Hi, and I'm Jermaine and welcome back to another episode of Clev. We Got Boys today today. We welcome actor and content creator.
Welcome. Welcome.
So, are
you? I'm not gonna lie. I'm a little bit nervous why I mean, it's the first like podcast I've done since I got back from the Philippines. We are, we are
very, very. Thank you. Thank you, Radel. Tell us more about yourself and our viewers here in Harsh
Podcast. Um Hi, I am Rayna. I am an actor. Um I actually just graduated from UNI I'll be having my commencement, I think sometime in July. Congratulations. Thank you. So I'm very, yeah, so I study psychology for four years. Not sure why I did it now that I'm acting. Yeah, it was very enjoyable. So, so what were
you doing in the Philippines? You
mentioned Philippines? Um I was actually in the Philippines to film a series. It's called The Day I Love You. Yes, it's hit, major hit. It is, it is, it is, it's been, the viewership has been good. The support has been great. So it's a BL series and I play the role of Eli. So Eli is a resident, you know, bad boy kind of guy who falls in love with the nerdy kid at school. And for those who are not familiar, what's
a BL series? Can you explain to us? Yes. So a BL series is a series with two male leads who, you know, fall in love with one another. So boy love bl, oh, I love that.
Yeah, I, I want to get like to know more about how it was like acting in this series later on. But, you know, here on harsh podcast, we actually focus a lot on women centric topics. A lot of our listeners are females, but we also have a lot of them who are males as well. So today, we want to bring you a note on the show to discuss male friendships like you mentioned, maybe not bl per se, but Bromance. So basically, Bromance is made up of two words, brothers and romance.
The definition of Bromance is a term to define a strong and close friendship between two men. And this is not to be confused with AEX relationship. So it's a friendship, right? Ok.
Actually, I would say I beg to differ. I would say it's more of a brotherhood
like brothers from different mothers. Yes, I think
to, to call it a friendship. I feel like it doesn't encompass exactly what a Bromance is. It's a bit more than a friendship.
Ok. So, in this industry, who do you have a Bromance
with, in this? Oh, my manager, for sure. Ok. So you would say it's definitely more than a friendship. It's almost like a best friend situation. But most of the time sometimes it's like a group of boys. Yes. A group of boys, perhaps not. I think it's, it's possible to have romance between just two guys. 1 to 1. Yeah, it's very similar to a best friend situation.
I'm very curious. Right. I mean, obviously we only, I mean, we mostly discuss like our girlfriends, our, you know, our best and all that for guys. I mean, do you call each other? Like your BFF, your besties? How, how does it work in like a male, bro, man? How do you call each other? Is it just that what calls me, like in a, I didn't see that between like Bromance, right guy, best friends. Is it like girl, best friends where we, you know,
we tell each other like our deepest darkest secrets. I find that my male friends, like how close they are, they just don't go in depth with their problems and issues, you know? But they would tell me, like, would you cry in front of each other? Male, best friends? Ok. You,
I haven't cried in front of my male best friends. Not that I remember your
manager. Have you cried in front of Sean?
Your manager? I have in front of sea. But for, for guys, I think, like you said, it's more like, hey, you know, we are bros but we do share, I do have friends, guy friends like my bros that I share my worries and really my deepest secrets with. So maybe it's not as common as girls, but it does occur. I think girls, you know, we talk about everything, we go in depth, the details and everything, not important details. I have, you know,
um I recently realized that guys also talk. Oh, but I think you don't go into the details of it. It's headlines, headlines, headlines
summarized
actually. Yes, I do agree with that. We don't, we don't spill as much tea. Yeah. And this is something I saw actually on one of the tiktok videos. One of the was saying like, you know, guys don't understand if you don't speak the details. I don't want to hear it. It's true. Is
it true? Yeah, because I have a lot of questions. It's like if, if let's say, you know, you tell you, tell me like, oh a girlfriend. Oh, I met a girl last week. I want to know what was she wearing? What perfume she was wearing? What makeup she had? What did you eat?
Yeah. She had long hair. She was wearing white hair, wore heels.
Ok. So this brings me to my next question. Male friendships are more low effort and low maintenance. Do you agree?
Kind of, I think because I have two really, really, really close guy friends. Ok. And we don't really speak as much, like we don't have to text every day. We, sometimes we meet like, once every few months, but I still know that they're there for me. We still bros. I would say that my best friend is actually a girl. She's, she's been my friend since we were in, um, secondary school and she do, I don't really have much conversation with her but whenever we meet up we
just catch up over like dinner or lunch, you know. But, yeah, I still know she's there for me. I don't, I feel like I did not answer your question.
I feel like in general your friendships are maintain,
I think in general. Right? A little bit of what adult friendships look
like. Yeah. Once you step into society, you just don't have time to meet your friends every week, like you do back in university. But between guy best friends, I mean, with guys there's always like ego and pride, you know, there's always that sense of ego and pride. Not that girls don't have it but has ego, like, ever come in the way of, you know, you and your guy best friend, like, fight over the same girl.
Thankfully, my, my good friends and I, my bros and I, we have different taste in, in partner. Yeah.
Good to hear.
Um, so for everyone out there, what's their long
hair, white dress and look, I remember today. Ok. Interesting to the girl. Another question. Ok. What do you think of men who are in a Bromance? Let's say your other half has someone he is very, very close with. Every weekend we meet up to play soccer kind. Is that a green flag or a red flag for you? Green flag? Yeah, for me as well. It is a green flag. I would prefer, they have romances than, like, I'm so sorry. I know you have a girl, best friend but I would prefer guy, best
friends than girl, best friends. Just because not that there's anything wrong with having a girl best friend, but just because I really have nothing to worry. If it's a guy, best friend. If I had something to worry, then, you know, it's too late. So it's a green flag for you as well. It was a neutral colored flag. It's a brown flag. Yeah, it's good. It's not too
bad. Right? Because my best friend, so I'm actually really, really close to her partner as well. Yeah. So whenever we go out there's this running joke. Like, who is the actual girlfriend? Who is third winning? Who is third winning? Is it me or is it you? Yeah. But
that's good that you guys all have a good relationship. I think that's important. Yeah. But I think another reason why, like we not mentioned just now you are a bit more, like, open to speaking with your girl, best friend, right? Every few months you meet up over dinner and maybe you just go into more detail and depth about your life as you do with your male best friend. Do you find it hard to be emotionally vulnerable to
your male, best friends? Is that the reason why you don't speak as much with them?
I think in general it's easier to be emotionally vulnerable to ghost. Right. Yeah, because I, I feel like the feeling gets reciprocated more question your brother, is it then no shit against guys, right? Love guys, love girls. But um but I think when guys, when we first form friendships, right? It's very much over silly things when it's like over
game gaming. Like we laugh, we tease each other, but an interaction with a girl is slightly different, at least for me like there isn't that straight up like, bro, like, you know, what kind of shoes are those? Like, not, at least not from the very beginning. No, no, at least not from, from the very beginning. So I think once the foundation of how a friendship is formed is already there, it might be a bit harder to break out of it. Yeah. But I do still have
very vulnerable talks with my very close guy friends. So like a manager, like my manager, I, I think I've been the most vulnerable to my manager actually. Would she say that with male friendships? Like romances? Usually if you're going through a really tough time you already said stuff like that, you wait till the last minute, like you cannot anymore and then you go to them and open up a little bit more than usual. For sure. For sure. It's more of, I think I
want to try to solve the thing myself first. I don't want to like, you know, I, I don't want to impose on you.
Ok. So that's Bromance. So we're talking about a relationship that is strictly non sexual assume based on what I've been talking about so far. Now, let's move on to bl boys love. OK. So what I understand about boys love is basically BLB boys love boys, right? As what was portrayed in the day I loved you. What was it like the chemistry between Eli and Nicole?
Do you mean the characters or do you mean me and the actor, you and the actor? OK. Um The very first time I saw um the actor, his name is Tommy. So when I first saw Tommy is actually doing auditions and we did a small script read together. I really felt that Tommy was the perfect person for the role. Straight away from the very start because I felt there's a certain kind of chemistry between us that II, I actually told the producer and the director like it has to be Tommy. I really, I really
did want it to be Tommy. Oh,
you were in a position to decide. Oh, I
wasn't such, it just so happened that I was picked for the role first. I see.
OK, so you have more of like a saying power as to who you want to,
I think it is
important, right? Like for the chemistry, but I believe like right from the get go as you were mentioning, there had to be sort of a barrier to the Bromance that could be portrayed between you and him, right? Like even in real life as yourselves as actors, you had to sort of like get yourself into the role of the romantic kind of relationship. Was it
awkward? Not really, actually it really wasn't because Tommy was very professional and he's such such a great actor. So on set when he was in the zone, it was very easy for me to, to give it back to him. Yeah, I, I enjoy it,
enjoy it back to him. Give him the energy
like, yeah, give the energy, that energy,
so very professional. Are you guys
friends? For sure, for sure. We still talk, we still chat online. You
love. But boy love is, it's, I think it's a relatively new concept um especially to this part of the world, but I see a lot of it in Thailand. Yeah, actually, I think that's where it kind of, you know, first came about in Southeast Asia. And now there are so many like boy couples, I've seen some, they have joined Instagram accounts. Um And then they promote shows together, they take photo shoots together of them like love do. And
that was pretty cute honestly. And after Thailand picked that up, I think Taiwan joined shortly after and then many different places. And I think now it's really becoming a huge sensation. But what I really want to ask you is what did you think about KC Tommy on screen? Was it hard for you to execute
that? As I was saying, I think Tommy was very professional about it. Both of us, we we knew from the get go, it was gonna happen. So I think we had some time to prepare. Like, you know, this is, this is a scene we have to do. We didn't discuss it though. It wasn't like a OK. This is how we're gonna kiss. I'm going to embrace you. No, we didn't do that. It was very, it was very natural, it was very comfortable. Do you
feel it was important for you to take on this
role? Important is a strong word? But I felt that it was a great chance for me. I really am very thankful that, you know, I got to do this show, like not just to the producers and the directors in the Philippines, but everyone here who is, you know, pushed me for to take it up and, and really believed in me.
It's like a huge step for you. It
is,
it's showing people that you can do things not just in one dimension but more than that as well. So my next question is, what did your parents say after finding out that you were about to take such a role?
These are the questions. So um I'm quite close to my mom. OK. Um So I did ask her before like, hey mom, like what if one day I came out as you know, not straight like queer, my mom is quite, it's very Chinese, it's typical Chinese mom. So she was a bit like, ok, I I will have to accept it right? Because at the end of the day, you're my son. So if you really are queer, I still love you. And when I told her about this role, surprisingly, she
was very supportive. Yeah. The only thing she asked me was, can you cook with your school if you had, if you go to the Philippines film as a Chinese mom as the
greats are important? Wow, that's very surprising that, you know, she was so supportive of you that I think
I get a sense that, you know, you were very open to this from the very beginning, you know, that um it's a good career set for you. Uh It's a great role opportunity. But I think for a lot of males out there till today, even when it's, you know, in 2023 there might be some of them who feel a little bit like um that in my heart. There are future steps, you know what I mean? Um There might be some of them who feel like once I portray a certain role like this um that I get type custard into this
or that now people see me as this person. Did you have any such reservations? I would be lying if I said I was completely free from these thoughts. I mean, it didn't occur to me like what if you know, what if I only get custard for bl from now on? But after I thought about it for a bit, I realized that it doesn't really matter. Does it actually? Why not? Yeah. Why
not such a strong,
right? If I get as a beer actor, then so be it. II, I would just do it. And I think in a way it's kind of a positive thing because if people have the mindset that, you know, I'm a, be a actor, I'm a beer actor and I do well in a series that's outside of the genre, people will see that actually this guy can do a lot more than just be
making a strong impact on both ends. Yeah. Why, why not? So, I read online on an article that your studies really will affect. How did she
take it? Sorry, mom. Very, very sorry, mom. I love you very much. I haven't told her yet. I hope, I hope she hasn't seen on the news. But yeah, it did take a toll because for sure, for sure, for sure not. I was writing a thesis paper and I took some time off it to film. But I think overall I'm still doing fine. I hope I don't fail. Your grade is not out yet. My grades are not out yet.
Oh, everybody say asylum.
It's too late now, isn't it? Yeah, you are
graduating actually. I'm sure she's seen how successful you are right after this entire series was posted online and the sort of like support that you've been receiving from people, not just in Singapore, but the Philippines as
well. When I first did the series, I did not think that I got so much support. You know, I said it, I said it before but I can't stress how grateful I am for everyone who's been involved.
No, but I think it was a big step on your part to take a chance in this. That probably a lot of people just knowing that it's a BL series would have turned down, right? Maybe people that are you Gen Z? He is
OK. But you are, I
would think that maybe people even just five years older than you would have turned it down just because maybe they have their own business be um about, you know, things surrounding um queer love bl and all that. But what were your views right before you filmed this show about LGBT, LGBT Q plus, LGBT Qi A plus Yes. Yes.
What are my, what are my thoughts? Were you always an ally? You know? Yeah. Actually, I, I don't think my thoughts before and after I filmed the series has changed, I always thought that, you know, it's all about preference. Right? I may like broccoli more. You may like cauliflower more. But at the end of the day, at the end of the, yeah. So, I really think it personal to personal preference and the type of people or whoever you like. That's not the final.
It really doesn't define who you are. Love is love. Love is love.
But have you received any hate comments for portraying such a role?
Thankfully? Not yet.
Wow, because you have got a presence on Tik Tok and tiktok. There are a lot of very nasty comments. I pray you never received it. I just do 13 seconds dance and I get like multiple like bad comments.
I do get bad comments. Ok? I really do not about this but not about this. So everyone has been very supportive of this venture. Oh, that's wonderful. My next question actually is sometimes within your group of friends, especially, you know, Bromance, bros, you tease each other sometimes there's this like male, like you gotta be strong, you gotta be, you know, like very guy thing when you go to the gym, the gym, gym, bro, when you took this role up when it blew up. Um Were there any
comments for your guy friends. Maybe it was just like, you know, teasing you. I'm sure they are very proud of you. Did they say anything about it? Most of the, the, you know, the teasing I've gotten was like, you know, oh, you, you're doing so you're going to kiss someone, right? Yeah. It's just that, it's just, it stops there. Like, it's very, it's very, like teasing. My friends are generally very, very supportive of me.
So good friends.
I'm selective. Actually, my next question also is that, um, as your understanding with your bros, um, with the Bromance and all that walk us through some bro coats that you think are unspoken of but are in place because we always hear about it. Right. But I feel like everybody has a different or like bro code, I think they are like general. Is
it like you can vote for the code?
Yes. Yes. Yes. That is there any more because I feel like that a
lot. What else can like, bros, not do to each other?
I can tell what bros do for each other. Ok. I think at least within my friend group we try to kind of cover up for one another to who to anyone. What do you mean?
Like each other's back,
we have each other's backs. So I'm kind of sound like a horrible person, but I believe that, that a good bro. Right. Ok. Let's see. Let's see. Your bro's girlfriend calls you and ask if he's with you. You would say yes, I would. Yes, I got your back.
Where were you, where were you not with your girl? Ok. But wouldn't girls do that for each other too? Like one time my friend told me if my mom asked you where I am ever, like, she didn't give me an end date. Like, I guess it's for the rest of my life forever. Just say that you. So I have, I have done that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She's with me and OK, so covering up for each other in that sense, I can't
think of any at the top of my head. Right? Actually girl code and boy
code. Yeah. At the basis of it it's, you know, being a good friend, right? Having someone's back. But I have heard so much about BL is there GL there actually is WW oh, woman love women, am I right? Or GG? I am
not too sure but I know there is, it's not as big
of a niche.
It's the biggest scene right now. I think so too because the consumers are women and they want to see you guys actually. That's true. A
lot of the target audience are heterosexual women. B CBC. Basically. OK. So why, why cute boy. Yeah. Yeah. Two cute boys plus one bad boy and one good boy. The more the merrier, right? Sorry. No, no, no. Moving on. So, yeah, I mean GL who knows that could be like a new niche in the next like 5, 10 years. I totally think so. Yeah. But do you see yourself portraying in similar roles moving
on? I, I would love to, if there are any suitable roles, if the script is good, why not? I, I really would love to like currently we are having some talks in the Philippines again. Hopefully it goes through and hopefully I can bring you guys more shows to watch. Yeah. OK.
Some notes from our producer, OK, a little disclaimer in some countries, bl dramas can be crucial in raising the visibility of love between same genders. But we acknowledge that bl dramas can also be controversial um due to some homophobic undertones, especially when like gay men are portrayed as predators, for example. But thankfully, we can safely say that there's no such portrayal in the series that you were in was in and we hope that the media representation of the gay community
gets better in the future. Absolutely. OK. So moving on whether it's romance or it's bl we can all agree that being in any sort of relationship allows you to express emotions and sometimes being vulnerable. So girls, when was the last time you were vulnerable to someone last night? You know, what's the thing? Right? I've told I've said this before on the podcast, I find it very hard to be vulnerable on social media um because there's a
lot of people out there. It's very scary and you may look weak, you may look like, you know, you're not strong. But I was just in my feelings basically last night and I was talking to a friend and she said to me, uh Jermaine always remember you are beautiful, you are loved and you are doing well and I really needed to hear that right. It's just
simple words. So I screenshot that and I put that on my story and then I said just in case you needed to hear it too, the amount of responses I got of people saying I really needed that. Just you know, from, from words that I'm not even saying it to you, but just putting it on your story and you internalizing it. I'm beautiful. I'm loved. I'm doing well. So many people needed that. So yeah, don't be afraid to share,
show vulnerability. Actually, I feel that Jermaine is a very tough woman like she hardly shows her vulnerable side to anyone at all. OK. Our tougher lady, when was the last time you were vulnerable?
An open book. Remember we agreed on that. So maybe this morning last night,
five minutes ago, five minutes ago. No, I think the three of us, we are very true to our emotions, like whatever we feel, we show it by the way. So I would say the last time I was vulnerable probably like within this week as well. Yeah, I'll speak to my family my friends about whatever I'm feeling
at all. I think for me it differs, there are things that I'm willing to be vulnerable about, but some things I'd rather not share your closest friends. Here comes the time frame thing. Right? Ah, yeah. So I think the more reserved I am on a certain topic, the longer it takes for me to actually be like, hey, yo, I need to talk to someone. Yeah. So it depends on what the thing is in
the circumstances. But if we are talking about vulnerability in general two days ago over what I had a good talk with my friend in JB in Malaysia, we were just ironing out like how we sometimes have miscommunications and understanding how I feel. And he also told me how he feel. So I think we've matured, our friendship has matured from that,
you know, girls have cat fight. The boys have like, I don't know, dog fight. Like what is the, have you ever fought with a bro?
We argue but I don't think it gets, I haven't gotten physical. I hope I don't have to get physical
but if you need it, no, no violence is never the answer. Come on. No violence. But I'd say it's ok to be vulnerable because there's actually many perks of being vulnerable. I mean, as irony as it sounds, it actually helps to promote your mental well-being. It also helps to build empathy with, you know, the people around you because if, if you always look strong and you know, like that nothing can affect you, then no one's gonna feel any sort of emotion for you.
Like a robot. Yeah,
like a robot, a pristine robot. And I think on the rare times that you are vulnerable to someone, it actually helps you foster a stronger connection between you and the other party. So to all of you listening to a harsh podcast, people out there don't be afraid to be vulnerable. Just let yourself be true to your truest emotions. I think that's very, very helpful.
True. You feel a lot lighter, you feel like you get it off your chest. And actually, right, very recently I had this thought to myself of which I think for so long in society, we've always been conditioned that when someone asks you, how are you, how have you been doing? The immediate response is good. I'm ok. Yeah. But recently when people ask me that if I'm not ok,
I go actually, I'm not ok. Or actually I've been struggling and I think if only everyone would respond a little truer to what they were actually feeling instead of the generic. Why and how did it come to how you had to be responded with? I'm good. I think sometimes it's a bit tough though, isn't it to tell somebody? Like if someone ask you how's your day and you tell them actually could be better. I, I feel sometimes like I am posing on them like, like why, why are you making my, why should I
make your day a little bit worse? Like
you making the other party feel a bit more negative or like making him or her feel obliged to ask you. Oh, what's wrong?
Maybe I do get that feeling sometimes. So
it depends how close you are to the party and in what context, like for example, if I run into hazy in the lift here and we have 30 seconds and she asked me, how are you doing today? I'm not gonna start crying because she will be like, oh my God, what do I do? But if we're at lunch or where, you know, we have a good time to, to chat then yeah, I will, I will share a bit more extensively, right? I think the so last but not least any final words to your bros out there. Who
I always got your back, bro? Always, always, you mean said it's forever, right? You forever until death even past
where is best with me next?
Yeah, I'm really thankful for all of you guys, you know who you are. Yeah. So I got you back no matter what, I hope you got my back. Oh,
that's so nice to hear if you know you love Ray. No, you love to see more of what he's been doing. Please follow him on Instagram and on tiktok as well at Rayt. Yr did I get
it right? You're right. Is tiktok, my Instagram is Ray dot Tyr
dot Tytyr stand for. I was gonna say thank you so much for taking time off the bus schedule to join us today. We really, really enjoyed your company.
It's a pleasure. It's my pleasure. Actually, thank you for having me here. Thank you. Thank you. I shall go watch the day I left you after this. Yeah,
we we'll
cry. Oh,
never mind. You need a good cry. Excuse me? She's very scary. Ok? If you have any comments at all, feel free to follow us on Instagram and drop us ad m at its clarity dot com.
That's where you can listen to us on Spotify Apple Podcast as well as me and listen. Don't forget to turn on your
bell. Yes and watch us on youtube. If you want to see radio's kill ya. Thank you so much. I will see you guys next time. Bye.