I am all in again.
Oh that's you.
I am all in again with Scott Patterson and iHeartRadio Podcast.
Hey everybody, Scott Patterson, I am all in Podcast one to eleven productions. iHeartRadio, iHeart Media, iHeart podcasts. We are gonna visit with Shelley Cole and discuss season one, Episode eight, Love and War Air Day, December fourteenth, two thousand and Shelley Cole, How you doing?
I'm well, it's do you want to see how pretty it is?
Is it? Are you in Colorado and it's snowing? It's butt off. I got to show you. I always check the snow.
Isn't that beautiful snow?
To me? I would have to say, you know, you've done all the interviews, Jelly. They always ask you what similarit you have to the character you play? You identify with most? What traits that kind of thing? I'll tell you when it comes to snow. Me personally, I'm a Laura Lie.
Oh you know that's which which really leads into this episode.
Yeah, I I I identify I Snow brings me even more joy than what you saw her experience in this episode.
Okay, I'm going to be straight up honest I had never seen this episode before really, which was a real pleasure because I had never seen it. So, you know, I've been to some of the fan fests and stuff like that, and I've done a ton of like you said, a ton of the interviews. I did not know. I mean, this show, for God's sake, is such a fan like. I mean, fans just clamor over it. It's just amazing. So I never knew that I smell snow come from this episode, yep.
Not also such an iconic line too.
So is it's set up so beautifully. And I mean, if you didn't love the character of Loyal Eye for the first seven episodes, you fall deeply in love with her now. I mean it's just like anybody that can take a season and fall in love with the season, and this is this is I mean, it's a it's
a fall winter show, let's face it. I mean, all of the data is in, you know, the streaming data, which I talk about sometimes, is really spikes for Gilmore Girls on Netflix beginning in the first week of September, and it just keeps going up up up through the winter. Per week viewership it's in the five six hundred million viewing minutes per week. Yeah, and it's because I think a lot of it has to do with this episode.
I think if anybody Okay, let's say you consume the first set episodes and you'll like it, but you're like, I don't know, I don't know. I'll give it one more shot. And they see this, they're in for life. They're in for life.
Yeah, and thank you. I love that you asked me to watch an episode and discuss an episode that I had never seen before. And then I'm not in because I'm in at least half the episodes for the first three full years and then two and the fourth year. So it was a pleasure to watch your reaction to Max and Laurel I walking together, to see how Luke
it was so vulnerable and so really quite beautiful. And I think, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that Loralai inspires Luke to take the coffees and the you know, and and to be that nice guy to the you know, you know, all of those people that he just hates, this stupid symbolism of But I feel like it's he who inspired she who inspires him to do this. Is that correct?
Yeah, that's a good question. Does he does she maybe?
I mean he's so pissed off during the meeting and he's like and he's all of that stuff, and they're describing an like that.
Made that made me so happy because there's so much bad television. Now, yeah, there's a lot of good television. There's a lot of great but there's so much bad stuff out there that's so compromised. And so it's just there's there's nothing really interesting about it. There's no real thought behind it except for let's just make this as commercial and as soft as we possibly can to get the wide best audience. I mean, it's just like it's
not even artistic. There's no art involved. It's just pure commerce.
Yeah. So, but you know, I've watched a lot of television especially, you know, my downtime is so important to me because my job that I work now, I actually like to call it my work, because I don't like to call it a job. I work with in special ed department in the middle in high school here in Denver, and monkey and I do, and it is emotionally and physically taxing so much, and I and it's it's really important work, and I wouldn't trade it for anything. But it is hard work, and on my off time, I
just come home and just just pass out. I'm so exhausted at the end of each day. And I just love to watch television right.
Right, you know, it's it's it can be very very relaxing. I'm obsessed with a diplomat right now.
I have before.
It's just brilliant. She's great, rufus Sewell's great, Carrie Russell's great. Scripts are great. Everybody is great. If you're into that kind of thing. I love that kind of you know. I love anything that's smartly written about our world. Are that well, anything involving like the government.
Did you ever watch twenty four?
Nope? Sorry that it's just the ad campaign for that didn't It.
Didn't, Okay, But anyway, I think what you the point that you were making was this well, and like I said, this episode was so compelling for me to watch and beautiful and perfect timing because I mean, this snow is coming just at the right time. It's our second snowstorm of the year. And and I love love snow and so magical and and I don't miss l a like at all, and I love having these seasons. But the thing that hit me most was how Luke had his vulnerability and how he just oh and you and you
see it all in just one look. And I feel like that was the defining moment for the episode truly.
Yeah, because up to that point you always it was implied that Luke had a thing for Laura I. But then this time, you like really visually saw it, and that was your confirmation.
When he when he tried to get her into the diner to have a cup of coffee, and then when she said no as a friend. He was doing it as a potential boyfriend. She was saying no as a has acquaintance. As a buddy. He was disappointed when she walked away.
He was like, man, But for me, it was that look, oh no.
No, I know, I know what you're talking about. And he saw them kissing. Yeah, yeah, listen, I lived that. We've all had that experience. We've all been that guy and gal and seen that and it's it's devastating. It's like, but you know, I'm reading now and we're discussing with Shelley. Call ladies and gentlemen, this is this is Season one, episode eight, Love and War and Snow. Air date December fourteenth, two thousand, Susan, do you have it in front of you? Want to read the synopsis?
Sure, Rory is stranded at her grandparents house by snowstorm. Lorelei spends the night with Rory's teacher, Max, and the townspeople re enact a revolutionary war battle. I had to put battle in air quotes there.
Directed by Alan Meyer, beautifully directed by the Way, and written by Joan binder Weiss.
Yeah, I definitely was directed by him, and I definitely
was in at least one episode that she wrote. It was really fun to have been there from the very well, not from the very but like the first episode after I mean the launching of it on Warner Brothers lot and and from day you know, from day one when it was established that was it was such an honor to have that, just that privilege of being there from the very first episode and growing with the show and with the crew and with everybody from the little trailer,
the casting trailer to the giant you know building that every you know that they eventually took up residence in this true honor too to get to to get that experience from just from the very start.
Yeah. So here we are in the town meeting, all right, the first one, the first town meeting, and I mean there's classics. It was just this was the I think the funniest town meeting of them all. I mean, Taylor was funny and David Huddleston as the mayor was hysterically funny. So why don't you just go s leave the US today and go stand in line paper in the USSR luke, you know, And it's just like that was it was hysterical. The guy floored me.
And I think that Lorli and Roy were only there, uh with their popcorner, their hot dogs or whatever to watch you. You were like, they're entertainment and they're ready for a show.
They're ready for a show, and they I gotta tell you, they set me up beautifully in this in this episode. I mean, what fun Because I don't remember it, you know, and but now when I see it again, I do remember walking out in the snow and serving them a callbe all the stuff. But man, what a what a great episode.
And he looked darn you looked very handsome. You were easy on the eyes in that episode. Well not that you weren't, you know all the time.
But that's when that's before my hair turned gray.
Yeah, like a few guys going into here.
I used to have, you know, darker hairs.
But we all did.
But it was just such a great opening. It was such a great opening. All right. So now we're now we're in lurlized house and it's a middle of the nite and she comes downstairs. She's opened the windows, and she listens to a bunch of voicemails from Max Medina, right, and so she listens to these message messages underneath her blanket on repeat, and he how many Messages's saying, how many messages?
I think it was just one, one message one?
And she just kept there, okay, all right, and this is the first time. And then Rory comes down, Mom, you know it's what are you doing? It's it's freezing in here. Close the window. She goes, no, no, no, no, no, just just breathe, breathe, do you I smell snow. That's the first time we hear it. How iconic is this?
It's iconic.
This is where it happened, This is where she said it.
Which which which is why my point is, I had not I did not know. I mean I always see associated with Gilmore girls I smell snow. I never connected. This was such a revelation for me.
And I think she does say it in one or two other episodes too, So if you didn't know that, those weren't the first time, Like you don't know what you don't know, so you may have heard it different episode and thought, you know, that's that's.
Where it started.
Yeah, but it started in this one.
Yeah. Yeah.
And then lauralized says the best things happened to her when it snows and sensorially speaking, But Lauren Graham is just really putting on a show. She's putting on a real display of acting talent. Because I'm feeling it too. I'm just like, yeah, man, I'm with you. I'm like, that's the way I feel, and that's what you know.
I don't know if everybody in the northeastern part of the country feels the same way as she does, but I think they do in terms of their memory as children of their first and second and third snows in the magic.
Of It, Emily hates every second of it right.
It contrasts mother daughter. Emily hates it is hold up in her house. She's grouchy. They can't know. Nothing can function in snow, it's dangerous, the whole thing. But their daughter it's magic. So it really is beautiful writing and beautiful contrasting characters. You know.
Actually that makes me ask the question, what is magical Emily.
Order, power, etiquette, Yeah, well else status, but it's it probably isn't really it's that's not really magic, but I think it's her magic. Yeah, I really think this is a you know, we're starting to see that this is a journey of two people and completely different you know, they're they're they're related by DNA, but they're nothing alike.
But there are some similar similarities, I guess. But Laurlai escaped and she's she's living a beautiful life, as she said, she's got a great life, she's got a great kid, and she's living the dream. And it has nothing to do with any anything Emily thinks or says or does.
But you can see how Laurlai comes from Emily in their fierceness and.
The absolutely yeah yeah, yeah.
That that that strength, uh is really beautiful And I do I really think that that the three generations of women and their strength speak volumes to just so many people, men and women and other alike. I mean kids in school, literally, kids in school. Uh and like I said, I work in a middle in high school. Kids in school. They they watch it, which is shocking to me. You know,
they watch it with their mothers and et cetera. And and it speaks to them too, which is such an honor to be able to represent that.
But the thing that really jumped out at me about this episode, and it does does this quite often as you as you watch it. This whole thing is set up in the snow globe world where nothing bad can happen and everything is good. Way to say, everybody's safe. And uh, there's so much humor to it. But these characters go there. They go to places that characters we're used to seeing in situations in towns and tonality of
show like this don't go these characters go there. I mean, we go into the Dragonfly and Michelle's complaining about snow. He hates snow too. Oh, He's like Emily, how does he hate snow? He goes on a rant about you know, cannibalism and eating other people's butts to survive, right, I mean, who goes there in a family friendly I mean, it's
it's like couched in this family friendly thing. But the Palladinos are having all kinds of fun with like there, you know, they're they're quite extreme sense of humor, right, I mean that that kind of a joke or that kind of dialogue does not appear in these types of shows. And and Laurel I goes there. I mean, they're all going there, you know, and Luke is going there. It's like, for the love of God, how many times do we have to hear this? You know what I mean? The
characters go deep. I mean, they are what's the what's the what's their phraseology? They are one hundred percent of who they are, and they're not ashamed of it. And and Amy and Dan gave us the freedom to go there, which I think is why the show is so funny and so compelling, because it doesn't really it doesn't it doesn't it doesn't really skew with like small town American life.
I mean, you don't you know what I'm saying. Can you imagine a French concierge in a place that you would frequent at a bed and breakfast that you and your husband go to a year, if your year, and then over here the concierge, the snooty French concierge talk about campbalism and each other's butts, and Suki go make a cake where just butts. You know this kind of thing the humor is is is incredibly rich, it is and.
Those two are are so richly darkly funny, uh and and their their knowledge of pop culture is astounding. It kind of makes me think. I can't remember the name of the episode, but the episode where they sing that freaking song over and over and over and over and over, and I know that Milo's in that episode, and I think his character says something like, I think we'll stop alay this song. Do you know what I'm talking about?
Yeah? Lazy hazy crazy.
Yeah.
In this small town, funky little like just and do you know what I'm talking about that they sing this lazy hazy m blah blah and it just goes right aund on a loop and drives the other bed crazy.
All right, So we leave the dragon Fly and as we're leaving the kitchen, you know, Rory has come in to pick up the Rocky Road cookies for Dean and her mother, and Sukie tease the but Jesus out of her. The Dean and the love and the cookies and the Dean and the.
Love and the cookies.
And one of the best lines in the whole thing is when Laurela comes up to Lane in her band hat and uniform and says, hello, doctor Sergeant Pepper. That doctor Pepper, Uh, Sergeant Pepper.
I like it when she says, she looks at her and she says, wow, I know, I know.
So now we're on the bench, and you know, poor Lane is feeling like you ain't getting the FaceTime with the Ory Gilmour that she used to because this new tall, dark drink of water from Chicago has blown in from the Windy City, as it were, so there they are.
She isn't paying attention to to to Lane at all.
Really, yeah, but she's got to understanding, Well, there's a boyfriend. It's it's you know, it's it's youthful jealousy. It's it's it's perfectly understandable. And you know what, I've had the adults react the same way. I mean, they're no different, and you don't grow out of that. You know, if you have a good friend and then somebody muscles in and you know, catches your eye.
Way, I'm still here, I still have problems.
Ye, poor girl. I thought this was a great episode for Keiko too, really really strong, especially that scene in Rory's bedroom with Laura I and Lorela I mothering her and listening to her. I really enjoyed that scene. Yeah, me too.
It was great to see Lane have her own storylines and sidekick.
Right, and it was really well written. And she's really good, isn't she. I mean you don't. You don't really see her acting.
Ever, No, she's great on and offset. I've spent so much time with her, you know, party are you know, Gilmore girls parties and all that stuff. And she's just really true. She's very she's exactly what you expect, you get what you you know, exactly what she gives. She's she's really sweet person.
Yeah she is.
And I love that she's so funny and vulnerable in that giant hat. Just the hair Okay, well we're not that's the hair yet.
Okay, So now she feels alienated and we get to the scene where it's nighttime. They're outside of styles Hollow High school. Band practice is over or maybe it's just beginning on it. No, it's over, and there's a there's rich was it bloom? Bloomenthal, Blumenfeld, blooming Felt and no bloom Blumenfelt, and she she runs her fingers through his hair, his unsuspecting head, and the look he gives her.
Oh on fire. She's like, he's like what, like.
Like what was that? And then she just runs away. I mean it was really funny. Oh, it's really funny.
That was excruciating to watch. Yeah, ever, oh I know, and then she just books it out of there as soon as possible.
All right, Susanne, you want to take take it from here.
The scene ends with her running away, and then I think it goes to back to Richard Emily's house, right, and that's where Emily's on the phone with the chef and the chef can't come, and so Emily's like, oh my gosh, we're gonna what are we going to do now there's no one to cook for us, and uh, they find the frozen pizza.
In the freezer.
And I really liked the part at Richard and Emily's house. The several scenes connected because we really got to see with the parmesan cheese and all that, we got to see Emily getting.
A glimpse of uh what Emily what?
Laura?
I and Rory's life is like like and she really likes the parmesan on the pizza, and so.
She's having this realization that hey, maybe their.
Life isn't all that bad, even though it's not what I wanted them to be doing.
So I liked those scenes.
Pick it up and eat it, you know, Okay, it's because.
They're like using their knife and fork, and Rory's like, just pick it up and eat it.
And then I think, Rory, which is so funny. I forgot that pagers even existed. Rory. Lane goes to Rory's house pages Pages Rory, Rory cllls her why didn't Lane go home?
The pager thing? Just on one comment.
I watched this episode last night with my husband, and my husband's.
Like, well, how did how did Rory know that Lane was at her house? And I said, because of the pager.
You put your number in where the person's gonna call you back, and so she put in their house number and that's how she knew where she was. But I had the same question, like, isn't missus Kim wondering where Lane is this whole time, Like there's there's a snowstorm, and wouldn't she be concerned that her daughter wasn't at home.
Yeah, I think paid. The pager is something that missus Kim gave to Lane to so she could page for all the time. I found that a little confusing and weird.
No, it was Rory's pager, so Lane used the phone.
Rory has a pager.
Yes, yes, Rory has a pager.
Probably Emily gave it to her.
I mean, this is two thousand, No, I know.
Yeah, but I.
Don't know when I had a cell phone for the first time. But it wasn't in two thousand. I think it was after that.
Yeah, I can't remember.
They do start using flip phones soon after that in the show. But yeah, I'm not sure why. As a high schooler Rory had a pager.
I remember having one when we were on set, at least in those first two years or so. Oh my pager went off a bitter gool, They're looking for me. But that was funny anyway. So so so, then so this culminates into them having that moment with the high school like photo album, and and then Lore lies in that dress her coming out party or something that she eventually didn't make it too. Weirdly, it looked like a wedding dress to me too, and I guess she didn't
go to the coming out party. And then that shuts that down because I guess she was pregnant, and that's sort of like what the whole scene was about, I suppose correct.
Yeah, yeah, that was definitely the implication.
That was the mood killer of the evening.
Yeah, you know, it was a very stark scene. Yeah, very really beautifully acted by all. Yeah, but they were funny. I mean it was really funny. Richard's funny. He looks so young, didn't he?
Yeah, I thought the same thing.
Yeah, didn't he look so young?
And I love the first shot of him. You don't even see him, you just see the whole the whole screen is taken up by the newspaper and then he lowers it and there he is.
But yeah, I mean it really just just great stuff. I mean, what are what great writing? You know?
What I struggled with during that scene is is how both Emily and Richard are so I guess shaken by the whole idea that Laura I never went to her coming out hard because she was pregnant. But then Rory is sitting right there. As a result of this pregnant, you know, this mistake that she made, and so that scene pulled me in two different directions. One like, Okay, well, yes, she, you know, made a mistake, but this is a result of this, this beautiful mistake. Yeah.
But I think I think that's one of the central themes of this episode and of this show is you know, we see everybody in their pain, dealing with their pain and their anxiety and doing it in a really funny way. And you know, there again we have the Palladinos, you know, giving depth and and and so many layers to these characters because everybody's going through their pain and their frustration and it's entertaining to watch.
Sure.
And they were talking also in the scene about Emily's sister, so we got a little of Emily's background, and she seemed to like really miss her sister and so she was kind of in her feels a little bit, and so we were really kind of seeing their vulnerability there.
Wait.
But the beautiful part of it is is when they actually get to that picture of Lorella in her dress, and it all just stops and you can really see their pain and you can really and you know, you really feel for them because that's their daughter, and they had you know, whether they were you know, completely out of touch with their daughter or just sort of fifty percent out of touch with their daughter, whatever percentage it was, they still love her and they loved her back then,
and that's their baby that they raise, and she was going to have her debutante ball and they were going to have their life the way they wanted it, and they wanted the best for their daughter. You know, judge them all you want now, but back then they really had. They were being you know, what they thought were great loving parents with their only child and spoil her rotten obviously, because that's what you do with your only child. They
can hold the attention. And she was fierce and smart and you know, headed for greatness, you know, yeah, and a great life, and it all just got derailed and you just you could really feel the pain coming out of those two and you could hear the breaks, the screech of the breaks put on everybody's lives in that moment. And that's the thing I love about the writing on
this show is you don't know when it's coming. Yeah, and then all of a sudden, boom, a huge moment is revealed and it's just they're so good at this. They're so good at this. They really do surprise you, both on the humor side and the drama side. You know, God, I love this show. This I gotta say this is
and I'm just gonna say it right now. So far, of every episode besides the pilot that I've seen of this show, this is my favorite episode because it's it's it's beginning to really mature now, right the look of it. The characters are so definitive together.
You really know, you're getting to know as a viewer, you're really getting to know them and to understand the whole spectrum of each and every one and how they all kind of come together as a as a sort of a family truly, like Kirk and you know, just everybody. I So, then we go to So then after that we go to Lorelai and she's you know, she's wandering around and she bumps into Luke and and he asks
her to, you know, come on in. I think he softens up there, and then she chooses to wander around and then she just miraculously bumps into Maxi Mendino, whose car just you know, comes off the side of the road. You know just what concidence.
There were a couple characteristics of this scene that I found both distracting and very interesting, and I think it worked. Okay, is that all of these Snow scenes were looped. We had the adr every single line of every single scene. But it didn't take me out of the show. I like it.
No, I couldn't tell at all.
Because because oh god, yeah, oh yeah, it was looped. And the scene between those two and Luke expressing his negativist as extraordinary negativism about the season and about Snow and about anything related to it. I don't know, what did you think of that? It's odd? He's an odd guy. What do you think of this guy? If you met a guy like this and he was talking to you in this way about reenactors, about Snow, about this, and I mean, it's like the guy hates everything.
Well, it depends on how long I've known him. And you know, I think we all know people who have a fairly negative outlook on life and and just kind of try to pick everything apart. But if upon first meeting him, I think I'd probably walk away.
But if Okay, Shelley Shelley, Shelley Shelley as an actor. Yeah, as an actor, maybe maybe I could have done that dialogue better. Maybe that was a quicker scene, hence the humor of it, because then he asked her for a cup of coffee to come on in the dinamy, because that what he was saying there, that's Luke's game. Like, is that your game? Bro's a good question.
Would you do anything differently?
I think I would. I think I would clip the dialogue much faster, okay, and much lighter, and not lean into it so much so that the joke could work, because I don't think the joke really worked. I kind of made it dramatic. So I made a choice not to go for the humor but go for the drama
of the relationship. And I remember the conversation I have with the director now and he said, well, you know the style of show blah blah blah, And I said something to him like, you know what, for me, it's about the relationship and that he couldn't possibly be in a nervous or light hearted mood when he's in her presence because she makes him nervous and when he gets that way, he loses energy. Right, So that's how I
justified it to the director. All right, okay, it would work either way, I think, but that's just kind of how I did it.
I okay, all right, fair enough, but I'm going to know I do. I know what you mean, but I am. If it were me, I would leave it as it is because it helps us learn who Luke is, and it takes us on that journey through I mean, Luke goes on a massive journey throughout the course of this life, and a massive journey. I mean, you see Luke disgruntled, but you also get to see and know the beauty that the humanity that Luke really you know, the man that he really is. And I wouldn't change it for me.
I probably wouldn't change it because I think that it speaks to you know, like Scrooge. We get to know who Scrooge is. I think that Luke's got a lot of Scrooge in in a lot of ways. But I think that it enables us to go on the journey with him of truth, like of healing, of falling in love, of being. That's my opinion.
Maybe he's just a big wounded puppy and flannel in a backwards hat.
I think he is a wounded puppy, But I think he becomes a real strong man, right.
I think I think he has one part of his life where you know, he's solid with and he knows who he is. But on the romantic side, I think he's really really injured struggling. Yeah, injured struggling right.
Right, He's definitely got a wall built around him that is impenetrable, and we don't know why that is, but we start to see in this episode, we start to get a little bit of that. Like, he clearly has some unresolved issues from his past, and so we get to kind of see some of that vulnerability because this whole reenactment thing is clearly triggering to him in some way.
And so I think this really kind of shows, like you said, Shelley, his humanity and because I don't know, we've just seen him as kind of this curmudgeonly guy who's just always in a bad mood, and now we see a little bit of background.
Yes, Scott, I don't think that that moment that I mentioned at the very start, that moment when he sees her and Max, I don't think that that the beauty of that moment would have landed as hard if we hadn't seen him as curmudgeonly as he was before, And I think that lended itself to really making that moment beautiful.
No, I mean that's that's that's how that's how I would communicate it to directors. That was always my vision for the character.
Yeah, it's beautiful. Oh man, okay, where are we?
You know, all of these characters take you to uncomfortable places at times. Yeah, but I don't think anybody did it better than Lauren. You know now she did, didn't she do it with such grace and ease? You know, it would change she was She was required to change courses so quickly, so many times within like thirty second period, marvelous to watch. And she really loves She's falling in love with Max Medeena. She really likes that guy. And those two are good together. Yeah, they are good together.
They fit, don't they?
Yeah, they do, but until they don't, I mean yeah, but.
I mean it really seems like this is going to happen, and she's just I mean, look, her perfect night is snow.
He shows up and right, it's almost like fate.
They want us to feel like this is fate, that Luke is not the fate he could be, but Max Medeena is the fate.
Well, so I wanted to mention and I thought about this last night while I was watching her and both her with Luke and with max X and she Lauren had done so many pilots and et cetera, et cetera before the show, and this is the one that landed because I feel like all of the stuff that she had done before, she wasn't coming across as like sexy and you know, that sexy female lead and this in
this show. And I think this is one of the reasons why the show really hit and why her career took off, was because in this show she is sexy and she's a woman, and she's so beautiful and attractive. And I think that she brought that because I remember watching those shows before, you know, and then they none of them would ever take off, And in this one, her sexiness and her appeal took off. Yeah, but we
everyone knows she's going to end up with Luke. Everyone just knows it from that moment he looks across the snow at her. From that moment we know.
That was That was a very heavy movie moment.
That's movie magically the best moment of the show for sure, and.
That moment, man, Yeah.
And you played it so brilliantly, so beautifully.
Well, I've been that guy, I mean a couple of times, so I know what that feels like. It's bad. I remember once in high school that happened and I took a very long walk in a rainstorm to try to get over it.
That's beautiful and you'll never forget it. I don't think we ever forget those moments where just our heart is just stabbed. Yeah, but to me falling down the stairs.
So we're jumping around a little bit. We're not really going chronological. But so we did the Friday night dinner. We did the frozen pizza, you know, Rory Rory kind of introducing these very high falutin society people with a little frozen pizza, right, and it's like, you know, welcome
to my world. Guys. It's not so bad. And maybe really the pizza for me was Lorelei and their frozen relationship with her that froze sixteen years ago, and let's thaw out that relationship and go ahead and let's you know, I want to be gross about it, but let's eat it.
That's a good one though.
Right, But it's like, hey, my mom, we used to be your daughter. Who you're so disappointed in? This stuff's good. This is how we live. You eat it now. It's mana.
So Richard and Emily are the parmesan and ror Free is the greater. She's the facilitator between the pizza and the parmesan.
Yeah.
I mean even to the point where where that Rory did such a good sales pitch that she got Emily to go give a sales pitch to Richard.
Yeah, oh you must try to get it.
Yeah, And I think what it just it was a beautiful moment. It was just a really beautiful moment that that Rory opened Emily's eyes a little bit about who her mother was, you know, you know, and really really in a subliminal way, and but you know, very effective. Okay, more snow. So this is this is I think we talked about this, but it's a very touching scene. It's really an iconic scene. It was a ton of snow. Luke walks out, he sees the reenactors are freezing their
butts off. He takes some coffee out to them. Uh, he hands he has a little struggle with Harry. Harry doesn't want to take one the the mayor, David Huddleston, and he finally gives me. He says, my dad would have taken one. Now we show how these people used to respect his father.
And he took It makes me want to meet Luke's father.
Yeah, I know, right, yeah, but you know we don't need to. No, it ain't my show, it's her show. That's Lauren's show. Yeah, you know, that's we meet their parents. I don't think you can get too into the weeds on well. Look, I think they balance that very well. And to keep the audience on it asking those questions I think is also great writing. It's what you don't
write as well. Yeah, that's kind of brilliant. And then you know, Kirk orders to tea with lemon and here comes here comes the Palladino of humor again and a couple of guys wanted hot coke and looks like, oh okay, yeah, I can go get you.
It looks like okay, sure.
It turns into a very friendly situation all the way. So he goes from screaming at the mayor about why are we doing this junk every year? To out there, you know, just being friends. Yeah, so it's the season to come together as a community and sort of forgive and forget and all that stuff, and then the bad and it all comes to.
Again.
I don't think we see Luke after that moment, correct, I.
Think you're right.
Yeah, yeah, we do.
I think you're right again. What you don't see? Great writing? Yeah, he served his purpose. The character we used to its explicit purpose for this portion of the story telling. We don't need him anymore now we have these other stories to tell. It's like we told this story for this episode perfect economy. Character is perfect. All right, next morning we got problems. Well, we have a problem Max days overnight.
Yeah, before the morning after, the night before. I think we touched on a little bit that scene with Lane and Laurel I.
In Rory's bedroom.
It's just it was just so good, Like Laura I is just giving her such good advice, you know, like this is just a practice humiliation for all the humiliation that's going to happen to.
You as an adult.
Like it just was such a nice moment and not something that Lane would have gotten from her own life.
No, Laane needs to have Lane needs to be mothered like that sometimes and be told everything is going to be okay. I think if she had told her mom what happened. A first of all, he's this Jewish kid or whatever, you know, he's not Korean. And secondly, I think her mom would have just shamed her.
Yeah.
I can hear her saying, why are you touching boys? You know, I could totally hear that response for touching boys?
Yeah, exactly. So I love that moment. That was really great for Lane. Got to go to sleep, yeah, yeah.
But overall, it was really a joy to see laurle I not mixed up in too many controversies during this episode. I mean, she kind of she kind of surfed and sailed through this episode pretty much unscathed.
Right, she was definitely floating above everybody else.
I think she was right. She was like floating on the snow throughout the whole episode, taking it in. Her mood was elevated. She was loving life. This is just a wonderful, wonderful thing to see because we're also used to seeing her, you know, arguing with her mother, having conflict here and arguing with it, and you know, it's all over the place, and that's what she does so well. But it was so nice to just see her go
through the episode and love it, enjoy it. Yeah, and yeah, nothing was going to bring.
It down to see her just really her life and enjoy Max. And when she when when you know, when Rory comes home, I.
Think, what a bonehead? Right, it's like how about this? But but it was really a funny scene at the door when she like runs out like I gotta tell you something.
I just want to tell you you're English teachers in here.
Then she backs into the house real so she goes, well, yeah, well anyway, so that's it was really brilliant And yeah, an uncomfortable situation and uncomfortable conversation she's in the kitchen with but Rory, you know, that's a tough that's a tough thing to deal with.
Yeah, having seen that little picture that.
Of Christopher Morelo from eighty three, nineteen eighty.
Three, Yeah, I don't think that she had seen that picture before.
No, she found it and she put in her pocket and it just makes she feel for her so much. She mean, you know, it's like, what happened? Where's my daddy? Yeah? You know, why is any around? More like what's going on? She's sort of used to it, but she doesn't want to be used to it.
So yeah, and like her face at the very end, like you couldn't you could tell she was kind of torn. She's like, Okay, my mom's happy, but like.
Where does this leave me? Like this is my teach teature. This is kind of weird.
It's not my dad, you know, it's just you know, she just was in a lot of different places. And I think Alexis really played that that very last shot very well.
But it's the beauty of the writing because you would have to say, as appealing as Laural I is, as appealing as Lauren Graham is, right, you give them a flaw, You give them a couple flaws, and it makes the human right. Yeah, that's the beauty of it. Right. If she was perfect, perfect, perfect all the time, would we not be oh so bored with these episodes because there wouldn't be anything happening.
Yeah, that's true.
Because of these flaws. You know, this breeds all of these wacky situations that are so you know, they're inappropriate. Yeah, but it's TV, so we suspend our you know, our judgment a little bit, especially second time around.
But there's so far I really think that apart from Luke, I think that Max is my favorite one fellow for her right. I lovely to watch them fall in love and sad.
I think if Luke could no longer represent the United States as you know, mister America, I think that Max Medina would be a wonderful replacement.
But it's super bittersweet too because we know that she's not going to end up with him forever. I mean I know that from the you know, we just know that he's a he's he's a you know, a page holder and until she gets to, you know, finally end up with Luke. But it's my he's my favorite of all of her page holders or placeholders, whatever that term is.
You know, he's my favorite. That's why it's bittersweet to watch them fall in love because it's beautiful, and then we also know that he's not going to stick around.
It's hard to get an audience to buy in to any kind of a relationship, you know, but you know, this show makes you buy into the potentially the Luke thing that gets you looking ahead for that uh and now they have you buying into something that's happening right now, which feels very organic and very real. Uh and kind of perfect, right yeah, and it's and it had to be that way. The stakes have to be really high for Luke and Lorelei. There has to be a worthy challenge. Sure, yeah.
Otherwise where's the tension, you know, where's where's the competition. There's got to be some serious competition in this guy's serious competition.
Yeah.
I would say with the with the with the viewers, I would say that Christopher is pretty pretty popular and you know whatever, but but for sure Max is my favorite besides Luke.
You think Christopher is popular? Now he's hated? Oh god, yeah, well.
Not the actor but the but the character.
Is he really the characters loathed and despised? Uh yeah.
A lot of people don't like the deadbeat badness.
Oh yeah, yeah, no, they don't like it.
So they mean like Luke, or they mean like Lorelei and Chris as a couple.
But right there is a faction that does like that as a couple because.
They want and like, why would you want to be with a man that treated your daughter like that?
So that that the Christopher relationship, the Christopher relationship throughout the series only serves to frustrate the audience, so they do it intentionally to the audience. They piss everybody off, so it pushes so their their desire for a Luke LORELEI interesting.
I know, I remember when they were casting that was not well said?
Was its great? You know you didn't hit the quite the bulls eye? We know what you mean.
But I remember when they were casting that character of Christopher. Do you know you probably know this. I know that originally I think Amy really wanted Robert Downey Jr. To play that role. What, Yeah, I remember this very clearly.
What Yes, I did not hear this.
I really be wrong, but I'm pretty sure I'm not. I remember that name being floated around and her really wanting to cast him as the ideal like Dad. I mean, obviously that didn't work out, and it wouldn't have worked out because of the you know, the long term, you know, arc of the character.
But I remember that Robert Downey Jr.
As Christopher, Yes, I was. I need to fact check, but I'm almost positive that I remember that correctly.
Who was who was the character? Wait a minute, I could see him as who was the guy who was who started a business with Richard? What was that character's named? Digger. Yeah, I could see Robert Downey Jr. Digger right maybe, I mean, I don't know, but it wasn't was it was in two thousand? Was it was Robert Downey Junior, a big movie star at that point. He was, wasn't he was?
He? I don't think that he was iron Man then, No, but he was. He'd done Adeal maybe and.
He was the name for sure, for sure?
But was he? But yeah, because everybody was switching over to doing TV, all the film guys were, yeah, we're going over to TV.
They started positive.
I'm remembering this really, yes, I'm almost positive. Okay, just well we had well, while we're on it, boyfriends my least favorite of all time boyfriend that Laura I ever had. I don't remember his name. Great story, shall we? I can't remember his name?
But how about his her date with Rune. You couldn't consider him a boyfriend though?
No, no, no, she actually dated this Glics the coffee guy. No, no, no, sorry, I can't remember that. My phones out there so I can't look it up. Anyway, he was my least favorite.
He was, well, describe him.
He just he's just kind of like styles.
He's just kind of it's it's not Jason Styles. I think it actually is. It's not. I can't, I can't finish this. But John Hamm, No, it's not John Hamm. I think John Hamm is outstanding looking. You're right, it is. It's Chris EigerMan.
Is that is that Jason Styles? Who's Digger?
Yeah, that's Digger.
Yeah.
I don't know who Digger is, but whose Digger Styles?
That was his nickname. Okay, so it's all all in the same.
Oh my lord, we've brought all these puzzle pieces to Yes, he is the one that really really irked me as far as boyfriend.
He's the one that had the fancy condo, but his kitchen was in his floyer.
It was weird, yes, and he just.
Had no game whatsoever, none, zero. So he was my last favorite of all.
Now we know, take a towel off man. Well, all right, so Shelley, thanks so much. We're going to wrap it up here.
It was a pleasure than you. That was.
That was an action packed hour right there.
Yeah, we did. We talked a lot. We had metaphors, We talked about.
All kinds of things. There was allegories, metaphors, narratives and universal themes mixed in with a lot of snow. Really so far, gotta say, besides a pilot that's always going to be my favorite, this is my favorite episode besides the pilot. What, Susanne, what do you think? You've seen them all multiple times? How does this rate? This episode?
I do love this episode.
That moment where Luke sees Lorelei and Max together, it just that just gets me every single time.
It's moment.
I think it's a great episode. It moves the story along, it establishes the characters relationships to each other. It's just it's foundational.
Yes, great word, it definitely is, you know, a foundational show.
That's where I started to fall in love with Luke m Yeah.
I mean, what a what a great episode they wrote for me? Well, they didn't write it for me, but they wrote it. Well, maybe they do the character. I wrote it for the character. But anyway, so thank you for that, thank you for the episode, and I appreciate it. Shall we have your time and all the best, and it's always a blast talking to you, And keep your tips up when you're scanning, and.
You'll find me in the in the the lobby of the hotel, having.
A you know, yeah, all right, well you know, same as a seat because we'll be coming in from the slopes anyway. Thank you, Susanne, thank you, Shelley, thank you. That's going to wrap it up here. Best fans on the planet Earth, thank you so much. And remember where you lead, we will follow. Stay safe, hey, everybody, and don't forget Follow us on Instagram at I Am all In podcast and email us at Gilmore at iHeartRadio dot com.