a few people wait time out I never think Freddie's frightening because you know that was an effective scene that happened to be your monster to be frightening I know but I love when he I love when he slashes that dude boom in the back yes and there were thirty seven people running around but

he got that one guy that's right and you don't want to be that one guy and you know what I'm one guy but the other thirty six didn't mind he slash two of them I think but one of them probably had minor injuries yeah well that's what that's what is scary me what happens when a lioness

uh... goes after a bunch of zebras I mean she gets one of them and the rest get away but the one of them it's very scary for that one zebra or yeah because I'm in a minute look at that one Freddie was lucky that I came to him because he did he just stood there

yeah yeah that's the guy that you know that's the guy who you live in the hospital but did not die I believe in my mind it was one guy he's flashing the face early on that definitely died yeah yeah but there was a there was a really good slash to the back and then

the father comes out and takes the absolute lamest shot you'd seen any movie in the eighties well can't wait like jay go ahead and uh... i the pool scene is very divisive amongst horror fans yeah some love it some don't jay apparently you're one of the

people who love it so one of you take this opportunity to talk about your relationship with the film as well okay and also my other pool scene comments for later than but uh... i didn't know there were more i think we just cover the whole thing there are well i was listening to you guys but i

i was i was i'm patiently but but but no the answer runs the initial question though so i saw the first nightman on the street first and then i think you the in the order i saw them out of sequence after that i think any order was like the third one and then i got to the second one anyways

uh... makes that which makes sense with our our time frame that you and i were growing up right that's right because yeah when you're when you're that age you don't always get to see every let me let me actually say the jump ahead of a film real quick uh...

did you see you saw the third one i'm guessing was that a video rental you yes uh... yeah yeah but still yeah it was very fun that way but anyways that's coming up but um... but no for this one on on us to goodness you guys i have always like this film and appreciated it because

and i know you get some grief on this but uh... i don't i don't like dream things in movies in the first place and so i was kind of happy what do you like in movie shape you don't like all all that spread from you i like i like logic uh... character motivation continuity in my thomes brother it's this the simple for me i like samara weaving in movies that that's what i like but anyways so so i got it she plays if she if she plays she stars in megan three what are you gonna do uh...

i'll be getting the megan doll anyways so what i was saying was you have to inflate it yourself though those are not the inflatable kinds anyway this is such a a rabbit hole but we won't go there yet said so run no i i like the fact that there aren't that that it's a little more

it's not entirely set in reality but the more that of a horror film is closer to the reality that i'm familiar with my everyday life the more exciting it is which which for example as well i appreciate the pool scene because

you could have a psycho path show up at a swimming pool and start slashing people because they are very vulnerable because their half-knit half-nick-knit in their swim suits and that would suck for a dude with with knives you know a knife gloves slashing at you when you're in your bathing suit

just saying but anyways so i i i thought i had to match this real quick jay before you premium on them since you like scenes under set in the real world as opposed to the dream world where anything's possible you like real physics and and and doc shock you can try

on this as well because there's a scene and this movie that always confuses me whenever I watch and I can't use make in this time and this is the scene where the gym teachers killed will get to the homo erotic undertones of that a little bit later but just the scene

in general as it is like is that a dream that that happened in real life I think it did happen in real life I think I did because that was the whole idea was Freddie was possessing as opposed to you know they set it up at the beginning in the dream world and then they just sort of left that

behind and carried on with the possession so yes I do think it happened in the real world it's a little bit of a cringe moment because he's got the kid running around the gym and his bare feet right and then all of those showers but there are there are possessed towels

but he's sitting with the towel while he's naked and yes I said there was and then it was very tied them it was high him to the wall themselves I thought it was an effectively done scene it was a little cringy just because this isn't a teenager this is an underage kid and we now know something

a little more about the the gym teacher and then what happens to him it only I mean I thought it was well done and I thought it was actually handled pretty well as far as effects and the effectiveness of it you know because it is a pretty it's a very unsettling scene with the question

is though if no one to sleep in dreaming like how how is all this stuff happening the supernatural statue hold my two that has to forget the dream world this is not said in the dream world this is but it's just because he has no hours he's lose he thinks he's losing his mind because he's seeing

these things happening but in reality it's Freddie controlling him to the palace Freddie controlling things in the real world see that's the part of the movie I have an issue with they change the rules right and and we learn that early on like when I mean he is able to possess things such as Jesse

and the parakeet and and the physical gym equipment but let me just point out one thing the parakeet scene was hilarious by the way that scene is awful but it's really hell it's any hill like it's painful but but let me just please for people who watch this again and I hope

you do or watch it for the first time but I hope a lot of people have probably seen this one and maybe not but yeah for if you do went in the gym and the gym teacher scene when he's being attacked with all the gym equipment I die laughing I mean I pretty much close to die laughing it is

so hilarious to me the way that actor doesn't react at all he just casually keeps chewing his gum as various gym equipment keeps coming at him and he gumboes and he's just gum and just casually look he doesn't even have a facial reaction and it is so hilarious I love that

but but I think I think Ron your confusion is is where I was confused first watching this move so I'm thinking wait if that's the dream world is there no this is kind of leaving other than the opening scene I really liked that opening scene on the bus I thought that was really cool

yeah other than that and a few other moments you know later on this is all happening in the real world and Freddie is may is pushing his way into the real world as opposed to pulling people into the dream world and wait a second real quick though why why I don't one thing I don't get

100% as why you guys are gripping about this because because the first way was so effective in the dream world why I'm here for this one I understand that but this isn't the first one this is the second movie and we're dealing so let's let's forget we're working the first and do something

all different in the second so this is the Halloween three of the nightmare and I would see I actually you're you're taking you're taking stuff I'm gonna say ahead of time it is this is this is in a sense very much so yes since you brought that up this is Halloween three of this

franchise just as it's also sort of the Jason goes to hell where things work differently for the monster but anyway but table in that goes to hell was hundreds of years in the future Halloween three was not Michael Myers so there's two distinct differences in the face and

X no I'm I'm this one still taking place in the nightmare and I'm free world but I'm just saying where the monster role functions differently in the franchise I feel like you can put this in Halloween three yeah because Michael Myers he only appears like on a TV and that's it and

and then Jason goes to hell like the way the way the monster works in that is different but I think it goes Jason can work at all but it doesn't I put it more and different in any part five because Jason's not in it yeah that's the continuity of the whole franchise

I think that goes to hell is terrible but at least it's part of the franchise yeah I can I don't disagree with you Jay I see that I see that we're trying to do something different we're trying to do something different here I see that it just didn't work at all for me but

but no and I and that's fair enough but my original conceit though for while my original argument for you to is we're dealing with a supernatural being he's in the evil supernatural being so he does have supernatural abilities which which I'll just put out there that's one reason why

I don't like supernatural stuff is because the parameters are always changing just like when people try to teach you card games right Ron sometimes yes see so anyway sorry that's not but that's not you know that's not unique to paranormal films or supernatural films plaster films do the same thing

yeah but but the thing is we know he's not effective in the real world because of the end of the first one we know this is not his domain why did he want to make it his domain this time around wait a second how are you calling him not effective in the real world he killed all those kids

when he was alive he's very dangerous well yes in the real world but you're saying he's supernatural now he wasn't supernatural then now you're saying he's supernatural I'm just saying when he was on the world yes when he was alive yes and hidden and nobody knew what he was doing or who he was

yes he was very dangerous we're not talking about that Jay that's that's that's history in the first movie right we're talking about what we've been presented in the first movie of Freddie in the real in the dream world he can do anything and you can't escape him when he got to the real

world when Nancy pulled him into the real world she was able to kick his ass a little bit so we know he's not effective in the real world why make a movie where he's all we what he wants to be in the real world he kills people in this movie I wouldn't say yes he's not effective in the real

world and not I didn't think any of the kills that happened in this real world were effective at all other than the one with the gym teacher I thought that one had some cool moments and had some cool ideas to it every other one generic and not effective even the actual death scene in that

wasn't very great he discussed that in the back yes so when you when you guys are saying effective though just to clarify you're saying the kill wasn't impressive to you but I'm saying does he rack up a body count in this the answer is yes he killed yes not nearly as much as he could have

at that party but we'll get to that later I guess wow you're also the last one person and killed one person and that Freddie should not be about body count that's not his thing he needs he needs to have the fear of the people that he's killing so it might take him two or three dreams and

then but it but does it work in the real world the fear yeah it's it put in the dream work it did work in this movie that's for sure I mean okay Michael Myers sorry Gregor is sorry ahead of time Michael Myers walks around with one knife blade people are afraid this dude has knife

blades on all of his fingers on one hand you know even more scary so he gets five times the fear of Michael Myers because he has five blades that's some good thing Jay I would have never thought of that I was just saying in as much as Michael Myers is scary because he can kill somebody with a knife

or any killer for that Michael Myers goes after he doesn't stand there waiting for them to run to him wasn't that fool see yeah I'm not I'm not saying that Freddie is not scary in the real world I'm saying within the parameters of the franchise it doesn't make sense for him to be to voluntarily

come to the real world but but aren't you two and I'm just I'm just asking aren't you two reviewing not reviewing the movie that as it is we were viewing a sequel ways the exact the second the the first sequel to a very popular film that had an effective that had an effective

um crime had an effective world that it built and said in this one who needs well wait I agree with that no there's in the national film industry just saying that's right a good point and I agree with you the first film was very effective but I'm just saying we can lament that it's different

from the first film but that's not what we have now in so I'm just saying I'm lamenting and not liking it that's not working for you I should respect it I'm just saying let's take this film at face value okay and not get so hung up I think that's I think that's what I'm doing the way

we're taking it at face value and I'm looking at its weaknesses compared to the first one but I guess because it's not what you think maybe it's not working but can you say what's an vacuum sure let's look at it in a vacuum let's let's talk about the parakeet scene let's talk about what

you said about all yeah very of the parakeet scene of course well it's a big moment in that sorry Ron you can't you can't look at this in a vacuum because it relies on the mythology of the first film to work yes and it is it it exists in that same world they find Nancy's diary it

refers back to the first movie they're not divorcing from the first movie completely and they're living in her house there are still bars on the windows man yes but the the front doors a different color no I'm just kidding but the thing is the screenwriters did that to tie it

to the first film and and sure I mean that's how they if they can do it but we can't I'm just saying I'm just saying like if for me a sequel if we're gonna be judging a sequel and and Ron could speak to this for sure because I know how much time he spent with sequels I like to be able to see

my male name sequel Ron that's right he's he's part two I'm a junior so I technically am a sequel honest you you are a sequel I would like to be able to see okay can this movie potentially stand on its own merits as a horror film and not just leaning on its press it can it can it is a flower

without ready cruiser it can do it without if there was a if it wasn't for years ago yeah I said this 10 years ago and it still stands if there was a movie horror movie out there about repressed the homosexualism where a teenager who is having questioning his sexuality and goes into some sort

of trance and kills people every time he has homosexual thoughts and doesn't know that he's doing it this could be that movie but now with Freddy Krueger in it wait a second though Ron what one pushback on that I like most of what you said but let's take let's take Pennywise okay Pennywise

has all sorts of versatility and in his and his approach and then his attack and I know and so I'm just saying like there's a supernatural evil monster who can who can change it up to it to attack people in the shape shifting alien yes right exactly he and he remains supernatural in this

world Freddy does not he just becomes mortal no he no he does he does you're a supernatural in this world that's right he can walk through fences and he can throw around gem equipment apparently apparently he did and he can snap asses with towels boy this movie told us a lot

about Freddy that's right he's really good at snapping with towels by the way you it's really good to draw blood that's right that's right no that's our problem with this movie if Freddy shouldn't be able to do that in the real world why in the real world tell us one thing like that that he did

well all right there was a little bit of it with like the footprints and then what he did the to Nancy's mother there was a little bit of that all right so I see what you're saying I see what you're saying he probably could do it in the real world but yet he can still get his ass kicked

too it doesn't make sense well I mean all all the monsters can write we don't want to make them yes but did he ever get his ass kicked in the dream world pick one moment in that first movie where Freddy was at a disadvantage in the dream world I'm just saying I don't think that we can put a

supernatural monster in a box and be like he is only this and it's like who are you to say he's only this well you know but but but but why abandon a formula that worked for this one I don't understand that part of it I don't understand that part of it why the man in the formula that worked

you're looking at the first I know I know I am I am equal to the first one right I can we ignore the first one and say this is a bubble this movie existed in a bubble we should never have even thought of the first one though I make it Freddy then why make it Freddy but I know

okay I agree I agree with that but and and I'm sure you're rating will reflect that but I mean to to what extent I mean is every bit of your critique for this particular film is every bit of your critique going to be tied to that or are you going to look at other things it's going to be

tied to Freddy and then it's called nightmare and else treat to no I think part of it is going to be tied I'm saying being tied to your lament that he doesn't function the same way as well in the real world which was established in the first one yet this whole movie he wants to pop his way

into the real world for some reason yes well that is a big big part of the problem I have today oh yeah the man should say okay if I say let's say Friday of 13th part seven this random one let's say in that movie Jason Boerhees for some reason without explanation just started flying

and was using a bazooka instead of walking around the woods with a machete would you not call bullshit on that I mean he's a boy right does he I do I do love him and he is super natural to grow in the dead how many times well here's let me answer it let me answer that for you if

in the previous film and yes I'm talking about the previous film if in the previous film they got the upper hand on Jason by flying around using bazookas because that's exactly what Freddy does here you guys maybe you're not giving him enough credit they pull him in the real

world to try kick his ass but he's like okay I can play in the real world too and I'll kick your ass and that's what he does but but didn't you like that Ron I thought you would appreciate that the fact that they turned around and used the real world on Freddy I think it's cool

the thing Freddy's like okay I'll get you guys I'll I'll use the real world on you back yes you're jumping through a lot of heaps hoops yeah forget the fact I can already get you when you fall asleep let me tell you not a lot of your wide awake I'm just saying like they can tell you this

as a guy who watched franchises and reviewed him for over 10 years I can tell you that once the franchise gets away from the formula it has set in the in the original film and later films once it gets away from that that's when the terrible movies get made and you don't want to

watch an eye for an hour and a half maybe then why are you putting an eye for an hour and a half for movie and your DVD player well let me ask you a question about that run and this is especially for you gift wrap with a boat my question for you in that which the way that we're defining

whatever it is like the first movie I know that all we have here this is just the second film it's also a retrospective so we can take the entire franchise into consideration sure sure I guess but my memory isn't as sharp on these films to be honest because I just don't

watch them that much but but anyways I can play Lee writes out this entire film with one exception yes yes the rest of the franchise does right yeah well and and that's why I mean I do think it is so I'll save that argument my little gift wrapped argument I'll save that for when we're later on

but I will just say um again I do think this feels like a like a Halloween 3 of sorts which is making it an oddity being devil's advocate here even though I'm naturally a pessimist I don't know if our audience could tell that or not being the devil's advocate here I can see the

argument we've only had one film let's do this cool thing let's use the house as a conduit that really Freddy's sort of possessing the house or he's a supernatural entity attached to the house so this new teenager moves in for the first time in five years and we're going to use him

as a conduit for Freddy Krueger in general and then the writer says you know what I'm just going to make a thoroughhold of gay stuff in there too let's see what let's see if it all works out so I can see that argument because it's the second film if it was like the fourth film there's no way you can make that argument at that point because the format has not been finalized I don't think until the third film I think the third film is the definite divider between no more fucking around this is the

format now yeah but but why do you feel that franchises can't change and evolve over time I don't think I don't agree I think they can and I think they can't evolve this one just didn't do it well the horror writers normally cannot do it well if you can make small changes over time and evolve your

your franchise and this something different by the end but it all makes sense and it's in good continuity in the movies themselves are decent that's pretty rare I only know of one franchise that pulled that off and that was child's play and that's only because the same guy wrote all those movies

mm-hmm normally we have a different writer and a different director for each film yeah which probably explains a lot right and the middle movies of child's play are terrible anyway but he did evolve the franchise and this would be different and made it better by the end mm-hmm there was a

rough patch in the middle for sure no other franchise from my perspective having watched dozens of franchises over the course of the 10 years I was on the resurrection of zombie 7 podcast there was no other franchise that was able to do that so given the body of work we have with all these horror

franchises it seems unlikely that that can actually take place because I watched all those franchises and it didn't happen yes you did very dutifully I might end again like my argument still stands if you don't want to watch a nightmare numstreet formatted movie you don't like one liners and you don't like people getting killed in ironic ways and dreams and don't put a niner numstreet movie and I expect

something different but on the other hand and I think by the same token like if you don't want to watch um you know a the mixing it up on a later franchise film and trying something new you know then I guess you can do that is what you do right I mean I do that just I did that just because I was

curious about how franchises evolved yes and they entered that and I feel like I'm I'm uniquely qualified to say this what they don't it's just shit that is go to shit eventually they don't really fall except for how razor number 10 if you can do it and you can

do it well and you can do it in small increments over time I think it can't be done for example I'll use this example from from your franchise Jay I think Friday the 13th part 7 is fine it's a little different because the one girl has the psychic powers right mm-hmm she's scary as yeah I don't

I don't have a problem with that like that's adding something new to the franchise doesn't take out the basic context of the franchise Jason still in the woods murdering people with a machete yes so I think that's a fine like evolution does he need to get on a cruise ship and go to New York now

he doesn't well this is gonna we this is gonna probably lower your mind I don't even really mind that much that he ends up in space even though it is a sign and ridiculous but but it is neat to see the monster um essentially still still be monstrous even in space I think 10 fits

better within the storyline then eight nine does do mm-hmm yeah I can see that are you I would agree with that too yeah that's our problem with with this movie in the middle of the night I mean I'm street franchise yes so my initial uh context with this film was similar to Jay when uh I knew the

fourth from most coming out and we'll get we'll get to this in the next episode or in between the next two episodes um I don't know if you guys remember this but nightman I'm street three was such a massive deal when it came out there was a huge height machine between nightman street three and

nightman street four and I was like man I got to watch these movies to be a cool kid mm-hmm so I went out and remit nightman um street one and and two and three and got caught up before I actually saw four in the theater that was you know just trying not to get beat up at school right

which is like 88 I believe right 1988 yeah I think it dates when four came out it was 88 or 89 I think I believe 88 is correct 88 and yeah because run my little note here is uh DJ Jezzy Jeff in the Fresh Prince and Nightmare on My Street song um that song primarily

discuss it talks about plot points from one and two but it was released right before four hit theaters right and I have um some good trivia about that song and before shadowing I won't do it until we get to nightman um street four okay sorry uh but there is some good trivia with with

that song this is all stuff that I researched when we did this franchise originally back on the my other podcast but we can't really go much further into an nightman um street two without talking about the elephant in the room uh and that elephant is homosexual because many many

horror sites gay horror sites call this the gayest horror film of all time there's reason for that yeah um because there's a lot of gay homosexual homo erotic undertones in this film to begin with the lead actor Mark Patton he is homosexual I don't he was not out at the time of this film

because I believe he I don't know if you guys have seen his documentary about this film I really would like to though I really want to yeah that's gonna help you screen queen it's a little I'm not gonna lie to you it's a little woe with me uh but it is him coming to terms with his homosexuality

and his role in this movie and his role in horror uh as a homosexual lead actor so it is very interesting as well well let me ask you on that run because I bet you you know this stuff I'm sorry to put you on the spot if you don't but from all the way to the without Jay okay

that's right from from my reading on this I mean it's weird how many different stories you hear and then probably maybe you're going into that now so I don't want to take away from it but I'm just saying it's weird to what extent because you hear a few different accounts on how this film

came together and and and so forth and so sometimes you know in some counts you know I do feel really bad for what happened to this kid and in other accounts it sounds like it's that wasn't the case at all so I don't really know what to believe he believes that I I tell what he believes

he believes that um all of that homo erotic uh stuff was put into this these were all done and rewrites this wasn't in the original film when he agreed to do it okay so David Chaskin was adding all of this uh homo erotic material into the script and Mark Patton believes it's

because he knew that Mark was a was a gay man and at that time in 1985-1984 whenever this was made to be a gay man in Hollywood wasn't as accepted widely as it as it is now he thought it would really hurt his career so he was um you know angry because there was all this stuff where he's first of all

he's constantly sweating all the time in the in this film yes at one point he gets some sort of cream on him you know that the the coach gets attacked by a bunch of balls for example there's a lot of a phallic imagery that as melting in the candle yeah yeah in his room and that's just the

small stuff the bigger stuff is whenever Jesse as a character um gets sexually excited whether it be come because he's in an s and m bar whether it be because he has a secret crush on his best friend Grady whether he has a traction to Lisa and he's confused about it whenever that happens that's

when Freddie appears and kills people so you look at one of two ways like either Freddie is killing all of the homosexual temptation that he might have or um Freddie is a representation of his homosexuality and he has he's lashing out about at one point in the movie when he's in the bedroom

with his best friend Ron Grady you know he's a attractive guy played by Robert Russeller mm-hmm he gets sexually excited by Lisa right and immediately goes over to his friend's house where they you don't have any shirts on there swinging together separately but in the same room

when that when that happens Freddie literally comes out of Jesse giving a giving a new visual representation of coming out right which I thought was actually a really good scene yes it actually was well done for like a possessed character yeah

yeah we're coming out of another character for that time period for physical effects I thought it was also yeah very well done and thematically Ron I think the latter yeah I mean I I understand that there are two very popular readings of what you said but the the second one the latter

where it's um Freddie represents homosexuality and that he wants to try to suppress it and not let it let it out right I think that is extremely powerful in the context of this film given how much he suffers as he's wrestling with it because yeah yeah so I mean I think it's it's very poignant

and even heartbreaking to some extent and that's why I'm saying there's a good movie here mm-hmm just not what's Freddie Krueger because that's not within the realm of what Freddie Krueger does right and I and I I thought it was interesting that when he was with Lisa it was like her trying to

uh she could never get him to talk about what was bothering him she could never get him to to talk you know say anything about it he just didn't want to open up to her but then the moment he was with his with his friend in the room and they wanted a really great friend let's be honest

it's not like they were really close friends they were they were growing closer um you know they they had sort of a rough beginning there for any moment I never got the feeling that maybe he's all yeah maybe he saw Ron in his as his best friend but I don't think Ron ever saw him as like a

best friend but the minute he gets in that room he he spills everything around he even tells him he killed somebody mm-hmm yeah he even tells me that he opens up to Ron completely and I noticed that this time even more than the other than previous times that I saw it yeah right and go ahead

do you so sorry go ahead and with what you were going to say I'll circle back in a minute because it was it was about the writer and and and the writer go ahead that's probably what I'm going to well I was just going to say that um one of the one of the accounts that I read was that the

perhaps the writer ended up writing the script that way for this particular actor being cast because Mark Patton's two previous roles I guess even though he was he had not come out at the time as being gay he his two previous roles were gay characters I guess is what I read and so but he was

he was getting nervous about being typecast and so I don't know if this writer um knew that this dude was gay or assumed he was gay but having seen him in those two previous roles that makes me wonder if you know that's maybe what led to this but I will I will say this the writer claims that he for

years and years and years after the movie even though Mark Patton claimed something different this writer claimed that he wasn't uh potentially putting in homosexual erotic scenes or imagery into the film and the rewrites then by the time um never sleep again comes out he openly admits

that he did it on purpose yeah and he has tried to reach out to Mark Patton to apologize but even even that I mean that I'm part of Mark Patton's like maybe his his his relationship with this film is he never had that you know that um apology or that the the writer emitting that before

like 2010 which is which is a little uh suspect I think because yeah this film ended up becoming a a cult favorite and it was celebrated um it's been celebrated especially by the gay community in a lot of ways so so yeah I could see him later being like yeah that was my idea all along

it was brilliant and I don't know and then he wants to look like he also claims yeah but by the way he the way he went about doing it was pretty crappy right if that yeah that's the case yes yes he also claims that he did it because of the time um homosexuality was still somewhat tapu uh so

that adding those images and would make a teenage person who was watching this in a theater or something uneasy um which is what a horror writer kind of wants which sounds like a lame justification for what you did he did something shitty and you're justifying it with some lame excuse you came

up with that's what it sounds like to me anyway mm-hmm and and then the dance the dance sequence that he does when he's cleaning his room um you know I've read different accounts of that too right aren't there different accounts of that Ron where it's like some people say uh you know

like in one account he claimed that it was like to everything in that movie scripted and then another account he's just he was embarrassed to do it but he worked on the dance on his own and then he just threw it in there but I'm like either way whoever came up with that dance

letter was the writer or this dude I I feel like the um what's what's the word the the visual suggestiveness what word am I looking for yeah whatever that word is I'm looking for I feel like it's undeniable in that sequence at certain moments it certainly is yeah yeah I'm understanding from Mark

still to the stage that he that wasn't something that he wanted to do but I have read the other account too that that he that that he had lived it but he hasn't admitted that that's sad I mean if that's the case it is kind of it is kind of sad and and also on one of the sadder accounts when

he was and maybe he says this in his documentary um but Patton was saying that um you know it was very uncomfortable for him because he you know he hadn't come out yet and then he's playing this role that's filled with with this you know all of all of this innuendo and so it was

a real wrestle for him making him uncomfortable so I could see why that would be a very challenging experience for him I bet and let's look at Jesse as a character versus I mean I'm gonna come with final girl obviously it wasn't a female character but he's a final girl architect right for

for this particular movie but compared to the other uh final people in the franchise compared to Nancy compared to Alice later um and even compared to some of the final people from other franchises Tommy Jarvis for example in the in the Friday the 13 franchise or um Jamie li Curtis's character

in the Halloween franchise like he's the weakest one I feel like he's the weakest final person in any of these and any of these movies because he doesn't but Ida he's actually do anything to um overcome his situation it's all through uh Lisa who for some reason is overly impatuated with this kid

to the point where we got uncomfortable at this point where she would like murder her parents for this guy at some point I think it's she was asked to it's very interesting how they made the female characters as strong as they are in this movie not just Lisa if you think of both sets of parents and I love clue uh clue go I love I love that guy but he's he's he doesn't come off as like a great character in this movie he's a he's a dope in this thing he really is and look at the father

look at Lisa's father and and how the mother like he's ruining the party with his music and everything and the mother somehow gets him okay I'll get him out of here and lures him up to the bedroom then he comes running out that shot he took I mean literally you want to talk about like people

shooting machine guns and not hitting anybody this guy takes the worst shot I've ever seen in in in any movie and they would he had one shell in there mm-hmm it was it was it was really pathetic so the women characters the female characters in this movie are shown as the stronger like it is

really Lisa who who helps Jesse overcome all this and I read both of those fathers in this film I think there's there's something being said there there's an undercutting which I do feel and this is a personal theory but but I do feel like we started seeing that in the 80s when they

started yeah mocking fathers making them look stupid and dopey and and like yeah the sitcom thing and in this they're they're completely ineffectual and and especially it's especially point in during greatest death he's against the door screaming for his father and that's extremely sad

and by the way I read this Ron that that when that actors real dad watched the movie with him in the theater he cried try to do but anyway but that scene is extremely point it because the fathers in this film because there's another scene to win when our our lead Jesse is yelling for his dad

they're completely ineffectual and unable to help the sons I'd like that scene who was banging on the door too I thought that was that was there was a lot of tension there it would have been nicer if we could have had a better kill there I wonder if that was the mpa getting involved because this

was a V five and by that point they were starting to get a little more involved in and not letting the violence to get out I was wondering if maybe that was sort of an off screen type of kill because of that my soul that's what I was thinking I haven't read anything about that Dave I mean it might

not be it might not be because memory hadn't just put in full of credit yet but I mean that's same with the coaches that I mean the the actual death scene but the buildup may be good but the actual death scene isn't right especially compared it later later films in this franchise and these

dads compared with John Sacks and then the next exactly John Sacks and was such a strong character in the first one I mean he isn't the third one as well yeah it's something it's really something in that in this movie they just did they they just changed everything around but that's another

a weakness of this of this film is we spent a lot of time with Jesse's family and they they have no effect on the film whatsoever like this wasted time everything under the one scene where he's standing over his sleep walking and standing over his

little sister I like make sense because for any child killer yes but other than that it's everything with his family is just the waste of time or you have an apparekete that explodes so the film can get openly mocked for the next 39 years because of that one scene and then the

father saying he put a he put a cherry bomb on it what you couldn't see if you put a cherry bomb a lit fuse on this bird is it was flying past you if this is the guy with the same guy who didn't understand the house was out when it was 97 degrees inside the house yeah that's true that's true

and and and the guy who um who the bird knocked over one lamp he knocks over the other with a broom it was just it was it was it was like straight up out of like a Laurel and Hardy movie that that's that whole scene so we wait we waste a lot of time a lot of scenes with that family is

completely wasted in the context of the film that's just like 20 25 minutes of runtime that you could have done something else cool with or at least make the family more effective I mean at one point the cops bring Jesse back he's naked in the blanket they say yeah we found him wondering

around naked on the highway and the only and the rest don't see anything you have the only questions he has to ask the aren't even like what were you doing naked on the highway it's like what do you want and who's holding it up on that what's well if there were a scene later where

perhaps they force Jesse into some sort of counseling or some sort of clinic where he's made to go to sleep then that's an effective scene and then I'm in Elm Street movie yeah which you know happens in the later films yes that does yeah that is a good one so that you know whether or not you

you believe this is a the gayest film of all time which which I've actually heard Robert when called this there they're with a gay film I pretty come out with mouth yeah yeah well I think it's unmistakable I mean for example even on even on Jesse's bedroom door it says no chicks

but but it says no out of town um checks and and and they he crosses it out makes it an I know out of town chick but it looks like it says no chicks and then there's a game up in his closet yes closet called probe yes and I'm like wow they are really putting in thick here you know I maybe

when I watch this the first time in 1987 whenever I watch it maybe I probably didn't pick up but I was 11 you know I definitely picked up on it in later in later viewings and in Jesse our quote unquote final girl final person is always showing his boobs you know but with which the

final girl doesn't really he hates her yeah yeah he he's have naked a lot of the times he also screams very feminist screen there's a will home screen even once for him like there's some pretty big screams from him bitter yeah wow yeah yeah so that's not all the time not all the time but you do

you do pick up on that like especially the first one that's off screen mm-hmm yeah well he does it several times that's not really Mark Patton doing that though do you think no I don't think so either but but they the filmmakers made it so right yeah he probably yeah they made it they

definitely made a choice yeah yeah they made a choice absolutely so I have one more one more quick question then we'll go into ratings okay and I think we've already discussed most of this is this a worthy injury into the 9-minute-homes-3 franchise I think I think it has moments where it is

but ultimately it it did not work for me for many of the reasons I was saying earlier that it just did not make sense for me to change up a formula that works so well as completely as they did this time I'm not saying it and I see where you're coming from Jay that that he is still doing supernatural

things he is still controlling but he has so much more control when they're in his world than he does when he's in their world and I just don't see why he wanted to he spent the movie trying to get to the real world it just didn't make any sense to me and and then so it didn't work for me

I happen to really I don't really talk about Mark Patton performance I thought he did a good job I actually like to I like his character a lot in this movie and I thought he was one of the strengths of it that we spent so much time with him because you I think he really does convey the the agony

of what he was going through yeah I used to I used to shit on hip-hop formats in the song but upon this viewing I'm going to reel that back because I agree with you Doc Shock I will say this I don't think I don't think there was a character in this film worth rooting for because he's very very

annoying in my eyes in this in this film but I do I do think the acting is much better than I ever gave a credit for the first couple times I watched it I think he's annoying I think Lisa's annoying okay but that's just my personal personal opinion I wasn't as annoyed by them to be honest

whether or at least not this time I was more annoyed by the characters surrounding them the adults surrounding them then I was by yes I was annoyed by I was annoyed by them as well but it very much leans into that 80s mid 80s like teen angst were mad all the time yeah it's very

much is a very much is a product of it's time for sure yes and maybe that's why I thought the the acting was better because I looked at it more this time as this is a product for the mid at the mid 1980s and this was the you know this was actually probably honestly a step up from the

quality of acting we were used to and and turn around horror films in the mid 1980s did sorry Dave did you finish your answer on what if this is a word of the entry yeah I said it didn't it didn't work for me because I don't think it it it it man it didn't it didn't do what made it didn't do

with what what it was trying to do in this film it didn't work as well as it did in the first film with a different set of rules I just I did not I did not see his desire to come into the real world when he can do whatever he wants in the dream world to all these kids just by pulling them in there

I didn't understand that I didn't understand the need to change that up I found a confusing as at first like Ron well if he was dream in here how did that really happen I think I think the idea was he wasn't dreaming it was Friday controlling him right that was the idea other than other than the

beginning there's no doubt that that bus that scene on the bus at the beginning that has to be the dream world and it's like okay he was dreaming when these two these two girls on the bus and that's something else where there was they didn't really go anywhere after that it's just he woke up

and you never heard any other character saying that they were sharing these these dreams so that it was just him it was just Freddie focusing on him because he was in that house and these are Elm Street kids so they're a lot of them have moved their after they didn't grow up there yeah

Freddie would have no connection to the whatsoever for the revenge narrative for his death doesn't work with this song either no it doesn't well my answer to your question uh Ron Martin is if this is a worthy and please Fred head Ron Martin Fred head Ron Martin sorry about that thank you yes um is

see the reason I resent not resent is not the right word but the reason I think the term the more recent term elevated horror is the reason it it just as nails on a chalkboard to me is because I think horror films the best horror films had quote unquote elevated concepts that they showed us

and taught us about life in the real world all along it's not like just recently in the 2010s we started getting more meaningful horror films um we we've always had some horror films and I think that by that same judgment this this has some like a legitimately uh poignant story and it uses horror

to depict like the way I read it which is he is trying to suppress because he feels afraid to come out or whatever he's trying to suppress his homosexuality and so he's really suffering with this and and he's also afraid of what it's going to do to other people around him the people

in his life right and and so I think in that way this is an extremely powerful film and I think it's pretty lofty or even elevated if you will that we we use a Freddie Krueger film to to portray something so meaningful and impactful so so yeah I think this is very worthy entry okay I'm

gonna disagree with that okay mostly I will agree that if this film resented today with a non- Freddie Krueger antagonist it probably could be considered elevated horror but the fact that it is Freddie Krueger is why I think does not make this a worthy entry into the franchise looking at

the franchise as a whole you can take this movie out completely into this and change anything in the entire franchise that's what you say and sorry just to clarify so you're saying that because you feel they are mis misusing this monster in his correct okay got you got you got you

correct there's a good movie here it's just not with Freddie Krueger so in this franchise I will I will agree with you though Jay that that the 2010s did not invent what they call elevated horror you're right you're getting it in the term yeah they invented the term but it's always but it's

always existed horror has been meaningful since the beginning but anyways yes no my by my point is looking at the franchise as a whole I'm no treat one to Freddie Verstrasen you can take this film completely out and it changes nothing about the narrative nothing nothing is hurt so that's

why I don't think it's a worthy entry any of the other films you know probably have something at least lower wise in them that if you took the film out it would mess the continuity up over to mess the overall Freddie Krueger lower up this one you're missing a like exploring parakeet

engage him teacher so I don't believe this is a worthy entry into the franchise and I think my ratings gonna represent that so speaking of let's go into ratings I'm gonna throw a little twist at you too and Doc Shock will start with you so give your rating and then I want you to rank some

of the other some of the black sheep of these franchise that I've picked for my black sheep Friday 5 night minimum street 2 Halloween 3 and Texas chainsaw masker the next generation like rank those four right okay okay I'm I'm still gonna give this a six out of six out of 10

because I think there are some really intelligent things that the movie is attempting to do but failing and I think it has some very strong scenes in it you know and I think it has some really great effects and I think in this one Robert England as as Freddie Krueger he's he plays it even

even straighter than he did in the first one I thought you know because he's not really giving joke lines in this one I didn't think anyway I didn't really come across any good yeah exactly I know you would like oh there's the body I've got the brain's famous line isn't it but yeah

and but that was also a really cool effect when he when he pulled that back I thought that was another really cool effect but just also it's somewhere itself with this tongue which is kind of funny yeah but ultimately I I did like I said it just I didn't I didn't I don't think he's nearly

as effective in the real world as he was in the dream world he that was his domain I didn't see the need to change it up so but still I'm gonna give it a six out of 10 and you want us to rank okay which ones from from worst to best Friday Friday 5 night minimum street 2 Halloween 3

Texas chance on masterbook next generation okay starting from the bottom you have Texas chance on masterbook the next generation right above that I put plan 9 for matter space right above that I put man nose hands of fate and then right above that I would put what was the

what were the other ones okay well now I'm gonna have to go right away at 5 Halloween 3 yeah Friday the 13th part 5 then I'd go night more known street 2 and then I would do Halloween 3 all right Jay okay final thoughts are ready okay got you a couple little things that make this great to me

at this time I discovered it this time I was hearing these weird sounds in the background and I'm like I really I was like is that a is that a whale in there and then I read in the trivia that they put whale song to the Freddie scenes and I'd never mention for the audience with

what I don't think we've touched on this does not have the traditional 9 man um street score right yes which I consider personally myself I mean I know many would can probably say Halloween but I think the 9 man um street score is probably the best score in horror for my for

me personally hmm the Halloween the the music for the music for Halloween probably supersedes that but the overall score I just think the the 9 man um street reprise that I think it's just so powerful and so recognizable for me it's all franchise then then maybe this one

but Halloween picture that they they have that saw franchise has that like solution right yes I mean that it's very it's very catchy that's a song yeah okay so when the fact that Freddie comes out of the hero like what I mean how uncommon is that for the monster to literally

erupt out of the hero and it's like sort of a chess buster it's very alien as other than other than like you're saying alien or some of the some of the werewolf movies that you do not see that you certainly don't see it in a slasher that's for sure that's right and in the out like an alien

when chess burshtures happen because the here's the here's the franchise there shouldn't be possessions well okay and I don't I don't I don't disagree with you now yeah the the heroes die like an alien when that happens but also really cool this is like an 80s thing but also it thematically fits

really well the fact that um Freddie is basically wearing this guy or the this guy is Freddie's inside of him there's a body glove sticker which I think is cool body glove that's kind of neat to me to think about thematically all in this movie speaking of uh

phallic symbols and so forth sometimes a snake really is just a snake and then there's a point that I think he's in this film yeah that was kind of a surprise I thought he was definitely dreaming yeah you would definitely think in this film of all films this snake would be representative

but no it's just like a python book a strictor that somehow got out and found this guy who was sleeping yep that's right and in all another thing is in a lot of time in ghost movies like haunting movies when the monster shows up like the ghost show up it gets really cold and freezing but in this

movie when Fred shows up it gets super hot and that's kind of cool to me well fire's his thing that that's representative throughout the franchise yes but I did it I'm just saying I like that here um it's also funny so we're talking a lot about um again phalluses and so forth and these

pills the keep him awake are called stay up pills which is super funny to me in a way instead of you know I'll be honest I didn't even make that connection but you're right which is used for the rest of the franchise but okay but yeah it's not a red pill or a blue pill it's a stay up pill

you know anyways blah blah blah let me see what there's anything else oh and yeah the reason I value this most I mean yeah the the parakeet scene is freaking awful there are some really low points in this but I love the imagery at the beginning where the bus is balanced on that precipice

of life too I really like that too yeah the look of that is tremendous and then this is a cinematic oddity to me I mean we've got Robert England's least favorite uh Freddie movie here it as Ron said it does not use the theme it's famous theme song in it at all it's the only film in

the franchise where Fred kills outside of the dreams and Freddie is actually only on screen for 13 minutes of 87 minute runtime anyways um so yeah for me this is a 7 out of 10 and I think this is a for me I own it of course but um you know I think if you haven't seen it before I'd call it a

strong rental recommendation and then Ron the the end of your so we're starting at the bottom right on this ranking you can bomb or top what are you gonna do Friday 5 and I'm going to be following three guys just cancel mask or next generation these are the black sheep I believe

of their franchises okay the very bottom is Skinner Meringue and then and then next gen and then Friday 5 and then Halloween 3 and then Freddie 2 actually yes there is I mean I so I'm just gonna go into my rating here then I do think there are reasons and some of them J has presented here

on the podcast that this film is worth watching for that purpose to see that analogy to see that metaphor I don't think that Freddie Cruz should be the right character to present that metaphor I don't have a problem if they made a whole franchise based on that metaphor using a different

monster and new and new rules for that particular monster however as an armored industry film I don't think that this works and I think it confused the audience as to the rules of the franchise which thankfully is corrected in the next film I think this does a little bit to her Freddie's image not

because of the homosexual overtones but more because of what Doc Shock was saying seems that the party and things but luckily by the time you get to the 4th of 5th film of the franchise you forget that this one existed because it means nothing to the rest of the franchise

so that's why I am saying as a nightman almost read movie you don't need to see this this is a three out of 10 you can completely skip this if you wanted to watch the rest of the nightman almost read films and now watch this one you'd be perfectly okay doing that and you wouldn't miss

anything only you miss would be dogs with human faces that they do absolutely nothing the dogs of human faces are creepy as hell and they do nothing with and it was I think that was when she was trying to show that she was not afraid and maybe that's why they didn't do anything I don't know

that was the feeling I got when she was trying to say she knew that if you're not afraid then you know they kind of carried that over a little bit that's what I was looking at and think of that scene with the snake I was wonder if that was like the director giving a wink to everybody

saying hey this has taken place in the real world yeah yeah maybe I don't think I don't I think there's some speaking up the director I think there's some really bad directorial choices here too I don't think Jack shoulder was the right guy to take over this franchise this time it doesn't sound

like you really wanted to anyway right right I mean if the things the things I read about this situation was we're true like because because right the first film was released in November and then this had a release date already set for the next November and then he said isn't this true Ron

tell me if I'm wrong he said that there were a bunch of special effects scenes and he didn't even have any idea how to do those correct and right and like I mean yeah I mean he's just that's an around time definitely puts a damper on the production but I believe my and I haven't

read this anywhere this is just my theory my belief is they were trying to keep up with that Friday the 13th production schedule we're Friday the 13th is putting on a movie every year but at the same time the night of number street franchises much more special effects heavy than

the night the Friday the 13th franchise absolutely especially this one I I will all of them but you know this one has those moments as well all right I'm going to rank the black sheep of the franchise and then I have a few trivia questions for you guys okay so coming in last is screen six

and then just about that it's mid-summer and then it has to change on master the next generation then a nightmare on street two then Halloween three and then Friday five which is I discussed in one of my myth best segments is the perfectly fine Friday 13th you did yes you did that was a

great segment you guys ready for some some quick trivia I got six questions here for you guys sure yes ready number one what famous film actor did Mark Patton beat out for the role of Jesse was found to two people one of them became pretty famous actor Brad Pitt Brad Pitt is correct

other actors that tried out for the role Michael J Fox John Stammer was Christian Slater wow eat question number two somebody did the research Jay I tried what role did new line cinema founder Bob Shea play in this film I know it but you can you can take it I did no

research into this one he's he's the bartender in the SNM bar right literally Jay I have as I answer written on my notes bartender in SNM club you almost that word for word okay good nice all right I'll be sure if you get this one that means you really did your research say I okay

Jesse's car from this film is featured in another Freddie Kruger related media yes driven by a screen queen of sorts what's the media and who is the screen queen I know it's in Freddie's nightmares but I forget the screen queen's name sorry she's in your franchise

yeah yeah in the movie we've mentioned today oh I won't I won't be able to pull it my my large park Lincoln okay yeah from my grade seven I don't know all the actors as well as you do having met them and had drinks with them like you did I've never met large park Lincoln

no I can okay so from one Avenger to other Avengers what Avenger drove Robert Ressler who was just talking about to his audition for this movie it was a rubber downed junior what I mean they were they were they were co-sarring in a weird science the time that Robert

Ressard did this audition oh wow nice ah you're doing very well Jay yes you're really looking at myself I did not look at any trivia for me thank you and doc you may be able to discuss this next one what scene in the movie was heavily criticized by both Robert England and West Craven as breaking the rules of the franchise could be it could be any of the scenes in this movie I think you're just like a gesture probably gonna get it right okay the the scene of him coming out of the body oh no not

that one okay the pool scene because he was shorter than the teenagers and I think that's total B.S well Chuck E's short and he's deadly right no no no right you're getting it you're left craving how to problem with the pool scene because you thought that Robert England's a small

a shorter guy so he wouldn't look at the timid that the reason they had a problem with it was cause it breaks the rules of Freddie Krueger like the same reason that doc shocked and I had a problem with it right yeah but that's the whole movie pretty much yeah the whole movie sort of

breaks the rules so it's not even well this is the guy who but this is the guy who created Freddie Krueger and the guy who plays Freddie Krueger right well he should have directed you don't get much more official than that the only the only movie breaks the rules the pool scene is just

lame pool scene the pool scene the pool scene and the exploding perky for the two main reasons that I've read that West Craven did not want to direct the film he should have just said all directed but those scenes are going you think you'd have the pool to do that right I would think so

yeah I mean I wouldn't have been kind of cool if a few people died in that boiling pool instead of everybody getting out alive they probably were red and tenderized last question here and that jail being pressed we get this one as well how many people in this film played Freddie Krueger

two no no no no no three three sorry I was so it was Robert England it was there was one scene that the stunt person they had a mask it was like the the steam room gym shower scene you can tell it's a bigger looking dude and he's just kind of stalking inside of yes like Freddie Krueger does

and then the number three is a girl it was um what's his face his girlfriend when it was the look yeah the special effects guys girlfriend when you look in the mouth and you see his eye looking out of the mouth that eye is actually the girl because she had they needed a really small petite

person to be able to look through there right Jay color me impressed look at you that is great thank you this is a head serve of France rise you killed it well I was trying to um you killed it I'm like Freddie Krueger at that pool party I wanted I wanted to try to even though I like I'm not like

over the moon about this film I do I am impressed with it in some ways and so I wanted to try to show up today and um you know give it it's good as best I could thank you no actually what because you knew Ram was going to give trivia questions you did your research and I completely forgot he did

that last time you destroyed me last time and in the first one so yeah I wanted to be a little better than all right okay so that's our coverage well done yes that's our coverage of a nightmare on street two we have learned I do not take on Jay of the dead at night and almost

for trivia night at your local bar yeah right at least not nightmare and almost for two for this episode I was your host Ron Martin and on behalf of Jay of the dead Dave Dr. Shock Becker the Gillamann Joel Robertson Mr. Watson Dr. Walking Dead's Hell Bishop Brighamortis Macula and Dave Z and we all want to thank you for listening to Jay of the Dead's new horror movies the exploding winners of horror podcasting