The three most important qualities that we should have is love what you do, or fall in love with what you do. Second is learn, which is becomes more difficult as you grow once because you have less time, or you become more arrogant in thinking you have. You know it enough. You don't need to learn more. And then legacy, I think what you need to do as you grow is defining for
each year. What is the legacy that will survive me that makes business people, organization, relationship better than when I came but set something that is achievable, measurable and extremely concrete you you're
listening to part two of my incredible interview with Ilaria resta, the CEO of the luxury watch brand, Omar Piguet. If you haven't yet listened to part one, be sure to check that one out first. Now, without further ado, here's part two of my awesome interview with alaria. So everyone wants to know today who's watching, who's not a watch collector. How much do these costs? And let me just go through some stats here on you and your competitors. So we
start with Rolex. The average price of a new Rolex watch is $13,562 the average price of a Cartier is $6,340 the average price of an omega is $7,296 the average price of a new Patek is $44,389 the average price of an AP watch is $53,786 and the average price of Richard mill, which is the most expensive Watch you can buy, on average, is over $200,000 who is your typical customer and what's the percentage between men and women buying your watches?
We we don't have a typical customer as such, but definitely I can back at you in in, in clusters, even though I really don't like doing that, because there are so many nuances in each in each bucket, definitely have the collectors. So we have people that, over time, are building a very thought through collection. It could be by brand or multiple brand specific complications, or like a lifetime at a certain center century, they're
collecting. There are different theme, thematics of of collection then, and they represent the most knowledgeable of our clients, and the ones that actually transmit their passion externally. So they they write blogs, they are on social media. They are the ones who will spot your watch and comment on it and share it. And it's a very active community, and often they know each other to be
collectors in the world. Then there is there are people who buy to celebrate a certain stage in their life, people who use watch as a memory holder. So a new promotion, the birth, the marriage, and in this case, watches also represent an emotional connection to the person, to the moment. And they capture, they capture memories.
And we had, for instance, the other day, I just learned a couple came to our boutique and he offered, in front of the bootsui managers, a watch engraved with William ary me to his girlfriend? And it's the first time we we kind of assisted with this request for managing a boutique. So that was clearly the case of somebody who buy for an emotional connection to the watch in the moment. And then we have the stylers, people who just love how the watch
looks. They choose watches for the esthetic appearance, also for the complication appearance, and they make it a statement for themselves or for others to buy a watch. And then there are many more. What we are trying to do is to have a diverse enough reach to the prospect clients and the clients in terms of opportunities, we are underdeveloped with women. We are in the range of below 20% of buyers of our watch are women, when we know that by 2030, 45% of women will buy a watch in the
industry, mechanical watch. And the scene is changing, because in the past, women were not so much into mechanical watches, and now they are getting more and more interesting. And what we see actually is with the younger generations of of kids. They at the age already of between 20 and up, they start being interested in watchmaking, and they even bring their fathers, who are not into watchmaking, into this world. And yesterday, we had an event.
The son was the one bringing the father and educating the Father on on the art of watchmaking. And it's interesting, because this is an hyper connected generation that you would say, why would they buy a mechanical watch? And actually, they are rediscovering vintage in many areas, including, including watchmaking.
Finding an AP watch is a process. Right? One of the things that people like me and everyone else, you go on an AP store, nothing for sale. You go on a Rolex store, nothing for sale. I remember going into my first AP store. My son showed me this royal watch. He had an opportunity to buy one, and he said, it's very hard to get. Like, can't be that hard to get. I walked into the store said, Hey, I would like one of these. And they look, they look at me like I was from the planet Mars.
When I finally did some research, I said, Well, I would actually like one of those. I'm in Aspen. I walk into the store, I need Leslie Cameron, who's who was great. And again, there was a whole song and dance there, right? I knew I'd done some research that I had to basically get to know her, get her to know me. Trust me that I'm not going to flip the wash. We'll talk about flipping in a minute, and basically talk about me and my buying behavior. And I started with, I collect art. So I put
myself in the category. I've been an art collector now for 25 years. I don't flip pieces. If you flip a piece, meaning, for those people who don't know what flipping a piece is, you go to an art show. Your relationship with art galleries that you've developed over the years. There may be 10 or 15 pieces from that show, and there may be four or
500 people who want them. So the people who get them get first choice are the people who are loyal customers, who have good collections, and who don't flip the art. If you can flip a piece of art, and I bought a piece of art from behind nicodem me, hi, I love you. Thank you for letting me be a very good
customer. And this piece of art was $80,000 and he promised it to me because I had bought a larger piece of art from him, much more expensive, maybe a year before, and he promised me from the same person who painted this painting. And he said, I'll give you the second piece of his next show. The first piece was going to Charles Schwab, who's going to put it in a museum. He's going to donate. So I got the second piece, and it was a small piece of art, but there were several small pieces, and
there were three of these. This one was the best. So he offered to me, it was $80,000 that night, he said, The person who bought the second piece will pay $250,000 for that piece. I could have made a lot of money instantly. I said no. And why did you say no? Because my piece was a lot better than the other piece. Then it came back with an offer for more money for that piece, and I still didn't sell
it, right? And it would have been okay at that point to sell it, because it was going through the dealer, but I still don't want to sell it, so I still and why? How's you, you know? Oh, I love it. It's in my house. I look at it. I mean, art brings me tremendous satisfaction now carrying amazing watches, and I have a brigade that was the first watch my mom bought me from graduation. I have a Chopard watch, which is cool
with a rubber band. My wife for my 50th birthday, for my 50th birthday, but for my 50th birthday, bought me a Hublot watch, which is my daily watches. Is very, very meaningful. How does someone get an eight to watch for the first time you answer
yourself the question you wouldn't necessarily want to go in for two hour interview. That is not going to
interview. See finally, what she's going to be embarrassed, by the way, but what I'm going to say, but you know, she going back and forth, you know, to the back room, and I don't know what she's doing, right by some there's some due diligence going on. I'm not sure who she's calling, but when she came back for like now, I know she's calling you and so. So when she came back, I glanced at her phone, and my my website was her phone, so I knew what was going on back there. So sorry to
embarrass you. Leslie, but what's the process here? Let me
answer you in a simplest possible way. If we were in the business of revenue, all these were gonna happen. If our obsession and objective is, you know what? Let's maximize
revenues. Let's get rich. Let's sell we are in a business of relationship and passion for quality and and I'm here again to make sure that this way of doing business perpetrates for 150 years when you want to build a relationship with somebody, you don't go and say, Okay, will you marry and if you want to marry you, you marry me to the person you just saw in a bar. Yes, you don't do that. You
build a relationship, right? We are in a business of relationship as much as we are in a business of time pieces selling, because the moment we create a relationship, this relationship lasts for many, many years and beyond you. We receive watches of the dates 100 years ago, and we service them and we repair them. We take. Just because we discover movements that we are not
producing anymore. And you enter in our family, and we are truly we call our clients AP family, most of them, because they really start getting to know us. We know their collection. We can
curate it. And then if you come to Le brasu, which I really love to have, you to the bra Su, and maybe you do a video recording on the way we produce, you will see that it's so much manually done, and there is so emotion in the in the process of finishing and watch and letting go, where I had one story, one woman watchmaker, she asked me the favor because I was doing my own boarding, asking, What can I do for you? What can I do better? Is there anything? And he helped
me neither. She said, Yes, can you please bring me back the watch I helped to assemble to say goodbye, because before he leaves, the level, level of attachment these watch makers have with their creation is very high, and it's for us, it's important that that we create a relationship with the people, then they're bringing those watches to their wrists. We need to make sure that we give you also watches with the highest science standards of excellence. It takes months, if not years,
to develop them. So we are not in a transactional business where you want you buy, you go home and we don't see each other anymore. This is not our business model. You
know, it's interesting, when you talk about the prices of watches, I mean $53,000, for the average price watch. I mean, I was in the store in Vegas. I was in Leo's store in Vegas as well, and they were showing me a $400,000
watch. Which is which? Something I'm not going to do right now, at least, but, but, but, but, when you, when you think about it, every customer is a millionaire, or they're not being financially responsible, because when you're paying $50,000 for a watch, that means you have to earn at least in the US. You're in the highest tax bracket. You have to earn
$100,000 to have a watch. And some of the watches are 100,000 $130,000 so you're talking about a lot of people who have a eight figure net worth coming in to buy the watches.
The figure you mentioned indeed is an average. So we have, we span differently in price. This is not our entry price for watches, but three or 3000 of your
entry price, right? So probably,
yeah, we have less. We have lower as well.
By this, or can they show me the lower one? By the way, maybe because
they know you so well that they want to cater to your knee. Parallel website you see, okay, that's intimacy with clients, because we know you and we offer you what you deserve. But no jokes aside, the prices range depending on again, complication and and development and materials. We just launched the universal, which is the most complicated the wrist watch that won also the Grand Prix the Lord Roger Vin and Geneva last year.
This, watch is more than ever and more than a media, but it takes at least two years to assemble manually by one watchmaker that wakes up every day to do only that watch in Switzerland, you can go visit the person and see your own watch under development over time, so the time and the price is connected to what I call the overall value question of the
time piece. And we're after value creation with materials, with the complication and innovation behind so our calibers are some are a trademark, because we do so much research on micro mechanic before launching that that's what those behind the price that you read,
you look at the Birkin bag per maze, you can't get one unless you go in and again, it's based on your spend, right? There was a class action there was a class action lawsuit filed in March of 2024 saying, Hey, this is monopolistic behavior. A customer should just be able to walk in and buy a Birkin bag. When you saw that lawsuit, what were you thinking? Are you worried that AP may be facing the same issue along with the other high quality watchmakers? We
don't ask people to buy certain amounts of watches. We don't create these these connections. So I'm not entering the case of her mess, because it's separate case that I don't know enough to express any opinion, and I don't want to, but in our case, what we have a certain capacity of production, that is a choice, and the choice comes from excellence. If we would do these watches assembled online with zero human power, if we would copy caliber of others. If we wouldn't use these materials, we
could produce more. We decided not to produce more. We decided to produce less than the number you gave before, because we are aiming at the highest, highest standard of watchmaking, which makes us in the need of making choices vis a vis our clients. We welcome all our clients. Is a matter of time when we can serve them within the time piece they want, but when we are not into the business of combining or bundling, which is not part of our for
limited supply watches like yours, demand is usually greater than supply during COVID, the pandemic, wealthy people had nothing to spend their money on, so a lot of them bought luxury goods that went way up in price on the secondary market. You can't get one from the store. A lot of stores weren't open, and then they wanted, they still wanted to spend money. You had watches like the Royal Oak. You have a lot of models, but going for
five times their value. And when you see watches trading on the secondary market for that kind of price, there's an opportunity to sell your watch for a lot of money. Luxury watches over the last five years, depending on the brand, the average luxury watch has beaten the S, p5, 100. Are watches good investments.
Watches have always been also another class, like many other luxury brands. And I think what matters is more the innovation behind the watch, the how much craftsmanship there is behind the watch. So I don't buy, and most of our clients in our lives you don't buy thinking of an asset class, thinking they really think about the usage, the importance of the watch in their own collection and in their life.
There's a huge secondary resale market for luxury watches. It's estimated to be $25 billion a year. That's revenue that you could be collecting on certain watches that you're not collecting. There's been talk of you starting a secondary watch market, for lack of a better word, where you're reselling these secondary AP watches. Is that happening or going to happen?
We're working on, on, on a project that has the mission to create the offer a service to our clients in terms of certification of our watches and offering them the chance to renew their collection if they want, hence sell certain, certain watches. We are honestly thinking still how and if this proposition can work, and if, if it works, in the next years, we will launch
there's a company slogan which says, to break the rules, you must first master them. Is that true at any successful company
depends on the company. It was true for us, and it's still true for us. We are a rule breaker in a positive sense, in the sense that other market in the history has always been so edgy to go and try to do things that didn't make any sense. And that's what I call it rule breaker. You don't have to go back too many years ago, but when the royal lock was invented, it was a rule breaker
across all aspects. I mean, it was in still priced like gold, in a huge shape, because at the time, the 39 diameter was considered to be gigantic. That's where the name jumbo came. It was a big, big watch in a context where we were at the very at the onset of the the, of course, crisis. So coming with that launch was like, Are you crazy? I mean, what happened to
you? And in fact, it was received with mixed feelings by the market, and then it became a good success a few years after, we launched the thinnest perpetual calendar, again, in a moment where extremely expensive in a content, because it's the highest complication possible we could do. Instead of focusing on entry price to fight the courts, we focus on the highest complication to to set ourselves
to another league. And then if you look at all the marketing campaigns, the collaborations we have always been, if you want infant rebel in the Watch making industry by doing things that pushed outside of the edges of what was considered normal. And that's the way we work. If you go and come one day to visit us, you will see these personalities in the company. That's why I believe there are certain people
who can work at odemar PK. Some others cannot work another market, because we have this witty spirit, this sense of not taking ourselves seriously, yet our job is extremely serious and professional, this constant it try to go further, break the rules on materials that cannot be produced because they will crack you know, we use the ceramics that can can be destroyed easily. That takes a lot of tire trial and error to
produce, and yet we do that. So there is this common desire to go beyond that belongs to us. We've
talked about extreme preparation, how important that is to our success. What are three of the most important qualities that we can have that lead to our future success?
The future in
Yeah. What are the three most important qualities, ingredients of success as people that we could that we should have? Yeah? I
have mine that I keep repeating all the time, and there are coincidentally three, is love, learn and legacy for me, in any job you do, in anything in life you do, I have these three guiding words. Is, is love what you do or fall in love with what you do. And normally, is much more falling in love than loving because it's very rare. You will love always what you do, the bosses, you work for your colleagues, it will be much more an active role of falling in love that you need
to have. Second is learn, which is becomes more difficult as you grow once because you have less time, or you become more arrogant in thinking you have, you know it enough. You don't need to learn more and learn and make learning accessible to others the Learn, especially now with all the changes we see. What I learned that 30 years ago working at PNG is completely relevant. Now, if I would stack to that learning, I would be
obsolete as a CEO. So learn, learn constantly, and a legacy, I think what you need to do as you grow is defining for each year. What is the legacy that will survive me that makes business people, organization, relationship, better than when I came it doesn't need to be a grand use legacy. People say,
ah, save the world. Reduce CO two emissions, sure, if you have that chance do it, but set something that is achievable, measurable and extremely concrete as a league legacy, every, every, every, every year. And that's how I judge my people in the performance evaluation, the question I have, what's the legacy you left behind that wouldn't be here without you?
You talk a lot about women in the workforce. You're one of only two female CEOs in the luxury watch business you talk about, tell us briefly, since we're getting to the end of our show, about what you said about cheerless acknowledgement on Women's International Day, and what's your message to women and in the workforce who want to have very successful careers, find
mentors and find the supporters along the way. Don't be shy in asking for help. I think what we women normally, and I hate to generalizing, because there are different women, there is this fear of asking for help and putting their needs because it felt inappropriate. I think the broader the net you cast to get supporters, to get coaching, the better. The second for me is really extremely, be extremely vocal on what you want, because sometimes we are relegated in a role because others are trying
to help us. It happened to me when I when I was expecting my first, my first child, I came back after maternity. I didn't get a job in PNG, they put me. I was managing a business, and I came back to become event organizer. I said, sorry. Why event? Because we wanted to help you as the first child, you want to be home more often. Maybe the intention was positive, I don't even know, but definitely it was a killer for me. So for my second maternity I learned the
lesson. I said, I'm going to come back when my child is three months old. I want to have a job as big, if not bigger than the one I'm leaving based on my performance. You have nothing to worry about in terms of work hours, because I will work as much as before, and then I got the job, so I now had no issue of hearing in calling it out. And if you feel an injustice has been done to you, speak up, because there are people who
want to help you. It's just what I don't like is this constant feeling of it has to be this way, because it has been decided on me this way and last advice, and I really believe in it, start talking about your life in terms of choices and not sacrifices, because as a woman, there is this constant sense of guilt or feeling that I'm making sacrifices. I'm not there for my children. I'm not there at the birthday party. If you leave all these choices as a sacrifice.
Then, first, you're not in control with your life, and you live miserably and you don't achieve any anything, while instead, make it a choice, make the and define what is a real choice for you, being in the driving seat of your life, and not the passive suffering of the nature of being a woman. That is the advice I
wouldn't you have a huge job. You have two kids, teenagers, one merely a teenager. Your husband worked from home. You've talked about the sacrifices on work life balance and the guilt you have. Do you have any general advice for women or men? Stay at home. Stay at home. Men, stay at home. Women, both sides on what's the proper balance there?
Again, it needs to be a choice when, when this is a sacrifice, the choice either to stay home or to live and work. It doesn't work. It's a short term. It creates tensions, tensions within the couple with. Kids. And by the way, you said the wrong example to your kids, my role. I see it in a positive way. To say, I tell my kids every day when I go to bed. I had a wonderful day. I learned so much. Today in Miami, I went to see Art Basel, and I saw this
piece of art. And by the way, the weather is like that, and I send pictures. Yes, I'm not physically there. Yes, maybe sometimes it's tough, but you know what I bring them? I believe I bring them the visibility of the world through my eyes and the fact that it's possible to have a satisfying working life and being a mother at the same time. I want my children to to consider this a normal fact. I felt guilty with my mama, because for my mama, these shifts of life was
absolutely unacceptable. I was this Nomad going around the world, leaving the poor kids behind in desperation. And how could I do that when I could have been a teacher in kindergarten like her. So it's it's all goes back, make the choices, get the most out of the weed. Big smile, or change the life.
So you make these interesting watches named after people like John Mayer has his own watch, and these watches are on, first of all, why? And second of all, when are you going to make the Randall Kaplan watch?
First of all, we're going to make the Randall Kaplan When. When you come to Libra Sue, you're sitting down. We work. Jokes aside, John Mayer is a great example of a collaboration that I feel is extremely valuable for us. John is a Collector. Watch collector. Is a watch connoisseur, and he's been very close to us in providing inputs and and kind of point of view on the on the voice of the collectors and and our esteemed clients who
understand watchmaking. So when I met him, I told him and offer this role, which is the role of creative conduct, is somebody who brings, in a creative way the external world of collectors inside of the market, I cannot have discussions with the 1000s of collectors, but John, in a way, as he participates to lots of forums on watchmaking, he knows what sort he knows what people like, and I like to have always an external voice to my
creative team. And then he was extremely passionate for certain material, for the perpetual calendar, for a certain type of blue and finishings. And he came with this idea that I felt was new for us. It pushed our boundaries, and we decided to do it. I don't like doing collaborations that are just for the name of a celebrity or somebody who is famous, and then we do a collaboration that doesn't bring anything to the
map. Again, these collaborations I will not do, but any collaboration like cause we've done a collaboration with the with Brian Donnelly, the artist, of course, and that one,
and shouldn't to be clear, they have one watch. It just came out. You had a big party for it, and I believe the retail price is $220,000
for that watch, correct, right? It's a concept to be on with the companion of cause attached to the sapphire crystal. And we developed for that watch a new movement also, which is a peripheral time display. So we can show the time with the with the with the index, we show it with the peripheral time arrows, not to occupy the central space of the watch, and leave everything to
the companion. That was a wonderful collaboration, because, once again, cause came with an idea to have the companion attached to the sapphire crystal, looking at the wearer of the watch. But then what do we do with the with the showing the time? And we decided to create this new movement. So it's a new movement inspired by the work. Of course, all right,
we're the end of our show right now. And I always finish a show with a game that I call fill in the blank to excellence. Are ready to play, ready to play. The biggest lesson I've learned in my life is stay humble. My number one professional goal is leave a legacy on people in my organization. My biggest regret is not having traveled more. My biggest fear is not having enough time to travel. The proudest moment of my career is now. When you landed this job as CEO, what did your mom say to
you? I can't believe you're
you got this, but she could believe it, right, yeah. She was very proud. Proud. Yeah.
She said your dad would be extremely proud of you. He was no longer with us.
The craziest thing that's happened in my career is
many you know when, when you are with, surrounded by people that left, or you, I mean, left your team and they went somewhere else, and after multiple multiple years, they write you love letters, they bring you tears. Is is just the most rewarding part of my job, just to hear back from people that you think were forgotten and they're still around for you and remembering.
You. The funniest thing that's happened in my career is I always mix up
names of people, celebrities. I am I have bad memory for names.
The best advice I've ever received is observe first, then listen. The worst advice I've ever received is you should change
the way you behave in your posture. 10
years from now I'm going to be doing, I hope this job. 20 years from now, I hope I'm going to be doing teaching university. If you could pick one trait that would lead to somebody's success, what would it be? A trait? One trait, learning, desire. The most important thing that's contributed to my success is
learning, learning, desire, curiosity. The
one thing I've dreamed about for a long time but haven't done is actually teaching at university. If you could go back in time and give your 21 year old self one piece of advice, what would it be keep
changing challenges in your work and live when you feel comfortable. If
you could meet one person in the world alive today, who would it be? My father? That's a beautiful answer. So the last question I have, I actually have two more questions. The one question you wish I had asked you but didn't, is,
oh, it's very difficult. This one, it's all the questions related to my, my personality. Who are you as a woman?
Who are you as a woman? Oh, no, I shouldn't,
it's so personal. I am in I am,
I am, like, curious cat. I am somebody who really, really lives and breathes knowledge and discover places people. I'm a connector as a new customer and someone who's new to the luxury watch market. Are there any questions that you'd like to ask me that other potential or new watch buyers would like to hear the answer to,
how do you feel like wearing this watch with feelings that does it give you?
I mean, I get up in the morning, and when I look at the watch that I want to put on today, it makes me feel great. You know, it's, it's not only, uh, beautiful, and I love looking at it because I like looking at beautiful things. I like art, but it's personal, because I'm wearing it on my body, and at some point too, just coming from a humble background, the fact I've done well enough through all the hard work to afford a hard watch, to afford an expensive, beautiful watch like that is very
meaningful. I love looking at this watch. I love looking at all my watches. They all speak to me in different ways, different colors. This gold is very I'm not a blingy person. This has a little bit of a bling bling, but I love it when I go into your store. Of course, I want to buy more, and I was a bit impulsive when I went to Las Vegas, and liar was kind enough, and I know how lucky I am to sell me three watches. I have a pre existing friendship with him, so I was very grateful for
that. But it really is a representation to me of all the hard work and success and all the work that I've done, and it is inspirational, you know, to go in there, it's like when I started collecting all right, I got this, oh my gosh, I gotta, I really gotta do this. And I'm feeling that way about watches. AP, I'm just on a mission. You know, I've looked up attack is and it's a beautiful watch. It's not my thing. Rolex, beautiful watch. Not my thing, either. There's too many. And I like
unique watches. I like AP watches. I know this is a bit of a infomercial in many ways, and rightly so. I mean, I'm a huge fan. I'm a huge customer. And I think this episode too, and I really want to mention this everyone listening to the show today, in all my podcasts, want to do better, right? It's meant to inspire, motivate them to do better. And a lot of that comes with which means they want better jobs. They want better advice, they want to do better, and they want to make more
money. And, you know, they want to afford the home, they want to afford a car. And at some point, when you can afford it, they want nice things. It's aspirational. And so for me, when I start looking at watches, it's aspirational. You know, for me, so makes me feel great, and I appreciate the question,
wow, I should hire as our spook first aid. Amazing.
It's been amazing. Thank you, Larry, I appreciate you answering my email. A cold email says a lot about you. I'm a huge fan. Me too. Are you? And I'm grateful. I'm grateful for your time. Thank you so much. For being here, it's truly a pleasure and honor to meet you in person.
Thank you, Randall. A great pleasure to be here, and I hope I helped somebody to get good advice. Awesome. You.