What (not) to Wear in the Cold

the description of this podcast. It is very long, but you should be able to find links to lots of the things I spoke about there and a few other products which I think are good value if you are interested in getting yourself some clothing. All right, enjoy, Hi everyone, Welcome to it could Happen here podcast that I'm enthusiastically introducing for the third time because I've just sounded so half fast the first two times that I've made myself

do it again. I'm joined by my friend and your friend, Lanny Unis. Hi, Serene, Hi.

It's very, very cold. Because I've been spending a lot of time outside both helping drop water for migrants crossing the border, helping out in cucumber, and a lot of days just like doing my recreation stuff in the mountains. So I like to do and I think that, like I guess education, I guess a lot of people have been aggressively marketed at about what to wear when their outdoors, be that people who are working or people who are recreating.

And I think it's good to have a little bit of clarity around it, especially as we're entering like this might be the worst winter of our lives, it might also be the best winter of the rest of our lives. Right. Climate change is making more and more people exposed to more and more extreme weather all over the world. So I want to talk a little bit about the stuff I've learned in thirty something years of playing outside about how to stay warm in the cold. So that's what

I'm going to do. I've got it's broken down. Like I think, the really important thing to think about when you are picking your outfit is obviously having all your colors match. It's very important. But more than that, it's like thinking about thinking about outfit as a system rather than as a series of individual things. And I think this is where like the way outdoor companies market is

really bad. They'll be like, oh, yeah, this jacket is badass, and it's warm, and it's waterproof and it's wind proof and it's also breathable, and like that's you probably would be much better off with three cheaper jackets and one very very expensive jacket. Interesting, specifically, I guess I've seen a lot of people come a cropper when their very single jacket gets wet, right, and then you're either got one layer or you commit to wearing a wet jacket.

So we're going to talk about the different parts of your clothing system, what you should look for and why you should pick certain things. I'll try and recommend things that are cheap as well, because I know that money is hard to come by and the world seems to be constantly trying to extract money from us. So this system's based on Do you know who Mark Twite is, Serene.

of books dream. Yeah, Well, one day talking me sheep, Actually, let's talk about basse layers because one of the things they could be made out of, showing is wool from sheep.

off quickly. Right, So you can get wet, you can sweat, but it's much more preferential to be able to dry off quickly. And that's all cotton doesn't do. And so that's why cotton is considered to be like your worst choice here. So if your base layer, you want to go with the two options, I guess well, it's it's like many things, it's a continuum, not a binary. And so you've got wool on one end and you've got

synthetic on the other end. Wool is really nice because it doesn't smell right, Like if you have like athletic clothing, that synthetic can get really stinky. If you wear it for a few days, it only gets stinkier. Wool tends to be much better for that. It also doesn't catch fire and melt to you, which if that's important in your line of work, then then that's useful. Wool is naturally fire retardant. Really where it's like, yeah, yeah, does everyone know this? Clearly? No, charene, but.

even sitting around the campfire. It is actually really shitty if your clothes melt to you. I've had gloves melt on my hands and it was unpleasant. Wow, that was only like a little bit. But again I can I can assure you that people sitting around campfires do have their clothing catch on fire. This is not like a thing. It's why all your tents have to be treated with a flame retardant treatment. It's that stuff that makes when

you're tent. You know, if you put a tent away where it's wet and hot, you leave it at the back of your truck, it gets really sticky when you when you get out. That's a frame retardant treatment on your tent. Oh, then lot about fire today. So the the problem with will though, is that you have to treat it with care, like you don't want to be tumble drying wool right, and it can kind of get misshapen.

There are like hybrids, the thing called new yarn, which I like a lot, which is like a wall synthetic hybrid. I have lots of clus stuff made of that, and then there are full synthetic things like have a little base layer here. Again this being mainly a podcast. Scharene can see this.

work on the railway lines or something. You know, if you're going to be active, having too thick of a base layer could be really annoying because if it heats up, that's kind of your last option. And if it's really thick and you try to rely on that for most of your warmth, then you're going to overheat. And then

when you overheat, you're going to sweat a lot. Or when you sweat a lot, that sweat is saying going to soak your layer right, and then when it gets cold, you're going to be wet and cold, and that is bad. So consider if your base layer like a lightweight or a midlight thing, and try and get your warmth from something else. It's whatever suggest. I really like the new yarm ones. Like I said, there's one made by Black Diamond called a Rhythm T shirt, which I really like.

I've loaded those. They are often on sale. You can get them really cheap. If you're looking for something really cheap, I would say to just avoid cotton, so you can look for things which are polyester or nylon, and those are going to be a lot better than just your T shirt. They are going to smell, they're going to get pretty stinky. But you can often find them for around the same price. Right, and if it's very cold, you may want basic layers your legs as well. Good

ones for those are hard to get cheap. I like ones that zip all the way off, like like like you know, like like Chipendale style. Yeah, but you want zips all the way down the side, Oh, zippers, so they're up pull on no, yeah, but because then you have to take your boots off.

in waterproof trailers. I really like ones that have vents, like mechanical vents, so you can open up so you can cool off these guys. Right, Like, the pockets are mesh, so if you open the pocket, not only can you get your accessories out, but you can also like vent off the heat that way, and so that way you don't soak them out with sweat. Right. There's a company called Beyond who makes every possible weight and size of trouser. I really like their stuff. I use this stuff a lot.

You can get kneepad pockets as well, which are super useful, not only if you're like like you see them in military gear a lot, but if you're working, saying, construction or carpentry or something that you have to kneel a lot. It's a really nice table on kneepad, So those get a recommendation for that. For a cheap one, the Proana make a parent called the stretch Zion, which I think is really nice. Climb in them all the time. They

can often be found really cheap. Your next thing is your active insulation, so that's you need to warm yourself when you're active, right, So there's two types of insulation. The system is active and static. One is for when you're moving and the other is for where you're stationary, and your active insulation is People used to call this a mid layer, but that was back when people wore like wool jumpers and you kind of had to keep it covered from the world or it will get wet

and stretched out and very very heavy. But sometimes this will actually be outer layer, So I don't think mid layer is a great term. That's what they used to call it. People used to use fleeces a lot. Fleeces are fine, but again they can get very very heavy if they get wet. Some of them don't breathe very well, and they can sort of very quickly become too hot of your exercising, and they're not very wind proof. They don't block the wind at all, so much better choice

is something called a grid fleece. So like the base layer was talking to you about, it has like a little grid pattern that allows for moisture and air to move away from your body, so like you're less likely to overheat. There's a really cool fabric called Polo Tech Alpha, which you should look for rather than like looking for a specific item. If you look for Polartech Alpha or Polotech Alpha direct, then you can scat around for stuff

that's some sale and find something that's really nice. It kind of looks a bit fleecy, but it's also a grid pattern. It's really warm and it's very small. I have a few things that are like made of that. I have one from a moot called the Alpha sixty. So there are different weights, right, sixty ninety one twenty sixty is the least. I think ninety it's grams for square meter, but ninety grams for square meter is pretty

much a good mid zone for almost everyone. So that's what to look for in those if you're looking for a cheap midless or a cheap way to stay warm while you're moving around. The US military has this thing called a waffle top because inside of it looks like a waffle right, I guess grid was. They like to give things baby names in the US Army. Oh LUKX, suren's got one. Yeah like that.

with any sort of intention. So that's where you want to keep your things separate, so you can choose choose what, like exactly how warm you are where then being forced to be like a certain level of warm. Talking of forcing people to do things, Charene, Wow, it's time for us to force them to listen to some adverts.

when you stop moving. So if you're hiking, that would mean when you stop to regrow, you stop to have a snack or to put your camp together or whatever. It's good to have like a really big jacket that is warm that you can toss on immediately. Putting clothes on once you are cold is generally not the deal. The deal that is putting them on so you don't get cold, because all you're doing with all these layers, right,

is trapping air against your body that is warm. That's what the little the grid parts and the grid fleece do, and that's what all the little feathers in the down jacket do, right. They're just trapping pockets of air that you heat up. So if you wait till you're really cold, it's going to take you a lot longer to get to get warm. The thing to do is once when you're moving you're nice and warm, you stop, you're gonna get cold. So if you toss on that jacket then

you can stay cold. I say warm down jackets are really complicated. If there are a couple of issues with like cheap down jackets that make them probably best avoided. One is the but if you're not using ethically sourced down, that the industry can be pretty abusive, right. That down is comprised of feathers that come from ducks and geese. It's not very nice to ducks and geese to kill

them and steal their feathers. And if you're going to do it at all, if that's something that you choose to do, you should at least try and find ethically sourced down, in my opinion. The other thing is that down natural down, when it gets wet, it clumps up and it doesn't work anymore. It doesn't insulate you, right, no like nicer downs modern more like modern downs are treated with water repellent coating, so they don't tend to

do that as much. But the other thing was down is that like a lot of numbers get thrown at you when you're looking at a down jacket, Like if you look at the money Internet, it's all kinds of information. Some of that stuff is bullshit. The things that are

important are the fill power and the fill weight. The fill power is it tells you how many cubic inches of loft one ounce of that down will fill, So a higher number is better, right, a higher number is more puffy, And then your feel weight tells you how much of that down is used in a jacket. So a higher fill power jacket with a lower let's say, a four hundred four power jacket with sixty grams of feel weight would be as warm as an eight hundred

fold power jacket with thirty grams of feel weight. So once you get your phil power and your feel weight, then you get a pretty good idea of how warm a jacket is going to be. So the other alternative to natural down is synthetic down. Right. Where that stands out is like it can get wet, and you can generally like baby it a bit less, but it doesn't pack down as well, and it is tends to be heavier, and you don't get feel power, but you do get

feel weight. So if you're the jacket I use is synthetic because like I like to shovel in my bag and sometimes it's wet, or like sometimes it gets a bit wet, right, I just I don't like to have to like try and baby it so much. I also, for ethical reasons, prefer that. There's a company called Prima Loft p R. I m A. They make synthetic insulation sort of very good, and they say make some from post consume recycled plastics and they have something that to

buy degradable as well, so I really like cool. Yeah, it's cool, right, Like I saw something a while ago and how ducks and geese are treated pelic down and it may be very I was like, I.

wall stuff I got before I was vegan. But I think if you're picking between wall and down, I think the down industry is it's hard to be mean to sheep in a way that people are mean to a poultry because sheep just aren't having it. They'll die.

you're stationary, so you put them on. And it's nice to have a hood on these two, right, because you don't want to be like, oh, I've got to get my beanie out, get my jacket on. You want to just be able to put your one big warm jacket on and then you're warm.

big difference, especially like your ears. You know, where the circulation is close to the skin, they can get cold your nose, right, you can get frost nip your nose and your ears. So like you do want to cover those things, having like a kafa or snowed is that what it's called.

to get rid of the turbidity. So like if you if you're filtering from buddy water, you can put your kafa over the lid of your bottom and then rub a band down scoop. Yeah. Yeah, many used to make a sling out of it. I won't use it to hold gauze on a leg wound that I had. Well, people lived a wife, Yeah, many of mycrofias lived a life. Just I'm just here for the ride. So yeah, that's your your down jack if you do want like a down animal down duck down jacket. The cataline ones are

really good for the money. The cathline is a French sports It's like French ARII or European ari It's huge in Europe, not so big in America, but there's stuffs excellent value. Also, if you want to get really dorky about down jackets and warm jackets, the ultra light subreddit a place where I definitely go sometimes more time than I should, is you you can find like someone has made a spread cheet ranking like the fill power, fill weight,

and price of different down jackets. So if you want to get into it, you can get really into it there. You can spend a lot of your life on that subreddit if you want to. So the next layer, and it kind of plays into the the two insulation things. It's your wind layer. So a lot of the way we experience cold as humans is through wind, right because of the way, that's why we have the concept of wind chill right, or the air rushing past you, cause you a lot more than that same temperature without the

air rushing past you. And this is often how we experience cold and the outdoors especially right. So having something like active insulation is great, but often like that alpha fabric for instance, it's you can see through it. It can be very warm, but it doesn't do anything to bluck the wind, and that's sort of by design, right, because it's allowing vapor to move out, which is what you want, but you do sometimes, especially in windy conditions,

need a layer to block the wind. That's your wind layer. It also helps a lot in not trashing your expensive insulation layers, like a very nice down jacket will sometimes have a very low the Denny account is like the thickness of the fabric, So a nice down jacket will still can often have a low Denny account. It's not really designed to be like it's not like recently, I've been out in cucumber building shelters for people, right, so I'm constantly carrying lumber and you know, using tools and

cutting stuff. And if you wear your fancy, expensive, super light down jacket, you're going to shred it and then you're going to end up with little patches of duct tape all over it. And now you're expensive down jacket's not as warm as it used to be. Well, yeah, sad time for you. So you can avoid this by either just not wearing it for that or covering it with a wind layer, which also helps because even those down jackets often like the wind can get right through them.

A wind layer is is a really nice option for a number of those reasons. Also, you can often just worry about your base lay and even down to pretty cold when you're moving trail running, like people trail run, I'm sure they'll have have already know this, but if you're hiking, your trail running, if you're climbing, a wind layer can really like increase the range of temperatures which

you can work in without getting too cold. And like a very small mind is like the size of maybe a tennis ball when I pack it down, but it makes you a lot warmer. And you don't want one that blocks all of the wind because then you won't be able to it won't be breathable. Right, Oh, you want something that's a little bit breathable. The one I have, I looked up the one I like. It's called a mouth in hardware core air shell, but core is spelled

with a K. How you know it's cool? Yeah, you got to you got to get it in, got to get it in this and where, and then wear is spelled like you know, like like wearing clothes, so double puns on their spellings. It's made of the stuff called

pertext quantum air, which is really cool. It feels like silky but it's a synthetic fabric and it's really nice and it's very small, and it's very light, and you could put it in and if you had, like if you're wearing like cargo trousers, you know you can put it in the side pocket or cargo short if you're that kind of person. So those If you're looking for a cheaper thing to block the wind, like you can

find pretty cheap wind cheaters right out there. You don't want something that's very plastic key and then kind of clammy you're going to sweat up in. You can get surplus British wind proof smocks that are really nice. I use those all the time when I'm working outside because I uploads of pockets. They're nylon cotton blends, so they're not all cotton, and they they're very like robust. You know, they're not going to wear wear down or like get destroyed.

If you're carrying lumber or rock climbing, right, if you're into clam like a lot of this stuff, will you need something with a thicker face fabric otherwise you're going to destroy it when you're climbing, especially if you're climbing somewhere like Joshua Tree where like the rock is like

sandpaper and it eats your clothing. The final layer is your waterproof, right, It's a final one because like you want to avoid wearing your waterproof really, Like I think far too many people where like they rely on waterproof coats when it's not raining enough to need one. The problem with waterproofs is if rain can't come in, moisture

can't really come out. Even fabrics like gortex per text and that they say that they're breathable, but I think anybody who's tried to exercise hard in a gortex jacket will tell you that they're not. Like, if you're hiking with a group and you'll put on your gortex, then you need to move slower because you're going to overheat, and then you're going to get wet from the inside

because you're sweating, and that's not what you want. So waterproof is important because when it's really wet and you're outside, you don't want to get soaked, right, But it's also not something you should be wearing most of the time. What you want to look for in a waterproof again, there are like statistics numbers. One of them is the

it's the pressure resistance of the fabric. Like it's expressed in the as the height of a water column in millimeters until it can push through the water resistance of the fabric. Does that make sense?

So if you live somewhere really wet, like Belgium or the UK, Belgium just sticks out in my head as a place where it rained all the time, but maybe that's just my bitterness. You're looking for, like something in the twenty thousand range. That's a jacket that you can pretty much wear all day in the wet and be fine. Gortex Pro Fabric, I know it's twenty eight thousand, so that's kind of your gold standard, but anything over twenty thousand it is fine. And then breatheability is the last one.

Moisture vapor transfer rate, and again anything over twenty thousand is good. The other thing to look for in a waterproof is taped seams, like you know, the bits where it stitch together. If there isn't tape behind those seams, then water can get in through that stitching. And like I've seen people get very expensive jackets which in explicably don't have tape seams. I think it's like maybe a fashion jacket or something, but I have like wet like down every seam, Like they take off their jacket.

risk free endeavor. Right, returning from my judgmental character to waterproof jackets, you know, te you know what else, I am judging how my voice out. I'm remaining a loop from judgment. I would never but but I am judging your products and services and support this show, and I'm judging them or because gold is not a good way to spend your money.

the wind jacket. I like toberhood if you're doing climbing and you're doing I never really wear a hood when I'm cycling, but other helmet actively if you're caving or canyoneering, might be a good idea to check the hood situation

with the helmet that you wear for that activity. So like for climbing, you know, you lots of people will say they have a helmet compatible hood, but I don't know what helmet those people are wearing because they don't fell over like even a pretty low profile climbing helmet. So if you know, if you can go to your loco outdoor shop, take take your helmet, you know, don't don't be afraid of trying on with a helmet on. And you want these all really to be cut to

allow you to move right. A lot of modern outdoor gear it looks really nice like when you're going about town, but it's cut kind of too tight in there. It looks very trendy. It can inhibit your movement, right, and so you want to be aware of that. You may have to size up. And it's not because you've got bigger, it's because close I've got smaller.

jacket over the gortex just to protect it. Right. I have two gortexs that like, I have one that's very small and very thin, and that I like keep as an emergency, like if I don't expect it to rain or expect for it, but I'm going on a week long trip, I'm not gonna you know, want to be completely fucked if it rains, So I bring a little one. It's called the Mountain Hardware minimizer. Kind of the name

gives away, but it's just very small. It's made of gortex pack light, which is like the lower tier of acceptable gortex. It's fine, you know, like a go outside a lot and I use it and it's fine. It doesn't breathe quite as well, but you can again overcome that rete with some with them zips that don't zip. And then if it's going to be red all day, I have a jacket that's a bit heavier, thicker, packs bigger, but the one I have is from a hunting company

called four Low lo h. It's really nice. Often, for some reason, hunting stuff in recent years has got a lot better, and outdoor stuff kind of has used to. Hunting stuff used to be shitty, but it's kind of

overtaken it for some reason. And sometimes it's also nice to have stuff that isn't bright orange and it isn't like you have a theory of why that is because people have a metrics shit ton of money and wealthy people have got into backgoundry hunting because they were I have a big dead thing, but these are not people who maybe some people, some people are sending it really fucking hard doing hunting and doing like ten twelve day hunts. And they're hardcore out doors people as well, and they're

very wealthy people. They like to be uncomfortable and they will spend a lot of money on expensive jackets. That's my theory. Yeah, thanks for coming to my ted talk. Those are the two things that you really want with any waterproof you do need to take care of them. I think with gor Tex that everyone should be aware of. It has what are called forever plastics in it, and they are really not good for the environment. And not only are they not good for the environment when it's made.

And this isn't just Gortex, right, I'm not. Gortex is a brand. They make fabrics, and I'm not just saying it's with all those like those those kinds of multi layer laminate waterproofs. And it's not just when they're made, it's also when water sloughs off them. Right, So when it rains on you and then that the rain you know, the rain drop goes into the three and the stream goes into the river, and the river goes into the ocean, that little forever plastics are still there, and that's not good.

I would imagine as with many things, it's more not good than we know right now. So some brands like fiol Ravan won't use gortex and this stuff for that reason, they don't have any forever plastics. Instead they use waxes. I think people are kind of maybe have forgotten or like you don't see as much of it as you

used to. But wax jackets are really good if it's going to rain all day, if you're not so concerned about weight, you can get like a waxed cotton jacket or waxed canvas jacket like car Heart makes some right or Filson have a nice Filson jacket that they were a lot and it's way less fragile, but it is

much heavier, but it's also better for the planet. So that's something If you do have a goratex jacket, like it's not something that I feel good like having five gortex jackets, you know, and like buying new ones every year, like you should try and take care of them. And there's a product called nick Wax which is really good. You should use nick waxsuff when you're watching any of your outdoor. If you're washing down, you should use nick Wax down wash or you're really fuck up your expensive

down jacket. So I think that's a good thing. And then yeah, wax, Like, consider how often you're really out in an absolute downpour and if that's not very often, like maybe you're okay with a wind layer or like just waxing the shoulders of of your like have a cotton jacket behind me that I just wax the shoulders off, but like it's like a smock with lots of pockets

and I just put wax. I bought some Greenland wax, which is which is a fear ratheran thing, and wax the shoulders so the shoulders are impermeable to water.

was extremities. Right, I have rainos where like to really? Yeah? Really rainos at hand?

So I found like having a base layer or a midle, a active insulation lare with thumb loops really helps because then thumb loops make sure that the sleeve goes all the way into the glove, and I would encourage you, rather than wearing one big ass pair of gloves, to have like a glove. I know this sounds really dorky, but like a glove system. So like a thin lacy glove and then a shell glove which is either waterproof or wind proof, and then if you want to, you

can then stack that with a mitten on top of that. Right. Yeah, I love emittletons are so cute. Yeah, get your person who sews in your life to so your par emittans. Have them join with a little string so you can run that through the sleeves of your jacket. You don't lose them. I used to have those.

body to do anything that much out of research. Make a good glove system, but they only make it for the military and they won't sell it to you, which is lame. Yeah, there's a lot of like so one of the reasons that some of this surtplus clothing comes up is because it's designed as a system, which is good. Right, it's one piece designed to work with another piece. And like, for instance, Patagonia makes a protective combat uniform for the army. As much as it would like to not talk about it,

it's still true and I've written about it before. But they make a really good system and it's great and scuffs got like. They actually have like this little graphic that's like if it's this cold, where this, If it's this cold and wet, where this, If it's this cold and windy, where this. And it's very handy for people, especially people who may not have grown up or had that kind of experience or just had the chance to

try different products because they're very expensive. Right, It's very handy to be like, Okay, this is and this, and then you only need these five or six pieces that way, as opposed to having dozens of jackets and dozens of different things for different weathers. So like it. It works very well, and it frustrates me that they don't do the same thing when selling to people who are not in the military. So the other things I wanted to

do with extremity is real quick socks, socks. It goes the same way as gloves that you don't want to a sock system. Yeah, I'm glad that you're picking up when I'm picking down a Serene.

its weight. The other nice thing about woll socks is again the insulate when they're wet, right, so your feet are going to sweat you're moving and so you want something that's not going to get your feet cold, especially your person who already gets cold feet. So Marina wool is good, our packer wool is very good. But yeah, you don't want to restrict with like one big fluffy sock. You can get insulated boots if it's really cold, I

right down until below freezing. I don't like insulated boots because again I don't like my feet to get sweaty.

you don't need an insulated boot. Maask makes some nice insulated boots that I've used. And then hats is the last one. Hats again, like it depends a little bit on the temperature. But I have a couple of wool beanies that I got years and years and years ago, and they're very good and they're very warm, and the only thing is when they get wet, they kind of stretch out a bit, so they don't love getting wet. You might want to put a hood over yourself. Otherwise.

A flee speanie is really good. People are sleeping on the flea speanie, but like a micro flee stretchy beanie, it's very nice. I tend to take them when I travel because I'm a cold person and planes are cold. So if I have that and my little Kafa in my bag, then I can kind of wrap myself up on the plane and I probably look a bit weird to everyone else, but I don't care because I am warm and planes are cold. I think that it's the

end of my ted talk on warm clothing. I talked for an hour about cold Cusherine, I didn't think we keep it under an hour? Really yeah, No, I've been draining my whole life for this shit. Like I love, I used to like my whole job used to be to tell people what to wear and take with them when they go outside. Wait really so yeah? Outdoor industry journalists who are years That was how I started my

little when I was little baby journals. The expert here, a little baby journalist, I wrote, I don't think I'm an expert, but I will say, well, I'll tell you what. There's my other little soapbox. You will read a lot of reviews, and sometimes, like the reviews for Boots, did they did Sharen in a good direction. Not everyone who's writing those reviews is going outside very much, is what

I will say, or sending it very hard. Some of them are, doubtedly are, but a lot of them are trying to get you to click a link which will return a certain percentage to the website that you're clicking the link from, so four or five percent back right, And you may, for instance, some of the brands I mentioned here don't have that. It's called affiliate marketing. And if brands don't have affiliate marketing, you generally can't put it in articles for lots of magazines about the outdoors.

This is something that I fucking loathe, and you can't be honest and say this is my favorite thing. Everything's designed to be seoed and to get you to click something and to return some affiliate revenue to the website. So it would take a lot of those reviews with a pinch of salt. And also just small brands struggle to get into a lot of into a lot of magazines because they don't have the marketing money to send piles and piles of free stuff. So yeah, be cautious

about what you read. And if you look around, you know, if you're looking at this shit like like I absolutely have jackets that got several hundred dollars that I got for free or I made some employer pay for because I was going somewhere horrifically in hospitable as a human life like Alaska, or Alaska's actually lovely. I'd like to live there, That's the dream. Right, one day, I'll podcast my way to a million dollars raise sheep in Alaska.

can find new stuff. eBay offer up a lot of people buy outdoor stuff, go camping, wants, get cold, get wet, get sad, slap it on the internet and sell it for pennies versus what it's worth, so you don't have to buy any of this stuff new. Most of these companies also have bomber warranties, and I'm just going to leave that there as to the combination of second hand purchasing a warranties. But you can probably join the dots.

flease blankets. You know, if you're looking towards your local unhoused community, right again, like think about things that are durable and that will still insulate when they're wet. Well if you if you do well, then then that's a great choice for a lot of those things. And perhaps we can have one of my own house friends on to talk about like effective donations. The best way to help people who are unhoused is to give them money and that they can buy the things that they need.

Because they know about the things that a good point and so yeah, yeah, that's my last thing for today. Give people who need things money so they can buy them. All right, bye, every one Bye. It could Happen here as a production of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts and cool Zone Media, visit our website cool zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever.