The Future of Abortion Access

We have two guests from the bridget Alliance in the Midwest Access Coalition. We're going to talk more about what

they do in a second. Broadly speaking, both seek to UM attach people who are looking for reproductive healthcare and abortion access UM but cannot get it easily in their area, UM with clinics and the things that they need in order to get to the clinics and glue in transit and you know, time and hotels whatnot, UM, in order to make it easier to get access to that kind of healthcare in places like the Midwest, where folks have been spending decades making it much more difficult even prior

to this recent ruling to get that kind of healthcare. So I'm gonna let our guests introduce themselves. UM, you've got the floor. Well, Hi, I am O'Dell Shelley. I am the executive director at Deep Bridget Alliance, and I'm gonna introduce my counterpart here. I'm Diana Parker, trusta from

the executive director of the Midwest Access Coalition. And yeah, so y'all have been in some ways kind of dealing with elements of the post row world because obviously, like you know, we're all focused on this Supreme Court decision that's in the pipeline, but um, anti choice activists have been working very hard to essentially create a post row world in chunks of the United States prior to this point.

So you all have been kind of dealing with the reality that a larger number of people are going to be living under for a while, right. Yeah. Yeah, Missouri has been able to effectively bad abortion state for years now. I think, Uh, there's maybe a handful of abortions that the one clinic there are able to do because of all of the trap laws, um, which is the targeted restrictions for abortion providers. Uh, and the waiting period, so people have to go to another state Kansas, Iowa or

Illinois Missouri. Um, and we've been helping those books for years, and UM, I'm gonna guess this. I mean, just because you've been living in with this for a while, I'm gonna guess the announcement last week did not come as a total surprise. The timing of it certainly did, which for Diana and I came at the heels of a conference that we were at thankfully together, which is was kind of just pure luck for us so we could actually commiserate together. But no, ultimately this is not a

huge surprise. I mean, I think we're all still waiting to see what actually happens in June. That the writing has been on the wall for months, in years, if not longer. And you know, as you were just pointing it out, essentially, for organizations like the Bridget Alliance and the Midwest Exist Coalition, we have been existing already because the protections of ROW are insufficient to actually secure abortion

access for all in this country. So this has been our lived experience, and preparing for this moment has um It has been a long time coming, and I'm sure there have been a number of conversations that have been going on about what to do and how to prepare for this right because the primary change is going to be, at least initially until some they make some sort of federal push that states that have some sort of functional access to abortion are going to be flooded with an

even higher number of people in need of care. Um, could you kind of walk us through what sort of steps have been taken to in order to kind of brace for that impact, so to speak. Yeah, So I think a couple of things. And and the first to sort of pull back on that for a second is to say that part of preparing for what's to come has been our orgs in the community that we exist in.

This this incredible expansive landscape of different types of organizations that have existed for decades to secure abortion access where the laws were insufficient, where um, people were faced with barriers like income in equity and geographic inequity and the

unavailability of providers. UM. This network, though, has a existed largely unseen, and so a lot of preparing for what is to come is really embracing our existence, feeling affirmed in that and in our value, not shying away from the expertise within this community, which is held both by volunteers as well as staff UM and so I think a lot of the last couple of years has been focusing on really trying to harness that expertise and that knowledge and compassion and the fact that many of the

people who are leading a lot of the efforts in the reproductive justice movement are people who have had abortions themselves, which is a enormous um and valuable part of how this movement moves and hopefully will continue to center the people most impacted by the fall of row UM. I think, more specifically for Bridget and or its like MAC preparation means deepening our relationships with the clinics that we work with. They are critical, of course, and their sanity is critical

to abortion access. Is making sure that we have the sufficient funding to continue to staff train that volunteers systematically and mindfully UM and ideally do so in a sustainable way so that we're not all overwhelming ourselves with the sudden surge of need and the sudden surge of impact UM.

And then you know, for Diana and I even personally, it means deepening the relationships that us practical support organizations have with one another, Because no one organization is going to be able to help every single abortion seeker who will need to travel. It will rely upon really strong and transparent collaboration. So those are some of the things

that we've been focusing on. One of the things that strikes me as a problem that's going to be, if not immediate and pretty imminent for y'all, is we've are you seen threats and promises from legislators in some states to attempt to criminalize leaving a state where abortion is illegal in order to get access to healthcare? How what? What kind of preparation is even possible for that sort of world, because it does seem like we're staring down

the barrel of that. Yeah, I think the only preparation we can have right now is to expect that the corners will allow them to do that. Um. They're very creative now that they've seen a go into effect and hold on as the law of the land, even though it's in direct violation of federal law. UM scoede us. The highest code up court of our country, uh is

the one that has been allowing that to happen. And so that sends a huge message to all these UH force birth legislators that you know, bring us your worst take on the law. We will in a way to let you keep it. UM. We're we're working with you on this and UM you just need to get bolder

and bolder and see what you can get away with. UH. So we can't really predict how they're going to do that, although Missouri has indicated that they're going to consider an I guessing as it's fertilized a resident and UM a resident of the state, that they have, you know, responsibility for protecting UM, completely ignoring the fact that it's growing inside a complete human being that has rights. UM. But that's that's the latest that I've heard of them figuring

out how to restrict someone's someone's travel UM. But it would require a significant shift in how we understand constitutional law and UM the basis for our legal system, and that that seems like something that I don't know, like really genuinely seems to be on the table in this moment. I maybe we have I think it's Louisiana who's trying to like part part part of their bill is that they like literally it says that they can disobey the federal government, which we had a civil war about that,

we had we had a nullification crisis about that. We like, so, yeah, I guess I'm wondering what your impression is on like how far this can go? Like, do do we get to the point where states can just like tell the federal government no? Yeah, yeah, I mean that's what the architect of the st law essentially told the part is that they don't have jurisdiction and all the laws that they have passed in the hundreds are actually um enforceable, and the federal government has no authority to stop them,

and uh, they are the fifth district ants. Tootis has indicated that maybe you are right, maybe that is the correct way to interpret our constitution. UM. So I feel like all of that, all of our decades centuries of um figuring out what the law means for this country is just up in the air, and we may be looking at laws now that are just more and more buzz are um, as long as you know the GOP and the right have control over so many bodies of our governments. You it really is, I can't even fathom.

I don't think we can predict what's going to come honestly, Um, I mean, I'm also wondering, to put it crudely, will legislators in states that are currently committing because we have seen an umber states California kind of leading the pack committing to maintain um access to to to abortion and other forms of reproductive health care that are being threatened

right now? Do do you like, do you feel like you have a good chance that they are going to back you, especially in the event of, you know, laws that would potentially open people like you up to criminal charges just for trying to support people in getting you know, reproductive health care outside of their state. Is your question? Do you do we think that elected officials that are pro choice are going to back us? Yeah? Yeah, yeah?

Do you like it's entirely possible that we're going to see some sort of federal law that not just criminalizes abortion or even like prior to that criminalizes aiding people in seeking abortion outside of states that have banned it, right, Like that's on the table. How does that change the landscape?

Where do you suspect that, like in kind of a similar way to have some of these some of the legislators and states trying to ban abortion said like we're just going to ignore federal law if that contradicts our state law. Do you think that, um? Do you think that pro choice legislators in states you know, like California are going to be willing to go to the mat

and protect you? Or are are we? I mean, yeah, I guess I I know this is kind of an unknown, but I'm kind of these must be conversations that y'all are having, right, I mean, I really freaking hope that they are. And if they're listening, please please prepare to

do so. And it's really heartening to see states like California and Oregon, in Illinois and New York and Connecticut for instance, UM, come up with really clear language around their support of not just choice, which was the language of the past, but abortion and are saying that and are starting to invest in things like abortion funding and trouble to themselves actually, you know, put forth their own efforts to contribute to the people will need to travel

into their states. UM. And you know, Diana was just speaking the other day with a bunch of electing officials in Chicago, So I think I think this is also why what I was talking about earlier in terms of orgs like ours, coming coming into the light is so important, is that we were going to need those relationships with those politicians. We're gonna need them to know us and see us and understand that we're a critical part of how we're going to serve their constituents and that, yeah,

we're going to need them to back us. Will they I can't say definitively, but I really freaking hope so yeah, yeah, and hopefully those you know, as deal said just now, I was UM in a press conference yesterday the city the Mayor's office announced this fund to support abortion procedure

funding and practical support. And my hope is with UM municipalities will talk to each other and give each other the models for doing UH this protective, preemptive UH support for people traveling to our states for abortion here and UM yeah, I'm in with talks with the a c l U in Illinois to talk about potential UM bills that are floating around to even further protect UH pub

in this state. Specifically, I know of one that wants to explicitly protect providers from being extradited or sued or shut down by prosecutors in other states that want to claim that they have to jurisdiction because like, like I said, they figured out a way to give residency status to fertilized eggs or something. You know, it's just completely fun that That's kind of what we're staring at, right Like that that's that's the thing that you have to be

concerned with, is like out of state law enforcement. I don't know, like and and that's the thing. No one knows what it's going to look like, right Like, we know that they have a vested kind of interest already and do being parts of this through bounties, which is kind of like the thing that I'm worried about. Are we going to see like out of state law enforcement bounty hunting people trying to folks up with reproductive healthcare?

And I guess that's just kind of an unknown at this point, but it's right, and it really depends on like our local protected state juristics, Like how far are they going to go to protect us from those entities that are going to try to come in for us? Um Just just today, one of our staff members tweeted about practical support funds and who to support throughout the country that provides the sort of travel logistics for people

and they got followed by a sheriff department in Missouri. Yeah, so there are already you know, targeting and surveilling uh, abortion seekers and the people who support them. Yeah, and of course I'm sure that there's a degree to which some of these folks are working with um, shall we say, non state actors in order to like, I know they've

been prepping with that for a while as well. Um, what is I mean one of the things that I know because I've been having some conversations with friends of mine who are and like I guess we could say adjacently adjacent organizations to to where y'all work and who are at in some cases the convention you were at, who are concerned that as providing people with reproductive healthcare

becomes illegal. Um, there's going to be a lot of fair weather friends kind of revealed and I I am interested, like, is this a thing that in order to be engaged in providing people with reproductive health care you have to be willing to engage in illegalism at this point? Like, is that really where we are? That's really interesting question. Yeah. As as a member, like as I go and threes, uh, you know, looked at our state governments are federal governments.

We can't engage in anything that's legal. Um. But people have forever on their own dumb things that the state has considered illegal in order to have bodily autonomy. UM. There are people who can't afford it. There are people who are just so far from the nearest clinic that they can't even fathom how to make that trip. Uh.

They're undocumented folks. Uh. There are people near the borders that can't even physically move past a border checkpoint because they're just trapped there and can't get care um in other parts of their state where it's available. UM. So there that that will be a thing. I think that is going to increase, because the need will not decrease. UM. And I do not like my organization and we can't really see anything about that. But you know, personally, I'm like,

you do whatever it takes to live your life and thrive. UM. Laws are made up especially now. Yeah, that is nice to hear because I, you know, I try to keep abreast of the sides of this fight that are you know, working through five O one sees and and the like and engaging in electoralism. The people who are you know, doing stuff like trying to figure out ways to um provide access to like miso pills and whatnot to people, UM,

because that's just where we are. We've talked about the degree to which you guys have already been living in some people's future, you know, just because of the specific nature of what your organizations have been doing, UM, and the degree to which you know you knew some of this is coming. What has surprised you outside of just like the fact that it got leaked ahead of time about kind of what we've seen in the last weekend change mm hmmm mm hmm. I think I am. I'm

not so much surprised by the response from folks. UM. I'm a little frustrated that it took this moment for people to realize what has been happening in this country for the past decade, few decades. Honestly, this is this is a very long game, uh for the antis. But ever since Trump was put into office and started just flooding the federal courts with very young, very anti conservative

judges UM and SPA was a huge flag. UM. But I think I was surprised that there was a maths amount of people that we're going to step up when the decision came out. Um, it's it gives me hope. I hope it's sustained for the many many years we're going to need uh practical support and abortion funds while we fight for legal rights. Um. Yeah, so I guess

the surprise is a mixed it's a bad for me. Yeah, I was gonna say something similar that I think I've been pleasantly surprised at how well educated and informed a lot of our supporters and newer supporters are about as Diana mentioned, the existence of abortion funds and practical support organizations. That practical support is even being talked about is huge. We couldn't get this conversation and into the media a couple of years ago. So like, this is really remarkable

and important. But what's more, there seems to be also like a understanding of why we have to exist. Um, it doesn't seem to be shocking people quite as much of but there certainly are still tons of people who are shocked by this. But for many, they're not shocked that for some abortion has simply been inaccessible and what those reasons are. Um, and you know that's things obviously to a lot of the really hard, important conversations that have been had over the last couple of years about

racial justice. And I think that, you know, it's a silver lining for sure, but I'm I'm grateful to find that the depth of the conversations is there now and hopefully that means that the commitment is going to be sustained in long term, because this is a little bit of deja vu for us in the sense that we've

had little moments like these ever since our organizations existed. Um, when a single band goes into place or threatened to go into place, this like swell occurs using my hands a lot, which obviously can't see if you're listening to me right now, So I'm gonna put my hands down, um, and you know, and that and that brings out a lot of really incredible donors and a lot of really incredible offers for volunteers, and and then they tend to

go away. Um. And especially when when Biden was you know, elected, and there was definitely this like moment where everyone was like, Okay, we're cool, right, which this guy hasn't said the word abortion, but we're still fine. And we're not We're like the furthest from fine. So yeah, again, like pleasantly surprised that people seem to have, um a sense of why we're here. Yeah, I just wanted to bring up the website. Did Biden say abortion yet or it just like it's so unfortunately

hilarious to me, um, but I've is really glad it exists. Um. And then they someone reached out to the someone in the Biden administration to make a comment on this when the when the the draft was leaked, and they said, well, we tweeted it or like whatever it's and it's like it's he said it once in a tweet and like once in like a statement or something. So I just think it's there, you go. I don't know what more we want, but like, I just think it's important to

what you were saying earlier. Um, how legislators in Oregon or California, like it's so important they're saying the word abortion, not just pro choice, because I think a lot of people are a lot of people are scared about that word for some reason, or it sounds scary to them if they're not that educated about what pro choice means

or what abortion means. So I think I have a little bit more hope seeing more people even saying that word, UM, because it yeah, yeah, I think the statistics is something like the antis have been using the word abortion three times as much as we have, and that is why it's so stigmatized and difficult to talk about. And I definitely try to encourage people to say the word abortion, to talk about abortion with everyone they know. Uh, just

so we can stop hiding. I guess kind of the last thing I'd like to ask, and we can we can cut this bit if this winds up not being

something you want to get into. But have you have you felt an additional need to worry about given how public you are in your advocacy personal protection UM, as things kind of have heated up, you know, we were we were recently at the conference that you mentioned before, UM, and it definitely with all of my colleagues in one place, it definitely made me feel a little vulnerable for myself and them. But honestly, the people who are targeted or the providers by far UM, I'm not worried about my

physical safety. UM. I'm worried about the physical safety over of our providers and the fact that our government is responding to peaceful protesters outside kavanas Um House and talking and and asked for I think Susan Collins on the sidewalk outside her residents results in legislation being media immediately, they all somehow got together for once in their lives to do something about the terrorists who chalked sidewalks by

legislators home. Um uh is it's it's really demoralizing. Um, because we have our providers have seen violence and um yeah, they've seen violence every day, murders, ASCID attacks, bombings. Um. Yeah, Chris Sharene, do you have anything else you wanted to

get into. Yeah, I wanted to ask one thing, so, you know, Okay, seeing this sort of increasing fectlessness or politicians even by their standards, and you know, their response to this being let's give more power to the U. S. Marshals, which is maybe great, the worst idea I've ever seen. But what can just people do about this in it? You know, I mean we've talked about like giving to abortion funds, but like what, how how can people get involved and how can people get involved in a way

that's sustainable of the long term. Yeah, I mean, definitely give two abortion funds, give to practical support organizations like the Midwest Access Coalition and the bridget Alliance. UM. If you are interested in volunteering, reach out to your local organization. UM. There are a couple of really great resources for lists of those organizations and where they are, like the National

Network of Abortion Funds. UM. And you do bear with all of us because we are handling a flurry of emails and that's incredible, But we won't be able to plug you in immediately. UM. It might even take a little bit of time. But then I think that you know, voting is still critical, especially in local UM, in any local elections, especially if we're thinking about how we're going to prevent the possible criminalization of abortion seekers and of

abortion providers. We need to make sure that we've got the judges in good local elected officials at the very least, So do not stop doing that. UM. Yeah, I think those would be the things that I would say, focus on and the thing that I always say, which is

just like talk about it. Like I am totally that person who is like the downer at the dinner party talking about abortion, But be that person and go and talk about it and share why it's important and how it's not just about abortion and it's not just about women it's at families, it's about parents, it's about queer folks, it's it's about immigrants, it's about miners. Um, You've got a lot to be worried about right now, So don't

stop talking, listening, reading, consuming whatever you can. Yeah, And just to jump off that, if you are in a safe state, you're not going You're not going to be safe forever. Uh, They're gonna come after us. They're going to come after the legislators, the supreme courts of those states. They're usually a thin margin, um as far as conservative

versus progressive judges on state supreme courts. So find out who your local org is that is leading that voter turnout to make sure that people are voting for the right judges go in. Um. And also I wanna lift up escorts. Escorts are on the ground many days of the week. They will put you to work and they're going to be needed more and more. UM. Yeah, I think that's that's all very important and a good note to end on. Does anyone else have anything else or

are we um? Should we should? We? Let y'all get back to your very important work. UM, And thank you again for for making the time for us absolutely thank you for covering us and talking about it. Yeah, happy to do so we'll be we'll be continuing to to do that. And I hope you all. Um, um, jeez, I don't even know what to say. Like, I hope you. I hope you function up for the people who are

sucking shut up, you know. But I hope the support doesn't like dissipate as like the trend goes away or whatever. You know. I think that's so disheartening if that happens. And like, hopefully the flood of emails but not necessarily remains a flood for you. But like, I hope that people are actually serious about doing something. And um, I think this time they might be just because I keep being surprised about little things, so I'm not gonna expect

anything anymore. Maybe people were surprising, But I really appreciate the work you do. Um, So thanks for coming out to talk to us. Thank you, Thank for us. It could happen here as a production of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for it could happen here. Updated monthly at cool Zone Media dot com

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