Inclusivity & Confidence in Ag with Beck Underwood

Oli Le Lievre 0:01 G'day and welcome back to another episode of the humans of agriculture podcast this year is honestly flying by back in March. That was a long while ago, we had a Women in Ag panel in Melbourne. One of the people who were on our panel was back Underwood. Now, technology wasn't our friend on the day, we had a couple of little issues. Hence, the recording didn't actually work. Actually the recording work, the microphones we had didn't work. So what I thought we'd do is loopback. I found Vax background, her insights in the night really insightful. So I thought it was time to learn a little bit of water, go under the bridge and then catch up again for a bit of ER. So let's just get into it. Welcome back to the humans of agriculture podcast. I'm your host olive leaf. And this week, we are going for a bit of round two, we sat down with Beck Underwood from nutrient back at our women in Agyeman. Gosh, it was back in March. Doesn't that feel like forever ago? Unknown Speaker 0:56 Does for sure, yeah. Oli Le Lievre 0:59 No big deal, the National sustainability field manager for nutrient ag solutions and the director for landcare, Australia. When we sat down and chatted, it was off the back of our sheet and campaign and really showcasing and highlighting the careers and opportunities for women around agriculture. I think your career is really interesting from the sleeves up hands on agronomy side to now really looking down that barrel of the commercial lens leading teams leading people being really involved. So I think what I'm keen to chat about and probably revisit, really, for the people who weren't there on the night is around that deliberate decision making and how it's evolved over your career. And I guess, also to just the importance of throwing yourself out there and the chances of having luck kind of work in your favor. But I'm standing on Gadigal country, you're on the lands of the Kulin nation, we're Zoom is putting this one together for us. And one thing I did want to chat to you about, because this is something off the back of our event, we had like, there was a couple of aspects, which was awesome. We had about 50 people come together, and they absolutely loved it. The thing which I was probably a little bit frustrated by it was we only had three blokes in the room. And my thinking is like, how do we like the conversations we had about? How do we be be more inclusive? How do we create opportunities? How do we support women? And that comes from everyone. It's not just one person. But the conversations that if we had time again, when we have our time, again, to host an event like that, what do you reckon we can do differently? Speaker 2 2:18 Yeah, and only? It's a good question. And we've asked ourselves this question, we've run a number of regional events where we're trying to highlight Women in Ag and tell some really inspiring stories of some women and men and how we advocate for Women in Ag. And to a lot of those events to the male population in the room was pretty limited. So again, we're still struggling on that. I think it's finding though, if I had to have my time over again, for our Melbourne session for humans back, it's probably really finding those key advocates, those key male advocates, and they are out there and that there is plenty of them. But finding those key male advocates and really encouraging them to get along, and then encourage other men to get along. Because in the end, we had a lot of women in the room, but they're probably converted. We're preaching to the choir, we really need those men to come along. I've don't have a really good answer, but really just working through those key male advocates for women in Yeah. Oli Le Lievre 3:11 And I think it's something which, like, I've asked the question of our team and thought so much about it, like how can we get more people into the room and like, I think it's something we can really throw to the audience, like when it comes to these events, and even just remove women from ag but it might be about talking about people with disabilities in Agra, just let's go broad brush and go inclusivity how to make the sector more inclusive. But when you start to talk about these subjects, which are a little bit more pointed, and not focused on where the markets, etc, people seem to shy away because they are uncomfortable in the sense of like, it challenges you to really think a little bit more. And I think that's a good thing. Yeah, no, Speaker 2 3:44 absolutely. And I've had conversations with particularly around the Women in Ag side of the discussion, I've had some conversations with, you know, the white male, you know, 35 to 50. And I've got lots of friends that are in that category. And sometimes they're a little bit worried about what they'll say like, they're worried about saying the wrong thing with regards to Women in Ag. But, look, I think a lot of these people are really key advocates. And it's just really, really having the tough conversations with some of those people that aren't so I certainly wasn't very good at it. Up until recently, last five years, I've probably really had some tough conversations around why people are doing what they're doing, which may not be as inclusive as it needs to be. So I think we've come a long way as a company, but I still think we've got a long way to go, and so does the industry. So Oli Le Lievre 4:28 let's pick on that. Let's not choose specific contexts. Let's talk about the evolution of you there. So what was it that flick that switch to go actually, I'm going to lean in and get uncomfortable? Speaker 2 4:39 Yeah. That old saying about comfortable with being uncomfortable. I don't think anyone are comfortable with being uncomfortable, but certainly what I try to live by now, if those opportunities come up, and they make you nervously excited. They're the ones you should be grabbing hold of, I think and that's what I've certainly been trying to lean into in the last 10 years. Yeah, I mean, there's so many opportunities These inagh. And I think if you're standing back and you're not putting yourself out there, then you're going to miss some of these opportunities. So it's really putting your hand up, I guess. And I've said this to you before Ali, back in the day, you know, I was really wondering, Well, why do we need to highlight Women in Ag? And I say that being very brutally honest. Why do we need to highlight Women in Ag? Why can't it just be people in ag, or humans of ag as the case may be? But I really do think that there's a need to do that women do face a lot of challenges, family home pressures. And also, and I know, this can be the same for males, but just that self confidence issue, like the lack of confidence that I see in a lot of women in the industry. I think that's a real challenge. And certainly, that's been to be honest, that's been my biggest roadblock. In my career, I've been my biggest roadblock, that lack of self confidence. And I do see that and I think it's really great to highlight women through programs and give them the opportunity to improve their self confidence, and put themselves out there to others to see, Oli Le Lievre 5:57 how did you improve that self confidence? So that was that you actually needed to find those kilos? Speaker 2 6:02 Yeah, it's really tough when people ask me this now, how do you improve self confidence? And someone said, fake it till you make it that didn't really resonate with me? I think it's just it's been a long journey, to be honest. And I know that the 20 year olds listening to this probably don't want to hear that they probably want a silver bullet answer. But it is a long journey. There is a little bit of fake it till you make it don't get me wrong. But yeah, networks really key having those people like you say, to cheer you on, and I have got a great group of people, both within the company and also outside the company that will really do that. But yeah, there's no key to it, you know, reading, putting yourself out there into uncomfortable situations, eventually, they'll become slightly more comfortable. You know, those networking events, it's all really key, but it just takes some time. There's no silver bullet to increasing your self confidence. I don't believe others might have a different opinion on that. Oli Le Lievre 6:50 Now, if someone's got one, can they let me know? Because I find I still Yeah, no uncertain terms. I ship myself when it comes to it's like you're putting yourself out there. But for me, it's kind of just knowing that okay, well, the reason I'm doing it is because it's kind of bigger than me and go like, Oh, actually, if I'm not gonna do it, and it's was where humans bag really started. And where we struggled in the early days was because I didn't want to put myself anywhere near it. Because I was like, one that I can become a target to, I don't want it to be about me, but like, to be honest, it was more one, it was like, I don't want to be that person. And then people go, Ah, there's ollie or whatnot. But like, if you or I aren't doing it, then how can we expect someone else to do? Speaker 2 7:24 Absolutely. And just Yeah, trying to you know, certainly other women, men and women in the industry, just trying to really boost them up, give them say when they've done a job well done. One of the one of the girls in the company said to me the other day, you're a great presenter, but I feel so nervous, I get very nervous. I think I've got these really bad, wobbly, my voice but apparently doesn't come through. But so I would say some of the most seasoned people in the industry is still questioning themselves still have issues with self confidence. So it's just a continual journey? I think so. Oli Le Lievre 7:54 And we answered on that panel, but it's something I'd love to chat to you about, again, because I think it ties in really nicely with this. Those voices on the shoulder of that the self confidence going back Yogge good enough. And you got this and just go and give it a red hot crack nurses, like you're not qualified to be here. What other noises come? Who turns up? How do you manage them? And then which one do you listen to? Speaker 2 8:17 Yeah, this is a challenging questions. So who turns up I think actually depends on a lot of factors. And one for me is my stress level. So if I'm Ultra stressed, at the time, those voices become worse. And then it actually is cycle that it perpetuates, the voices become worse, and then you're questioning yourself more. So I think really depends on my state at the time, I'm trying to work on being cool, calm and collected. I haven't got there yet. I'm going to be honest. But certainly, that's something trying to be calmer in all my dealings, because I find that I make better decisions when I'm calmer. And I also don't react to that voice as much as the other two parts to the question, Oli Le Lievre 8:55 who turns up? How do you manage them? And then which one do you listen to? Speaker 2 8:58 Yeah, so the managing partner is for me trying to be calm and trying to talk through so that networks really important so if you're having a certain issue, picking up the phone, just chatting to someone and you know, even if it is chasis has really given me the shits today, just having that conversation can sometimes just take all the the wind out of you and then really just try to reset. So I do find networks help enormously. Just trying to maintain that calmness. I think balance is sometimes a bit of a myth, to be honest, work life balance is a bit of a myth. But certainly, you know, if you can be less stressed and have a bit more balance, I do find it helps. Yeah, so and listening to that voice. I listen to it less I still listen to it, but I listen to it a lot less than I used to or be it if I've had a really bad couple of weeks it'll still pop its head up a bit more and I'll start to listen to that side a little bit more Oli Le Lievre 9:49 often on the same like, I struggle with approval. Like I want people to go Oh, like well, I want people to feel like I want to feel that people genuinely liked me and I don't come across like a dickhead if that's coming that leads me into that. I've always keeps you humble and going, but actually then also going well not earned the right. But yeah, I am okay to be in this position. And I'm going to learn from it and not make it perfect or anything, but it's just going to be part of this journey. And who knows what happens? Speaker 2 10:14 Yeah. And I do think your point about being humble, I think there's a fine line with everyone about getting more competence and being humble. I can and you know, they're definitely two are on opposite sides of the spectrum. But I think it's definitely a balance between those two. Oli Le Lievre 10:28 Yeah, definitely. Let's chat about the girl from Ireland. And what it was about agriculture that drew you in? Was it always this love that you've got the industry now? Yeah, so Speaker 2 10:38 I grew up on a family farm between my low income look. So yeah, two great little communities in central west New South Wales couldn't say anything better about each of them, and grew up on a farm doing all sorts of stuff. And I really knew that I wanted to be involved in ag, I just was pretty confused as to what that look like what that path look like when I was in 1011. So left, left school and decided to do ag science and signed up to do ag science by distance education and thought, Oh, I'll get a job at the same time. And if if I didn't get a job and go to uni full time, that was the plan. Anyway, I happened to be a local retail outlet in Cumnock, and one man show or one woman show as the case was, and I got that job, I found out later, the only reason I did get the job was because I was the only one who applied for the role. So anyway, importance of throwing your hat in the room. Exactly, nonetheless, so started out there. And I think for the first three days, I was there by myself. And then certainly most of the time, it was four plus days on my own in that branch. So I really needed to teach myself how to drive a forklift, what the products were that I was selling, and really and introduce myself to customers. And I was a pretty introverted, 19 year old at the time. So that whole thing about comfortable with being uncomfortable, I was certainly uncomfortable in that situation. So but a great start, the farmers in that community were excellent and still very close to a lot of them because they were just so supportive of me and that journey. So I did eventually start. So I was a branch manager. And that was because I was the only one there. Oli Le Lievre 12:05 So it's all in the title back. It's all in the title, good title at Speaker 2 12:09 19. So then I started a dual role as a branch manager slash agronomist. So once I got my ticket to practice agronomy, so did both for a while. And then some opportunities came up to purchase with the company I was with to purchase a couple of neighboring branches. So we purchased those branches. And then I was sort of managing three branches and doing agronomy across those branches. And then eventually, that company, very supportive company, they said to me, Well, can you manage this area, which was 10 branches, and then I was also managing the seed portfolio for that company as well. So it's sort of I think we talked about it last time, it was very just opportunity sort of fell into my lap or just came my way. I wasn't very deliberate about what I was doing and why I was doing it. So just sort of took the opportunities as they came to me after that, though, I guess. And like I said, their company was great. But it was sort of just time for a change. And that was when I became a little bit more deliberate about what I want to do with my career. And even I had never had a mentor before and really just started to look at how do I take control of my career? And how do I start to drive this? And I don't I don't think it was a conscious decision. It was probably subconscious, but certainly did the job. So that's when I joined nutrient ag solutions is the national sales manager. And then more recently, I've just joined the Sustainability Team, which is relatively new 12 months old. So yeah, that's sort of the short history of my career. Oli Le Lievre 13:31 One thing I'm really curious about and I think about this so much when I think of as people work their way up and naturally become more removed from the thing that was the probably drew you in, like, do you miss the days of being in the dirt, looking at crops, being just, I was gonna say just an agronomist, but really just going your focus purpose. Everything is about growing those best crops. Yeah, no, absolutely. Speaker 2 13:54 I miss some of the growers first and foremost. So I still do deal with growers in this role, but probably not as you know, you're really working with the same growers day after day, week after week, and helping them to grow crop and that's what I miss probably the most just chatting away in the paddock. You know, great. Some of the day is excellent. I'm a redhead, so don't miss the 40 degree days or the minus five degree days out in the paddock, but certainly do miss just yeah, just being out in the paddock and chatting to growers and seeing what the results are out of farm level. So that I'm probably a couple of steps removed from that now. And that's it. I certainly do miss it. Oli Le Lievre 14:29 And so with the couple of steps removed now, what are the parts of your job that you really enjoy? And over your career? How's that fire reignited in different ways? Speaker 2 14:36 Yeah. So I still like to think that we're doing like I still really like to focus on maximizing production for farmers. And that's what we're all about. Everyone in the ag industry is about so so that's still the focus. And I think that really ties back to what I'm doing now is maximizing productivity whilst reducing our environmental impact. And that's the part you know, I guess, you could say farmers and a lot of advice As is always focused on that always focused on sustainable ag and Australian farmers, by default need to be some of the most sustainable in the world. But I guess now with a lot of the pressure coming onto the ag industry with regards to sustainability, then really focusing on that precipice between the two really improving and maximizing our productivity, whilst reducing those environmental outcomes. And that's, I guess that's my, I hate to say the word, but the passion at the moment is really to try to help our growers understand what this means for them on a practical level. And that's what our team's doing. What does this mean? How do they navigate it? What could this whole space look like in two, three years time? And maybe it's not even that long without being alarmist, and just making sure that they're starting to give a little bit of information and education around this space? Oli Le Lievre 15:47 And that's the thing, isn't it? Because that was part of the reason we've just recently launched this carbon conversation, like it is moving so quickly, and there's so much not gonna say alarm, but there's so much information getting spread, and there's people who are the opportunities that are jumping in and going, oh, yeah, he's obviously. But for farmers and agricultural, it's like this is livelihoods and businesses, not just that have been built to this generation, like the decisions that people are making around in specifically the sustainability space around carbon and projects, that's generational impacts and commitments that people are making. Speaker 2 16:21 Absolutely. And that's what our advice to farmers is, we're not saying that don't enter into a project, it's been going into it eyes wide open and getting that secondary independent advice on a program that you might be entering into, because some of these, these programs do have a really long time that the grower needs to be committed for. And so yeah, they really need to go eyes wide open, because there is some pretty big dollars to being put on the table in front of growers, you know, which is good, because some of those are real opportunities, but some of them the science probably doesn't back some of those opportunities being put in front of a grower. So that's our advice is to seek that independent advice, and really go into those into those conversations with eyes wide open and a little bit of education around what this space means. Oli Le Lievre 17:05 And for you like is it really interesting being in a bigger beast of nutrient global business working, based out of North America, and obviously, with the Australian arm now, to have those conversations, cross continents and understand nearly what are the trends what's emerging out of North America, but then also being able to relate and talk about what's happening back down under? Speaker 2 17:26 Yeah, exactly. No, no, it is really good. So I've, I always worked for a smaller company. And then I joined nutrient. And I was a bit worried about the Big B's too, to be honest. But I couldn't be happier with working for nutrient with those global connections. Because it's exactly that you've got plenty of people, you can reach out to you to say, Hey, what's going on over there in this space, soil carbon, for instance, what's happening in soil carbon? How's that playing out for you guys? What are the issues over there? So we can sort of have those discussions and bring some of that information back to growers albeit needs to be contextualized to the Australian context, but we can have some of those conversations. So yeah, it is really good to have those global connections, but a lot of the issues facing Australia, just by the nature of how dry we are one of the driest continent on the earth. Just those challenges around some of this will be unique to Australia. So yeah. Oli Le Lievre 18:15 And one other parts involved in nutrient slightly removed from your day job, but highly related to your day job. Is your involvement in diversity and inclusion committee at nutrients. So like, what are the conversations? What was it that got you involved in there? But actually, what are the conversations you guys have as a group? Speaker 2 18:30 Yeah, so the diversity inclusion committee really started myself and another girl with nutrient at the time, we were getting asked lots of questions. We're sort of playing an informal mentor role to a few women in the business. And we said, Well, what else can we do here? Because we have so many employees, and there's a lot of women across the country that we're not even have we don't even know about, let alone having conversations with so how can we do this a bit better and a bit more structured. So we started just with a meeting in Melbourne, where about 100 women across the country came in and we just tossed this up workshop that we had our MD at the time Rob Clayton there. And it was really to put everything on the table and work out how we go forward. So post that we developed a diversity and inclusion committee, and one of our key focuses to start with was Women in Ag so and making sure that we had high representation in the business generally, and then also particularly in leadership roles. So a couple of the key initiatives that came out of that was the women and nutrient mentoring program. So we have 12 women each year, roughly 12 each year that like we have quite a few applicants. And then we select 12 women to be paired with a mentor, and really working on their career journey, what's next for them, and having that advocate in the business. So some of these women probably go under the radar because they're not putting their hand up. And so having that advocate in the business is great. And also the big part of it is is to try to increase their self confidence. So we find that's one of the biggest issues as I mentioned before, so increasing that self confidence having that mentor or to really put some power behind the career discussion, and then an advocate in the business. So we have that. And we have another version of that for for senior females in the business. And then combined with that we're doing a lot of regional events to really try to promote why having a more equal workforce is a benefit to the business, you know, that diversity of thought, is a big one. So we're doing that. And like we said, it just be great to get a few more miles to the events. But albeit where we're starting, we really are starting to make some inroads in there. What I would say, and someone had mentioned this, to me at the start, when we're at the start of the journey, they said, If you don't have the top level support of the company, you'll probably never get anywhere. And we're really lucky that Kelly Freeman, our MD and the whole Australian leadership team, it's just not lip service, that paying lip service to it. It's not just a throwaway line. They're really dedicated to making sure that we do promote more and more women to come into the business and then also into leadership positions. So Oli Le Lievre 20:57 yeah, and it is so important, isn't it? And that's where I think private business, and like Walmart is careers fair at the moment for people. And I think like there's a role for everyone to play in it. And obviously, the artist says really push it, different groups, but private businesses where real change happens, because there's real outcomes on the line. There's real financial, and business impacts of not getting those things, right. So actually driving and being the leaders that you actually not just need today, but into the future and making sure you've got that coming through. And you're supporting those people within your businesses like that's where the change really happens. And I think that's something which my eyes have probably been really open to where I think I've had that philosophical view of like, oh, yeah, it's, it's great. That's happening up here. But the real drivers are happening in businesses every single day. And, and I think you guys are a testament of that. Speaker 2 21:44 Yeah. And only thing I'd finish on is that we've really seen like, a real cultural shift, I think, in the last couple of years, where before it was sort of roll your eyes sort of stuff about the initiative. And now it's like, yeah, so it's really starting to be ingrained in the business, which was always the the end goal. And I think that's testament to a lot of the people in the company, but particularly the leadership team, advocating for it. Definitely. Oli Le Lievre 22:07 Now, back, I've got a couple of thoughts starters. And this is one well, they're really fueled by conversations we're having on the side, there's obviously the really important question around advice to your 10 students. But I did want to chat to you, because I'm interested like to you, what is your definition of agriculture? Speaker 2 22:25 That's actually that's a really interesting question, definition of ag. So I guess it's producing food to feed the world. Like, I guess that's our tagline to so maybe that sounds corny, but it really is, it's producing food to feed the world and fiber to clothe the world. So it didn't, that's in a nutshell, at its base level. But I think AG is so much more than that. Now, you know, and this is probably gonna lead into the year 10 Students question like the question that or the advice I'd give to your attention, and ag, you can go in any different direction. In AG, there's, you know, AG is ag tech, it's biotechnology, its data, its sustainability. There's so much more to AG now. So see, and I really think it's about that. And I think going forward, it's really going to be about that making sure we've got the balance between maximizing productivity to feed the world. And then also making sure we're reducing our environmental impact. So we don't impact climate change anymore. Oli Le Lievre 23:23 Yeah. And I think it'd be part of the part, which I'm learning, as well. gounder is learning is around with, like, agriculture exists today. And this is what it looks like. And this is what's called a best practice. But knowing that the way we do it today isn't going to be the best way in the future, because we're going to continue to learn and understand there's gonna be better ways to do it. But I think that's the sustainability part of it is going, we continue to learn, we continue to shift that dial, but today with what we've got, and what we know, and what allows people to continue to do it. This is how it works. But then let's actually understand where it's heading from there. Speaker 2 23:57 Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And there's, there's so many drivers of that like, and I'll just bring it back to one example like biotechnology. So when people talk about tech in ag, you think about no robotics and drones and all that sort of thing. But for me in my seed background by technology and the gap, the yield gains, the pests and disease management, nutrient use efficiency that we can achieve by looking at the biotechnology and breeding of some of these crops. I think that's a fascinating space, but it's one of many that's coming in ag. Yeah. Oli Le Lievre 24:29 100%. Now, of course, I've only introduced this one recently. Is this something that you're trying to overcome addressed today? Or an area that humans of agriculture can actually help you with? Speaker 2 24:41 Yeah, so I think it was, we've probably already touched on it earlier. It was really around that education on what sustainability means for a grower. I think from our discussions with growers, there's a lot of confusion and mixed emotions about this space some just saying I don't want to know anything about it and it's complete crap. And others are saying, you don't want to be right on board. What Can I do now and there's everything in between. But I think overall, a lot of people are confused about what this could mean for them. So I think it's that education piece. I know you've done that session with Richard Eckhart. And Richard does a carbon neutral agricultural course that that we also facilitate. So I think that's a, you know, that's a key cause for some growers to participate in. But just trying to start getting growers to try to potentially understand what this means for them. And the importance of that, so that yeah, they don't lock into anything that may have longer term impacts on their business. And that also just said that they're prepared for when something comes in this space. And I think probably most people that are operating this space thinks something's coming, whether it's regulation, market access market premiums, but just so the growers are ready and prepared for that. So that's probably just trying to get that messaging out there, which you've already done a lot of Ollie. Oli Le Lievre 25:53 So yeah, awesome. Well, we'll just keep plugging away. But I do think it is really just starting the conversations, getting the different perspectives and views out there. But then going, Yeah, it's okay to ask those questions. But really, I guess what we try to drive off the back of those conversations is people to get curious. Because otherwise, that's where if you're not, and not asking the questions, that's where there's blindsides in market access in regulation, whatever it might be, can what feels like coming out of the blue, but actually, if we start to ask the questions and be proactive, I think that starts to reduce that potential heartache and the track. Yeah, I Unknown Speaker 26:24 agree. And that's our message. Yeah. Oli Le Lievre 26:26 So one final question for you back. What's the question that you'd like me to ask the future guest? Speaker 2 26:33 So you throwing them all that really great. So I'm gonna answer these two questions. one's probably more boring and predictable. And the other is just going to be a bit out there. So I guess one question that I'm constantly asking myself, so I'd be really interested in other people's thoughts is, if we fast forward 10 years in agony, you could even say 20, but I think there's gonna be a lot of change in 10 years, we fast forward 10 years in Angular, what what's the ag industry look like? And what are those major changes that have happened? So if you know, I guess if we had a crystal ball, we'd be able to rich, but certainly, I think that that's gonna be a really important piece, the rate of change is just going to really make I think, and I believe 10 years time, it's going to look a completely different landscape. So I'd really I'd ask someone that that's my boring answer. My more interesting question was, I'd ask someone if you had an unlimited budget, which celebrity would you get to be the face of Australian ag at a campaign highlighting Australian produce to the world and why so? So that can be a hard question. You can ask someone next time while it because I don't have a great answer on it. But Oli Le Lievre 27:36 I love that one. That's a good one. Which celebrity would you get to be the face promote Ozzy? Yeah, sorry, interesting. We're just bringing back Russell code that way, but we Speaker 2 27:48 were just testing this one out the other day. And I was thinking it depends on if you wanted to have more women in agriculture, you could certainly you could pick a couple of well known celebrities that might help that, but that certainly Yeah, so I think that'd be a good question. Oli Le Lievre 28:02 Miley Cyrus. Unknown Speaker 28:05 wouldn't be my first Oli Le Lievre 28:06 pick. But I'm just trying to say yeah, Speaker 2 28:08 it's a tough one, isn't it? So yeah, I haven't come up with a great answer yet either. But I'm still thinking on it. Yeah. Matthew McCullough, it could be a good one. Chris Hemsworth. came to mind. But he's Australian. But yeah, Oli Le Lievre 28:19 well, that's the thing. Do you go and or do you go on someone overseas? Speaker 2 28:23 Yeah. Anyway, so that's a tough one to ask someone next time on your podcast. Oli Le Lievre 28:28 Well, and you know, something I learned the other day is David Beckham used to play in kangaroo leather, soccer. Let's take a Unknown Speaker 28:34 David Beckham and David Beckham. It is. Oli Le Lievre 28:39 Well, Ben, thank you so much for coming and having a chat. I'm glad we got the audio right this time, because I do think our event was an awesome conversation. But it was actually fantastic to sit down with you one on one and hear a little bit about your story, the decision making that you've made at different points in your career. And I appreciate the time and looking forward to catching up with you again soon. Unknown Speaker 28:56 Yeah, thanks, Ali. Thanks very much. Oli Le Lievre 29:00 Well, that's it for another episode from us here at humans of agriculture. We hope you're enjoying these podcasts. And well, if you're not, let us know. Hit us up at Hello at humans of agriculture.com. Get in touch with any guest recommendations topics, or things you'd like us to talk and get curious about. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend. Right subscribe, review it. Any feedback is absolutely awesome. And we really do welcome it. So look after yourselves. Stay safe. stay sane. We'll see you next time. Say Transcribed by https://otter.ai