0120 - Bipolar Partner Irritability - Bipolar Relationships

00:00 - Temple (Host)
the partner says something inappropriate and you can just go hey, that's not, let's shut it down, let's shut it down, let's go into the kitchen and let's cool off. Okay, welcome, annabelle. Are you there? I am here, okay, welcome. Annabelle gets to be my highlighted guest today because she brought up this topic, and it's a great topic. It's how do you manage bipolar irritability? I call it bipolar crankiness. 

00:29 - Annabelle (Co-host)
We call it grumpiness in our house, for sure, grumpiness. 

00:32 - Temple (Host)
Yeah, so does it seem pretty identifiable when your spouse or your partner has bipolar grumpiness. Can you give me some examples, annabelle? 

00:44 - Annabelle (Co-host)
Yeah for sure. So I mean he will get triggered pretty easily. We have two girls that are somewhat emotional, almost teenage girls, and so that triggers him every time, whenever they have emotions, and so sometimes he'll respond just with grumpiness or maybe even a little bit immaturely. Maybe call them names. I mean it's so embarrassing to say, and I can just see it from spectating, and then I just want to, I sometimes I call him out on it because I don't want him to hurt the girl's feelings, who then in turn I hurt his feelings because then he feels like he's being a bad parent. 

01:22
So that's kind of the example I gave Temple this week. You know, it's just you never know with what you're going to present, if it's going to come back with acceptance or grumpiness, or are you crazy, or just you never know. And so the other thing I was struggling with is like as a parent, like if we're trying to set boundaries together as parents, sometimes he'll forget what we have said. Or like this last week we talked about I think it makes sense for our kids to wear masks at school. Well, the next morning I had to go to work and everyone had agreed to do that, but he forgot to enforce it, maybe because he was feeling too depressed. 

02:01
He has bipolar 2, I'm pretty sure he's been depressed for the past three to four months, so it's just kind of been that low. And if he has enough energy to, you know, interact, then it's often grumpy. So yeah, that's kind of. I don't know if that kind of helps, but it's a hard thing to balance when you have kids that have emotions, when everyone has emotions in the house, right, and just trying to make sure we're all supporting each other and loving each other versus trying to take each other down. 

02:29 - Temple (Host)
So, yes, Thank you, annabelle, that was. That was a very good description of how your spouse is getting triggered and what the symptoms are that are being expressed when he is triggered. So you know and you said go ahead. 

02:46 - Annabelle (Co-host)
I was going to say that the hardest dynamic is that you're he's an adult and he's a parent right, so you want to respect that. But then sometimes it's hard to respect and also be like a caretaker for his bipolarness, but also respect him as an adult and a parent. That's always something I always come back to with bipolar is how do I respect him and love him but still give him the support he needs? 

03:10 - Temple (Host)
So anyways, Well, that's a perfect question to ask. You know, I think we all go through that because the discomfort, like you said, is that your partner is an adult. However, like you said, is that your partner is an adult. However, oftentimes people with bipolar have had a lot of compromised brain activity and it can really change them. 

03:34
I think most of you have heard my version with my spouse that he really had to go all the way back to childhood after some severe psychotic episodes and it's almost like he not almost. It is like he's growing up all over again from a little boy and he's kind of in the teenage years right now. So how exciting is that? But you know, there there are things that get compromised and the amygdala is part of that. Your emotional control can definitely be compromised when you've had psychotic episodes, when you've had rapid cycles of mania or even just hypomania or even a lot of depression. The brain has parts, just like the car, and when certain parts get worn out, it changes the way it drives. So you see a body that is an adult, but the brain may have been compromised and they might have a lot less emotional maturity now than they did when you started in your relationship. Does that make any sense, annabelle? 

04:41 - Annabelle (Co-host)
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Actually, I think we were in the worst of the worst one time. He said why am I being treated like a 15 year old? And I was like well, and then he's like well, maybe it's because I'm acting like one. Wow, yeah, that's cool that he recognized it right? 

04:59
yeah, for sure, yeah that. I think that helps me to try to remember that it's the illness I I get stuck on, it's just the grumpiness and knock it off versus maybe you know he's doing the best he can with what he has at the moment. 

05:14 - Temple (Host)
So well, there's an article. I had to leave my computer because the chainsaw was buzzing so loud, so now I'm sitting in my bathroom like it's an office, so I don't have my computer in front of me. But I'm just going to speak from memory, because I was just reading an article about bipolar and the connection to rage and anger. It was a light article, it wasn't very in depth, but it did remind me that anger is a reaction to a trigger. Okay, bipolar is a symptomatic illness that has triggers to the symptoms. Anger isn't a symptom, it's a reaction to symptoms. So if something's going on and your partner is cranky or irritable, it's because there's something else that's being triggered. It's not like oh well, you know, bipolar. People with bipolar are just mad people and they just rage and you never know and they can lose their shit at any time. So you better beware. Okay, that's not real. What we see usually in extreme cases is rage that has been carried on from untreated symptoms for a long period of time that have continued to be triggered and triggered and triggered and escalated, and escalated and escalated without medical help, and then the end result can be very extreme. It could be violent, it could be verbal rage. It could be walking out on a job. It could be screaming at your spouse. If there's psychosis involved, it could be screaming at the demons they see in the wall. I mean, there's so much that's happening inside the brain. When they're bipolar, unstable, that crankiness is very subtle. But you know when somebody's in the middle of a psychotic episode, that's pretty obvious. So I like this topic because it's much more subtle. 

07:21
And this is where I've really screwed up a lot of times myself, annabelle, because I would confuse my husband's bad attitude where I couldn't tell if he was triggered or if he was just being a jerk, and that's when I'd start yelling at him, right. So it does take. It takes a lot of practice, emotions and relationships to be able to regulate those things. It takes a lot of practice, emotions and relationships to be able to regulate those things. It takes a lot of practice and the more you know, the better you're going to get at it. But I kind of live by this little rule that if he starts saying things that are untrue, then I know that it's not him. It's probably he's been triggered and bipolar is speaking on his behalf at this point. 

08:05
So that's an easy one for me to differentiate now, because if he starts calling me names or this or that, something about me that I know isn't true, that he doesn't really feel that way, then I have to stop, stop, drop and roll out of the conversation and go. Oh hey, hold on a minute. Let me get back to you for a second. You know it's not good to confront right there unless you just say stop it. But if you're going to try to convince them, you know that they're wrong then now you're in confrontation, probably in front of your kids or whatever. 

08:38 - Annabelle (Co-host)
So I, and that's what I struggle with is it's it's usually with my kids, and so then, sure, I could roll out, but is that the responsible thing to do? I mean, I need to make sure that my kids are feeling supported as well. So I think that's really one thing. I wanted to get advice from other women who have kids and how they deal with that, because that is one of. I mean, I've learned a lot over the years and working through this, but that part is really hard, because you want to be a mama bear, but you also want to love your spouse, and it's it's a hard balance. 

09:13 - Temple (Host)
Absolutely, and that's that is a very poignant question is when you have kids in the house. It's easier when your kids aren't there, because you're a grown person and you can deal with the stress most of the time. You know what you're capable of handling. Where they're little kids and they don't have a choice on what kind of energy they're sitting in. And tell me again, Annabelle, how old are your kids? 

09:38 - Annabelle (Co-host)
Yeah, so I have a 13 year old daughter, a 12 year old daughter and then a six year old boy. Okay, so you have a house full, and and then to add to it, I mean he's the stay at home parent, right, and then I have to work because that's been hard for him. So then I have to just kind of let go, which I'm fairly good at. But then I'm like man I some days I want to control more of those interactions than I can. 

10:12 - Temple (Host)
So right, hi, Valerie, hi Hi, I just want to bring you up. I want to start getting some feedback here If anybody has any experiences with their bipolar partners on things that have happened in the house with crankiness or irritability, if you've had any success or testimonies about how you've handled it when other people are in the room. 

10:29 - Guest (Guest)
So, valerie or Laura, yeah, irritability is definitely one of the biggest challenges for me, especially because I also have younger children, and one of the rules I kind of set for myself especially when I can tell that when my partner is struggling is sort of taking him aside before things get to a place where I find them uncomfortable and asking him to kind of take a break. 

10:53
Maybe just we'll revisit it later. It definitely doesn't always work out that way, but it's one of my number one things I try to stay on top of because my kids are 11, 9, 5, and 3. I try to stay on top of because my kids are 11, 9, 5, and 3. And they pick up on his moods very quickly when things are changing, so they can tell and irritability is just something that he's like the biggest struggle for us to kind of stay on top of it and just manage that with so many emotions, like with the kids' emotions and just in general. So I do try to stop myself ahead of time and try to get ahead of it if I can. That doesn't always work, but that's what I've been practicing most often, especially over the holidays, because it was very stressful for us to kind of give him some time on those specific days where I might take more of the responsibility, where he just takes a break, but those are just helping us manage how much irritability the kids are seeing. 

11:48 - Temple (Host)
Right, you know, you've really said it that the kids pick up on what's going on. It's kind of like when there's a storm coming and your dog's ears perk up before it's here. We are so sensitive to the energies that we are living in and kids are naturally hyper aware of things because they don't have the cognitive skills that we do to be able to just pick up on verbal cues and stuff like that so easily. So their energy antennas are really open, especially like babies. They don't even speak a language yet, so they but they need to know when mommy is loving on them or you know, they feel it. It's all through an energy exchange. 

12:34
So the little one probably really confused is why does daddy have these ups and downs, these feelings that the baby's taking on and not understanding where it's coming from, or why? Because babies at that age three, the only time they really get like an aggressive energy is when they're doing something dangerous. They're headed towards a light socket or whatever and you go no, and that energy shocks them. They go what? Oh? And they can stop, but now you're going to I mean, valerie, I just love you so much. The three-year-old, the five-year-old, the nine-year-old, the 11-year-old, so they've been growing up with this polarities of energy in the house where dad has these certain reactions that don't really make sense. But can you talk a little bit more, valerie, on what you've done to have conversations with your kids about your husband's diagnosis and his symptoms? 

13:28 - Guest (Guest)
Sure, my older two. I obviously always try to have really age-appropriate discussions, so we talk about you know, it was my 11-year-old she's a little bit, you know. No, she doesn't know everything, but she does understand mental health, a little bit about what that means. We don't talk about it as a negative, but we talk about it almost as if you were talking about someone feeling sick or not having a good day. We talk about it that way, so like if he had a cold or something. It's not to say that he's sick. I try to word it that way, but I just talk about it as it will fade. And they do notice, especially my older two. They'll notice different things. They try to be. I mean, obviously they only understand just the little bits and things that we talk about, but we do try to talk, discuss it in a very like healthy way, as in it's nothing too negative, but that you know that he's working through issues, just like everybody else has issues like difficulties and challenges that they work through, whereas my my younger two don't. We don't really discuss it as much with them, but I do talk to them about just how, how, the how we're feeling throughout the day, in like and using emotional words and discussing things, and a lot of times I try to keep it as much as I can from becoming really negative. 

14:41
When he, when my husband, was going through getting diagnosed, when we had some really major things happen that were just unexpected and out of my control, their kids did, you know, see some things that I wish they didn't have to see. But we've discussed it since then and, um, they understand a lot more now than when we were going through it then and so I do feel we have reached out. We've, um, like a psychologist just for a little bit, because there was a lot going on and they just felt really emotional at first when my husband did go have a couple times where things were what we didn't know yet, like what part was going on, yeah, and so I think that was the hardest, you know, the hardest part. But now I do think it's healthy to have a healthy line of communication. Hardest part but now I do think it's healthy to have a healthy line of communication and if your kids do get exposed to things that maybe they don't understand, it's been really helpful with my older two to have a psychologist and like an open discussion with them. 

15:34 - Temple (Host)
Right, so do you have a family counselor? 

15:38 - Guest (Guest)
Valerie we did. The person we were seeing is moving, so we don't we aren't seeing someone right now, but honestly, it was one of the best decisions we we did for that time period, because it was a big transition and it was hard to navigate with my kids and and my own emotions on how to handle everything. 

15:57 - Temple (Host)
Right, yes, I'm glad you said that because that was one of the things I wanted to mention to Annabelle or anybody with kids that you know family, a family counselor, is probably really imperative. When you have a spouse that is in the recovery process and learning their symptoms and learning their triggers, with little kids there, they need to have a voice somehow, some way, and I know that we know, as the partners, that bipolar can shut us down a lot. My voice has been shut down a lot during his most symptomatic times, when he's more than angry, when he could even have psychosis or he's manic, rapid cycling. I'm not going to get to share my feelings in that moment, but having a family counselor is a safe space. And even if your partner can't go because that's what I had to realize through marriage counseling is that when my husband's not well, he can't show up for that. It causes more problems than it solves because he's feels attacked, painted into a corner, he's not able to manage his own triggers yet. So it just blows up and he would walk out and then I would sit there and cry to the therapist. So a family counselor is good because you can interchange the characters you know. You can come in with one kid at a time. You could come with just the children. You could come in with the two of you, go by yourself, but it's good to find somebody that you can bring the whole family and get them all involved, one piece at a time. For what they're going to get a benefit for, especially Valerie, you've got an 11 year old right. I mean the 11 year old is is learning their emotional maturity is really imperative right now. 

17:57
Learning how to react to people and being able to uh, still have a voice and express their feelings in a safe and healthy way, when they've probably felt shut down quite a few times when their dad was unstable and it hurts. I know it hurts. And Annabelle said I'm embarrassed to say my spouse is yelling at the kids or saying things he shouldn't say. You know what? There's no shame in this group. I've said it a million times. I want to keep saying it there is no shame. Many of us have been through some very extreme circumstances that we would not put ourselves through with anybody else in the world besides the person that we love, and it's unfortunate that we've been through those things. But okay, it's there, we're here. Let's keep moving forward. Let's find ways to keep reducing the triggers, reducing the stigma, so that our partners aren't constantly triggered and then doing embarrassing things in front of our kids, in front of our family members, to let us know that they aren't feeling well. 

19:01
Because that's what it always comes down to the irritability, the grumpiness it could be part of hypomania. You know the difference between mania and hypomania is it's like mania light. It's a smaller version where instead of rage, you just see a mild irritation that keeps coming out. But that irritation is the result of something being triggered. So what's going on? Are they irritated because they're not sleeping? Are they irritated because their cognitive skills are struggling, they're not able to keep up with the demands of the children, they're not able to keep up with the demands of the house and the job? You know what is it? That's where those conversations need to be had in private, not in the moment. 

19:48
Of course it hurts the kids when something happens and the partner says something inappropriate and you can just go hey, that's not, let's shut it down, let's shut it down, let's go into the kitchen. Like Valerie said, we need to move it away. In this article that I just read, it said don't just give in and say yeah, you know, okay, we're all going to stand here and take abuse. That's not what I'm trying to say either. But you can energetically intervene just by a demanding or a commanding stance. Hey, we're not going to do that right now. Come on, let's go to the kitchen and let's cool off and remove the situation where you can and remove him. It's harder probably harder to remove three kids than it is one person right. 

20:31
Annabelle. 

20:32 - Annabelle (Co-host)
Yeah, no, that makes me feel better because I'm very good at boundaries now after years of practice. 

20:39
now, through all this and I do I just kind of say, hey, let's stop that from both of them, because they both get escalated. It's hard. I mean my two girls. They think dad's always mad at them, no matter what they do, and that's just because of past. That's what's happened in the past. Now that he is on medication he's not mad with them all the time, but they still say it and they still feel it right. So we try to work through that to an end and I'll be the first to defend my husband. Hey, no, he really isn't. Look, he's not mad at you right now. 

21:11
So thank you, temple. That helps to have that energy to stop what's going on in the moment. That's what I do and I just wanted to make sure and I don't make a big deal about making either of them feel bad, but just try to step in and be like OK, let's stop. So thanks for the advice to Valerie. 

21:29 - Temple (Host)
Yes, Is there anybody that has a response to Annabelle or Valerie so far in what we've been talking about? And Courtney, you know we love to hear from you. 

21:39 - Guest (Guest)
Yeah, I really love the discussion about healthy boundaries with that. When you and your spouse are just going at it and like because my husband and I this is the one topic I can really relate to is an irritable spouse with the depression side, and when he's tearing me down in front of the kids, I don't know how to step up and say, hey, look, kids, go to your rooms. Mom and dad need to talk right now and I think that's a healthy discussion I need to have really. 

22:06 - Temple (Host)
Wow, yes, absolutely. That's wonderful. You know what's really challenging that. I know it's hard to think on your feet, right. It's hard to think like we. We have wonderfully insightful and you know self-confidence in our groups when we're here and we've got each other's energy here with us and then you're in the situation and there it is in front of your face and you go right into you know fight or flight or freeze reaction mode and you forget everything that we talked about. So I totally get it that it takes a while for the light bulb to go on and sometimes I have to use my mentors that have helped me along the way. 

22:48
I literally will kind of put their voice in my head. You know we do practice runs and I do this with my clients often. Where we will do a practice run, what happens? Where are you most frustrated? And Annabelle would say well, when he yells at the kids when they're not really doing anything wrong. Okay, well, let's do a practice run. The baby knocks over some water, whatever Bipolar spouse starts spouting. Well, let's do a practice run. The baby knocks over some water, whatever Bipolar spouse starts spouting off. Let's do a run through. What does that feel like? What can you say and you have to use your voice to practice it and say oh hey, you know what? This is unnecessary, let's move along right now. Honey, can I see you in the kitchen? It's really important. Okay, now see how confident I sounded in saying that without saying hey, you fucking asshole, what are you doing to my kid? You have to find a way to be firm without shaming your partner and aggravating the trigger. So is there anybody that wants to chime in? So far, crystal, would you like to? 

23:48 - Guest (Guest)
speak? Yeah, can you hear me? Okay, I can. Yes, welcome, okay, Thank you. So one thing that really is hard for our family, for my husband, like we usually don't go out to eat or anything like that Sometimes it's successful, like if we go to a restaurant. But we went out recently with our kids, who are 11 and 17. And I could just see it coming where he was going to just have a meltdown and he did, and it's just like he'll start cussing, like he's like F, this like using the F word getting a little too inappropriate, like in a public setting, and it's upsetting. Is there a way that you found to kind of deescalate the situation without the time being ruined? You know if that makes sense. 

24:39 - Temple (Host)
Oh, yes, I mean that's a great question and I do have some feedback and then I'm going to open it up to anybody else that's had some success at that. I really like this question, crystal, because this was my whole thing, because I like to go out and really enjoy myself. There's some people like my husband. He's an introvert, he's not very social, so when he goes out he just kind of wants to go and eat and hang out. It doesn't need to be our production where I want to go out and oh hey, there's our friend at that restaurant, remember, let's say hi to the waitress. It's a whole experience that I'm trying to have. So if bipolar sabotages things, I get really upset and disappointed that my experience was compromised. 

25:26
So what I learned to do was a lot of prep time beforehand. You know, if it's an event that I know that my husband might get triggered by, if there's too many people, like over the holidays, I know he couldn't go to every gathering and let's say even pre-COVID okay, we all can't gather much now anyway, but pre-COVID there would be big Thanksgiving dinners and then there's Christmas. There's like three or four Christmases and then there's some birthdays in between and there's New Year's. I know he couldn't do all that. You know he's maybe good for one. So I would get very strategic about what was the most important for me and then we would talk about it for weeks ahead of time. I would let him know who's going to be there. I would let him know who's going to be there. I would let him know what time we would plan out his medications. You know the ones that make him sleepy. We're going to put those off until we get back and make sure that he had what he needed beforehand. Does he have all of his things? Does he have something to eat beforehand? Has he prepared the brain? Prepare, you know. Prepare, prepare, prepare is what I want to say, because you don't want to gamble on bipolar, because they usually win. 

26:32
If there's a bipolar episode, there's nothing you can do besides wait it out or put the brakes on everything and let's go. So the success is in the beforehand, it's in the preparation, and then, when you are somewhere and things do start to go sideways, the way to salvage it is to try not to overreact. I mean that sounds very simplified, but think about it. If your kid is screaming their head off in the middle of a restaurant and you start screaming back at your kid to pipe down. That kid's just going to keep wailing. But if you pick the baby up and you step outside and you give them a chance to break away from the environment and the energy whatever it was in that room that was triggering them then they usually calm down. Or maybe they you know their favorite toy didn't get brought with them. 

27:22
So I know I'm comparing our spouses to children, but it is very similar. When bipolar fits happen, it's a fit. So how do you get through a fit with your children? Think about those skills that you've developed on how to deescalate and use them with your spouse in a healthier way, I mean in a little more mature way, like, hey, was there something you forgot? Do you need to step out to the car for a few minutes and go take a break? I have done this in a restaurant where I've seen him start to spiral and I said hey, why don't you go sit in the car for a little bit? Figure out what's going on? Do you need a cigarette? Do you need some water? What, what do you need? Well, go ahead and take a 10, 15 minute break and I'll be right here and I sit there and play on my phone and I don't freak out. You see what I'm saying. 

28:10 - Guest (Guest)
Crystal does that help you at all? Yeah, it definitely does. It's just, you know, like the appropriateness, because it's usually not, you know, like if you're a healthy person and I know I get anxious around tons of people so, like in a restaurant setting, usually we go to like something that's more on the quiet end. But I mean, if we're like this particular instance, he was just really amped up, cussing a lot, and the girls are like I could tell they're kind of getting embarrassed because of how he was acting. So it's like we did prepare I think it was like a week ahead of time talking about we were gonna go have this particular meal it was sushi just to get him ready, and so we did end up excusing him, like at the last part of the meal. It was like, okay, he can go wait outside, but I guess we can just keep trying at it and maybe sometimes it's just not good for him to come out with us, you know. 

29:04 - Temple (Host)
Yeah, that's exactly right. Sometimes it's just not going to work out and I, like I said, during the holidays I plan my events by myself or I'll take a girlfriend, because I know that he doesn't like crowds. But there's one party that I wanted him to really be there and he knew it was important to me. So that was the one and he went and we planned it well and he had a good time. He fell asleep on the couch at 10 o'clock while I was still dancing in the living room. But, hey, he made it all the way till 10 o'clock and there was no episodes. 

29:37
But it's taken us many years of practice to get to this point. I'm not sure how long you've been with your spouse or how long he's been in recovery or treatment, but it does take a lot of trial and error to say, oh, hey, well, you know what we're going to have, to call it done, let's head out of here, let's go through a drive-through and go home and you go on with your night, get one of your girlfriends on the phone, get them on FaceTime and have some fun, because that's what you need. You need to continue to enjoy your life and enjoy your experiences while bipolar is in recovery. Okay, it can take a long time, especially if medication isn't successful right at first. Courtney, I want to get back to you because you know I call you my resident bipolar, yes, yes, and. But Courtney is a success story because she works very hard at being bipolar stable and you do have children in the home. That's right, courtney. 

30:38 - Guest (Guest)
Yes, I have three children nine, six and three. 

30:41 - Temple (Host)
And how old were they when you were in your most symptomatic time? 

30:46 - Guest (Guest)
I think my oldest was about seven when I was most symptomatic and my younger two were probably too young to really recall or remember when I was most symptomatic. 

30:58 - Temple (Host)
So the oldest one. Have you two been able to repair your relationship from some of the things that might have happened while you were symptomatic? 

31:08 - Guest (Guest)
A little bit, slowly but surely he knows that I love him with everything, because he is my clone, and that scares me how much of a clone he is of me, because he does have his irritability and his anger too, just like my husband and just like me. The three of us have our anger together, whereas my two younger daughters don't, and just repairing that relationship has it's gonna take a lot more time than I've realized. 

31:36 - Temple (Host)
Yeah, I mean, sometimes it takes a lifetime. Here I am, I just turned 51 a couple of weeks ago and I finally feel like I have emotionally recovered from a lot of things that I went through with my parents, with my mom. It takes a long time, but it's really about consciousness If you have the intention to heal, then healing will come. And I believe that, courtney, you always have that heart of wanting things to heal and to grow, and so it's a matter of changing our habits, because we are very habitual creatures. 95% of our actions are unconscious thoughts and you have to work really hard to have conscious thoughts. So your kid who is mirroring mommy, daddy, I mean that makes perfect sense. Monkey, see, monkey, do. 

32:23
I was a wild girlfriend in the early years, where, I mean, an argument usually led to a candle flying across the room, hopefully didn't hit him. In the early years, where, I mean, an argument usually led to a candle flying across the room, hopefully didn't hit him in the head, but I modeled my parent. That's how my mom treated my dad and treated us, and so it was easy for me to just model what she did and think that that's the way you treat people, until somebody told me you cannot treat me that way. And I was like, why? What's the problem? He said because you're an asshole and I'm not going to live with you like that. And then I was like, oh well, that makes sense. I didn't even realize it, I was so unconscious about my behavior that I thought it was perfectly acceptable and they should just, you know, think I'm cute. But no, it's not cute and it's intolerable. As you change, courtney, as you continue to grow and to heal and have new ways to express your anger and frustration, your kid's going to come right along with you, and your spouse as well. 

33:25
But coping skills for anger that needs to be on the top of everybody's list, because if it turns to oppression, then that leads to other chronic illnesses lots of stomach problems, digestive issues, migraine headaches. Too much adrenaline from getting angry, not not knowing what to do with it, uh, can damage the the, your adrenals and your nervous system, and I mean it goes on and on and on. So think about holistically what anger does, not just to the room in the moment, but how it lingers on in your life and affects every person's body and psyche, and it's going to affect their future, their future relationships, their future health. So I really encourage all of you to look in to anger management skills. You know for yourself as well, not just oppressing, but how do I live with somebody who's symptomatically angry? If it doesn't go to counseling, then where's your boundary? You'll have to find it. 

34:27
How much anger can you tolerate, how much should you tolerate? And that's that's up to you. But you'll see it in your kids because they'll begin to model your relationship, they'll begin to model your marriage, and that's what they're, that's what they're great for. Kids are little mirrors to show you how screwed up we are, you know, and it's good because they need to show us, because we need to do better. Okay, I want to take a little reset here and invite either Laura or Danny if you have any feedback right now of any coping skills when your bipolar spouse is cranky or irritable, and how do you move through that? Or can you move through that? Can either one of you unmute? 

35:09 - Guest (Guest)
Hi everybody. I feel like this is like just such a topic that can probably be talked about for so long, because I just feel like that is bipolar, that is, dealing with a bipolar spouse, is the one of the hardest parts, is just the irritability and the anger, and I'm actually not doing so well right now at dealing with it. I think one of the things I've realized the past week, like self-care for me, has been so important because I got put on a progesterone for some issues that I have going on and I've been taking it for three weeks and I just started crying all last week and kind of fell into a depression and what happened there was my spouse then was triggered and went, you know, just did his thing and then I was just crying, crying, crying and so sad, thinking I don't think I can do this anymore. And and a few days went by and I thought I wonder if it's this medication, because, you know, normally I mean I don't always handle it well, but this is the first time that I can remember in ten years I felt so sad and depressed and, you know, it just got me thinking about how important it is that I go outside and I, you know stare at the Sun and I'm getting exercise and I'm eating healthy just to keep myself afloat so I can help keep everybody else from going down. 

36:34
And everybody. What everybody has said has been great advice. I think one thing I've always done is remove the kids from the situation. I mean, that's kind of what I've been told to do, especially when it's really bad and you know like there's cussing involved and and as they get older it's harder because you know then you have explaining to do. I just do the same thing that you said, valerie of. You know daddy doesn't feel, you know he's sick and sometimes he doesn't make good choices and sometimes he says things that are inappropriate and then he doesn't mean so. And then, crystal, you were talking about the eating out. I totally have been there too, and there have been times where I've just been like, ok, we're going to get the check, we're going to get to go boxes, I'm going to go take the kids to the car and we'll meet you in the car. That's happened multiple times. 

37:25
So I just think what everybody has said is has been good advice and with that's kind of the routine here in our house too, in dealing with it, it it gets to me more, I think, than it does. The kids are kind of used to it and he can kind of retreat when he knows he's not well. The problem is is if I say, hey, maybe you shouldn't say that, or I pull him aside, he gets, he takes it out on me and it tends to make things worse. So the best thing I can do is like deescalate, get very quiet and move around, leave the house or, you know, leave the room or get distractions going with the kids. So but yeah, it's been. It's been especially hard for us lately. His irritability has just made me feel very sad and it's because it's hard to live with somebody who's constantly seems like they're miserable for a while now, at least a couple weeks months maybe, so it's just starting to kind of get heavy. Couple weeks months maybe, so it's just starting to kind of get heavy. 

38:22 - Temple (Host)
So that's where we are. Okay, laura, thank you so much for sharing. We love you and you know what I just you brought up something that is really important. Just your own personal hormonal balance is extremely important when it comes to your coping skills, because this is a group about us, and how do we continue to live a fulfilled life with somebody with a chronic mental illness? And you're spot on when you started taking that progesterone and then it shifted. 

38:53
We all know that our hormones directly affect our emotional response. I mean, I use an app and I track my moods. They have them for anybody, it's not just for people with bipolar, but you can track your moods with your hormones. And I know there is a pocket of time, like right around the second week of the month, that I should not be making any decisions about anything that matters, because I'm pretty much thinking that everybody is terrible and I can't be around anybody. The world is shit, I'm shit, I hate myself, I hate everybody. That happens for about four days every single month. So I have to monitor myself and know when it's appropriate to be having conversations about emotions and when it's not, and if my husband is irritable during those four days. I have to let him know. Look, we can't have conversation right now, like whatever's going on, I need you to call your counselor and get back to me in a couple of days because I'm struggling, okay, so know yourself and make sure that you are finding your own pockets. Where you may not have the resources to be the right kind of support, you might be more prone to react. And then you're apologizing for everybody Daddy's not feeling good and mommy's not feeling good. We're all hot messes. So if everybody could just hold on tight, it's going to be a wild ride for a couple days. Hold on tight, it's going to be a wild ride for a couple of days. And the other thing is that Courtney had to leave, and please say a prayer for Courtney, because she is dealing with the same things, even though she's the one with the diagnosis. Her husband is struggling with depression and it doesn't matter who has the diagnosis. Mental illness is a family illness and everybody in it struggles. So please send your prayers for Courtney and her husband. 

40:37
What I wanted to say quickly is because, gosh, the time just flew right by. Anger is not an unhealthy emotion, okay, and I really need to say this because there's a lot of women in this group that we are programmed that it's not appropriate to be angry Otherwise we're called a lot of names about it, or that if you assert yourself then you're too much to handle. But anger is an appropriate emotion when you have something that you're angry about. It's just a matter of what kind of damage are you doing with that emotion, because sometimes you could be angry. 

41:16
I can be angry about something that's going on in the world and I'm spewing it out in the kitchen, but I'm not directing it at my spouse or at my mom or at my cats. I'm just expressing it out loud and somebody is listening and they might be uncomfortable to listen, but they're not getting a direct hit of my energy, do you understand? So if we can talk to our spouses about, hey, it's okay for you to have anger, but you have to realize that your anger is a vibration that we all feel, and so if you're directing it at us, then we feel really bad and we feel to blame and the kids feel to blame. So if you're angry about life, then you can have two or three minutes to express that, but if this is going on and on about a topic about politics or religion or something like that that they can't get off of, then they need to go talk to their counselor and air this out in another way, that it's not appropriate to keep running a cycle in the room with the kids that don't understand why you're not getting over it. 

42:22
So there's another boundary that I've had to make, where my husband and I don't talk about politics anymore, but I did express my opinions about women's rights and religious freedoms and gender freedoms and all those things, and I'll continue to express them because that's who I am, that's the way I feel, and I'll continue to express them because that's who I am, that's the way I feel. And my spouse is going to hear what kind of person I am and what I believe, and that's perfectly fine. You all get to believe what you want to believe and you all get to be safe in that. Well, I hope that some of these things gave you guys some coping skills. Well, I love you all and have a great, fantastic week.