Inside The Longhouse: The Right Wing's Latest Meme - podcast episode cover

Inside The Longhouse: The Right Wing's Latest Meme

Aug 15, 202346 min
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Episode description

Robert sits down with Gare and James to talk about Bronze Age Pervert and a surprisingly influential new family of far right memes.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Transcript

Speaker 1

It could happen here a podcast about frustrating people and frustrating times. That's not all it's about. Sometimes we talk about nice things like like raising sheep or unionization efforts, you know, the endless struggle of working people to better the world. But not today. Today we're having a real, real piece of ship episode about a real piece of ship, and it's gonna make everybody unhappy. Hello Garrison, Hello James. How are you both doing today?

Speaker 2

So much better for hearing that, Robert, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 3

Just ready to have a fine evening here, ye about something that's probably very fun.

Speaker 2

Yeah, going to be good. You don't have you don't have your soda stream? Disappointed in you?

Speaker 1

James and I are now so toa stream pilled.

Speaker 3

Not I've not gotten the company so to stream yet that has must generation.

Speaker 1

Yeah, the unfortunately the company beverage is is Billy Beer. Uh Billy Carter Jimmy Carter's Brothers beer that was on sale for roughly a year in the nineteen seventies.

Speaker 2

Is it made of peanuts? If only?

Speaker 4

No?

Speaker 1

So today let's start. I got a question for you. Have either of you seen the Barbie movie?

Speaker 2

Yes?

Speaker 5

I have.

Speaker 1

I was it well done, Gear.

Speaker 2

Oh I didn't go buddy sold gear.

Speaker 3

The said dress thing was was nice.

Speaker 5

It was.

Speaker 6

It was a great lesson in like liberal recuperation. I'm sure, I'm sure.

Speaker 3

I'm sure it'll be great for like kids who like don't know who like don't know what feminism is.

Speaker 6

But but yeah.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it seems I have not watched it either. It doesn't seem like my kind of movie. But it seems broadly act correct me if I'm wrong here, that it has what you might call like very very modest and fairly mainstream approachable feminist message. Yeah, yeah, that seems like it's fair, which most people would not be particularly angry about.

But a sizable chunk of the very online right, the chunk of the right, particularly that makes their living by having takes on shit has has has been up in arms ever since it came out, and particularly ever since it made more than a billion dollars in the box office. I'm sure a lot of people are aware that our old friend Ben Shapiro filmed a forty two minute video tearing it apart and his signature preteen stolen Valor voice boy.

Speaker 3

After I watched the movie, me and some friends tried to watch the Ben Shapiro video for fun. We made it like six minutes in, and that everyone forced me to stop.

Speaker 1

Intolerable shit. Cowards. Cowards are cowards. But that's yeah. So elsewhere in the right and kind of the less mainstream acceptable chunks of what we'd call the insurgent right around here, various thought leaders attempted to declare the movie stealth conservative propaganda as a way of insisting that its success was really due to it being anti woke. That's silly too. None of this is worth discussing in detail. I promise you all, this is not going to be a podcast

about the fucking Barbie movie. None of this is worth discussing in detail, save to say that Shapiro's anger at the movie, and particularly its comic relief character Kin, seems to have been the more wide spread response from those kinds of people. Now, because I have made, over the years a lot of poor decisions in my browsing and

engaging habits. Over the years, Twitter sends me a lot of weirdo right wing responses to everything that happens in the world, including this movie and one of these posts that I caught somewhere in late July or on the twenty second, twenty third caught my eye. Now this post features a vapor wave filtered kin photoshopped in front of a burning Viking long house, accompanied by the text exit

the long house. Now, when you see something like this and you don't know what they're getting at, like, you have two choices. If you're like, you get like, I don't know, kids, a really demanding job, anything at all going on in your personal life, you scroll right past it. If you're me, you spend like four and a half hours reading various fascist essays about feminism to try to figure out what the fuck a longhouse has to do

with the Barbie movie. Now, the guy who had made this post is a low level fascist political columnist named Lomez. He is, he's kind of on me. He's a little bit of volapild. He's he doesn't he's not like a very major figure. He's kind of several steps below anyone you've heard of. I would say, like two or three steps standard deviations of fame below like Jack Pisobiec. But his writing has a degree of purchase among the kinds of conservatives who trick Ron DeSantis into running in comprehensible

campaign ads with son rads in them he has. He's like, he's got a little bit of influence among that kind of crew, and he's sort of in the conversation with a lot of those people. I took notice of his post because I'd seen the term long house being used by a couple of these guys off and on, and because Lomes's post got like three thousand something likes, which meant that, yeah, there's some community out there that gets

what he's talking about. So on a whim, I clicked to view the quote tweets for this post, and I found a post by a user named Siege, which is of course a reference to a book about carrying out acts of terrorism in order to bring about a white Ethno state. The post says, Kin is you. He is an exaggerated Western man in the twenty first century, anxious, confused, chasing women who don't care about him. He exits the

long House and discovers his own will to power. Like you, he decides to bring this knowledge back to his fellow man, and it's you know, I'm gonna I'll show you guys this this post here. It's pretty pretty Nazi. Yeah, pretty pretty Nazi.

Speaker 2

It's not the best work on Ken, like he guys looks like a blob.

Speaker 1

No, I will say I have a little bit of respect for the craft here that he didn't just go to an ai that looks like somebody like crudely cut a picture of kin that they have like uh uh, color inverted and then photoshopped it into a picture of a long house with a fire behind it.

Speaker 2

It's too.

Speaker 6

I will say. Uh.

Speaker 3

Sieg's description of Ken from the from the from the Barbie movie is pretty accurate to what's in the film.

Speaker 1

M that's good. So what is the long house? What the fuck does a long house have to do with what are otherwise pretty standard neo Nazi esque messaging about, you know, the decadence and failure of modern man and all that kind of shit. And is this dumb fascist

memes something that you need to care about now? Unfortunately the answer to that is yes, because all of this ties back to one extremely influential, insurgent right wing ideologue whose followers have been close to the presidency once before and may yet find themselves there again. That asshole is an mi I T graduate named Kostin Alamaru who posts online under variations of the name Bronze Age Pervert. You guys, how aware are you of Bronze Age Pervert or BAP as he's often known.

Speaker 2

I've heard of BAP, but maybe only in passing because I wasn't familiar with Bronze age pervert. Thank you, yeah, thank you for sharing with me today.

Speaker 1

Robert, Oh, oh, You're going to be so much less happy, Garrison, are you familiar with this fella?

Speaker 3

I think I may have only seen stuff from him in passing. I'm not I'm not overly familiar.

Speaker 5

Now.

Speaker 1

Yeah, that was kind of my experience until like a month or so ago when I started really digging into the guy. And I don't feel better as a result of having done that. But uh, yeah, we know that this guy's actual name is Kostin Alamariu because of a very recent Atlantic articles, like a month ago, that this guy got revealed in this article because this writer for The Atlantic was a friend of his, like at mit, like it was just somebody who like and recognized his

voice on a podcast. Now, this article, I find it frustrating for a number of reasons. I don't think it's great analysis of BAP's work or what people find appealing in it or a particularly honest, intellectual look at what this guy has to say. But it does have some interesting reveals, including the fact that Bronze Age Pervert's first public media appearance was a parody audio tour for an exhibition at the Boston Museum of Fine Arts, written by

bj Novak, who played Ryan in the Office. Yeah, so that's that's odd, and it's one of those BJ Novak is not a stealth Nazi, don't worry. But the video or the thing that they put together does kind of fit it for like a fascist art project. And I'm going to read how The Atlantic describes this audio tour they put together together, or put that they assembled together.

Novak had recruited a Romanian classmate with a deep voice, and together they'd recorded an audio tour for the exhibition Tales from the Land of Dragons a Thousand Years of Chinese Painting, with the help of friends. They then slipped cassettes containing their tour into the museum's official audio guides. Art lovers must have wondered about the thick Eastern European accent that greeted them over the twang of a Chinese

string instrument. The Romanians soon became opinionated. Personally, he said, I think this painting is a piece of crap. Then deranged, he alluded to his disgusting anatomical abnormalities. He called his listeners decadent imperialist maggots, and confessed a desire to smash a glass case with a sledgehammer and rip a scroll to shreds with my teeth, which, by the way, are extremely long and sharp, more like fangs than human teeth. At last, he offered an interlude of idiot music while

he fumbled with his script. This should keep you occupied, you drooling, imbecile, he bellowed at the listeners, by now either amused or complaining to management. So there's like there's like little little whiffs of degenerate art stuff in there, but it's also just kind of like they like a little bit like Max head roomy kind of stuff, like where you're kind of tricking people into into into consuming this like parody artwork thing. Like again, I think this

was a pretty innocent joke on Novak's fall part. But Costin number one probably got picked for this because he's a he's he's got a thick Romanian accent that he very much plays up. He was noted in this time as kind of talking like Dracula deliberately. He also would always wear these like long and elaborate black coats, so that he kind of looked like a Dracula type figure, like he was, you know, he was he was doing

a bit. He was putting on like a That was the image he wanted to He wanted to portray himself as to people as kind of like mysterious and Eastern European sort of sort of figure.

Speaker 2

Now.

Speaker 1

Costin first started posting as bronze age pervert on a series of obscure web forums in twenty ten. In the November of twenty thirteen, he joined Twitter and immediately fell in with a loose community that some people call frog Twitter. And these are you know who these guys are. It's like a general term for anonymous alt right adjacent posters

with like pepe avatars. Yeah, and the other group the kind of related people that he fell in with and that he started to have traction with our adherents to a fascist philosopher known as Curtis Jarvin or Minsius Moldbug. Curtis is his real name. Minsius Moldbug is the pseudonym. He wrote under now I know it's a it's these.

Speaker 2

People this shit, man, it's just so pathetic, like play Dungeons and Dragons.

Speaker 1

Just a solid twenty percent of our fascist problems are like people didn't get a reliable D and D group early enough, like a lot of these I think Balder's Gate three is gonna save us from a lot of these guys in the future.

Speaker 2

The Antifa computer game. Yeah.

Speaker 5

So.

Speaker 1

Curtis Yarvin aka Mensius is a UC Berkeley graduate in computer science who joined the tech industry and got pilled on a strain of anti democratic libertarian theory.

Speaker 2

This is this is like a this is a pathway, man, Yeah, this is perfect well.

Speaker 1

Bronze age pervert also goes into tech after graduating from m i T. Right, and like, you know, a decent number of these guys come out of like Stanford and shit, like it's all, uh, it's all these guys who are, in fact, to some extent, like intellectual elites, bronze age perverts. Dad is a teacher at mi T, like just kind of like you look at like Stephen Miller's background, Right, A lot of these guys come out of like liberal

academia families. But anyway, it's very common. Yeah. Curtis comes out of uh yeah, gets into the tech industry and he writes a book kind of while he's he's working and like he's a he's a founder and stuff for some company. He writes a book in two thousand and one titled Democracy, The God That Failed, follows it up with a series of blog essays, and his writing becomes

very influential amongst Silicon Valley proto fascists. Jarvin's ideas in brief is that the US is run and a lot of Western society is really run by what he calls the Cathedral, which is a mix of professors and journalists who act as a Brahmin class dominating the United States

with a progressive state religion. He sees their egalitarian impulses as toxic the destruction of natural civic order, and advocates for his followers to design new architectures of exit to replace the Cathedral with what is effectively a right wing dictatorship. The number one supporter of Curtis Yarvin's ideas and financial backer of him is Peter Teel Teal has a funded Jarvin's work as a big fan of what he has to say and his philosophy, which is generally referred to

as the Dark Enlightenment. And this is when we're talking about dark Enlightenment, we're talking like mid aughts is kind of when this stuff starts to really take off. This is before the alt right that kind of becomes really well known nationwide. Is A is A is a major term. This is like in the pre and right around gamer Gate period is when he's really starting to take off

with a lot of folks. And he certainly he feeds into the alt right to Trump, you know, and to that period of time, but he's much more on the the pseudo intellectual end of things as opposed to the like hitting folks in the street end of things. That's

what he gets a lot of Peter Teel money. So uh yeah, Bronze Age Pervert is kind of a he He espouses a philosophy that rhymes with with moldbugs with Yarvin's philosophy in many ways, but where Yarvin dresses his words and is writing up in a costume version of mainstream academic discourse, Bronze Age Pervert is unapot apologetically online and weird and he writes, like somebody who spends too

much fucking time on the Internet. A lot of his stuff is cloaked in things that are like half jokes, or at least want to be have plausible deniability of jokes, so that like, if you take them seriously, he can make fun of you for falling for the bit. But he describes himself on Twitter as an aspiring nudist, bodybuilder, free speech and anti zeno estrogen activist, So just just the most irritating.

Speaker 2

Kind of guy, the normal guy.

Speaker 1

Much of his politics centers around a worship of ancient Greece, which he believes settled on these scientifically ideal human form. He believes men should engage in bodybuilding and nude sunbathing to emulate the Greeks, And you'll see sometimes his followers be like, oh, you're an idiot if you fell for that. But legitimately half of what this guy posts about is just pictures of bodybuilders, and his pictures of himself being

looking very jacked like he's he's it's it's that. If that's all a bit, then all he has is this silly bit, because it is it is dominant in his content. BAP's ancient Greek or baps. Ancient Greeks are incredibly straight and hate women with a passion. One of those things is more or less right Greek, like upperclass Greeks, not super pro women, yeah, not woke. The Cathedral, in his eyes, is an oppressive dictatorship of femininity, if not always of

women over masculinity. Cancel culture is a particular topic of his ire, and he seems to see it as basically these that there are traditionally feminine methods of argumentation and conflict, whether or not women are the ones doing them in any given situation. Cancel culture is like the purest expression of this, and he believes that these kind of feminine methods of conflict destroy masculinity and make cultural progress impossible.

They chain men to this kind of like he sees, you know how a lot of anarchists will talk about how ancient society, these hunter gatherer societies, and like we're often more egalitarian than a lot of like medieval societies, classical societies, and this is often a lot of folks do make the mistake of like idealizing these cultures. But like that's a thing that gets talked about a lot positively by by by some anarchists and I think obviously

worth studying. He takes the opposite tact of like these ancient cultures like light, like people lived in the fucking mud and were miserable, and it was because they were't a galitarian. It was because the women were dominating the men. Right, this is going to lead us to the long house in short order, but we have somewhare to cover right here.

So he focuses a huge amount on anti egalitarian arguments and on supporting a culture dominated by strong, beautiful, powerful people who look like Greek statues and suppress women and anyone else who doesn't look sexy. Basically, you get to feel like that's a big part of it to this guy, like he wants he wants a dictatorship of hot, violent men. That's that's a big part of what he argues with.

Has he watched Lenny riefenstyles Olympia because this scene, Oh god, yeah, I feel like that's playing in the back of his fucking mind at all times.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Now, Bapp argues that the state in its present form preserves the lives of the weak and feeble minded, allowing them to oppress the naked Aryan bodybuilders who by all rights ought to run things. The prime repository of his philosophy is his twenty eighteen book Bronze Age Mindset, which was at one point in the top one hundred and

fifty books on Amazon. A former Trump White House official Toad Politico in twenty nineteen, if you're a young person, intelligent, adjacent in some way to the right, it's very likely you would have heard of it. In chapter thirty five of his book Bronze Age, the Bronze Age Mindset bap rights quote, should the tyranny that has descended on our age ever gain the power it seeks and then be

challenged enough to feel itself in danger? The mass annihilations that will be carried out by homosexual, transsexual, and especially lesbian commissars will exceed in scale and cruelty anything that has yet happened in known history. Imagine lesbian Mulata commissars with young Martin sheen face and haircut manning the future. Bergen Belson's installations that will span tens of miles.

Speaker 2

Yep, sending you to the transgender goolag.

Speaker 1

Yeah, it's it's it's something else, and it's very funny because like that fucking the Atlantic writer here like talks about how he's he's got this like almost hypnotizing quality to his writing, and he's he's got this really like, uh, fascinating mind that you just want to engage with, and it's I'll read you a fucking quote from this guy's profile on Bronze Age pervert and try not to gag.

I consider myself a connoisseur of brilliant lunatics, and I have a high tolerance for their lunacy if it has compensating virtues of say humor or ingenuity. But even I find back worrisome what starts as comedy can become something more sinister and bap shtick. Well sometimes hilarious shows every sign of transforming into a mode of new far right radicalism. He goes on at a various point to be like, yeah,

he likes this book that I like. So I was willing to put up with the fact that he was he was bigoted for years because like we would talk about literature together, you know, I just had so much respect for his mind that I was willing to be strung along for a long time. I don't I find this guy kind.

Speaker 6

Of connoisseur yea a connoisseur of pig shit.

Speaker 1

Yeah.

Speaker 3

I really love sifting through all the different types of donkey dogs.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I just can't stick quite enough shit.

Speaker 2

Uh you know what make you become a connish there of dog shit? Internet content?

Speaker 1

What what? James what? James?

Speaker 3

What?

Speaker 5

Will?

Speaker 2

Well, it's it's a Washington State Highway patrol.

Speaker 1

Uh, that's that's I hope they are ready for the lesbian commissars. Oh you know, I know, I am.

Speaker 5

Yeah, there the work police.

Speaker 1

Ah. And we'll back.

Speaker 2

We're back, We're back back, We're back.

Speaker 1

We're back.

Speaker 5

Oh.

Speaker 1

Yeah. So it was Joseph Conrad's novel Nostromo that that this Atlantic writer and uh and Bronze Age Pervitt both loved. Yeah, yeah, here origin another fucking paragraph. For many years we corresponded. Costin's messages arrived regularly, and the tone ranged from friendly and inquisitive to boorish and insulting. I went to South America on assignment. He sent long messages extolling the issues of Joseph Conrad's Nostromo, which is selt there set there.

A friend who reads books like Nostromo and can talk about them is a friend worth putting.

Speaker 2

Up with South America. It's fucking not even a fucking country.

Speaker 1

Just yeah, incredible generally South America. And like right after that, he says, after about ten years, he took to calling my friends and then he uses a series of slurs. At some point he had begun bodybuilding, and he sent me a picture of himself shirtless with the message, do you like this pic of me?

Speaker 2

Again? A cure guy.

Speaker 1

It's just a just a real genius, so Bronze writings, Yeah, he's substating one of the one of the Greeks he's obsessed with because he's he claims it, like frames himself as an expert on Greek society, which he portrays as something of a paradise. But he only knows about like six guys and one of the as Alcibiades and Alcibietes, was an Athenian general and a statesman who was a big player in the Peloponnesian War. He defected from Athens to Sparta and then from Sparta to the Persian Empire

before being recalled and reinstated as an Athenian general. He is a real motherfucker and an interesting guy. And because he was so interesting and kind of he was very charismatic in his own time, and this kind of like very shady figure two, he becomes an early celebrity. He's like one of the first famous people that's really out there.

And a big part of why he stays famous is that Plato will write a lot about him and Socrates, right, and Plato's at writing a after they're dead, So a lot of Alcabietes is like a character written by Plato as opposed to the actual historical fact about the dude. It's also worth noting, given how anti queer bap is, that Alcibiades and Socrates were lovers. Socrates was like famously kind of a simp for Alcabieties, while also was kind of a piece of shit to Socrates. A lot of

fun stories about that. But these guys were not at all straight.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I mean, pederaste was an institution in anteen Greece. That pederaste is the same as being.

Speaker 1

No, no, I don't I don't think that's the same as what was going on with these two dudes.

Speaker 2

Yeah, these dudes are just.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, yeah, happy for mm hmm. Bronze age perverts. Rants are profoundly silly to anyone who wasn't a deranged chud obsessing over white girls don't like him while shooting steroids into his ass. But because that's a fertile demographic, he has influence among some important conservatives.

Speaker 2

Form the White House in the technical sense of the word.

Speaker 4

Yeah not not after all those steroids, yeah hit testuestering too much.

Speaker 1

Well, and none of these guys will let themselves touch a walms because they're they're so they're so horrified by the concept of women. So former White House speech writer Darren Beattie followed him on Twitter and in a acted with his writing, as did Minnesota State Senator Roger Chamberlain.

Curtis Jarvin called him his White House cell leader. This is interesting to me because BAP himself has encouraged his young followers to avoid supporting him in public and instead of hide their sympathies while taking positions in the government to institute his ideas. It's also worth noting that you can find some fans of Bronze age pervert on the

so called anti woke left. There's clips out there from the red Scare podcast which the less set about the better, where the two hosts read segments of his book with a what seems like a degree of appreciation, calling it the good kind of racist.

Speaker 5

Yeah.

Speaker 3

Does that also makes sense in terms of their condess they're like anti feminist stuff that they do.

Speaker 1

Yes, Yes, And I think his his writings, he has a very like florid purple prose style. I don't think it's good writing. I don't find it particularly engaging. It's very channy and kind of exhausting. But people who are dumbfall for it. So yeah, yeah, he's hit his demo.

Speaker 2

Well.

Speaker 1

Now. His influence is significant enough that some conservatives have sought to explain it. I found a fun write up on americanmind dot org that describes his appeal this way. So, what exactly is the teaching of Bronze age mindset and why is it so attractive to so many young men? The answer, I think is simple. It is a revitalized

paganism obsessed with strength and beauty. It appeals to today's young men because these things, strength and beauty are exactly what contemporary society has tried so hard to deny them. The gospel of son and steel, of vitalism, and strength and power are exactly would have been denied to the boys of the Western world and their spirits militate against this. Everything great ever achieved, Bap tells us, was done through

strong friendships between two men or brotherhoods of men. And this includes all great political things, all acts of political freedom and power. Now I should note part of what he Bap gets at when he's talking about how these strong groups friendships of between two men or small brother

the hoods of men. He is a big advocate and one of the reasons why he is popular among like the Adam Waffen set is he's a big advocate of his followers forming small two, three, four man groups and training with weapons together and preparing for the future, you know, day of the rope style thing. He doesn't use that term, but he's he's speaking to those people from like a

more educated mindset. And there's I think an extent to which you could see his writing as trying to pull in that kind of educated upper crust kids of the upper middle class, you know, with ivy League educations who go into politics, trying to draw them in closer to the actual violent insurgent right at least in terms of the sympathies of their ideas. And support for methods of organizing that are more traditionally found against you know, the I Loham City set, right. I think there is a

degree of that going on here now. Bronze Age Pervert is more supportive of Trump than a lot of these guys, largely because he finds him funny and sees him as an avatar of disruption and destruction.

Speaker 6

Yeah. I think it's it's like an accelerationist support.

Speaker 1

Yeah, exactly exactly, which is actually honestly that there's that's perfectly logical because Trump is accelerating both the death of the kind of conservatism that is state loyal that is sort of system loyal, right, the George W. Bush kind of conservatism, which.

Speaker 6

Is a conservative system that's like the two thousands.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Yeah, and Trump is has done damage, terrible damage to that and damage to the structure of the state in the hole. So it doesn't it's to perfectly logical for him to support Trump. He's not like, this is not inconsistent with the other things that he talks about. One of the people that that Atlantic writer talked to is Michael Anton, a former Trump administration national security official who wrote a twenty nineteen essay in the Claremont Review of

Books about Bronze Age Pervert. He acknowledges that Bapp's work is racist, anti Semitic, anti democratic, misogynistic, and homophobic, but suggested that like, you know that that's all, that's not you know, that's not necessarily what he really believes. Maybe it is, but the big reason why he does this

is it key. It distracts leftists from his like his more serious, like secret heresies that are like the real, deep, dark, arcane wisdom at the center of it, like hang out with your bros and trading with guns or whatever, or yeah, like heiden the fucking government and waiting for the right moment to strike, but then blow it all up when you make an ad for Ronda Santis. That kind of

cleverness anyway. Anton writes that Bronze Age Pervert quote speaks directly to a youthful dissatisfaction, especially among white males, with equality is propagandized and imposed in our day, a hectoring, vindictive, resentful, leveling, hypocritical equality that punishes excellence and publicly denies all differences, while at the same time elevating and enriching a decadent incompetent and corrupt elite.

Speaker 2

There you go.

Speaker 1

So what does all this have to do with long houses? Well, let's finally get to that. Longhouse describes a category of dwellings that have existed on basically every land mass and the planet in some form, stretching back to the Neolithic period. These are, in general, large halls, sometimes with private family rooms built into them, sometimes with communal sleeping arrangements, but

always organized around a large, single communal hall. In ancient days, these are where feasts would be held and where groups of families or tribes would huddle together in long, cold winters. Bronze Age Pervert conceives of the long house as an example of the miserable lives primitive and shameful cultures not his beloved Greeks lived in before modernity. In his writing, he makes it clear that his fear is rule by degenerates and our fallen modernity will cause society to regress

to this prehistoric misery. Now, the heart of his hatred of what he calls long house culture is that, in his mind, these dwellings were dominated by women who forced men to live inside the smoky, cloying, stinking confines this is not really accurate to any kind of history. I expect his conception here comes largely from the fact that long houses are often suspected because we know relatively little about many of the cultures that had them, are often

suspected of having been organized among matrilineal lines. In other words, if you, as a dude, merry a lady, you move into her family's long house. Right, this does sink out. There are modern cultures that lived that had long houses or have long houses who also live this way, the Iroquois being a good example. Right, there was a long house culture and where which house lived in was matrilineal.

But it is a mistake to characterize matrilineal as meaning like the women are completely in charge, because they were not an Iroquois culture, nor many other cultures where longhouses existed. Vikings lived in longhouses, and you might recognize there's a society is not precisely anti masculine.

Speaker 2

Yeah, the Vikings, Yeah.

Speaker 1

The woke vikings. So this is more of a problem though, with the conceptions of the longhouse that are spread by Bab's followers, because again he's using it as a shorthand for the fact that this kind of like prehistoric darkness of egalitarianism is going to destroy the only thing that, in his view, can bring progress, which is small groups of beautiful men enforcing their will through violence. Right, that's what he talks about when he's talking about the Long House.

His followers tend to use the Long House as a short end, more of a shorthand for the kind of stuff Curtis Yarvin gets at with the cathedral, a catch all term for progressive modernity, women who get to say no to sex and have their own credit cards, trans people on hormones, vegan meat, substitutes, and yes, the Barbie movie.

Speaker 5

Now.

Speaker 1

I open this episode with a post about that movie by Lomez, an adherent of Baptism who wrote an interminable article on the Long House for a website called First Things, which describes itself as America's most influential journal of religion and public life.

Speaker 5

I love it is.

Speaker 2

Yeah, I bet it is, buddy, And you can tell because they always let you know straightaway. Yeah that's true.

Speaker 1

Yeah, Yeah, they really got to hit that up for you. I'm going to quote from that now. Even for those of us who use it, the Longhouse evades easy summary ambivalent to its core. The term is at once politically earnest and the punchline to an elaborate in joke. Its definition must remain elastic lest it lose its power to

lampoon the vast constellation of social forces it reviles. It refers at once to our increasingly degraded mode of technocratic government, but also to wokeness to the progressive, liberal, and secular values that pervade all major institutions. The most important feature of the long House, and why it makes such a resonant and controversial symbol of our current circumstances, is the

ubiquitous rule of the den mother. More than anything, the long House refers to the remarkable over correction of the last two generations towards social norms centering femine in needs and feminine methods for controlling, directing, and modeling behavior. As of twenty twenty two, women held fifty two percent of

professional managerial roles in the US. Women earn more than fifty seven percent of bachelor degrees, sixty one percent of master's degrees, and fifty four percent of doctoral degrees, and because they're overrepresented in professions such as human resource management, and compliance officers that determined workplace behavioral norms. They have an outsized influence and professional culture, which itself has an

outsized influence on American culture more generally so. The Wawright taken over human resources, he sounds like he lost to fight with his fosaurus when he's writing that, Like, yeah, at every point, like he's just using unnecessarily long word. Yeah, it's it's I mean, it's also just like women have are dominating society because they they're getting more bachelor's degrees.

Speaker 2

Yep, that's what it is.

Speaker 1

Huh okay, uh huh.

Speaker 2

Yeah, that's a famous to useful Baptist which always leads to employment.

Speaker 1

And position to tremendous wealth.

Speaker 5

Oh.

Speaker 1

Also, and the idea that like human resources are in some degree to somehow setting the terms culturally as opposed to responding to the needs of corporations to mitigate risk, right, Like r's that's what HR actually is. It's not setting an agenda, it is avoiding lawsuits, it is minimizing exposure whatever.

Speaker 5

Ye.

Speaker 1

Lomez also goes on to quote Richard Hanania, an influential conservative thought leader who is revealed recently to be a neo Nazi or at least someone who regularly wrote neo Nazi things in neo Nazi parts of the web and wants to be seen as respectable. Now, well, we'll talk about him later. Lomez approvingly notes that Hanania echoes a bapist talking point when he discusses how female domination of HR has given them control over public and private institutions.

Now again, the way Lomez is talking about this shit is not actually in line with how Bronze age Pervert conceives of the long House. And one of the funnier results of everything that I've been talking about today is that Bronze age Pervert now spends much of his time on Twitter angrily tweeting at his followers that they're using the longhouse wrong. I'm gonna read you a post. It is from July twenty seventh, longhouse has gone crazy, out

of control. Usually misused. It's not a synonym for feminism or matriarchy, nor for group consensus, though those are part of the story. It's a concrete image from pre airy in Europe of lower life and of most traditional societies. Baby got away from you. Yeah, And some of his ire is likely due to the fact that his followers, who are largely very young, tend to apply what they see as his analysis to children's movies. Here's a real

good one. Yeah, this is a it's a post for a picture of like the female villain from the movie Tangled by Activated Sleeper. If you want a good example of the nebulous long house, look no further than mother gothal Fane narcissism driven by resentment and envy of the young, whose primary and most effective weapons are gaslighting, manipulation, and the rhetoric of fanatical safety ism. It's good stuff.

Speaker 3

Thank you, Activated Sleeper, for you Activated Sleeper exposing that great cutting, cutting commentary on the twenty twelves Tangled.

Speaker 2

Now.

Speaker 1

One of my favorite recent examples of how many of these guys use the long house was a post in the off my Chest reddit which went viral on Twitter. The post is by a woman who says that she interrupted her husband while he was telling a story, and he was like, hold up, Tony Minner, talking as like a joke, and she got angry at this and they

had a fight. One popular bapist response to this story, fifteen hundred likes in counting when I found it, stated men attempt to take one comedic step out of the long house, and the locks get ten times bigger.

Speaker 2

Jesus Christ. It is.

Speaker 1

It is very silly to like bring up actual history with this, but one of the points you'll find and like writing about long houses traditionally is that because everyone was cooped up in the winter comes spring, the women were generally like doing everything they good to get the men to fucking leave and go hunter something. They get the fuck out of that, get out of here, like, go do something else. We need something, need like a fucking week or two without you hanging around. Go to yeah,

go to war, do something. Jesus Christ. Nobody likes being cooped up in a fucking long house anyway. That's that's the long house. That's uh, bronze age pervert. It is kind of worth noting because these guys are convinced that, like they are the intellectual vanguard of this movement that's going to overturn what is classically described as lib rualism, this idea that like people have like rights that are worth protecting, and shit, that that's a failed idea. It's

obviously failed. Look at how ugly buildings are today, and they'll post some picture of like the Chicago World's Fair. These people are like weirdly adjacent to the the the Tataria conspiracy theory that one hundred years ago the world was ruled by this like vast advanced Russian empire that made all the nice buildings, and then World War Two was a secret excuse for the rulers of the world to destroy all the good architecture, and that's why buildings are ugly.

Speaker 3

I definitely seen like this bad guy in those in those like circles of people who are like like culture critic or like Greek Greek enjoyer or whatever. Ye, like, yeah, those pictures of like like old expensive architecture stuff and mixed in with like like either like uh mostly mostly like brutalist or like moderness architecture.

Speaker 6

Be like what happened?

Speaker 1

What which way? Well, for one thing, like the society that people like you insisted upon this one in which like value is maximized at all costs. So we we took windows out of my school that was built in that brutalist periods because.

Speaker 3

It because like it's like because some like prince bankrupted their country building this pretty building, and that's why we don't do that anymore.

Speaker 1

Like you thought, like, yeah, jacked dudes with guns should run everything started a series of wars that bankrupted those countries and they had to sell their nice buildings to the Americans. Why we got the London Bridge, I assume.

Speaker 3

But it's it's definitely all that all in like in that in that same rough rough Twitter mill you. I mean, it's certainly now that you've explained all of this at longhou stuff, it certainly makes sense why they're kind of fawning over the Barbie movie.

Speaker 6

And I mean very.

Speaker 3

Clearly Ken is going to become one of these like a memeable characters because of what he does in the film. It's he's he's going to join the pantheon of like American Psycho and uh, all.

Speaker 6

Of Ryan Gosling's other roles.

Speaker 5

It is.

Speaker 3

It is fascinating how right Goslin kind of has become like the literal poster child for much of like the dissident like anti feminist rite just because of the types of roles that he's taken.

Speaker 6

But yeah, I mean, it's it's.

Speaker 1

Really questionary tale male actors.

Speaker 3

It certainly makes sense in context of the Barbie Movie in terms of how they kind of structured all of the like social critique in that in that movie. But but yeah, this is very silly. I mean, uh, it's I'm excited I won't have to hear much more about like the uh the stunning poetic prose of Bronze Age.

Speaker 2

Perfect. Yeah, fucking the Atlantic every time. Never.

Speaker 1

It's so like weird because there's there's this whole thing that opens the article where he's talking about how like, you know, the the first strains of this new anti democratic, you know, anti liberal thinking in academia came out through philosophy students who you know, realized that their professors just took for granted, you know, the the truth about things like the value of human rights and didn't weren't ready

for their arguments against them. And it was these like these people who didn't want to be told not to think in certain ways. No, man, they were assholes. They're asshole rich kids who needed somebody to hit him in the fucking face. They need they need a folding chair deployed on them, Like yeah, yeah, you.

Speaker 2

Got to see.

Speaker 3

I demand to shutdown of all coastal universities until we figure out what the fuck is going on.

Speaker 1

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm sorry if you were pretending that you are, like somehow in the insurgent underground, uh as the son of an M I T professor, going Tom I T yourself like you fucking dilat that's all. That's all this fucker is is a diletant, and that's all most of the people following are. It's a mix of dilettants and guys who are going to shoot up walmarts anyway, right, cool.

Speaker 6

Give him a follow, Give a follow.

Speaker 2

Yeah, yeah, I'm checking out activated sleeper and I've learned a lot already. So oh yeah, yeah, you're getting pilled by him? Yeah yeah, yeah, pretty much. I you know, as much as one can be hill by a fourteen year old. But uh yeah, really interesting stuff here. I think fair to say that this is an insight into a world. Oh buddy, fuck me, all right, yeah wait, we're not talking about that. We are not talking about his bedroom wall by everyone.

Speaker 1

Oh oh wait, now I got a lotch James, what did you We can bleep it.

Speaker 6

You have to at least tell us what you Oh wow, his his pinned.

Speaker 4

It's fucking I'm not sure it's get veteran playing. Yeah, what's on the veteran. And what looks like is that a German national about like a German? Is that Imperial Germany?

Speaker 1

Yeah? I think this guy is a kaiser Reich.

Speaker 6

Dude, this is certainly impressive.

Speaker 1

I'm sure.

Speaker 6

I'm sure he's getting all the ladies in there.

Speaker 1

I gotta I gotta show you guys this pinned tweet and then I'll read it. It's all caps. Let me tell you how much I want a FED post. There are a hundred billion neurons within my brain. If a FED post was written on each and every one those neurons, it would not equal one billionth of the compulstion I feel feel the FED post at this micro instant fed post, FED post that means posting about doing a terrorism So.

Speaker 3

That this is the type of tweet that could either come from the sun, like like mentally unwell leftist.

Speaker 5

Yeah yeah yeah.

Speaker 2

The flag he has, just to be clear, it's a franco Is flag of Spain, which, okay, it's something that good we will have to talk about, which is the American right has been embracing franco As like based and good uh for a while now, like as this kind of returned to Catholic tradition and like it's just anti woke crusader.

Speaker 6

I do call it.

Speaker 3

The suggestion follows here on Activit Sleepers Page, son Optimist.

Speaker 1

Aleric, the Barbarian Impernter Philippus.

Speaker 6

These people are such birds.

Speaker 1

Here's he's reached a post from Bronze Age Jacob Eurowski. Jews are like the one ring for politics.

Speaker 3

I think I think, I think I think reached the I think we reached peak peak.

Speaker 6

I don't think.

Speaker 2

Yes.

Speaker 1

I hope you've all learned a lot from this. Have a wonderful week, every wonderful week, and funk you for making me write this to our listeners. It could happen here as a production of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Speaker 3

You can find sources for It could Happen here, updated monthly at Coolzonmedia dot com slash sources.

Speaker 6

Thanks for listening.

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